12[00:12:43] <jmcnaught> FightingFalcon: 10.5 will be in Debian 11/bullseye when it gets released
13[00:12:59] <FightingFalcon> i have stretch
14[00:13:06] <FightingFalcon> shall i upgrade to 10.5?
15[00:13:35] <dvs> FightingFalcon: Debian is up to 10.9 actually
16[00:14:16] <FightingFalcon> ?
17[00:14:25] <sney> !10.9
18[00:14:25] <dpkg> Debian 10.9 was released on Mar 27th 2021. his point release corrects some serious bugs and copies security updates across to the main archive. Further details are at replaced-url
19[00:14:28] <jmcnaught> FightingFalcon: Once a Debian release is released its packages stay at the same version for the rest of the release life cycle. Stretch will always have the same version of mariadb (10.1), buster will always have 10.3
20[00:14:47] <FightingFalcon> So how come i have 10.3?
21[00:15:08] <jmcnaught> FightingFalcon: did you install it from stretch-backports?
23[00:15:20] <FightingFalcon> nope, from another repository
24[00:15:40] <jmcnaught> FightingFalcon: so that's why. It also is not in stetch-backports, my mistake.
25[00:16:35] <jmcnaught> FightingFalcon: if you use the mariadb packages provided by Debian then you are using the version that was released with that Debian release. Security fixes are backported. Only in rare cicrcumstances (and for browsers) do version numbers change in a Debian release.
26[00:17:02] <FightingFalcon> I see
27[00:18:06] <sney> you should update that stretch system when you can, it only has LTS for another year
36[00:21:18] <sney> presumably the initrd has logic to look for debian-$ver iso files. I haven't used the 4.3.3 method in years though
37[00:24:10] <FightingFalcon> sney, can i upgrade my stretch to buster?
38[00:24:12] <FightingFalcon> is it safe?
39[00:24:39] <sney> dpkg: stretch->buster
40[00:24:40] <dpkg> Read (at least) the upgrading chapter of the <release notes> replaced-url
41[00:24:57] <sney> debian releases are designed to upgrade over previous releases. it generally works.
42[00:25:50] <ryouma> i got intimidated by the release notes for stretch to buster as there were some issues it pointed out that seemed complex, but probably it is ok if you're normal
43[00:28:56] <FightingFalcon> isnt a fresh install better?
44[00:29:56] <ryouma> it can be a lot of work comparatively unless you are a wiz who can pre-configure stuff and use configuration management stuff and so on
45[00:30:19] <FightingFalcon> I better wait for the next version: bullseye
46[00:30:19] <ryouma> debian is designed to be both upgraded and dist-upgraded
47[00:31:12] <FightingFalcon> Sop
48[00:31:13] <FightingFalcon> So
49[00:31:22] <FightingFalcon> Shall i take a snapshot and give it a go?
50[00:32:51] <dvs> FightingFalcon: you have to upgrade to buster to get to bullseye
51[00:33:15] <ryouma> poll: did anybody have horro stories from stretch to buster?
52[00:33:36] <ryouma> or even more than minor issues
53[00:34:24] <sney> nothing that I remember specifically
83[00:47:18] <buu> So do I need 2.26 for this cve to be fixed?
84[00:48:43] <sney> if you are affected by that cve, and you need a fix in your environment, the only option is to upgrade to buster.
85[00:49:25] <ryouma> and that should be showing in check-support-status?
86[00:49:27] <sney> but before you panic, you should read the bug report and the flaw description more closely. most of the time these little glibc vulnerabilities are only exploitable in very narrow/rare circumstances, if at all
87[00:49:51] <buu> Oh I'm definitely not panicking
88[00:50:16] <buu> I am however fighting this stupid bureaucratic process that involves and idiotic "cve scanner"
89[00:50:25] <sney> the debian security team considers this issue 'minor' like a lot of stuff replaced-url
90[00:50:34] <sney> ah, figures
91[00:50:38] <buu> But this magic program I must obey think it's critical!
92[00:50:46] <buu> =[
93[00:50:59] *** Quits: Mister00X (quassel@replaced-ip) (Quit: "I'll be back" — Arnold Schwarzenegger)
94[00:51:17] <ryouma> huh, on a stretch box check-support-status is not showing that one
95[00:51:38] <buu> hm
96[00:52:02] <buu> This is actually the postgres:9.5 docker image
97[00:52:08] <buu> I wonder if the -alpine one will magically pass
98[00:52:54] <buu> oh but we use postgresql-plperl
99[00:53:00] <buu> Woe is me
100[00:54:55] <FightingFalcon> If i take a snapshot, try to update and fail, i can safely revert back right?
101[00:55:14] <sney> that's what that term usually means
102[00:55:27] <sney> though I don't think you've said what kind of snapshot
103[00:55:44] <FightingFalcon> hetzner says take a snapshot
108[00:58:19] <ryouma> i have heard that btrfs can fix broken upgrades by surrounding the upgrades with a snapshot, but idk if that's true or if it is supported for that in that version
109[00:58:42] <sney> maybe they meant lvm? or a vm hypervisor? who knows
112[00:59:31] <sney> buu: and I suppose you need postgres-9, or you'd be on buster already. I hope your org lets you put 'wontfix' on a ticket if it's for a good reason.
113[01:00:16] <buu> ha ha ha
114[01:00:22] <buu> I like your optimism!
