64[00:52:33] <Grad106> where are new packages installed?
65[00:54:22] <bomb> everywhere! welcome to the Linux
66[00:55:55] <sney> !fhs
67[00:55:55] <dpkg> Debian follows the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard. The filesystem is categorized by purpose, not application. This allows, for example, the easy and efficient deployment of a read-only /usr area across a number of thin clients. See replaced-url
68[00:56:51] <Grad106> this is great. thank you. i heart IRC
134[02:05:27] <Enkidu_ak> Evening. I'm trying to install Buster on an Aspire One D250. I've written Buster boot.img.gz to my usb stick and added the Buster netinst.iso, bot for i386, but when I boot from the stick it halts after posting the SYSLINUX version string. I've seen this before with mismatched boot image and netinst, but in this case I'm certain that they match and have recreated the boot device more than once to be
137[02:07:39] <sney> Enkidu_ak: is there a reason you didn't write the netinst iso directly to the usb stick? the netinst iso has been a hybrid image since squeeze, it doesn't need anything extra to boot from usb
138[02:08:55] <sney> that acer seems to have the same specs as my eeepc which I can confirm supports the regular buster installer with no modifications
139[02:08:59] <Enkidu_ak> sney: Ignorance, mostly :D I wasn't aware. I'll try writting the iso directly
140[02:09:16] <sney> !ig
141[02:09:17] <dpkg> The Installation Guide for Debian 10 "Buster" can be found at replaced-url
142[02:10:13] <Enkidu_ak> I was following an installation guide specific for the Aspire One, I though tha tspecial considerations had been made for the older hardware. I'll refer to the general Buster guide and see how it goes.
143[02:10:30] <sney> let us know if you need anything else.
144[02:10:35] <Enkidu_ak> I will, and thank you
145[02:10:40] <sney> np
146[02:11:10] <sney> always helps to check the date on those older guides.
148[02:12:19] *** Quits: imMute (~immute@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
149[02:13:45] <annadane> (which is something i like about the wiki, that it does in fact specify "for stretch, follow these instructions; for jessie..."
150[02:13:56] <annadane> closing parenthesis i keep forgetting to add)
191[02:45:29] <scaredysquirrel> they last stopped on debian 7 or 8
192[02:46:20] <scaredysquirrel> ok debian 8 is the last one
193[02:47:15] <scaredysquirrel> ok i'll tell you i'm really running devuan and i just believe the debian instructions will work as all they change is the theme and the init systek
194[02:47:24] *** Quits: nf9c (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
209[03:08:53] <somiaj> scaredysquirrel: powerppc has an unoffical port, ports.debian.org
210[03:09:31] <somiaj> I can't say what ports devuan takes, I suggest just using debian, but I find systemd not terrible (and many things I actually like about it once I took tiem to learn it)
211[03:09:52] <sney> sounds like lennart shill talk to me
222[03:13:20] <somiaj> I wonder if learning from nothing, systemd can be shown to be harder/easier than sysvinit. I think it was the transition that got people, I dont' think systemd is harder to learn from scratch (I also don't think it is easier)
224[03:15:12] <sney> from a user perspective, not counting troubleshooting, it's barely different from any init system. use a utility to start/stop/query status of a given service, config files are predictably located, etc
229[03:16:21] <imMute> I think the transition is messing with alot of people. (I also think some people are clinging to things like "The UNIX Way" and "binary files are bad" too much.)
230[03:20:04] <sney> should really be past tense at this point. but yeah, a lot of UNIX traditionalism
271[04:00:19] <somiaj> "dpkg maintains some usable information about available packages. . The information is divided in three classes: states, selection states and flags."
284[04:02:18] <somiaj> "Display details about package-name, as found in /var/lib/dpkg/available. sers of APT-based frontends should use apt-cache show package-name instead."
285[04:02:28] <nvz> I was compiling a list of information about a system.. various commands that show the big picture
288[04:02:41] <nvz> I just don't know what this dpkg -p info really says
289[04:02:59] <nvz> sounds like its an archaic option
290[04:03:07] <nvz> no longer really applicable to anything
291[04:03:07] <somiaj> it says what is in /var/lib/dpkg/available, which is information dpkg has collected based on packages you have installed/removed
292[04:03:25] <somiaj> well it is dpkg keeping track of information of packages you have installed/removed, vs apt keeping track of packages aviaalble on internet sources
293[04:03:41] <nvz> hmm.. I wonder if it then only shows manually installed stuff
310[04:08:32] <somiaj> man page seems it might have something to do with deselect which some people still use, there is an --update-avail and a --merge-avail option
328[04:11:46] <dimitry008> Hello guys, something weird is really happening to me, I am trying to do a 'uniq -d' but I found it does not work with specifically some strings. replaced-url
329[04:11:52] <dimitry008> can you see that paste and reproduce please?
330[04:12:05] <swift110-phone__> Lol
331[04:12:52] <nvz> dimitry008: that only works on sorted lists
333[04:13:17] <nvz> dimitry008: if you want to do that without sorting the list i.e. with sort or sort -u, then use awk.. it can find duplicates in place
334[04:13:51] <dimitry008> nvz, my god, okay understood. Thank you very much!!!
