People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
0 [00:00:01] <freem> but sometimes I wonder if it's frozen or not, since I >/dev/null debootstrap
1 [00:00:12] <freem> and I >/dev/null it because otherwise it just spams
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3 [00:00:21] <ratrace> freem: do it the microsoft way :) count steps, not bytes lol. nice progress to 98% within first few minutes, then 3 hours for those last 2%
4 [00:00:27] <freem> and the other day, someone here spoke about pv... so...
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6 [00:01:12] <freem> with debootstrap, even showing steps would not be easy :)
7 [00:01:19] <ratrace> I like the way how freebsd can be installed by unpacking two tarballs. and stage3 on gentoo.
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10 [00:03:42] <freem> hum... looks like by using the tarball builder, I can avoid downloading 3 times /var/lib/apt/lists's content
11 [00:03:43] <mrkramps> freem, from the first look, the deb list seems to be saved in a variable
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13 [00:05:28] <freem> I find it preferable to avoid patching such a beast
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17 [00:06:13] <freem> using official stuff as long as I have the choice seems a lot preferable to me
18 [00:06:42] * f8e4 feels empowered with aa under the chest
19 [00:07:43] <freem> hum... I tricked download step with a sed expression, but the install them will be require multiplying the number of packages... damn
20 [00:08:03] * freem never remembers how to do math in shell
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23 [00:09:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1156
24 [00:10:08] <f8e4> freem python -c '1+1'
25 [00:10:12] <freem> lol
26 [00:10:21] <freem> man shell
27 [00:10:44] <freem> man dash
28 [00:10:47] <freem> actually
29 [00:11:01] <f8e4> oh shell, not 'a shell
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31 [00:11:30] <freem> also, I find $((1+1)) faster to write
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42 [00:23:38] <deicide-> whats the website to post code?
43 [00:23:44] <mrkramps> !paste
44 [00:23:45] <dpkg> Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: replaced-url
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46 [00:24:07] <deicide-> ty
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52 [00:38:36] <gnat_x> I'm using a 3rd party repo for one package. i have been for years, and the upstream maintainer has been pretty good about stuff. anyway, upgraded to bullseye, and now getting "Depends: python3 (< 3.9) but 3.9.0-4 is to be installed" is that a packaging error, or possibly some risidual config issue from buster on my end?
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54 [00:39:48] <freem> maybe python >= 3.9 broke something in the program, and thus the program in the package needs fixing?
55 [00:40:31] <mrkramps> nope, package is for python < 3.9 and bullseye ships with 3.9
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57 [00:41:59] <mrkramps> probably will not work then
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61 [00:43:20] <freem> < 3.9 means 3.9 and above broke something
62 [00:44:08] <mrkramps> maybe code was just not tested for 3.9 yet
63 [00:44:10] <freem> if the devs and packager did their job, at least
64 [00:44:15] <freem> that, too
65 [00:44:42] <gnat_x> yeah, i'll check with the maintainer.
66 [00:45:03] <gnat_x> looks like that might be the case, if i'm reading apt depends right.
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70 [00:48:17] <H-var> guys what is the name of that next graphical engine for linux that is supposed to take place of x11?
71 [00:48:44] <mrkramps> wayland
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74 [00:49:23] <H-var> is this like serious? It's gonna happen eventually on all desktop interfaces?
75 [00:49:31] <H-var> is it gonna come to xfce?
76 [00:49:49] <H-var> what are the most important challenges of wayland right now?
77 [00:49:56] <mrkramps> this is serious
78 [00:50:27] <mrkramps> some distributions have it already anabled by default
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82 [00:51:25] <mrkramps> if i believe wikipedia, it's also default for gnome in debian buster already
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84 [00:52:21] <H-var> but people say that there like some problems running apps in it
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86 [00:52:44] <H-var> I was wondering if like it's apps that have to adapt and change, or it's wayland that has to be better?
87 [00:52:58] <freem> wayland is not an engine, it's a protocol, which already have a lot of server implementations
88 [00:53:15] <mrkramps> apps need to support this protocol
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90 [00:53:35] <mrkramps> those build on gtk3 and qt5 for example already do this
91 [00:53:40] <freem> apps usually depends on gtk or qt, which is where the porting work is done, usually
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93 [00:54:00] <freem> all applications directly relying on X11 won't be ported, though.
94 [00:54:14] <freem> or will require a lot of work (unlikely to be done)
95 [00:54:30] <mrkramps> for xfce i'd guess xfwm4 is the issue
96 [00:54:43] <mrkramps> or at least the biggest issue
97 [00:54:56] <freem> ah, yes, window managers also requires rewriting
98 [00:55:11] <gnat_x> my understanding is that xfce 4.16 will not support wayland, but it is on the roadmap for the following release.
99 [00:55:13] <freem> compositors, too
100 [00:56:01] <mrkramps> gnat_x, xfce 4.16 should be mostly ported to gtk3, but the window manager is not wayland compatible yet
101 [00:56:32] <gnat_x> yes. that's basically what i understand to be the situation.
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103 [00:57:01] <gnat_x> and that the call was made to not hold up 4.16 to wait for all the wayland bits to be hammered down.
104 [00:57:13] <freem> because window managers will become graphic servers in wayland
105 [00:57:31] <mrkramps> probably xfwm4 will not be ported and be replaced by something like xfway
106 [00:57:55] <freem> I'd it's not wise to use freshly ported ^W rewriten WM promoted to graphical servers
107 [00:58:42] <H-var> how can I make debian update to xfce 4.14?
108 [00:58:51] <H-var> or 4.16pre2?
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110 [00:59:23] <mrkramps> H-var, building it yourself
111 [00:59:55] <mrkramps> although for the time being 4.14 is in testing
112 [01:00:14] <gnat_x> but gnome3 in sid uses wayland works fine, if you like gnome3's whole deal. i tried it on a sid machine a couple months ago. switched because the ui was bad for the TV remote thing i use for that machine,
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115 [01:00:47] <mrkramps> gnat_x, gnome3 pretty much targets wayland primarily
116 [01:00:59] <gnat_x> *nod*
117 [01:01:17] <freem> I don't think people using xfce wants to play with gnome 3 :)
118 [01:01:26] <gnat_x> i think someone was asking if wayland works, and it does for stuff that supports it.
119 [01:01:37] <gnat_x> freem: i certainly don't :)
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121 [01:02:02] <freem> for a start, people would require computer with more ram, disk storage, and processing power
122 [01:02:11] <freem> and then, there's the taste
123 [01:02:31] <mrkramps> freem, this is a gnome issue and luckily not related to wayland
124 [01:02:42] <freem> I mean, gnome's icon is a.... foot... smells bad already
125 [01:03:06] * freem ->[]
126 [01:03:49] <gnat_x> hence my "if you like gnome3's whole deal." it is certainly not for everyone. including me. the reason i stopped using it was gnome, not wayland.
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129 [01:05:00] <freem> ok... looks like debootstrap --print-debs --include just don't returns the true list of yet to be installed packages
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132 [01:09:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1150
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135 [01:12:50] <freem> I think this might be an actual debootstrap bug, will dig in that later... the result is just that the downloadin goes to 160% and the install to 143% after all
136 [01:13:02] <mrkramps> oO
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139 [01:14:06] <freem> well... I rely on --print-deb saying the truth, but I use --include=... which are not counted by it
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142 [01:14:35] <freem> debootstrap --print-debs --keep-debootstrap-dir --variant=minbase "--include=$PKG_LIST" $(cat $SOURCE/distname) "$cp_target" "$MIRROR"
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144 [01:15:01] <freem> in that line, it looks like --print-debs just ignore what's in the --include list
145 [01:15:25] <mrkramps> run include before print-debs?
146 [01:15:34] <freem> I tried, no change
147 [01:15:35] <mrkramps> it's a bash function after all
148 [01:15:40] <mrkramps> hmkay, just a guess
149 [01:15:45] <freem> I had the same :)
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151 [01:16:10] <freem> at least I gave my installer script a nice progress bar today, I'm happy
152 [01:17:04] <freem> when it will be good enough, I'll probably share the link, but I still have some work to do there
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155 [01:18:16] <freem> gn folks
156 [01:18:21] <mrkramps> gn
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161 [01:25:07] <jaami> hi, what other debian based distro is as good as windows in terms of drivers?
162 [01:25:20] <mrkramps> none
163 [01:25:28] <jaami> oh
164 [01:26:17] <jaami> i need help to setup tp-link wifi usb dongle
165 [01:26:20] <sig_9> jaami: you mean out of the box distro
166 [01:26:44] <jaami> yes, out of the box distro
167 [01:26:51] <sig_9> any of the *buntus
168 [01:27:03] <sig_9> most detect non-free hardware and install drivers
169 [01:27:15] <mrkramps> jaami, what's the exact model of the wifi dongle?
170 [01:27:27] <jaami> ah ok, i was thinking about *bunto but was not sure
171 [01:27:39] <jaami> just a second , let me recheck
172 [01:27:42] <sig_9> what wifi card isn't working in debian
173 [01:28:00] <mrkramps> sig_9, everything realtek
174 [01:28:09] <sig_9> that's not an issue
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176 [01:29:03] <sig_9> thernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8101/2/6E PCI Express Fast/Gigabit Ethernet controller (rev 07) <== had to get a github driver for this rtl8821ce
177 [01:29:19] <mrkramps> sig_9, that's your ethernet card
178 [01:29:46] <sig_9> pasted the wrong line
179 [01:29:50] <mrkramps> ;)
180 [01:29:52] <sig_9> rtl8821ce
181 [01:30:05] <jaami> TL-WN727N_V5.20_190514_Linux
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184 [01:30:30] <H-var> ah
185 [01:30:51] <mrkramps> ok, that's realtek rtl8188
186 [01:30:52] <H-var> the famous rtl8101 rtl8821ce driver
187 [01:30:58] <sig_9> yup
188 [01:31:34] <mrkramps> wait .. is it!?
189 [01:32:36] <mrkramps> jaami, you need to install package firmware-realtek
190 [01:32:41] <jaami> yes, you are right 8188eu.ko
191 [01:32:51] <jaami> oh great
192 [01:33:08] <jaami> plz let me install the package
193 [01:34:37] <mrkramps> jaami, you know how to install a package?
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195 [01:36:42] <jaami> yes, i know apt install firmware-realtek
196 [01:36:50] <mrkramps> exactly
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199 [01:37:00] <jaami> do i need to restart?
200 [01:37:22] <mrkramps> jaami, actually it should work directly
201 [01:37:31] <mrkramps> maybe replug the dongle once
202 [01:37:33] <sig_9> you can modprobe it or restart yes
203 [01:38:23] <jaami> yes, unpluged and plugged in but i think modeprobe is needed
204 [01:38:53] <mrkramps> probably just restart then
205 [01:39:07] <sig_9> what card is it?
206 [01:39:28] <mrkramps> realtek rtl8108eu
207 [01:39:37] <mrkramps> realtek rtl8188eu, sry
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209 [01:41:07] <sig_9> sudo modprobe 8188eu
210 [01:41:28] <mirrorbird> hi
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212 [01:41:59] <mrkramps> module should be rtl8188eu
213 [01:42:18] <sney> all of this annoyance with realtek, there should be a downloadable utility that identifies which of 500 different models you have, and what you need to do to make it work
214 [01:42:30] <sig_9> mrkramps: what?
215 [01:42:31] <sig_9> dude
216 [01:43:10] <mrkramps> all realtek modules start with rtl
217 [01:43:16] <sig_9> stop
218 [01:43:33] <sig_9> modprobe 8188eu
219 [01:43:40] <sney> mrkramps: nope, some of them start with r and some are just the number. to keep things simple, of course :P
220 [01:43:54] <jaami> once again i see the same error but wifi is now visible and scanning is working. The error: modprobe: FATAL: Module 8188e not found in directory /lib/modules/4.9.0-13-amd64
221 [01:44:43] <jaami> sig_9, yes it worked without error
222 [01:45:00] <sig_9> ok
223 [01:45:03] <sig_9> wifi working?
224 [01:45:10] <mrkramps> hmkay, but then module name is r8188eu
225 [01:45:25] <jaami> yes , working
226 [01:45:36] <sig_9> mrkramps: for instance my card is rtl8821ce
227 [01:45:41] <jaami> :)
228 [01:45:41] <sig_9> you modprobe 8821ce
229 [01:45:49] <jaami> yes i did
230 [01:45:54] <mrkramps> sig_9, sorry for the irritation i checked on module rtl8188ee
231 [01:45:55] <sig_9> mrkramps: or you can look through all the modules
232 [01:46:00] <jaami> oh
233 [01:46:14] <jaami> np, ty
234 [01:46:20] <sig_9> no irritations
235 [01:46:23] <mrkramps> my fault
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239 [01:48:25] <mrkramps> hmkay, and i also apologize for the confusion for unsing the term "irritation" which means something completely different than i meant
240 [01:48:26] <mrkramps> oO
241 [01:48:44] <sig_9> heh
242 [01:49:03] <mrkramps> i was actually meaning "confusion"
243 [01:50:23] <sig_9> confusion is dealing with ipp ipps socket printing crap etc.. command line
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265 [02:06:30] <mirrorbird> any hot chicks?
266 [02:06:54] <sney> if there are, it's offtopic
267 [02:06:58] <sney> !offtopic
268 [02:06:59] <dpkg> #debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
269 [02:07:26] <mirrorbird> i am a debian users and i want support in finding hot chicks who like debian
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271 [02:08:18] <sney> I'm a debian user who likes craft beer, and if I wanted to talk to other debian users about drinking, it'd still be offtopic. you can play nice, or someone will be along eventually to ban you. your call.
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273 [02:08:50] <mirrorbird> he has no power so he threatens with the teacher
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275 [02:09:02] <jaami> can somehow a wifi usb router work as wifi card for scanning and connecting to wifi network?
276 [02:09:09] <mirrorbird> we'll get you after school
277 [02:10:17] <PamiWulf> my Debian stable 10 "buster" has smartd running, and it is reporting 9 pending unreadable sectors. is it a software bug?
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281 [02:11:05] <sney> jaami: sometimes, it depends on the device. but it's not a trivial thing in any case
282 [02:11:21] <mrkramps> PamiWulf, no your hard drive is failing
283 [02:11:41] <PamiWulf> "Device: /dev/sda [SAT], 9 Currently unreadable (pending) sectors"
284 [02:12:09] <jaami> sney, ok
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286 [02:13:31] <sney> PamiWulf: look in dmesg, there are probably a lot more i/o errors listed. SMART is pretty conservative about reporting errors, if it's notifying you about unreadable sectors that means there is a real problem
287 [02:14:25] <sney> see if there's a firmware update for your disk. buggy controllers can sometimes create false positives. otherwise, time to go shopping
288 [02:14:46] <PamiWulf> mrkramps: ok, thanks. my father bought me a new one, but it is still in the package and I have not seen the new hard drive yet. I think I will install the new hard drive my father bought me either when this one completely stops working, or when I get an inspiration to do it. I have become lazier. How do I preserve or transfer the current Debian stable system graphical user interface settings (Cinnamon)
289 [02:14:53] <PamiWulf> to the new Debian stable system?
