People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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1 [00:03:59] <serverman> do you just get given an scope with IP range hacktime
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4 [00:05:17] <serverman> do you have to worry about the many firewallsloadbalancersIPSIDSSOC inbetween
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11 [00:10:28] <hacktime> It's more than just that. Pretty in-depth topic, like I said, off-topic.
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22 [00:12:54] <serverman> ok
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111 [01:39:22] <ipatrol> the default NumPy version should be upped from 1.13 to 1.17. Apparently something was changed on account of a CVE, and some libraries already rely on the new behavior. See replaced-url
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162 [02:30:20] <yans> Hello
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174 [02:43:34] <GenTooMan> hmmm If I remove a Win10 installed drive and replace it with a different drive, I presume the win10 install is still on that drive. Would that cause trouble with the UEFI system?
175 [02:43:55] <ksk> GenTooMan: that is a debian question in what regards?
176 [02:44:18] <GenTooMan> ksk I wish to put an empty drive in and install debian onto the disk via USB.
177 [02:44:32] <ksk> sooo, do that!?
178 [02:44:51] <ksk> !problem
179 [02:44:51] <dpkg> it has been said that problem is something that can be solved, fixed or worked around if properly described. A good thorough description of the problem, with detailed steps of how to reproduce the problem, the produced output, and the expected output, is the best start to discuss a problem.
180 [02:45:39] <GenTooMan> !UEFI
181 [02:45:39] <dpkg> Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later releases support installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is currently not supported. replaced-url
182 [02:45:51] <somiaj> GenTooMan: the efi partition the machine was looking for was probably on that drive you removed
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184 [02:48:01] <GenTooMan> I just want to keep the win10 system (despite it never being used) and replace with Linux. I am uncertain how useful dual boot would be (or how complicated) hence the question. I think it's that simple but I don't know what the UEFI will do as a consequence. Measure twice cut once thinking.
185 [02:49:14] <ksk> mhhm I am not into UEFI, but I suppose it works just the same as with BIOS; you install additional harddrive, tell debian installer to use that. If I remember correctly it should automagicly create a grub entry for your windows disk, too
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187 [02:49:53] <ksk> buster DOES support secure boot btw.
188 [02:49:54] <dvs> GenTooMan, I think if you remove the Win10 installed drive then the UEFI partition will be gone with it.
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190 [02:51:02] <somiaj> you should be able to point your efi to the debian installer, create a new uefi partition on the new disk and move on
191 [02:51:13] <somiaj> you just need to reconfigure your firmware to deal with the efi partition being removed
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193 [02:55:48] <GenTooMan> Ok I sort of have the picture. have video will yank hard drive and replace with different one. Should I update the bios first before swapping out the HD from win10? As Windows 10 is the only way to update the bios it appears.
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196 [02:57:08] <dvs> GenTooMan, are you sure? Most new BIOSes can upgrade themselves if the update file is on a USB flash drive.
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198 [02:58:05] <GenTooMan> dvs the manufacturer has a win10 update utility only.
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221 [03:20:56] <GenTooMan> side note OMG win10 is SLOW!
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246 [03:40:57] <PoPo> Tell the professors to suck each other off...
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258 [03:46:55] <PoPo> You want me to say something you son of a bitch?
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262 [03:48:55] <SerajewelKS> dpkg: wireguard
263 [03:48:55] <dpkg> SerajewelKS: I don't know, could you explain it?
264 [03:49:50] <SerajewelKS> dpkg: wireguard is an in-kernel layer 3 VPN with a reputation for speed and code simplicity. See replaced-url
265 [03:49:51] <dpkg> SerajewelKS: okay
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268 [03:51:23] <ksk> dpkg: forget UEFI
269 [03:51:26] <SerajewelKS> the official installation instructions for wireguard have one pulling packages from unstable, even on stable
270 [03:51:49] <SerajewelKS> is this actually recommended? or is there another way to install wireguard on buster?
271 [03:51:59] <ksk> ,v wireguar
272 [03:52:00] <ksk> ,v wireguard
273 [03:52:00] <judd> No package named 'wireguar' was found in amd64.
274 [03:52:01] <judd> Package: wireguard on amd64 -- bullseye: 0.0.20191206-1; sid: 0.0.20191212-1
275 [03:52:04] <annadane> !uefi
276 [03:52:04] <dpkg> Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later releases support installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is currently not supported. replaced-url
277 [03:52:16] <annadane> why did dpkg not forget it?
278 [03:52:18] <ksk> I wanted to edit uefi faqtoid ;)
279 [03:52:22] <ksk> cuz it told me
280 [03:52:24] <ksk> 02:51 <dpkg> will not delete 'uefi', count > limit (382 > 100) use 'no, ' instead.
281 [03:52:43] *** Quits: Arkaniad (~Arkaniad@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
282 [03:53:03] <ksk> dpkg: no, UEFI is: Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later releases support installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is suported with Buster. replaced-url
283 [03:53:04] <dpkg> that's too long, ksk
284 [03:53:09] <ksk> pff
285 [03:53:28] <annadane> !smack dpkg
286 [03:53:28] * dpkg smacks dpkg upside the head.
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289 [03:54:09] <ksk> dpkg: no, UEFI is: Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 and later releases support installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is supported with Buster. replaced-url
290 [03:54:09] <dpkg> that's too long, ksk
291 [03:54:13] * ksk gives up
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296 [03:57:47] <SerajewelKS> dpkg: UEFI =~ s/is currently not supported/is supported starting with buster/
297 [03:57:47] <dpkg> OK, SerajewelKS
298 [03:57:50] <SerajewelKS> !UEFI
299 [03:57:50] <dpkg> Unified Extensible Firmware Interface (UEFI) is a firmware interface specification, intended to replace the <BIOS> firmware interface. Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later releases support installation in (U)EFI mode on 64-bit PC systems (amd64), <secure boot> is supported starting with buster. replaced-url
300 [03:57:54] <SerajewelKS> ksk: better?
301 [03:58:00] <ksk> SerajewelKS: uh nice! thanks
302 [03:58:13] <annadane> burn the witch
303 [03:58:34] <SerajewelKS> dpkg: UEFI =~ s/buster/Debian 10 "Buster"/
304 [03:58:34] <dpkg> OK, SerajewelKS
305 [03:58:40] <SerajewelKS> might as well be consistent
306 [03:59:25] <SerajewelKS> wonder if it's worth noting that in secure boot mode you can't modprobe third party modules like nvidia
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324 [04:16:07] <annadane> why does MATE not open terminal applications from the menu?
325 [04:16:20] <annadane> on xfce i can click neovim, it opens a terminal. MATE, nothing happens
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601 [05:10:39] <annadane> netspliiit
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614 [05:25:34] <MoonKid> Good morning
615 [05:26:00] <dvs> nite!
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626 [05:36:34] <buhtz> I want to learn how a specific bug (replaced-url
627 [05:36:35] <judd> Bug replaced-url
628 [05:37:03] * buhtz posted the wrong bug
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630 [05:37:35] <buhtz> replaced-url
631 [05:39:34] <buhtz> In my understanding a new major release won't be accepted for Debian 10 (it is "stable"). So upstream need to fix the problem in a minor release, right?
632 [05:40:18] <buhtz> Or is there no need for a release? The fix is only about 5 simple lines of code could be added by the debian package maintainer her/himself
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634 [05:40:57] <dvs> buhtz, if the bug is severe enough, it could find itself in a minor release.
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637 [05:44:24] <buhtz> could or should - that is the core of my question. Debian stable package version is 5.2.1-1 (with the IMO grave bug). Upstream released a 6.0.0 (beta) where the bug is fixed. Resources for upstream are quite low so he need to know if 6.0.0 would be used for Debian stable or if he should create a 5.* minor release also where only the bug was fixed.
638 [05:46:13] <dvs> buhtz, creating a minor release would have a better chance getting into stable.
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645 [05:50:36] <Wipadee> how is saved sessions supposed to work in xfce?
