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• 4[00:02:47] <ChillerDragon> my drive is full and i need more space but only in one directory so i plugged in another drive can i just mount that there and use it as this directory?
• 5[00:02:54] <ChillerDragon> or is that a bad idea?
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• 10[00:03:27] <azeem> ChillerDragon: that's usually a bad idea unless you know what you're doing
• 11[00:03:37] <ChillerDragon> meh
• 12[00:03:39] <azeem> ChillerDragon: is it a system directory, or somewhere in your $HOME
• 13[00:03:45] <ChillerDragon> something in home
• 14[00:03:53] <ChillerDragon> a data directory that grows and grows
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• 16[00:04:17] <azeem> if you mount it there, the old content will vanish I believe
• 17[00:04:34] <ChillerDragon> the old content of which drive?
• 18[00:04:51] <greycat> normally you would want to stop whatever's using this content, rename the directory it's in, recreate that directory, mount the new device there, and then copy the content over
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• 20[00:05:00] <ChillerDragon> yes
• 21[00:05:05] <ChillerDragon> that sounds good
• 22[00:05:12] <ChillerDragon> but is this some bad practice or soemthing
• 23[00:05:24] <ChillerDragon> its not temporary i want to use this permanent
• 24[00:05:29] <azeem> no what greycat said is good practise
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• 27[00:05:58] <ChillerDragon> but can i start my system that keeps writing to it then?
• 28[00:06:10] <ChillerDragon> no traps involved?
• 29[00:06:20] <azeem> what's writing to it exactly?
• 30[00:06:26] <ChillerDragon> a game server
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• 33[00:07:10] <greycat> that sounds unlikely to cause any issues, then
• 34[00:07:13] <azeem> I suggest to follow greycat's advise, which however involves shutting down the game server during the migration
• 35[00:07:23] <ChillerDragon> yea thats fine
• 36[00:07:35] <ChillerDragon> cool ima try
• 37[00:07:39] <ChillerDragon> im a bit scared tbh
• 38[00:08:02] <ChillerDragon> i never fully understood partitioning is this a usecase for that?
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• 41[00:08:12] <greycat> the renamed directory will hold what's essentially a backup copy
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• 43[00:08:14] <ChillerDragon> to presist it across reboots? or cant i do that across dirves
• 44[00:08:30] <greycat> add the mount to /etc/fstab to make it permanent
• 45[00:08:35] <ChillerDragon> ah ok
• 46[00:08:40] <ChillerDragon> and thats it?
• 47[00:08:45] <ChillerDragon> and then its a partition
• 48[00:09:04] <greycat> I assumed the partition had already been created, and the file system within it.
• 49[00:09:29] <ChillerDragon> the data drive currently has debian installed
• 50[00:09:34] <ChillerDragon> i thought i just mount it
• 51[00:09:36] <ChillerDragon> and rm -rf
• 52[00:09:42] <ChillerDragon> and then use it as data directory
• 53[00:09:55] <ChillerDragon> or should i do some proper reformatting?
• 54[00:10:01] <greycat> recreating the file system might be faster than rm -rf
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• 56[00:10:48] <ChillerDragon> ok so a disk wipe?
• 57[00:10:53] <ChillerDragon> fdsik*
• 58[00:10:54] <ChillerDragon> ok
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• 70[00:25:27] <ChillerDragon> ok yay the mounting worked now i think
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• 75[00:27:30] <ChillerDragon> im scared to edit /etc/fstab greycat is there a tool like on archlinux that does it for me?
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• 79[00:30:09] <themill> There's a couple of pretty good tools for that. vi is one, emacs is the other.
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• 88[00:35:09] <greycat> One of the tricks I like is, instead of mounting the file system by running a mount /dev/... command, edit fstab *first*, then use "mount /your/mountpoint" to mount it. This verifies that the fstab line is working.
• 89[00:35:43] <ChillerDragon> why?
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• 91[00:36:02] <ChillerDragon> i dont get it
• 92[00:36:02] <greycat> The last sentence I wrote explains why.
• 93[00:36:20] <ChillerDragon> i use the mount command?
• 94[00:36:28] <ChillerDragon> and the mount command then looks at fstab or what?
• 95[00:37:18] <ChillerDragon> sounds like a nice idea im not too sure what to write in fstab tho i do not know the UUID and can also only guess the other values
• 96[00:37:27] <greycat> Let's say your new device is UUID=12345 and your mount point is /home/john/gameserver. Instead of running "mount /dev/sdb3 /home/john/gameserver", you would edit fstab first, and then use "mount /home/john/gameserver" with no device, so it *has* to read fstab.
• 97[00:37:40] <ChillerDragon> ah
• 98[00:37:41] <greycat> And of course you use the UUID in the fstab line, not the temporary device name.
• 99[00:37:44] <ChillerDragon> i see that makes sense
• 100[00:38:01] <ChillerDragon> where do i get it from?
• 101[00:38:13] <ChillerDragon> oh probably fdisk l or something
• 102[00:38:19] <greycat> lsblk -f is one of many ways
• 103[00:38:30] <ChillerDragon> nice
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• 106[00:38:36] <ChillerDragon> and all the other values?
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• 108[00:40:59] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> hexadecimal
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• 110[00:43:10] <ChillerDragon> i mean what do i use as <option> <dump> and <pass> ?
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• 112[00:45:24] <ChillerDragon> ok i went with auto 0 0
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• 115[00:46:37] <ChillerDragon> oh nice it worked thanks so much greycat :)
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• 125[00:51:34] <sponix> Is there any advantage to a static swap partition vs a swap file ?
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• 127[00:52:15] <greycat> At one point, at least, the partition was considered much more efficient. Don't know whether that's still the case.
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• 129[00:52:36] <sponix> thanks
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• 144[01:17:33] <rawtaz> hi. am i right that replaced-url
• 145[01:18:00] <greycat> if there is a CVE you can check it on the Debian security tracker
• 146[01:21:12] <rawtaz> i think i found it, replaced-url
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• 148[01:22:33] <rawtaz> cheers
• 149[01:22:39] <themill> replaced-url
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• 156[01:33:05] <dff> jhutchins: i was switching user with su and not su -l
• 157[01:33:16] <greycat> !buster su
• 158[01:33:16] <dpkg> In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). See replaced-url
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• 163[01:42:11] <oxek> rawtaz: in case it's not clear, debian-stable has not been affected by that security bug
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• 165[01:42:30] <oxek> the debian tracker is misleading by saying it is "fixed" in buster
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• 169[01:45:47] <rawtaz> oxek: yeah, and that is because its using libgcrypt20, which isnt affected, correct?
• 170[01:46:42] <oxek> rawtaz: it's because the vuln was introduced in version 1.9.0, which has never been in debian-stable
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• 173[01:49:39] <rawtaz> i think thats the same as what i said effectively so we probably agree :P
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• 175[01:50:08] <rawtaz> but yeah it's more about the version of the package
• 176[01:50:27] <rawtaz> im curious why its named libgcrypt*20* when it's a 1.8 version number, do you know?
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• 178[01:52:11] <oxek> I've seen that in many libraries, no idea why
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• 181[01:54:54] <oxek> libraries ending with 0, or with any other number
• 182[01:55:49] <rawtaz> mm :)
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• 199[02:07:54] <oxek> look at my horrible search: apt list | awk -F/ '/^lib/ {print $1}' | grep -e '[0-9]$'
• 200[02:08:00] <oxek> lots of libraries that end with a number
• 201[02:10:51] <sney> that would be the soname, which refers to the library abi. see replaced-url
• 202[02:11:43] <sney> for your libgcrypt example, see how the actual binary produced is libgcrypt.so.20.* replaced-url
• 203[02:12:04] <sney> cc rawtaz
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• 214[02:31:50] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> can someone give me a cloak for ##linux
• 215[02:32:01] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> my host is blocked (irccloud)
• 216[02:32:01] <foxide> Wrong channel.
• 217[02:32:11] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> i know I'm banned from there
• 218[02:32:18] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> i need a cloak for it
• 219[02:32:28] <foxide> You need to talk to freenode staff.
• 220[02:32:34] <LEGITtimeTRAVELE> k
• 221[02:32:36] <jess> did someone say freenode staff
• 222[02:32:39] <foxide> replaced-url
• 223[02:32:41] <jess> we've spoken about this before LEGITtimeTRAVELE
• 224[02:32:45] <foxide> oh hi!
• 225[02:32:48] <jess> \o
• 226[02:33:07] <foxide> always watching, wazowski... always watching...
• 227[02:33:34] *** Quits: bertbob (~bertbob@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 228[02:34:03] <foxide> And I think web clients will override an unaffil cloak anyway.
• 229[02:34:13] <oxek> jess: I think LEGITtimeTRAVELE's interpretation of causality like "before" and "after" might be different
• 230[02:34:24] <jess> ah.
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• 232[02:35:25] *** LEGITtimeTRAVELE is now known as LEGITtimeTRAVELR
• 233[02:35:27] <LEGITtimeTRAVELR> there
• 234[02:35:31] <LEGITtimeTRAVELR> that's better
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• 273[03:11:24] <tinga> The AWS marketplace EC2 "Debian 10 Buster" image shows "Please login as the user "admin" rather than the user "root"." when trying to ssh in as root; where is this configured?
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• 275[03:12:08] <tinga> Aha, found it in .ssh/authorized_keys
• 276[03:13:00] <sney> what on earth
• 277[03:13:17] <sney> as if ssh bruteforce botnets don't also try 'admin'. absurd
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• 281[03:16:49] <ricky_clarkson> Hi. I'm on a corporate fork of Debian, and I started using XFCE recently. I see some processes like panel-14-notifi*, panel-10-action*, using >60% CPU constantly. It looks like they're XFCE panel widgets. Is there a common cause for that?
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• 285[03:20:34] <sney> ricky_clarkson: broadly, desktop stuff that seems to be using a lot of cpu is usually a symptom of something else, like an indexing service or some other false positive. however, we can't offer accurate support for derivative distros here since we can't know what changes were made. maybe ask in #xfce
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• 295[03:29:48] <ricky_clarkson> sney: Sure, I did that first. Thanks.
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• 313[03:50:37] <maxrazer> Does anyone know if obs-studio on debian comes with nvenc standard yet? I noticed that it does on KDE Neon. I would hope it could by now.
• 314[03:51:07] <maxrazer> It might be an Ubuntu only thing, but I would hope that the Debian maintainers could do it too.
• 315[03:51:46] <maxrazer> I'm looking on the changelog on an KDE Neon and the maintainer is debian.
• 316[03:52:22] <sney> so it's probably something that's in obs-studio in bullseye and up, but not buster?
• 317[03:53:20] <maxrazer> It probably wouldn't be buster, because it wasn't there last I checked just last time. However, the changelog says last updated march-2020, so that isn't that recent.
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• 320[03:53:42] <maxrazer> I used Debian testing/unstable in the past though. I had some issues, so I am running KDE Neon at the moment.
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• 324[03:54:39] <sney> do you have a link to this changelog you're looking at?
• 325[03:55:12] <maxrazer> It doesn't mention adding nvenc. I'm just using that to see when the package was last updated.
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• 327[03:55:38] <maxrazer> I might be able to find a link. I was using the apt changelog command.