290 [02:15:30] <mrkramps> PamiWulf, just backup your whole /home/user directory
291 [02:15:57] <mirrorbird> PamiWulf, are you a hot chick
292 [02:16:01] <H-var> when does new version of debian usually come out?
293 [02:16:11] <mirrorbird> H-var, for christmas, to boost sales
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295 [02:16:15] <H-var> :D
296 [02:16:40] <mirrorbird> PamiWulf, because if so, remember to backup your nudes folder
297 [02:16:42] <mrkramps> PamiWulf, and probably do it now before an unexpected hdd fail make you lose all data
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299 [02:16:48] <mirrorbird> PamiWulf, i have a service you can use for that
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301 [02:20:11] <H-var> if I have buster, I should add "bullseye-backports" or buster-backports" if I wish to have backports enabled?
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306 [02:22:18] <jmcnaught> H-var: buster-backports
307 [02:22:40] <H-var> is this the correct guide for updating to debian 11 testing? replaced-url
308 [02:22:58] <H-var> thank you jmcnaught
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317 [02:34:02] <zykotick9> H-var: i didn't check that link's contents, but installing testing "might" not be in your best interests? or maybe it is?
318 [02:35:31] <H-var> how about this one? replaced-url
319 [02:35:32] <sney> H-var: that site spends a lot of time on installing buster, but the instructions aren't really wrong or anything
320 [02:35:41] <sney> H-var: here's the short version
321 [02:35:45] <H-var> this one seems much easire
322 [02:35:47] <sney> dpkg: buster->bullseye
323 [02:35:48] <dpkg> In /etc/apt/sources.list, change "buster" to "bullseye", remove lines like buster-backports, debian-multimedia <dmo>, and other 3rd party repos as they are known to cause issues then do: apt update && apt upgrade && apt full-upgrade. Note that testing is a <moving target> and may be buggy, and read the sid FAQ: replaced-url
324 [02:36:04] <mirrorbird> any marachoods here?
325 [02:36:13] <H-var> yeah, sney, that's the one thanks
326 [02:36:27] <H-var> "1810 packages can be upgraded. Run 'apt list --upgradable' to see them."
327 [02:36:31] <H-var> lol :D
328 [02:37:13] <H-var> if I run apt list --upgradable I worry my terminal might crash, or it might look like a matrix screensaver for some while :D
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330 [02:37:52] <sney> H-var: since you're intentionally upgrading releases, you don't really need to check that list unless you want to
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335 [02:39:40] <H-var> I know even the testing channel will work great - debian community has the most wonderful minds in the world
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339 [02:42:03] <H-var> I have one issue "libc6-dev : Breaks: libgcc-8-dev (< 8.4.0-2~) but 8.3.0-6 is to be installed" should I just uninstall that package, and run apt full-upgrade?
340 [02:42:21] <sney> H-var: run 'apt full-upgrade libgcc1-' to get around that.
341 [02:42:35] <H-var> and it's gonna be ok?
342 [02:42:41] <sney> yep, known issue
343 [02:42:45] <H-var> :D
344 [02:43:14] <zykotick9> heh, "welcome to testing" ;)
345 [02:43:16] <H-var> thank you, sney
346 [02:43:23] <sney> np
347 [02:47:53] <H-var> unable to locate libgccl
348 [02:47:58] <H-var> libgcc- ?
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352 [02:48:14] <sney> H-var: 1 as in the number
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354 [02:49:02] <H-var> lol 2GB upgrade, and all of that to see the new amazing graphics of xfce 4.14 :D
355 [02:49:12] <H-var> those godrays and ray tracing
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359 [02:58:20] <H-var> I was using DeJavuSans. Switching to Carlito helped to see the difference between l and 1. In DeJavu Sans they look almost identical
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362 [03:00:35] <_0xbadc0de_> hello
363 [03:00:50] <sney> hi
364 [03:02:11] <_0xbadc0de_> I have an nvme ssd and a sata ssd, on the sata ssd - On the sata ssd I am able to install ubuntu and grub and be able to detect the nvme drive with debian installed. the issue is that when I reboot
365 [03:02:22] <_0xbadc0de_> grub shows the entry but says the drive cant be found
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367 [03:02:35] <_0xbadc0de_> but if I install ubuntu on the nvme drive it works perfectly
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369 [03:03:45] <disillusion> I'm trying to run a WireGuard server with VLAN in which the clients can access each others services (ports). But the clients can only ping each other, not access each other's ports. The ufw.log file on the server shows that it's blocking traffic from one client to another. How do I fix this on Debian 10
370 [03:03:47] <disillusion> ?
371 [03:04:05] <disillusion> for the firewall, all I do is install ufw and set a few simple rules
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374 [03:05:17] <disillusion> the kind of thing I see on the WireGuard server, which uses the WireGuard address of 10.100.0.1, in the ufw log is: "UFW BLOCK SRC=10.100.0.2 DST=10.100.0.3 DPT=443"
375 [03:05:35] <disillusion> on the server, allowing 443 on 10.100.0.0/24 doesn't fix it
376 [03:05:51] <disillusion> (and I don't want to have to do that anyway)
377 [03:06:52] <disillusion> so what's going on under the hood on Debian that causes this problem in which the server prevents clients from accessing each others' ports on a WireGuard network?
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379 [03:08:45] <disillusion> the ports access between the server and all clients work just fine, which is one way I know the firewall rules in ufw are ok
380 [03:09:12] <disillusion> it's only client-to-client that shows "BLOCK" message in ufw log
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386 [03:15:22] <f8e4> is this correct sudo?: echo -n 150 | sudo tee /sys/devices/foofile
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390 [03:19:07] <stompykins> f8e4: looks right
391 [03:19:16] <stompykins> you can pipe echo against sudo and it works fine
392 [03:19:25] <stompykins> if youre truly worried you could always su to root :)
393 [03:19:44] <f8e4> sudo sh -c '...' too yes mmh
394 [03:20:01] <stompykins> my personal laptop i set up wheel NOPASSWD:all
395 [03:20:09] <stompykins> i hate having to retype my password over and over
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397 [03:20:56] <f8e4> or: echo 'level 3' > sudo tee /proc/acpi/fan
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399 [03:22:46] <f8e4> former yes; ty
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402 [03:25:59] <oops_> my os is debian buster 32 bit , after installing xfce4 the gui desktop blink between black screen with message " no vGA input" and debian background without icons alternatives
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405 [03:27:21] <mrkramps> oops_, graphics card?
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407 [03:28:26] <oops_> mrkramps: i don't know how to view graphics card
408 [03:28:27] <stompykins> it blinks oops_?
409 [03:28:33] <stompykins> check your cable for bent pins dude
410 [03:28:36] <stompykins> sounds like a hardware issue
411 [03:28:46] <stompykins> your card could be loose as well
412 [03:29:57] <oops_> yes , i guess the cable no problem because the other ubuntun on the same pc work well
413 [03:30:56] <mrkramps> oops_, you get graphics card information with: lspci | grep VGA
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415 [03:32:31] <oops_> there have another phenomena is when i click then a snapshot continually take photo ,
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417 [03:32:56] <oops_> the vga is intel mobile 945GM/GMS ,
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422 [03:35:58] <mrkramps> oops_, might already help to just install firmware-linux-nonfree
423 [03:36:24] <oops_> in addition, my screen are external , the inbuilt screen with notebook has dismantled
424 [03:37:34] <f8e4> is this safe:
425 [03:37:49] <f8e4> * replaced-url
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431 [03:43:39] <f8e4> similar: replaced-url
432 [03:43:49] <oops_> mrkramps: i reboot my pc , the login interface appear ,after i type my user name and passwd enter in , the blink phenomena recur
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434 [03:44:27] <f8e4> oops_ maybe try another DEnv
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439 [03:49:37] <oops_> the most weird things is the "cacha" snapshot utter continually automatically even if i don't touch anywhere
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455 [04:09:39] <Kilgarah_Hunith> fresh debian10.7 install and did an update/upgrade and nothing needed updating, normally distros need an update after install so why not debian (buster)
456 [04:10:20] <dvs> Because Debian 10.7 is a week old?
457 [04:10:48] <Kilgarah_Hunith> you could be right! forgive my noobness
458 [04:11:03] <dvs> Kilgarah_Hunith: What did you use to install (the EXACT iso name)
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460 [04:13:29] <Kilgarah1Hunith> internet fell, i got my iso from replaced-url
461 [04:13:37] <dvs> sigh
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464 [04:15:28] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o eir
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471 [04:25:50] <KNERD> A week old and no updates! Slackers! ;-)
472 [04:27:00] <dvs> KNERD: I'm guessing there are security updates but since they couldn't tell me the name of the ISO they used, I couldn't tell if their sources needed to be updated.
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475 [04:28:57] <KNERD> Yeah that happens
476 [04:29:08] <KNERD> and left already
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504 [05:03:39] <oops> after installing "mate-desktop-environment" , the mate gui interface doesn't appear after rebooting , my os had installed xfce4 ,
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506 [05:04:59] <sney> oops: installing mate didn't remove xfce4. if you want to use mate, you need to select it at login. the menu is either in the corner or next to the login button
507 [05:06:31] <oops> after rebooting , the interface enter the console mode directly
508 [05:09:29] <sney> you probably disabled lightdm somehow
509 [05:10:24] <oops> how to enable lightdm
510 [05:10:37] <sney> systemctl enable lightdm, as root
511 [05:11:07] <sney> when you installed mate, did you get a menu asking if you wanted to keep using lightdm or use a different display manager? what did you select if so?
512 [05:11:56] <oops> no, no any prompt during the process of installing
513 [05:12:39] <oops> my pc is completely console mode now
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521 [05:28:36] <oops> can the debian official repository be added to sources.list by manually only?
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523 [05:30:15] <sig_9> oops: replaced-url
524 [05:30:20] <sig_9> this gives many examples
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559 [06:26:19] <A|an> replaced-url
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568 [06:39:16] * trui sets a timer.
569 [06:39:39] <trui> go, sid, go! haha. maybe.
570 [06:43:14] *** Quits: polyphem (~p0lyph3m@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
571 [06:44:52] <trui> (i'm on stable and the stable kernel, but i find it still fun to follow this stuff)
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579 [07:01:05] <oops> i have installed "mate-desktop-environment" , i had enabled "lightdm" and set "graphical.target " as default, when i reboot the os , it directly enter console mode and no mate gui appear
580 [07:04:13] <xikuuky> oops: is it possible you have more than one dm enabled?
581 [07:06:19] <oops> xikuuky: how to list all display manager and kill unnecessary dm
582 [07:08:03] <oops> xikuuky: you are right , gdm3 are working
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595 [07:19:55] <oops> i had walk through all 6 display manager , and now only lightdm are active , but the mate desktop still not appear ,
596 [07:20:17] <xikuuky> oops: did you check for it's .desktop file in the XDG folder?
597 [07:22:17] <oops> what file name do i need to check? when system start it directly enter the console,
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599 [07:24:13] <oops> there are lots of file with suffix ".desktop"
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601 [07:27:16] <oops> some are under "/etc/xdg/autostart/"
602 [07:28:57] <xikuuky> let me find the exact system path for you
603 [07:29:54] <xikuuky> what files exist at /usr/share/xsessions ?
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605 [07:31:29] <oops> those files are " gnome-classic.desktop , gnome.desktop , gnome-xorg.desktop and mate.desktop
606 [07:31:53] <xikuuky> oops: hmmm mate should show up then
607 [07:32:17] <oops> mate are the end in list ,
608 [07:32:17] <xikuuky> oops: can you run "cat /usr/share/xsessions/mate.desktop" and send me a pastebin link?
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610 [07:33:17] <oops> let me try , it's too hard to do it , i talk with you on another pc
611 [07:33:36] <xikuuky> oops: i understand
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613 [07:39:01] <oops> msg xikuuky
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2819 [10:01:21] <ychaouche> hello debianeers
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2821 [10:01:49] <ychaouche> how do I skip every part of the output of apt-cache show <packagename> and only get the description part ?
2822 [10:02:11] <ychaouche> I had to resort to sed for that, but I want to make sure there isn't an easier option
2823 [10:02:42] <ychaouche> oh by the way it doesn't *have to be* apt-cache show package, any command that would give me the description *only*
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2826 [10:03:18] <ychaouche> does this has to do anything with it ? APT::Cache::ShowFull
2827 [10:03:48] <ychaouche> (I don't know how to change that value on the command line, I tried with -o APT::Cache::ShowFull=dzaoiduazoiudz and it seems to have erred silently)
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2836 [10:10:52] <jelly> ychaouche: short or long description or both?
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2852 [10:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1167
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2855 [10:50:57] <ychaouche> jelly, long
2856 [10:51:15] <jelly> mmm, I don't know of a better way for that
2857 [10:51:52] <ychaouche> Something that would have a similar output as this : replaced-url
2858 [10:52:53] <jelly> ychaouche: careful, apt-cache show can provide more than one result
2859 [10:53:24] <ychaouche> good catch
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2880 [11:14:57] <ychaouche> apt -o is very permissive
2881 [11:15:16] <jelly> ychaouche: if you have dctrl-tools, you can do eg: apt-cache show debhelper | grep-dctrl -s Description-en -
2882 [11:17:03] *** Joins: Tobbi (~Tobbi@replaced-ip )
2883 [11:18:00] <themill> Bonus points for doing it all with python-apt
2884 [11:18:33] <ychaouche> jelly, that's one useful usage of grep-dctrl !
2885 [11:18:55] <ychaouche> I am not even being cynic :) (however that's spelled)
2886 [11:19:42] *** Joins: asymptotically (~asymptoti@replaced-ip )
2887 [11:20:32] <ratrace> (like that)
2888 [11:20:34] <jelly> I suspect it usually gets reimplemented, badly, because not installed by default
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2891 [11:23:06] <ychaouche> jelly, what gets reimplemented ?
2892 [11:23:31] *** Quits: ghost43 (~daer@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2893 [11:23:38] <jelly> grep-dctrl
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2895 [11:24:28] *** Joins: ghost43 (~daer@replaced-ip )
2896 [11:24:51] * jelly tries to parse an actual mail message with grep-dctrl... success
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2921 [11:43:30] <Franciman> Hi, what does the i915/kbl_dmc_ver1_04.bin firmware do?
2922 [11:43:33] <Franciman> is it necessary?