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647 [05:50:51] <Wipadee> mine only saved firefox and tbird for some reason
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657 [06:03:44] <annadane> Wipadee, you may want to ask the xfce people more directly, #debian may not know that specifically
658 [06:03:50] <annadane> #xfce irc channel
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660 [06:04:12] <annadane> Wipadee, clarify you're still on 4.12, which you will be if using debian stable
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662 [06:04:38] <annadane> (it's behind the release that just got released so if you don't clarify they may answer assuming you're using 4.14)
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665 [06:06:23] <Wipadee> yes 4.12 debian buster
666 [06:07:01] <Wipadee> is this how sessions work for you ?
667 [06:08:37] <annadane> i'm not sure how xfce really works regarding sessions, i've been using MATE
668 [06:09:02] <annadane> when i did use xfce i'm not sure i really paid attention to how it worked or how it differentiated between different types of windows
669 [06:09:32] <annadane> you can write down which things don't get saved, try to compile a list, experiment
670 [06:09:38] <annadane> but again, maybe the xfce people speciically know more
671 [06:09:42] <annadane> specifically*
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676 [06:14:15] <somiaj> xfce has a session manager you can run that configures what you want
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678 [06:14:23] <somiaj> I think by default it is set to autosave, but you can change this
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681 [06:17:26] <Wipadee> seems to only autosave certain apps
682 [06:17:50] <annadane> oh! right, it does
683 [06:17:55] <annadane> i totally forgot about that
684 [06:18:13] <somiaj> run the session manager, it should help y ou figure out what is going on. Are you logging out of xfce or just rebooting?
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686 [06:19:42] <Wipadee> well in session startup there is a session tabs but don't see how to add apps
687 [06:20:46] <Wipadee> think i've done both restart and logout then restart
688 [06:21:21] <somiaj> replaced-url
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694 [06:25:03] <factor> Does anyone know how I can get a supported version of nodejs with debian packages stable debian 10 does nothave a supported version
695 [06:30:12] <somiaj> You will have to install it from outside of debian.
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700 [06:32:35] <somiaj> looks like your options (I haven't done either) are to use replaced-url
701 [06:33:08] <somiaj> The other option is to use nvm, which to me might be more appropriate in debian, as to not mix third party repos (so it is up to you if you trust their packages to play nicely with debian packages or not)
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705 [06:35:38] <annadane> do we have like, a list of relatively trusted 3rd party repos
706 [06:35:51] <annadane> the only ones i know of for sure are WINE and sury's PHP
707 [06:36:16] <annadane> you'd think node would have something
708 [06:36:18] <somiaj> I don't think so, and trusted depends on indvidual's use
709 [06:36:22] <annadane> nodejs*
710 [06:36:43] <somiaj> in general any thrid party should be removed during dist-upgrades as they can cause problems (even if trusted)
711 [06:38:05] <annadane> you just comment out the repo and let apt dist-upgrade remove the packages associated with the repo?
712 [06:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1313
713 [06:39:22] <somiaj> kinda depends, but that is one way to do it. Though if a thrid party package is built against debian 10 libs, there is a chance it will break the upgrade if it the debian 11 libs don't match the version numbers, as most likely none will be tested for upgrades
714 [06:39:51] <somiaj> So it is always best to keep thrid party stuff to a minimum (hence why I suggest using nvm and making virutal local installs)
715 [06:40:57] <somiaj> even if things are made nicely, without being part of the debian testing process one just needs to be ready to deal with any issues with third party packages (the safest way might be remove them all before the upgrade then reintall), or just preforme a test upgrade before doing one on anything critical.
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721 [06:46:23] <GuestKO> high all
722 [06:47:21] <annadane> not yet, but working on it
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724 [06:49:10] <GuestKO> please include in /boot modules "relationship explicit
725 [06:49:52] <GuestKO> its a good way to do
726 [06:50:46] <GuestKO> if possible firware fetch telative
727 [06:50:50] <annadane> 1) it's unclear what you're suggesting 2) we're not developers, most of us, you may try #debian-boot on oftc
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733 [06:52:13] <GuestKO> so you are not responding for 2 or mire
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736 [06:53:17] <GuestKO> if anyone could comunicate debian bridging linux kernel too about something tompke s
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740 [06:56:05] <annadane> i... don't understand wtf they were going on about
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742 [06:58:42] <Guestvpn> someother can could comunicate debian team to include in /boot modules dependencies relationship
743 [06:59:10] <annadane> Guestvpn, ask #debian-boot on oftc or contact the debian-boot team in some other way
744 [06:59:13] <annadane> most of us are not developers
745 [06:59:33] <Guestvpn> its not programmers skill
746 [06:59:59] <jm_> you mean kernel modules?
747 [07:00:15] <Guestvpn> its a simple text file lime almost allthing in etc
748 [07:00:26] <Guestvpn> jm_ yes
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750 [07:01:12] <jm_> Guestvpn: you already have that list in /lib/modules/<version>/modules.dep
751 [07:01:20] <Guestvpn> for ex: firmware module module_dependencie(s)
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753 [07:02:12] <Guestvpn> jm_ text redable?
754 [07:02:41] <Guestvpn> jm_ including firmware?
755 [07:03:32] <jm_> Guestvpn: it is text readable, no firmware info is included in there, just module dependencies
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757 [07:04:09] <jm_> individual modulesinclude that info, so you could easily create that yourself using the modinfo command
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759 [07:05:30] <Guestvpn> jm_ ok, in my opinion would be a good cat info about module's relative firmware fetch
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762 [07:06:35] <jm_> Guestvpn: like I said, that info already exists, try say «modinfo r8169» or «modinfo radeon»
763 [07:07:06] <Guestvpn> jm_ try to imagine the the work to run so many modinfo
764 [07:08:06] <jm_> Guestvpn: it's trivial to create a script for it, but anyway, feel free to submit a wishlist bug
765 [07:08:41] <Guestvpn> jm_ yes
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767 [07:10:15] <Guestvpn> jm_ it would be great for begginers
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769 [07:11:00] <Guestvpn> jm_ as you said we are developers
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912 [09:21:16] <andre144k> hello all... how to use pigz in combination with tar cvf and pigz compressoptions?
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914 [09:21:22] <andre144k> current command is: tar cvf archive1.tar.gz archive1 --use-compress-program=pigz
915 [09:21:39] <andre144k> i want use "pigz --fast" instead
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920 [09:25:40] <BoyDoy> anyone suggest what application i can use for Document Management System. Thank you
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922 [09:25:53] <jm_> the simplest way is tar c archive1 | pigz --fast > archive1.tar.gz
923 [09:26:33] <jm_> or use --use-compress-program='pigz --fast'
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934 [09:31:37] <andre144k> jm_, thx
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938 [09:33:49] <jm_> no problem
939 [09:33:56] <andre144k> jm_, tar c archive1 | pigz - this works stable with archive-folders > 200GB ?
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944 [09:35:03] <jm_> andre144k: yeah should be no difference, the difference is that with the other way tar creates a pipe, but with this command shell creates it
945 [09:35:23] <andre144k> great
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960 [09:42:50] <nyov> andre144k: I would advise against using XZ for archiving. It can silently corrupt data
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963 [09:44:11] <nyov> or rather, the archive can become corrupt silently. just fyi. bzip2 archives can at least partially be recovered
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967 [09:46:01] <andre144k> i want multithrading support, cause i have to compress > 500GB
968 [09:46:22] <nyov> pbzip2 can also do multithreading
969 [09:46:54] <jm_> isn't pigz using the same compression as gzip?
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972 [09:47:22] <andre144k> jm_, seems so - i can uncompress via tar xvzf
973 [09:47:24] <nyov> jm_: oh right. My bad! sorry andre144k
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975 [09:47:36] <nyov> though gzip2 is also bad at recovery
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977 [09:47:38] <jm_> nyov: also, interested to read about XZ and corruption issues, do you have a link for that?