115[01:00:22] *** Quits: gry (~test@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
116[01:00:35] <ld> it is really frustrating that big sections of the most basic tasks in the documentation are out of date
117[01:00:54] <ld> the install instructions have no hope of working
118[01:01:02] <ld> worse the installer lies to you about files that it needs
119[01:01:34] <ld> "i want to install debian" is not a task covered by the debian documentaiton
120[01:01:47] *** Quits: andantino (~andante@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
121[01:01:48] <sney> ld: file a bug, but are you sure you didn't miss the part about how 4.3.1 is the only part most people need, and 4.3.2 begins with "an alternative way..."?
122[01:02:11] <sney> ld: the vast majority of installs succeed with a netinst or cd1/dvd1 written directly to flash media and booted.
123[01:02:26] <sney> the extra stuff below that is *only* for special cases.
124[01:02:27] <ld> those also involve destroying whatever else was on my flash drive
125[01:03:24] <sney> yes, if you are attached to whatever is on there already, you should back it up to more reliable media in any case
126[01:03:41] <ld> ???
127[01:04:03] <ld> that has nothing to do with what i said
133[01:04:35] *** Quits: Tobbi (~Tobbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
134[01:06:11] <sney> also: since 4.3.3.1 refers explicitly to mkdosfs and install-mbr, I suspect it's only supported by bios/legacy hardware and not efi.
135[01:07:29] <ld> that still has nothing to do with what i said
136[01:07:34] <maxtim> I'm having a strange issue with USB 3 ports. I first thought it was the RTL-SDR causing the issue, but the same behavior has been seen with several USB thumb drive. It first drops the port, then drops my NIC. dmesg remports 'enp4s0: NIC Up: 1 Gbps Full' link down, link up... repeat
137[01:08:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1029
138[01:08:56] <maxtim> It's super bizarre. Any ideas how to troubleshoot?
147[01:13:07] <sney> maxtim: hard to say, but it smells like possibly a power issue.
148[01:13:40] <ryouma> what type of solution are you looking for? --- 16:02 <ld> those also involve destroying whatever else was on my flash drive
149[01:13:47] <sappheiros> Isn't this what I want to get started (with ethernet cable plugged into the machine i'm trying to USB-install Debian into)? replaced-url
150[01:13:47] <ryouma> pardon me if i am missing something
151[01:14:41] <sney> sappheiros: most start with replaced-url
152[01:14:54] <sney> and specifically the netinst iso
153[01:14:59] <sappheiros> and i can use macos terminal to write this CD iso onto a USB stick?
154[01:15:17] <sney> probably.
155[01:15:18] <sappheiros> yes, says that page
156[01:15:30] <sney> I haven't done that in osx but I don't see why not.
157[01:15:43] <maxtim> sney, a 600W PSU with a GTX 960 and not much else...
159[01:16:21] <maxtim> that does sound right, but how to be sure i wonder
160[01:16:40] <sney> maxtim: if it's a power issue, it would be with that PSU (or maybe the motherboard vrm) failing, rather than not having enough watts
161[01:17:02] <sney> you could also check for an efi update from the mb vendor, sometimes that can help
162[01:17:47] <maxtim> i actually just recently went looking for mobo updates. it's a little old, maybe 2015ish.
163[01:18:07] <sney> sappheiros: the page has a description of the mac iso, depending on the age of your computer it may be what you need
164[01:18:32] <sappheiros> step 0. stop being impatient and read more carefully ... gotcha, thanks
165[01:18:56] <maxtim> PSU feels right though.... I'll look into that
180[01:33:56] <maxrazer> Somehow my SSD storage went from hundreds of GB free to only 25GB free and I'm getting errors in applications about not enough storage space. Does anyone know how I can figure out where all my storage went?
182[01:36:13] <ryouma> maxrazer: du is a good place to start
183[01:36:17] <sappheiros> I just copied the netinst.iso following the directions but I'm _still_ getting "isolinux.bin missing or corrupt." I'll try putting it into each USB slot to see if it's checking one in particular for boot media ... do you have another recommendation?
194[01:41:38] <sappheiros> I was able to access the boot menu through F11 but it still went to "isolinux.bin missing or corrupt"! :( I wrote the iso to USB using this command after verifying the sha512 signature: sudo dd if=/Users/user/Downloads/debian-10.9.0-amd64-netinst.iso of=/dev/disk3s1 bs=4m; sync
195[01:42:30] <sappheiros> and it said 84+1 records in 84+1 records out presumably successfully executing (~353 Mb transferred in ~49 s)
196[01:42:49] <jmcnaught> sappheiros: is /dev/disk3s1 the whole drive, or a partition?
197[01:42:54] <maxrazer> ryouma, Ok, " du -hs * | sort -h" says that "gpodder" has taken up 390G. So that is where 390G suddenly went in the blink of an eye.
198[01:43:20] <sappheiros> jmcnaught: it's the fat32 partition; i followed the tutorial at replaced-url
199[01:43:42] <sappheiros> i'll try repeating the dd identifying the main drive instead of that partition, then...(right?) ...
200[01:43:56] <jmcnaught> sappheiros: Debian ISO images need to be copied to a device, not a partition.
201[01:44:33] <sappheiros> thank you. so i will use /dev/disk2 instead of /dev/disk2s1 ...
202[01:45:08] <segamain> sappheiros: delete the partitions on the usb if u have any and try again
203[01:45:46] <jmcnaught> When you copy an image to a drive it writes over anything that was already there, partitions included.
204[01:45:59] <maxrazer> Somehow my ~/gPodder/Downloads folder is 390G according to "du"
205[01:46:00] <sappheiros> so there's no risk in using dd straightaway without erasing?