2923 [11:43:40] <Franciman> I installed it because I saw the error
2924 [11:44:00] <Franciman> but I've been using debian previously without it, on the same pc, with no visible problem
2925 [11:44:36] *** Joins: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip )
2926 [11:45:22] <shtrb> It's just a firmware for a set of devices supported by this device (intel )
2927 [11:45:45] <Franciman> yes I have an intel cpu
2928 [11:45:52] <Franciman> using the integrated GPU
2929 [11:46:02] <Haohmaru> my condolesence
2930 [11:46:05] <Franciman> lol
2931 [11:46:10] <Franciman> I was wondering what it does
2932 [11:46:19] <shtrb> lol Haohmaru
2933 [11:48:07] *** Quits: lesless (~lessless@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2934 [11:48:25] <Franciman> do you know a cpu which is more transparent?
2935 [11:48:37] *** Joins: Jerrynicki (~niklas@replaced-ip )
2936 [11:49:07] <jelly> Franciman: some bits of firmware are for 3D support, other bits help with accelerated encoding/decoding of video streams I think
2937 [11:49:17] <Franciman> ok thanks
2938 [11:49:34] <shtrb> Franciman, don't worry after yesterday Intel hack we may see the source code and plans :P
2939 [11:49:44] <Franciman> love!
2940 [11:49:47] <Franciman> I didn't know :P
2941 [11:50:03] <Haohmaru> wut?
2942 [11:50:05] <Franciman> btw I think I found a workaround for my wifi issues
2943 [11:50:08] * Haohmaru deploys an ear
2944 [11:50:10] <shtrb> I don't know if the data would be leaked, I just wish to have my intel cpu working saner
2945 [11:50:33] <Franciman> I used the firmware-4.bin instead of the firmware-6.bin
2946 [11:50:39] <Franciman> and now it seems to not be disconnecting
2947 [11:50:58] <Haohmaru> the next time i buy a comput0r, i want a ryz0n in it
2948 [11:51:01] *** Joins: BenDover (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip )
2949 [11:51:01] <shtrb> Haohmaru, some intel department had been hacked yesterday , no one knows for sure what happened except they had been hacked
2950 [11:51:26] <jelly> right now all the modern x86 GPUs need some firmware
2951 [11:51:30] <Franciman> Haohmaru, I think it's better to find a free alternative
2952 [11:51:36] <Haohmaru> free?
2953 [11:51:40] <shtrb> ARM ?
2954 [11:51:42] <Franciman> with no closed firmware
2955 [11:51:57] <shtrb> FPGA ?
2956 [11:52:00] <Haohmaru> don't some of these ARMs have blobs too?
2957 [11:52:07] <Franciman> we are doomed
2958 [11:52:07] <Franciman> lol
2959 [11:52:13] <Haohmaru> the thicc ARMs i mean.. with GPUs and stuff
2960 [11:52:23] <shtrb> Haohmaru, well , if you have some nice FPGA you wouldn't need it :)
2961 [11:52:39] *** Joins: lesless (~lessless@replaced-ip )
2962 [11:52:40] <Haohmaru> i don't speek ef-pea-gee-ay-ish
2963 [11:53:08] <jelly> Franciman: you can probably get an 8-10 year old amd discrete card, that will require less work than building your own from a FPGA
2964 [11:53:10] <Haohmaru> afaik from those who do, they hate the FPGA tools
2965 [11:53:35] <Franciman> probably yeah
2966 [11:53:41] <Franciman> makes sense
2967 [11:56:09] <shtrb> but it would be open source :)
2968 [11:57:17] <jelly> shtrb: just like the r600 driver which already exists
2969 [11:57:55] <shtrb> jelly, isn't the R600 still uses blobs ?
2970 [12:01:37] <Haohmaru> <blobs____blobs_everywhere.jpg>
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2976 [12:07:19] <jelly> shtrb: honestly I don't remember, if it needs fw to even bring up the framebuffer and set mode, then they can pick an even older card
2977 [12:07:56] <st4rry> Hi, all.
2978 [12:09:10] <st4rry> I'm having some trouble with my dual Graphic cards on debian 10 , could someone help me please? I noticed it's kind of some common problem. But I still couldn't make it clear with the solution found online
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2982 [12:10:16] <st4rry> I've a HP Laptop and when I installed Nvidia driver and I don't have my Desktop environment run anymore.
2983 [12:11:48] *** Joins: dselect (~dselect@replaced-ip )
2984 [12:11:50] <st4rry> I installed bumblebee-nvidia and managed to run glxinfo with optirun and it shows my GPU but still it has some nvidia persistent error when boot and also hashcat doesn't recognize both my GPUs
2985 [12:12:22] <st4rry> I'd like to ask some help here , please.
2986 [12:13:39] <jelly> st4rry: which desktop environment session type is selected? Does the initial graphical login screen appear at all?
2987 [12:13:43] *** Joins: djakov (~djakov@replaced-ip )
2988 [12:14:13] <st4rry> my desktop environment is Mate
2989 [12:14:30] <st4rry> it's working until I install nvidia
2990 [12:14:32] <st4rry> driver
2991 [12:14:38] *** Quits: Kevlar_Noir (~manjaro-u@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2992 [12:14:59] <st4rry> so I had to remove all nvidia-drivers and restart the lightdm and the GUI runs again
2993 [12:15:09] <shtrb> Speaking of blobs , "elan_i2c 0-0015: unexpected iap version 0x00 (ic type: 0x28)" buster with backports (kernel 5.9.0) anyone have an idea on what firmware it could be ?
2994 [12:16:03] * freem likes doing volley with blobs
2995 [12:16:32] *** Joins: jaren999 (~cyr4x3@replaced-ip )
2996 [12:16:55] <jelly> shtrb: that line does not look like a firmware-requesting line
2997 [12:17:27] *** Quits: Jerrynicki (~niklas@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
2998 [12:18:13] <shtrb> lol never mind , I missread the line ends with ", firmware update will **not** work"
2999 [12:19:02] <shtrb> back to 5.8 I guess :)
3000 [12:19:58] *** Quits: lesless (~lessless@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
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3010 [12:31:02] <st4rry> jelly: my desktop environment is Mate, it's working until I install nvidia drivers. so I had to remove all nvidia-drivers and restart the lightdm and the GUI runs again.
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3015 [12:35:59] <dermoth> Hey there.. so I launched apt upgrade, and caught a changelog entry which basically tells me I have to keep back one package for a little while (waiting for required dependency update). What is the most correct way to cancel at this point? I can of course kill the process... Although I was wondering if there is a more correct way?
3016 [12:35:59] *** Quits: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3017 [12:36:36] *** Quits: ohwowlol (~ohwowlol@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3018 [12:37:18] <dermoth> if I hold the package from another shell, will it prevent the upgrade?
3019 [12:38:08] *** Joins: somazero (~somazero@replaced-ip )
3020 [12:38:27] <dermoth> well cnasewer myself on this one since I was going to hold it nayway... backend is locked
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3022 [12:39:37] *** Quits: Hackerpcs (~user@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Hackerpcs)
3023 [12:40:01] <dermoth> killed it... though it would be nice to have a 2nd chance to gracefully skip a package after seeing the changelog
3024 [12:40:20] *** Joins: Bushmaster (~BushDog@replaced-ip )
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3026 [12:41:05] <Bushmaster> Hi, in my Debian stretch, my root is totally full, 0 space and I cant install software, is there a way to get rid of unenecessary files from root to clear up spaces
3027 [12:41:34] *** Joins: Hackerpcs (~user@replaced-ip )
3028 [12:42:21] <ratrace> Bushmaster: if you're using apt-get (instead of, say, apt) you can use `apt-get clean` to clean out the package cache in /var/cache/apt/
3029 [12:42:42] <ratrace> Bushmaster: then look into /var/log and see if there's any log files growing uncontrolled
3030 [12:42:42] <Bushmaster> ratrace, thanks, let me see
3031 [12:43:05] *** Quits: Haudegen (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Bin weg.)
3032 [12:43:16] <ratrace> ultimately you probably need to rearchitect your disk layout.
3033 [12:44:15] *** Quits: mp107 (uid383093@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
3034 [12:44:27] <Bushmaster> ratrace, no space has cleaned here is the output replaced-url
3035 [12:45:00] <ratrace> Bushmaster: so you're using ubuntu.... :)
3036 [12:45:09] <Bushmaster> No
3037 [12:45:12] <ratrace> go ask in #ubuntu what to do and how to get rid of the garbage accrued by it
3038 [12:45:13] <Bushmaster> Debian Stretch
3039 [12:45:20] <ratrace> Bushmaster: yes. you have gnome snap. that's ubuntu installation
3040 [12:45:40] <ratrace> anyhoo... snaps keep around multiple versions, see how to get rid of those
3041 [12:45:45] <Bushmaster> that is something came out in my Debian when somebody help me to install a windows software
3042 [12:45:49] *** Joins: shabius_ (~shabius@replaced-ip )
3043 [12:45:56] *** Quits: dermoth (~dermoth@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3044 [12:45:59] <ratrace> no. debian doesn't install snaps by default, definitely does not install gnome snap. that's ubuntu
3045 [12:46:00] <Bushmaster> I am using Debnian
3046 [12:46:17] <ratrace> but anyway, clean out the snap garbage
3047 [12:46:36] *** Joins: Jerrynicki (~niklas@replaced-ip )
3048 [12:46:48] <Bushmaster> ratrace, here replaced-url
3049 [12:46:51] *** Joins: runlevel7__ (~runlevel7@replaced-ip )
3050 [12:47:04] *** remy^ is now known as Remy
3051 [12:47:36] <ratrace> DE cinnamon and oyu have the gnome snap ..... clear out unneded snaps, and unneded snap versions
3052 [12:47:42] <ratrace> *unneeded
3053 [12:48:02] <Bushmaster> how I do that ? ratrace
3054 [12:49:01] <shtrb> Bushmaster, why did you install snapcrap?
3055 [12:49:03] <Bushmaster> ratrace, I remember, it was a software called Photoscape
3056 [12:49:11] *** Quits: shabius (~shabius@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
3057 [12:49:13] <ratrace> ask in #ubuntu how to remove old snaps, it's their software even if you're not using ubuntu (which I seriously doubt)
3058 [12:49:30] <Bushmaster> shtrb, I rememebr, I needed a software called Photoscape and one of the friends enable me to isntall it in my Debian
3059 [12:49:55] *** Quits: runlevel7_ (~runlevel7@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
3060 [12:50:05] <ratrace> Bushmaster: so how did you end up with Ubuntu 18.04's gnome snap?
3061 [12:50:06] <Bushmaster> is there a way to remove Photoscape
3062 [12:50:11] <ratrace> it didn't install itself automagically.
3063 [12:50:21] <Bushmaster> ratrace, I do not know, but I am in Debian
3064 [12:50:26] <ratrace> Bushmaster: `man snap` for commands. probably `snap remove <snap name>`
3065 [12:50:29] <shtrb> Bushmaster, snap remove $packagename
3066 [12:50:48] <shtrb> you may wish to select specific revisions or the entire crap
3067 [12:50:49] <ratrace> you also have two gnome snaps, that 400MB right there if you're not using gnome, but cinnamon
3068 [12:51:18] <shtrb> Why would wine be as a snap ?
3069 [12:51:28] <ratrace> Bushmaster: does dpkg -l | grep netpl show netplan.io?
3070 [12:51:35] <shtrb> Bushmaster, can you list your /etc/apt/sources.list please ?
3071 [12:51:37] <Bushmaster> shtrb, and ratrace so best would be to remove the entire crap, but not sure how to do it
3072 [12:51:53] <Bushmaster> yes okay hold on please
3073 [12:52:13] *** Joins: MrTrick (uid181961@replaced-ip )
3074 [12:52:30] <shtrb> you can iterate over "snap list --all" and run snap remove for each line
3075 [12:53:45] <shtrb> You can also then do sudo apt-get remove --purge snapd
3076 [12:54:01] <ratrace> well...... if that really is ubuntu, doing that would nuke the system
3077 [12:54:08] <Bushmaster> ratrace, and shtrb here replaced-url
3078 [12:54:09] <shtrb> he said he's on debian
3079 [12:54:31] <ratrace> I just don't believe it :) so careful, if that really is ubuntu, don't purge snapd.
3080 [12:54:41] <Bushmaster> shtrb, let me executue the first command
3081 [12:54:45] <Ede|Popede> wouldn't unake -k and /etc/os-release bring some light into that question?
3082 [12:54:54] *** Joins: mohabaks_ (~mohabaks@replaced-ip )
3083 [12:55:03] *** Quits: mohabaks (~mohabaks@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
3084 [12:55:10] <shtrb> Ede|Popede, neofetch said it was debian
3085 [12:55:16] <ratrace> can be faked like everything else :) wouldn't be the first time somoene went out of their way to get support from much more knowledgeable #debian, about their 'buntu.
3086 [12:55:33] *** Joins: d1cor (~d1cor@replaced-ip )
3087 [12:55:34] <shtrb> You are joking right?
3088 [12:55:34] <Ede|Popede> 22GB is really ambitioned for / btw. but i'm not surprised, can't see any info on snapcraft.io about the size of the photoscape snap.
3089 [12:56:00] <ratrace> ~20MB unpacked and mounted, according to the initial paste
3090 [12:56:13] <ratrace> so a bit more or less than that for the related squashfs on disk
3091 [12:56:30] <Bushmaster> shtrb, or Ede|Popede can any of you can help me to get some space in my debian root, i would appreciate
3092 [12:57:01] <ratrace> you're getting hepl right now. get rid of unwanted snaps, and old versions of wanted snaps
3093 [12:57:05] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster, just remove something from root, or move it to another partition
3094 [12:57:34] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you are getting help , uninstalling snaps , and then snapd would be a start , so does apt-get clean and as you had been told before
3095 [12:57:40] <Ede|Popede> du -x could be a start
3096 [12:57:42] *** Quits: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3097 [12:57:42] <Bushmaster> shtrb, and Ede|Popede this is what I get replaced-url
3098 [12:57:52] <ratrace> with ~/ on separate partition, I really DO wonder what took those 22GB out.
3099 [12:58:04] <ratrace> when you clean out some space, install ncdu and investigate where the bulk of disk space has gone
3100 [12:58:13] <Bushmaster> shtrb, I have done apt-get clean and it did nothing to clean
3101 [12:58:15] <shtrb> how the hell did you manage to get wine under snap ? it should be via apt
3102 [12:58:26] <ratrace> shtrb: newer versions
3103 [12:58:31] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster, the only thing i know about snap is that i don't use it, neither feel like doing so.