• 328[03:55:56] <sney> ok, so it probably matches the same March-2020 entry from this? replaced-url
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• 330[03:57:09] <maxrazer> It matches that last entry exactly. The one for Sat, 28 Mar 2020
• 331[03:57:46] <maxrazer> So, that is the latest package I had and yet it has nvenc built in with the default build of the binary package.
• 332[03:57:58] <maxrazer> "latest package I have"
• 333[03:58:22] <maxrazer> And I'm pretty sure Debian testing/unstable hasn't even had it in second half of 2020.
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• 335[03:59:11] <sney> well, that changelog is the one for the package in unstable. and google says only obs-studio 23 and up have support for nvenc, so buster's 22.0.3 wouldn't be sufficient.
• 336[03:59:23] <maxrazer> I'm not sure it matters too much actually. The reason I like it is mostly because it shows user friendlyles. I'm actually planning on switching from Nvidia to AMD for better linux performance.
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• 338[03:59:53] <maxrazer> And that suggests to me that Ubuntu based distributions may have more things like that in the packages setup better.t
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• 340[04:00:15] <maxrazer> I don't know why, I don't really use it, but I wanted to in the past and now it is there and I was happy.
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• 342[04:00:33] <sney> if the changelog is debian's, then the package is the same (source) package as debian, unless ubuntu/neon are doing something *very* wrong
• 343[04:00:39] <maxrazer> And surprised to see nvenc on obs-studio with KDE-Neon.
• 344[04:00:55] <maxrazer> Oh, right the source is the same. That doesn't mean the binary is the same.
• 345[04:01:16] <maxrazer> And the binary is the build options, which will not have nvenc enabled. It could be the free software thing actually.
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• 349[04:01:45] <sney> I think the most likely scenario here is that your problems with testing prevented you from accurately testing this feature
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• 351[04:01:59] <maxrazer> Debian only allowing free software would prevent obs-studio from having nvenc enabled in the main repository. It would have to have another version with it enabled in the non-free repository.
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• 353[04:02:25] <maxrazer> maybe
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• 355[04:03:03] <maxrazer> I tried to install Kubuntu and the installer failed. Ubuntu is just about the only distro which I haven't been able to install over the years. The installer often crashes.
• 356[04:03:18] <maxrazer> But, KDE Neon installed fine.
• 357[04:03:25] <maxrazer> Which is based on Ubuntu LTS.
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• 359[04:03:37] <sney> congratulations, I guess?
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• 362[04:04:22] <maxrazer> I guess, but very disapointing that for years the Ubuntu installer has crashed. How could that be? I think at one point I tracked it down to some bug about changing the hostname during install.
• 363[04:04:31] <sney> feel free to try bullseye again, either now or a few more months into the freeze, it'll be much less of a moving target than it was last spring.
• 364[04:04:38] <maxrazer> I've had the Ubuntu install crash on me every time for at least 5 years.
• 365[04:04:42] <sney> you would probably have to ask #ubuntu for support of their installer.
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• 367[04:05:43] <maxrazer> I didn't make a note on what my problem was with Debian Unstable. I'm forgetting now. But, I don't think I'd want stable. Maybe testing, so it is at least rolling.
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• 369[04:06:50] <sney> debian does not do "rolling". testing, currently called bullseye, is the dev platform for the next stable release.
• 370[04:07:34] <maxrazer> Well, whatever you would call getting new upstream packages.
• 371[04:08:47] <maxrazer> I tried out some arch based distro's since that is a rolling release. But, the compiling from source was taking forever.
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• 373[04:09:38] <maxrazer> I think I didn't use all the cores on my CPU. I didn't know to set that. So, it could have been faster. It would be about 2 hours to build GZDoom.
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• 375[04:09:55] <maxrazer> Without using all the cores.
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• 378[04:10:21] <maxrazer> May I ask which desktop you use? I've been using Plasma a lot recently.
• 379[04:10:35] <sney> same, I've been a plasma user for the past ~6 years
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• 382[04:11:19] <maxrazer> Ok, yeah. it has been working pretty well. I did have one bug where some folder with thumbnail previews for music files caused Dolphin to crash every time, but other than that it has been very rubust and reliable.
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• 384[04:11:49] <maxrazer> And it was just one album that would do this. I have no idea why. It may be something wrong with those files. I may try to edit the album cover data.
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• 387[04:12:42] <smoking-crack> what's a good image hosting site that isn't imgur i need 25mb file capacity and original quality
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• 390[04:12:56] <smoking-crack> imgur only goes up to 15
• 391[04:13:06] <petn-randall> !paste
• 392[04:13:06] <dpkg> Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: replaced-url
• 393[04:13:24] <sney> imgbb has a 32MB limit, I don't know offhand what the quality settings are
• 394[04:13:33] <maxrazer> You want something free and temporary? I'm not sure I know one off hand.
• 395[04:13:36] <petn-randall> smoking-crack: ^^^ Maybe imgbb.com? Otherwise you'll have to use a paid service.
• 396[04:14:07] <sney> or stick a thing on a vps for that custom touch
• 397[04:14:13] <petn-randall> smoking-crack: For asking questions here you likely won't need higher resolution images. It's enough if it's readable or shows the issue.
• 398[04:14:15] <maxrazer> I know an interesting web hosting service that has pay-as-you-go and breaks down cpu,storage and bandwidtch charges seperately.
• 399[04:15:21] <maxrazer> Good for hosting static content and I think minimum payment is like 25 cents.
• 400[04:15:23] <smoking-crack> thx file bin workd
• 401[04:15:31] <smoking-crack> dpkg: thx
• 402[04:15:31] <dpkg> THX (R), the next generation surround sound, developed by a George Lucas company. (mplayer is not certified), or just say "Thanks"
• 403[04:15:40] <smoking-crack> replaced-url
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• 405[04:16:48] <smoking-crack> dpkg: bot?
• 406[04:16:48] <dpkg> I ain't no stinkin' bot. I am a finely tuned and hand crafted tool. Oh wait... I guess I am a bot (that you should not abuse).
• 407[04:17:01] <smoking-crack> dpkg: trigger
• 408[04:17:01] <dpkg> no idea, smoking-crack
• 409[04:17:22] <smoking-crack> is that a declarative statement? dpkg
• 410[04:17:23] <smoking-crack> lol
• 411[04:17:51] <smoking-crack> you have no idea, then smoking crack
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• 414[04:18:25] <sney> our dpkg is an infobot, it doesn't have intelligent responses to follow ups or anything
• 415[04:20:24] <smoking-crack> dpkg: markov chains
• 416[04:20:24] <dpkg> smoking-crack: have you tried replaced-url
• 417[04:20:59] <sorcerer> dpkg a private bot for this channel? or is it available for everyone?
• 418[04:21:00] <dpkg> okay, sorcerer
• 419[04:21:06] <sorcerer> :o
• 420[04:21:21] <petn-randall> smoking-crack: So, do you have a Debian support question?
• 421[04:21:34] <petn-randall> dpkg: forget a private bot for this channel? or
• 422[04:21:34] <dpkg> petn-randall: i didn't have anything called 'a private bot for this channel? or' to forget
• 423[04:22:10] <petn-randall> !dpkgbot
• 424[04:22:10] <dpkg> Please visit replaced-url
• 425[04:22:15] <petn-randall> sorcerer: ^^^
• 426[04:22:16] <smoking-crack> petn-randall: no, should i part or can i idle?
• 427[04:23:08] <petn-randall> smoking-crack: You can idle. We also have #debian-offtopic for social chat. If you want to play with the bot, please use /query dpkg, so you don't spam the channel.
• 428[04:23:34] <smoking-crack> k
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• 430[04:23:48] <sorcerer> ty
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• 473[05:19:08] <sh4d0w_w4lk3r> Hi
• 474[05:20:48] <sh4d0w_w4lk3r> q
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• 484[05:43:53] <The-Fly> I see that kernel 4.19.0-14 for Buster is out. Where would I locate the changelog for this kernel version ?
• 485[05:45:27] <sney> with 'apt changelog' on your local system, or via the versioned links on tracker.debian.org
• 486[05:46:26] <sney> this appears to be it: replaced-url
• 487[05:48:43] <The-Fly> perfect!
• 488[05:49:19] <The-Fly> I got a big file server (500TB) that I hate having to reboot, as I gotta send out notices to all the whiny users :) Looks like I dont need to worry for this kernel
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• 490[05:50:55] <sney> the main reason to reboot in a hurry would be if you are affected by any of these: replaced-url
• 491[05:51:10] <sney> (d-s-a is a good list to sub to if you are using debian in production)
• 492[05:51:38] *** Quits: adapter (~adapter@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 493[05:52:34] <The-Fly> excellent suggestion, I'm gonna go sign up for that right now
• 494[05:52:45] <The-Fly> and thanks for the link...fortunately i dont think any of that will impact me
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• 496[05:53:34] <sney> np
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• 602[08:37:49] <queip> how to configure softraid, raid mirror, to read each sector from both devices and verify are they identical (fail with device error otherwise)?
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• 614[08:44:32] <rudi_s> You can manually force it with "check" (writing it to /sys/block/md$x/md/sync_action) but AFIAK you can't force it during regular use.
• 615[08:44:44] <rudi_s> queip: ^
• 616[08:46:15] <queip> rudi_s: very sad
• 617[08:46:43] <ASDX> someone (not me, I swear!) increased a couple disks' sizes on a VM running Debian 10 in VMware while the OS is running (including the boot and root filesystems), and it's not using LVM! Is there a way to make this work without breaking the VM? i would've thought running partprobe and then something like resize2fs would require the filesystems to be unmounted?
• 618[08:46:59] <queip> or well, quite sad, a work around probably is to put FS on top of integrit device, which has raid under it. that will detect problem too
• 619[08:48:29] <ph4nt0m> hi all
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• 621[08:49:55] <MrBuck> hi one
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• 623[08:51:07] <ratrace> queip: with dm-integrity under it
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• 625[08:51:45] <rudi_s> zfs is an alternative (I cannot recommend btrfs because it's raid is very buggy, as is btrfs in general)
• 626[08:51:46] <ratrace> there is otherwise little point in scrubbing as mdadm has no idea which one is correct
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• 628[08:51:59] <ratrace> btrfs's raid1 is very fine.
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• 630[08:54:58] <ratrace> also... I _can_ recommend btrfs, been running it on critical systems. the only problem with it is understanding the quirks and staying away from problematic areas, like raid5/6.
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• 648[09:11:38] <queip> ratrace: when ever I tried btrfs, it corrupted my data
• 649[09:12:16] <queip> rudi_s: zfs is so buggy it can corrupt your data when your hibernate the system. 10 year old bug - replaced-url
• 650[09:12:24] <ratrace> I'm sure that's quite a hyperbole, or you tried it long time ago when indeed it was buggy
• 651[09:12:51] <queip> ratrace: well tried it once or twice. Destroying my data once is enough.
• 652[09:13:03] <ratrace> ZFS ate my data just last year. meanwhile, both ZFS and BTRFS can and should be used together, between production and backups. which one to which, depends on preferences
• 653[09:13:41] <queip> I guess I will have to go with raid + dm-integrity. it is somewhat slow afair
• 654[09:13:48] <ratrace> other than still experimental dm-integrity, there is no other software mechanism in *NIX world for integrity protected storage.
• 655[09:14:20] <queip> ratrace: you would put 2 integrity, one on each device, and softraid mirror on top, or place 1 integrit on top of raid?
