Realtime Nick Name Ticker of #debian at freenode (ICQ IRC service)

0[00:01:48] <oxek> I got that reference
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20[00:38:35] <heap_> hi, how do u backup some debian installations on cheap arm computers with sd cards? do u install it utilizing LVM so snapshot of whole sd card can be done while machine is running? thansk
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29[00:44:55] <MrHatter123> I just did a fresh install of debian 10, which went fine, however on first boot it hangs with a white flashing cursor in the top left, pressing alt f2 gives me a login prompt.
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36[00:48:41] <oxek> heap_: I use btrfs send and btrfs receive, and do regular snapshots
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49[00:52:02] <heap_> oxek: it means u install core OS on sd card using btrfs
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51[00:52:34] <heap_> oxek: so its not good idea to use LVM, its better to use btrfs? is that FS stable enough?
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60[01:07:19] <oxek> LVM might work as well, but I prefer btrfs on unreliable storage such as sdcards
61[01:07:45] <oxek> I use the backports kernel, 5.10, which is much better at btrfs than the default 4.19 kernel
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63[01:08:55] <heap_> well if i use devices as odroid xu4 etc its hard then bc these default images dont come with btrfs
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143[06:07:05] <ASDX> what needs to be configured in acng.conf for apt-cacher-ng to be used for debian 10 when apt-cacher-ng is running on a debian 9 server?
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283[11:29:39] <Kmarad> hi I don't get it, I install docker using apt, but then I can't enable it using systemctl : replaced-url
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285[11:35:59] <Kmarad> forget that :x
286[11:36:06] <madgemade> Does the service exist? (stat /lib/systemd/system/docker.service)
287[11:36:44] <jelly> forget what?
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289[11:41:58] <alive> &wc
290[11:42:08] <alive> oops sorry
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293[11:45:26] <Kmarad> I just installed an old version that is in apt packages for some reason, now following docker's website instructions
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296[11:48:18] <Antoine_> Hello, I have a question about makefiles and organizing a project. It doesn't exactly fit here but I don't know where if would fit so I hope you guys can redirect me, or answer :). I have a project, which I just organized in directories. I have a directory ./python/ for my python scripts. I want to script to produce their output in a directory ./output/. In my python scripts, if I save to a file in
297[11:48:19] <Antoine_> "../output/", then I can run the script from ./python/ but not from the root folder of my project
298[11:48:43] <Antoine_> And if I save to ./output/, then I can't run the script from my ./python/ directory
299[11:49:16] <Antoine_> Should I make a Makefile in my ./python/ directory and have my root Makefile call the other Makefile? How should I do it?
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301[11:50:38] <Antoine_> And can I use run-parts to run all my ./python/*.py files? `run-parts python/` doesn't seem to do anything
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307[11:57:26] <petn-randall> Antoine_: That's a question best asked for #python, though they have moved to another network. See replaced-url
308[11:57:41] <petn-randall> Antoine_: I'm also in that channel. :)
309[11:57:51] <Antoine_> petn-randall: Ok :)
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312[12:00:52] <Antoine_> petn-randall: I actually found a better way, by moving output/ to python/output. But my second quetsion still holds so I'll go ask
313[12:04:17] <petn-randall> Antoine_: Sure, cool! Also note that Debian's support channels have always been on irc.oftc.net, this channel is just a remnant of the migration back in 2006.
314[12:06:53] <jelly> we also have a presence on irc.libera.chat where #python* have moved to
315[12:07:10] <Antoine_> petn-randall: Ah ok, I didn't know!
316[12:07:46] <Antoine_> Are all the irc channels bridged?
317[12:08:03] <jelly> none of the #debian channels are bridged (yet) sadly
318[12:10:08] <Antoine_> And, which one is most active? I'm on all three of them
319[12:14:32] <oxek> the one on libera likely
320[12:14:47] <oxek> because everyone who joined that channel has been alive in the past 2 weeks
321[12:14:47] <petn-randall> Antoine_: I'd say #debian on irc.oftc.net is, judging by user count and activity.
322[12:14:56] <oxek> so the idle/autoconnect zombies can't be older than that
323[12:15:05] <petn-randall> hehehehe
324[12:15:06] <oxek> user count is meaningless
325[12:15:55] <petn-randall> maybe, but it's also worth noting that all *other* channels are on OFTC. Like #debian-next, #debian-mentors, #debian-devel, etc.
326[12:16:08] <oxek> take a random person from the nicklist here: "idle: 67 days, 16 hours 09 minutes 11 seconds, signon at: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:06:30"
327[12:16:11] <Antoine_> petn-randall: Ok, thanks :)
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357[13:24:48] <jelly> airnf, the ones on oftc and libera are likely to survive long term. Apparently no matter how much we'd like for users to come to OFTC for ALL their Debian needs, many seem to stay on the most active FOSS network. That USED TO BE freenode until the management change.
