12[00:09:24] <MrHatter123> If the 'mv' command is interrupted during the move, is the data still in its original location until all the data is moved ?
13[00:10:51] <oxek> MrHatter123: no
14[00:11:00] <oxek> well, depends
15[00:11:12] <oxek> if it is single file, then yes, original data is in original location
16[00:11:24] <oxek> if it is multiple files, then some files are transferred, some are in original location
45[00:39:59] <ratrace> clearly the premise here is that tools work as designed except, of course, when there's bugs. if we don't make that assumption, then technology would not work at all.
46[00:41:54] <ratrace> how often mv fails to atomically rename? by itself, on its own, with no other symptom or failure? Near never. Can it fail like that in case of a new bug? Sure. You'd probably sooner win the EU jackpot tho.
47[00:42:25] <ratrace> in other words, this is kinda like techno-reverse-solipsism. :)
48[00:42:33] <oxek> true
49[00:42:56] <oxek> maybe I'm just a cynical old debian user, having seen mv fail in all sorts of ways
50[00:43:15] <ratrace> on its own or becasue the filystem had a catastrophic failure elsewhere?
51[00:43:21] <oxek> both
52[00:43:41] <oxek> e.g. tried to mv a file on same filesystem, and the file *disappeared*
53[00:43:47] <ratrace> I only saw the latter, in over 20 years of *nix'ing. power failures, hardware glitches, memory corruption, ...
55[00:46:51] <ratrace> I mean.... the ACID'ity of databases is, partially, based on that atomicity (on atomicity of filesystem operations), backed by a replay-able WAL. And if those were failing willy nilly, teh whole civilization would collapse :)
60[00:47:38] <ratrace> can they fail? oh sure, absolutely. but they don't in vast, vast, vast majority of cases, unless the fs itself is experiencing a headshot. OR, it's mysql we're talking about :)))
91[01:21:14] <dpkg> Welcome to #debian, the larger but unofficial support channel for Debian GNU/Linux stable releases. Official channels have moved to OFTC (irc.oftc.net) see replaced-url
92[01:22:00] <Peppi> I'm using octopi (based on Debian). I'd like to make it so when I do a ll (list long) it call ls -l how do I do that? I don't even know what to google sorry lol
93[01:23:10] <ectospasm> alias ll='ls -al'
94[01:23:33] <ectospasm> Or, don't pass `-a` to ls if you don't want to see . and ..
95[01:23:58] <ectospasm> Whenever I'm in a new environment, I set up that alias.
96[01:24:19] <ectospasm> ...if I can't copy my full environment to the system.
97[01:24:31] <riff-IRC> Or ls -Al if you want to see hidden files, but not . and ..
162[01:38:22] <afidegnum> mutante: i'm choosing option 3, Mail Sent by smarthost no local mail
163[01:38:25] <afidegnum> correct ?
164[01:39:19] <afidegnum> 1. internet site; mail is sent and received directly using SMTP 3. mail sent by smarthost; no local mail 5. no configuration at this time
165[01:39:19] <afidegnum> 2. mail sent by smarthost; received via SMTP or fetchmail 4. local delivery only; not on a network
166[01:39:19] <afidegnum>
167[01:40:24] <afidegnum> what do you suggest?
168[01:40:25] <mutante> afidegnum: yea, well, do you have external mail servers to use? yes, 3 is the common one
169[01:41:01] <afidegnum> mutante: yes, I have 2 exim servers i'm confuguring, 1 as a clients with multiple mail accounts from multiple domains
170[01:41:38] <afidegnum> and the smarthost which is in docker. which will forward mails from server 1 to their respective destinations
171[01:41:40] <mutante> It used to say ""(3) Satellite system: All mail is sent to another machine, \called a "smarthost" for delivery.""
172[01:41:47] <mutante> that's why I called it satellite
173[01:42:08] <afidegnum> oh, ok, then the name changed
174[01:43:19] <mutante> afidegnum: 3 would be if this host is NOT doing mail itself and instead sends it to a different host, like the mail servers of your org or Google or whatever feels responsible for your domain
175[01:43:46] <afidegnum> yes,
176[01:43:54] <mutante> if you are setting up that smart host itself then it's more like 1 i guess
183[01:46:40] <afidegnum> ok, let me clarify, I have server A and B, server A has mails*@domains* it's a company mail system. and sever B will forward mails sent from server A to their final destinations
184[01:46:58] <sney> relay server relays all incoming mail to another server. a smarthost (usually) actually handles mail delivery for a local domain
185[01:47:12] <mutante> maybe the difference is only the list of domains it accepts
186[01:47:31] <sney> and yeah, definitions in smtp can be a little vague
187[01:47:31] <afidegnum> i have been battling this confusion since morning
188[01:47:47] <sney> it is one of the oldest things on the internet, after all.