• 656[09:14:24] <ratrace> mdadm + dm-integrity under it is not a bad choice. it also has its quirks one has to be aware of
• 657[09:14:45] <ratrace> queip: the only way to ensure mdadm actually restoring data is to put dm-integrity UNDER it, and have enough redundancy
• 658[09:15:27] <ratrace> anything else is just signalling and 50% chance (for 2-way raid1) for mdadm to further corrupt data, in actual corruption situations.
• 659[09:16:09] <rudi_s> queip: Put it below raid or you won't be able to recover errors.
• 660[09:16:19] <rudi_s> Ah, ra<tab> already said it
• 661[09:16:41] <queip> how immune that is to 2 sectors failing at same time? e.g. when computer hands just when writting a sector... raid mirror first does some write-intend? also how this cooperates with integrity
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• 663[09:17:46] <rudi_s> I don't know if dm-integrity also tracks age. If it doesn't, then you cannot know which sector is correct (basically a raid-5-write-hole).
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• 665[09:17:54] <ratrace> dm-integrity is checked on read, unless whatever is atop of mdadm does a read-check right after write, dm-integrity won't be too useful in write-only situations, except to write checsums which will be checked later
• 666[09:18:50] <ratrace> all dm-integrity does is cause full sector read error in case of failed check. then mdadm atop of it, by design, re-reads same logical sector, from another redundant member, and re-writes that data into the failed one
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• 668[09:19:45] <ratrace> and since dm-integrity is still experimental and from what I've seen very little used, your best bet is to create a test system and start faulting it
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• 672[09:21:28] <ratrace> there are userland tools kernel devices (like dm-flakey) that can help with that.
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• 697[09:52:19] <thnee> With the new GUI login screen, it does not read my .xinitc like it did when I was using startx. How can I make it read the .xinitrc?
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• 703[09:57:45] <lupulo> thnee, do you have read the file /etc/X11/xinit/xinitrc ?
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• 758[10:46:51] <serard> Hello
• 759[10:47:20] <serard> How do I set preseed file to include an apt repository (buster backport to install kernel 5.9)
• 760[10:47:24] <serard> ? :)
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• 818[11:32:46] <quiliro> hello....
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• 820[11:34:40] <quiliro> I want the dxf import/export libraries for FreeCAD in the debian repositories. Are they available from Debian?
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• 823[11:36:25] <munsking> hello, i just installed debian 10 on a "minix neo z83-4 plus" and everything went well, but when i boot the screen goes black after checking my disks. ssh still works though. i think i might be missing a graphics driver or something, where can i find it?
• 824[11:36:54] <munsking> lspci | grep -i vga tells me it's this controller: "Intel Corporation Atom/Celeron/Pentium Processor x5-E8000/J3xxx/N3xxx Series PCI Configuration Registers"
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• 828[11:37:51] <quiliro> mukmuk: The "or something" text would be useful.
• 829[11:38:39] <quiliro> sorry, that was for munsking
• 830[11:39:06] <munsking> quiliro: i have no "or something" text, i'm just assuming it's missing the graphics driver
• 831[11:39:07] <quiliro> I guess it is too quick to see it.
• 832[11:39:13] <munsking> yea
• 833[11:40:06] <munsking> journalctl -xe says: "intel_sst_acpi 808622A8:00: firmware: failed to load intel/fw_sst_22a8.bin"
• 834[11:40:09] <quiliro> The black screen means the X11 server is using a resolution not supported by the driver you are using
• 835[11:40:25] <munsking> quiliro: there's no X11 installed yet, it should be the TTY
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• 839[11:40:55] <quiliro> that file is probably the nonfree firmware which debian did not provide
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• 842[11:41:17] <munsking> can i enable a non-free repo? or would i have to install it manually?
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• 844[11:42:03] <quiliro> you could...it would hurt your freedom
• 845[11:42:31] <munsking> as much of an issue i have with that personally, it's for work so i don't really have a choice in the matter
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• 847[11:42:50] <quiliro> sorry
• 848[11:42:57] <munsking> same
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• 851[11:44:46] <quiliro> If you would like the freedom-respecting way, maybe you can get some lower resolution by using the generic driver
• 852[11:45:12] <quiliro> If you want that, I can help you search for how to do it.
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• 854[11:45:14] <munsking> how would i set the resolution for a tty?
• 855[11:45:16] <serard> Hello
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• 857[11:45:30] <serard> Do you know a shell script which keeps your system clean with one kernel, etc. ?
• 858[11:46:13] <quiliro> munsking: Are you sure you are not already in a tty? How did you get the information from journalctl
• 859[11:46:15] <quiliro> ?
• 860[11:46:44] <quiliro> serard: what do you mean clean?
• 861[11:47:09] <quiliro> serard: Do you want to remove all kernels except one?
• 862[11:47:31] <serard> in past, I have downloaded such a script which keeps your /boot clean, also clean logs, such things
• 863[11:47:47] <munsking> quiliro: i logged in via ssh, the TTY works but i just can't see it, if i type my credentials on the machine i can see the login worked (using "w" via ssh)
• 864[11:47:53] <quiliro> never used that, serard
• 865[11:48:03] <serard> quiliro, thanks anyway
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• 868[11:49:07] <quiliro> munsking: what do you mean by using w?
• 869[11:49:22] <quiliro> ssh -w
• 870[11:49:24] <quiliro> ?
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• 872[11:49:42] <munsking> the command "w", the thing that shows which user is logged in where and running what
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• 874[11:50:15] <quiliro> ok...so you do not see it on the machine
• 875[11:50:38] <quiliro> on the machine's monitor
• 876[11:50:44] <quiliro> is what I mean
• 877[11:50:45] <munsking> no, i cannot see anything on the machine, the display goes black after grub and checking the disk is fine
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• 879[11:51:31] <quiliro> I think that if you edit your grub at boot, you can use the generic driver
• 880[11:52:00] <quiliro> and if you remove the intel driver, the machine will boot with the generic driverç
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• 882[11:52:15] <quiliro> you have those two options
• 883[11:52:21] <quiliro> in freedom
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• 886[11:52:27] <munsking> okay, how and where would i do that? during grub or edit /etc/defaults/grub and running update-grub?
• 887[11:52:53] <munsking> i already tried installing the non-free intel video driver and that didn't help anyway
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• 889[11:53:15] <quiliro> I have done it at boot...I guess you could edit and then grub-update, but I do not remember how
• 890[11:53:36] <quiliro> at boot it is easy
• 891[11:54:32] <quiliro> I think that you add vga=775 at the boot line
• 892[11:55:02] <munsking> ok, i'll give it a shot
• 893[11:55:16] <quiliro> editing grub might make your system unbootable with update-grub
• 894[11:55:49] <quiliro> you press esc when grub kicks in
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• 896[11:56:11] <quiliro> then it will give you the option to "e"dit the boot line
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• 899[11:57:09] <munsking> and where exactly do i add the vga part?
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• 901[11:58:23] <quiliro> munsking: maybe this, I have not read it replaced-url
• 902[11:58:31] <ksk> Are there any discussions about moving away from GnuPG in Debian?
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• 904[11:59:55] <quiliro> munsking: why don't you remove the intel driver?
• 905[12:00:08] <munsking> quiliro: i did, didn't help :P
• 906[12:00:08] <quiliro> it _is_ the problem
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• 908[12:00:32] <quiliro> you said you installed it...did you remove it?
• 909[12:01:01] <munsking> first i installed the free one, that didn't work, then the non-free, still nothing, so i removed it again
• 910[12:01:13] <munsking> intel-media-va-driver
• 911[12:01:40] <munsking> it's the only intel thing that's installed (apt list --installed | grep -i intel)
• 912[12:03:28] <quiliro> different error message?
• 913[12:03:42] <munsking> nope
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• 915[12:04:03] <quiliro> weird it mentions intel without the driver, then
• 916[12:04:16] <quiliro> probably the driver is still installed
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• 924[12:12:29] <munsking> quiliro: found something! displayport works, hdmi doesn't
• 925[12:14:09] <quiliro> munsking: neat!
• 926[12:14:49] <quiliro> I also noticed something: "intel_sst_acpi 808622A8" might not be video
• 927[12:15:08] <quiliro> check lspci for that
• 928[12:15:12] <munsking> brcmfmac mmc1:0001:1: firmware failed to load brcm/brcmfmac43455-sdio
• 929[12:15:23] <munsking> yea no that might be the audio firmware
• 930[12:15:40] <quiliro> but you do not always need the firmware
• 931[12:15:56] <quiliro> I have some of those messages too and work fine
• 932[12:19:34] <quiliro> yes, it looks like the intel audio firmware
• 933[12:19:45] <quiliro> do not mind it
• 934[12:20:21] <quiliro> first remove the intel video driver you installed and then test the vga=775 suggestion I made
• 935[12:20:28] <quiliro> at grub
• 936[12:21:59] <quiliro> munsking: oh...but you do not need it any more because you connected svga display now!
• 937[12:22:28] <munsking> why would that vga thing help if it's working with displayport? to me that means something else is iffy
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• 947[12:30:15] <quiliro> munsking: the ports each have a different software which deals with them
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• 949[12:31:25] <quiliro> munsking: so you solved your issue?
• 950[12:31:45] <munsking> not sure yet, just testing some stuff, but at least i have something working now, thanks for the help!
• 951[12:31:46] <quiliro> (with that solution you found)
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• 954[12:32:37] <quiliro> good! the best is to find our own solutions...it helps create autonomy, munsking
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• 956[12:33:42] <quiliro> never used hdmi
• 957[12:33:45] <quiliro> or dvi
• 958[12:33:54] <quiliro> only old pure svga
• 959[12:34:06] <quiliro> and now I am on a 32 bit machine!
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• 961[12:34:46] <quiliro> I want the dxf import/export libraries for FreeCAD in the debian repositories. Are they available from Debian?
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• 963[12:35:24] <quiliro> or some software to transfor a freecad sketch to dxf
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• 965[12:37:54] <jelly> munsking, the "vga=" kernel boot options specifies the graphic mode to set up instead of the default one, using VGA BIOS API of the card. Does not matter what kind of physical output there is.
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• 968[12:39:02] <jelly> it hasn't been very useful since kernel modesetting caught up
• 969[12:39:55] <jelly> and it's probably even less useful on a machine that boots via UEFI and not BIOS
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• 979[12:51:40] <quiliro> good to know, jelly
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• 1004[13:15:27] <fourstepper> hi, I am bit out of the loop here: what is the best place to track decisions regarding Chromium addition/exclusion in Debian 11?
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• 1083[14:37:55] <jelly> fourstepper, what decisions?
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• 1144[15:22:37] <Iridos> is there a command to show me where the unit file for a systemd service is?
• 1145[15:25:04] <ChmEarl> sudo systemctl status docker | grep loaded| awk '{print $3}'
• 1146[15:25:07] <Iridos> mmh. guess systemctl --full edit service is supposed to do that
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• 1180[15:47:53] <last1> I'm trying to install go, I see in apt cache as golang-1.8.9 . but all the tutorials I see on the web recommend downloading from their website
• 1181[15:47:59] <last1> can I use the package ?
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• 1190[15:56:23] <hop> last1: of course you "can"…
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• 1198[16:00:53] <last1> except it's mired in a controversy apparently about where to place the go binary
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• 1200[16:01:05] <last1> you need golang-go to have 'go' available and that installs 1.7
• 1201[16:01:08] <last1> such a mess
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• 1208[16:06:42] <hop> last1: which debian release are you on?
