22[00:27:08] <sponix> Yes.. I created ipt, and it is literally ipt/ipt user/group -- but for some reason my sponix/sponix and it can wonder in and out of each other stuff
24[00:27:39] <sponix> Let me check something.. I know ipt isn't in my sponix "group" .. but not 100% sure the other way around is true
25[00:27:48] <sponix> I had been drinking a bit when I did this last install/setup
26[00:28:17] <nvz> sponix: chmod -R 700 /home/*
27[00:28:44] <hummingbee> is the -R really a good idea there?
28[00:28:47] <nyov> ooh, -R, really?
29[00:29:00] <nvz> ok, well maybe not :P
30[00:29:07] <nvz> cause that would mess up ~/.ssh
31[00:29:09] <nvz> and such
32[00:29:20] <annadane> i thought regular users only could access their own HOME's
33[00:29:33] <nvz> only if they are 700 or 770
34[00:29:47] <annadane> huh
35[00:29:56] <nvz> they are 755 by default
36[00:30:04] <sponix> nvz: I found it.. they both shared a "users" group also. I took the ipt user out of that, and sudo as well -- It is an sftp upload only user, so doesn't need either of those
37[00:30:07] <nvz> 750 works too
38[00:30:29] <sponix> nvz: Okay, will go 700 on this if I don't already have the desired effect
39[00:31:15] <annadane> 7 is rwx, 5 is rw i believe
40[00:31:16] <nvz> sponix: as previously stated the -R I said is actually not a great idea..
41[00:31:34] * annadane needs to get a bit better at chmod
42[00:31:42] <nvz> sponix: just do chmod 700 /home/sponix
43[00:31:44] <sponix> nvz: yeah, just do a "chmod 700 /home/sponix"
65[00:41:00] <sponix> nvz: umm.. yeah that is pretty dumb security wise
66[00:41:53] *** Quits: co_arab90 (~co_arab90@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
67[00:41:58] <nvz> yeah well, the installer only allows creation of one user.. if you know enough to do more than that, you would be whats called an administrator who should know to change such things :D
73[00:45:24] <nyov> sponix: interesting, I thought /etc/login.defs would be canonical for that
74[00:45:53] <nvz> the default umask is 022 everywhere
75[00:45:59] <Miles8of9> i'm reading debian install guide... as i have only 1 hd, does it make sense to partition the entire disk "and set up LVM"?
76[00:46:01] <nvz> thats the default umask for all processes
77[00:46:25] *** Quits: annadane (~annadane@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
78[00:47:36] <nvz> Miles8of9: lvm can aid in at least two things.. 1) you can encrypt the lvm and thus only need to unlock that rather than each partition if you want encryption, the installer does this when you choose encrypted lvm, puts rootfs and swap inside an lvm and encrypts it.. 2) makes for easier changing later like expanding an FS onto another disk or such
79[00:47:44] <nyov> my /etc/login.defs says: # UMASK is the default umask value for pam_umask and is used by useradd and newusers to set the mode of the new home directories. 022 is the "historical" value in Debian for UMASK 027, or even 077, could be considered better for privacy
80[00:48:01] <nvz> Miles8of9: if neither of those things are of interest to you, lvm might not really make one bit of difference one way or the other
89[00:49:37] <Miles8of9> i think i won't use encrypted fs... maybe add a second hd in the future? hmm...
90[00:50:16] <nvz> Miles8of9: lvm allows for adding another physical disk to the LVM and stretching the logical volumes (partitions/filesystems) across multiple physical volumes
91[00:50:50] <WoC> does apt-file work on any other arch type than x86/amd64 ?
94[00:51:02] <nvz> Miles8of9: you can still use another disk at a later time without lvm, you just can't make a partition/fs span multiple disks.. you'd have to make it a seperate fs and mount it somewhere
97[00:51:42] <judd> Package apt-file (admin, optional) in buster/armhf: search for files within Debian packages (command-line interface). Version: 3.2.2; Size: 37.6k; Installed: 90k; Screenshot: replaced-url
98[00:51:49] <nvz> ,i apt-file --arch arm64
99[00:51:50] <judd> Package apt-file (admin, optional) in buster/arm64: search for files within Debian packages (command-line interface). Version: 3.2.2; Size: 37.6k; Installed: 90k; Screenshot: replaced-url
100[00:52:02] <nvz> WoC: why wouldn't it?
101[00:52:26] <WoC> for some reason, apt-file doesnt seem to work on ppc64, 'apt-file update' seems to run w/o issues but when you try serach, it's like the update never got saved
102[00:52:28] <nvz> WoC: if you mean searching an arch other than the installed one, well.. thats different :P
103[00:52:53] <WoC> Linux ZEUS 5.3.0-2-powerpc64 #1 SMP Debian 5.3.9-3 (2019-11-19) ppc64 GNU/Linux
127[00:57:46] <WoC> i reckon aarch64 will be more active next year
128[00:58:21] <Miles8of9> are you using a powermac g5?
129[00:58:27] <WoC> yup
130[00:58:52] <sponix> nvz: well.. I'm not pure Debian 10 either -- on MX, so it could be something they did also. It sticks pretty damn close to the baseline from what I've seen though
131[00:59:19] <WoC> the arm (64) based workstations are still too expensive for mere mortals
132[00:59:37] <nvz> !mx
133[00:59:37] <dpkg> from memory, mx is the Mail eXchanger resource record in DNS -- it tells an <MTA> where to deliver mail for a given domain. Merry Xmas, or Mexico. Si está buscando el canal de soporte para debian relativo a México, diríjase a #debian-mx
134[00:59:43] <nvz> !mxlinux
135[00:59:43] <dpkg> MX-18 Linux is based on Debian stretch; MX-19 is based on Debian buster. However, MX Linux is not supported in #debian. Seek help at replaced-url
136[01:00:10] <nvz> sponix: I can't imagine why people use that
142[01:01:59] <WoC> Miles8of9: installing from CD is the best way
143[01:02:24] <Miles8of9> that was another question... it can't boot from usb
144[01:02:30] <sponix> nvz: yeah, you didn't need to hit me with that. But if you want to know some of the advantages, I can link you to a well written review, if you will give it a read :)
146[01:02:57] <WoC> unless the force is with you... if so, it may be possible to install from usb stick. Never figured out the openfirmware device name so i could not
147[01:03:23] <nvz> sponix: I'm not going to right now, but yeah, I wouldnt mind knowing wth someone would use a distro based on the universal OS, that has virtually no support community..