206[01:46:21] <maxrazer> yet, when I look in that folder I see no large files.
218[01:51:18] *** Quits: urk (~urk@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
219[01:51:52] <maxrazer> Maybe all the files in downloads added up to 390G. Maybe I accidentally told gpodder to download every podcast I was subscribed to?!?!
220[01:52:24] <maxrazer> I just deleted all the files in the gPodder/Downloads file and it freed up 390G.
221[01:53:01] <maxrazer> That is scary. I wonder if that could cause problems with my ISP.
227[01:59:17] <sappheiros> :D Thank you. Is it okay if I leave now that the installer is partitioning the hard drive (to dine with friends), or should I stay to finish the entire installation before leaving?
228[01:59:39] <sappheiros> ("The installer is now overwriting [...] to prevent meta-informaiton leaks [...]")
264[02:41:10] <jmcnaught> segamain: you will have better success typing people's nicks if you use <tab> completion. Type the first character or two of a nick, then press <tab> to complete, <tab> also cycles through the options available.
294[02:56:14] <dpkg> segamain: are you using Windows?
295[02:56:25] <segamain> dpkg: no
296[02:56:25] <dpkg> No Offense, or den norske debian kanalen #debian-no. For skandinaviske brukere av debian. It is the norwegian channel #debian-no for scandinavian users.
297[02:59:37] <segamain> dpkg: are you using windows ?
298[02:59:38] <dpkg> segamain: I wish you would RTFM.
299[02:59:55] <segamain> dpkg: whats RTFM
300[02:59:56] <dpkg> wish i knew, segamain
301[03:00:23] <jmcnaught> segamain: dpkg is a bot
302[03:00:34] <segamain> I konw :D
303[03:00:42] <segamain> somebody get this robot
304[03:01:47] *** Quits: Adbray (~Adbray@replaced-ip) (Quit: Ah! By Brain!)
362[03:36:23] <Sevenhill> sussudio: we are in covid19 times, all schools,universities , and other things are closed in most of countries right now , so it is normal for them to get bored :D
516[04:06:45] <brizz> is anyone familiar with haproxy? (i know there is a channel). I've been trying to figure something out for past 4 hours now
517[04:07:32] <dvs> !anyone
518[04:07:32] <dpkg> Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>.
519[04:11:03] <brizz> I am trying to use HAProxy as a forward proxy for PowerMTA. I've searched all over the net and can't find anything to help. PowerMTA connects to HAProxy and HAProxy connects to mx servers and delivers from the IP HaProxy is served on. It is NOT a reverse or balanced proxy setup
523[04:12:58] <sappheiros> For partitioning the disk during installation, does the following imply that if I use the whole volume group then I _cannot_ grow logical volumes later using the LVM tools? "If you use only part of it, or if you add more disks later, then you will be able to grow logical volumes later using the LVM tools". Are logical volumes 'outside of' the volume group used for guided partitioning?
524[04:13:25] *** Joins: Filo (~filohuhum@replaced-ip)
525[04:13:51] <sappheiros> For greatest flexibility should I use 50% of the volume group (i.e. my hard drive) for guided partitioning?
528[04:16:56] <ryouma> (my totally subjective opinjion: lvm shold not be shown to new users. it is just too much extra stuff for them to hav eto learn if they ever hav eto deal with it.)
529[04:19:15] <sappheiros> I agree. This would bother my mother, who is at least a little interested in switch from macOS to linux. It would be good to ask if the user is complete novice and wants all recommended setups, and if so then to pick reasonable stuff for him. (I went with 50% of my drive, and took a screenshot planning to learn more later.)
530[04:20:31] <sappheiros> Where is the deb.debian.org mirror located?
531[04:20:47] <sappheiros> "You should use a mirror in your region"
532[04:20:56] <ryouma> i am not a complete novice and i do not use lvm precisely because it just adds 3 ;layers and potential edge and corner cases
534[04:21:41] <sappheiros> rather than being a mirror per se
535[04:22:58] <sappheiros> "geographic proximity often isn't the most important factor for determining which machine will serve you best." then maybe i shouldn't try picking one nearby? :/
552[04:40:44] <ASDX> would you say debian supports OS downgrades (of point releases)?
553[04:41:10] <dvs> !downgrade
554[04:41:10] <dpkg> Downgrading is not, nor will ever be supported by apt. Programs change their data in a way that can't be rolled back, and package maintainer scripts support upgrades to new config file formats but not downgrades. Try: "dpkg -i olderversion.deb" or "aptitude install package=version" using "apt-cache policy package" to get the old version number. See also <partial downgrade>, <unstable->testing>, <sdo>.
555[04:41:37] <ASDX> dvs: thanks
556[04:41:43] <dvs> np
557[04:42:06] <oxek> ASDX: not supported does not mean impossible though.
558[04:42:12] <oxek> you can do it easily
559[04:42:21] <oxek> it just isn't officially supported
596[05:51:11] <McErroneous> Hi, cant find "ntp-server" in debian squeeze repository, but its beeing referenced by websites.... (apt-get update ; apt-cache search ntp-server .. is not successfull ) Have those packages been removed from the repository ?
677[08:11:57] <McErroneous> Hi, i installed some progams using apt-get..., and a packet lockfile-progs_0.1.15+squeeze got installed..., how do i verfiy which program requieres it in order to run ?
716[08:25:42] <McErroneous> should be enough if a single machines get the i-net time..., and the rest of the local net could get the time then , from my local server...