335[04:13:52] <nvz> dimitry008: google it, use awk to find duplicates without sorting
336[04:14:07] <dimitry008> okay cool, I will, thanks :)
337[04:15:26] <nvz> often its fine to pass it through sort first, but if you want your list in the original order but without duplicates, you need something fancier than uniq
358[04:44:16] <somiaj> now if a premade vps has configured this for you, I'm unsure, I'm just going off the wiki. YOu could check the config to get the answer
399[05:51:56] <somiaj> metbsd: you can use rfkill to check if there are any soft/hard blocks? Also what do you mean can't enable it? Are you using network manager? If so check /etc/network/interfaces, if your wifi card is there, networkmanager will ignore it. In that case remove your wifi card from that file and restart networkmanager.
403[05:54:47] <Gerowen> If I run the Debian installer in "BIOS" mode instead of UEFI, will the OS still support booting in UEFI mode post install, or only in BIOS mode?
404[05:54:47] <Gerowen> Reason I ask is that the 10.4 ISO only seems to want to boot in BIOS mode on this PC.
408[05:58:23] <M_aD> somiaj: the question is if he's actually running Debian since he's been active in the Fedora channel too. It makes me wonder. Maybe he has one of them installed in a vm
409[05:59:03] <M_aD> or is running windows and installs linux distro's in vm's
427[06:15:27] <somiaj> Gerowen: the installer will only configure your system to boot using the method it was booted, so if you use bios, it makes an mbr partition table and configures legacy boot
428[06:16:13] <somiaj> Gerowen: How did you write the .iso to your usb/cd drive? The isntaller should support both modes, but sometimes you have to select the right one when you have both legacy and ufi enabled. You sure your firmware isn't in some legacy only mode?
429[06:18:04] *** Quits: donofrio (~donofrio@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
430[06:18:06] <Gerowen> Nah I set it to UEFI only and the USB drive didn't show up.
431[06:18:21] <Gerowen> I tried both "Etcher", and just doing cp file.iso /dev/sdb
432[06:19:34] <Gerowen> I just had a thought, both machines have optical drives, I may try burning the image to an actual CD-ROM.
442[06:26:02] <somiaj> oh that one does default to amd64 now, it use to default to a 32bit/64bit combo.
443[06:26:21] <Gerowen> I did notice that when I open the image with the archive manager there are a lot of files that aren't on the end result. Etcher seems to have only included the EFI folder and nothing else.
444[06:26:24] <somiaj> It sounds like there is some issue with your firmware if it won't boot efi mode.
445[06:26:38] <somiaj> !hybrid iso
446[06:26:39] <dpkg> Since the 6.0 "Squeeze" release, Debian installation images for x86 systems - e.g. <netinst>, <CD1>, DVD1 - are hybrid images. These can be written directly to CD or HD Media (e.g. USB thumbdrive) without further preparation. See replaced-url
447[06:26:52] <Gerowen> I've done it before on this PC, but in the past it's picky, certain USB ports won't do UEFI boot.
448[06:27:03] <Gerowen> So I'm gonna try an actual CD and see how it goes.
449[06:27:20] <somiaj> You need to be really careful with thos .iso images, they have some fancy hybrid boot options to allow both usb/cdrom and legacy/uefi boot.
451[06:27:49] <somiaj> If you need non-free firmware, you could give the firmware image a try
452[06:27:52] <somiaj> !firmware images
453[06:27:52] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from replaced-url
454[06:28:15] <somiaj> Anywas, the cp method should work. Don't touch the image/open it up, etc, they can be a bit finky due to their hybrid nature.
455[06:28:44] <somiaj> I don't mess with them, I do recall fdisk use to complain about their partition table.
456[06:31:44] *** Quits: xtifr (~user@replaced-ip) (Quit: rcirc on GNU Emacs 26.1)
457[06:32:23] <Gerowen> Figured it out. Apparently in the MSI BIOS for this motherboard, you have to not only enable UEFI boot, but go in and enable the UEFI boot options for devices like your CD drive before those options will appear in the boot menu.
458[06:33:01] <Gerowen> So turn on UEFI boot as a whole, then go into the BBS priorities for your CD or USB drive and enable the UEFI menu option.
460[06:35:13] <somiaj> might be some secure issue, to control where it can get efi partitions from
461[06:36:22] <somiaj> or some developer was being nifty, but it does give you the ability to ensure someone with physical access cannot just hit a key and boot from an extrenal drive.
462[06:36:52] *** njka_ is now known as njkanjka
463[06:37:05] *** Quits: black_ant (~antilope@replaced-ip) (Quit: simplicity does not kill)
582[09:29:55] <benaiah> i'm trying to install debian using the Bullseye netinst image, and all was working well until i tried to specify a network mirror. i ended up hitting an error which led me to the other virtual terminal where an error was found saying "WARNING **: mirror does not support the specified release (bullseye)". This doesn't seem right, because i installed the exact same way just a week or so ago. I'm seeing this
583[09:29:57] <benaiah> behavior with both deb.debian.org and ftp.us.debian.org mirrors. any ideas?
584[09:30:57] *** Quits: tuxmania (~tuxmania@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
595[09:34:57] <ksk> also, we only support stable in here btw ;)
596[09:34:59] <ksk> !debian-nex
597[09:35:00] <ksk> !debian-next
598[09:35:07] <benaiah> oh, my bad
599[09:35:10] <ksk> !debian-next
600[09:35:10] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also replaced-url
601[09:35:36] <ksk> no hard feelings, should you have any more specific testing question I would encourage you to join oftc/#debian-next
602[09:36:10] <benaiah> sure, i'll direct questions there next time. thanks!