148[01:03:27] <WoC> it CAN boot from usb, but it takes some voodoo to figure out the device name
149[01:03:47] <nvz> sponix: cause we sure as shit aren't going to pickup the slack for them or anyone else who uses debian to spinoff a distro
152[01:04:24] <nyov> nvz, plot twist: you already did
153[01:04:27] <Miles8of9> i could bring back to life my g5... :D
154[01:04:33] <nvz> sponix: cause I know why I use debian, its all in the Why Debian and Social Contract documents on debian.org and right here in front of your eyes :P
155[01:04:56] <nvz> nyov: heh
156[01:04:57] *** Quits: om_chat_saja (~androirc@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
164[01:05:58] <Miles8of9> if i remember correctly it's a radeon card
165[01:06:05] <nvz> nyov: only non-debian thing I really see valid for most support is armbian.. cause they actually do use our packages unmodified.. their repos have like a dozen packages total.. kernel, drivers, thats about it.. as long as the questions arent about hardware or the installer, its applicable
173[01:07:33] <WoC> Miles8of9: you can change it, but if you do, you may lose the console in openfirmware
174[01:07:41] <Miles8of9> no gui? what browser do you use? lynx ??
175[01:07:51] <nvz> sponix: the questions you asked were vague general questions and you were satisfied with answers in kind.. you didnt draw me out into supporting something I couldnt reproduce
176[01:07:51] <WoC> not to mention, hard to get a compat card
209[01:20:58] <Miles8of9> i loved that g5 so much... until apple abandoned it... 6 months before it was on the apple store high priced.. 6 months later it was litterally garbage..
210[01:21:08] *** Quits: koniu (~koniu@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
218[01:35:46] <sponix> Miles8of9: outside of uefi mode being required for some obscure vm pcie passthrough stuff -- there isn't a whole ton of difference IMHO :)
219[01:36:10] <sponix> Miles8of9: If you have UEFI, might as well boot the installer that way, and do UEFI
220[01:36:32] <Miles8of9> how do i know if i have uefi?
222[01:37:08] <sponix> Miles8of9: most plaster UEFI at the top of the BIOS screen for starters. And there there are boot modes to enable different levels of it in there also :)
223[01:37:33] <sponix> Miles8of9: might as well set OS type "other" and Secure Boot off while you are in there
225[01:38:36] *** Quits: Space_Man (~Space_Man@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
226[01:39:43] <Miles8of9> so... i hit f2 at boot and set uefi options there?
227[01:40:19] <sponix> Miles8of9: if that is the key to enter your boards UEFI/BIOS system -- yes
228[01:40:51] <sponix> for some reason they can't come together and make a "standard" for what that key is. My Asus X99 board will accept like 3 or 4 different keys lol
229[01:40:51] <Miles8of9> hmm maybe i don't have uefi... it's a normal blue screen with black text... :D
230[01:41:14] <sponix> Miles8of9: if you have no mouse support -- Yeah, not likely UEFI
231[01:41:30] <Miles8of9> noo no no no... no mouse there!
232[01:41:55] <nyov> on a ppc? you don't :D
233[01:42:58] <Miles8of9> my ppc is sleeping in a box in the basement... -_-
234[01:43:56] *** Quits: bertbob (~bertbob@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
235[01:43:57] <Miles8of9> when i switched it off for the last time there was no more software for it... osx leopard if i remember
236[01:44:47] <sponix> nyov: hmm, I wasn't tracking what type of rig/arch we are working with. Keep forgetting Debian does a load of them
237[01:44:54] <Miles8of9> it also produced a nice amount of heat that really helped warming the room on winter :D
238[01:45:03] <sponix> Miles8of9: So, you are wanting to install Debian on a PPC Mac ?
239[01:45:28] <Miles8of9> sponix, no, plain amd-radeon pc.. :D
264[02:09:57] <somiaj> hmm, I have two files that appear to be linked (maybe hard links) but how would I check this, I don't see anything in ls -l that seems to state they are linked
266[02:10:50] <sponix> somiaj: I haven't used a hard link in forever. it should have some attribute in ls -l though I would think.. similar to the soft links
267[02:12:22] <somiaj> I haven't ever used hard links, but if I edit one file, the other changes, but I don't see anything noticiable in ls -l
343[02:38:45] <whislock> I think it's more to syntactically differentiate between a file name and a package name.
344[02:39:23] <WhispersInAkarra> Isn't a package a file?
345[02:40:01] <LaurentDumont> You can install the deb with dpkg but you might be missing dependencies so you might end up needing `apt-get install -f` still.
346[02:40:02] <whislock> apt install vim tells apt to retrieve the vim deb from the package mirror specified for your system.
347[02:40:15] <whislock> apt install ./vim.deb tells apt to directly install the deb in the current working directory.
348[02:40:44] <LaurentDumont> I was using dpkg before for single deb installs but switched to the apt method. No issues so far ;)
349[02:41:18] <whislock> It all goes to dpkg in the end, but apt resolves dependencies for you.
381[02:53:11] <dpkg> "Does anyone have X or use Y?" is taking a poll, not asking a good question that IRC helpers can answer. Don't do it or sussudio's army of militant badgers will hurt you. Also see <ask> and <bad polls>.
389[02:54:30] <irked> nvz your poll reminds me of the non completeness theorem
390[02:54:44] *** Lord_of_Life_ is now known as Lord_of_Life
391[02:55:33] <nvz> !factinfo poll
392[02:55:33] <dpkg> poll -- last modified at Sat May 15 07:58:49 2004 by dondelelcaro!~don@archimedes.ucr.edu; it has been requested 401 times, last by nvz, 2m 22s ago; it has been locked by .
405[02:57:53] <rander2> without X and with only one tty
406[02:58:17] <nvz> rander2: so type systemctl default and see what happens :P
407[02:58:24] <irked> render2 usually it helps to paste the specs into a code share thingy so someone who knows can tell u what to do, or your problems, then to paste the link here
408[02:58:39] <nvz> not comming up to your graphical display manager login doesn't mean it doesnt start up
409[02:58:46] <nvz> thats two totally different things
410[02:58:47] <rander2> I must go out
411[02:58:52] <rander2> I'm from irssi
412[02:58:57] <irked> yeh you probably dont have gdm or whatnot set up properly
413[02:59:08] <rander2> have irssi a shell ?
414[02:59:22] <irked> did you install your x stuff post-install?
456[03:09:27] <judd> No package named 'xddm' was found in buster/amd64.
457[03:09:30] <irked> nvz im hoping for the best
458[03:09:32] <rander2> I have gdm
459[03:09:38] <irked> oh sorry i meant gdm
460[03:09:42] <irked> my apologies
461[03:09:57] <irked> ok so you've got gnome installed but the system boots to terminal instead of gdm?
462[03:09:57] * nvz doesn't have gdm either uses lightdm
463[03:10:24] <LaurentDumont> There is nothing wrong with Openstack itself. It's just a massive beast that is a bit too big for most use-cases.
464[03:10:28] <nvz> and you'd do systemctl start gdm
465[03:10:35] <LaurentDumont> And it requires a lot of planning/admin stuff after.
466[03:10:40] <nvz> but you can't do that from single user
467[03:10:46] <LaurentDumont> Coupled with a user-experience that is subpar at best.
468[03:10:49] <nvz> hence why I said systemctl default :P
469[03:11:12] <irked> LaurentDumont, yeh the ubuntu guys over the phone told me that; they said i need about 8 servers etc. and i realised back then years ago i might in fact need to do some courses first.