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979 [09:48:01] <nyov> jm_: let me look that up again. I hope I can find it swiftly
980 [09:48:21] <jm_> cause I used pxz in the past and now switched to zstd :)
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984 [09:49:36] <nyov> jm_: replaced-url
985 [09:50:14] <nyov> specifically, point 2.5
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987 [09:50:46] <jm_> nyov: thank you
988 [09:51:06] <jm_> so basically it's an issue with the format
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995 [09:59:08] <andre144k> tar cv archive1 | gzip --fast > archive1.tar.gz - howto output filelist from -v in logfile ?
996 [09:59:19] <andre144k> tar cv archive1 | pigz --fast > archive1.tar.gz - howto output filelist from -v in logf
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999 [10:01:56] <andre144k> like: tar cvf archive1.tar.gz archive1 --use-compress-program=pigz >> mylog.txt
1000 [10:03:03] <jm_> tar cv archive1 2>filelist | ...
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1003 [10:04:15] <andre144k> ah ... thx sry for this stupid questions :-(
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1048 [10:22:32] <TrueSquad> Hello, does anyone know if a debian package is available somewhere? Or the source code of the firmware to be compiled either? replaced-url
1049 [10:22:55] <TrueSquad> related bug => replaced-url
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1052 [10:25:05] <jm_> are you seriously expecting to find source code for a commercial SSD product?
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1058 [10:27:49] <andre144k> jm_, for information... 19GB src-data via pigz without --fast option: 40min / 10GB compressed archive. - with --fast option: 8min 12GB compressed archive
1059 [10:27:52] <andre144k> heavy
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1090 [10:53:21] <TrueSquad> jm_ I know it's unlikely
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1092 [10:53:23] <Sanderei> Hi. I have some trouble with x11 on a chromebook. When I start an application like kdenlive it starts showing black boxes and green dots
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1103 [11:01:49] <Miles8of9> ook!! i installed buster on my notebook... had to install manually "firmware-linux-nonfree" package but it's ok
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1108 [11:02:17] <Miles8of9> now....! touchpad isn't working! mouse arrow is there but it's not moving!
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1112 [11:02:54] <humbot> ook
1113 [11:03:08] <Miles8of9> btw.... installation took less than 1 hour and it emptied my battery! omg lol
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1116 [11:03:56] <Miles8of9> btw2... battery is almost new.... Oo
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1146 [11:05:44] <Sanderei> can't install firmware-linux-nonfree
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1148 [11:05:57] <Sanderei> not in the pakagelist
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1152 [11:06:38] <Miles8of9> hehe!! you need to include nonfree repository!
1153 [11:07:02] <Miles8of9> in your /etc/apt/sources.list
1154 [11:08:09] <Miles8of9> you need something like deb <repo http> buster main contrib non-free
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1171 [11:09:32] <Miles8of9> the apt-get update and you should find it
1172 [11:09:46] <Haohmaru> he gone
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1178 [11:16:29] <vlt> Hello. I created a Debian-live iso using live-build. In the early stages of the project everything runs fine. When I add an /etc/crypttab with a line like "my_target /foo/bar none luks" and a corresponding /etc/fstab I get the passphrase prompt while booting. (replaced-url
1179 [11:16:31] <vlt> (img2) and finally after timeout "Cannot open access to console ... press Enter" (img3).
1180 [11:16:35] <vlt> Any iea how to fix this?
1181 [11:16:40] <vlt> *idea
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1186 [11:19:20] <Haohmaru> i thought "eth0" is no longer a thang
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1191 [11:22:29] <f8e3> whats the best staemachine builder?
1192 [11:22:37] <f8e3> a gui frontend for dot.exe?
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1206 [11:41:13] <f8e3> dot foo.dot foo.ps is bollox for quick design
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1265 [12:26:30] <andre144k> is there any way/chance that "tar cvzf archive1 arcchive1.tar.gz" is storing insided *tar.gz" files (e.g. archive1/foo/bar/foobar.tar.gz) 1:1 instead compress again inside archive1.tar.gz ?
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1312 [12:47:47] <satanist> hi i have strange bug in bash with folowing code: while read -r h ; do ssh "$h" "hostname" ; done < hosts
1313 [12:48:01] <satanist> the loop stops after the first sucessfull ssh command
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1315 [12:48:48] <ayekat> satanist: that's likely because ssh then proceeds to read from stdin (i.e. all the remaining files in your `hosts` file)
1316 [12:49:01] <satanist> ah thanks
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1318 [12:49:28] <ayekat> *all the remaining lines - but I think you get what I mean ^^
1319 [12:50:34] <satanist> yes, this was the problem
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1321 [12:51:08] <satanist> thanks searched now 30min for this
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1370 [13:34:39] <f8e3> is there an rss feed for replaced-url
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1379 [13:38:07] <oerheks> there are rss feeds .. replaced-url
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1383 [13:43:49] <jelly> damn, am I using proxy again, everything is in German
1384 [13:44:00] <Haohmaru> oh noes
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1386 [13:44:03] <avu> ja ja
1387 [13:44:05] <Haohmaru> ze h0rr0r
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1391 [13:46:01] <oerheks> wass?
1392 [13:46:21] <Haohmaru> ja nicht parles ze doych
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1394 [13:47:28] <avu> ze releaxen and watschen der blinkenlichten
1395 [13:47:44] <Haohmaru> ah, gut, gut
1396 [13:47:50] <Haohmaru> O_O
1397 [13:48:07] <ratrace> *blink* *blink* *blinky-blink*
1398 [13:48:18] <Haohmaru> -_- O_O -_- O_O
1399 [13:48:54] <Haohmaru> das ist nicht very vundabah
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1418 [13:56:00] <xj> I am trying to install KVM and keep getting a dependency on libpython3.5, but I can't install that. It says there is no installation candidate. I have python 3.7.5 installed.
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1421 [13:57:04] <xj> I am on buster. any idea how i might get past this?
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1424 [13:57:48] <ratrace> are you abusing third party repos?
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1426 [13:58:13] <ratrace> or better, start by explaining _exactly_ what you're trying to do, which package you're trying to install, etc...
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1428 [13:59:25] <xj> I am trying to install vert-manager.
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1430 [14:00:25] <ratrace> xj: can you pastebin `apt-cache policy virt-manager` ?
1431 [14:02:01] <xj> replaced-url
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1433 [14:02:53] <dvs> !frankendebian
1434 [14:02:53] <dpkg> When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall>
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1436 [14:03:46] <Haohmaru> Debistein >:)
1437 [14:04:29] <ratrace> xj: what dvs and dpkg said
1438 [14:04:37] <xj> ah... fair enough.
1439 [14:04:48] <jelly> xj: mixing a newer release branch is ill-advised, your installation is probably unsupportable. You can fully upgrade to testing, or reinstall
1440 [14:04:59] <jelly> if you choose to go testing,
1441 [14:05:02] <jelly> !debian-next
1442 [14:05:02] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
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1444 [14:05:35] <xj> thank you for the assistance. I had forgotten about adding testing
1445 [14:05:42] <jelly> (also, don't use "testing" in sources.list, use bullseye to avoid surprises next time testing becomes something other than bullseye)
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1448 [14:06:13] <jelly> if you did not actually install anything from testing the situation might be salvageable
1449 [14:06:22] <xj> bullseye?
1450 [14:06:44] <xj> the next release name?
1451 [14:08:00] <jelly> yes, what "testing" repo currently points to
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1453 [14:08:12] <jelly> !bullseye
1454 [14:08:12] <dpkg> The release following Debian 10 "Buster" is codenamed "Bullseye" (Woody's horse in Toy Story 2) and will be Debian 11. It is the current "testing" release. Remember that straight after a stable release, all sorts of mess suddenly lands in "testing" and it is best avoided if you don't like debugging things. replaced-url
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1457 [14:08:47] <butts> RIDE LIKE THE WIND, BULLSEYE
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1463 [14:13:25] <EdePopede> !wwbr
1464 [14:13:25] <dpkg> Debian 10 "Buster" started the <freeze> process on 2019-01-12 and should release on July 6, 2019. See replaced-url
1465 [14:13:43] * EdePopede would suggest some kind of update, the one or the other way
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1467 [14:14:42] <xj> went full testing....