629[10:03:17] <afidegnum> i have a binary application, how do i add it to the systemd where i can service start/stop it ? is there any article which details the procedure ?
916[13:51:54] <oxek> nobyk: it worked, everything is responsive again, thanks!
917[13:52:05] *** Quits: banox (~banox@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
918[13:52:27] <sjmulder> I get a bit worried about cruft building op over time in Debian. On BSD one can purge /usr/local, diff /etc and be done. Do people generally reinstall every so often?
921[13:53:25] <sjmulder> I used 'apt mark showmanual' but there's a lot of non manual stuff in there so I'm hesitant to remove things
922[13:53:48] <shtrb> sjmulder, if you are using normal sane packages that doens't leave clutter (snap, docker and libvirt I'm looking at you ! ) you should be safe
952[14:02:37] <oxek> nobyk: well I figued I should have some swap in case something runs out of control, and read swap should be as big as RAM, and did not want to hammer my SSD with swap writes.
953[14:02:48] <oxek> I did not realize linux was so eager to make use of swap
954[14:02:56] <oxek> yeah DDR4
955[14:03:04] <oxek> ECC as well
956[14:03:31] <shtrb> You are going to tell us you also have xeon ?
957[14:03:33] <nobyk> pff very nice man
958[14:03:50] <oxek> shtrb: the cheapest xeon there was, yeah
959[14:04:28] <oxek> Xeon E-2224
960[14:04:33] *** Quits: Lirion (~kesselink@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
961[14:04:35] <shtrb> just bloody WOW ! nice sound rig , next you are going to tell us , that this xeon 64GB , 2 tera SSD is a laptop
962[14:04:44] <shtrb> *nice sounding rig
963[14:05:00] <oxek> nah, the rugged laptop with two 4TB SSDs is a different machine
965[14:05:47] <elios> just means that you ran ot of ram
966[14:06:37] <oxek> yes, I ran out of RAM, and was expecting that due to what I was running. However I was expecting stuff to go back to normal after the job is done and all RAM is free again.
967[14:07:15] <oxek> whereas instead linux kept keeping stuff in swap so switching between apps and doing stuff kept being very unresponsive
969[14:07:42] <oxek> because it only loaded stuff back from swap piece by piece, instead of predictively loading everything that an app was using before
970[14:07:58] <oxek> so I want to load all the contents of swap back into RAM, and the swapoff swapon worked
971[14:09:01] <oxek> I'll play with the swappiness value a bit to see what suits me best instead of the default 60
977[14:10:31] <simplicius> how can I take a screenshot when in fullscreen mode?
978[14:11:49] <greycat> you could bind a key combo to run "scrot" (or whatever you prefer) at the window manager level. Or ssh in, manually set DISPLAY to whatever your desktop is using, and run "scrot" that way. Or switch to a console, manually set DISPLAY, and run something like "sleep 5; scrot" and then switch back.
979[14:13:23] *** Quits: gelignite (~gelignite@replaced-ip) (Quit: Stay safe! Stay at home! Stop the chain reaction!)
981[14:14:11] <simplicius> If I do just "sleep 5; scrot" shouldn't work?
982[14:14:14] <greycat> it's also possible that you are currently using some sort of Desktop Environment which has already done the "bind key combo" thing for you, and you just need to work out what that combo is. Possibly PrintScreen by itself, or Shift-PrintScreen....
983[14:14:56] <sjmulder> Nice oxek, bet you can run Slack and Teams at the same time on that machine
985[14:17:16] <oxek> sjmulder: electron apps are still a pain despite that
986[14:18:27] <sjmulder> There should be some way to share JavaScript VM resources between different Electron apps. Maybe even host them in the same app! With tabs.
987[14:18:29] <oxek> I imagine apps would once again be performant if devs were forced to work on machines using 2GB/4GB RAM.
988[14:19:16] <oxek> 64bit CPUs was a mistake :)
989[14:19:21] <oxek> (yeah I know there's PAE)
990[14:19:31] <sjmulder> 640k ought to be enough
991[14:20:10] <oxek> would be enough if devs knew how to work with it. I remember how small PalmOS apps were and yet they could do the exact same things my phone does now.
992[14:20:36] <oxek> actually I think it even predates PalmOS, I had some Pilot device
995[14:21:29] <oxek> a calendar app would be 4KB memory
996[14:21:35] <oxek> good times
997[14:21:41] <sjmulder> I installed Windows 2000, VS 6, Office etc on a PIII 800 MHz to see if it was a case of rose tinted glasses but it was snappy as hell
1001[14:22:44] <brutser> when partitioning from debian installer i can change Typical usage: from standard to largefile/largefile4 - this can save disk space because of using less inodes, but does this affect performance in any way?
1002[14:23:09] <brutser> i don't mind the disk space but i have a dedicated partition for the kvmpool and it's containing only files of 1GB or more
1018[14:35:07] <brutser> would it be a better choice here to switch to largefile or largefile4 ?
1019[14:35:28] <ksk> mhhm, to be honest I only see any real usage for changing this if you have many small files, meaning "the normal amount of inodes does not work out for me"
1020[14:36:13] <brutser> ksk: ok yes that makes sense, so for bigger files, the standard setting is just as good?
1021[14:36:14] <ksk> largefile is 1 inode per 1M, largefile4 is one inode per 4M as far as I know
1022[14:36:37] <ksk> I would say so, the fact that there actually is largefile and largefile4 indicate otherwise though..