3104 [12:58:46] <ratrace> shtrb: and winehq's deb repo aren't always easy to work with
3105 [12:58:58] <Bushmaster> so shtrb can you give me the command to get rid of these snap and I think that will create space
3106 [12:58:59] <shtrb> ratrace, who ever use snap to get "newer" version shouldn't be surrpesied stuff no longer works later
3107 [12:59:20] <shtrb> Bushmaster, snap remove core snap remove core18 ... (and continue )
3108 [12:59:21] *** Quits: JohnML (~john1@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3109 [12:59:26] <ratrace> shtrb: but they're isolated so they (the snaps) can only break themselves
3110 [12:59:41] <shtrb> ratrace, who said it was installed in classical mode ?
3111 [12:59:42] *** Joins: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip )
3112 [12:59:56] <ratrace> shtrb: what do you mean?
3113 [13:00:00] *** Joins: JohnML (~john1@replaced-ip )
3114 [13:00:11] <ratrace> classical mode only means no security confines. the snap is still isolated from the rest of the system
3115 [13:00:26] <shtrb> ratrace, snap can be installed in several forms , classical mean it can write to root
3116 [13:00:32] <ratrace> doesn't files anywhere. it's a squashfs loopmounted, and run in a namespace
3117 [13:00:43] *** Quits: st4rry (~st4rry@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3118 [13:00:48] <ratrace> shtrb: nnnnnnnnnghh.... I'm not sure, maybe it can
3119 [13:00:52] <Bushmaster> shtrb, from that list, you want me to manuually type snap remove one after another, there is no easy way to delete all of them in one go>?
3120 [13:01:17] <ratrace> maybe with xargs if you can list the names only line by line
3121 [13:01:31] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you can use awk/xargs and iterate but manually running 16 command would be faster if you are asking this
3122 [13:01:54] <Bushmaster> shtrb, okay, let me try one at a time
3123 [13:01:56] *** Joins: daniel_gc (~daniel_gc@replaced-ip )
3124 [13:02:07] <Ede|Popede> what happened to goold old /opt? is it too old fashioned for all these new kinky software infrastructures to use?
3125 [13:02:29] <ratrace> Ede|Popede: confined/containerized app installation has its benefits. installing under /opt is still polluting the system
3126 [13:02:39] <shtrb> Ede|Popede, yes
3127 [13:02:40] <ratrace> and I'm not sold on --classical being able to willy nilly write anywhere.
3128 [13:02:41] <Bushmaster> shtrb, I get this replaced-url
3129 [13:02:49] <Ede|Popede> ratrace: at least it would keep / clean
3130 [13:03:12] <shtrb> Bushmaster, skip and continue
3131 [13:03:30] <shtrb> ratrace, that is ubuntu and snap
3132 [13:03:47] <shtrb> ratrace, everything is possible (I might be wrong )
3133 [13:04:10] <ratrace> it's a mess one way or another
3134 [13:04:46] <ratrace> snap list | awk '{print $1}' | xargs -n1 snap remove
3135 [13:05:01] *** Quits: dpkg (~dpkg@replaced-ip ) (Quit: buh bye!)
3136 [13:05:12] <Bushmaster> hold on ratrace
3137 [13:05:17] <ratrace> but please do understand what each of these is doing before you blindly copypasta and blame me for nuking your 'buntu :)
3138 [13:05:21] <shtrb> ratrace, some will fail , he need to have that one by one
3139 [13:05:26] *** Joins: dpkg (~dpkg@replaced-ip )
3140 [13:05:37] <ratrace> shtrb: this will do one by one, ther's no && depending on previous exit code
3141 [13:05:39] <Ede|Popede> multiple runs should work
3142 [13:05:39] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you are going to loose Wine and all your stuff
3143 [13:05:51] <Bushmaster> shtrb, that is fine
3144 [13:05:58] <ratrace> programs. sane snaps data will remain in users ~/
3145 [13:06:00] <Bushmaster> I am prepare to loose those shtrb
3146 [13:06:07] <Bushmaster> please try to make some space in my root
3147 [13:06:23] * Ede|Popede steps out of Bushmaster's root
3148 [13:06:33] <ratrace> Bushmaster: first thing after you free some space is to install `ncdu` and investigate where the bulk of 22G has gone, since your /home/ is on a separate drive
3149 [13:06:37] <shtrb> After you had purged snap , you would need to erase snap data from home dirs
3150 [13:07:04] <Bushmaster> so what command to start removeing this one snap list | awk '{print $1}' | xargs -n1 snap remove?
3151 [13:07:16] <Bushmaster> ratrace, I have ncdu alreadt
3152 [13:07:22] <Ede|Popede> personally i prefer the cushion sheet model for du with GUI.
3153 [13:07:28] <ratrace> well then run it and find where the bulk of disk space is
3154 [13:07:45] <ratrace> Bushmaster: your /home/ is separate drive so ignore that, check other system locations, where did 22G go
3155 [13:07:55] *** Quits: brickfat (~brickfat@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3156 [13:08:08] <Bushmaster> well, i cant i do not know where to locate the unnecessary files ratrace
3157 [13:08:18] <ratrace> that's a huge lot of space gone to system. even full blown DE installation with a handful of common programs like firefox, libreoffice, ... will all fit under 10G
3158 [13:08:29] <Bushmaster> shtrb, shall I utilize this command then snap list | awk '{print $1}' | xargs -n1 snap remove
3159 [13:08:30] *** Joins: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip )
3160 [13:08:31] <ratrace> Bushmaster: so oyu run ncdu and it shows you where
3161 [13:08:46] <shtrb> Bushmaster, listen to ratrace he is good and safe
3162 [13:09:05] <shtrb> I prefer one by one , ratrace prefered the more nuclear way
3163 [13:09:31] <Bushmaster> ncdu is running ratrace shtrb but I do not have much time
3164 [13:09:40] <shtrb> why ?
3165 [13:09:56] <shtrb> did you uninstall some at least ?
3166 [13:09:59] <Bushmaster> the sooner I can make some space in root the better, cos I am in the middle of installing Android Studio for Java and space ran out
3167 [13:10:13] * shtrb facepalm
3168 [13:10:17] <Bushmaster> shtrb, well uninstall how? shtrb
3169 [13:10:24] <ratrace> Bushmaster: run ncdu while you're on system root / so it can enumerate the top level disk hogs
3170 [13:10:24] <shtrb> snap remove ...
3171 [13:10:58] <shtrb> or ratrace's command
3172 [13:10:58] <Bushmaster> shtrb, well it has gnome and all that, not sure you want me to remove all that, but now NCDU is running
3173 [13:11:19] <Ede|Popede> not even gnome and all that should be so greedy
3174 [13:11:19] <ratrace> Bushmaster: you're not even using gnome. do you need it?
3175 [13:11:33] *** Quits: PoaB (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip ) (Quit: PoaB)
3176 [13:11:45] <shtrb> time to purge some gnomes
3177 [13:12:22] <Bushmaster> ratrace, shtrb here is the NCDU output replaced-url
3178 [13:12:32] <Bushmaster> no I do not need it ratrace
3179 [13:12:53] <ratrace> Bushmaster: then remove it. what's in /ACADEMIC
3180 [13:12:53] <Bushmaster> i just need some space in my root okay, can anyhone help please, as you realize I am not the brightest
3181 [13:13:06] <ratrace> Bushmaster: I don't see that among your mountpoints, and it hogs 19 gees
3182 [13:13:08] <shtrb> ratrace, he run it from his homedir
3183 [13:13:29] <Bushmaster> ratrace, its all home what NCDU showing
3184 [13:13:30] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you should have run ncdu from /
3185 [13:13:31] <ratrace> oh right right
3186 [13:13:43] <jelly> (and as root user)
3187 [13:14:01] <ratrace> yeah. as root, run `ncdu` while you've cd'd into / (top level root dir)
3188 [13:14:14] *** Joins: st4rry (~st4rry@replaced-ip )
3189 [13:14:16] <Bushmaster> running again
3190 [13:14:26] <Bushmaster> can anyone help me to remove them snap in one go
3191 [13:14:35] <ratrace> Bushmaster: the command I gave you will do it
3192 [13:14:38] <shtrb> Bushmaster, ratrace gave you the command already
3193 [13:14:49] <ratrace> but please do understand what each of these is doing before you blindly copypasta and blame me for nuking your 'buntu :)
3194 [13:15:01] * jelly likes to du -x / > du-x-root.$(date -I).txt; sort -n du-x-root.$(date -I).txt | tail -n30
3195 [13:15:03] <Bushmaster> ratrace, which one ? This one snap list | awk '{print $1}' | xargs -n1 snap remove
3196 [13:15:11] <ratrace> Bushmaster: yes
3197 [13:15:22] <ratrace> but please do understand what each of these is doing before you blindly copypasta and blame me for nuking your system
3198 [13:15:34] <Bushmaster> ratrace, will it break my Debian?
3199 [13:15:40] <ratrace> should not
3200 [13:15:46] <shtrb> Bushmaster, and for your future sanity don't listen to friends who suggest to use snaps, meth or mixing debian versions
3201 [13:15:55] <Bushmaster> they were not there, they only came when somebody help me to install photoscape
3202 [13:16:00] <ratrace> Bushmaster: if you're actively using that gnome snap........ it WILL break your UI
3203 [13:16:15] <Bushmaster> I do not even know until today shtrb and ratrace
3204 [13:16:39] *** Quits: ov3rmind (~over0-07@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3205 [13:16:40] <Bushmaster> ratrace, am I using gnome or cinnamon, ? I think I am using cinnam on
3206 [13:16:51] <shtrb> #%@#%@#
3207 [13:17:01] <ratrace> I don't know. you could have both installed, and who knows what you selected on login
3208 [13:17:03] *** Joins: ov3rmind (~over0-07@replaced-ip )
3209 [13:17:14] <ratrace> then again .... just installing gnome snap on debian ... does that even work. that's ubuntu's thing.
3210 [13:17:26] *** Quits: towo` (~towo@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3211 [13:17:36] <shtrb> he also have .kde which mean that at one point he used plasma/kde
3212 [13:17:39] <Bushmaster> ratrace, replaced-url
3213 [13:17:50] *** Quits: st4rry (~st4rry@replaced-ip ) (Client Quit)
3214 [13:18:19] <Bushmaster> now I am gonna utilize that ratrace command
3215 [13:18:27] *** Quits: xet7 (~xet7@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3216 [13:18:28] <ratrace> Bushmaster: okay your /usr is a bit bloated, see if you can apt remove programs you don't use. snaps took 6 gees, so that's gonna free a lot of space. and WTH is 5G in /root/ ??
3217 [13:18:53] <shtrb> Bushmaster, don't forget to purge snap after you you ratrace's command
3218 [13:19:07] <ratrace> _and_ there's stuff in /opt holy hell, that's one effed up carnival ride! :))
3219 [13:19:11] <Bushmaster> i do not know how to do purge let me do the first command
3220 [13:19:24] <shtrb> Bushmaster, sudo apt-get remove --purge snapd
3221 [13:19:28] <ratrace> apt p.... yes that
3222 [13:19:56] <Ede|Popede> /usr may hold tons of docs
3223 [13:20:02] <shtrb> ratrace, having /opt is better than having /snap :P
3224 [13:20:15] <ratrace> I kno, I have PyCharm there. not using the pycharm snap
3225 [13:20:34] <ratrace> I used to use pycharm snap because <convenience> . it breaks EVERY TIME it auto-updates. yeah, no, baii.
3226 [13:20:37] <shtrb> flatpak should get more love than snap
3227 [13:20:55] *** Joins: towo` (~towo@replaced-ip )
3228 [13:21:00] *** Quits: mulot (~tyzef@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3229 [13:21:40] <Bushmaster> ratrace, shtrb now its stuck after this replaced-url
3230 [13:22:06] *** Joins: mulot (~tyzef@replaced-ip )
3231 [13:22:13] <shtrb> that is why I suggested to do it one by one
3232 [13:22:24] <Bushmaster> ratrace, shtrb oh yes it has removed it something I think here replaced-url
3233 [13:22:52] <ratrace> shtrb: it would have the same effect, running xargs -n1 does one by one independently
3234 [13:22:59] <Bushmaster> now this one right shtrb and ratrace apt-get remove --purge snapd
3235 [13:23:03] <shtrb> yes
3236 [13:23:06] <Bushmaster> hold on
3237 [13:23:18] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster: given these dependencies maybe it would be easier to remove snaps using wine and then wine. just to free up sth for the beginning.
3238 [13:23:23] <shtrb> ratrace, but when a person runs the command he understand what he does (and has it in front of his eyes)
3239 [13:23:28] <ratrace> "snaps using wine"?
3240 [13:23:54] <shtrb> Ede|Popede, it's wine over snap not the other way around ,because of he has snap for windows under wine it would be hilarious
3241 [13:24:02] <ratrace> careful with phrasing instructions to a novice :) or someone might try to install snapd under WSL under wine :)))
3242 [13:24:10] <Ede|Popede> *shrug* no idea what they're putting into snaps, i'm just prepared for everything
3243 [13:24:15] <Bushmaster> shtrb, ratrace Ede|Popede no idea, so what i need to do next, am not sure space has been made
3244 [13:24:26] <shtrb> did you purge ?
3245 [13:24:32] <shtrb> what was the result of the purge ?
3246 [13:24:37] <ratrace> shtrb: yes and I think I stated four times that they should understand my command before blindly copypasta :)
3247 [13:24:49] <Ede|Popede> df -h /
3248 [13:25:07] <Bushmaster> i get this shtrb ratrace and Ede|Popede
3249 [13:25:09] <Bushmaster> replaced-url
3250 [13:25:10] <Ede|Popede> if the Used column ends with a G it would a e good sign
3251 [13:25:25] <Bushmaster> hold on Ede|Popede
3252 [13:26:01] *** Quits: BenDover (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3253 [13:26:11] <Bushmaster> Ede|Popede, ratrace shtrb here replaced-url
3254 [13:26:17] <ratrace> I _believe_ (so I'm not 100% sure) you can `rm -r /snap`
3255 [13:26:19] <ratrace> (note, no -f)
3256 [13:26:24] <Bushmaster> i think not much space is cleared, roughly 1 GiB right?
3257 [13:26:51] <Bushmaster> shall I do rm -r/snap
3258 [13:26:57] <ratrace> Bushmaster: it's quite possible, snaps are stored as squashfs
3259 [13:27:01] <ratrace> Bushmaster: I would.
3260 [13:27:09] *** Joins: HerbY_NL2 (~HerbY_NL2@replaced-ip )
3261 [13:27:13] <ratrace> careful with spacing!
3262 [13:27:21] <ratrace> though -r / wouldn't do a thing.
3263 [13:27:26] *** Joins: rgr_ (~rgr@replaced-ip )
3264 [13:27:38] <Bushmaster> hold on ratrace
3265 [13:27:42] *** Quits: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3266 [13:28:00] <shtrb> Bushmaster, "sudo rm -r /snap" beware of the space !