717[08:26:56] * McErroneous BBL ( be back later)..
735[08:40:35] <McErroneous> ack. before introducing new stuff by upgrading/updating , i would like to get comfortable with my current system.., i am buffled by all the changes...
744[08:43:01] <Onepamopa> Hey guys... any ideas on why dhclient would fail to renew IP on reboot (/sbin/dhclient -4 -v -i -pf /run/dhclient.ens18.pid -lf /var/lib/dhcp/dhclient.ens18.leases -I -df /var/lib/dhcp/dhclient6.ens18.leases ens18) - it does DHCPOFFER w/o actually binding, but if I kill it and just run dhclient -v (w/o specifying any of the interface and so forth) - it'll start working immediately ?
745[08:43:29] <Unit193> ,i chrony
746[08:43:30] <judd> Package chrony (net, optional) in buster/amd64: Versatile implementation of the Network Time Protocol. Version: 3.4-4+deb10u1; Size: 228.9k; Installed: 498k; Homepage: replaced-url
845[10:44:54] <Franciman> the output of ss is the same
846[10:45:05] <ratrace> Franciman: run that ss as root to see the users of the process
847[10:45:14] <Franciman> oh
848[10:45:27] <Franciman> uh
849[10:45:30] <Franciman> looks like I have apache2
850[10:45:34] <Franciman> what the hell
851[10:45:43] <Franciman> thanks
852[10:46:23] <ratrace> you _can_ have both running. it's not unusual to use nginx as first web server, then apache behind it as some kind of application server, though there's better ways to use such setups
853[10:46:59] <Franciman> hmm I installed the php package
854[10:47:05] <Franciman> well if I have apache, I can use apache
855[10:47:19] <Franciman> I just want to get started with a small env to develop a stupid website in php
856[10:47:31] <ratrace> "start small", then I'd recommend nginx + php-fpm
857[10:47:40] <ratrace> whatever you do, do NOT run apache with mod-php
1011[14:30:21] <sappheiros> Must I unlock my disk with its password every time I boot up the computer, since the drive is encrypted? How often should the computer be turned off or restarted?
1036[14:53:09] <McErroneous> Hi, i know there have been some reports on "debian squeeze" about hidden mouse pointer. I have observed this only if a internet connection is active... . Offline i have never experienced this, i think..
1074[15:10:53] <sappheiros> I can't even paste into XTerm. -_- right clicking doesn't give me a menu to click Paste, and control+v, option+v, command+v doesn't paste ...... quickly getting my "i shouldn't use linux i suck at linux" hairs standing on end
1121[15:23:36] <dpkg> Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
1122[15:23:41] <sappheiros> how do i open sources.list with saving privileges? ... i'm just trying to install the GPU firmware
1123[15:23:45] <sappheiros> it won't let me save the new line to it
1147[15:27:42] <oxek> it was explained on the installation screen, and in the installation guide
1148[15:27:44] <sappheiros> oxek, oh. i thought i was doing what the installer recommended
1149[15:28:11] <jelly> sappheiros, that's an implicit setting in the installer. If you omit root password, you get sudo rights fom the start. If you enter a root password, you don't get sudo for the first user
1151[15:28:39] <jelly> if you want those, run "adduser yourusername sudo" as root, then log off and log back on
1152[15:28:49] <sappheiros> i guess i'll just reinstall the darn thing without cinnamon ... i thought it was saying if i didn't put in a root password i'd be running the computer always in sudo mode
1153[15:29:19] <oxek> you don't need to reinstall a debian system ever, unless you want to
1154[15:29:22] <sappheiros> bash: adduser: command not found
1155[15:29:31] <oxek> you can add yourself to the sudo group
1156[15:29:32] <sappheiros> well literally nothing is working right now
1157[15:29:36] <oxek> first you need to login as root
1158[15:29:37] <sappheiros> even commands you tell me are not working
1159[15:29:39] <jelly> sappheiros, open a root shell by doing "su -"
1160[15:29:40] <sappheiros> oh
1161[15:31:15] *** Quits: igrtrrt (~igrtrrt@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1180[15:36:13] <dpkg> Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
1190[15:38:05] <oxek> I don't think cinnamon is known for good accessibility
1191[15:38:37] <sappheiros> yeah after GPU firmware i will try to learn how to switch back from cinnamon to gnome default. the resolution is too small and there's only one setting for it in the Display options
1192[15:39:26] <sappheiros> editing in xterm, must I control+o to save before control+x?
1193[15:39:35] <sappheiros> i will search online for an xterm vim manual i guess
1194[15:39:41] <oxek> that's probably the `nano` text editor
1195[15:39:49] <sappheiros> oh, right, the easier one i selected
1196[15:39:52] <oxek> so yes, need to Ctrl-o
1197[15:40:19] <oxek> once you've done that, run `sudo apt update`
1198[15:40:41] <oxek> and then run `sudo apt install firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-misc-nonfree`
1199[15:40:42] <sappheiros> "File to insert [from ./]: " it's expecting me to type in the location of some file whose text to insert?! ...