358[13:29:04] <wyre> hi guys, is collectd mandatory?
359[13:29:11] <wyre> I mean, is part of the debian core?
360[13:29:24] <wyre> has it something to do with systemd->rsyslog?
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366[13:34:03] <jelly> wyre, it's not, and is not installed by default
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369[13:34:56] <wyre> jelly, so collectd has nothing to do with the log forwarding from systemd to rsyslog?
370[13:35:10] <jelly> correct
371[13:35:52] <jelly> I mean, I don't know what it does precisely, maybe you CAN configure things that way intentionally?
372[13:36:22] <jelly> but by default, if you install rsyslog and have systemd-journald running, they do their thing without it
373[13:36:48] <jelly> we don't have collectd installed on any of our debian servers
374[13:37:58] <wyre> ok, I see
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379[13:41:21] <wyre> jelly, do you think could I check what packages depends on it? 🤔
380[13:42:36] <jelly> if it's installed,
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382[13:42:46] <jelly> aptitude why collectd
383[13:42:49] <jelly> or maybe
384[13:42:50] <jelly> aptitude why collectd-core
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386[13:44:39] <wyre> jelly, apparently freeradius depends on it replaced-url
387[13:44:57] <wyre> because freeradius depends on libcollectdclient1
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392[13:55:31] <jelly> it doesn't.
393[13:56:03] <jelly> It's built with _support_ for it, probably, but sure doesn't require it in all configurations
394[13:56:48] <wyre> then why I can see freeradius in `aptitude why collectd`?
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396[14:03:07] <wyre> jelly, well, at least freeradius-utils depends on it, right?
397[14:04:27] <wyre> and freeradius-utils is recommended by freeradius, right?
398[14:06:27] <wyre> jelly, also ... what do you think about all those mmc1 errors in journal? replaced-url
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400[14:07:23] <jelly> wyre, freeradius-utils also depends on libpcap0.8. That doesn't mean the daemon is used to sniff packets.
401[14:08:25] <jelly> wyre, that looks like a SD or MMC card reader issues.
402[14:09:26] <jelly> wyre, which debian release is this?
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404[14:10:19] <wyre> jelly, 10.8
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406[14:10:29] <wyre> but it could be because I have a SD with a lot of partitions
407[14:10:34] <jelly> oh, sorry, that dependency chain in replaced-url
408[14:10:41] <wyre> so I'd say apparently it's the SD card
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410[14:11:14] <wyre> so freeradius recommends freeradius-utils
411[14:11:26] <wyre> and freeradius-utils depends on libcollectdclient1
412[14:11:47] <jelly> some of those deps would prboably need to be fixed
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414[14:12:30] <jelly> or apt would need to be fixed not to follow Recommends with more than one level or recursion
415[14:12:33] <heap_> hi, do u guys use btrfs on lets say arm computers with os on sd card ; for a snapshoting as a backup to remote site? does that make a sense? Also to recover it will be needed to restore partition table, mbr, etc... so too much hassle?
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426[14:22:06] <oxek> heap_: I do that
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428[14:22:50] <heap_> oxek: what exactly?
429[14:24:19] <oxek> btrfs on RPi-like ARM-based devices, that only have an SD card for storage, and do regular backups by using snapshots and tranferring them using btrfs send and btrfs receive
430[14:25:21] <oxek> partition tables are trivial to recreate, since I only use one partition anyway
431[14:27:41] <heap_> well; what about mbr; etc?
432[14:27:44] <heap_> then /boot?
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436[14:32:36] <oxek> I just have a single partition on those devices
437[14:32:42] <oxek> so no separate /boot or anything like that
438[14:32:54] <heap_> but how u restore mbr etc
439[14:32:59] <oxek> MBR or GPT can be simply recreated using fdisk
440[14:33:03] <heap_> or how do u restore from btrfs snapshot?
441[14:33:13] <oxek> creating 1 partition, that spans the full size of the device
442[14:33:29] <heap_> can u be pls more specific?
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449[14:41:54] <wyre> jelly, it's an eMMC
450[14:42:14] <wyre> I mean, which is failing it's the internal storage, not the external SD card
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453[14:43:40] <heap_> oxek: ?
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457[14:49:28] <heap_> can i convert my current sd card with instaled os to the brtfs? i mean i can copy partitions but how to create properly MBR?
458[14:53:14] <wyre> jelly, as you can see mmc1 is the internal storage replaced-url
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460[14:54:50] <wyre> and you can see here all those timeouts "waiting for hardware interrupt" are for mmc1 replaced-url
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466[15:06:13] <heap_> oxek: msg?