1023[14:36:39] <brutser> ksk: yes i read just about that, that's correct
1024[14:37:35] <brutser> ksk: yes, i was checking the options and then thought about what i would be storing in the kvmpool and it would fit exact the largefile criteria
1025[14:37:46] <brutser> so then i wondered, perhaps worth to read a little about it
1026[14:37:53] <ksk> maybe take a look here, first answer: replaced-url
1027[14:38:08] <ksk> sounds reasonable to me. tl;dr: Its a thing of the past, do not bother.
1038[14:51:07] <oxek> If I want `sysctl -w vm.swappiness=10` to persist across reboots, is my only option manually editing /etc/sysctl.conf? I would have thought there would be a command for that instead.
1039[14:51:41] <ksk> nope. Additonally chances are high you actually do not want to change swapiness at all :P
1090[15:34:28] <ksk> Not necessarily, as far as I know you cannot really perform the installer-tasks realiable - but by most pratical means "apt" will do, yes.
1091[15:34:30] <greycat> either install the packages you want with apt/apt-get/aptitude, or use tasksel if you want that "clicking a box in a severely limited menu" feeling
1092[15:34:42] <BadPractice> annadane, because i have no idea what exactly the installer did. For example after doing that that way my lock screen does not work propperly. It seems as this as not a good way to reproduce a propper installation
1095[15:35:12] <BadPractice> more like getting something close that you can get with a lot of manual labor nearly as good as a fresh installed from the installer
1096[15:35:23] <dutchfish> hi, i have a small question about latest Debian stable. I had a machine breakdown. The disk is ok. But somehow it wont boot in a simular machine. Any hints what to look for? It stops at the boot process, right after the boot manager.
1098[15:36:43] <cybercrypto> dutchfish: any particular messages and logs, where exactly the boot proccess stops? please consider pastebin the info
1099[15:36:45] <jmcnaught> What is reinstalling a metapackage going to do?
1100[15:37:18] *** Quits: hufdufhv (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1101[15:37:18] <BadPractice> xormor, that would reinstall my not propperly set up xfce4 i really dont think thats the equivalent of selecting it in the installer
1103[15:37:57] <dutchfish> cybercrypto, i would if i could. No messages, it stops either before or just after the kernel starts booting. I am on lvm/ext4 x86_64 latest stable kernel.
1105[15:38:06] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: as gréycat told you, run tasksel
1106[15:38:28] <cybercrypto> cybercrypto: when you remove a disk from one machine and install in another machine, you may want to re-install (re-config) boot manager/grub.
1107[15:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1309
1108[15:39:03] <dutchfish> cybercrypto, ah ok, that might be it. Any hints how to do that / link?
1109[15:39:05] <annadane> a malfunctioning lock screen quite possibly has nothing to do with the installer; you could narrow down why it's malfunctioning, or make sure otherwise that you copied the image correctly in the first place
1114[15:40:24] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: all that tasksel does is install and remove task packages, which are metapackages that depend on the packages required to install desktop environments.
1115[15:40:40] <cybercrypto> dutchfish: boot your new machine using a live-image and re-mount your system (using chroot) so you have the chance to edit config files and fix grub to match new hardware.
1134[15:51:17] <BadPractice> hi, i installed xfce4 now using tasksel but i dont think that did the same thing that happens at a debian installation. I still get a black screen when i lock my system (using ctrl + alt + L or the command xlock4). Also despite me deselecting GNOME in tasksel, i still can start a gnome desktop
1135[15:52:00] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: how did you try to start a GNOME session?
1136[15:52:36] <BadPractice> jmcnaught, at the loginscreen (i assume its slim now) i still can choose to do a gnome session
1137[15:52:55] <miskatonic> slim is deprecated
1138[15:53:25] <BadPractice> i dont know what it is using. Its the login screen that comes with xfce4 on gnome
1147[15:56:48] <miskatonic> in aptitude, automatically installed once are marked with an A
1148[15:57:18] <miskatonic> ones, not once
1149[15:57:34] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: in my experience tasksel is better at installing than removing. You could check to see if the task-gnome-desktop package is still installed "apt policy task-gnome-desktop" and then look at (but don't accept) what "apt-get autoremove" wants to do, and put it in a paste for others to see.
1154[15:59:24] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: right, "apt -s autoremove" is better because it won't remove anything yet. You want to make sure it doesn't want to remove anything that you want to keep.
1158[16:03:13] <BadPractice> jmcnaught, thanks but it dows not want to remove anyting. I think parts of gnome are still needed as dependency for a "apt install" i executed (for example apt install gnome-tweaks or something). Could that be?
1159[16:03:40] <cybercrypto> dutchfish: I am glady to hear, enjoy it.
1160[16:03:44] <miskatonic> and whatever you want to keep should be marked as manually installed
1161[16:04:35] <cybercrypto> dutchfish: what version you running on that machine?
1162[16:05:03] <dutchfish> cybercrypto, you mean what version of grub-efi?
1167[16:06:22] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: aptitude has a "why" command you can use on packages to ask why it's installed. It only tells you the first reason it can find, but it might be helpful. Try running "aptitude why <package>" on some of those packages in your paste.