189[01:48:02] <mutante> option 1 is if you are the mail server yourself and option 3 is if the mail server is elsewhere
190[01:49:10] <afidegnum> sney: does smarthost send mails out for a local domain?
191[01:49:16] <mutante> server A would pick 1 and server B would pick 3
192[01:49:21] <afidegnum> mutante: ok, i'm working on server B now
193[01:49:26] <afidegnum> where mails should be sent out
194[01:49:33] <afidegnum> so i choose 3 ?
195[01:49:43] <afidegnum> or 1 ?
196[01:49:53] <mutante> final destination .. means ?
197[01:49:56] <mutante> another mail server?
198[01:50:06] <mutante> or the user inboxes on that system
199[01:51:13] <mutante> well, now I think it might be 2 variants of option 1 but with different list of domains it accepts mail for
200[01:51:29] <mutante> sorry, not sure, maybe sney can chime in
201[01:51:51] <afidegnum> yes, i.e Server A sends mails from user1@domain1.com to some@google.com, user1@domain2.com to @yahoo.com and server B pick those mails to send to the respective destinations
202[01:51:59] <sney> usually the smarthost also does outgoing mail, yes
203[01:53:24] <afidegnum> so i chose option 1 or 3 ?
204[01:53:31] <sney> for your docker container that is not handling mailboxes or mail routing, you would definitely choose 3, where server A is still the core of your company's email infrastructure
218[01:58:46] <afidegnum> sney: ok, i chose option 3. do i use a domain name or part of the fqdn here? replaced-url
219[02:00:38] <Vanfanel> Hi! I have removed the systemd loging service, so now I get "Failed to connect stdout to the journal socket" errors on services launch. How I can stop systemd trying to connect stdout to the journal socket? I don't need it on this particular system
231[02:05:30] <ectospasm> It seems too much effort to set up (r)syslog for systemd instead.
232[02:05:37] <ectospasm> But that's just my opinion.
233[02:06:12] <Vanfanel> ectospasm: I just don't want any logging, and this is going to be an embedded system that works perfectly fine for what it does
234[02:06:25] <Vanfanel> ectospasm: I just need to know how to get rid of that message
235[02:07:16] <ectospasm> You could configure systemd-journald to write to /dev/null
236[02:07:31] <ectospasm> That way, it doesn't actually fill up your small embedded disk, but the socket is still there.
237[02:08:35] <Vanfanel> ectospasm: yes, but I would like to remove the socket too. It was easy to do by masking it in the past, now this error appears. Is that error unavoidable?
238[02:08:47] <mutante> Vanfanel: "LogTarget" in /etc/systemd/system.conf sounds like it.
239[02:08:51] <mutante> Vanfanel: "One of console (log to the attached tty), console-prefixed (log to the attached tty but with prefixes encoding the log level and "facility", see syslog(3), kmsg (log to the kernel circular log buffer), journal (log to the journal), journal-or-kmsg (log to the journal if available, and to kmsg otherwise), auto (determine the appropriate log target automatically, the default), null (disable log
280[02:20:41] <Peppi> so where do I place the .bash_profile file?
281[02:20:46] <ectospasm> It doesn't make that much of a difference, but if you have things that print anything in .bashrc they can mess with programs that don't expect that output (for non-login shells)
282[02:20:50] <trench> depends on what you want to do?
378[03:42:49] <oxek> (unless we're close to release)
379[03:43:18] <oxek> we're still lacking a distro that would have DFSG, but also up-to-date software
380[03:43:58] <mutante> but why would you want bleeding edge? you like to be beta tester?
381[03:44:04] <oxek> or at least a service that would make keep sid always up-to-date, and allow automatic (or at least trivially easy) backports of all software
382[03:44:16] <oxek> mutante: sometimes there's a bugfix that you need for work
383[03:44:23] <oxek> and compiling stuff yourself can be a problem
384[03:44:31] <ectospasm> If you want bleeding edge or near bleeding edge, go with a rolling release distribution.
385[03:44:49] <sponix2ipfw> Exactly
386[03:45:11] <abrotman> or learn how to make packages yourself
387[03:45:17] <mutante> ok, but generally it seems chances are higher that you get bugs in work that still need to be fixed later
388[03:45:25] <velix> mutante: At least you can mount overlayfs again, BUT I've read that you also can mount as non-root user.
389[03:45:54] <velix> sponix2ipfw: I've got virtual machines to test new stuff and to make decisions about the way to go next.
390[03:46:05] <mutante> velix: I can already mount as non-root though, what am I missing?
391[03:46:24] <velix> mutante: I never had priviliges to this without sudo?
392[03:46:39] <sponix2ipfw> mutante: apparently a higher version number
393[03:46:45] <velix> sponix2ipfw: When next kernel supports something I need, I either need another solution or need to change distribution.