552[03:44:14] <nvz> whislock: they came in saying their system wasnt booting and they were on irssi from rescue console.. I said do systemctl default and see what happens, they said it cause the machine to boot to their desktop
555[03:44:36] <rander2> nvz, no, my system boot normaly only in restore mode
556[03:44:51] <nvz> so it was likely just a quirk that it didnt boot. there is no reason the system shouldnt boot normally if it works doing systemctl default from recovery mode
557[03:45:20] <nvz> rander2: have you tried booting since the last time it didnt work?
560[03:46:11] <nvz> rander2: and did the systemctl default cause your machine to go to the gdm login or did you have to do something else after that?
561[03:46:22] <rander2> it's the same, I boot in restore mode as root, after systemctl restore, and start X . Before I was from tty1 with irssi
562[03:46:26] <somiaj> So I'm running a server on a vm (hidden from the outside world) with an ngnix passthrough, for the most part this works, but the server needs to be able to talk to itself, is there a way I can forward 433 to 80 for traffic comming from the server?
563[03:46:31] <nvz> for all I know you have the gdm service disabled or broken
564[03:47:03] <nvz> rander2: you mean you're typing the command startx ?
565[03:47:17] <nvz> rander2: or that X is starting when you type systemctl default?
566[03:47:26] <irked> somiaj, probably using iptables
567[03:47:28] <rander2> but if I boot normally , the screen is black and the virtual consoles don't go, so the system is unusable
568[03:47:58] <nvz> rander2: sounds like a graphics issue.. what graphics card? lspci -nn | nc termbin.com 9999
569[03:47:59] <somiaj> irked: that is what I was thinking, but i know sometimes local trafic is dealt with differently.
601[03:57:20] <nvz> idk, nothing is coming to mind why a machine that was working suddenly isnt booting normally yet will systemctl default and load normally from rescue mode
602[03:57:23] <irked> rander2, as a matter of fact i got debian 6 to run on a very similar system back in those days
603[03:57:44] <rander2> asus did a pretty crap
604[03:58:08] <nvz> if I werent preoccupied I'd compare the kernel commandline for recovery and normal boot
605[03:58:22] <irked> this is out of character for me but i suggest you just re-install debian 10 and you choose the xfce package DURING install not POST-INSTALL
606[03:58:30] <irked> and if that doesnt work, i dont know
607[03:58:33] <irked> but that worked for me.
608[03:58:58] <nvz> that should no more make a difference than booting normal or recovery and systemctl default
609[03:59:14] <irked> strangely enough , it worked for me
610[03:59:26] <irked> and that's why i agree and disagree with you nvz
611[03:59:28] <nvz> either the kernel or systemd is messed up.. possibly due to modifying of the grub commandline
612[03:59:45] <rander2> irked, It had a pre-installed ubuntu 12.04 LTS 32bit with a strange fat32 partition, after I discover the fat32 had a bloob proprietary video driver
613[03:59:52] <nvz> question is, what did you mess with and whats the difference between the two commandlines
614[04:00:04] <irked> oh its an old ubuntu lts
615[04:00:10] <irked> that explains it
616[04:01:02] <irked> rander2 honestly i got debian 6 to work fine on that gen of computer, and type
617[04:01:28] <rander2> I have deb10 amd64 now, the video card is supported with another driver. This netbook have a integrated gma3600 gpu, but the driver is gma500.
618[04:01:31] <irked> anyway i know the correct approach is to fix what's broken but i think its a new install nvz
636[04:06:25] <nvz> you'd like anyone giving you an excuse to procrastinate
637[04:06:25] <nyov> irked is irked
638[04:06:44] <irked> tell me about it..
639[04:06:49] <rander2> irked, gma500 was integrated in N450 , gma3600 and gma3650 are mode modern, they were integrated in N2600 and N2800 cpu
640[04:06:51] <whislock> rander2: The only reason the gma500 module is there is because the standard open source intel drivers don't work for PowerVR SGX 535 stuff.
641[04:06:59] <nvz> irked: so let me give you some wisdom of the contemporary philosopher Ellen DeGeneres... Procrastinate now, or you'll never get around to it
642[04:07:13] <whislock> rander2: GMA3600 uses the intel drivers; GMA500 doesn't.
643[04:07:17] <irked> :)
644[04:07:21] <irked> i like this chatroom bigtime
722[04:58:48] <nvz> they are failing to copy VERBATIM commands from the website
723[04:59:05] <nvz> when they're not meant to be copied, they're meant to be interpreted
724[04:59:43] <nvz> they wind up here cause they're using kali linux and a chat client the other special kind of idiots who make kali, are too dumb to modify our packages
778[05:32:19] <wikan> well today I strased lxc-start and I get know that at some moment of running unprivileged container... "command" file (unix socket in a container directory) should be created
786[05:33:42] *** Quits: Shahnaz_ (~Shahnaz@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
787[05:33:43] <ksk> !problem
788[05:33:43] <dpkg> somebody said problem was something that can be solved, fixed or worked around if properly described. A good thorough description of the problem, with detailed steps of how to reproduce the problem, the produced output, and the expected output, is the best start to discuss a problem.
789[05:33:51] <wikan> lxc-start and I get standard waiting for demonize error and after I strace it then I can see error below
796[05:36:46] <ksk> also, I dont really get your strace - what is that "/home/wikan/.local/share/lxc/ff/command" supposed to be in the first place?
797[05:37:22] <wikan> /home/wikan/.local/share/lxc/ff/command it seems to be a unix socket to communicate with a container
798[05:37:32] <ksk> cuz, for me (like the default) you place containers at "~/.local/share/lxc/$CONTAINER/" - and this path normally has things like "config" or a folder "rootfs"
799[05:37:36] <wikan> uploading logs...
800[05:37:52] <wikan> ksk exactly
801[05:38:19] <wikan> and "partials" and "userfs" or something like it
803[05:39:18] <ritalinona> I'm on debian 10 (host), and I have a debian 10 vm that I've been trying to use a vpn on. I can connect successfully on the vpn (btw I'm doing this via the terminal) but after connecting to the vpn I can no longer resolve domains, but I can still resolve ips. I made sure to install resolvconf, and I added my main ethernet connection to /etc/network/interfaces, but thats the extent of my networking troubleshooting and I don't know what else
804[05:39:19] <ritalinona> to do from here
805[05:39:28] <ksk> okay, straced a successfull attach command, it does indeed connect to that "command" file
809[05:40:24] <ksk> wikan: I can then only encourage you to maybe start fresh, and then post all relevant files. /etc/lxc/* ~/.local/share/lxc/foo/config, /etc/subuid and subgid
810[05:40:31] <whislock> ritalinona: When you're not connected to the VPN, what nameserver is the system using?
811[05:41:15] <wikan> ksk - working on it
812[05:42:30] <ritalinona> whislock: the ip of my router
813[05:42:45] <whislock> ritalinona: And that is?
814[05:42:58] <ritalinona> 192.168.4.2
815[05:43:07] <whislock> And what IP space is the VPN using inside?
816[05:43:29] <ksk> wikan: anything in dmesg by chance (looking at you, apparmor!)