3267 [13:28:32] <ratrace> tahnkfully rm -r / wouldn't do anything
3268 [13:28:33] <Bushmaster> shtrb, ratrace replaced-url
3269 [13:28:46] <ratrace> BUT YES ... always be mindful of what you type with rm before you hit the final <enter>
3270 [13:29:00] <ratrace> Bushmaster: I TOLD YOU.... WE TOLD YOU TWICE TO MIND THE SPACES !!!!!!
3271 [13:29:07] * ratrace flips table and screams
3272 [13:29:11] <shtrb> Obligatory replaced-url
3273 [13:29:41] <ratrace> shtrb: and Microsoft's R package that rm'd /bin/bash
3274 [13:29:44] <nkuttler> rm -rf root is a good teacher
3275 [13:29:45] *** Joins: SoulsForBelial (~SoulsForB@replaced-ip )
3276 [13:29:55] <ratrace> nkuttler: --no-preserve-root
3277 [13:29:56] <shtrb> nkuttler, not even funny
3278 [13:30:01] *** Quits: rgr (~rgr@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
3279 [13:30:07] <shtrb> someone would now nuke root's home dir because of you
3280 [13:30:08] <ratrace> without it, rm-rf/ wouldn't do a thing :)
3281 [13:30:09] <Bushmaster> okay I have done that again and this time I got prompt back ratrace shtrb
3282 [13:30:11] <nkuttler> shtrb: it wasn't meant as a joke
3283 [13:30:22] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster: spaces, quoting, escapes. the holy trinity of shell commands.
3284 [13:30:45] <nkuttler> shtrb: that would have been a good learning experience, better than / for sure
3285 [13:30:46] <Bushmaster> Ede|Popede, no idea, so what is next? do i have some space
3286 [13:30:58] <shtrb> Bushmaster, df -h
3287 [13:31:05] <Ede|Popede> used to be 1.6G last time i've seen it, it's a good start
3288 [13:31:16] <ratrace> Bushmaster: ALSO ... what do you have in /root/ that takes 5G
3289 [13:31:28] *** Joins: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip )
3290 [13:32:00] <shtrb> someone should be with Bushmaster and tell him about using lsof to find hogged data that is no longer have a filename
3291 [13:32:03] <Bushmaster> ratrace, shtrb replaced-url
3292 [13:32:06] *** Joins: Grldfrdom (uid391113@replaced-ip )
3293 [13:32:44] <Bushmaster> ratrace, shtrb I do not know, in file manager it shows 4.1 GiB space left and df- h shows 1.6 GiB
3294 [13:33:13] *** Joins: lpancescu (~laur@replaced-ip )
3295 [13:33:41] <ratrace> one step at a time. Apparently snaps only took 1.6G on disk. good.... next..... why is /root/ having 5G?
3296 [13:33:45] <Bushmaster> is there any way to get rid of some other software like I have Texmaker
3297 [13:33:55] <Bushmaster> ratrace, I do not know
3298 [13:34:13] *** Joins: jpe (~jp@replaced-ip )
3299 [13:34:15] <ratrace> WELL LOOK INSIDE IT .
3300 [13:34:19] <Ede|Popede> same game, next round
3301 [13:34:19] <Bushmaster> I have apache server running but I need that ratrace
3302 [13:34:27] <ratrace> where, in /root/ ???
3303 [13:34:46] <Bushmaster> well apache is running yes, i think it is in root
3304 [13:34:46] *** Quits: banisterfiend (~textual@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
3305 [13:34:48] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you can use dpigs to find big packages
3306 [13:35:00] <shtrb> Bushmaster, that does not work like that
3307 [13:35:06] <ratrace> Bushmaster: what do you mean ........... apache is in root . Please clarify.
3308 [13:35:26] <Bushmaster> ratrace, I do not know, all I know apache runs my file server
3309 [13:35:39] <Bushmaster> shtrb, that command does not worek
3310 [13:35:41] <ratrace> so the LOOK INTO /root/ and ls what's there. pastebin if needed
3311 [13:35:45] *** Joins: xet7 (~xet7@replaced-ip )
3312 [13:35:47] <Bushmaster> can we clear some more space
3313 [13:35:57] <ratrace> yes, look into /root/
3314 [13:36:03] <shtrb> Bushmaster, dpigs does not work or is not installed ?
3315 [13:36:08] <Bushmaster> look how? NCDU?
3316 [13:36:10] <Ede|Popede> then it runs with root privileges, but not in root's HOME (or it should not at least)
3317 [13:36:12] <ratrace> ...............
3318 [13:36:23] <Ede|Popede> <Ede|Popede> same game, next round <-- Bushmaster
3319 [13:36:29] <ratrace> Bushmaster: what do you think? how do you look into a directory on linux.
3320 [13:36:30] <Ede|Popede> just like you did before in /
3321 [13:37:10] <Ede|Popede> find your preferred poison, du, ncdu, gdmap, and use it
3322 [13:37:15] <shtrb> Bushmaster, dpigs is provided by debian-goodies
3323 [13:37:32] <shtrb> but check what the hell ate your root
3324 [13:37:39] <ratrace> I refuse to believe somoene is using all this software and apache even, and has to ask how to look into a directory....
3325 [13:37:43] *** Joins: darby5709 (~felike@replaced-ip )
3326 [13:37:46] *** Quits: geowiesnot (~user@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
3327 [13:37:48] <shtrb> what ate your /root
3328 [13:37:52] *** darby5709 is now known as S3xyL1nux
3329 [13:38:08] <shtrb> ratrace, I'm dealing with many ex-ubuntu and some kali users , it's normal
3330 [13:38:34] <ratrace> good grief.
3331 [13:38:39] <Bushmaster> i am running out time here ratrace shtrb hence I will need to do it some other timer
3332 [13:38:52] <Ede|Popede> ratrace, that's what systems like snap come with. single click install, shiny interfaces, no need to understand anything from the beginning.
3333 [13:38:53] <shtrb> Bushmaster, cd /root , du -h
3334 [13:38:58] *** Quits: S3xyL1nux (~felike@replaced-ip ) (K-Lined)
3335 [13:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1173
3336 [13:39:09] <Bushmaster> thanks a lot for helping me to install Android Studio by creating space, it has been installed but no icon is created
3337 [13:39:43] <shtrb> One problem at a time
3338 [13:40:00] <ratrace> looks like one problem just replaced another, so you still have N problems :)
3339 [13:40:31] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster, you also may want to think about some kind of notepad solution, may it be simple text files or a wiki or whatever.
3340 [13:40:32] <shtrb> Bushmaster, can you please paste the output of sudo du -h --max-depth=1 /root ? (make sure there is nothing that private when you paste)
3341 [13:40:35] *** Quits: darunesh (~darunesh@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3342 [13:41:01] <Bushmaster> shtrb, hold on
3343 [13:41:26] <Bushmaster> that question mark is also in the command?
3344 [13:41:38] <Ede|Popede> no
3345 [13:41:44] <shtrb> and also "sudo ls -lsa /root
3346 [13:41:44] <Ede|Popede> thus the spaces
3347 [13:41:44] <shtrb> "
3348 [13:42:22] <Bushmaster> i get this with question mark in it replaced-url
3349 [13:42:37] <ratrace> ...........
3350 [13:43:05] <ratrace> ohgawd.... /root/Desktop oh. my. gawd. oh lord. oh penguins!
3351 [13:43:14] <Bushmaster> without question mark I get this shtrb replaced-url
3352 [13:43:49] *** Quits: dexta (~D3XTA@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3353 [13:44:04] <Ede|Popede> /root/Android ?
3354 [13:44:05] <shtrb> Bushmaster, why do you have an Android folder for root ? why did you log in as root with a DE ? did you use Kali in the past ?
3355 [13:44:05] <Bushmaster> shtrb, ratrace replaced-url
3356 [13:44:21] <ratrace> Bushmaster: right, so first thing... stop logging into your desktop as root. NEVER do that. ever.
3357 [13:44:22] <Bushmaster> shtrb, I just installed Adroid Studio yes
3358 [13:44:51] <Bushmaster> i thought you wanted to see the out put of these commands hence the root ratrace shtrb
3359 [13:44:53] <Ede|Popede> are you planning to run is with your root account?
3360 [13:45:03] <Bushmaster> Ede|Popede, no
3361 [13:45:09] <Ede|Popede> so why in /root then?
3362 [13:45:14] <Bushmaster> how do I run that Adroid Studio anyway
3363 [13:45:17] <ratrace> Bushmaster: yes and now we're helping you fix a HUGE problem yo've created: running desktop as root.
3364 [13:45:27] <shtrb> Bushmaster, you should move all that stuff to /home for some user , and use THAT user
3365 [13:45:41] <Bushmaster> what stuffs?
3366 [13:45:47] <ratrace> everything in /root/
3367 [13:45:54] <Ede|Popede> !root
3368 [13:45:55] <dpkg> It has been said that root is the administrative account - only use it when root power is needed. So no reading mail, compiling programs, or running applications as root. And don't even think about irc'ing as root, it increases the danger from exploits and trojans (such as bliss), or see, for example, the security advisory on BitchX replaced-url
3369 [13:46:02] <ratrace> almost everything. all the user files
3370 [13:46:16] <Ede|Popede> "administrative account" <-- you don't do daily user tasks with it.
3371 [13:46:30] <Ede|Popede> you use it to keep your system working
3372 [13:46:59] <ratrace> rarely, mindfully, slowly typing things out and thinking twice, thrice, before you hit enter.
3373 [13:47:03] <shtrb> That is not the first time you log in to your DE by root either
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3375 [13:47:36] <Bushmaster> well i do not know all that and how to do such massive operation
3376 [13:47:38] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster: in your graphical login screen, do you have the root account listed?
3377 [13:47:42] <Bushmaster> and now I do not even have the time
3378 [13:47:47] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster: that's 101.
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3380 [13:48:21] <shtrb> please tell you didn't let someone access your ssh account as root for help
3381 [13:48:33] <Bushmaster> Ede|Popede, i do not think so, but not sure, machine runs 24 hours, cos its a Apache server, hence never really log back on
3382 [13:48:52] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster: you don't have to LOG IN to run apache
3383 [13:48:58] <shtrb> someone had been using it for more than a webserver
3384 [13:48:59] <Bushmaster> well what people can get from me anywayh
3385 [13:49:05] <ratrace> Bushmaster: it's an apache server on public internet?
3386 [13:49:08] <Ede|Popede> your computer?
3387 [13:49:11] <Ede|Popede> running a bot?
3388 [13:49:13] <Bushmaster> yes its public
3389 [13:49:22] <Ede|Popede> making your PC part of criminal activities?
3390 [13:49:24] <ratrace> you should shut it down immediately
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3392 [13:49:41] <shtrb> Bushmaster, 99% you had been hacked
3393 [13:49:43] <ratrace> turn it off, unplug the network cable, and never turn it on again until you've learned how to responsibly run public infrastructure
3394 [13:50:06] <ratrace> I will stop helping you until you've cut the network cable.
3395 [13:50:29] <shtrb> Bushmaster, unplug it , disconnect from any network access , asusme there is maleware on it. no usb flash that had entered it should be assume maleware free
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3398 [13:51:47] <shtrb> Bushmaster, Assume this machine have airborne rabies and airborne syphilis
3399 [13:52:07] <Bushmaster> how do I run that Android Studio I just installed
3400 [13:52:11] <Bushmaster> no icon is created
3401 [13:52:12] <ratrace> on
3402 [13:52:19] <ratrace> *no. you stop using that machine.
3403 [13:52:25] <shtrb> Bushmaster, that machine is gone , disconnect it
3404 [13:52:33] <ratrace> disconnect the network cable first, then we can talk.
3405 [13:52:45] <Ede|Popede> Bushmaster >>>>> For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.
3406 [13:53:02] <Ede|Popede> which doesn't mean IGNORE EVERYTHING THAT'S SAID TO YOU
3407 [13:53:20] <Ede|Popede> ask, get an answer, do what's necessary
3408 [13:54:18] <Bushmaster> not sure why this Android Studio is not in list icon
3409 [13:54:29] <Bushmaster> may be I need to reboot the machine to bring it back
3410 [13:54:38] <Ede|Popede> ignore what you're told to do, it's up to you.
3411 [13:54:40] <ratrace> you need to cut the network cable
3412 [13:54:47] <Ede|Popede> but then expect to be ignored in return.
3413 [13:55:05] <dermoth> Hello.. runnbing raspbian but since it's debian-bases... anyone ever encounteres an issue like this? Static ip configured by dhcpcd - when link flaps dhcpcd removed the static ip and never puts it bask.
3414 [13:55:10] *** Quits: Hallcyon (~Hallcyon@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
3415 [13:55:16] <Ede|Popede> !debian based
3416 [13:55:16] <dpkg> Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare replaced-url
3417 [13:55:20] <dermoth> I tried the nolink option but it still removes it
3418 [13:55:24] <ratrace> dermoth: "Static ip configured by dhcpcd" ... its not static then
3419 [13:55:48] <dermoth> yeah it it, dhcpcd allow configuring static ip's
3420 [13:56:09] <dermoth> it's runing as a daemin and configuring interfaces - some may be using dhcp other statically configured
3421 [13:56:18] <ratrace> dermoth: so then how do you call when you type up the ip manually in /etc/network/interfaces?
3422 [13:56:18] <dermoth> as a daemon
3423 [13:56:53] <ratrace> if it's defined by dhcp, it's not static network configuration, for all intents and purposes of the term "static network configuration" that has been used forever
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3425 [13:57:24] <dermoth> /etc/network/interfaces is empty - well I think I might just disable dhcpcd and configure everything statically in there... I'm not sure why it's set up like this, my latest raspian uses static config in there instaed
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3427 [13:58:11] <ratrace> dermoth: we are not sure eithre, we have no clue here in #debian. see the factoid above.
3428 [13:58:33] <ratrace> under debian, dhcp configuration means having an entry in /etc/network/interfaces by default.
3429 [13:58:35] <dermoth> ok... thanks anyway
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3431 [13:59:11] <ratrace> and it's using dhclient, not dhcpcd ... so you see THAT is why the factoid is there.
3432 [13:59:36] <shtrb> What would be a config to setup system default dialer (url hadnler to make calls) ?
3433 [13:59:44] <dermoth> yep... well by default, but you can install dhcpcd in debian :)
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3436 [14:02:47] <dermoth> it's actually the dhcpcd5 package (but still called dhcpcd...)
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3438 [14:05:46] <ov3rmind> i need congratulate firejail devels, someone tryed to delete some data of my accounts and i recover using firejail, very thanks cool friends
3439 [14:06:16] <ratrace> tryina picture here how does one recover data using firejail.