567[08:23:56] <asarch> What package do I need in order to run i386 binaries on Buster for amd64 (I already did dpkg --add-architecture i386 && apt update)?
575[08:33:51] <alkisg> asarch: I think it was like `apt-get install libc6:i386 libncurses5:i386 libstdc++6:i386`, if it's not I can look at the dependencies of some of my packages...
576[08:33:57] <oxek> asarch: the package should tell you
577[08:35:08] <afidegnum> hi, any insight about my issue?
579[08:35:48] <afidegnum> I have installed docker in debian and running a debian based image, yet i'm faceing this error: invoke-rc.d: could not determine current runlevel invoke-rc.d: policy-rc.d denied execution of restart.
584[08:40:29] <asarch> ERROR: ld.so: object '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/pulseaudio/libpulsedsp.so' from LD_PRELOAD cannot be preloaded (wrong ELF class: ELFCLASS64): ignored.
585[08:40:58] <asarch> And this: /home/asarch/Projects/Squeak/Seaside/Seaside 3.0.app/Contents/Linux-i686/lib/squeak/4.0.3-2202/squeakvm: error while loading shared libraries: libuuid.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
588[08:43:40] <alkisg> asarch: you'll need all the missing libraries. Try `apt install squeak-vm:i386`, it should install some of the missing dependencies for your project. Isn't it available as a .deb package?
589[08:46:14] *** Quits: Z4CHe (uid496478@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
686[10:16:11] <alkisg> In extreme scenarios, I can imagine that it could make a difference, but it's not common. E.g. package a depends on b, newer package a no longer depends on b. If you purge b before updating, you'd also purge a.
687[10:16:17] *** Quits: citypw (~citypw@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
692[10:20:08] <put_in> alkisg: thank you for your answer. i mean however just "update" not "upgrade" or "full-upgrade"
693[10:20:16] <put_in> does it still apply then?
694[10:20:43] <alkisg> I gave an example where "upgrade" would make a difference. "Upgrade" requires "update", so yeah "update" would be needed then. But that example isn't common.
695[10:20:48] <TheBigK> put_in: i would think purging doesnt do much in that sense... since dependency is calculated on the currently installed package
696[10:21:20] *** m1dnight__ is now known as m1dnight_
697[10:22:17] <put_in> the reason i am asking is because i write a bash script for my server and i want to remove logrotate right away. i will install some packages right afterwards but suddenly i wondered if i should put the purge before the update or after.
698[10:22:30] <put_in> fair enough, i will purge after the update. :-) thank you both
700[10:23:02] <TheBigK> put_in: its not wrong doing the update first... so ur welcome :)
701[10:23:04] <jelly> you can always do an update
702[10:23:23] <jelly> it doesn't change anything in package state
703[10:23:24] <alkisg> It's also possible for plain "update" without "upgrade" to make a difference in what's getting purged, but it's even more uncommon...
704[10:23:39] <ratrace> I think more joules and time were spent thinking and asking about it, than running an update just in case :)
705[10:23:57] <jelly> alkisg, only on significant changes in repos, eg. release upgrade
706[10:24:14] <alkisg> jelly: a depends on b|c; purging b might trigger c getting installed
707[10:24:17] <ratrace> there's also in teh back of my mind a situation where removing a package wanted to _install_ another because there was an either-or dependency.... could be remembering wrong and that wasn't debian
708[10:24:36] <jelly> alkisg, and existence of c won't change on update.
709[10:24:46] <alkisg> Dependencies of c might though
710[10:24:53] <jelly> no, they won't
711[10:24:53] <alkisg> So different packages might get installed
712[10:24:57] <TheBigK> isnt that the case with apache2-mpm-worker/prefork? or am i wrong there
713[10:25:04] <jelly> not within a release
714[10:25:27] <jelly> (well, okay, there are exceptions)
715[10:25:33] *** m1dnight_ is now known as m1dnight__
716[10:26:07] <jelly> alkisg, changes in binary deps and ABI are a big no-no within a release
717[10:26:49] <alkisg> jelly: I think I've seen some, for missing dependencies that were added as a bug fix... but I think it's in the "too uncommon to search for" at that point :)
718[10:26:50] <jelly> so if c follows Debian Policy, it's not bloody likely to happen
720[10:27:23] <jelly> if it's a bug fix, then the bug will be fixed, that sounds fine to me
721[10:27:52] <jelly> and if it's in stable, that'd mean it was a pretty serious bug in the first place
722[10:28:47] <jelly> testing and sid are completely different in this regard, and so are third-party repos which might not follow debian policy
723[10:32:51] <jelly> put_in, you can do installation of new stuff and purge in a single commmand with aptitude: aptitude -s install vim-gtk logrotate_
724[10:33:31] <jelly> useful if purge would temporarily break some deps
725[10:36:23] *** Quits: sputnik (kli0rf@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
744[10:59:24] <ratrace> but, the $1M question is ... is tehre a policy in packaging that forbids package names ending in _ ? I think there is something about - as that has function... but _ ?