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1469 [14:15:31] <jelly> dpkg, literal wwbr
1470 [14:15:32] <dpkg> "wwbr" is "<reply>Debian 10 "Buster" started the <freeze> process on 2019-01-12 and should release on July 6, 2019. See replaced-url
1471 [14:15:44] <xj> ok, so because I am now on bullseye. when bullseye becomes stable, no more problems. i hope
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1475 [14:16:56] <avu> which will be in 1.5 years or so :)
1476 [14:17:02] <xj> hahahaha...
1477 [14:17:20] <avu> I'm not kidding
1478 [14:17:36] <xj> i didn't think you were
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1480 [14:18:05] <xj> i guess i'll backup up my configs and files and reinstall
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1495 [14:32:39] <B1llW1gg0n> /join #offsec
1496 [14:32:46] <dvs> no!
1497 [14:34:35] <jelly> B1llW1gg0n: now do that without any spaces in front of /join
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1499 [14:34:44] <B|ack0p> hi jelly :p
1500 [14:34:56] <jelly> hi
1501 [14:34:58] <B1llW1gg0n> doh! thanks
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1509 [14:40:17] <MarioMey> Hi, there. I'm having troubles with unmet dependencies, trying to compile Blender.
1510 [14:40:19] <MarioMey> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
1511 [14:40:20] <MarioMey> libglewmx-dev : Conflicts: libglew-dev but 2.0.0-3+b1 is to be installed
1512 [14:40:20] <MarioMey> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
1513 [14:40:24] <MarioMey> The problem is, in this system (Debian 9), I can't have libglewmx-dev and libglew-dev installed at the same time. WhY?
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1537 [15:07:22] <jelly> ,v libglew-dev
1538 [15:07:23] <judd> Package: libglew-dev on amd64 -- jessie: 1.10.0-3; stretch: 2.0.0-3+b1; buster: 2.1.0-4; bullseye: 2.1.0-4+b1; sid: 2.1.0-4+b1
1539 [15:07:30] <jelly> ,v libglewmx-dev
1540 [15:07:31] <judd> Package: libglewmx-dev on amd64 -- jessie: 1.10.0-3; stretch: 1.13.0-3; bullseye: 1.13.0-4+b11; buster: 1.13.0-4+b11; sid: 1.13.0-4+b11
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1582 [15:35:18] <zodd> Is it possible to query a .deb file for (unmet) dependecies without installing it with dpkg ? I can think of --dry-run and manually checking dependencies. Obviously I prefer an automated proces.
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1585 [15:36:42] <hacktime> zodd: I *think* that apt install --dry-run will do similar while also checking deps.
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1587 [15:37:57] <zodd> hacktime, but does that not reference a repo instead of a file?
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1611 [16:01:09] <hacktime> It does both.
1612 [16:01:20] <hacktime> apt install --dry-run ./file.deb
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1614 [16:02:19] <Haohmaru> on lxde/lxpanel, i got a calendar, but teh week starts from sunday x_x
1615 [16:02:41] <Haohmaru> how do i fix this madness ;P~
1616 [16:02:44] <ratrace> Orage?
1617 [16:02:54] <Haohmaru> not sure.. lemme see
1618 [16:02:55] <ratrace> neway, that should be configurable
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1620 [16:03:17] <hacktime> zodd: See above.
1621 [16:03:42] <zodd> thanks
1622 [16:04:01] <Haohmaru> ratrace afaict, it's part of the "digital clock" widget
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1633 [16:08:10] <EdePopede> Haohmaru: in xfce the context menus for the widgets start with their name. have the same here with its DateTime. irritating, since i'm never sure about week numbers.
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1639 [16:09:32] <Haohmaru> at home i think i use akchually xfce4 panel specifically for the fancier clock, but i think there the calendar too starts from sunday x_x
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1642 [16:11:31] <ratrace> Haohmaru: it should be configurable anyway, and maybe it's relying on locale
1643 [16:11:49] <JordiGH> I want a window with an oscilloscope or any other kind of visualisation of the current audio playing. What's my best bet to do this?
1644 [16:11:55] <ratrace> first day of the week is definitely a locale attribute
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1646 [16:12:33] <Haohmaru> it's awkward cuz in my language tuesday means second-ish, wednesday means middle-ish, thursday means four-ish, and friday is straight five-ish
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1648 [16:13:11] <jhutchins_wk> Virtuallbox does not like it when my laptop hibernates.
1649 [16:13:16] <JordiGH> Ooh, projectm-pulseaudio, perhaps?
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1656 [16:17:46] <Haohmaru> if i set locale to BG, will many things turn into bulgarian? like.. the text in UIs, the text in terminals..?
1657 [16:17:53] <Haohmaru> coz that is a big "no" for me
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1663 [16:20:18] <JordiGH> free(): double free detected in tcache 2
1664 [16:20:18] <JordiGH> Aborted
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1666 [16:20:27] <JordiGH> Dammit, projectM, you disappoint me so quickly.
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1680 [16:26:17] <JordiGH> replaced-url
1681 [16:26:18] <judd> Bug replaced-url
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1686 [16:28:13] <EdePopede> the definition of week*end*
1687 [16:28:13] <JordiGH> Hm, so do I have to rebuild with the patch?
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1689 [16:29:02] <EdePopede> ,v projectm-pulseaudio
1690 [16:29:03] <judd> Package: projectm-pulseaudio on amd64 -- jessie: 2.1.0+dfsg-1+b1; stretch: 2.1.0+dfsg-4+b3; buster: 2.1.0+dfsg-4+b4; sid: 2.1.0+dfsg-4+b4
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1692 [16:31:58] <JordiGH> Yeah, no patch yet.
1693 [16:32:04] <JordiGH> Fine, nbd, I'll patch myself.
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1695 [16:32:22] <JordiGH> replaced-url
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1698 [16:33:55] <colo-work> :D
1699 [16:33:58] <EdePopede> pdo is irritating
1700 [16:34:11] <EdePopede> bdo should really link to the packages there somewhere
1701 [16:34:25] <JordiGH> Also, why isn't it already a requirement to have some kind of file that explains why there's a "dfsg" in the version number?
1702 [16:34:51] <EdePopede> had to recall a link from the past of another package, but not even buster gave me a hit after replacing the package name in the url bar(!)
1703 [16:34:56] <JordiGH> EdePopede: Unless I'm reading this wrong, there's no backport yet, is there?
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1710 [16:37:23] <EdePopede> that's all i get replaced-url
1711 [16:37:39] <JordiGH> Do you still have to use quilt manually to patch deb packages?
1712 [16:37:41] <joepublic> JordiGH, the dfsg info is in /usr/share/doc/*/copyright
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1716 [16:38:37] <EdePopede> !dfsg
1717 [16:38:37] <dpkg> DFSG is the Debian Free Software Guidelines, which are explained at replaced-url
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1719 [16:38:56] <EdePopede> can't even remember what that cryptic bunch of letters mean
1720 [16:39:05] <JordiGH> joepublic: *Sometimes*
1721 [16:39:13] <joepublic> point taken.
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1723 [16:40:02] <JordiGH> In this case, it seems there were some useless binaries removed from the tarball, but I'm just guessing that was the change.
1724 [16:40:16] <JordiGH> It doesn't actually say, "hey, this is why we put dfsg in the version number".
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1726 [16:40:48] <JordiGH> EdePopede: dfsg is not cryptic, you must be new to Debian. :P
1727 [16:40:57] <JordiGH> dfsg is mostly the main reason I still use Debian.
1728 [16:41:07] <JordiGH> For the replaced-url
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1733 [16:42:49] <EdePopede> JordiGH: long ago the same thing passed through my head. "why not have a form which has to be filled completely before submit?" inluding selection lists - in suse's kde i once had not only a submenu "mediaplayers" but also "media players" with a single entry, and titles especially for series never seem to follow a clear pattern on TV station sites, not even if it's just one of those mini series with 6 episodes only, you can see exactly when the main
1734 [16:42:49] <EdePopede> staff is on holiday.