817[05:44:10] <ritalinona> 10.66.61.24/24
818[05:44:37] <whislock> Alright, and what routes are being pushed by the VPN? Does it also push a nameserver?
822[05:45:32] <ritalinona> it doesn't puts a nameserver (at least while looking at /etc/resolv.conf) and idk about the first question
823[05:45:38] <ritalinona> oh wait sec
824[05:45:58] <wikan> ksk, why pastebin.com is hated?
825[05:46:09] <nvz> dpkg, pastebin.com?
826[05:46:09] <dpkg> pastebin.com mangles input, takes forever to load, is full of js, often makes us enter a CAPTCHA to see your paste and fills the screen with ads. Please use a different site, like replaced-url
831[05:47:12] <nvz> there is almost no chance of me accessing a pastebin.com url
832[05:47:28] <ksk> wikan: mhhm, you kind of provided nothing I asked for
833[05:47:31] <nvz> apparently they do have raw urls but you can't figure out what that url is from the normal url
834[05:47:38] <whislock> ritalinona: ?
835[05:47:44] <wikan> i am working on it :)
836[05:47:56] <themill> the raw URLs can still require you to answer a captcha sometimes
837[05:47:57] <nyov> ritalinona: what whislock is saying is, once the VPN is up, your /etc/resolv.conf needs to have a nameserver entry in the VPN address space, that it can connect to
838[05:48:09] <nvz> themill: ew
839[05:48:15] <wikan> ksk, now you need dmesg, and config files - right?
840[05:48:23] <whislock> nyov: Not necessarily.
841[05:48:32] <whislock> It depends on the routes that are being pushed.
842[05:48:38] <ksk> wikan: thats what I could think of at the late hour, yes.
843[05:48:42] <nyov> whislock: ok
844[05:49:08] <ritalinona> I'm having a hard time determining what routes are being added by the vpn
888[06:06:16] <wikan> i have even tried to add my local directory to the apparmor list
889[06:06:50] <wikan> btw: with nesting, and without nesting it doesnt work
890[06:06:55] <wikan> the same error
891[06:07:24] <ksk> is there a reason you have three entries for "lxc.mount.auto"?
892[06:07:26] *** Quits: os__ (~androirc@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
893[06:07:46] <ksk> apart from "are your id mappings correct?" I think thats the only difference to my config
894[06:08:52] <wikan> lxc.mout.auto - I copied it because i have tried everything (simple idea - if it will work I will try to figure out what this line means)
895[06:09:16] <wikan> id mappings is correct but i check it again - why not :)
898[06:10:29] <ritalinona> whislock, I tried added several ips different ips from the routes the were added when the vpn is started to /etc/resolv.conf but still nothing has changed. also those ips keep changing
899[06:10:47] <wikan> i count digits to be sure it is 100000 for sure
900[06:11:25] <wikan> ksk, maybe i should delete global config file?
921[06:21:17] <wikan> lxc developer said "i know that configuring lcx is a nightmare" - i agree :D
922[06:23:05] <wikan> i think... my case is the case he mentioned by words "you cant just run unprivileged container as a unprivileged user because first you have to prepare your environment as a root"
923[06:23:20] <wikan> but I don't know how to prepare my environment :|
924[06:25:05] <wikan> so i am very close to offer d*k sucking for any help :DD
933[06:34:14] <nyov> ritalinona: is your tunnel endpoint a private/company server, or a vpn provider? and is it an ipsec or openvpn tunnel?
934[06:34:46] <ritalinona> its a vpn provider and it's openvpn
935[06:36:05] <nyov> ritalinona: then your provider should have given you a config? check that /etc/openvpn/client..something (forgot the path) has a 'client' directive - essentially it *should* pull and update your local nameserver
952[06:44:11] <nyov> ritalinona: can you add these lines to your client config file:? replaced-url
953[06:45:06] <ritalinona> holly shit, duh
954[06:45:38] <nyov> ritalinona: assuming you have a file /etc/openvpn/update-resolv-conf, I believe this is the glue that should make resolvconf update the dns
1011[07:51:58] <Paddy^> virtualization for home users was virtualbox for me so far. but the debian way strongly suggests the use of kvm via qemu, is that correct so far?
1012[07:54:02] <diogenes_> Paddy^, libvirt.
1013[07:54:21] <Paddy^> and for that to work i would need to turn my host operating system into a router because the guests only work via nat?
1023[08:02:47] <SerajewelKS> Paddy^: user networking requires no changes
1024[08:03:16] <karlpinc> Paddy^: The host does have to route, as far as I know, because the only network path is through the host. I wouldn't think the host has to nat. You could assign a subnet to all the hosts's VMs and route the subnet.
1025[08:03:28] <nyov> Paddy^: nothing wrong with using virtualbox on debian - unless you want to run KVM in parallel, that won't work
1026[08:04:21] <SerajewelKS> karlpinc: user mode and bridging IIRC don't require ip_forward but others do
1027[08:04:57] <Paddy^> i tried a few things with bridged networking until i saw mentions that there are unfixed problems in buster
1028[08:05:27] <Paddy^> i wanted to avoid nat because it could influence my "networking tests" in a negative way
1029[08:05:29] <SerajewelKS> Paddy^: what problems are those? i bridge KVM and VPN tap interfaces to physical interfaces on buster without problems.
1030[08:06:06] <Paddy^> pity. i re-installed the host in the meantime without keeping the logs
1031[08:07:07] <Paddy^> but the advice is kvm and qemu
1032[08:07:23] <SerajewelKS> i've had to work around some specific ethernet driver issues that bridging exposed, but the problem was in the driver and unrelated to bridging
1043[08:08:53] <SerajewelKS> annadane: what do you mean?
1044[08:09:08] <annadane> you have to put what the OS is, or 'generic default'
1045[08:09:15] <annadane> it doesn't let you continue with vm creation otherwise
1046[08:09:26] <SerajewelKS> vbox does the same, i think it's to set some sensible defaults
1047[08:09:45] <SerajewelKS> "generic default" means "i don't want any sensible defaults"
1048[08:10:10] <annadane> fair i guess but it's a bit weird in debian stable to like, say you're installing openbsd 6.6, the newest available is openbsd 6.3
1049[08:10:13] <annadane> or whatever it is
1050[08:10:41] <SerajewelKS> i mean unless the hardware profile changed that much between 6.3 and 6.6 then i'd think choosing 6.3 would be fine
1051[08:11:44] <SerajewelKS> an example of how it changed on vbox: if you chose debian linux you'd get virtio network hardware, but if you chose windows you'd get e1000-compatible virtualized hardware instead.
1052[08:11:59] <annadane> okay, fair, i guess i'm just a pigheaded moron
1053[08:12:11] <epony> It's NEVER fine, old software = failure in the single most useful goal of having an updated software and relative confidence in software correctness (up to the moment of the latest release)
1054[08:12:24] <SerajewelKS> that might be going a bit too far... more likely they should explain what the option is for :)
1055[08:12:33] <epony> With OpenBSD you MUST use latest release. Installing and outdated release is BAD advice.