760[11:29:15] <jelly> _ is the delimiter for package_version_arch.deb
761[11:31:06] <ratrace> jelly: ah yes, the arch. thanks.
762[11:32:26] <jelly> > Package names (both source and binary, see Package) must consist only of lower case letters (a-z), digits (0-9), plus (+) and minus (-) signs, and periods (.).
764[11:33:26] <jelly> ra+tra.ce is a valid package name, rat_race would not be
765[11:36:28] <jelly> nothing about package names ending in - so that's a problem, but there are already ambiguity issues with those ending in + so it's not too huge a deal
766[11:37:15] <jelly> interestingly aptitude CLI conflict resolution uses _prefixing_ with - and _ instead of suffixing
775[11:45:12] *** Quits: emOne (~emOne@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
776[11:49:37] <jelly> does sudoers have a syntax to shortcut several alternative parameters in a command line? %devops ALL=(ALL:ALL) /bin/systemctl {start,stop,restart,status} grafana-server.service
777[11:51:17] <ratrace> jelly: comma separated maybe, via Cmnd_Alias spec
786[11:57:13] <ratrace> question is only if something liek this is doable: Cmnd_Alias SYSTEMCTL_CMNDS = /bin/systemctl start, /bin/systemctl stop, ... \n %devops ALL=(ALL:ALL) SYSTEMCTL_CMNDS grafana-server.service
787[11:57:39] <ratrace> OR grafana-server.service _has_ to be part of Cmnd_Alias, in which case this wouldn't work
792[12:00:09] <ratrace> jelly: MEANWHILE .... the penguin demigods invented polkit. this would be super easy with polkit and some hard dbus on dbus action, methinks.
816[12:22:18] <Heradon> Hello guys, i had a problem with my debian VServer. i cant ping a host on the internet (mail-tester.com) on my second root server i can ping (home too) any ideas?
831[12:40:04] <ratrace> Heradon: check if you can ping via ipv4 and ipv6 separately (-4 and -6 flags), check if you can ping by hostname and IP address separately
832[12:40:42] <ratrace> and, describe "can't ping", there's specific error message for specific trouble (dns resolution, routing, ...)
833[12:40:46] <Heradon> i already checked, i think my ip is blocked
983[15:24:12] <H-var> is there a good guide anywhere that covers all those things, like "oldconfig" and stuff?
984[15:24:18] <ratrace> H-var: it's going through _new_ options and asking to set a value. missing this step would've used defaults which may or may not've been sufficient
985[15:24:37] <ratrace> 5.12 is quite a jump from 4.19 btw, so there'a ton of changes
986[15:25:04] <jelly> H-var, was it the kernel that failed, or initrd?
987[15:25:10] <jelly> !debug initramfs
988[15:25:10] <dpkg> methinks initramfsdebug is replaced-url
989[15:25:34] <H-var> jelly is there a logfile anywhere that I can open?
990[15:25:44] <jelly> H-var, remove the "quiet" option from kernel boot parameters, and try to detect where things go wrong
991[15:25:45] <ratrace> if the kernel didn't load, there's no initramfs
996[15:26:30] <H-var> actually I am noob, but I think initramfs is the first thing that loads??
997[15:26:40] <jelly> kernel panic happens if there's no device with root fs found, too
998[15:26:48] <H-var> according to what I see during boot?
999[15:27:05] <ratrace> H-var: no. grub loads the kernel and gives the initramfs _path_ as param, so the kernel unpacks the initramfs in memory and seeks /bin/init and runs it
1000[15:27:38] <H-var> was anyone able to compile and load into debian with 5.12?
1001[15:28:08] <H-var> on an AMD architecture system?
1002[15:28:09] <jelly> is this your first custom kernel?
1003[15:28:22] <H-var> first time always hurts
1004[15:28:24] <ratrace> jelly: yes yes but my point was, if the kernel panicked, it didn't fully load or complete the loading process so there's no initramfs to debug from
1005[15:29:12] <jelly> ratrace, the factoid shows how to stop initramfs in several places to inspect things. You stop it before the panic.
1006[15:29:14] <H-var> ratrace, I can record a video I guess, if you want?