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• 1213[16:07:18] <last1> 9.6
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• 1215[16:08:17] <hop> and what are your goals with go?
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• 1218[16:09:06] <last1> to simply run this program: replaced-url
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• 1220[16:09:33] <last1> took about 1h so far, I got it working..downloaded the tar.gz file and unpacked it directly in /usr/local
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• 1223[16:09:53] <last1> the debian package is up to 1.8, this package requires 1.9+
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• 1227[16:10:46] <greycat> why the fuck are there 90 trillion packages with "golang" in their names
• 1228[16:10:50] <hop> debian buster is on 1.11 and backports on 1.14, if i see that correctly
• 1229[16:11:00] <greycat> someone take pity on me and tell me the damned package name
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• 1232[16:11:28] <hop> because modularisation? *mumble*
• 1233[16:11:40] <greycat> unicorn:~$ apt-cache search --names-only go lang | wc
• 1234[16:11:40] <greycat> 1540 13078 124256
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• 1236[16:11:45] <greycat> seriously, what the fuck is that
• 1237[16:12:01] <jelly> lib-foo-perl, only newer?
• 1238[16:12:28] <greycat> is "golang" the one we want to look at?
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• 1241[16:12:47] <greycat> ,v golang
• 1242[16:12:48] <judd> Package: golang on amd64 -- jessie: 2:1.3.3-1; jessie-security: 2:1.3.3-1+deb8u2; stretch: 2:1.7~5; stretch-backports: 2:1.11~1~bpo9+1; buster: 2:1.11~1; buster-backports: 2:1.14~1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 2:1.15~1; sid: 2:1.15~1
• 1243[16:12:50] <last1> golang-go installs the binary
• 1244[16:12:56] <last1> in bin
• 1245[16:12:58] <greycat> So, current stable has "golang" version 1.11.
• 1246[16:13:01] <last1> otherwise, it's in /usr/lib
• 1247[16:13:14] <greycat> Your insistence on running an old release is what's causing your issues. Assuming I have the right package name.
• 1248[16:13:22] <jelly> <last1> I'm trying to install go, I see in apt cache as golang-1.8.9 .
• 1249[16:13:26] <hop> golang is the meta package
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• 1251[16:13:41] <jelly> last1, can you pastebin that apt-cache command and the full output?
• 1252[16:13:55] <last1> that's fine, I installed from golang.org 1.15, all is good
• 1253[16:14:19] <jelly> last1, asking because I don't see 1.8 in any debian release
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• 1255[16:14:38] <last1> hmm
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• 1257[16:15:19] <last1> replaced-url
• 1258[16:15:43] <jelly> ,v golang-1.8
• 1259[16:15:44] <judd> Package: golang-1.8 on amd64 -- stretch: 1.8.1-1; stretch: 1.8.1-1+deb9u1; stretch-security: 1.8.1-1+deb9u1
• 1260[16:15:54] <jelly> fun
• 1261[16:16:16] <jelly> okay then. Still if you're on stretch you could have tried 1.11 from backports
• 1262[16:16:39] <greycat> *nod* good choice
• 1263[16:16:41] <jelly> but Go is weird
• 1264[16:16:55] <jelly> might be a better idea to go with upstream builds. who knows
• 1265[16:17:28] <greycat> upgrading to Debian stable may also be a reasonable choice, depending on what the reasons are for being on 9
• 1266[16:17:51] <jelly> at least it creates almost-static binaries, so you can build your stuff anywhere and transplate them huge executable
• 1267[16:17:53] <RadoS> !rename
• 1268[16:18:01] <jelly> s to an older OS
• 1269[16:18:10] *** Quits: store_scarecrow (~Andrew_00@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 1270[16:18:11] <last1> does debian offer easy upgrades these days ?
• 1271[16:18:17] <greycat> It always has.
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• 1273[16:18:55] <jelly> last1, they're less easy than Ubuntu's do-release-upgrade script, but still reasonably safe and easy IF you read the release notes
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• 1275[16:19:30] <last1> I come from FreeBSD where it's been a one-liner for like 4 versions now if not more
• 1276[16:19:42] <last1> with Debian I had to change files manually, etc
• 1277[16:19:44] <last1> never bothered
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• 1280[16:19:50] <last1> easier to just install new
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• 1282[16:20:21] <jelly> then do what's easier for you
• 1283[16:20:22] <greycat> You've gotta have a *seriously* non-custom system for a full new install to be easier than a dist-upgrade.
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• 1289[16:20:57] <jelly> or a trivial setup where nothing important is configured. Or be 3-4 releases behind
• 1290[16:21:17] <last1> yeah, this is a simple clamav-daemon running server
• 1291[16:21:19] <greycat> Yeah, that's what I mean by non-custom. A system where *nothing* was configured, installed, or changed by the admin.
• 1292[16:21:20] <jelly> I don't call release upgrades dist-upgrades.
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• 1298[16:23:32] <jelly> clamav maintainers have a rather complex setup of upgrading configuration in place with ucf, I have some systems with mail services that have survived in-place release upgrades from Debian 3 to Debian 9 or so
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• 1307[16:25:30] <oxek> what does ubuntu's do-release-upgrade do extra compared to just changing the sources.list to point to the next release? That's how I've always upgraded debian, and it works in ubuntu too (between LTS releases).
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• 1309[16:26:30] <oxek> following that question, would it make sense for debian to create their own do-release-upgrade tool?
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• 1312[16:27:08] <greycat> Sounds a bit hand-holdy and fragile to me.
• 1313[16:27:41] <oxek> yeah, the hand-holdy was me impression of the ubuntu tool as well, but perhaps it does something useful that I don't understand
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• 1315[16:27:45] <greycat> Debian has an absurdly large number of possible configurations and package sets, so I doubt any tool could be created that would work on 95% of them.
• 1316[16:28:21] <greycat> I'm sure it would work great on "I stuck the CD in and hit Enter until it was done".
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• 1318[16:28:43] <oxek> and yet it's fine for debian to upgrade by changing sources.list, whereas ubuntu (which likely has much fewer possible configurations than debian) has a special tool for it.
• 1319[16:29:04] <greycat> Debian has release notes that you must read and follow.
• 1320[16:29:12] <hop> the ubuntu-illusion
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• 1322[16:30:26] <oxek> hop: what do you mean?
• 1323[16:31:57] <ratrace> do-release-upgrade is not really required even on ubuntu. it's another NIH from canonical
• 1324[16:32:10] <hop> ubuntu "just works". until it doesn't. but no worries, just follow some totally unrelated advice from a random google search and it will magically be fixed
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• 1328[16:34:04] <ratrace> btw, ubuntu has a bit more configurations . PPAs are native there, now snaps too, they have also .deb packages that actually really just install a snap, and there's more flavors and releases active at the same time
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• 1330[16:34:29] <jelly> oxek, it does some useful stuff, including but not limited to setting up a screen session, setting up a secondary sshd if you're doing things remote, and there are custom tuneups for various issues during the release upgrade (mgt of nvidia blob drivers, for example). It's a tiny but full-blown python app.
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• 1333[16:34:55] <oxek> interesting, thank you
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• 1335[16:35:55] <jelly> lots of the stuff that debian's release notes suggest to do manually, they do automatically, like screen and script
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• 1337[16:38:41] <jelly> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root 9873 Jan 24 2020 ubuntu-release-upgrader-0s6qcf46/apt_btrfs_snapshot.py # apparently there might also be some support for "undo" for people using crazy experiemntal filesystems
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• 1341[16:48:16] <ratrace> "crazy experiemntal filesystems" LOL. no
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• 1343[16:50:00] <oxek> well, btrfs is a "crazy experimental filesystem" in the kernel that debian-stable is using. It is much more mature in the latest kernels.
• 1344[16:50:37] <oxek> really looking forward to kernel 5.10 to hit buster-backports
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• 1346[16:53:11] <oxek> when 5.10 hits the backports kernel package, will it keep on tracking 5.10 LTS, or will it eventually upgrade to 5.11,5.12,etc? I want it to track LTS.
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• 1351[16:56:15] <greycat> backports are not automated
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• 1354[16:58:52] <maxrazer> -Sney, Do you use Debian stable, testing or unstable?
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• 1366[17:08:53] <ratrace> oxek: stuff in backports is whatever is in testing + delay. since this period is overlapping with bullseye release, it probably won't get to 5.11 before then
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• 1369[17:10:00] <ratrace> (and I'm talking here about the kernel, there's no rule about what goes into backports for packages in general .. whatever the maintainers decide is worthy bringing to stable)
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• 1373[17:14:56] <neilthereildeil> hey guys
• 1374[17:15:12] <neilthereildeil> im having trouble staying connected to my wifi network from Linux
• 1375[17:15:18] <neilthereildeil> can someone p[lease help?
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• 1381[17:18:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1211
• 1382[17:18:32] <neilthereildeil> i get disconnected when i set wireless mode to Auto. i think its using 802.11ax in this mode.
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• 1386[17:22:29] <neilthereildeil> but when i set "wireless mode=Legacy" on thr router, i stay connected to 2.4 and 5GHz reliably
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• 1389[17:24:40] <Mister00X> neilthereildeil: I think we need at least the name of your hardware to help you
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• 1396[17:26:40] <vanfanel64> I have an sdcard that I want to assign to a constant mount point, so instead of random looking /media/$user/$numbersandhyphens /media (or /mnt) /something/fixed
• 1397[17:26:50] *** Joins: geeyae (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 1398[17:27:16] <vanfanel64> I have searched but Iam having trouble finding information about this.
• 1399[17:27:37] <towo`> give it a label
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• 1401[17:27:41] <neilthereildeil> Asus RT-AX56U router
• 1402[17:27:51] <towo`> then it's allways /media/$user/label
• 1403[17:27:53] <neilthereildeil> Mister00X
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• 1405[17:28:42] <hegemoOn> hey
• 1406[17:28:49] <hegemoOn> i have a little issue with some servers
• 1407[17:29:00] <hegemoOn> they were stuck from update since few months
• 1408[17:29:08] <hegemoOn> due to grub-pc update
• 1409[17:29:16] <hegemoOn> so i just got access to them today
• 1410[17:29:20] <Mister00X> neilthereildeil: I dont think we can help here if the router is the culprit. I meant your wifi card...
• 1411[17:29:36] <hegemoOn> (like my customer forgot those servers and just discover them today).
• 1412[17:29:46] <hegemoOn> so basically, i just want to update on package
• 1413[17:29:50] <hegemoOn> not grub-pc
• 1414[17:29:59] <hegemoOn> but each time im trying apt install foobar
• 1415[17:30:18] <hegemoOn> it blocks because it says i need to run dpkg --reconfigure -a
• 1416[17:30:26] <towo`> then do that
• 1417[17:30:27] <hegemoOn> to deal with grub-pc
• 1418[17:30:30] <hegemoOn> no
• 1419[17:30:37] <neilthereildeil> Mister00X: Intel Wireless 8265/8275
• 1420[17:30:48] <neilthereildeil> FYI i dual boot this laptop and wifi is reliable on windows
• 1421[17:31:00] <hegemoOn> they didnt update since june 2020
• 1422[17:31:07] <hegemoOn> i cannot reboot them at hand
• 1423[17:31:09] *** Quits: nitefall (~thewellin@replaced-ip) (Quit: nitefall)
• 1424[17:31:20] <towo`> "it says i need to run dpkg --reconfigure -a"
• 1425[17:31:41] <towo`> it the system is sying that, you have to do it!