1735 [16:43:11] <EdePopede> people seem to simply be not able to handle such things most of the times.
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1738 [16:43:47] <JordiGH> I'm sorry, what? What are we talking about? We do not have the same things passing through our heads.
1739 [16:44:00] <EdePopede> JordiGH: for me it reads mostly like "Deutsche [insert something for f and s here] Gesellschaft"
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1741 [16:44:20] <EdePopede> > a requirement to have some kind of file that explains why there's a "dfsg"
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1744 [16:45:16] <EdePopede> people won't do it and neither would be d'accord with an implementation forcing them to do it. especially if they don't do it anyway.
1745 [16:46:07] <JordiGH> Oh, that. Debian already has ways to enforce such things. It's called Lintian.
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1747 [16:47:00] <EdePopede> it can't enforce it too hard if there still are packages without that file ;)
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1753 [16:48:26] <JordiGH> Lintian doesn't have a rule specifically for dfsg in the version name, though.
1754 [16:48:33] <Iacob> I think Guix is more freedom
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1756 [16:48:41] <Iacob> and freedom is not free
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1762 [16:52:24] <hacktime> Iacob: Not really relevant in here, is it?
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1769 [16:55:35] <Iacob> I means document of many other distributions is not such good
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1773 [16:56:52] <hacktime> Iacob: Still not sure of the relevance.
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1777 [16:59:47] <JordiGH> Eh, I for one appreciate the Guix plug.
1778 [16:59:54] <JordiGH> Power, my GNU/Brethren.
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1781 [17:00:22] <joepublic> Iacob, parabola has a file listing why each package not meeting their standard (FSDG) falls short, but debian has no comparable file I don't think
1782 [17:00:28] <joepublic> for example
1783 [17:00:29] <JordiGH> Nice, applying that patch seems to have fixed the projectm crash.
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1785 [17:01:04] <JordiGH> Ooh, I'm excited. I'm going to be streaming a rhythm game later today and I wanted a good visualisation for the music.
1786 [17:01:24] <joepublic> for such a list for debian to be automatically generated, there would need to be a standardized file as previously mentioned.
1787 [17:01:31] <JordiGH> I can use OBS and mednafen and projectm and some custom Python scripts I wrote, and oh my god, so much free software just to have fun with.
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1825 [17:27:40] <GenTooMan> Now to replace windows 10 with something useful...
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1827 [17:28:19] <dvs> DOS?
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1829 [17:31:11] <Iacob> freedos
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1831 [17:31:46] <Iacob> it should be free
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1834 [17:32:44] <ratrace> why, with gentoo of course.
1835 [17:33:28] <hodapp> I just put FreeDOS onto an old craptop.
1836 [17:33:30] <hodapp> not sure why.
1837 [17:33:35] <hodapp> alcohol may have played a role.
1838 [17:33:38] <johnjay> to run turbo C?
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1841 [17:34:27] <GenTooMan> you can run turbo C in DosBox...
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1843 [17:34:35] <Iacob> and install a emacs
1844 [17:35:02] <Iacob> and always keep in mind you can do everything with emacs
1845 [17:35:07] <johnjay> even emacs in dos?
1846 [17:35:32] <hacktime> except edit text files decently
1847 [17:35:50] <GenTooMan> <smirk>
1848 [17:36:07] <dvs> !start an editor war
1849 [17:36:07] <dpkg> nano users can't think straight!
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1851 [17:36:36] <Iacob> I remember that I saw it
1852 [17:36:41] <hacktime> My mental issues have nothing to do with text editors, believe me
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1854 [17:37:24] <hodapp> GenTooMan: IT'S NOT THE SAME
1855 [17:37:33] <hodapp> johnjay: yes, it's still maintained
1856 [17:37:35] <hodapp> for some reason
1857 [17:38:14] <GenTooMan> they can build a binary and most computers that are still around have at least a 386 in them?
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1860 [17:39:15] <hodapp> wow, check your privilege
1861 [17:39:54] <hacktime> i have sudo rights, yes
1862 [17:40:15] <andre144k> is there a way to call manually nfs-sync ? maybe as cron each 10minutes?
1863 [17:40:36] <andre144k> or do i need sync-option in /etc/exports?
1864 [17:40:44] <Iacob> 640k memory can't do everything but emacs can
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1870 [17:45:43] <GenTooMan> it might take a while however
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1886 [17:59:02] <francis_murtagh> Hi, regarding packaging, If I have a debian/control/Build-Depends dependency of libboost-filesystem-dev which is greater than or equal to 1.64, but that system library is not available on older distros, should I just make build the package for the newer distros like buster or unstable and forget about older distros? like some users might be on ubuntu 16.04
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1890 [18:01:22] <joepublic> I might not be able to think straight but I am glad that pico-power was made free just the same
1891 [18:01:37] <jelly> francis_murtagh: it depends, but usually versioned build-deps on boost are there for a reason, and that reason is functionality actually being used
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1901 [18:04:04] <jelly> francis_murtagh: you could a) backport boost as well, which might be painful b) maybe be able to make a static or semi-static build on one platform that links with boost statically and happens to work on an older platform c) see if the code ACTUALLY needs that version
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1903 [18:04:54] <jelly> d) not use deb format for distribution but some other package format that alows you to bring the libs along
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1905 [18:05:58] <ratrace> underhanded flatpak/snapd advertisement ftw.
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1908 [18:07:53] <jelly> how is it underhanded
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1913 [18:09:48] <jelly> francis_murtagh: picking b) or d) means you now also have to care about (security) issues in all the build deps you ship as well, in addition to the piece of software itself
1914 [18:10:12] <jelly> s/build//
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1928 [18:16:46] <mason> jelly: Backporting boost shouldn't be too painful, assuming it doesn't jump across a new language standard.
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1946 [18:30:15] <jelly> nod. a) also requires having to care about boost as well, not just b) and d)
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1965 [18:42:28] <pie3> have you gone thru machine learning course-andrew ng/i would like to try some octave code online/online octave compiler/interpreter available?
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1984 [18:54:19] <spacebug^> After reading replaced-url
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1988 [18:56:50] <hacktime> Not true.
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1991 [18:57:29] <hacktime> Theres a periodic trim systemd timer that you should enable. Thatll take care of everything. fstrim.timer, I believe.
1992 [18:57:32] <hacktime> spacebug^: ^
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1994 [18:58:01] <hacktime> Its the fstab 'discard' option thats discouraged.
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1996 [18:58:42] <spacebug^> hum ok
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2001 [19:00:29] <humbot> hmm
2002 [19:00:31] <spacebug^> thanks hacktime
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2018 [19:20:26] <Miles8of9> debian says battery 0% and not charging!
2019 [19:20:40] <Miles8of9> how do i tell debian to recharge battery?
2020 [19:21:10] <Miles8of9> (btw i think battery is charged but i may be wrong)
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2022 [19:22:06] <diogenes_> Miles8of9, one method is to unplug ac and wait a few minutes.
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2024 [19:22:32] <Miles8of9> in few seconds the laptop goes to sleep
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2027 [19:23:14] <diogenes_> why?
2028 [19:23:36] <Miles8of9> because he thinks battery is 0%
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2030 [19:23:50] <Miles8of9> so to protect the system he goes to sleep
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2033 [19:24:58] <diogenes_> then change power settings to not take any actions on critical battery level.
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2036 [19:27:55] <Miles8of9> how do i change power settings?
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2039 [19:28:35] <diogenes_> it depends on DE.
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2043 [19:32:20] <n_1-c_k> Miles8of9, try package 'tlp'.
2044 [19:33:33] <Miles8of9> have no DE... mouse does not work.. i can run gnome etc... but mouse arrow won't move!
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2048 [19:36:58] <zerocool> friends my goal is to p2v a dell poweredge that may or may not have hardware that requires nonfree firmware. does anyone know if virt-p2v-make-disk already has this firmware or how i can add it?
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2085 [19:58:54] <stockholm> does debian-science have a irc channel?