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471[15:15:18] <jelly> wyre, could be a driver issue, but I'd avoid using that eMMC for anything before it dies completely. Maybe you can keep /boot on it but move the OS to more reliable storage?
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478[15:35:15] <wyre> jelly, I have the same issue in two different and similar machines
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485[15:53:18] <Lope> I just wanted to mention, that I resolved my issue by using /dev/disk/by-id/md-name-foo instead of /dev/md/foo
486[15:54:43] <Lope> oops, I didn't ask on this IRC server.
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488[15:59:38] <jelly> wyre, I'd look for reasons in kernel and hardware support.
489[16:00:10] <jelly> wyre, is this x86, what kind of device is it?
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492[16:12:32] <wyre> jelly, replaced-url
493[16:12:45] <wyre> it's an Intel Atom E3950
494[16:13:49] <wyre> you mean the manufacturer? (regarding to hardware support)
495[16:15:37] <jelly> emmc is usually used in cheap embedded stuff, smartphones, android stbs
496[16:15:52] <jelly> tablets
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498[16:16:02] <wyre> yes, this is an embebed device
499[16:16:16] <wyre> this industrial box PC replaced-url
500[16:16:19] <jelly> I am not surprised there are issues with a normal distro kernel
501[16:16:49] <jelly> you could blindly try a newer kernel and see if it works any better
502[16:18:15] <wyre> jelly, apparently I have a kernel update, right? replaced-url
503[16:18:28] <wyre> is linux-image-amd64 the kernel package? 🤔
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513[16:37:21] <jelly> wyre, that's a metapackage that pulls in the latest distro kernel. You'll have to "apt full-upgrade" or "apt-get dist-upgrade" to actually apply
514[16:38:08] <jelly> I'm skeptical about real bugs being fixed within 4.19.x, but who knows. Try it and see.
515[16:38:29] <jelly> and if same hangs and issues persist, try the 5.10 kernel from buster-backports
516[16:43:22] <somiaj> apt upgrade will pull in new packages (Thus kernels) -- unlike apt-get which won't pull in new packages.
517[16:44:15] <jelly> TIL
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522[16:46:47] <wyre> somiaj, so it's not the same apt than apt-get? 😱
523[16:46:55] <wyre> I thought it was the same!
524[16:47:32] <somiaj> apt/apt-get/aptitude all use the same libary, the issue was apt-get was used in enough scripts that its behavior could nto be changed
525[16:47:55] <somiaj> apt was created to be more a user tool (not scripts) that could have changing behavior, so there are differences, this is one apt upgrade is more like aptitude than apt-get
526[16:48:07] <somiaj> It will install new packages in an upgrade, but it won't remove any
527[16:49:43] <somiaj> I'm unsure on why they did this change, my guess is they wanted 'apt upgrade' to work in stable for security and point upgrades, which did require pulling in new kernels.
528[16:56:20] <Rodon> what to add in command to install latest available application which shows with -a (apt show profanity -a) ?
529[16:57:27] <somiaj> Rodon: don't quite follow you, apt install or apt upgrade will always install the latest available version.
530[16:57:37] <oxek> Rodon: if you have backports repo enabled, then do `apt -t buster-backports install profanity`
531[16:57:41] <oxek> otherwise don't do that
532[16:57:48] <somiaj> Rodon: look at 'apt policy packagename'
533[16:58:13] <Rodon> yeah done already..!!! got in docs..
534[16:58:18] <somiaj> yea, I was goign to mention that, pinning in backports makes it so they are not installed by default (for good reason). You don't want to just blindly install/upgrade to backport packages, you may break things.
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536[17:01:41] <Rodon> "-a" denotes backports version... this is command i forgot.. "sudo apt-get -t buster-backports install package"
537[17:01:50] <jelly> there's no need to pin against backports explicitely
538[17:02:38] <jelly> the repo is configured to only allow automatic upgrades from it, first installations have to be explicit
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540[17:04:06] <Rodon> this is first package from backports i installed .. just because omemo is only in latest in backports... i dont like backports/unstable..branch.. i understand it ...its only the exception..
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542[17:05:06] <jelly> Rodon, "apt-cache policy profanity" shows cleaner output regarding available versions, than what apt-cache show ... or apt show ... -a would
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545[17:06:52] <Rodon> thanks...it really helped me to see the thing..😀
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547[17:10:17] <somiaj> Rodon: "-a" denotes all, which shows all versions if there are multiple avialble.
548[17:15:41] <Rodon> yeah
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725[22:53:53] <Enissay> For purpose of special monitoring, I'd like to create a user with SSH restricted access to a unique folder `/home/enissay/monitor`. What would be the clean way to do so ? The user doesnt need any home or special access, basically just read/write on that folder.
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728[22:56:19] <Enissay> IS this ok: replaced-url
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