• 1426[17:32:19] <greycat> --reconfigure or --configure?
• 1427[17:32:41] *** Joins: oxek (oxek@replaced-ip)
• 1428[17:33:12] <Mister00X> neilthereildeil: is your wifi firmware up to date?
• 1429[17:33:26] <towo`> i would oracle it's dpkg --configure -a
• 1430[17:33:27] <hegemoOn> --configure
• 1431[17:33:28] <hegemoOn> ok
• 1432[17:33:46] <hegemoOn> it's alright, in fact postinst grub-pc was stuck since june 2020
• 1433[17:33:56] *** Joins: nitefall (~thewellin@replaced-ip)
• 1434[17:33:57] <hegemoOn> killed it and i was able to run dpkg again
• 1435[17:34:05] <hegemoOn> and avoided to install grub-pc update
• 1436[17:34:12] *** Quits: geeyae (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: geeyae)
• 1437[17:34:17] <hegemoOn> i just updated my foobar package
• 1438[17:34:19] <hegemoOn> thank towo`
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• 1442[17:35:14] <ratrace> okay I'll bite. why is that system not updated regularly and normally?
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• 1445[17:35:57] <vanfanel64> towo`, Thanks, I wasn't quite aware of that. What I was wondering is if there is a way to override the mount point by other means, not related to the label?
• 1446[17:36:19] <hegemoOn> ratrace: customer run a crontab
• 1447[17:36:21] <towo`> vanfanel64, you can make a entrie in /etc/fstab
• 1448[17:36:37] <towo`> with noauto as mountoption
• 1449[17:36:39] <hegemoOn> but crontab was stuck with grub-pc update
• 1450[17:36:48] <hegemoOn> from june 2020
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• 1452[17:37:26] <ratrace> hegemoOn: oh okay, so you can now upgrade it normally?
• 1453[17:37:40] *** Joins: korzq (~korzq@replaced-ip)
• 1454[17:37:47] <hegemoOn> yes it just happen they remember those 17 servers today
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• 1456[17:37:52] <hegemoOn> and i got root access on them
• 1457[17:37:59] <ratrace> must be some very important servers then :)
• 1458[17:38:00] <hegemoOn> of course it runs a critical application...
• 1459[17:38:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1217
• 1460[17:38:10] <hegemoOn> so i cannot reboot them at will
• 1461[17:38:11] <vanfanel64> towo`, I thought about fstab but I don't want every sdcard to have that mount point, just this particular one
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• 1464[17:38:37] <towo`> vanfanel64, write an udev-rule
• 1465[17:38:48] <ratrace> hegemoOn: then they're not _that_ critical. critical stuff has failover and you can upgrade them in A/B fashion
• 1466[17:38:52] <vanfanel64> I've never done anything with udev
• 1467[17:38:58] <hegemoOn> ratrace:let's say that covid19 home office lockdown curfew have impact on corporate business :)
• 1468[17:39:23] <hegemoOn> ratrace: this is why i started this consulting mission last june
• 1469[17:39:30] *** Quits: Ticho_ (~Ticho@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 1470[17:39:32] <ratrace> neat!
• 1471[17:39:36] <hegemoOn> to implement such basic mechanisms
• 1472[17:39:46] <hegemoOn> they are all quant dev statistician
• 1473[17:39:57] <hegemoOn> and they only know rust/go/haskell/ada
• 1474[17:40:05] <hegemoOn> not much about how to manage servers
• 1475[17:40:07] <hegemoOn> :)
• 1476[17:40:13] *** Parts: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip) ("vergissmeinnicht")
• 1477[17:40:58] <hegemoOn> and they only have dev mindest, not any kind of operationnal/sysadmin/devops mindset
• 1478[17:41:53] <hegemoOn> so my task is automation/ansible/log management/system management
• 1479[17:42:03] <hegemoOn> all those things they are illiterate about
• 1480[17:42:04] <ratrace> that's okay, and that's why people hire competent sysadmins
• 1481[17:42:26] <hegemoOn> yeah but sometime it's quite depressing from my pov
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• 1483[17:42:44] <ratrace> but you get to: a) fix it, b) get paid to fix it :)
• 1484[17:42:45] <hegemoOn> but i satify myself telling me that this is the way i can pay my loan and feed my children
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• 1488[17:43:39] <oxek> my internet dropped out, was there any explanation why linux-image-amd64 was steadily updating kernels all the way through 5.x?
• 1489[17:43:54] <hegemoOn> to worsen the things, im more accustomed with RH in corporate environment
• 1490[17:43:56] <oxek> and an answer about whether 5.10 from backports will stay 5.10 or upgrade to 5.11 eventually
• 1491[17:43:58] <hegemoOn> but they are full debian :)
• 1492[17:44:33] <hegemoOn> so it's a little challenging, cause im not that much comfortable as with RH ecosystem which i practised since many years at works
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• 1503[17:54:29] <ratrace> oxek: linux-image-amd64 in stable is steadily updating kernels within the 4.19.x LTS branch only
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• 1505[17:54:36] <vanfanel64> towo`, I am having trouble figuring out how to properly change the label. df -T says type is "fuseblk" and fdisk says "HPFS/NTFS/exFAT" so I'm really not sure what the real FS type is
• 1506[17:54:59] <greycat> The partition type ID is just a comment.
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• 1508[17:55:44] <vanfanel64> fdisk says Id is 7
• 1509[17:55:56] <ratrace> oxek: backported kernels are backported from testing if and when the maintainers decide so, but in general they're (because kernels in testing do) steadily upgrading beyond "LTS" ones upstream
• 1510[17:56:17] <greycat> It's not important what the ID number/description says. You can change it to match what you expect it to be, or ignore it.
• 1511[17:56:18] <ratrace> oxek: due to bullseye release being so close (months away) I doubt the buster-backports will go beyond 5.10.x
• 1512[17:56:51] <ratrace> at any rate bullseye will be 5.10.x so that probably means no buster-backports beyond that
• 1513[17:58:52] <vanfanel64> greycat, I just want to change the label, like one would under Windows via properties, but under Linux there is fatlabel, exfatlabel, and others, and it is also not clear if I should be passing /dev/mmcblk3p1 or /dev/mmcblk3 (I assume the former as I believe it should be a operating on the partition and not the whole disk, no matter how Windows treats remoable disks/drives.)
• 1514[17:59:51] <vanfanel64> Looks like I need to first know what the real FS type is
• 1515[18:00:50] <vanfanel64> What confuses me is how df -T says the type is "fuseblk" which I have never seen before (I have always known fuse to be for thigns like sshfs.)
• 1516[18:01:33] <greycat> If you want to change the ID, use fdisk or an equivalent and change the ID. This is not the same a a file system label.
• 1517[18:02:06] <greycat> File system labels and UUIDs are ways to refer to a specific partition/file system in the face of changing /dev/sd* names.
• 1518[18:02:08] <vanfanel64> greycat: I do nto want to change the Id, just the label
• 1519[18:02:31] <ratrace> you can also use partlabels
• 1520[18:02:33] <greycat> The thing that fdisk says, like "Linux file system", is just a description that is derived from the two-digit ID.
• 1521[18:02:43] <vanfanel64> ratrace, thanks I will look at that
• 1522[18:02:52] <ratrace> (gpt) partition labels which then appear under /dev/disk/by-partlabel/ that's what I use, so it's FS agnostic
• 1523[18:03:01] <vanfanel64> greycat, I see, thanks
• 1524[18:03:03] <greycat> Like, somewhere there is an array where 0x82 is "Linux file system" and 0x83 is "Linux swap" and so on.
• 1525[18:03:35] <oxek> ratrace: thanks. I think I now understand backports. Backports into stable come from bullseye, and if bullseye will be 5.10 then only 5.10 will come into buster-backports. Backports will not come from whatever the name is after bullseye.
• 1526[18:03:57] <greycat> replaced-url
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• 1528[18:04:01] <greycat> I guess I got those switched.
• 1529[18:04:10] <ratrace> backports into stable come from testing. backports into buster come from bullseye. nitpicky, but important naming pattern distinction
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• 1531[18:05:06] <oxek> true
• 1532[18:05:20] <vanfanel64> ratrace, I do not seem to have partlabels on my system
• 1533[18:06:00] <vanfanel64> replaced-url
• 1534[18:06:03] <ratrace> vanfanel64: maybe they appear the first time the kernel sees one
• 1535[18:06:17] <ratrace> vanfanel64: eh that's not a package....
• 1536[18:06:20] <ratrace> part(ition)labels
• 1537[18:06:27] <vanfanel64> that is a contents search
• 1538[18:06:45] <vanfanel64> I just want to give this sdcard a name, that is all I want to do
• 1539[18:07:00] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: use gparted or something the like for that
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• 1561[18:22:40] <vanfanel64> In gparted, the "Label File System" option is greyed out when looking at the sdcard partition
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• 1569[18:26:08] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: unmount the sdcard
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• 1576[18:28:11] <vanfanel64> Mister00X, even unmounted it is greyed out (and the keys icon changes to an orange-yellow-nacho-colored caution triangle with !)
• 1577[18:29:06] <vanfanel64> Under information it says "unable to read the contents of this file system!"
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• 1580[18:29:32] <vanfanel64> This is a new and unused 256 GB sandisk SD card
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• 1582[18:29:58] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: wait could this be an exFat formated card?
• 1583[18:30:14] <vanfanel64> yes, gparted reports it is exfat
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• 1586[18:31:45] <metbsd> the new update causing problem of wireguard.ko
• 1587[18:31:52] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: you should have two options, label file system and lable partition are both greyed out?
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• 1595[18:35:28] <vanfanel64> Mister00X, I am right clicking on /dev/mmcblk3p1 and I just see "Label File System"
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• 1597[18:36:55] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: maybe called name partition
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• 1599[18:37:38] <vanfanel64> Mister00X, I ma not sure what you mean
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• 1602[18:38:35] <vanfanel64> Under "Partition" menu both "Label File System" amd "Name Partition" are greyed
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• 1605[18:39:02] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: hm...
• 1606[18:39:24] <vanfanel64> Since this sdcard is fresh and unused, should I just delete the partition and make a new one?
• 1607[18:40:09] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: thing is gparted can not make exfat partitions
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• 1609[18:40:41] <Mister00X> and apparently that card has an mbr not a gpt partition table
• 1610[18:40:53] <vanfanel64> Oh
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• 1617[18:43:15] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: replaced-url
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• 1620[18:44:26] <Mister00X> exfat makes things sometimes complicated cause the nice partiton GUIs like gparted dont like it
• 1621[18:44:34] <vanfanel64> Mister00X, thanks, I was able to set the label with sudo exfatlabel /dev/mmcblk3p1 '...'
• 1622[18:44:55] <Mister00X> great
• 1623[18:45:21] <vanfanel64> That is surprising, exfat has been around for over a decade and is really just an extension of FAT32, no?
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• 1626[18:46:02] <Mister00X> vanfanel64: that has something to do with M$ licensing I think
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• 1629[18:46:47] <Mister00X> and I think its not part of libparted or something like that I think
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• 1634[18:49:07] <vanfanel64> Man o man... once again licensing proves how it can work against humanity. Really, filessytems shouldn't be wallable like that, it should fall under interopability and other FS types have been reverse engineered before, like NTFS and HGFS+ (os x)
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• 1639[18:55:00] <maxrazer> sney: Do you use Debian stable, testing or unstable? I don't think I asked you about that. I know you use Plasma.