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2088 [19:59:15] <josef_October> could someone please upload this file to wikileaks it is endlessly important!!! Its about safety of the whole human mankind | replaced-url
2089 [19:59:15] <josef_October> <josef_October> my computer is beeing controled thats why i cannot upload it
2090 [19:59:16] <stockholm> i have quesitons about sage
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2097 [20:01:17] <annadane> stockholm, yeah #debian-science on OFTC
2098 [20:01:28] <hacktime> !ops josef_October spamming
2099 [20:01:28] <dpkg> Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly, petn-randall, bremner: hacktime complains about a problem (see above)
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2125 [20:12:24] <somiaj> stockholm: what is your quesiton about ssage, is it about installing it in debian or using it? There is #sagemath
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2127 [20:14:04] <stockholm> somiaj, it seems to be a version mismatch between the GAP package and sage in debian testing. #sagemath cant help, its an issue with debian
2128 [20:14:30] <somiaj> ahh so this is a #debian-next issue, have you filed a bug report (or looked for one)?
2129 [20:14:52] <stockholm> #debian-next? what is that?
2130 [20:15:01] <somiaj> anyways #debian-next on irc.oftc.net is the channel for debian testing/unstable questions
2131 [20:15:16] <somiaj> in this case it sounds like a bug in the package, so look at bug reports or file one (if it is truely a version missmatch)
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2133 [20:15:29] <stockholm> right
2134 [20:16:30] <somiaj> basic advise for this kind if issue is, can you install gap from sid (so there is no longer a missmatch), you can also check out snapshot.debian.org to find older packages, so you can install the packages that won't have a missmatch while you wait for the bug to be resolved (after it is filed)
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2137 [20:19:23] <stockholm> ok, i will try the unstable package
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2150 [20:35:08] <vlt> Hello. I created a Debian-live iso using live-build. In the early stages of the project everything runs fine. When I add an /etc/crypttab with a line like "my_target /foo/bar none luks" I get the passphrase prompt while booting. (replaced-url
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2152 [20:35:40] <vlt> But adding a corresponding /etc/fstab (log replaced-url
2153 [20:35:54] <vlt> Any idea what might cause this?
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2161 [20:40:05] <somiaj> vlt: unsure if #debian-live on irc.oftc.net might be of better help for that question
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2170 [20:48:30] <vlt> somiaj: Will try that, though I'm not sure if this is a debian-live problem or just something I forgot to add properly for a normal boot.
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2204 [21:04:34] <dn4> Is arm64 good for the ARM Cortex-A72
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2223 [21:21:14] <Zambezi> I can use cryptsetup before I start Xorg, but not after. Is there any solution than going back to old stable?
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2228 [21:23:46] <loquace> hello
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2231 [21:25:20] <crapulon> salut les français débianeux !
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2233 [21:25:52] <EdePopede> !fr
2234 [21:25:52] <dpkg> Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr or #debian-quebec. Francophone users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr or #debian-quebec.
2235 [21:26:05] <EdePopede> ils sont là je crois ;)
2236 [21:26:17] <crapulon> ahahaha merci
2237 [21:26:19] <EdePopede> et salut, crapulon
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2239 [21:26:26] <crapulon> salut EdePopede
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2245 [21:28:48] <mason> Zambezi: You should be able to use cryptsetup whenever you like.
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2249 [21:30:27] <Zambezi> mason: I can't. bash: cryptsetup: command not found
2250 [21:30:36] <greycat> !buster su
2251 [21:30:37] <dpkg> In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). To approximate the previous behaviour, put "ALWAYS_SET_PATH yes" in /etc/login.defs. See replaced-url
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2253 [21:30:57] <greycat> we're going to be seeing this one for a *decade*
2254 [21:31:05] <mason> Zambezi: That's got nothing to do with X.
2255 [21:31:21] <mason> Ah.
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2260 [21:33:19] <somiaj> And at that time they'll change it back
2261 [21:33:25] <Zambezi> mason: My theory is that some package interfering with cryptsetup, which is launched after startx. It's really impractical to only be able to use cryptsetup after reboot, before Xorg starts.
2262 [21:33:35] <mason> Zambezi: No, read what greycat said.
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2264 [21:33:54] <greycat> and more importantly, what dpkg said in response
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2268 [21:36:10] <Zambezi> mason: My apologies. Didn't realise it was meant for me.
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2270 [21:37:03] <mason> Zambezi: As long as you're good to go, we're happy.
2271 [21:37:22] <Zambezi> greycat: Thanks alot. When I reboot my computer, I always log in as root first to start cryptsetup. Then I exit and log in as my regular user.
2272 [21:37:35] <somiaj> Zambezi: in the future you should give more than 'doesn't work', you should look at the error that is produced. command found in one context but not found in another should indicate the PATH
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2279 [21:39:15] <Zambezi> mason: I certainly am. A great relief.
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2282 [21:41:20] <Zambezi> somiaj: I did at first, but it was a bit too long so I shortened it to a summary. And if I got help, I would be more specific. Now I got the solution straight away.
2283 [21:41:43] <somiaj> it is usually easier to get help being more specific at the start
2284 [21:42:24] <greycat> pasting the (single line) error message is typically the fastest way to get to the answer
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2289 [21:43:58] <ALowther> I am trying to start nginx.service, it fails. I checked /etc/systemd/system and nginx.service exists, but it is empty. What might this mean?
2290 [21:44:28] <greycat> it might mean you, or your predecessor, screwed up
2291 [21:44:49] <somiaj> remove /etc/systemd/system/nginx.service if it is empty, and the run systemctl daemon-reload to use the system on in /lib/systemd/system
2292 [21:44:56] <greycat> is /etc/systemd/system/nginx.service a regular file, and empty? or is it a symlink to /dev/null? or something else?
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2294 [21:45:15] <ALowther> greycat: It is a sym to /dev/null
2295 [21:45:20] <greycat> then someone masked it.
2296 [21:45:22] <somiaj> (oh yea forgot it links to /dev/null if masked?)
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2298 [21:45:44] <greycat> someone wanted nginx to be utterly incapable of starting (that's what mask is)
2299 [21:46:04] <greycat> so, either remove that symlink, or use "systemctl unmask nginx.service"
2300 [21:46:12] <ALowther> greycat: Hmmmm, would it be automasked on `apt remove nginx`?
2301 [21:46:20] <somiaj> nope
2302 [21:46:22] <ALowther> Only I've had access to this VPS. I definitely didn't mask it.
2303 [21:46:25] <greycat> I don't know what purging does with a mask.
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2305 [21:46:48] <greycat> oh, you didnm'
2306 [21:47:02] <greycat> oh, you didn't say "autoUNmasked" as I thought you did
2307 [21:47:15] <somiaj> maybe some script you ran to set something up masked it.
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2309 [21:47:42] <somiaj> either way at this point I would just unmask it and move on
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2311 [21:47:49] <greycat> if you have a timestamp on the symlink, that might be a clue to when it happened, but you might never figure out why
2312 [21:49:03] <Zambezi> somiaj, greycat: Your feedback is taken in consideration, if I need help again, I promise to be specific from the very first message.
2313 [21:49:40] <r4u1> help
2314 [21:49:46] <somiaj> !ask
2315 [21:49:47] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
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2326 [21:54:43] <jhutchins_wk> ALowther: Which release are you runnng?
2327 [21:54:58] <ALowther> Debian Buster
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2330 [21:57:03] <jhutchins_wk> I just realised that having available targets and symlinking them to the "active" directory, like what we do with Apache sites & modules, is pretty much an extension of how rc.d scripts worked.
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2340 [22:02:19] <ksk> sounds 1990 to me ;) /hides
2341 [22:02:21] <somiaj> jhutchins_wk: I kinda like that model over the foo.d modle that only reads .conf files, so files you don't want active you have to rename to .conf.something
2342 [22:02:58] <somiaj> plus allows more freedom on naming things, though sometimes I wish there was a better way to controll the order than 000-foo, 001-foo, and so on
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2348 [22:07:12] <ALowther> jhutchins_wk greycat somiaj: Thank you for your thoughts.