1200[15:41:08] <sappheiros> i guess i'll try putting the /etc/apt/sources.list location, seems probable i'll screw something up
1239[15:49:34] <sappheiros> I've got it now: replaced-url
1240[15:50:31] <sappheiros> "If you have a 3-button mouse, the easiest way is to use the standard Unix/Linux shortcut: select the text you want to copy (drag the mouse over it, or double-click to select a word, or triple-click to select a line). Then middle-click to paste the text." This does not work. :(
1286[16:00:55] <judd> Search for amdgpu/vega20_asd.bin in buster-backports/amd64: firmware-amd-graphics: lib/firmware/amdgpu/vega20_asd.bin
1287[16:01:17] <jelly> sappheiros, if you're using a kernel from backports, you need to use firmware from backports as well
1288[16:01:35] <jelly> versions of drivers (= kernel) and firmware need to roughly match
1289[16:01:43] <sappheiros> i followed the easy standard install for the most part, unless installing 'web server' and other such optional packages changed it?
1290[16:01:53] <jelly> sappheiros, what does "uname -a" say?
1292[16:02:40] <sappheiros> preceeded by Linux PCname
1293[16:02:43] <jelly> that's a regular buster kernel
1294[16:02:57] <oxek> regular buster kernel can use the firmware files from backports
1295[16:02:59] <jelly> unusual that some fw is missing from the fw packages
1296[16:03:16] <oxek> not unusual, quite common in fact
1297[16:03:18] <jelly> sappheiros, eh. Reboot and see whether this is enough
1298[16:03:20] <sappheiros> i suppose i should log out and log back in to see if the graphics will switch over to my GPU now? or should i turn off computer again and boot back on?
1299[16:03:31] <sappheiros> you're saying i should reboot, rather than log out and in. okay ...
1300[16:03:40] <sappheiros> i'm already sick of entering my long decryption password -_-
1301[16:03:47] <sappheiros> i didn't know it would make me type it every time the computer turns on
1302[16:04:09] <jelly> keep typing it in, you're going to learn it by rote soon
1303[16:04:29] <oxek> reboot and come back, I know how to fix your problem afterwards
1304[16:04:30] <jelly> I know my 25 character one.
1305[16:04:56] *** Quits: sappheiros (~main@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1329[16:10:44] <oxek> the buster-backports package does
1330[16:10:49] <jelly> oxek, that W: isn't necessarily a file they need
1331[16:11:01] <jelly> that's a generic check from update-initramfs.
1332[16:11:34] <sappheiros> lol i feel like a dog looking anxiously between the adults wondering what to do
1333[16:11:41] <jelly> the check looks for ALL the possible firmware bits for ALL THE CARDS
1334[16:11:49] <sappheiros> "what are they talking about" "they seem to be disagreeing" "what should i do"
1335[16:12:09] <jelly> sappheiros, do things work well now?
1336[16:12:22] <oxek> sappheiros: we're not really disagreeing, I'm just skipping a few steps whereas jelly is doing it one step at a time and being more careful
1337[16:13:03] <jelly> no no, we're duking it out
1338[16:13:10] <oxek> bring it on!
1339[16:13:27] <sappheiros> sudo apt install firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-misc-nonfree -- should I run this again to see if any firmware for this sapphire pulse Radeon RX580 is missing?
1340[16:13:56] <oxek> sappheiros: ideally, you'd look through the output of `sudo dmesg -H` now and try to spot if it says anything about missing firmware
1341[16:14:18] <jelly> sappheiros, no, look at "dmesg" output to see if the actually running driver is still missing firmware for your actually present card
1342[16:14:20] <sappheiros> yay, first i'ma "man dmesg" and look for -H because i RTFM >_>
1343[16:15:06] <oxek> the -H makes error messages red and has a few other nice things for humans
1344[16:15:30] <sappheiros> DMI: To Be Filled By O.E.M. To Be Filled By O.E.M./X570 Phantom Gaming 4, BIOS P3.40 10/21/2020
1345[16:15:34] <sappheiros> ^ am I missing DMI?
1346[16:15:36] <sappheiros> what is DMI ...
1347[16:16:01] <oxek> you can ignore that one
1348[16:16:03] <sappheiros> [ +0.000002] MTRR default type: uncachable -- i dunno what this is but 'uncachable' seems not good
1349[16:16:24] <oxek> you can ignore that one too. try to search for firmware
1350[16:16:25] <sappheiros> [ +0.000008] ACPI: Early table checksum verification disabled -- i dunno if that should be like that ...
1351[16:16:59] <sappheiros> [ +0.000080] No NUMA configuration found
1356[16:18:04] <ksk> nevermind the latter, if you already did ask a meaningful question already..
1357[16:18:59] <sappheiros> Oh! I was meaning to ask about this on the debian forums later, but I'm still getting this error when booting up the PC, and it appears here in dmesg -H also:
1358[16:19:08] <sappheiros> [ +0.000000] do_IRQ: 1.55 No irq handler for vector
1359[16:19:35] <ksk> sappheiros: Do you actually have a problem / question? "things I dont understand in dmesg" is not a bad thing, per se.
1360[16:19:37] <oxek> you could spend an entire university course going through each line of dmesg output...
1361[16:20:47] <sappheiros> sudo dmesg -H | grep firmware doesn't report any clear errors, though it only shows polaris10 stuff, not the vega lines from earlier
1362[16:20:48] <jelly> there's all sorts of crap in there
1363[16:21:21] <jelly> sappheiros, that's because your card is a polaris thing, so it doesn't need missing firmware for the vrga thing
1364[16:21:24] <jelly> vega*
1365[16:21:29] <sappheiros> i dunno if vega is even relevant for me though. i dunno what the Radeon RX580 or Ryzen 7 3700X needs to work well with debian
1445[17:12:54] <Azlux> Hi all, I'm maintain a debian repository and I'm aslink myself when I do server update and I need to cut my repo server few time, is there are a http error code I can send to avoid client to have a time-out ?