1184[16:11:08] <dutchfish> cybercrypto, what happened is this. The efi part is recreated along the link in the bios. So the old bios link is no longer valid
1185[16:11:43] <dutchfish> cybercrypto, but nothing i couldnt solve
1186[16:11:48] <jmcnaught> BadPractice: i means installed, A means installed automatically (as a dependency of another package), p means purged (not installed)
1212[16:24:46] <BadPractice> jmcnaught, i did not install that stuff. There are 2 options: first the NSA hacked me, 2nd the installer was sloppy setting them as installed, not as dependency
1244[16:39:17] <greycat> 0 0 * * 0 only runs one time per week
1245[16:41:19] <tcurdt> greycat: thanks for the "journalctl -u cron" that helped ... I think I can take it from here :) thanks!
1246[16:41:55] <jozefk> Could somebody please check the content, or to paste the content of /etc/fonts/conf.d/ ? I think I messed up something there. Would like to compare and see. This is what I got there now: replaced-url
1256[16:45:36] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also replaced-url
1257[16:45:38] <miskatonic> oops testing ... then not everything is supposed to work already
1264[16:47:45] <greycat> A standard full MTA, with the SMTP listener service turned off, is such a tiny thing compared to the power of modern hardware.
1265[16:48:23] <tcurdt> qmail? exim? postfix?
1266[16:48:25] <ksk> tcurdt: for example: "dpkg-reconfigure exim4-config" offers some "only sent mail, do nothing else" option which fullfilled that role for me. Granted, I am somewhat familiar with exim4.
1267[16:48:33] <miskatonic> if /etc/fonts/conf.d is already present, this is the place where the hard work for font permissions is done. study the files in that directory to figure whether or not terminus is already considered
1268[16:48:36] <greycat> I use qmail, but I don't normally advise it for new people.
1269[16:49:14] <greycat> As ksk says, exim4 is the standard in Debian, is very well supported and understood by the community, and setting it up for local delivery only is easy.
1270[16:49:37] <tcurdt> exim I am also quite familiar with
1276[16:51:10] <jozefk> miskatonic, I see lots of links there but I am not that good about the meaning of those and I think I removed some, actually what I did first was that I made a backup. But later those backup files disappeared from there so I don't have them anymore. Anyway, I posted the question in #debian-next
1278[16:52:42] <miskatonic> even a stable fontconfig is a pain in the rear
1279[16:52:46] *** Quits: cstls (~cstls@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1280[16:52:58] <tcurdt> ksk: is there a way to select that config option just by installing a package? trying to avoid an interactive config
1281[16:53:07] <Bushmaster> Hi Folks, I have installed OpenJDK 14 (Java Development Kit) in my Debian Stretch 9.12 but when I type java -version it shows openjdk version "1.8.0_252" How can I configure my latest installation of JDK14?
1283[16:53:26] <ratrace> tcurdt: with dma or something similar, you can even send an email to yourself using your own provider and your own submission credentials, so technically (with some exceptions) you don't really need a full MTA
1284[16:54:12] <tcurdt> ratrace: that's what I had in mind when I asked for the "lightweight" package
1285[16:54:25] <tcurdt> "dma"? I'll have a look, thanks
1286[16:54:58] <ksk> tcurdt: eh, you were asking about "how to get the xfce task applied to a running debian"? I think the grey cat offered something useful.
1287[16:55:04] <ratrace> tcurdt: dma is as simple as they get, and it's maintained. ssmtp is abandonware
1297[16:58:47] <ksk> as I tried to explain before, to my best knowlede; the tasks used in the installer are not part of the installed debian system, so its not easy to use them. How about just installing "xfce4"-package? :)
1301[16:59:21] <ksk> (and to some extend, most advanced users tend to not use the tasks at all, and rather prefer packages to be installed by themselved)
1308[17:02:31] <oxek> anyone have a link to a working guide on making shared folders work in a windows7 guest when using qemu/kvm/libvirt/virt-manager?
1309[17:02:32] <EdePopede> 01.m3u: M3U playlist, UTF-8 Unicode text
1320[17:06:24] <EdePopede> and then mc has with Open, View, Edit (three!!!) 3 different actions per filetype. xdg seems to know only about a single one. which then even breaks far too often.
1322[17:08:38] <EdePopede> somiaj: it xdg-open calls exo-open on xfce. i had the same issue already with empty files and short TS segments which don't have a real magic number. all of this using mc's default action handlers as frontend.
1323[17:08:58] <EdePopede> only i thought the xfce thing would call the xdg thing
1329[17:12:36] <Psil0Cybin> Hey all quick question I am trying to install Debian on my old laptop Dell Inspiron 1525, i can get passed all the install menus but once it starts installing the system it fails
1330[17:12:56] <Psil0Cybin> after partioning? How can I find out exactlky why this is happening? I am trying to boot up in live cd mode, but it seems like i never saw anything like this before
1331[17:13:25] <Psil0Cybin> it partitions my disks, goes to install the software, and than stops and says installtion not completeed, allows me to hit continue and than asks if i want ot install over something already installed
1338[17:18:03] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: is it Ok for you to get logs? Perhaps can you try 'text installation' instead of default graphical install? You need to check what logs are saying, so you may be able to unsderstand where to look/troubleshoot
1339[17:19:50] <Psil0Cybin> very smart cybercrypto !!
1340[17:19:59] <Psil0Cybin> I was using just graphical install as per usual experience, let me try your advice
1342[17:20:31] <somiaj> EdePopede: looks like it is file --mime-type to get the mime type of the file.