1056[08:13:09] * SerajewelKS rolls his eyes
1057[08:13:11] <whislock> epony: The advice wasn't to install an old release. It was to select the closest VBox profile to the version you're installing.
1058[08:13:47] <SerajewelKS> in this case virt-manager not vbox, but yeah
1059[08:13:59] <whislock> Or that, yeah.
1060[08:14:09] <epony> virt-manager (for libvirt) is a much better alternative than VBox
1061[08:14:23] <whislock> epony: According to your opinion.
1062[08:14:29] <whislock> epony: Read before reacting.
1063[08:14:34] <epony> did not realise you were speaking about VM software profiles, they all suck
1064[08:14:53] <epony> whislock, according to many other opinions, vbox is sucky
1065[08:15:00] <whislock> epony: The plural of anecdote is not data.
1066[08:15:00] *** Quits: torbo`` (~user@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1067[08:15:19] <epony> whislock, I've heard this line from you another time, and it was not correctly applied then too.
1068[08:15:34] <whislock> epony: You'll hear it from me many more times if you keep it up. :)
1069[08:15:59] <epony> whislock, I'll not hear from you again, because I don't read your lines.
1070[08:16:00] <whislock> epony: anecdote, n., an account regarded as unreliable or hearsay.
1071[08:16:10] <epony> whislock, buz off
1072[08:16:19] <whislock> epony: You relaying "many opinions" is the definition of hearsay.
1073[08:16:57] <epony> no, and don't care about your objection
1075[08:17:23] <whislock> Take it up with the dictionary, let me know how that goes.
1076[08:17:47] <epony> you take it up to vbox people and tell them their software is not very useful
1077[08:17:59] <whislock> epony: Another opinion.
1078[08:18:09] <epony> whislock, and a dicktionary to go with it
1079[08:22:37] <whislock> epony: Hey, if it helps you with basic communications skills, then at least your presence in this channel won't be ENTIRELY pointless.
1080[08:23:48] <pie3> anyone familiary with python?
1130[08:46:38] <Katana_Steel> pie3, It's more of an introduction to the for loop than the dict type, and as such just think of items() as a special function that returns a list of pairs
1131[08:47:06] <Katana_Steel> (If you just want to get through the example)
1132[08:47:59] <pie3> "for user, status in users.copy().items():"
1133[08:48:04] <pie3> what is meaning of this?
1134[08:48:17] <pie3> normally syntax is like this , right? for X in Y:
1135[08:48:40] <pie3> here is bit strange: for X,Y in X.Copy().items():
1136[08:48:42] <pie3> so confused
1137[08:48:47] <whislock> pie3: It's easier to think of lists and dicts are two kinds of a 'collection.'
1141[08:49:21] <pie3> list is single column(normally), while collection as double column?
1142[08:49:23] <whislock> A dictionary is more complex. Instead of a collection of one item, its a collection of pairs. Each pair has a key, and a value.
1143[08:49:25] <pie3> sorry dict
1144[08:49:49] <whislock> .items() returns each pair at a time. The key goes into the first variable, and the value goes in the second.
1145[08:50:08] <whislock> So 'for key, value in myDict.items():' is a good conceptual example.
1146[08:50:26] <Katana_Steel> And .copy() is like list[:]
1147[08:51:05] <pie3> can you explain me thru the same example shown earlier:... words = ['cat', 'window', 'defenestrate']
1148[08:51:19] <pie3> >>> for w in words:
1149[08:51:26] <pie3> i am still confused
1150[08:51:33] <Katana_Steel> I'm sure dict is explained later though
1151[08:51:37] <pie3> yes
1152[08:51:57] <creepy> hi all
1153[08:53:26] <Katana_Steel> Book = {"author": "Terry Pratchett", "title": "discworld"}
1179[09:02:52] <creepy> kyros: that's what I did, I followed all steps but...finally it doesn't work due to this problem. just reminder Iam using 8.11v(I guess jessie)
1180[09:03:08] <Kyros> ooh
1181[09:03:18] <Kyros> id try diogenes_'s advice and just download it directly
1182[09:03:45] <creepy> Idon' get you sorry
1183[09:04:22] <Kyros> go download it from here replaced-url
1184[09:04:59] <creepy> oops I missed comment of our friend diogenes_
1366[11:18:21] <dataCobra> Hello everyone, I've got a question. libvirt is starting the virbrigdes after my nftables.service so my service is stopping because he can't find my virbr0 interface that I setup in the nftables.conf. Is there a way to fix this issue?
1387[11:29:14] <Lope> I've just booted live debian non-free and can't connect to any of my wireless networks, I just get deauthed. I've tried using the internal wireless adapter as well as a USB one.
1398[11:36:28] <soul-d> Lope, not sure if the names are still up todate since this was begining wifi but you need a sniffer on a wireless card in monitor mode air-snort aircrack airodump
1399[11:36:41] <soul-d> something along those lines
1486[12:19:13] <abff> Can I please get some assistance with setting up my nvidia driver? I just finished installing Debian Buster, and I am getting errors when instructing apt to install the driver for my GPU. I tried to use aptitude to resolve the dependancies more forceuflly but those dependencies are listed as (UNAVAILABLE)
1487[12:21:03] <dataCobra> abff: can you paste the command that you execute with apt?
1488[12:21:10] <abff> yes
1489[12:22:09] <abff> sudo apt-get install nvidia-legacy-390xx-driver; this is what I used initially, I tried adding -f after install as well as using aptitude instead
1490[12:22:50] <dataCobra> abff: did you install nvidia-detect and use it beforehand?
1491[12:22:58] <abff> If I browse throught aptitude and look at the packages the driver is dependent on they are listed unavailable
1492[12:23:08] <abff> yes, I did
1493[12:23:20] <ratrace> dataCobra: sorry I don't use nftables.
1494[12:24:01] <ratrace> dataCobra: perhaps consider not using nftables, and let libvirt deal with iptables itself. OR... configure nftables to start after virbr nics are set up.
1496[12:24:18] <dataCobra> ratrace: no problem. Nftables is not the problem. :) It's just I dont know how to make the service wait for libvirt to be started
1497[12:24:27] <ratrace> nftabels aren't the future btw, there's talk of going full ebpf for packet filtering, instead of nftables. I wouldn't bother with that.
1516[12:29:52] <dataCobra> abff: if you use non-free contrib should be there always
1517[12:30:12] <dataCobra> abff: if you use non-free, contrib should be there always
1518[12:30:12] <srged> I tested my ssd read speed in two different ways and got very different results, can anyone explain? replaced-url
1519[12:30:23] <dataCobra> ratrace: thank you. :) I will try that
1520[12:30:37] <abff> dataCobra: I have one last question but it's much further out of scope, it's trying to install all of the packages for amd64 and i386, do I need both versions? I don't want to install 55 packages if I can do 27 instead
1540[12:36:06] <ratrace> dataCobra: btw, just a bit of warning, if you reschedule nftables to run later, you'll have that period in which your NICs are not packet-filtered, and it's also possible nftables won't start at all, if the virbr device never appears...