1453[17:16:16] <imMute> Azlux: are you mirroring the official debian repo, are you running your own repo with your own packages?
1454[17:16:26] <Azlux> it's my own
1455[17:17:04] <imMute> okay, what software are you using to manage the repo?
1456[17:17:18] <Azlux> oxek: I have a repo server, and sometime I need to shut the web server. Is there are a better http error for maintenance than timeout.
1468[17:19:41] <imMute> I think just about any error code is going to cause apt to fail the request, so it probably doesn't matter much.
1469[17:20:07] <Azlux> imMute: indeed. 503 look the best.
1470[17:20:08] <oxek> imMute: 'connection refused' requires some device to refuse the connection. You're not gonna get that if things are powered down.
1471[17:20:29] <imMute> oxek: true, I was thinking "down" as in the HTTP server was stopped, not the whole system powered off.
1472[17:20:36] <Azlux> I feel the same, apt will not care of the http error. only print a failure
1473[17:21:33] <Azlux> oxek: I have a very small server as backup with a simple http page in case I stop my main one (vrrp protocol)
1474[17:21:43] <Azlux> That why I'm asking the question :D
1495[17:39:46] <greycat> There isn't a "default desktop". If you have more than one installed, there should be a dropdown menu widget on your login screen (Display Manager) that lets you select a different X session type.
1521[17:50:33] <sappheiros> It was a fresh installation and I selected additional things to install including cinnamon, but I did not uncheck any of the default options.
1522[17:51:13] <greycat> We don't know which things were the "defaults" in your particular installer.
1530[17:53:16] <oxek> something else struck me as odd with that installation - console-setup was not installed by default
1531[17:53:33] <sappheiros> > If you complete the installation, the screenshots can also be found in the directory /var/log/installer/ (after the reboot into the installed system).
1532[17:53:54] *** PamiPetteri is now known as xormor
1533[17:54:11] <sappheiros> > Could not load image “partman-auto-lvm_guided_size_0.png”. / failed to load input stream for file ....
1534[17:54:34] <sappheiros> is this because my user account doesn't have root privileges by default?
1535[17:54:57] <sappheiros> looks like it
1536[17:55:01] <imMute> sappheiros: what does 'file /var/log/installer/partman-auto-lvm_guided_size_0.png' say about the file? (assuming I got the filename right)
1537[17:55:21] <sappheiros> that it's a screenshot i took of the partitioning process that doesn't apply to the conversation about packages installed
1538[17:55:47] <sappheiros> i was just wondering how i can access files outside of my user folder, like if i need to XTerm 'sudo nautilus' or something (thinking back to Ubuntu)
1539[17:56:07] <sappheiros> Nemo, not nautilus, perhaps ...
1540[17:56:16] <oxek> you really wouldn't run `sudo nautilus` even on ubuntu
1581[18:22:52] <sappheiros> might be sudo hcitool -a
1582[18:22:59] <jelly> !what's my hardware
1583[18:22:59] <dpkg> You can use lspci, lsusb, lsscsi, lspcmcia, lshal, hwinfo, dmidecode, and/or lshw, or even dmesg to find out what kind of hardware your machine might have, or you could crack the lid and look inside ... oooh, shiny! If you install lshw, run "lshw -html > myhardware.html" as root and you'll have a nice HTML summation. See also <myram>, <driver locator>.
1584[18:23:15] <dob1> I don't remember how to kill a python script with killall
1594[18:26:03] <sappheiros> do i need to look out for anything in particular when buying a wifi/bluetooth card for linux compatibility?
1595[18:26:09] <oxek> sappheiros: yes
1596[18:26:22] <sappheiros> debian specifically in this channel i mean to ask
1597[18:26:25] <dob1> pkill -f seems to work, so giving the script a unique name can be helpful
1598[18:26:32] <oxek> sappheiros: also yes
1599[18:26:34] <sappheiros> lol
1600[18:27:27] <sappheiros> instead of asking here, would it help people searching online if i first made a thread in the debian forums, and then post answers i get here to that thread, so it can be archived by search engines?
1601[18:27:42] <sappheiros> (and changed it to [Resolved] in the subject after posting the answer)
1615[18:33:21] <greycat> wherever you find correct answers is fine
1616[18:33:51] <sney> stackexchange has some good advice and some bad advice. don't trust them 100%, and don't blindly run any commands from there, but they are a good source of clues
1617[18:33:52] <sappheiros> wondering which has more info on it
1618[18:34:05] <sney> really, manuals are better than forums in general
1619[18:34:06] <oxek> what info are you looking for?
1622[18:35:29] <sney> if you're buying a wifi card, buy intel. they are supported best and there's only 1 driver, so it's not a random nightmare like some cheaper stuff.
1623[18:36:17] <oxek> but firmware...
1624[18:36:27] <oxek> and especially non-free firmware
1625[18:36:30] <sney> there's no choice with wifi anymore
1626[18:36:38] <sney> ath9k is too old to be considered
1629[18:36:59] <oxek> I don't know what the thinkpenguin devices use nowadays
1630[18:37:16] <sney> hard to find new. if you have one and it still works, great, but nobody is retailing ath9k cards in 2021
1631[18:37:28] <oxek> wifi is problematic anyway, the spectrum is saturated to you won't get better speeds than ~100Mbps anyway, unless you're somewhere far from a city
1636[18:44:37] <sappheiros> I was thinking to buy a bluetooth keyboard, but a wired one may be better. and I've got loads of 'how do I ____' questions, being new to debian and still generally sucky with linux
1637[18:45:19] <EdePopede> a lot of them can be answered by reading or just playing already.