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2359 [22:12:42] <busch> What are the minimum hardware requirements for an debian 10 with apache2 for a downloadserver with no more than 5 concurrent connections? Can I possibly go as low as 256 or 128mb of memory?
2360 [22:13:08] <somiaj> you are gonna be not liking life with that little memeory
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2362 [22:13:26] <greycat> I wouldn't choose apache2 for a purely static web content server with minimal hardware as a core goal.
2363 [22:13:46] <somiaj> replaced-url
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2366 [22:14:14] <somiaj> minimum requirement is 256megs (though you can get away with less, it is going to be a pain to run a server without at least 512)
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2369 [22:14:56] <busch> Oh, I didn't see the official requirements. Then I will stick with 512MB
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2374 [22:15:23] <somiaj> and I would listen to greycat, there are far more light weight web servers than apache2
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2376 [22:15:58] <greycat> "all of them"
2377 [22:16:33] <busch> somiaj, apache2 is something my collegues and myself are familiar with. They are probably going to hate me if I do anything other than what we already have I our environment
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2380 [22:16:58] <jhutchins_wk> greycat: Maybe not iis.
2381 [22:17:28] <somiaj> busch: nginx isn't that different, and neither is lighthttpd, espically for a simple static server.
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2383 [22:18:37] <jhutchins_wk> Especially as you're not going to need all the apache module functionality.
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2386 [22:19:07] <busch> somiaj, Then I have to write specific documentation on that server. And I am not intested in writing documentation tomorrow :)
2387 [22:20:02] <busch> And: SSL/TLS settings can be very complex. I guess they differ on nginx or other webservers. So I have to maintain a template for that...
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2392 [22:21:35] <somiaj> took me about 20 mins to get nginx up with ssl
2393 [22:21:51] <somiaj> but either way, it will just help you survive off of less resources
2394 [22:22:04] <jaakkos> busch: there are so many people using nginx that you will most likely find 100% valid example configuration from vendors like AWS, Azure, etc...
2395 [22:22:33] <greycat> or even #debian
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2404 [22:26:07] <greycat> replaced-url
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2420 [22:32:11] <GenTooMan> tell me what some of the problems with AMD radeon graphics are? I noticed that the the graphics are messed up for the install DVD.
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2422 [22:32:52] <greycat> you probably need firmware. you might also need a newer version of Debian, depending on how bleeding-edge the hardware is.
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2426 [22:33:24] <GenTooMan> 10.2 install?
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2429 [22:34:00] <GenTooMan> It seems to mess up both graphic install and text install. Rather disappointing.
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2439 [22:36:17] <GenTooMan> I'm using pheonix bios with lenovo and updated the bios before starting.
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2442 [22:37:20] <somiaj> you can disable modesetting that sometimes helps
2443 [22:37:33] <somiaj> use the nomodeset boot parameter
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2450 [22:43:02] <GenTooMan> !dpkg nomodeset
2451 [22:43:11] <GenTooMan> !nomodeset
2452 [22:43:46] <greycat> !modesetting
2453 [22:43:46] <dpkg> Kernel Mode Setting (KMS) has graphical modes initialized by the Linux kernel instead of X. It is hardware dependent, introduced in Linux 2.6.29. Enabled via modprobe as of xserver-xorg-video-intel 2:2.9.1-2 and xserver-xorg-video-radeon 1:6.12.192-2. To disable, edit /etc/modprobe.d/{i915,radeon}-kms.conf or boot with the 'nomodeset' kernel command line parameter. replaced-url
2454 [22:43:49] <somiaj> its a kernel boot prameter you have to add to grub during the boot
2455 [22:43:59] <towo`> i would use the firmware-installer instead of disabling modesetting
2456 [22:44:34] <somiaj> Does the firmware installer contain gpu firmware too? I guess that makes sense but though it was mostly network cards.
2457 [22:44:39] <EdePopede> greycat, from apache's dsc (even on stretch): The result has long been the number one web server on the Internet.
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2460 [22:44:56] <EdePopede> apache's website still claims leadership :)
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2462 [22:45:22] <somiaj> might be a hard thing to quantify, but more and more static sites are switching to nginx
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2464 [22:46:06] <towo`> somiaj, it includes all distributable firmware, so even the gpu firmware
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2466 [22:46:47] <EdePopede> even more: if you use apache AND nginx in a proxy setup and loadbalancers, how do you count them?
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2470 [22:47:43] <somiaj> yea, that might be it, nginx is being used for proxies on vms not be accurate
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2472 [22:48:33] <nkuttler> i use nginx everywhere, i simply prefer the config syntax over apache httpd
2473 [22:48:40] <somiaj> Seems about 2014 apache started loosing to other servers, though wonder what microsfot did between 2014 and 2018 to gain so much percentage.
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2480 [22:50:14] <ksk> they gained percentage? :o
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2482 [22:50:31] <ksk> I think the point "apache2 might live behind an (nginx) proxy nowadays" is also valid.
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2485 [22:52:15] <busch> somiaj, Just a guess: Azure
2486 [22:53:51] <EdePopede> IIS on Wine on Linux? :) replaced-url
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2503 [22:58:41] <GenTooMan> towo` so basically add the firmware to a USB drive and hope the install CD picks it up. Maybe I shouldn't have done the net install DVD bleah.
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2506 [22:59:15] <somiaj> !firmware images
2507 [22:59:15] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from replaced-url
2508 [22:59:33] <somiaj> no use the unoffical firmware image, which the hope is comes with firmware for your amdgpu
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2521 [23:10:30] <GenTooMan> ok... now to see if it ever stops checksum checking (bleah)
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2525 [23:12:43] <bigterd> hm. seems i've lost 2 drives during a reshsape from raid5> raid6. it's still reshaping. should i interrupt or let it continue?
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2527 [23:13:01] <bigterd> kinda worried. the reason of the move was to prevent 2 failed drives!!!
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2534 [23:15:48] <noahmg123> Ok, so I got a new laptop and I want to install Linux on it. But I wanted to test out a few things first. So I took a USB stick and put Debian Live on it. However, it doesn't really work well. I got it to boot once, but when I tried to shut down, I got a error that said "soft lockup - cpu#5 suck for 22s". The error repeated a couple times, until I held down the power button to force it to turn off.
2535 [23:16:27] *** Joins: preview (~quassel@replaced-ip )
2536 [23:16:37] <GenTooMan> so graphic install and text install does the same thing with a different image. I used this image replaced-url
2537 [23:16:58] <somiaj> noahmg123: what cpu is in that laptop?
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2539 [23:17:36] <bigterd> replaced-url
2540 [23:17:50] <somiaj> GenTooMan: could still try to use nomodeset as a boot parameter, see if that lets you install with the text installer, from there get a newer kernel and firmware from backports to see if that works on your hardware
2541 [23:18:12] <noahmg123> somiaj: you mean like what processor does it have? It's an Intel Core i7-8565U
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2543 [23:18:25] <somiaj> noahmg123: and what gpu?
2544 [23:18:30] <bigterd> replaced-url
2545 [23:19:39] <noahmg123> somiaj: two GPUs, actually. Intel UHD Graphics 620, and an Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050.
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2549 [23:21:17] <somiaj> that could be an issue, linux (and debian in particular) has trouble working with optimus technology
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2552 [23:21:41] <somiaj> replaced-url
2553 [23:21:53] <somiaj> in short the easiest solution is to disable one of the gpus (if you can) in the firmware
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2555 [23:23:21] <noahmg123> Gross
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2559 [23:24:15] <somiaj> Anyways i've seen mixed sucess with getting debian to work with optimus gpus, read through that wiki, I have personally avoided such hardware.
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2561 [23:24:59] <towo`> even that intel gpu is needing non-free firmware for propper work
2562 [23:26:35] <towo`> and kernel 4.19.x could be not the best choice for the cpu
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2565 [23:26:56] <noahmg123> Will do. Another question. Are NVMe drives (with Linux installed) plug-and-boot, or is there more to do? I broke my old laptop's LCD screen, and it was falling apart anyway, so I bought my new laptop. But before the screen broke, I had upgraded to an NVMe drive. Could I just stick it in my new laptop and boot into Linux, or would there be more that needs to be done?