1343[17:20:55] <greycat> aren't mime types just decided by the "extension"?
1344[17:20:57] <somiaj> EdePopede: though that is strange that xdg-open hands off the call, is this even if you run it in a terminal? Or using the file manager?
1345[17:20:58] <Psil0Cybin> but justr to note also i tried to booting debian in live mode, and it started working like i saw the bars starting to develop (in the XFCE4) gui or what ever default GUI was but than it stopped and i got a blank screen..hmm
1346[17:21:19] <somiaj> greycat: I think that is only part of it.
1350[17:21:58] <EdePopede> somiaj: yep, text/plain. so exo-open relies on file this time? that's all weird.
1351[17:22:08] *** Quits: tijara (~tijara@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1352[17:22:14] <EdePopede> somiaj: always terminal here
1353[17:22:48] <somiaj> greycat: I took a .pdf file and copied it to .txt and file still sees application/pdf as the mime type, it uses more than the extension. I think it looks at the file headers a bit
1354[17:22:52] <Psil0Cybin> cybercrypto, stupidest question to ask right now, but couldk it be because the machien is 32bit vs 64bit, or it would obviously have given me an error right away
1355[17:22:58] <Psil0Cybin> before i even go through partition, creating user name, etc etc
1361[17:23:26] <greycat> somiaj: then I would imagine file(1) is giving you a totally different (and therefore wrong/irrelevant) answer than whatever program is actually being invoked
1363[17:23:41] <EdePopede> not sure if text/plain is correct at all, though it *is* plain text
1364[17:23:52] <EdePopede> but that's also true for xbm and xpm
1365[17:25:11] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: kernel will not load in that case. is your HW 32?
1366[17:25:11] <EdePopede> usually i just press Enter on the file in mc so it checks its handler script (/etc/mc/mc.ext) and fires up the appropriate action
1367[17:25:30] <EdePopede> which usually is xdg for a lot of filetypes these days
1369[17:26:11] <Psil0Cybin> cybercrypto, like right now when i try to run live cd, it shows me a bunch of time out messages, I wish i could copy and paste it but too complex to type out quickly than it shows me the Debian logo
1370[17:26:21] <somiaj> seems file managers do a combination of look at extension, try to guess based on contents
1371[17:26:26] <Psil0Cybin> so I can see something is happening hitting insert gives me the OK for everyhthing atm
1372[17:26:29] <Psil0Cybin> for live CD
1373[17:26:32] <greycat> xdg-open(1) refers to replaced-url
1374[17:26:33] <EdePopede> file had a textfile in the past, seems to be gone now. a problem was that some things couldn't be expressed with its syntax.
1377[17:27:28] <EdePopede> what i don't get here specifically is that xdg-mime this time sees that it's media but xdg-open ignores everything and calls exo-open
1379[17:28:14] <Psil0Cybin> cybercrypto, than it goes through the list, saying [OK] for everything so seems like live CD has no errrors, than I am stuck with just a black screen
1380[17:28:14] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: If I am not mistaken, you can change to tty4 or 6 to check messages. you can also login as root in another tty and loog those messages mannually.
1383[17:29:02] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: before you continue, your hardware is 32bit and you have a 32bit live-image, if thats true, you are good to go.
1384[17:29:44] <Psil0Cybin> no im using 64 bit, let me burn a 32 bit version. I had high hopes anyway because typically if i installed or inserted a 64 bit on a 32 bit machine it gave me some kind of warning
1385[17:29:45] <EdePopede> with those short TS files it was the other way round. file said it is video, but *sometimes* they start Office because xdg thinks it is some message catalog.
1386[17:30:01] <Psil0Cybin> this didnt give me any kind of notice just black screens after processes.
1389[17:31:24] <EdePopede> so /usr/bin/xdg-* all are shell scripts.
1390[17:31:56] <greycat> a few clicks later, replaced-url
1391[17:32:03] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: if your HW is 64, go for it. do not burn a 32bit media.
1392[17:32:04] <greycat> good freaking luck figuring this out
1393[17:32:45] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: check also /var/log/installer
1394[17:32:51] <greycat> all I can suggest is that whatever MIME type xdg* comes up with will NOT necessarily match the MIME type suggested by file(1) or other non-xdg* tools
1395[17:33:24] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: and use the text installation mode, preferably (just in case)
1396[17:33:24] *** Parts: hop (~hop@replaced-ip) ()
1398[17:36:18] <Psil0Cybin> okay thank you cybercrypto will attempt what you suggest :) and provide results.
1399[17:36:29] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: there is a hardware-summary file in there, check it and see what is detected and what not from the generic kernel.
1400[17:36:34] <EdePopede> greycat: for some reason Mousepad *was* set in xfce4-mime-settings. can't even remember to have changed it. maybe the file db is just outdated so it doesn't know about these HLS mediatypes.
1401[17:37:17] <EdePopede> at lest its detection seems to be better, i ran it once over some directories with TS files, it never failed. unlike xdg-mime :/
1402[17:37:32] <Psil0Cybin> thanks i will do this, Its just such an old laptop Dell Inspiron 1525 and i have this project i want to basically use it as a node to automate or get into automation with ansible.
1407[17:39:08] <Psil0Cybin> yea thank you because yes partition went fine! I got to the second after basically entering my root/making user account than it goes to installing system and after 45 minutes of installing it fails.