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• 1654[19:09:47] <dokma> Do any config files get parsed when I execute `startx dwm` ??
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• 1656[19:11:16] <dokma> I'm having a strange issue where characters get ignored under dwm and fluxbox
• 1657[19:11:34] <dokma> So I'm trying to isolate things and start X with as little stuff as possible
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• 1661[19:13:28] <dokma> Often when I change focus from one window to another first 2 characters I type are ignored and on the third typed character one UTF8 character gets inserted as it though I typed a UTF8 sequence.
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• 1665[19:15:02] <maxrazer> I don't think I've seen anything like that before dokma. I haev run dwm in the past for quite a while though. Not fluxbox.
• 1666[19:15:23] <dokma> maxrazer: I don't think it's dwm related as it happens in both dwm and fluxbox.
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• 1669[19:16:04] <maxrazer> I can tell you that I've had a pretty good experience with Plasma desktop. Cinnamon may also be a good experience.
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• 1671[19:16:45] <maxrazer> A lot of very knowledgable Debian users use Plasma I've noticed.
• 1672[19:16:47] <dokma> maxrazer: I'm not really into changing my window manager. I just want to figure out what is causing my characters to get consumed wrongly
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• 1675[19:17:26] <dokma> Do you know what is the most bare bone way to start a wm with startx?
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• 1677[19:17:35] <dokma> Something that would skip all config?
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• 1679[19:17:41] <maxrazer> Well, you could certainly try one of those desktops and see if it does it there. Also, could try a fresh install.
• 1680[19:17:50] <greycat> dokma: startx yourwm
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• 1682[19:18:03] <maxrazer> I've used startx in the past.
• 1683[19:18:05] <greycat> it will skip the .xsession and /etc/X11/Xsession but it will still read the wm's configs
• 1684[19:18:14] <dokma> greycat: does startx wm parse any config?
• 1685[19:18:30] <dokma> greycat: dwm has no config
• 1686[19:18:35] <dokma> other than source
• 1687[19:18:40] <greycat> you logged in, so you got stuff from login, from PAM, and from your login shell
• 1688[19:19:18] <dokma> greycat: there might be some ancient clutter on this account. It's 17 years old install.
• 1689[19:19:21] <maxrazer> There are some things like PAM, systemD related stuff I think some bare bones installs don't include.
• 1690[19:19:37] <dokma> maxrazer: I'm not running systemd
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• 1692[19:20:06] <maxrazer> I think systemD is the wrong term. But, you must be running SystemD, right because you are using Debian.
• 1693[19:20:17] <maxrazer> oh Dbus, was it?
• 1694[19:20:21] <dokma> Devuan, khm khm... don't kill me
• 1695[19:20:25] <dokma> I hate systemd
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• 1698[19:20:33] <maxrazer> You are really using Devuan? oh ok.
• 1699[19:20:36] <greycat> then you're in the wrong channel
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• 1701[19:20:59] <dokma> Well, it's 99% Debian. Systemd is an abomination and many Debian users agree.
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• 1703[19:21:07] <greycat> *plonk*
• 1704[19:21:16] <maxrazer> Some of these applications need some stuff like Dbus, or PAM or something otherwise they act weird.
• 1705[19:21:38] <dokma> I'll run startx dwm for a few hours to see if there's any difference
• 1706[19:22:06] <maxrazer> It is mostly for application to application communication, but I think I've experienced some weird stuff like that. Certainly on BSD I did because it was not installed by default, also may been on Devuan. This is somewhat of a long shot, but my mind is going on that area.
• 1707[19:22:36] <dokma> maxrazer: stuff like characters being wrongly consumed?
• 1708[19:22:41] <maxrazer> I may have experienecd stuff like that and couldn't figure it out until I installed these other helper systems.
• 1709[19:23:01] <maxrazer> I'm not sure. I think the application wasn't responding also, xdg-open wouldn't work I think.
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• 1715[19:23:45] <maxrazer> Have you tried starting your application in terminal so you can read any output?
• 1716[19:23:48] *** Quits: shokohsc (~shokohsc@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 1717[19:23:49] *** shokohsc0 is now known as shokohsc
• 1718[19:24:32] <maxrazer> Does it do it on all applications though, or only some? What about just plain terminals?
• 1719[19:24:45] <maxrazer> Because only some applications need these helper systems.
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• 1722[19:25:34] <avu> maxrazer: please don't encourage users of derivates to come here for support by helping them, Devuan surely has their own channels/forums/lists
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• 1724[19:25:57] *** Joins: frgo_ (~frgo@replaced-ip)
• 1725[19:27:16] <ws2k3> im trying to scp Everything from the remote server to local. anyone got some advice on how the scp command should look like? i currently have scp -r username@server:/ ./ but that does not seems to be correct
• 1726[19:28:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1216
• 1727[19:28:04] <avu> ws2k3: sounds more like a job for rsync to me
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• 1731[19:29:46] <avu> ws2k3: -avz or something close to it perhaps, maybe -x or at least some excludes for stuff like /run and /proc and so on
• 1732[19:31:53] <jolt> something like this: rsync -aHx --info=progress2 --numeric-ids --ignore-times --exclude={"/dev/*","/proc/*","/sys/*","/tmp/*","/run/*","/mnt/*","/media/*","/lost+found","/etc/fstab","/etc/udev/rules.d/*","/etc/network/*","/lib/modprobe.d/*"} user@host:/ /
• 1733[19:32:29] *** Joins: neilthereildeil (47a35ec3@replaced-ip)
• 1734[19:32:57] <greycat> that is one twisted choice of quoting
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• 1736[19:34:43] <greycat> you could've used --exclude='{/dev/*,/proc/*,...}'
• 1737[19:34:56] <jolt> I know, I stole it from the internets and never bothered to fix it
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• 1739[19:38:25] <neilthereildeil> can someone please help me make my 802.11ax connection reliable?
• 1740[19:38:32] <neilthereildeil> it keeps hanging
• 1741[19:38:45] <neilthereildeil> the same laptop dualboos windows10 and debian
• 1742[19:38:53] <neilthereildeil> and windows 10 works with the same hardware
• 1743[19:39:00] <neilthereildeil> so i know the hardware supports 802.11ax
• 1744[19:39:10] <neilthereildeil> but linux conenction is not reliable
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• 1750[19:42:15] <neilthereildeil> should i try updating firmware or driver?
• 1751[19:42:40] *** Joins: irl25519 (~irl25519@replaced-ip)
• 1752[19:42:55] <maxrazer> This can't be related to the 802.11ax I don't think. But, just a a general wifi connection/driver problem.
• 1753[19:43:48] <maxrazer> I know there is a Debian image with Wifi driver included. Has your Wifi worked at all?
• 1754[19:44:05] <neilthereildeil> i have the same router at a different location, but set "802.11ax / Wi-Fi 6 mode-disabled", and linux is able to use but 2.4 and 5GHz networks reliably
• 1755[19:44:45] <neilthereildeil> so i know this hardware supports 802.11ax AND the same model router works in a different mode of operation
• 1756[19:44:52] <neilthereildeil> (elsewhere)
• 1757[19:44:59] <maxrazer> Oh, because my understanding is 802.11ax really just relates to the router end with many connections supported.
• 1758[19:45:36] <neilthereildeil> do windows and linux on the laptop load their own firmware at boot?
• 1759[19:45:52] <maxrazer> I don't think Debian is going to have your wifi driver/firmware
• 1760[19:45:54] *** Quits: fjavier__ (~fjavier@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
• 1761[19:46:00] <neilthereildeil> or is it the same firmware across OSes
• 1762[19:46:18] <greycat> In Debian, firmware is part of the initrd image, and is loaded then. I have no clue what Windows does.
• 1763[19:47:07] <neilthereildeil> greycat: is the wifi firmware loaded at EVERY boot?
• 1764[19:47:14] <greycat> yes]
• 1765[19:47:35] <neilthereildeil> hmm so this must mean windows and lonux each load their own wifi
• 1766[19:47:38] <maxrazer> What about that non-free Debian image with the special firmware drivers isn't that the wifi?
• 1767[19:47:57] *** Quits: __marco (~marco@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
• 1768[19:48:10] <neilthereildeil> i am alrady using the nonfree repo (i think)
• 1769[19:48:26] <neilthereildeil> yea im using nonfree
• 1770[19:48:32] <neilthereildeil> i just verified
• 1771[19:48:39] <greycat> you can use lsinitramfs /boot/initrd.img-whatever to see what's in it
• 1772[19:48:41] <maxrazer> Ok, but if you don't have internet connection because no wifi you can't download the wifi driver. That is why there is that image with wifi driver included which is non-official.
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• 1775[19:51:22] <neilthereildeil> greycat: how can i tell which is the intel iwl-related firmware in the initrd?
• 1776[19:51:57] <maxrazer> I recommend using ethernet though. I really like ethernet. The wifi should still work though.
• 1777[19:52:31] <greycat> I would imagine it has something like "iwl" in the filename.
• 1778[19:53:00] <greycat> If the firwmare is installed on your system, and you know its package name, you could list the files in the package.
• 1779[19:53:06] <greycat> Otherwise, there's packages.debian.org
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• 1782[19:54:25] <neilthereildeil> i actually dont see any intel wifi related modules in the initrd
• 1783[19:54:27] <neilthereildeil> i see a lot of ethernet drivers though
• 1784[19:54:29] <neilthereildeil> like e100 e1000 e1000e
• 1785[19:54:30] *** Quits: neilthereildeil (47a35ec3@replaced-ip) (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))
• 1786[19:54:46] <greycat> !listkeys iwl
• 1787[19:54:47] <dpkg> Factoid search of 'iwl' by key (12): iwl7260 ;; iwlwifi ;; iwlagn ;; iwl5100 ;; iwl4965 ;; iwl6250 ;; iwlwifi etch #del# ;; iwl3945 ;; iwl3160 ;; iwlegacy ;; iwl7000 ;; iwlist.
• 1788[19:54:53] <greycat> !iwlwifi
• 1789[19:54:53] <dpkg> The iwlwifi Linux kernel driver supports several Intel 802.11n (WiFi Link, Wireless-N, Advanced-N, Ultimate-N) and 802.11ac adapters. Firmware is required, ask me about <non-free sources> and install the firmware-iwlwifi package to provide. Supported devices and troubleshooting hints are listed at replaced-url
• 1790[19:54:58] *** Joins: neilthereildeil (47a35ec3@replaced-ip)
• 1791[19:55:12] <greycat> so... firmware-iwlwifi according to the bot. now I know where to go on p.d.o
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• 1793[19:55:36] <greycat> replaced-url
• 1794[19:55:49] <neilthereildeil> greycat: nope, i dont see the firmwqare package in my initrd
• 1795[19:55:49] <greycat> I observe several files with iwl in their names.
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• 1798[19:56:13] <greycat> Also a bunch with ibt.
• 1799[19:56:13] <neilthereildeil> but what does that tell us?
• 1800[19:56:26] <neilthereildeil> it probably is loaded by the kernel
• 1801[19:56:29] <neilthereildeil> rather than initrd
• 1802[19:56:30] <greycat> Those are the names o the firmware files that should be in your initrd image.