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2567 [23:27:21] <noahmg123> towo`: so what do you suggest for me any my situation (with the GPUs)?
2568 [23:27:34] <GenTooMan> So the disk I have in the drive is 32bit debian perhaps I can update to debian 10.2 64bit without much durress. It works at the moment.
2569 [23:27:43] <towo`> 1st, try a non-free image
2570 [23:27:57] <noahmg123> That's what I started with, actually
2571 [23:27:57] <somiaj> GenTooMan: there really isn't a simple way to do an update inplace from 32bit to 64bit
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2573 [23:28:15] <somiaj> GenTooMan: there are ways, but I woudln't suggest them. Use debootstrap from a live system that works would eb a more manual way to install debian
2574 [23:28:19] <noahmg123> (and by started with, I mean, that's the one I used)
2575 [23:28:28] <towo`> noahmg123, try a linux with a more recent kernel
2576 [23:28:32] <somiaj> GenTooMan: also what installer did you use to get the 32bit debian on that machine?
2577 [23:29:08] <noahmg123> towo`: where would I find that?
2578 [23:29:36] <GenTooMan> Well I got the system to at least albeit very slowly AND the graphics work.
2579 [23:29:46] <towo`> noahmg123, really? there are many distros, which have a recent kernel
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2582 [23:30:26] <towo`> noahmg123, sest a actual ubuntu, if it is working then you know, you need a more modern kernel
2583 [23:30:33] <towo`> s/sest/test
2584 [23:30:33] <noahmg123> I know, although a lot don't advertise, at least not clearly, what kernel they're using
2585 [23:30:41] <GenTooMan> somiaj Actually I took an older laptops disk from it and stuffed it into this laptop to preserve the current disk. It just so happens to heave stretch 9.8 on it.
2586 [23:30:49] <noahmg123> towo`: this is the image I used replaced-url
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2588 [23:31:08] <somiaj> GenTooMan: you could do something similar, pull the disk, use another machine to install, then get a newer kenrel on it and move it to the laptop.
2589 [23:31:22] <towo`> noahmg123, debian stable comes with kernel 4.19.x, which was released before your cpu was out
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2591 [23:31:34] <somiaj> GenTooMan: though if you can get a more modern live system to work, a manual install with debootstrap isn't to bad for one fmailr with linux and the cli
2592 [23:31:52] <noahmg123> towo`: Ok, what about Debian Testing?
2593 [23:32:09] <noahmg123> Or whichever one is one step down from testing?
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2595 [23:32:10] <somiaj> noahmg123: you can get a newer kernel in debian , 5.3 from buster-backports, but if you require a newer kernel it can be a pain to install for someone with out a decent amount of experience with linux.
2596 [23:32:14] <towo`> noahmg123, would be worth a test, but i don't like testing
2597 [23:32:26] <somiaj> noahmg123: usually we don't suggest testing, but use a backported kernel
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2599 [23:32:39] <somiaj> the install can be tricky if you can't get the installer to work like GenTooMan over there
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2601 [23:33:08] <noahmg123> somiaj: backported kernel?
2602 [23:33:21] <somiaj> !backports
2603 [23:33:22] <dpkg> A backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and <ABI> complications. replaced-url
2604 [23:33:40] <somiaj> debian provides some software backported to stable, the kernel is a big one, to allow more modern hardware on stable.
2605 [23:33:47] <towo`> somiaj, but then he has a hen egg problem
2606 [23:34:00] <somiaj> Yea, the install can be tricky
2607 [23:34:06] <towo`> for using backports, he need to manage an install with the stable kernel
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2609 [23:34:19] <A|an> Refresh my memory: Will installing (configure, make, install) a tar.gz file cleanly over-write a pre-existing installation, or do you have to track down every pre-existing scrape and delete it by hand?
2610 [23:34:25] <somiaj> and might require using a live system with a newer kernel and debootstrap (in general it is going to be difficult unless you know what you are doing)
2611 [23:34:54] <somiaj> A|an: it really depends on the source
2612 [23:35:06] <A|an> great
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2614 [23:35:07] <towo`> noahmg123, you can try to boot your debian with some acpi bootcodes
2615 [23:35:18] <joepublic> how could it not?
2616 [23:35:24] <somiaj> A|an: from the previous source you could run 'make uninstall' first, because if files change it may leave artifacts around
2617 [23:35:28] <noahmg123> somiaj: could you link to a tutorial of some sort that could help me set that up?
2618 [23:35:32] <somiaj> A|an: also tools like gnu stow can help with this too.
2619 [23:35:35] <noahmg123> towo`: hm? what do you mean?
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2621 [23:35:40] <A|an> thanks
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2623 [23:35:49] <somiaj> noahmg123: don't know one off the top of my head, but just look up, 'debootstrap install debian'
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2626 [23:37:30] <somiaj> but debian is sometimes not the best distro choice for bleeding edge hardware
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2631 [23:38:14] <towo`> somiaj, s/sometimes/often fixed that for you ;)
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2644 [23:45:18] <ryos_> debian is gud, ai laiket
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2650 [23:48:54] <noahmg123> somiaj: what distro would you suggest, then?
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2653 [23:50:27] <somiaj> I don't really know what disto runs well on new hardware, ubuntu comes to mind. You might be able to get debian to work, but it is going to require extra work which may not be in your tool kit
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2655 [23:51:12] <noahmg123> I've been using Linux for years now (although I haven't had to deal with hardware issues really)
2656 [23:51:41] <somiaj> anyways, you could try the debian installer, maybe it will work better than the live system.
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2661 [23:52:10] <somiaj> Just install a minimial system (no xorg or desktop). Maybe after that you can install the kernel and firmware from backports and be able to get things to work
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2663 [23:52:19] <somiaj> next is figure out xorg and how to deal with your dual gpu setup.
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2665 [23:53:07] <noahmg123> Do I really need to strip it down that much? Debian live works well. It's just that on shutdown, I get that error
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2667 [23:53:34] <somiaj> maybe you don't then, maybe you just need install the firmware and kernel from backports
2668 [23:53:42] <joepublic> iirc, debian live is cool-but-not-supported-nor-recommended and debian installer is all three?
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2670 [23:53:43] <somiaj> I always start from a minimial system personally
2671 [23:54:29] <noahmg123> all three what?
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2673 [23:54:41] <joepublic> cool, supported, and recommended
2674 [23:55:08] <noahmg123> Ah I see
2675 [23:56:15] <noahmg123> Also, I don't think my earlier question was answered. Can I put an NVMe drive (that has Linux on it) into my laptop and be good to boot? Or should I just pull do a fresh install of Linux onto it?
2676 [23:56:24] *** Quits: rainfyre (~rainfyre@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2677 [23:57:00] <ksk> noahmg123: debian install asks about if it should put just specific drivers or more generic ones into your kernel (initrd to be precise )
2678 [23:57:01] <somiaj> for the most part (provided the kernel supports your hardware and you can point your firmware at the drive to boot) yes
2679 [23:57:05] <ksk> if you choose the more genreic, it should work
2680 [23:58:20] <noahmg123> somiaj: It's from another computer with different hardware, so would there be drivers and such on there what would just be wasting space installed in the new machine?
2681 [23:58:23] *** Quits: macaronus (macaronus@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2682 [23:59:00] <joepublic> if you install a minimal system, add backports repository, and then install a newer kernel, you can run `tasksel` afterwards and select software to have in the full system
2683 [23:59:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1447
2684 [23:59:16] <somiaj> everything is contained in the kernel, so even if it uses different modules (Drivers) it will still work provided the hardware is supported by the kernel and as ksk pointed out, important modules are in the initrd image
2685 [23:59:39] <somiaj> noahmg123: so again in many cases it should work, but there are some 'ifs' there that could make it not work
2686 [23:59:43] <noahmg123> I see
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