1408[17:39:31] <Psil0Cybin> righht now the 64 bit iso dvd in live mode keeps flickering the bars for xfce4 on top and bottom so yea something is off..
1409[17:39:41] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: it is fine to work with old ones, debian supports the majority of them.
1410[17:39:52] <Psil0Cybin> i am going to try the 32 bit version without graphic install so i can really ifgure out whats going on
1411[17:39:56] <Psil0Cybin> lkike you suggested my smart friend :D
1412[17:41:13] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: enjoy it.
1413[17:41:26] <Psil0Cybin> also last question, replaced-url
1414[17:41:27] <Psil0Cybin> for these files.
1415[17:41:39] <Psil0Cybin> I used to be able to find it but it became more hidden lol
1421[17:44:28] <cybercrypto> Psil0Cybin: hehehe they are not hide, believe me.
1422[17:44:47] <tharkun> Good $DAY since the schools are closed I had to "donate" my laptops to homeschooling. That is not the actual problem. The user "10 year old" is using youtube when he is not supposed to. Is there a "GUI" to disallow this type of rouge behaviour. So far I am using a cronjob with iptables but a more user (wife) friendly solution would be appreciated. Any suggestions?
1442[17:55:25] *** Quits: edman007 (~edman007@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1443[17:56:29] <tharkun> Or a simple worried full time dad.
1444[17:57:16] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: conta)
1445[17:59:19] *** Quits: b1ackandwh1te (~iazer@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1446[18:01:00] <cybercrypto> tharkun: using nftables to control access to youtube may work... but will never be efficient nor easy for 'wife-friendly' as you say.
1448[18:01:53] <cybercrypto> tharkun: few home routers offer 'web filters' that you can define URL to allow or block (works like proxy). Please check in networking channel for more detailed information.
1449[18:03:39] <tharkun> cybercrypto: Thanks for your time I will bug them a little.
1478[18:14:49] <cmptr> I just don't know what package I need to enable this feature. On my old laptop I had the trackpad gestures working, but I do not recall how I achieved that.
1513[18:34:50] <cybercrypto> cmptr: It is ok to try the wiki page i suggest you, even that you are running testing version. You may want to check with the testing channel for support if you will.
1514[18:35:08] <cmptr> cybercrypto: SynPS/2 Synaptics Touchpad. I didn't think it was Synatpics because on Windows it uses Precision Touchpad.
1520[18:36:03] <dragon2> how is Debian doing at the moment, it's been a couple of years since I used linux
1521[18:36:12] <cybercrypto> cmptr: I understand. but in any case i believe you may want to try the sinaptic package and config.
1522[18:36:17] <mesaboogie> rock solid dragon2
1523[18:36:26] <annadane> chugging along as usual
1524[18:36:55] <dragon2> good to hear mesaboogie
1525[18:37:11] <annadane> you're trying to get trackpad working on debian bullseye?
1526[18:37:13] <annadane> !debian-next
1527[18:37:13] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net. See also replaced-url
1528[18:37:17] <annadane> try asking there i guess
1529[18:37:20] <cybercrypto> cmptr: check the wiki and review it. After that, head to testing channell and ask about that for the folks there.
1530[18:38:01] <cmptr> I'm checking the wiki now. I know there is some kde pacakge that I am missing, so I will check that next. THank you for the help cybercrypto
1551[18:56:19] <BadPractice> hi. can you tell me if a xfce installation with tasksel might not be done correctly on a debian system or if xfce is just mighty buggy even after a correct install?^^
1552[18:56:34] <RetroRudie> when i setup ufw with "default allow outgoing" and "default reject incoming" do i need a rule to cover localhost connections?
1553[18:56:54] <greycat> BadPractice: most people who have an issue with a desktop environment just need to install non-free firmware for their video chipset
1559[18:59:47] <r3> greycat: about non-free, I've recently run into that issue, and saw something about putting the .deb into /firmware on the install media - is the the correct way to go about it?
1561[19:00:08] <greycat> If you can boot and get on the internet, just do that, and install the firmware packages with apt-get.
1562[19:00:27] <greycat> All of that mucking around during installation is only necessary if you MUST have the firmware to get a working network.
1563[19:00:41] <r3> aye, that's what I ended up doing, but it would have been nice to be able to use the graphical installer ;)
1564[19:00:50] <greycat> !firmware images
1565[19:00:50] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from replaced-url
1566[19:00:51] <nobyk> RetroRudie: I would think so but tbh I don't know
1567[19:01:05] <RetroRudie> yeah :)
1568[19:01:46] <BadPractice> greycat, i dont think thats my issue. For examle when i start xlock (locking screen) it just goes to blackness. For what i have seen so far thats caused by the missing screensaver utillity in the stable repository
1569[19:02:19] <greycat> You have an "xlock"?!? From where?
1570[19:02:27] <greycat> xlockmore hasn't been in Debian in years!
1582[19:06:24] <imMute> RetroRudie: I think you need to explicitly allow lo. I don't think the filters have any special casing for loopback, since maybe you really do want to do something tricky with filtering it.
1585[19:06:44] <RetroRudie> i am experimenting with rules for localhost without success so far
1586[19:07:47] <imMute> RetroRudie: I don't use UFW, so I can't help there. I use iptables and I have a rule "-A INPUT -i lo -j ACCEPT" near the beginning of my rule list.