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3441 [14:06:56] <shtrb> ov3rmind, that does not make any sense
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3446 [14:11:19] <ratrace> so it seems..... dhcpcd can actually, litreally, be uset to set up non-dhcp "static" network config. how 'bout that.
3447 [14:11:33] <ratrace> sans all the not-had-coffee-yet typos
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3449 [14:12:30] <ratrace> now I have to figure out why would someone replace defaults with dhcpcd to set up static (non-dhcp) IPs .
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3508 [15:25:24] <wsky> suspends 10 seconds after closing thel id?
3509 [15:25:29] <wsky> oops
3510 [15:25:39] <wsky> is there a reason why my comnputer suspends 10 seconds after closing thel id?
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3512 [15:28:39] <LtL> wsky: it does so to prevent over-heating, is my best guess.
3513 [15:28:53] <wsky> well, that's not what i meant
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3515 [15:28:59] <wsky> i want it to suspend instantly
3516 [15:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1184
3517 [15:29:02] <LtL> mine does the same thing
3518 [15:29:36] <mspe> why are testing and unstable Contents-all 404?
3519 [15:30:07] <ratrace> mspe: ENOCONTEXT, also:
3520 [15:30:09] <ratrace> !debian-next
3521 [15:30:09] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also replaced-url
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3535 [15:43:17] <Kilgarah_Hunith> atleast debian 10 buster got me to stop ditro hopping :)
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3561 [16:05:03] <mspe> I did debian-hopping
3562 [16:05:29] <mspe> stable, unstable, stable+backports+pinning, and currently testing
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3578 [16:24:26] <Zathras> How can I 'broadcast' cname/aliases of a hostname through avahi? It can be manually done by script, but isn't there any proper daemonized way?
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3580 [16:24:44] <Brigo> mspe, i didn't know debian-hopping was a thing :)=
3581 [16:25:14] <Zathras> a bit like: replaced-url
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3585 [16:26:34] <Zathras> I noticed a patch for the server-daemon in 2012 or so, but avahi-alias is not part of buster
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3587 [16:27:06] <quadrathoch2> ,v avahi-alias
3588 [16:27:08] <judd> No package named 'avahi-alias' was found in amd64.
3589 [16:28:06] <Zathras> if it would be a part, it would likely be part of a package, not a full package, but I fear it does just plain does not exist
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3605 [16:43:54] <edernucci> 37.425713 -122.1703694 1608058800
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3611 [16:47:37] <edernucci> 37.425713 -122.1703694 1608058800
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3615 [16:53:50] <otisolsen70> Is there any way to get "age" (replaced-url
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3617 [16:54:54] <pasiz> Zathras: avahi-aliases package is for python. there is also mdns-publisher (also via pip)
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3619 [16:55:55] <pasiz> so pip install avahi-aliases should get you that package (depends on python3-avahi)
3620 [16:58:01] <ksk> ,v golang
3621 [16:58:02] <judd> Package: golang on amd64 -- jessie: 2:1.3.3-1; jessie-security: 2:1.3.3-1+deb8u2; stretch: 2:1.7~5; stretch-backports: 2:1.11~1~bpo9+1; buster: 2:1.11~1; buster-backports: 2:1.14~1~bpo10+1; bullseye: 2:1.15~1; sid: 2:1.15~1
3622 [16:58:19] <ksk> !tell otisolsen70 about backports
3623 [16:59:00] <ksk> otisolsen70: buster-backports has 1.14 - that should work according to your description.
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3625 [16:59:34] <dob1> considering that I am not used to graphics programs, I have a screenshot I have to obfuscate some parts of it (some text), what program can I use that makes this simple?
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3627 [17:00:20] <LtL> dob1: gimp
3628 [17:00:21] <dob1> I would like the blur effect
3629 [17:00:29] <dob1> gimp is difficult
3630 [17:00:48] <LtL> dob1: for what you need, no it's not.
3631 [17:01:22] <dob1> LtL, I found a tutorial for this, I try
3632 [17:01:25] <ksk> You can also easily google "debian linux paint replacement" and get many blogs giving you a wide field to choose from..
3633 [17:01:35] <avu> blur can be dangerous for this, it might be reversable at least to a certain degree, I'd prefer just straight black or something like that
3634 [17:02:21] <ksk> dob1: for example, "pinta"
3635 [17:02:35] <dob1> avu, like a black line on it ? it's better?
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3637 [17:02:47] <dob1> I give a try
3638 [17:03:04] <avu> dob1: yes, just cover the sensitive parts up with a opaque color
3639 [17:03:14] <dob1> ok thanks
3640 [17:03:16] <Haohmaru> yes, blur could be reversed to some degree.. beware
3641 [17:03:18] <avu> which should be trival even in gimp :)
3642 [17:04:09] <Haohmaru> for stuff like this, i use MSPaint (or KolourPaint when i'm on debian) and use a thicc brush
3643 [17:04:20] <Haohmaru> or filled rectangle
3644 [17:04:44] <otisolsen70> ksk, ok
3645 [17:04:48] <otisolsen70> ksk, thanks
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3660 [17:16:25] <jhutchins> ,kernels
3661 [17:16:26] <judd> Available kernel versions are: experimental: 5.10.0-rc6-686-pae (5.10~rc6-1~exp1); sid: 5.9.0-4-686-pae (5.9.11-1); bullseye: 5.9.0-4-686-pae (5.9.11-1); buster-backports: 5.9.0-0.bpo.2-686 (5.9.6-1~bpo10+1); buster: 4.19.0-13-686-pae (4.19.160-2); stretch-backports: 4.19.0-0.bpo.9-686-pae (4.19.118-2+deb10u1~bpo9+1); stretch: 4.19.0-0.bpo.13-686 (4.19.160-2~deb9u1); jessie-
3662 [17:16:27] <judd> backports: 4.9.0-0.bpo.6-686-pae (4.9.88-1+deb9u1~bpo8+1); jessie: 4.9.0-0.bpo.12-686 (4.9.210-1+deb9u1~deb8u1)
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3667 [17:19:53] <jhutchins> Strange, my system is stuck at 4.9.0 on stretch.
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3670 [17:26:07] <pasiz> jhutchins: stretch kernel should be 4.9 according to: replaced-url
3671 [17:26:53] <pasiz> also: replaced-url
3672 [17:27:21] <jhutchins> pasiz: Yeah, somehow the bpo version "leaked" in judd.
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3679 [17:33:22] <Zathras> pasiz, thank you. I already got it working using a python script, but I would like to have a daemonized solution
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3708 [17:53:46] <freem> dpkg: !help
3709 [17:53:47] <dpkg> freem: I don't know, could you explain it?
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3717 [17:58:23] <freem> anyone knows if this link: replaced-url
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3720 [18:00:56] <last1> I am trying to mount a remote nfs v3 share but I keep getting this error: RPC: server 192.168.1.21 requires stronger authentication
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3724 [18:01:27] <freem> also, I'm thinking of using (home-made) packages to automatically patch a system's configuration, after an initial install and also when it receives updates. Planning to do so with both PreDepends relation and triggers. Would it be doable/desirable?
3725 [18:02:15] <freem> last1: is not NFS3 outdated?
3726 [18:02:37] <last1> it may be...so I can't mount it anymore ?
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3730 [18:03:47] <freem> you can probably still mount it, but why would you? Do you must use NFS3 instead of NFS4? Are you certain you are actually trying to access an NFS3 mount? How are you trying to access it?
3731 [18:04:30] <last1> yes, this is a local repository that relies on IP based authentication
3732 [18:05:10] <last1> the thing is, I checked with tcpdump on the nfs server, the debian client doesn't even send the mount request
3733 [18:05:20] <last1> something local on debian throws that error before even trying to mount
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3736 [18:06:47] <last1> no, I take that back, I wasn't running tcpdump properly
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3774 [18:39:53] <TomyWork> "The repository 'file:...' does not have a Release file." - I'm trying to figure out why this is a security issue. Is it because .deb packages cannot be individually signed and thus require signing via the repo key to be considered authentic?
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3776 [18:40:51] <greycat> Packages are not signed; package *lists* are signed.
3777 [18:41:12] <freem> .deb packages can be individually signed: replaced-url
3778 [18:41:20] <TomyWork> i have a Packages.gz that I know isn't signed
3779 [18:41:39] <freem> "Some packages are signed by a GPG key." but this does not mean it's the norm.
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3781 [18:41:45] <TomyWork> freem, that sounds like source packages
3782 [18:41:53] <freem> ah, true
3783 [18:41:54] <TomyWork> not entirely sure though
3784 [18:42:15] <freem> finding doc about what can go in binary packages is not really easy
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3786 [18:43:00] <TomyWork> afaik it's just some version number, control and data
3787 [18:43:01] <freem> I remember having found something months ago, but lost the bookmark
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3789 [18:43:14] <TomyWork> and control afaik doesn't contain any signatures
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3792 [18:43:43] <TomyWork> neither does data, since that's just the plain tree
3793 [18:43:44] <freem> not only. There are triggers, post/pre rm/inst scripts, conffiles, file hashes, etc in the same tarball as control
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3795 [18:44:10] <TomyWork> yes these are in control. they're not signatures. so nothing i said was wrong :)
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3797 [18:44:41] <freem> oh, you meant control.tar.gz? sorry, I thought you meant DEBIAN/control :)
3798 [18:44:46] <TomyWork> yes
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3810 [18:52:36] <freem> looks like I can be forgiven for that confusion: "There is unfortunately a collision of terminology here between control information files and files in the Debian control file format." :)
3811 [18:52:39] <freem> replaced-url
3812 [18:52:43] <freem> finally found that doc anew
3813 [18:54:06] <freem> and indeed, I can't find anything to sign a binary package.
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3816 [18:55:37] <sney> you use debsign to sign the .dsc and .changes files, and that gpg signature applies to the package built by them.
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3824 [18:56:45] <freem> but can't be found inside built package, thus signs must be in a keyring?
3825 [18:57:58] <sney> that sounds right. it's been a few years since I've done this so my memory is a little fuzzy, though. #debian-mentors on OFTC (note, right now you are on freenode) would be able to tell you 100%
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3838 [19:07:05] <powerjungle_> is there a way to use backports only for a single package or will it upgrade all of them?
3839 [19:07:28] <sney> backports is designed to be used with single packages only
3840 [19:07:54] <powerjungle_> oh okay
3841 [19:07:58] <sney> or single packages and their immediate dependencies, anyway. if you enable backports you will only get what you explicitly ask for
3842 [19:08:10] <powerjungle_> that's nice
3843 [19:09:55] <powerjungle_> sney, thanks for the info
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3846 [19:10:33] <sney> np
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3859 [19:17:09] <freem> but one could favor backported packages, using preferences. That would probably not be such a good idea though. Not sure about the idea's quality.
3860 [19:17:40] <freem> s!preferences!/etc/apt/preferences.d/!
3861 [19:17:44] <sney> the bpo instructions say not to do that. bpo packages have been tested in combination with stable, but usually not with each other.
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3863 [19:18:22] <freem> I would not really even try to do that, but I just wanted to mention taht there is techinically a way
3864 [19:19:01] <freem> admins should know what they are going to do before installing a backported package anyway
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3866 [19:20:16] <powerjungle_> well only thing I'll be upgrading from the backports is znc
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3878 [19:31:49] <f8e4> assume 1gb blob byte file; how to chunk 1mb off at the end?
3879 [19:32:25] <greycat> man 1 truncate
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3881 [19:34:24] <f8e4> greycat ty
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3885 [19:43:29] <_0xbadc0de> greycat: you chillin brah
3886 [19:43:33] <_0xbadc0de> you chillin?
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3902 [20:01:52] <edernucci> 37.425713 -122.1703694 1608058800
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3907 [20:03:03] <tomreyn> thanks for the birthday party invitation
3908 [20:03:31] <greycat> latitude, longitude, and time in epoch format?
3909 [20:03:42] <tomreyn> looks like it
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3913 [20:05:27] <freem> it's in the past.
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3923 [20:15:43] <_0xbadc0de> I have bullseye how do I install virtualbox?
3924 [20:15:50] <_0xbadc0de> the one from debian 10 should work?
3925 [20:16:24] <nkuttler> ,v virtualbox
3926 [20:16:25] <judd> Package: virtualbox on amd64 -- jessie/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; jessie-security/contrib: 4.3.36-dfsg-1+deb8u1; stretch-backports/contrib: 5.2.24-dfsg-4~bpo9+1; sid/contrib: 6.1.16-dfsg-6
3927 [20:16:38] <nkuttler> !debian-next
3928 [20:16:38] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also replaced-url
3929 [20:16:38] <greycat> as you can see there *isn't* one in Debian 10
3930 [20:16:50] <greycat> also ask the bot about virtualbox
3931 [20:16:56] <_0xbadc0de> fuck you there is one in the virtualbox website
3932 [20:17:07] <greycat> _0xbadc0de: /msg dpkg virtualbox
3933 [20:18:11] <freem> how polite.
3934 [20:18:35] <edernucci> 37.425713 -122.1703694 1608058800
3935 [20:19:01] <greycat> There may be one *for* Debian 10 on the third party web site. You can try that if you feel you trust them. There is not one *from* Debian 10, because Debian dropped support for virtualbox.
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3941 [20:21:28] <_0xbadc0de> yeah but my question is will it work on debian 11
3942 [20:21:47] <greycat> We don't know. The #debian-next people might.
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3945 [20:22:15] <greycat> According to judd there's a version in sid, which may or may not be compatible with the current in-flux version of Debian testing. The #debian-next people might know.
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3951 [20:31:33] <pasiz> _0xbadc0de: in my testing systems it doesn't work, but are free to try it yourself...
3952 [20:32:07] <towo`> _0xbadc0de, and why you ask in 2 channels the same question at the same time
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3973 [20:51:50] <neilthereildeil> how isi it possible to have multiple python processes listening on the same port? python 1237 neil 20u IPv4 2199706 0t0 TCP *:2042 (LISTEN)
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3976 [20:53:19] <wr> on my Debian XFCE, my sound gets up/down mute/ON most times, seen, uninstalled, reloads, bars, icons, packages, configs, can't figure out what the hell is doing this, seems sometimes with everything closed icon flashes, i am suspicious of a bug in vlc when open....
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3978 [20:53:26] <mutante> neilthereildeil: that is just one process though?
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3980 [20:53:50] <Ede|Popede> neilthereildeil: python or not, you don't.
3981 [20:53:53] <ratrace> neilthereildeil: where do you see multiple?
3982 [20:54:08] <neilthereildeil> heres another line from the same lsof -i output: python 1279 neil 20u IPv4 2199706 0t0 TCP *:2042 (LISTEN)
3983 [20:54:16] <ratrace> you can have one process run accept() and dispatch to multiple worker threads/procs
3984 [20:54:26] <neilthereildeil> and another: python 1282 neil 20u IPv4 2199706 0t0 TCP *:2042 (LISTEN)
3985 [20:54:38] <neilthereildeil> but they all have different PIDs
3986 [20:55:32] <Ede|Popede> neilthereildeil: do you use ps's f switch?