1675[19:22:59] <shtrb> sappheiros, bluetooth works^TM in linux. I personally hate wireless keyboards because of the annoying default auto sleep in them
1695[19:33:31] <EdePopede> on a desk in front of the monitor there's no need for a wireless keyboard, but when i'm not there i don't want to hold it all the time
1696[19:33:57] <shtrb> A good feature with I think Logitech it would alert you the battery charge level (bluetooth ?) and plasma even had a popup alert once
1697[19:34:16] <EdePopede> the really annoying thing for me is the compact keyboard design, i really would appreciate some more of the usual gaps
1698[19:34:27] * shtrb imagine EdePopede go around his office with his keyboard in one hand and a PC in the other
1699[19:34:57] <shtrb> EdePopede, there are sane keyboard with space for fingers and not sales designer chopsticks
1700[19:35:02] <EdePopede> is this even still a thing? batteries dying all the time were a reason not to get one until maybe 2 years ago, but i'm still using the 1st set i think
1701[19:35:26] <shtrb> It's my luck
1702[19:35:33] <EdePopede> shtrb, it's a logitech set, nothing special
1703[19:35:47] <shtrb> at least they are recharable
1711[19:47:10] <ikus060> I ask the question on #net-snmp, but I see little activity in the channel. So asking here too. Is it possible using command line to get the trap name from a oid ?
1712[19:48:03] *** Quits: sinaowolabi (~Sina@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1751[20:36:11] <jhutchins> ikus060: I think that specialised a question is more likely to be answereed on an smpt mailing list, or possibly the mailing list for your mailer.
1823[21:10:21] <varaindemian> somiaj: just update, I am trying to perform an update for it
1824[21:10:26] <jhutchins> varaindemian: Did you checksum the iso you downloaded?
1825[21:10:44] <somiaj> varaindemian: the DE's in buster don't get upgrades (outside of some targeted security/bug fixes)
1826[21:10:48] <greycat> 'apt update' only downloads the changes to the list of available packages
1827[21:10:54] <varaindemian> did you see the link I pasted?
1828[21:11:03] <somiaj> varaindemian: all apt update does is just download the package list files, it doesn't actually upgrade anything on your machine.
1829[21:11:03] <jhutchins> Does the concept of "update" mean anything with a disk?
1830[21:11:07] <varaindemian> Yeah, but as you can see it fails..
1831[21:11:22] <varaindemian> somiaj: I know
1832[21:11:39] <somiaj> varaindemian: oh yea, sorry missed your link, do you really need to use the cdrom sources?
1833[21:11:45] <ValeraRozuvan> What's the future of aptitude? Will apt slowly faze it out?
1834[21:11:48] <greycat> So is this problem COMPLETELY unrelated to your original question about which DE other people should tell you to use?
1835[21:11:52] <varaindemian> somiaj: I don't
1836[21:12:00] <varaindemian> greycat: yes,
1837[21:12:15] <somiaj> varaindemian: edit /etc/apt/sources.list and commentout remove the lines about the cdroms and only use internet sources.
1838[21:12:33] <varaindemian> somiaj: thank you! I'll try it
1839[21:12:42] <somiaj> ValeraRozuvan: afiak they will both be avilable, one isn't going to phase out the other (Debian still has dselect for those who want to use it)
1842[21:13:30] <somiaj> ValeraRozuvan: not really, there isn't a clear chain.
1843[21:14:06] <greycat> dselect and aptitude and synaptic are all "big-ass monolithic administrative tools" with lots going on
1844[21:14:18] <greycat> apt-get and apt are simple command-line tools
1845[21:14:26] <somiaj> ValeraRozuvan: aptitude and apt (via various binaries apt-get, apt-cache) were kinda created in parallell, and apt is mearly another binary for the same apt package that can allow changes to its output which apt-get cannot due to used in so many scripts.
1846[21:14:29] <varaindemian> somiaj: so that was all?
1848[21:15:00] <varaindemian> somiaj: looks like it is up to date already
1849[21:15:11] <somiaj> varaindemian: In the future, you should start out asking about your actual problem. But yes, you had those in your soruces.list from your install and since you didn't have the cd available when you ran update, it couldn't find it.
1850[21:15:37] <somiaj> varaindemian: yea, debian stable only gets security and sever bug fixes.
1851[21:16:05] <varaindemian> somiaj: Sure. I saw on the web page that there were 2 more cds/dvs. Do I need to just download thoese and complete the update?
1852[21:16:15] <greycat> No.
1853[21:16:19] <varaindemian> Okay
1854[21:16:44] <greycat> If your machine is on the Internet, at least part time, you should just remove all CD or DVD lines from sources.list. You'll never use them.
1855[21:16:47] <somiaj> varaindemian: no, in general I only ever use the 'netinstall' cd, since I download and update all my packages online. Those are only if you want an offline copy, and even then the first dvd ismore than enough.
1856[21:17:18] <somiaj> well more than enough for most people, the packages on the later dvds are not used nearly as often
1867[21:19:19] <somiaj> varaindemian: debian uses free nouveau by default, if you need non-free drivers this requires a bit more work in debian due to debian's stance on non-free
1868[21:19:32] <varaindemian> somiaj: then it's the kernel. Debian is on kernel 4, ubuntu is on kernel 5
1871[21:20:29] <somiaj> varaindemian: it is most likely something else, unless your computer is acient, a newer kernel should still work on it.