1007[15:29:16] <ratrace> H-var: "into debian" here is irrelevant. there's no "debian" until the kernel loads and starts /sbin/init from the rootfs
1008[15:29:49] <ratrace> H-var: no need, just please imgur a screenshot of the panic message and trace, AND run without "quiet" as jelly suggested
1009[15:29:54] <H-var> ratrace, you're right - maybe there are issues with my hardware on 5.12
1010[15:30:11] <jelly> it's too early to say that
1011[15:30:59] <H-var> I will finish compiling 5.11, and try installing that first, and then I'll boot into 5.12 and screenshot the error
1012[15:31:31] <jelly> and based on my experience, if you started with debian's everything-and-the-kitchen-sink .config, it's more likely you have a working kernel and initrd failing, than the kernel failing before initrd
1013[15:31:34] <H-var> have you tried 5.12 already? Is it working for you?
1014[15:31:58] <jelly> debian thankfully allows us to NOT have to build custom kernels
1016[15:32:41] <jelly> in most situations, that is
1017[15:32:43] <ratrace> unless you need to :)
1018[15:32:56] <jelly> you mean, unless you buy very latest hardware
1019[15:33:21] <ratrace> no I don't mean that. I run kernel.org current LTS, ahead of Stalebian's updates
1020[15:33:39] <jelly> I like what debian kernel team ships.
1021[15:34:02] <jelly> we roll with that
1022[15:34:14] <ratrace> because the kernel devs _want_ everyone to run latest, and they designed the (stable) patching policies around that requir^W desire.
1023[15:34:34] <H-var> I bought this fucking mini pci-e card and it's not supported in 5.10. Debian plans 5.11 in 2022, so now I have to compile this shit on my own like some hacker. I don't even know what I'm doing.
1024[15:34:39] <jelly> I think the only place we have custom kernel on debian is on some public exposed infra, where grsecurity is applied
1025[15:35:28] <jelly> H-var, please file a bug report for the kernel version in bullseye and ask for a backport of all the bluetooth and wifi bits to bullseye kernel.
1026[15:35:29] <ratrace> H-var: since you've been at this for the past several days..... could it be fastre/cheaper to just buy another, more compatible card? :)
1027[15:35:37] <H-var> I have no idea what is going on
1028[15:36:12] <jelly> _you_ have to compile it now, but maybe the next user with AX210 won't have to
1029[15:37:09] <H-var> so I just paste a screenshot, and explain what is not working, and they might add it to 5.10?
1030[15:37:29] <H-var> but they already fixed it in kernel
1031[15:37:39] <H-var> only, the fix is available in 5.11
1032[15:37:59] <ratrace> jelly: how does that process work btw... are such driver backports trickling down into stable point releases or one has to wait for debian-next?
1033[15:38:20] <H-var> you mean report on the debian's bugreport website, not the kernel.org website?
1034[15:38:33] <ratrace> yes
1035[15:38:50] <H-var> !bugreport
1036[15:38:53] <H-var> !bug
1037[15:38:54] <dpkg> Bug Tracking System for Debian packages, replaced-url
1063[15:56:32] <jelly> so if you do a dpkg -S /boot/vmlinuz-* ... it will report all the package names for kernels that are installed and that ship files starting with vmlinuz- in /boot directory
1065[15:57:15] <jelly> is an example result of that, and "linux-image-5.10.0-6-cloud-amd64" is the package name
1066[15:57:41] <H-var> oh, I see now. I will make a screenshot of the error during the boot of 5.12, and then report it to the debian bugtracking system mentioning the output of dpkg -S /boot/vmlinuz*5.12 as the package
1072[15:59:44] <H-var> so I will need to report it to kernel.org instead then
1073[15:59:56] <jelly> but fail to work. So you'd complain to Debian to say "your bloody linux-image-5.10.0-6-cloud-amd64 doesn't work right with my AX210 PCI ID [8086:2725] Subsystem [8086:4020] card,"
1074[16:01:03] <jelly> H-var, there are two different tracks here. First is making a custom kernel and verifying it supports your hw. Second is reporting that the distro kernel does not make your hw work correctly.
1075[16:01:40] <jelly> H-var, you don't, in general complain to upstream kernel that you didn't know how to build and run your kernel
1134[17:10:54] <H-var> I guess the issue is that the driver is written for 5.11 and is not adaptable to 5.12 or something. Idk, but if anyone wants to buy AX210 - you can buy it. It works perfectly on 5.11 kernel.
1146[17:13:38] <vsk> Hi my debian 10 laptop freezes all of a sudden when I watching Youtube videos. I have checked all the logs in the log viewer but could not identify anything.....what other facts I have to search please guide me
1147[17:14:20] <H-var> overheating CPU?