1548[12:38:16] <dataCobra> abff: I would consider also to install the drivers directly from nvidia, but this is a bit to much for a debian beginner. But keep this in mind if you discover some problems while playing.
1574[12:46:49] *** Quits: ghost43 (~daer@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1575[12:47:02] <dataCobra> maybe this gets overwritten by libvirt?!
1576[12:47:05] <ratrace> dataCobra: one more thing, perhaps you also need BindsTo=sys-devices-virtual-net-virbr1.device as well, so it doesn't even attempt to schedule it before the device is available
1586[12:49:05] <Lope2> With a debian 10 buster kde-plasma live non-free USB I can't connect to any WPA2 networks. I tried the internal wireless adapter and 3 USB adapters.
1587[12:49:16] <Lope2> If I try a live Ubuntu USB, no problems.
1588[12:49:26] <Lope2> On the same hardware and same networks
1589[12:49:31] <ratrace> Lope2: sounds like KDE issue, not Debian. I can use WPA2 just fine with wpa_supplicant
1590[12:50:10] <dataCobra> ratrace: Ubuntu is not Debian
1591[12:50:13] <NetTerminalGene> Lope2, official debian doesn't install non-free firmware by default
1592[12:50:17] <dataCobra> ratrace: sorry wrong link
1593[12:50:31] <NetTerminalGene> you may need to install non free firmware
1594[12:50:42] <Lope2> NetTerminalGene, there are debian live USB's that are non-free (comes with firmware)
1595[12:50:47] <dataCobra> Lope2: Ubuntu is not Debian. Like NetTerminalGene says Debian is using only free firmware by default
1596[12:50:51] <Lope2> I've definitely got all the non-free firmware installed.
1597[12:51:04] <Lope2> I'm well aware that ubuntu is not debian, thanks :)
1608[12:52:56] <ratrace> that said, some wifi NICs are just too stubborn, even if you give it all the firmware it wants, sometimes the hardware and firmware is just buggy like that
1609[12:53:03] *** Joins: todi (~todi4@replaced-ip)
1611[12:53:23] <ratrace> jim: yeah, the "can you try with spa_wupplicant directly?" suggestion :)
1612[12:54:15] <Lope2> ratrace, well I kind of eliminated the need to do that with a shortcut.
1613[12:54:39] <Lope2> I just disabled all encryption on the network and then only the internal wireless adapter was able to connect, none of the USB adapters were.
1614[12:54:46] <NetTerminalGene> Lope2, when you select a wifi connection, does it allow you to enter password
1615[12:55:01] <Lope2> It shows that they're authenticated, then they just get deauthed.
1623[12:56:12] <ratrace> Lope2: uhhh no you didn't :)
1624[12:56:13] <NetTerminalGene> Lope2, set up password in network manager
1625[12:56:14] <Lope2> NetTerminalGene, yes it asks for a password
1626[12:56:17] *** Quits: todi (~todi4@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
1627[12:56:26] <Lope2> NetTerminalGene, I've tried that
1628[12:56:41] <ratrace> Lope2: wpa_supplicant is the defacto tool for wifi, even the NM and other fancy GUI tools are using it via dbus in the background
1630[12:57:32] <Lope2> ratrace, yeah, I know. But I'm saying it's not practical to use it manually when going to coffee shops etc.
1631[12:57:50] <NetTerminalGene> Lope2, i mean set up it in network manager settings
1632[12:58:32] <ratrace> Lope2: I never said it was, this was just to troubleshoot... I've seen with GNOME and NM using wpa_supplicant via dbus failing, while manually configurig and using it directly, working.
1633[12:58:33] <Lope2> NetTerminalGene, yes, I've done that, when you open the network-manager GUI and change wireless network settings
1634[12:58:52] <NetTerminalGene> :/
1635[12:58:52] <Lope2> ratrace, ah, I see.
1636[12:59:27] <jim> Lope2, so what's different between debian and (the working) ubuntu? are the firmware files different? the driver? I guess you could at least compare versions... also, howbout wpa-supplicant? in all these, do the binaries match according to cmp?
1723[13:46:32] *** Quits: zamuro (~Samantha@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1724[13:46:50] <EdePopede> with multiple systems on a gpt disk, wouldn't it be better to have an extra boot partition somewhere between efi, swap, and the system partitions?
1726[13:48:45] <sponix> EdePopede: I just do one 256MB /EFI as fat32, and let my /boot be on the / (root) partition (I don't split that off)... BUT, I do a separate /home so when I need to reinstall the OS 98% of my stuff is still already configured when I return
1728[13:51:51] <EdePopede> sponix: EFI is 511MB (i just like clean alignments) followed by swap and / - i even have an extra /boot on this single boot system, and wanted to play with some more stuff on the other machine. including parallel installs of busters which may break as long as they don't affect the other ones or the system in general
1752[14:00:36] <EdePopede> i have here 2 kernels, 26MB each. 1GB is more than enough for some more of them. but i also may install memtest on the other one, and what not. and iirc at least this one also goes into /boot? so according to that article 12GB Swap would be ok for my 8GB RAM even with the hibernation option. i don't think i'll add more of it in the near future.
1765[14:07:39] <ratrace> EdePopede: swap > total RAM is needlessly big. if you'll ever need swap bigger than RAM that means you're in a serious overcommit mode and risking swapstorms that will grind you to a halt
1773[14:13:33] <EdePopede> ratrace: that's my point. i ran a live stick on that machine even with only 4GB and no swap. i didn't recode HD videos or did any 3D rendering, but for the usual desktop usage it really was enough. may be the fact that there's no network connection was helpful, no bloated JS frameworks and other evildoers, but it was really a pleasure to use it. (remember: even with 4GB only, where now i have 8)
1777[14:15:11] <EdePopede> and (just for the theory so far): should i have multiple systems and plan to hibernate and boot another one, then i guess i should have different swap partitions for these?
1780[14:16:12] *** Quits: Shahnaz_ (~Shahnaz@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1781[14:16:32] <srged> ratrace: i created the file using this command to test the write speed. sync; dd if=/dev/zero of=tempfile bs=1M count=1024; sync
1867[14:57:54] <uniqdom> if I just do your second option, I will miss updates. In your first option, you mean to enable the repo in sources.list, install the package, and then remove the repo? then, I will also miss updated
1868[14:57:54] <uniqdom> updates*
1869[14:59:23] <uniqdom> but i think that I will just do that.
1870[14:59:27] <uniqdom> thanks
1871[14:59:39] <jim> but consider this... if you install the firmware and your wireless works, what reason is there to upgrade?
1885[15:05:31] <sponix> EdePopede: you only need more swap than ram if you are on a laptop or whatever and want to do hibernate/suspend features. For playing around and breaking Debian 10 (learning) I suggest Virtual Machines with like virtualbox if your rig has the power to support more than one OS running at the same time
1886[15:06:06] <jim> is having a virtual RMS illegal now?