1872[21:20:43] <varaindemian> it's quite new
1873[21:21:08] <varaindemian> i7 9750h
1874[21:21:13] <varaindemian> dell laptop
1875[21:21:48] <somiaj> But this isn't really a ubuntu channel, if you wanted to debug what ubunutu was doing differently. But I dont' think it was at the kernel/hardware support level.
1876[21:22:02] <varaindemian> yeah, true
1877[21:22:07] <varaindemian> just wondering
1878[21:22:15] <varaindemian> since they are both debian
1879[21:22:39] <somiaj> no they are not both debian.
1881[21:23:13] <somiaj> ubuntu is based on debian, but its core has diverged quite a long ways that outside of using common packages, there is a lot of differences.
1884[21:24:03] <varaindemian> Thank you so much anyway!
1885[21:24:06] <format_c> Exim got reported severe security vulnerabilities. Version 4.94.2 should be fixed. I just upgraded my Debian Server and it shows upgrade to Exim verison 4.94.2 . I chcked packages.debian.org bug the Changelog and Patch-History doesn't really work. How do I know that the security patches are really included in the Debian verison of the package?
1886[21:24:26] *** Quits: varaindemian (~oct@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1887[21:24:26] <somiaj> format_c: do you have a CVE for this issue?
1888[21:25:24] <format_c> multiple
1889[21:25:57] <somiaj> format_c: well debian clearly tracks them, the most recent CVE I could find from 2021 says debian buster is not effected replaced-url
1890[21:25:59] <sney> it's DSA 4912-1 and there was a d-s-a email about it 2 days ago
1891[21:26:10] <greycat> format_c: you appear to be looking only at the upstream part of the package version number. Debian backports security fixes.
1894[21:27:21] <greycat> format_c: also, you appear to be using a non-stable release on your server. This is not advised, and testing does NOT receive security support.
1896[21:28:09] <format_c> Thanks. Will check out this resource...
1897[21:29:01] <format_c> What does bullseye pakage mean.
1898[21:29:33] <sney> bullseye is the codename for the next debian release
1899[21:29:48] <somiaj> format_c: Debian's security tracker will let you know the status of any know CVEs, this way you can clearly track any CVEs and there current state in debian.
1900[21:29:50] <sney> it's not out yet. if you're running it on a production server, that's somewhat risky
1901[21:30:55] <somiaj> format_c: are you running exim4 from backports?
1902[21:31:14] <format_c> I guess not. let me check
1903[21:31:32] <somiaj> format_c: what is the output of 'apt policy exim4' if you care to share at paste.debian.net
1906[21:34:42] <greycat> So when you said you were using 4.94.2 that was just made up?
1907[21:34:44] <sney> I wonder where you saw 4.94.2 then, but that's debian 10 and it has the security fix according to replaced-url
1908[21:34:56] <sney> you should remove those stretch sources, too.
1909[21:35:00] <somiaj> format_c: you aren't running 4.92.2, so that is why we were confused. You are running the stable version, which as we showed you is fully patched against those issues.
1910[21:35:09] *** Quits: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1912[21:35:45] <greycat> maybe they've got 2 or more machine, and they mixed them up...
1913[21:36:15] <format_c> Sorry paste error. Version got upgraded to Debian version 4.92-8+deb10u6
1914[21:36:38] <greycat> !security faq
1915[21:36:39] <dpkg> "The most important guideline when making a new package that fixes a security problem is to make as few changes as possible. ... moving to a new upstream version is not a good solution, instead the relevant changes should be backported." replaced-url
1916[21:36:56] <format_c> Just read that the upstream version is 4.94.2 where the issues are fixed
1923[21:41:56] <format_c> I see 17 of the affected CVE's being fixed in the Debian version
1924[21:42:00] <format_c> 21 have been reported
1925[21:42:08] <format_c> see which are missing
1926[21:42:47] <somiaj> format_c: the one I shared with your originally didn't effect debian so thus it wasn't needed to be fixed, so you'll either find that debian wasn't affected or due to the threat decided a fix wasn't needed.
2012[23:07:00] <Hash> So if stable is frozen, and dovecot has seurity issue, dire, which needs fix, go from 2.2 to 2.3, does stable still force an update on you in Debian?
2028[23:18:12] <sney> Hash: it is *extremely* rare for stable to get full version upgrades. if it's required due to a dire security issue, then it could happen, but it's much more likely that the debian package will receive a cherry-picked patch from the upstream release, rather than the whole thing
2029[23:18:16] <sney> !security faq
2030[23:18:16] <dpkg> "The most important guideline when making a new package that fixes a security problem is to make as few changes as possible. ... moving to a new upstream version is not a good solution, instead the relevant changes should be backported." replaced-url
2035[23:26:39] <ryouma> there are a few packages whose purpose is to get the latest. and only a couple of packages that upgrade instead of backporting security issues.
2036[23:28:11] <ryouma> i am not sure but e.g. w3m-el-snapshot, firefox-esr might meet those criteria. idk what firefox does about its companion add-on packages.
2037[23:28:56] <Hash> Hang on guys, brb. Thanks for info
2043[23:32:40] <ryouma> but to answer your security question, debian is big on security so you will get upgrades for those. usually in the backport form that preserves your version.
2044[23:34:07] <longshot> Is it possible to pass a preseed file to debootstrap?