1148[17:14:35] <H-var> or damaged GPU\CPU
1149[17:14:36] <vsk> all logs mean : kern.log, sys.log, message.log
1150[17:14:44] <H-var> maybe it was overheated once before
1165[17:18:17] <vsk> H-var as per my knowledge and understanding which is limited ofcourse.......regarding the overheating thing I could see message like this i am not sure if that is cause............my point is I could not find any major descriptive thing....which seem like error there could be minor things
1166[17:18:25] *** Quits: xet7 (~xet7@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1167[17:18:52] <H-var> actually what you can do is you can download a stress test application
1168[17:19:03] <H-var> stress test your CPU GPU and RAM under full load
1169[17:19:12] <H-var> without opening any other stuff
1170[17:19:28] <H-var> better loading into terminal instead of desktop, and test from there
1171[17:20:45] <H-var> but even, if they pass the tests, there could still be some other hardware issues - something wrong with the motherboard
1172[17:20:58] <vsk> H-var this is what I saw in syslog few seconds before it froze.........also i does not happen occasionally once in 2 days esp when i watch youtube....first video stops playing then I close browser tab....slowly browzer also stops responding then whole pc
1173[17:21:09] <vsk> H-var Apr 29 19:33:03 Orion dhclient[650]: DHCPREQUEST for 192.168.100.8 on wlp12s0 to 192.168.100.1 port 67
1174[17:21:09] <vsk> Apr 29 19:33:03 Orion dhclient[650]: DHCPACK of 192.168.100.8 from 192.168.100.1
1175[17:21:58] <vsk> H-var my pc is connected to wifi router my IP address is given dhcp so occassionaly the above thing is logged
1184[17:24:30] <vsk> H-var around the same time I saw cpu throttle message "Apr 29 18:56:52 Orion kernel: [16536.254536] CPU1: Core temperature/speed normal
1185[17:24:30] <vsk> Apr 29 19:02:01 Orion kernel: [16845.151198] CPU1: Core temperature above threshold, cpu clock throttled (total events = 14075)" like this messages are repeating for about a min
1186[17:24:56] <oxek> /var/log/dpkg has nothing of interest
1188[17:25:38] <vsk> H-var this CPU temperature above threshold messages came about 20m before the freeze event
1189[17:25:38] <H-var> vsk that's the problem - cpu should be able to continue working even under 100% continuous load
1190[17:26:02] <H-var> even under 24/7 continuous 100% load CPU should never fail
1191[17:26:49] <afidegnum> hi, please what can you suggest for this exim4 config? I want to configure 2 servers, one relay mails to the second server which send outside. what additional confugraitons do i apply?
1192[17:27:00] <vsk> H-var right i am using 4GB RAM, 4GB swap and core 2 duo processor 2.33GHz.........is it supported for modern firefox-esr browser and debian 10
1208[17:30:57] <H-var> his CPU is overheating probably because fan is dirty, and cpu throttling is not implemented well
1209[17:31:20] <vsk> jelly : last time I opened the CPU fan 2 years back
1210[17:32:26] <vsk> H-var ok i will try that ....regarding "CPU throttling is not implemented well" anything I can do in this regard
1211[17:32:37] <H-var> you can do a really simple life hack - buy those plastic sexy stockings, cut them to size, fold into 2 layers, and cover all the PC holes with them
1236[17:44:52] <andrew_smart> vsk consider seeing if in this "frozen" condition you're able to switch to a virtual console, e.g. ctrl+alt+f2, or using magic sysrq keys to see if you're able to get the system responsive again
1237[17:45:54] <jelly> "hey your laptop looks sexy"
1255[17:59:59] <H-var> two pumps was totally unnecessary, but it looks cool
1256[18:01:31] <H-var> the PSU is hidden behind the video card. Air from the front fans cools down the radiator, and then goes right into the PSU's fan, and then it comes out from the top of the PSU and right into the top radiator, and fans, and then finally escapes through the top
1257[18:03:32] *** Parts: Kel (~KelMonsta@replaced-ip) ("Closing Window")
1303[19:00:02] <another> H-var: got any references for that claim?
1304[19:00:16] <sney> kernel.org is supported by sponsors, because the linux foundation is a non-profit. big non-profits get support from corporations. this is normal. companies like atmosera and google and microsoft and so on have a lot of money, so they provide things, that might include servers.
1306[19:00:33] <petn-randall> H-var: "This site is operated by the Linux Kernel Organization, Inc., a 501(c)3 nonprofit corporation, with support from the following sponsors."
1307[19:00:41] <petn-randall> None of those are Atmosera.
1308[19:00:51] <sney> "atmosera owns kernel.org" is wrong; "atmosera provides some infrastructure to the linux foundation" is accurate but your interpretation is stupid.
1309[19:01:20] <H-var> just found it interesting that kernel.org is owned by Atmosera Inc, and this company is owned by Microsoft's CEO, that's all...
1310[19:02:02] <sney> some parts of kernel.org live on a computer provided by atmosera, you mean.
1311[19:02:05] <sney> oh noes.
1312[19:02:07] <petn-randall> H-var: You haven't provided any sources. Until you do, I'll assume you made that up.