1888[15:06:12] <sponix> EdePopede: I didn't mention a swap partition because I decided to do a "swap file" like Linux Mint defaults to -- and set that up later myself (Googled in on the interwebs)
1893[15:09:21] <EdePopede> sponix: with those 8GB i will for sure test out what i can give it. i still have to go for Xen (given that it's still alive and well), had the kernel installed here before, but then the problems started, so i never used it.
1894[15:09:29] <sponix> vrms: 67 non-free packages, 2.5% of 2685 installed packages. 27 contrib packages, 1.0% of 2685 installed packages.
1900[15:11:06] *** Quits: uniqdom (~uniqdom@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1901[15:11:07] <jim> uniqdom, one question you could ask, is by what criteria is a package judged non-free
1902[15:11:24] <sponix> EdePopede: most do kvm with lib-virt for serious vm play these days (virt-manager frontend) it is very little overhead, and powerful/flexible
1903[15:11:31] <EdePopede> sponix: i'll also have to decide at some point what i want to do with the windows 10 home i have on that other disk. at least it means i have an official license, the first since my XP PC :)
1904[15:12:10] <EdePopede> is it also still a question of cpu flags, depending on the guest system?
1907[15:12:46] <sponix> EdePopede: well, chances are if you install Windows 10 even on a different drive, if you don't actually "unplug" your Linux one it will eat grub, and you will have to boot live media to go back in, chroot, and re-install it -- loads of FUN
1908[15:13:35] <EdePopede> it came preinstalled, didn't touch anything there, for the installation now i even removed it
1910[15:14:49] <EdePopede> and booting live media is what i actually had to do, couldn't get that damn lenovo to cooperate. w/o secure boot it was blind, with it it gave me a secure boot error. but that's why the grub menu is editable :)
1911[15:15:17] <EdePopede> a new entry with 2 lines is enough to get through to the installed system
1912[15:15:55] <EdePopede> and the windows disc is 240GB only, so even a dumb dd backup isn't really an issue
2036[16:34:12] <subcool> ok. idk what happen. I put my laptop to sleep, opened the lid. ANd it kinda spazzed. didnt properly pull up login box, but i put my apssword in an logged in. WHen the desktop showed up, it froze. ctrl alt f1-f7 didn work. SO i held down the power button. Now, i have emergency maintence mode. the last error to show on the screen , ---" nouveau ### DRM: pointer to TMDS table invalid.
2037[16:34:19] *** Quits: hejux (~hejux@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2147[17:39:53] <shtrb> Where does charge_start_threshold is stored ? I swapped the battery with a replacement and it had a different value but when I plugged it back it should the previously stored value (tlp is uninstalled , thinkpad , thinkpad_acpi is loaded)
2175[18:00:29] <nvz> shtrb: look in /sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/
2176[18:01:53] <shtrb> That is how I found about it, someone at #kernel hinted me that the Embedded Controller may store on the battery itself (or as I guess on the EC memory itself)
2177[18:02:19] <shtrb> very nice and strange feature
2178[18:02:40] <nvz> I threw up on my keyboard on this T440 and couldnt get the smell out, so I bought a new one, and had similar issues with my new keyboard's trackpoint.. the settings were all different
2180[18:03:17] <nvz> I've wrote a little tool for the trackpoint settings.. if I ever get around to it I'd like to just make a user-friendly sysfs tool for all things
2181[18:03:19] <shtrb> your new laptop smelled too ?
2188[18:05:13] <nvz> for all I know it may work now.. I'd let it dry 2 days before trying it.. but its now been sitting there for a week or more.. it may be working now for all I know
2189[18:05:33] <nvz> there is a lot more electronics in these newer keyboards
2190[18:05:58] <hiya> Is there live ISO for debian with non-free enabled?
2205[18:08:54] <nvz> hiya: you may want to use the testing non-free images to install, and use expert mode which will allow you to install stable but will boot with a newer kernel
2206[18:09:17] <nvz> hiya: the same kernel thats in testing/unstable is in buster-backports
2231[18:13:30] <nvz> raidghost: I can't comment on that specifically cause I never had a tv card of any kind but I been building kernels a long time and I know there are mainlined drivers with that name, have been for a long time
2232[18:13:50] <nvz> raidghost: as with any hardware, we'd need pciids or such to lookup support, the name means nothing
2234[18:14:11] <nvz> drivers claim hardware based on their IDs not their names
2235[18:14:39] <raidghost> 05:00.0 Multimedia video controller: Conexant Systems, Inc. CX23885 PCI Video and Audio Decoder (rev 04)
2236[18:14:42] <raidghost> 06:00.0 Multimedia video controller: Conexant Systems, Inc. CX23885 PCI Video and Audio Decoder (rev 04)
2237[18:14:52] <nvz> raidghost: you need to use lspci -nn
2238[18:15:22] <raidghost> 05:00.0 Multimedia video controller [0400]: Conexant Systems, Inc. CX23885 PCI Video and Audio Decoder [14f1:8852] (rev 04)
2239[18:15:25] <raidghost> 06:00.0 Multimedia video controller [0400]: Conexant Systems, Inc. CX23885 PCI Video and Audio Decoder [14f1:8852] (rev 04)
2240[18:15:39] <nvz> ,pciid 14f1:8852
2241[18:15:40] <judd> [14f1:8852] is 'CX23885 PCI Video and Audio Decoder' from 'Conexant Systems, Inc.' with kernel module 'cx23885' in stretch. See also replaced-url
2242[18:15:51] * nvz checks against that driver in buster
2249[18:18:15] <nvz> hiya: you got one of the core i cpus in there ?
2250[18:18:29] <hiya> nvz: 8250u
2251[18:18:51] <raidghost> nvz: " if you are using a Hauppauge DVB TV tuner in Europe or Australia/New Zealand, you also need to install the TV firmware"
2252[18:18:53] <hiya> Yes Intel CPU with integrated GPU
2253[18:19:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1537
2254[18:19:05] <raidghost> only ubuntu that i have seen that have that package
2260[18:20:25] <nvz> hiya: that page doesnt get into the specifics of the hardware.. but a core i machine, if thats what you have.. (there are 5 possible processors for that and only 3 are core i) most the hardware is on the CPU itself and is supported
2267[18:23:04] <nvz> raidghost: we have a firmware-ivtv that has firmware for conexant cards.. but it doesnt mention that model specifically.. either way firmware if required is trivial
2268[18:23:34] <nvz> raidghost: they are binary blob files you drop in /lib/firmware you can get them from anywhere. another distro, upstream, whatever.. its not a big deal
2270[18:24:11] <hiya> shtrb: but nvz just suggested not to use this way and I think I have free repo ISO downloaded
2271[18:24:26] <nvz> no.. I said do not install from a LIVE
2272[18:24:38] <nvz> you can use the non-free ones to make sure your wifi will work..