• 1803[19:56:35] <neilthereildeil> i dont think that distinction matters
• 1804[19:56:42] <neilthereildeil> why should they be in initrd?
• 1805[19:56:54] <greycat> Because that is how firmware works in Debian.
• 1806[19:56:54] <neilthereildeil> why not loaded by the kernel rather than initrd?
• 1807[19:57:01] <greycat> They are loaded BY THE KERNEL.
• 1808[19:57:22] <greycat> You should also see the names in dmesg, if your kernel hasn't been running forever or produced a shit-ton of output.
• 1809[19:57:26] <neilthereildeil> ok so ur saying the kernel takes the firmware from initrd and loads it?
• 1810[19:58:11] <greycat> The initrd image is unpacked in memory and used as a file system.
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• 1812[19:58:49] <neilthereildeil> so if i dont see anything matching "iwl" in the initrd, does that mean linux is not loading its own wifi firmware?
• 1813[19:59:05] *** Quits: store_scarecrow (~Andrew_00@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 1814[19:59:31] <greycat> It probably means you haven't installed the firmware package in Debian. Or your initrd images are out of date for some reason. Or who the fuck knows what you did wrong.
• 1815[19:59:53] <neilthereildeil> ok, but dmesg DOES show iwl messages
• 1816[20:00:17] <neilthereildeil> firmware direct-loading firmware iwlwifi-8265.36.ucode
• 1817[20:00:25] <neilthereildeil> ^ i see that string
• 1818[20:00:34] <greycat> that's good, I guess
• 1819[20:00:39] <neilthereildeil> so what is "direct-loading"?
• 1820[20:01:26] <neilthereildeil> how can it "direct-load" something thats not in my initrd?
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• 1823[20:02:07] <neilthereildeil> greycat: i also see fimrware-iwlwifi is installed at the newest version
• 1824[20:02:11] <neilthereildeil> apt tells me that
• 1825[20:05:14] <neilthereildeil> hmm i just found something in teresting here: replaced-url
• 1826[20:05:22] <neilthereildeil> my card is listed
• 1827[20:05:29] <neilthereildeil> but they tell me to install a windows driver
• 1828[20:05:36] <neilthereildeil> how can i find the linux equivalent?
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• 1831[20:06:05] <neilthereildeil> i need intel wifi driver 20.70.0 (or higher version)
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• 1837[20:06:56] <Belfur> what is this package? codeblocks-dbg/stable,now 16.01+dfsg-2.1 amd64 [installed]
• 1838[20:07:17] <Belfur> do i need it to have debugging inside codeblocks? or is it debugging symbols for codeblocks itself
• 1839[20:07:31] <sney> neilthereildeil: linux drivers are not versioned that way. I haven't read your whole scrollback, but if you have a new wifi controller and you're on buster, try the 5.9 kernel from backports. linux drivers are kernel modules, and so this will update iwlwifi along with everything else
• 1840[20:07:49] <jelly> Belfur, each package has a description, read it
• 1841[20:07:59] *** Joins: nobyk (~nobyk@replaced-ip)
• 1842[20:08:00] <jelly> Belfur, dpkg -s installedpackagename
• 1843[20:08:05] <Belfur> jelly, Code::Blocks debugging libraries
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• 1845[20:08:29] <Belfur> does this mean debugging libraries to see if codeblocks has bugs, or libraries that i use inside the debugger of the IDE
• 1846[20:08:42] <neilthereildeil> sney: im running debian 10.7 with a backported kernel 5.4.0.0.bpo.4
• 1847[20:08:55] <neilthereildeil> can i get a newer kernel on 10.7?
• 1848[20:08:56] <jelly> Belfur, tno idea, but the longer description may be more helpful
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• 1851[20:09:22] <sney> neilthereildeil: yes, buster-backports has 5.9 now.
• 1852[20:09:30] <neilthereildeil> ok cool
• 1853[20:09:41] <greycat> ,kernels
• 1854[20:09:42] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.10.0-trunk-686 (5.10.2-1~exp1); sid: 5.10.0-3-686-pae (5.10.12-1); bullseye: 5.10.0-2-686-pae (5.10.9-1); buster-backports: 5.9.0-0.bpo.5-686-pae (5.9.15-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-14-686-pae (4.19.171-2); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.9-686-pae (4.19.118-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.19.0-0.bpo.13-686 (4.19.160-2~deb9u1); jessie-
• 1855[20:09:43] <judd> backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.12-686 (4.9.210-1+deb9u1~deb8u1)
• 1856[20:09:54] <greycat> "buster-backports: 5.9.0-0.bpo.5-686-pae"
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• 1858[20:09:58] <neilthereildeil> how can i install this side-by-side with my existing kernel? i think i disabled kernel update because o dont wanna mess up another project on this dev laptop
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• 1862[20:10:16] <sney> debian by default keeps 2 kernels installed at all times
• 1863[20:10:24] <sney> so you just install it, and that will be handled automatically
• 1864[20:10:41] <neilthereildeil> i already have 2 installed
• 1865[20:11:39] <sney> it will remove your older one, the 4.19
• 1866[20:11:57] *** Quits: freebench (~freebench@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 1867[20:11:58] <vanfanel64> Is it possible to mount an sdcard to a specific mount point when it matches a certain serial number (I believe that is /dev/disk/by-id) (and maybe also label) ? I believe /lib/udev/rules.d/ is where it would be done but I don't know anything about udev/rules.
• 1868[20:11:59] <sney> or rather, the 4.19 will be flagged for autoremove later
• 1869[20:12:09] <neilthereildeil> i dont think i have 4.19 installed
• 1870[20:12:30] <vanfanel64> neilthereildeil, check in /boot
• 1871[20:12:35] *** Quits: sdoubleyou (~sdoubleyo@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1872[20:12:36] <jelly> neilthereildeil, dpkg -S /boot/vmlinuz*
• 1873[20:12:59] <sney> the point is, it will not remove the 5.4 kernel you are using right now, if that is the highest kernel version on your disk
• 1874[20:13:11] <neilthereildeil> i have 5.4.0.0.bpo4 and 5.4.0.0.bpo3 installed
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• 1877[20:14:35] <greycat> Those are fairly old.
• 1878[20:14:37] <neilthereildeil> so maybe is will remove the 5.4.0.0.bpo3 kernel?
• 1879[20:14:48] <jelly> neilthereildeil, if you want to track latest from backports, install linux-image-amd64 -t buster-backports
• 1880[20:14:49] <sney> it would mark that one for autoremove, yes.
• 1881[20:15:05] <neilthereildeil> i want to keep the 5.4.0.0.bpo4 but replace the 5.4.0.0.bpo3 with the one that has the wifi driver fix
• 1882[20:16:08] <sney> we can't know if it "has the wifi driver fix" until you try it. but otherwise, 5.4.0.0.bpo3 will be replaced by 5.9.0-0.bpo.5
• 1883[20:16:48] <neilthereildeil> ok, so "apt-get install linux-image-amd64 -t buster-backports" will KEEP my 5.4.0.0.bpo4 and only replace this older kernel with the newer one? thats important because irt could mess up my dev project
• 1884[20:16:58] <sney> yes.
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• 1886[20:17:56] <jelly> I don't know whether autoremove removes kernels you explicitely installed
• 1887[20:18:30] <jelly> or just those both older than the two latest and also automatically installed
• 1888[20:18:43] <greycat> I don't know either -- I disable autoremove entirely.
• 1889[20:19:01] <sney> yeah, it's possible that they'll have 3 kernels but pretty academic unless /boot is tiny
• 1890[20:19:26] <jelly> I like being reminded there's stuff I might want to remove
• 1891[20:19:50] <neilthereildeil> ok, its installed
• 1892[20:20:04] <neilthereildeil> 5.9.0 is installed
• 1893[20:20:12] <jelly> that's not 5.9.0
• 1894[20:20:13] <greycat> I didn't mind it at first, but (1) the list grows quite large, and (2) sometimes a program will just decide to run "apt autoremove" for you out of nowhere with no warning.
• 1895[20:20:16] <sney> and what do we do when we want to use a new kernel?
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• 1897[20:20:31] <jelly> ,kernels
• 1898[20:20:32] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.10.0-trunk-686 (5.10.2-1~exp1); sid: 5.10.0-3-686-pae (5.10.12-1); bullseye: 5.10.0-2-686-pae (5.10.9-1); buster-backports: 5.9.0-0.bpo.5-686-pae (5.9.15-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-14-686-pae (4.19.171-2); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.9-686-pae (4.19.118-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.19.0-0.bpo.13-686 (4.19.160-2~deb9u1); jessie-
• 1899[20:20:33] <judd> backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.12-686 (4.9.210-1+deb9u1~deb8u1)
• 1900[20:20:37] *** Quits: ddsys (~ddsys@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1901[20:21:00] <neilthereildeil> how can i tell which kernels are installed?
• 1902[20:21:01] <jelly> it's probably 5.9.15, and 5.9.0-0.bpo.5-amd64 is just the ABI string
• 1903[20:21:18] <greycat> neilthereildeil: I use "ls /boot"
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• 1905[20:21:22] <jelly> neilthereildeil, dpkg -S /boot/vmlinuz* isn't half bad a way
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• 1908[20:21:38] <sney> 'apt list --installed linux-image*' or just look in /boot
• 1909[20:21:41] *** Quits: huwjr (~huwjr@replaced-ip) (Quit: huwjr)
• 1910[20:21:53] <jelly> that's too long man!
• 1911[20:22:30] <neilthereildeil> apt list --installed linux-image returned an empty list
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• 1913[20:22:47] <sney> neilthereildeil: the * was there on purpose
• 1914[20:22:57] <neilthereildeil> but i see them in /boot
• 1915[20:23:14] <neilthereildeil> how how can i uninstall 5.4.0.0.bpo3?
• 1916[20:23:30] <sney> it will probably clean itself up with 'apt autoremove'
• 1917[20:23:32] <jelly> neilthereildeil, find out the package name and then remove that package.
• 1918[20:23:33] *** Quits: nuno_nunes (~PC@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1919[20:23:52] *** Quits: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 1920[20:23:53] <jelly> neilthereildeil, first, reboot into the latest kernel so you know you have at least two kernels that actually work
• 1921[20:24:16] <jelly> and how will you find the package names?
• 1922[20:24:21] <jelly> dpkg -S /boot/vmlinuz*
• 1923[20:24:21] <dpkg> You Fool! /boot/vmlinuz* is installed!
• 1924[20:24:25] <neilthereildeil> ok removed
• 1925[20:25:04] <neilthereildeil> and how can i make sure this doesnt auto-upgrade?
• 1926[20:25:13] <vanfanel64> Under /dev/disk/by-id/ I see mmc-SF256_0x... -> ../../mmcblk3 (and a set with -part1 pointing to ../../mmcblk3p1), does anyone know how to set up a udev rule or so that mounts based on that? Or is it safe to just add a fstab entry that points to /dev/disk/by-id/mmc-SF256_0x...-part1 ?
• 1927[20:25:14] <jelly> it WILL auto-upgrade
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• 1929[20:25:25] <jelly> that's what linux-image-amd64 is _for_
• 1930[20:25:28] <neilthereildeil> i dont want the kernel to be automatically upgraded
• 1931[20:25:30] <greycat> neilthereildeil: if you want to make sure your 5.4.x is never removed, put it on hold
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• 1933[20:26:13] <vanfanel64> I believe just having the fstab entry will not prevent the /media/$user/$label mount though... I really don't know how to do this
• 1934[20:26:21] <jelly> neilthereildeil, what did you think "if you want to track the latest" meant
• 1935[20:26:29] <vanfanel64> Or would it?