1595[19:14:19] <greycat> OK, at this point you're asking questions about the utilities specific to some desktop environment, so you'll need someone who actually *uses* a desktop environment. Or you can search for existing bug reports.
1596[19:14:41] <greycat> Personally, I just use i3lock (and no other pieces of i3).
1597[19:15:04] *** Quits: boubou (~boubou@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1598[19:15:23] *** Quits: JohnML (~john1@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1611[19:20:21] <vlt> Hello. I used the official debian-live-10.4.0-amd64-mate.iso (and its non-graphical installer) to install Debian to a new ThinkPad. Everything just worked (except for the need for firmware-iwlwifi from non-free).
1619[19:22:16] <cmptr> What about multi finger gestures? I figured out how to create single finger gestures, but not multiple. Two finger scrolling works right out of the box, but not the going back and forward through webpages.
1718[20:36:26] <dpkg> Some packages intended for Bullseye (Debian 11) but recompiled for use with Buster (Debian 10) can be found in the buster-backports repository. See replaced-url
1719[20:36:45] <greycat> It won't necessarily be "latest", but it's better than many of your other options.
1720[20:37:13] <dvs> and it's (almost) supported
1721[20:37:22] *** Quits: adikt (~adiktz@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1722[20:38:12] <CQ> greycat, I know backports, but if I install say linux-image-5.5.something, will it stay on 5.5, or update within the 5.5 series, or also move to 5.6?
1723[20:38:24] <oxek> GNU\colossus: you sure curse a lot :)
1724[20:38:31] <CQ> I am wondering which package to install, do I need a concrete kernel package, or is there a 5.x or 5.5 meta package?
1734[20:40:29] <tds> ^ buster-backports will get you 5.5 :)
1735[20:40:37] <greycat> (currently)
1736[20:40:42] <jmcnaught> CQ: you must not have included "-t buster-backports" in your command
1737[20:40:45] <oxek> GNU\colossus: I don't know who that is. Would it be interesting knowledge for me to find out?
1738[20:40:57] <CQ> tds ah, thanks, that explains it. I thought buster was on 5.x already since I see 5.4 and 5.5 kernels in apt-cache search linux-image
1740[20:42:35] <GNU\colossus> oxek, you can probably spend your time more meaningfully and/or productively :) "Schily" is a rather prolific and productive software developer from Germany who's very much into Sun Solaris, and he wrote much of cdrtools/cdrecord.
1750[20:47:11] <GNU\colossus> he's a notoriously trollish presence on German language IT forums, and best simply not dealt with at all in my experience ;)
1882[22:20:39] <r3> each time you boot yow. That's 6 so far
1883[22:21:35] <EdePopede> with a boot password the boot loader shouldn't even show up? never used one, so no idea where it pops up.
1884[22:22:17] <b1ackandwh1te> the nightmare is to put a bios password in a laptop and forget it.
1885[22:22:31] <r3> splash screen and then password prompt, I think, EdePopede
1886[22:23:10] <EdePopede> that's what i'd call login password
1887[22:23:28] <r3> heh, well, you won't see grub is what I was getting at :)
1888[22:24:23] <EdePopede> reminds me of the confusion with windows and tabs and what not. terminal multiplexers and browsers and other types of software all use their own contradicting nomenclature :)
1902[22:49:21] <karlpinc> I'm having trouble because my laptop battery is at 0% and is not charging. acpi -b says "charging at 0 rate", and this is confirmed by "upower -d". "The Internet" says to try resetting the hardware power manager by removing all power but this did not seem to have an effect. Any suggestions? (ACER Aspire one)
1904[22:55:11] <karlpinc> Which reminds me. The ACER has only 1G of ram, runs buster with xfce, and I use a browser on it just fine, although never watch videos etc. I did replace the platter with a ssd, so I suppose swapping (in) happens faster. It also has a slow Atom 32 bit cpu. Without the SSD using it was painful.
1907[22:57:43] <sney> karlpinc: I have an asus eeepc with similar specs and its battery gave up the ghost after I'd had it for about 6 years. Luckily generic batteries are available on ebay. That would be my guess unless the battery in yours is new
1908[22:57:48] <r3> well, karlpinc, this might be outside the scope of this channel, but I would take the battery out of it, and if you have a multimeter, check to see if it even registers a charge. If it sort-of does, look to *carefully* take the battery apart and check the individual cells.
1909[22:58:24] <r3> chances are you will find one cell at significantly lower voltage than the others.
1910[22:59:12] <r3> you could also check to see if the charger is plugged in, and also check it with the multimeter to see if it is putting out anything. Change to a different one if you can.
1915[23:00:24] *** Quits: halvors (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1916[23:01:19] *** Quits: nicolaf (~nicolaf@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1917[23:01:27] <r3> you might also clean the contacts on everything, the charger, charge port, internal contacts to the battery, the terminals on the battery. Fluff does accrue.
1923[23:04:11] <r3> or, you know, maybe just replace the whole thing - it is, what, probably 11-12 years old? :) Good luck - and be sure to unplug from the mains before fiddling with anything. Don't want it to be said that "The Internet" caused your injuries.
1937[23:11:53] <sney> I still use my eee. the keyboard port on the motherboard is shot so it doesn't work as a laptop anymore, so instead it's a low power server with a battery backup that hosts my nagios4 instance. why get rid of a working computer?
1939[23:13:40] <r3> oh hey I'm the last person who would pitch out a working computer - I've got dozens and another dozen in the boneyard in the back storage room