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3988 [20:55:57] <ratrace> hrm... SO_REUSEPORT probably
3989 [20:56:18] <Ede|Popede> i don't think lsof can to anything related, but it's also what i use, since i just can't remember that other command xD
3990 [20:56:45] <ratrace> replaced-url
3991 [20:56:55] <neilthereildeil> no, i did not run ps
3992 [20:57:06] <neilthereildeil> i only ran "lsof -i"
3993 [20:57:15] <neilthereildeil> and thats some of the output that i shared
3994 [20:57:56] <ratrace> neilthereildeil: read the link above, they're probably using SO_REUSEPORT socket option and are all accept()'ing
3995 [21:01:19] <neilthereildeil> hmmm i dont see SO_REUSEPORT, but i do see sock.setsockopt(_socket.SOL_SOCKET, _socket.SO_REUSEADDR, reuse_addr)
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4028 [21:08:02] <DDDD> Hi, i'm currently running Manjaro with full disk encryption but i'm an old debian user. Today i discovered that luks full disk encryption seems to store keyfiles which can be used to decrypt the drives in /. Does debian work the same way? Otherwise a switch back to debian is in order.
4029 [21:08:38] <DDDD> Storing keyfiles for encryption in plaintext on the hdd seems very odd to me, but maybe this is how all luks setups work?
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4032 [21:09:36] <fourstepper> Hi, do I understand correctly that between zfs and btrfs on Debian, btrfs is the one supported, right?
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4034 [21:10:03] <sney> fourstepper: both are supported, but zfs is out-of-tree so there are extra steps to use it.
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4037 [21:10:55] <fourstepper> sney does out of tree mean having to go and mess with the kernel for the support of zfs to work?
4038 [21:11:18] <sney> DDDD: every luks setup I've seen requires a passphrase, without which the keyfiles are useless. I'm not sure of the exact layout but the bootloader does need to be able to unlock the disk, so *some* luks component needs to reside on an unencrypted partition
4039 [21:11:58] <sney> fourstepper: on modern debian, it's just a question of installing the zfs-dkms packages from contrib and letting your system build the drivers. it's pretty automatic. I've been using it for years.
4040 [21:12:16] <fourstepper> I see - that's pretty eas
4041 [21:12:18] <fourstepper> easy*
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4044 [21:12:56] <DDDD> Sney on manjaro i input my decryption key which is 25+ characters long at boot. Shouldnt this be enough? Why is there a need for a keyfile that can be used to decrypt the drives in / ? Yes i know / is in the ram and not the disk per say. But anyone with root access can just cat /key
4045 [21:13:00] <fourstepper> thank you for the answer :) I suspect running zfs on debian sid for a storage disks raid array would not be a good idea? (in the bounds of sid itself)
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4047 [21:13:43] <sney> fourstepper: sid isn't recommended for a system that you need to be reliable, like a fileserver.
4048 [21:13:54] <aminvakil> DDDD: where has your keyfiles been stored?
4049 [21:14:07] <sney> which is not to say it would automatically break, sid just needs more attention than stable.
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4051 [21:14:31] <DDDD> aminvakil: in /root/. Again this is no on debian but Manjaro. Reason i'm asking here is to make sure this is not the way it works in debian too before i switch.
4052 [21:14:53] <DDDD> not /root/ but in /
4053 [21:14:58] <mrkramps> afaik this is how luks handles key files in general
4054 [21:15:01] <DDDD> sorry for the mistype
4055 [21:15:16] <aminvakil> mrkramps: i don't think so
4056 [21:15:41] <DDDD> That would be very odd and a major security flaw imo.
4057 [21:15:51] <aminvakil> after typing password or providing the key with usb key or whatever other solution, the key resides in memory
4058 [21:15:52] <DDDD> Anyone with a rootkit could then just access your disk encryption keys
4059 [21:16:13] <fourstepper> i am mostly looking at sid from the desktop perspective, where I am fine with fixing things from time to time, as long as the RAID isn't brought down including data loss when upgrading to a newer version ofs id
4060 [21:16:28] <aminvakil> DDDD: exactly, i use arch btw
4061 [21:16:30] <aminvakil> :)
4062 [21:16:37] <sney> fourstepper: tbh that sounds like you should use testing
4063 [21:16:59] <aminvakil> and i can't find a key in my /root or /
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4065 [21:17:11] <DDDD> Sure / resides in memory too, but being able to sniff network stack buffers to get the password is one thing, having the knowlage to do cat is another :P
4066 [21:17:26] <aminvakil> ?
4067 [21:17:55] <aminvakil> DDDD: / resides in memory?
4068 [21:18:10] <fourstepper> I am generally pretty comfortable running Arch, Alpine or Fedora as my "production" workstations, and do the upgrades on the weekend - I hate to ask this for sure overasked question, but does Sid have a bigger breakeage potential than, let's say, Arch?
4069 [21:18:34] <freem> DDDD: I have a server on which I encrypted the disk, / included. There are 2 keys, there, one in my mind which is used to uncrypt /, and a second one to uncrypt the mountpoints, which is stored for convenience in /etc/crypttab
4070 [21:18:47] <DDDD> was supposed to be "it" :P
4071 [21:19:08] <aminvakil> DDDD: aha :)
4072 [21:19:59] <sney> fourstepper: it depends. sid isn't designed as a rolling distro. it's where packages are first uploaded by debian developers, the only assurance you have is that they compiled on the dev's computer. but the ultimate aim is stability and the packages are supposed to be high quality. so it really varies based on what debian is working on at the time
4073 [21:20:01] <mrkramps> fourstepper, one question, ten user, probably eleven different answers
4074 [21:20:06] <aminvakil> freem: i had a machine which i had the key of another luks partition on /etc/luks-keys and i've point to it by /etc/crypttab, but this is different
4075 [21:20:44] <DDDD> I think the reason manjaro/luks is storing the keys in / is because boot is encrypted. The password typed in at boot is used to decrypt /boot and then the keyfile is used to decrypt the rest of the disks, so you don't have to type the password several times.
4076 [21:20:54] <sney> fourstepper: right now, bullseye is <1 month away from the freeze, which puts sid in a state we call "slushy" - it'll be pretty usable for an experienced linux user.
4077 [21:20:58] <DDDD> But i'd rather have /boot/ unencrypted then this solution :P
4078 [21:21:26] <sney> !slushy
4079 [21:21:26] <dpkg> When a <testing> release becomes frozen, <unstable> tends to partially freeze as well. This is because developers are reluctant to upload radically new software to unstable, in case the frozen software in testing needs minor updates and to fix release critical bugs which keep testing from becoming <stable>.
4080 [21:21:40] <aminvakil> DDDD: then the key should be in /boot, not /
4081 [21:21:42] <fourstepper> thanks sney mrkramps - thanks for the explanation. I will probably go and test this on my own on a second disk for some time to see how (un)stable the unstable really is. I do consider myself as an experienced linux user
4082 [21:21:53] <freem> how can /boot be encrypted, anyway?
4083 [21:22:07] <mrkramps> fourstepper, that's actually the best answer :D
4084 [21:22:08] <freem> decrypted by UEFI?
4085 [21:22:36] <aminvakil> freem: replaced-url
4086 [21:22:40] <freem> because I doubt MSDOS's MBR is big enough for that kind of jokes, and I'd be surprised if GPT does it
4087 [21:22:54] <sney> fourstepper: np, and make sure to read the sid faq. replaced-url
4088 [21:23:04] <freem> ohhh.... ok, grub, say no more. Do they encrypt the /grub partition too? XD
4089 [21:23:36] <ratrace> sney: luks keyfiles are not like SSH, with passphrases, they ARE the passphrases
4090 [21:23:37] <fourstepper> sney thanks - wasn't aware that debian resides also elsewhere other than freenode - will go see what other communication channels exist
4091 [21:23:44] <fourstepper> have a good day
4092 [21:24:06] <sney> ratrace: ah, thanks for clarification'
4093 [21:24:11] <ratrace> DDDD: so whta's wrong with storing the keyfile on the _encrypted_ drive?
4094 [21:24:28] <aminvakil> ratrace: what's the necessity of doing so?
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4096 [21:24:33] <DDDD> Either way imo its very weird to store luks files in /. But i'm no way a pro so maybe i'm just stupid :P
4097 [21:24:36] <ratrace> sney: it's literally possible to echo -e "your password" > somefile and then use --key-file somefile
4098 [21:24:49] <freem> I think the problem for DDDD is that one can steal the secret if can get access to disk
4099 [21:24:53] <ratrace> aminvakil: mutliple drives unlocking
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4101 [21:25:03] <trui> the oftc ones are technically the official channels, fourstepper
4102 [21:25:18] <fourstepper> thanks :)
4103 [21:25:25] <ratrace> surely to unlock / you don't store keys on / that's pointless. but if you have additional mountpoints, then you can store their keys in encrypted /etc/
4104 [21:25:41] <aminvakil> yes, i have said that multiple lines before, i have done it too, but having the private key of the same partition on partition does not help
4105 [21:25:43] <trui> i need a new username since someone is using this one there, apparently.
4106 [21:25:51] <trui> alas
4107 [21:26:15] <trui> unless it's me and i forgot
4108 [21:26:19] <ratrace> aminvakil: it doesn't, is that the case with manjaro? or is it keeping / keys on (encrypted) /boot/ so you unlock once?
4109 [21:26:33] <ratrace> becuse with grub, if you use encrypted /boot/ you can't reuse the passphrase for / . you HAVE to type it twices
4110 [21:26:47] <DDDD> The key to my main drive where /root and /home resides is for some reason in /
4111 [21:26:51] <ratrace> *twice . So a common method is to encrypt / with a keyfile stored on encrypted /boot/ that you unlock with your typed password
4112 [21:26:57] <DDDD> Now if this was the key to a secondary drive i could live with that
4113 [21:27:26] <ratrace> DDDD: well then ask manjaro why they do that. there's nothing in luks per se that woul do or mandate this
4114 [21:27:29] <aminvakil> ratrace: yes, it seems that manjaro does this, DDDD was making sure this does not happen in debian
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4116 [21:28:05] <ratrace> I can't say for certain becuse I manually debootstrap encrypted debian installations, but I doubt the installer is that dumb
4117 [21:28:30] <ratrace> unless ..... it for some reason generates the passphrase randomly then stores on / for the uesr to make copy (and remove)
4118 [21:29:12] <mrkramps> hm, manybe "somebody" could just test it in a VM?
4119 [21:29:21] <DDDD> ratrace: Yeah i know i'm in the wrong channel mate and sorry to be bother you guys. But i didnt wanna reinstall to debian just to find out it works the exact same way.
4120 [21:29:30] <DDDD> I'll just install it in vm and try
4121 [21:29:35] <DDDD> yes exactly mrkramps :)
4122 [21:29:35] <sney> my laptop downstairs has luks as configured by the debian installer, I could go check
4123 [21:29:38] <mrkramps> :)
4124 [21:29:41] <ratrace> yeah I can't say for sure, I don't use the installer
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4126 [21:29:54] <ratrace> but it'd be dumb if it did _unless_ it generates a random passphrase
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4128 [21:30:11] <mrkramps> DDDD, and let us know
4129 [21:30:19] <freem> are there people usingthe installer around?
4130 [21:30:35] <DDDD> :P
4131 [21:30:38] <DDDD> i'm sadly one of them
4132 [21:31:00] <mrkramps> seriously, there's an installer to be ... used by someone
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4134 [21:31:14] <ratrace> DDDD: btw, where in / does it store it?
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4137 [21:32:42] <ratrace> I'm thinking another option. Basically everything in /boot/ is programmatically put there by grub, initramfs-update and the kernel package. a keyfile for / would NOT. so maybe thats'a master copy in /etc/ from which initramfs-tools scripts copy into /boot/ on each update.
4138 [21:32:43] <DDDD> in /
4139 [21:33:08] <DDDD> ./crypto_keyfile.bin
4140 [21:33:47] <ratrace> DDDD: is that file named somewhere in kernel command line?
4141 [21:33:56] <sney> nothing like that on this bullseye laptop. I also grepped for my passphrase in /etc and nothing there either
4142 [21:33:57] <TundraBear> Hello super users! How to recognize external audio card connected via firewire-thunderbolt adapter?
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4144 [21:34:10] <trui> i used the debian installer to install stable, but the plan was to only use it once :P
4145 [21:34:19] <freem> haha
4146 [21:34:19] <ratrace> sney: but do you have encrypted /boot/ ?
4147 [21:34:34] <ratrace> DDDD: and to confirm you have encrypted /boot/ ?
4148 [21:34:37] <DDDD> from the crypttab file luks-adac181b-c561-415d-8c23-569c5d791580 UUID=UUID /crypto_keyfile.bin luks
4149 [21:34:52] <trui> it's one of the attractions of debian vs ubuntu lts
4150 [21:35:10] <sney> ratrace: no, this is luks as configured by the debian installer, which uses a regular ext2 partition for /boot
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4152 [21:35:26] <ratrace> DDDD: I'm really thinking now that's the master copy used by scripts to inject into /boot/ and/or initramfs to unlock / from encrypted /boot/ that you unlock with your primary password
4153 [21:35:57] <ratrace> becuse, again /boot/ can be programmatically recreated at any moment. having a master in / to copy from, makes sense.
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4155 [21:36:04] <mrkramps> Fixing recursive fault but reboot is needed!
4156 [21:36:07] <mrkramps> i hate my pc
4157 [21:36:08] <sney> TundraBear: install alsa-utils, run 'aplay -l', if it shows in that list then pulse and any other audio applications should be able to use it out of the box. if not, you will need to figure out driver support.
4158 [21:36:11] *** Quits: mrkramps (~mrkramps@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Quit)
4159 [21:36:17] <ratrace> now the location is maybe dumb, I'd put it in /etc/somwhere, but hey...
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4161 [21:36:31] <sney> TundraBear: usb audio devices are *usually* plug and play, though. my focusrite solo needed 0 extra work
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4164 [21:37:02] <freem> recreating /boot at any moment seems quite ugly to me
4165 [21:37:13] <ratrace> quite the contrary
4166 [21:37:44] <DDDD> ratrace: check pm
4167 [21:37:46] <ratrace> the kernel is from a package, initramfs is autogenerated by triggers, grub config is autogenerated. there's nothing in /boot/ for uesr to fiddle with manually
4168 [21:37:59] <ratrace> DDDD: what's in it?
4169 [21:38:11] <ratrace> for *user to fiddle with
4170 [21:38:24] <freem> I disagree. Also, more than 1 distro/OS can use the boot partition, especially in UEFI's case
4171 [21:38:32] <DDDD> screenshot of the main drive.