1316[19:05:46] <H-var> oh, I see. It's just when I tried to open an email that arrived from kernel.org, my email client warned me about "Dangerous content", and I was prompted to verify the owner of that email. After a verification, it said that the owner of the electronic letter was Atmosera
1325[19:10:15] <another> there's so much wrong with that, i don't even know where to begin
1326[19:10:33] <H-var> I know, right...
1327[19:10:51] <H-var> Microsoft holds the servers of kernel.org...
1328[19:11:00] <another> to clarify: i meant your statement
1329[19:11:35] <sney> "hey this is weird, why is this other company verifying emails from kernel.org?" "because corporate sponsors provide stuff to big non-profits whose tech they use." "ohh that makes sense, thanks for the explanation"
1332[19:14:18] <H-var> okay-okay - I know you guys know about it since forever, but I just found that out now. Just wanted to share. I didn't know everyone knows about it
1343[19:22:32] <ratrace> even if microsoft literally directly owned the domain and servers .... so what. they're already a significant contributor to the kernel code. they already own the infrastructure for vast majority of FOSS ecosystem, namely teh github.
1344[19:24:00] <alex11> (off topic but) i do think we ultimately need some sort of decentralized code hosting website
1345[19:24:48] <jelly> alex11, every time you do a "git clone" there's a decentralized copy.
1346[19:25:06] <another> if anyone cares: i dug a bit into it. 198.145.29.0/24 is registed to the the Linux Foundation and routed and announced by 198.145.0.0/19, AS2044 Atmosera
1347[19:25:25] <alex11> yeah, but i mean stuff like github but unable to be owned by a company
1348[19:25:36] <sussudio> without googling, is it just hosted on azure?
1349[19:25:50] <sney> do it like kernel.org, where the companies are welcome to sponsor but they don't control what the service does
1350[19:26:17] <sney> atm with github, technically microsoft could decide that some part of it isn't making enough money to justify keeping online, and bye-bye that part
1351[19:26:31] <sney> but yes we're getting into the ot weeds
1352[19:28:05] <aminvakil> alex11: i can't remember very well, but there was an incident in 2012 or 2013 where kernel.org got hacked somehow and nothing happened as everyone had a copy of source code on their pc
1356[19:29:42] <ratrace> alex11: git != github. if github literally disappeared today, all that code is in git trees of each contributor for each project. issues and other things may've perished, but that's all
1357[19:30:00] <alex11> ok, but it's still the basis for project discovery
1358[19:30:46] <aminvakil> alex11: do you have any other alternative?
1359[19:30:50] <ratrace> then everyone would re-origin to gitlab and discovery would be restored
1360[19:31:14] <alex11> not currently, but i'm talking in idealist terms
1361[19:31:37] *** Quits: szorfein (~daggoth@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1362[19:31:38] <another> there are people who use github for discovery?
1367[19:34:55] <alex11> okay, but it's still the de facto place for a lot of things
1368[19:35:19] <alex11> and if microsoft decided (or any company, this isn't specifically anti microsoft) to Be Evil migrating all these things to some other website would be a chore
1369[19:35:41] <another> sure. but i discover project usually by a link somewhere. not by using gh
1397[20:01:35] <H-var> I honestly don't understand why people called me "conspiracy" and lost their minds just because I casually mentioned it. I don't accuse anyone. I was just like "huh, that's funny" that's all. If I knew someone would be upset, I would rather just not say anything at all
1398[20:02:09] <imMute> I think most of the upsetness comes from it being wildly off topic
1399[20:02:51] <imMute> and it was stated more as a fact than an a curiosity. and it being very wrong played into that.
1401[20:05:06] <H-var> it's what my email client said "would you like to verify the owner"? I clicked YES, and it said "Owner: Atmosera Inc". So I thought @kernel.org's owner is Atmosera Inc. I mean, I trust my email client... In any case, it was programmed by a way more intelligent person than me, so I didn't even have a thought of doubt
1406[20:09:52] <imMute> I think it's more you're not understanding what "Owner" means in your email client. whois says kernel.org "Registrant Organization: The Linux Foundation"
1407[20:10:26] <greycat> owner *of what* was my initial thought
1443[20:26:50] <H-var> I feel like something's missing in there?
1444[20:26:53] <greycat> that's not how log files work
1445[20:27:27] <oxek> H-var: what do you mean? That's the entire output I saw on the screen
1446[20:27:41] <greycat> I don't *see* any other failures in there, so maybe google the error message that you got and see if there's a known bug in needrestart
1447[20:28:40] <oxek> I googled before coming here
1448[20:30:20] *** Quits: szorfein (~daggoth@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1466[20:41:14] <H-var> On August 8 it will be a full year since I logged into windows last time. I wanna buy a cake lol, but I do not know what to write on it. How about "sudo apt upgrade" xD
1508[21:02:26] <H-var> chriss_toni if you see firmware: failed to load - it means that probably you do not have that file. You can get that file from here: replaced-url
1509[21:02:31] <jelly> BCM4314 sounds similar to those wifi card from broadcom where you have to use a fwcutter tool to slice the firmware out of their blob
1510[21:02:45] <sussudio> firmware-brcm80211 is in non-free, so what i said before. don't know if this also contains BCM4313.