• 1936[20:26:35] <jelly> [20:14:48] <jelly> neilthereildeil, if you want to track latest from backports, install linux-image-amd64 -t buster-backports
• 1937[20:26:43] <neilthereildeil> greycat: how can i put it on hold?
• 1938[20:26:46] <greycat> !hold
• 1939[20:26:46] <dpkg> hold is a status flag that tells the package manager to not automatically upgrade a package. To hold a package 'echo $package hold|dpkg --set-selections' or 'aptitude hold $package'. Note that prior to <stretch> "aptitude hold" is ignored by other package managers and aptitude won't necessarily use holds set with dpkg; see Debian bug #137771. See also <hold list>, <unhold>.
• 1940[20:26:58] <sney> jelly: the bpo kernel advice was to have a newer wifi driver, the only person who brought up 'tracking the latest' was you
• 1941[20:27:13] <jelly> if you don't want the latest from backports to be installed automatically on upgrades, don't install linux-image-amd64 from backports
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• 1943[20:27:44] <sney> this user is clearly parsing about 1/3 of what we're saying, anything technical or esoteric we say is clearly getting filtered
• 1944[20:27:52] <greycat> I suspect he's confused because his *real* goal is to have his 5.4.x kernel never get removed, and he thought the only way to achieve that was never to update any other kernels.
• 1945[20:27:54] * jelly shrugs
• 1946[20:27:54] <neilthereildeil> no worries
• 1947[20:28:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1210
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• 1949[20:28:41] <jelly> sney, I'm usually VERY careful about what I'm writing, if a user is going to skip half of it I can't help them at all
• 1950[20:28:53] <vanfanel64> I think it is good to keep a previously working kernel for fallback
• 1951[20:28:56] <neilthereildeil> its cool guys
• 1952[20:29:06] <neilthereildeil> yea i have a previously working kernel
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• 1959[20:35:11] <vanfanel64> Does anyone know to do what I'm trying to achieve? Mount this particular SD card based on /dev/disk/by-id/mmc-SF256_0x...-part1 (unless there is something better) when it is inserted / on boot ? I want other SD cards (like reading one from a camera) to mount normally, I onlt want this specific card to mount to a different mount point, as it's used for data and more permanant.
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• 1963[20:36:16] <sney> vanfanel64: I haven't done what you describe, but maybe it could be accomplished with a systemd mount file? they offer a lot of fields for matching
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• 1972[20:39:12] <Brigo> vanfanel64, i don't get the question.
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• 1982[20:47:26] <vanfanel64> Brigo, I have a 256GB SD card. Right now when I insert it, it is automatically mounted by the system to /media/$USER/$label-of-first-partition. I am fine with this behavior for random SD cards and USB thumb drives, but for this particular SD card only, I want to mount it as /data instead.
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• 1988[20:50:35] <brokencycle> Hi! My mouse pointer jumps around quite eratically, without my even touching the computer (laptop).
• 1989[20:51:08] <brokencycle> Eg. I can leave the mouse pointer somewhere, and seconds to minutes later, it is somewhere completely different,
• 1990[20:51:35] <brokencycle> focussing a different window, or even somewhere on the attached monitor.
• 1991[20:52:05] *** Joins: GravelCZ (~GravelCZ@replaced-ip)
• 1992[20:52:06] <brokencycle> Except for the very latest kernel, I am confident that the machine is current.
• 1993[20:52:21] <brokencycle> Should I be looking at a hardware failure?
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• 1999[20:52:49] <sney> brokencycle: check your Xorg log, see if it registered more than 1 mouse/input device
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• 2001[20:53:22] <brokencycle> sney: Could be, because sometimes, I also plug in a USB mouse. But the problem occurs in both cases.
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• 2004[20:55:42] <brokencycle> sney: I see messages like "config/udev: Adding input device PixArt USB Optical Mouse (/dev/input/mouse4)" and
• 2005[20:56:19] <sney> if X "sees" a mouse that you don't have physically connected to your computer, it could be somehow interpreting random usb noise as movements
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• 2007[20:56:28] <neilthereildeil> jelly: ok, so i used dpkg --set-selection
• 2008[20:56:45] <brokencycle> XINPUT: Adding extended input device "PixArt USB Optical Mouse" (type: MOUSE, id 11)
• 2009[20:56:47] <brokencycle> and
• 2010[20:57:01] <brokencycle> config/udev: removing device PixArt USB Optical Mouse
• 2011[20:57:05] <brokencycle> when I remove the mouse.
• 2012[20:57:28] <neilthereildeil> should i hold each individual kernel version, or the linux-image-amd64 package?
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• 2037[21:11:35] <diginetX> apologies for the kind of dumb question but I'm trying to enable ufw on a server but it doesn't seem to work? In that, attempt to access blocked ports just times out, rather than refuses the connection
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• 2039[21:12:53] <diginetX> I have all in/out traffic denied by default in my rules. I want to deny e.g. port 22 and use a differnet port for ssh, but when I try to connect on port 22 to my server I just get a hang
• 2040[21:13:19] <Azrael_-> so it just seems to drop the "denied" packages instead of rejecting the connection
• 2041[21:13:21] <ratrace> sounds like DROP vs REJECT
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• 2043[21:18:56] <diginetX> Azrael_-: yeah I think that's what is happening
• 2044[21:19:01] <diginetX> though I'm unsure
• 2045[21:19:25] <diginetX> afaict nothing is listening on e.g. 22 so I just get a timeout rather than a connection refused
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• 2047[21:21:19] <greycat> If nothing is listening, you will get connection refused.
• 2048[21:21:42] <greycat> If you get a timeout, but *any* other connection or ping works, then there is a firewall dropping packets.
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• 2051[21:22:09] <diginetX> greycat: oh I see, so the behavior I'm getting is actually expected?
• 2052[21:23:31] <greycat> Timeouts generally mean the admin is incompetent.
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• 2056[21:25:42] <diginetX> Oh :(
• 2057[21:25:54] <ratrace> lolwut
• 2058[21:26:11] <ratrace> greycat: surely you don't mean that in the context of firewalls?
• 2059[21:26:56] <oxek> it is a fair point. Internet should be built on getting a reply, saying either allowed or denied, as opposed to silently dropped
• 2060[21:27:07] <diginetX> I'm not an experienced sysadmin, so I apologize for any of these dumb questions
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• 2062[21:27:43] <ratrace> oxek: yeah let's add gigabits more of useless traffic cause by network probing botnets and threat actors
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• 2064[21:28:03] <diginetX> I have ufw enabled the way I think it's supposed to work and yet I get timeouts instead of connection refused. I can pastebin the ufw status but is there some obvious pitfall here?
• 2065[21:28:15] <ratrace> in context of firewalls, DROPing is recommended over REJECTion. it's not incompetent sysadmining, it's "I don't care about responding to you, you have no business proding this port"
• 2066[21:29:22] <ratrace> and then for extra sweetness you permaban IPs accessing ports nothing is listening on, so they don't even get to access your open ports, if their probe started with a "closed" one
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• 2068[21:30:24] <diginetX> OK! I get it, ufw deny = DROP, ufw reject = REJECT
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• 2070[21:31:14] <ratrace> diginetX: there's nothing wrong with deny if you know what it does
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• 2072[21:31:34] <diginetX> ratrace: ok cool. intuitively it seems more secure since you'd waste an attackers time, right?
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• 2074[21:32:29] <ratrace> diginetX: it's not about wasting their time, it's about signal intelligence
• 2075[21:32:47] <ratrace> (and being a good netizen by not causing garbage traffic)
• 2076[21:33:07] <diginetX> fair enough
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• 2078[21:33:18] <ratrace> (wasting their time, if it happens, is just bonus :) )
• 2079[21:33:31] <diginetX> thanks for your help! much appreciated
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• 2082[21:34:10] <Brigo> vanfanel64, you can do that in the fstab, for example, as any other filesystem.
• 2083[21:34:48] <neilthereildeil> ahh man i upgraded the kernel, but im still getting the same issue
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• 2118[22:07:26] <neilthereildeil> how can i make sure wpa_supplicant and network-manager dont conflict?
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• 2120[22:09:14] <nkuttler> neilthereildeil: conflict?
• 2121[22:09:24] <greycat> !xy
• 2122[22:09:24] <dpkg> Slow down for a bit! Are you sure that you need to jump through that particular hoop to achieve your goal? We suspect you don't, so why don't you back up a bit and tell us about the overall objective... We know that people often falsely diagnose problems because they are too close to them -- it's easy to miss that there is a better way to proceed. See replaced-url
• 2123[22:09:29] <neilthereildeil> i heard the conflict of the two can cause my network t odrop
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• 2125[22:09:59] <neilthereildeil> greycat: even after upgrading the kernel, im still getting disconnect issues from my AP
• 2126[22:10:03] <neilthereildeil> im running 5.9 now
• 2127[22:10:22] <neilthereildeil> so i read it could be due to a conflict between wpa_supplicant and network-manager
• 2128[22:10:39] <neilthereildeil> however, this same config works at a different AP without 802.11ax
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• 2140[22:21:09] <hegemoOn> ratrace: if i didnt updated grub-pc
• 2141[22:21:17] <hegemoOn> did it remove the older package from disk ?
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• 2195[23:08:42] <Thete> is there any logs I could check that would show why my mouse stops responding randomly?
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• 2228[23:46:25] <gordonfish> Re: <ratrace> and then for extra sweetness you permaban IPs accessing ports nothing is listening on, so they don't even get to access your open ports, if their probe started with a "closed" one
• 2229[23:46:29] <gordonfish> One should be very cautious when implementing a scheme like that. You don't want to mistakenly ban hosts when a regular service goes down for maintanance, for example.
• 2230[23:47:03] <ratrace> regular service going down doesn't alter firewall rules
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• 2232[23:48:32] <gordonfish> Good point. I meant more a scheme that has a daemon/program checking if a port has a listener on it, but yeah it would likely just be goign by already established firewall rules.
• 2233[23:48:45] <ratrace> the idea here is to add addresses to a permaban ipset, for example, as a last rule in the chain, which is packets hitting the firewall aftre all the acceptable traffic is allowed
• 2234[23:49:17] *** sparde is now known as kline
• 2235[23:49:25] <ratrace> then naturally if a service goes down, its firewall rule doesn't change, and if it does, then yes, one must be careful to keep the rule but explicitly set to DROP, so the packet doesn't hit the last permaban ipset rule
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• 2238[23:50:31] <ratrace> in such a scheme your first rules are allowing established, then sanity checks, then ban tables, then SYN packets for port you allow, then the final blocker
• 2239[23:50:36] <jsubl2> apt-get check failed i have broken packages what do i run
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• 2241[23:51:48] <gordonfish> ratrace: That sounds sensible
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• 2250[23:58:39] <vanfanel64> I have a 256GB SD card. Right now when I insert it, it is automatically mounted by the system to /media/$USER/$label-of-first-partition. I am fine with this behavior for random SD cards and USB thumb drives, but for this particular SD card only, I want to mount it as /data instead. Does anyone know how this can be done?
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