4172 [21:38:34] <ratrace> that's not /boot/ partition but ESP
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4174 [21:38:47] <TundraBear> sney, thank you. Must i install some packages fro thunderbolt port?? My scheme is: audiocard->1394->thunderbolt->computer
4175 [21:38:48] <freem> true. But then, why have a /boot partition at all?
4176 [21:38:57] <ratrace> because grub
4177 [21:39:05] <ratrace> and in this case because FDE
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4181 [21:39:30] <freem> I don't see the point here? grub uses an own parition, yes, but of specific type because they always relied on an ugly hack of dos part system
4182 [21:39:34] *** Parts: ansimita (~ansimita@replaced-ip ) ()
4183 [21:39:42] <ratrace> freem: the context here is FDE with encrypted /boot/
4184 [21:39:59] <ratrace> not every installation is ESP/EFI, and grub + /boot/ predates it. so, autogenerating it makes seense
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4186 [21:40:25] <sney> TundraBear: to my knowledge, thunderbolt is basically external pci express. it shouldn't need extra drivers. maybe a new kernel if you have new hardware. but running peripherals through multiple adapters can have unpredictable results, also
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4188 [21:40:58] <freem> why not, I guess. I don't know what's fde anyway
4189 [21:41:08] <TundraBear> <sney> thank you MAN
4190 [21:41:09] <quadrathoch2> freem only like 2 months ago grub got luks2 encryption support. till then you can't encrypt /boot (with luks2)
4191 [21:41:18] <quadrathoch2> fde= full disk encryption
4192 [21:41:24] <freem> oh.
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4194 [21:42:00] <freem> I need to read more about it, from here it sounds like bad advertisement
4195 [21:42:18] <ratrace> because you're confusing /boot/ with ESP
4196 [21:42:26] <quadrathoch2> freem so sadly for debian, it's probably debian 12 (bookworm) where we finally get support for a fde (incl /boot)
4197 [21:42:29] <ratrace> there's nothing in /boot/ for user to fiddle with. ESP is different
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4200 [21:43:40] <freem> ratrace: not only. the simple idea of _full_ disk encrypted still being able to load grub does it
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4206 [21:46:38] <ratrace> freem: yes and the context here, into which you interjected, was that the keyfile is probably stored on / as a master to be copied into /boot/ since everything else in /boot/ can be regenerated programmatically.
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4208 [21:47:00] <ratrace> that's the only use case that would make sense to me, for /'s key to be stored on / itself (too).
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4231 [22:15:49] <Eryn_1983_FL> hi peeps
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4233 [22:16:06] <Eryn_1983_FL> what process do i cat to get batt power left?
4234 [22:16:11] <Eryn_1983_FL> /proc/ something?
4235 [22:17:23] *** Quits: Franciman (~francesco@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
4236 [22:17:36] <mrkramps> Eryn_1983_FL, /proc/acpi/battery/BAT0/something
4237 [22:17:49] <Eryn_1983_FL> ok
4238 [22:17:56] <Eryn_1983_FL> ty
4239 [22:18:40] <Eryn_1983_FL> nothing but button and wakeup
4240 [22:19:15] <mason> Eryn_1983_FL: install/run 'acpi' ? It's what I do
4241 [22:19:25] <ratrace> replaced-url
4242 [22:19:29] <Eryn_1983_FL> ok acpi
4243 [22:19:31] <Eryn_1983_FL> that worked
4244 [22:19:37] <Eryn_1983_FL> ty ty
4245 [22:19:39] <_0xbadc0de> is there a big differnce between debian 10 wine and debian 11 wine
4246 [22:19:47] <_0xbadc0de> coz I rememebr I was able to run this app befpre
4247 [22:20:34] <ratrace> ,v wine
4248 [22:20:35] <judd> Package: wine on amd64 -- jessie: 1.6.2-20; stretch: 1.8.7-2; stretch-backports: 4.0-2~bpo9+1; buster: 4.0-2; bullseye: 5.0-4; sid: 5.0-4
4249 [22:20:57] <ratrace> you can look up changelogs and release notes between 4.x and 5.x, on winehq.org
4250 [22:21:05] *** Quits: kn0rki (~Kn0rki@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
4251 [22:21:08] <mrkramps> _0xbadc0de, version 5 to 4 was quite a jump in development
4252 [22:21:12] <ratrace> meanwhile, you can always install latest from winehq's debian repos.
4253 [22:22:28] *** Quits: d1cor (~d1cor@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 272 seconds)
4254 [22:22:28] <mason> ratrace: How long has winehq been shipping a Debian repo? I don't remember that. Neat.
4255 [22:23:06] <mason> Oh, never mind. I am remembering this now.
4256 [22:23:30] <mason> the libfaudio0 note reminded me
4257 [22:24:16] <mrkramps> winhq repo goes back to wheezy
4258 [22:24:49] <mason> This same quality lets me reread books and enjoy them again and again, too.
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4261 [22:29:29] <DDDD> Confirmed no crappy plaintext file on debian. Thanks for all the help, i'll start reinstalling and changing to debian.
4262 [22:29:37] <trui> well, that's fun. i might have messed up an rsync, oops.
4263 [22:29:53] <trui> i should have made it a script already
4264 [22:30:10] <DDDD> Thank you ratrace aminvakil mrkramps for your assistance earlier.
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4268 [22:32:26] <trui> ah, we good. i accidentally copied it to a seperate folder inside my regular backup folder.
4269 [22:32:59] <trui> is it safe to interrupt rsync with ctrl+c or should i resign myself to a pointless full backup?
4270 [22:33:48] <n4dir> just mv /regular_folder/wrong_dir/* /regular_folder after it finished?
4271 [22:34:24] <n4dir> else i for one would ctrl+c . i guess.
4272 [22:34:25] <trui> yeah, that'd work. i might as well keep it as a seperate backup though.
4273 [22:34:34] <trui> i've got the space
4274 [22:34:54] <n4dir> just so you are not sad: I fubar rsync commands all the time. Ain't that hard. :-)
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4276 [22:35:20] <trui> yeah, lol. the difference between / and no / is important. ;)
4277 [22:35:36] <n4dir> exactly that. :-) And i doubt we both are the only ones.
4278 [22:35:49] <trui> i'm definitely making it a script though, since i think the mount name is always the same
4279 [22:36:41] <n4dir> adding a safety net if it isn't isn't probably that hard. as in "will mount x to y, does that sound corect. y or no"
4280 [22:37:00] <trui> true
4281 [22:37:05] <n4dir> so i would prefer to keep it simple. I guess.
4282 [22:37:21] <ratrace> mason: hah! I can re-watch movies like that. don't remember whta happend in most of them. only most impressive ones get remembered
4283 [22:37:33] <n4dir> damnit. i make so many typos. so is though. I will go back to silence. good luck
4284 [22:37:46] <trui> on the plus side, it's running less hot than it usually does during such a long backup. thanks to switching to openbox.
4285 [22:37:49] <trui> thanks
4286 [22:38:07] <bitsdude> exit
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4289 [22:40:20] <trui> i'm in that greyzone between being an inexperienced user and really knowing what i'm doing, which is why debian works well for me.
4290 [22:40:27] *** Joins: fb_ (~freebench@replaced-ip )
4291 [22:41:02] <mrkramps> trui, this is the greyzone most of us live in
4292 [22:41:51] <trui> true, but i'm on the more inexperienced end. i'm not scared by a terminal, but i like that i don't have to touch stuff for years if i don't want to.
4293 [22:42:43] <trui> every time i help a family member with windows, i'm glad i'm on debian. ;) it'd be too much work to get what they use working on debian, so i wouldn't recommend them to switch, but i'm glad it works for me.
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4295 [22:44:46] <trui> i tried fedora once, though now i'm regretting having to delete the lvm partition from debian. not sure how to do that safely. :P gparted recommends that i use lvm's tools.
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4299 [22:49:27] <mason> trui: Help family members with Debian and you'll feel better still.
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4303 [22:51:17] <trui> it's a bit selfish, mason, but with windows, i can blame any problems on windows 10. with debian, any problems would be blamed on me.
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4305 [22:51:38] <n4dir> lol.
4306 [22:51:53] <mason> heh
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4308 [22:52:21] <sney> family tech support is best kept to a minimum, for the sake of everyone's sanity
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4310 [22:52:27] <trui> and i'm really not looking forward to trying to get their essential programs working on wine.
4311 [22:52:32] <CommunistWolf> s/tech support//
4312 [22:52:53] <CommunistWolf> mrs CommunistWolf runs debian on her laptop, it's been fine
4313 [22:53:08] <n4dir> i also stopped helping others with Windows. If they think it is such a comfortable OS, they can do it themselves.
4314 [22:53:42] <trui> my mother uses a specific version of WordPerfect, a tax program, and a few other essential programs.
4315 [22:54:12] <trui> so it's essential that those work for her business.
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4317 [22:55:02] <trui> it might not be impossible, but remote tech support is easier when she's on windows.
4318 [22:56:17] <trui> 'reinstall/update this driver' or 'update windows' are usually the solutions. or sometimes, 'go back to an earlier version of windows'
4319 [22:57:06] <trui> if none of those work: 'it's windows 10.'
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4322 [22:57:45] <trui> or reload said drivers/whatnot
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4324 [22:58:22] <freem> ^happened regurlarly to me last time I had to handle windows, for network ones
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4327 [23:00:05] <trui> i mean, debian wouldn't be too bad. even when i've moved to europe, I could use when I visit her to do the big every two year update.
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4331 [23:04:52] <mutante> WordPerfect.. blast from the past. That was before "Word" was a thing :P
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4333 [23:05:44] <mutante> trui: solve it by doing actual remote support as in you take over her desktop
4334 [23:05:48] <mutante> from remote
4335 [23:06:06] <mutante> not "tell her on the phone what to try to click"
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4337 [23:08:38] <trui> skype works too, and eh, i guess. 'okay, so whitelist my ip and open this port--' eep
4338 [23:09:22] <trui> and yeah. the current version of wordperfect is too expensive, so she hasn't updated.
4339 [23:09:33] <trui> i think it's gone to a subscription model perhaps
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4341 [23:10:22] <trui> but this is getting into #debian-offtopic territory now
4342 [23:11:11] <trui> is it safe to just delete an unmounted lvm partition? despite what gparted says?
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4344 [23:11:34] <greycat> does it contain a file system? if so, mount it and see what's in it.
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4346 [23:12:02] <trui> i've got a parition which uses lvm which currently has fedora on it.
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4348 [23:12:09] <trui> since i tried it out once
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4350 [23:12:23] <trui> now i'm on my main debian partition and i'm considering deleting fedora.
4351 [23:12:25] <greycat> if you're never going to use it, then sure, you can delete it
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4354 [23:13:33] <trui> i guess the warning is that you can't delete one lvm subpartition (or whatever you call it) without affecting the entire lvm partition?
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4356 [23:14:07] <trui> which isn't an issue in my case, i don't think, since i want to delete/free the entire partition
4357 [23:14:16] <greycat> ... you're omitting too much information here.
4358 [23:14:25] <greycat> If the lvm partition *in use*?
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4360 [23:15:07] <trui> i'm not sure how to find that out. i don't think so
4361 [23:15:51] <greycat> but there's a "warning"?
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4363 [23:17:45] <trui> it says 'you are deleting non-empty lvm2 physical volume'. Deleting or overwriting the physical volume is irrecoverable and will destroy or damage the volume group'. which, i think is fine, because my debian install doesn't use lvm and it's on a seperate partition anyways.
4364 [23:18:23] <trui> and i want to delete the fedora lvm partitions.
4365 [23:18:42] <trui> i've just never done stuff with lvm before
4366 [23:19:28] <mutante> trui: If $have_backup then echo "yolo, only one way to find out" else "create backup"
4367 [23:19:42] <sney> trui: look at this diagram to understand which part of LVM you are looking at. replaced-url
4368 [23:19:46] <trui> true, and i do have backup.
4369 [23:20:20] <sney> typically when reusing parts of a disk handled by LVM, you only want to change logical volumes, not any of the higher level stuff.
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4373 [23:21:30] <jhutchins> trui: You can kill an rsync, and it will resume without repeating files.
4374 [23:22:10] <trui> hmm, even when i want to free the physical volume to later format as a non-lvm partition? sney
4375 [23:22:37] <trui> debian is on sda1, fedora lvm is on another physical volume
4376 [23:22:47] <trui> and good to know, jhutchins
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4378 [23:24:11] <trui> the plan is to delete it, then either use the free drive space to make a partition to try out sid, or just leave it there.
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4383 [23:27:22] <mason> Hrm, interesting. Just upgraded a Stretch box to Buster, and it panics on boot with only 128M of RAM.
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4385 [23:27:47] <trui> why are my paritions so messy? haha. there's also this 1 gb partition which i have no idea what it's being used for. not lvm.
4386 [23:28:54] <mason> 256M seems to work
4387 [23:29:10] <mutante> yea, i think that matches official minimum hardware requirements afair
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4389 [23:29:46] <mutante> yea, 256 if "with desktop"
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4391 [23:30:53] <mason> hrm - this is a text-only box. And the panic is before the kernel passes off to userland from what I can see, but checking that.
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4393 [23:31:48] <mutante> hmm. to be fair it also says "It is practically impossible to give general memory or disk space requirements for server installations as those very much depend on what the server is to be used for" on that page
4394 [23:31:52] <mason> Yeah, it's on loading the initramfs.
4395 [23:32:30] <mutante> interesting. well, something just crossed the threshold it seems
4396 [23:32:36] <mason> yep
4397 [23:33:01] <mason> It's not a show-stopper, just surprising. I was always happy I could squeeze down single-purpose server VMs that small.
4398 [23:33:19] <mason> But frankly, 256M is still small enough.
4399 [23:33:49] <mutante> mason: maybe there is no need to actually go 128->256 and we are just so used to it.. if a VM.. why not try 160 :)
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4401 [23:33:58] <mason> Hm, and sure enough, the old initrd was 18M, new is 25M.
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4403 [23:34:29] <mason> mutante: I'm too contained by my box to have thought of that. Giving it a try. :)
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4405 [23:35:26] <mason> Indeed, the extra 32M was enough.
4406 [23:35:58] <mrkramps> mason, already plan adding a little extra for bullseye
4407 [23:36:06] <mason> Hm, maybe I'll go to 192. 160 gets me five megs free, and the box will likely accumulate a bit as it goes.
4408 [23:36:14] <mutante> go crazy and give it an odd number, 171MB
4409 [23:36:18] <mason> haha
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4414 [23:38:25] * mason shakes his fist at buffer cache for obscuring the comparison.
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4416 [23:39:09] <mason> I'll let you guys bleed on Bullseye for a while before I start thinking about it.
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