1511[21:03:01] <jelly> chriss_toni, you would put the file exactly at /lib/firmware/brcm/BCM43142A0-0489-e062.hcd
1518[21:06:05] <dpkg> The Broadcom BCM43142 is a hybrid 802.11n and Bluetooth 4.0 device. Its wireless LAN component (PCI ID 14e4:4365, incorrectly identified as BCM4365 by Broadcom's proprietary driver) is currently only supported by Broadcom's proprietary driver since version 6.30.223.126 (packaged for Debian 8 "Jessie" as broadcom-sta-dkms).
1527[21:11:13] <chriss_toni> I've found the driver on Github. thx for the Link. Who can i load this driver with no reboot. I have packed it on the right Path.
1528[21:11:19] <jelly> first result on goog's gives a github repo with that binary file. Maybe it's kosher, maybe it's malware for your radio chip, who knows!
1529[21:11:33] <chriss_toni> what?
1530[21:11:44] <jelly> chriss_toni, the easiest thing to do is indeed a reboot
1531[21:11:54] <chriss_toni> oki.
1532[21:12:08] <chriss_toni> what is malware? jelly
1535[21:13:00] <chriss_toni> thx but i need this driver for my Mocrosoft Mous.
1536[21:13:28] <chriss_toni> When i install this driver what is waiting for me?
1537[21:13:30] <greycat> firmware, not driver
1538[21:14:13] <chriss_toni> yes. oki i was a windows user.. ^.^
1539[21:14:19] <chriss_toni> befor
1540[21:14:35] <sney> it's probably as safe as anything you'd download for windows
1541[21:14:41] <sney> we just don't know, because the source isn't visible
1542[21:14:49] <greycat> Drivers are loaded into the Linux kernel and run on your computer. Firmware is loaded into your device, and runs on that device.
1543[21:15:08] <jelly> it's as safe as any random github repo -- we don't know what's in there
1544[21:15:43] <chriss_toni> okay.
1545[21:15:52] *** Quits: Night-Shade (~TimF@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
1546[21:16:38] <chriss_toni> the security on my laptop is okay when i use this firmware. it's safe for me. best thx.
1547[21:17:06] <chriss_toni> But a nother firmware was a kosher way
1548[21:17:09] <chriss_toni> ...
1549[21:17:17] <chriss_toni> öhm...
1550[21:17:24] <sney> with broadcom + bluetooth, this is probably your only option.
1551[21:17:58] <chriss_toni> sorry you mean a stick per usb??
1673[22:49:01] <metbsd> hmm should i keep debian testing or ubuntu? hard to pick
1674[22:49:07] <metbsd> they are pretty much same
1675[22:49:39] <mutante> this channel has bias for debian of course
1676[22:50:18] <metbsd> yes ok
1677[22:50:40] <monkwitdafunk> as long as you dont waste precious data you are okay. i am using 4G LTE
1678[22:51:00] <jhutchins> monkwitdafunk: There's not much luck involved with burning an iso to a usb drive. Checksum your download, use the correct command and you should have no problems. If you have problems, post the command you used here and will set you straight.
1680[22:51:53] <mutante> nowadays an actual "cp" of an iso to a (flash) drive works, back in the days you had to dd
1681[22:52:04] <monkwitdafunk> thank you jhutchins. yeah. i am rusty with my command line as i stopped using a computer longer than 30 minutes for maybe 3 years
1682[22:52:26] <monkwitdafunk> cp?
1683[22:52:28] <sney> a common problem with the DVD isos is people trying to boot from the DVD-2 (or 3, 4, etc) images, which don't contain a bootloader or installer progam, just packages
1684[22:52:32] <mutante> yea, like copy
1685[22:52:34] <sney> only disc 1 can boot and install
1686[22:52:51] <jhutchins> monkwitdafunk: Actually, I believe cp always worked, it just wasn't much advertised.
1687[22:53:05] <metbsd> does testing have security fix?
1688[22:53:26] <monkwitdafunk> jhutchins, have you herd of die.net?
1695[22:56:29] <monkwitdafunk> yes. i almost forgot. i am so rusty but i am back
1696[22:56:45] <mutante> monkwitdafunk: I couldn't resist the chance to say it: 'man man' (but to give you a better answer, yea. die.net is actually somewhat well known for man pages)
1697[22:57:47] *** Quits: Deyaa (uid190709@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
1698[22:57:57] <mutante> more literal answer maybe something like "man --all *"