2273[18:25:14] <shtrb> and to do so , you can use the link that I just gave (that's for testing just in case )
2274[18:25:19] <nvz> just dont use the live version, use the regular installer, for testing, use expert mode, choose stable for the mirror, and chroot from the installer post-install before rebooting, and enable backports and install the backport kernel and firmware
2275[18:26:15] <nvz> the idea here is, you'll use the testing installer so the INSTALLER will boot with the NEWER kernel and firmware, but you'll use it to install STABLE, then will manually install the newer kernel/firmware prior to rebooting
2276[18:26:18] *** Quits: culmination_ (~PLAT-H@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2277[18:26:57] <nvz> you said this made sense to you so I didnt go into any further detail on it
2278[18:27:20] *** Quits: Python1320 (Python1320@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2282[18:28:05] <nvz> when in expert mode, when chooosing an apt mirror, after you select a mirror it will ask you which branch you want
2283[18:29:57] <nvz> I am not 100% certain if installing stable from a testing installer will copy the kernel from the cd or use the stable one.. I been meaning to test that but havent gotten around to it.. but its not hard to chroot in and just enable backports and grab linux-image-amd64 and firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-iwlwifi and such from backports
2284[18:30:24] *** Quits: soul-d (~name@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2286[18:30:57] <nvz> well, I'm not at all certain what it'll do.. I just know its definitely doable to get stable installed this way on machines with hw possibly too new for stable
2291[18:32:28] <nvz> so we can easily recommend installing stable for everyone without the extra steps of using a testing installer in expert mode and doing a chroot
2315[18:42:28] <gvth> Hi; I am running tails inside a qemu-kvm virtual machine but it's reacting very slowly. How do I find out whether hardware virtualization extensions are enabled and being used?
2318[18:43:27] <jcmesar> I miss you equally in silence; And with my soul, I hug your soul. In every caress you give me, I read there feeling true; there I read the love you profess for me ...
2319[18:43:31] <gvth> (hint: cpu virtualization is enabled in BIOS)
2331[18:54:24] <whislock> Bushmaster: More specifically, I said that branching out would be less daunting than you think, and encouraged you to try something non-Debian-based to gain experience.
2335[18:56:28] <Bushmaster> i am in OpenSUSE site whislock there are rolling realise (tumblweed) and something stable, called Leap, I think Leap would cater y needs
2336[18:56:58] <whislock> Bushmaster: You should be aware that this is significantly offtopic for #debian.
2337[18:57:06] <Bushmaster> apparently, I tried to install phpmyadmin in mint and it failed, hence I need to get rid of mint too
2338[18:57:37] <Bushmaster> oh yeah, okay, no problem, sorry for bothering you
2347[19:00:48] <Bushmaster> neither am I whislock but I need to video record screen cast Apache-MariaDB-PHP-phpmyadmin installation
2348[19:01:56] <Bushmaster> hence I need couple more distros, beside, if I cant eliminate Mint and Elementary and replace with other distros, I am wasting my disk space, but I need Debian based Distros
2355[19:07:04] *** Quits: MI9 (~007@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2356[19:07:20] <nvz> I need to fix my VMs so I can document this proceedure for people with newer hardware.. the VM modules are failing to build on my custom kernel so I either gotta fix that or go back to stock kernel :P
2357[19:08:01] *** Quits: Ericounet (~Eric@replaced-ip) (Quit: Je m'en vais ...)
2363[19:10:08] <Bushmaster> whislock, I need to utilize hard disk capacity and these two distros sitting duck, I need to replace with good distros so maximize my disk capacity usage
2364[19:11:15] <whislock> Why do you need more than ONE distro?
2382[19:22:22] <whislock> Bushmaster: Make a backup of your data, and rebuild your system with a single distro. What you're doing now is kind of insane.
2383[19:23:45] <Bushmaster> whislock, i have not done anything yet, I am consulting and gathering information,
2384[19:24:24] <whislock> You have multiple distros on your system, and you're having trouble working with it all. You haven't established a good reason for putting yourself through this much hassle.
2386[19:24:38] <Bushmaster> it is true that one distros will save more space in my hard drive, I have 7 distros and I am planning to eliminate two of them okay
2398[19:29:13] <whislock> You installed one to begin with.
2399[19:29:20] <whislock> Sounds like you can install one.
2400[19:29:26] <whislock> But that is what you need to do.
2401[19:30:03] <hiya> !live
2402[19:30:03] <dpkg> it has been said that live is The Debian Live project provides pre-built Debian live system images and allows creation of your own. These can be used to install a Debian system (although the installer is better to use). Live images are available from replaced-url
2403[19:30:11] <hiya> !USB
2404[19:30:11] <dpkg> Universal Serial Bus (USB) is a technology that has replaced the way that some peripheral devices connect to a computer. It is much faster than serial/communications and more flexible: many devices can be connected to simultaneously. USB 3.0 is supported by the Linux kernel since version 2.6.31. replaced-url
2463[19:52:32] <rany> Hello. How could I check NetworkManager connectivity in a dispatcher script? I know of `nmcli networking connectivity check` but I want to use variables...
2468[19:53:25] <marduk> hiya type lsblk to determine your usb drive and make sure it is not mounted, then dd your iso on whole device not on partition, use conv=fdatasync an bs=4M options for dd. It is no difference how you formated your usb before, dd will make everything as it should be
2484[19:58:55] <marduk> hiya: dd will also divide it as it should be. usualy 2 partitions
2485[19:58:58] *** pclov3r is now known as pclover
2486[19:59:25] <whislock> So will 'cp'.
2487[19:59:28] <hiya> marduk: How can I format the whole disk by removing all the partitions?
2488[19:59:39] <whislock> None of this is necessary. Just cp the iso to the block device.
2489[19:59:40] *** Quits: Night-Shade (~TimF@replaced-ip) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2490[19:59:42] <EriC^^> hiya: that's right, are you using a separate usb for the live ubuntu usb you're booting, and a separate disk for the debian iso you want dd'd ?
2491[19:59:55] <EriC^^> whislock: x-y problem
2492[19:59:58] <marduk> just use /dev/sdb (not sdb1)
2493[20:00:07] <hiya> I want to kaput all the /dev/sdb partitions and reformat it
2503[20:01:17] *** Quits: WrathOfAchilles (unit193@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2504[20:01:17] <whislock> EriC^^: Doesn't sound like one to me.
2505[20:01:23] <marduk> dd if=deb.iso of=/dev/sdb and all partitions will be kaput
2506[20:01:27] <whislock> hiya: Serioualy. Just cp/cat the iso to the block device.
2507[20:01:43] <whislock> You don't need to futz with dd or its parameters or options.
2508[20:01:43] <EriC^^> whislock: scroll up to the disk size reported by parted -ls
2509[20:01:49] <hiya> whislock: I tried but it is focusing on all the 2GB
2510[20:01:50] <whislock> Then the USB device is bad.
2511[20:02:01] <hiya> Whereas the USB is 16GB
2512[20:02:02] <whislock> It's that simple.
2513[20:02:05] <EriC^^> whislock: he said he just dd'd ubuntu iso to it successfully
2514[20:02:16] <hiya> EriC^^: Yes I did, not lying,
2515[20:02:21] <hiya> after that it stopped working
2516[20:02:29] <whislock> "after that it stopped working"
2517[20:02:52] <whislock> If the media is misreporting its size, that's not a partition table error.
2518[20:02:54] <EriC^^> hiya: so you're booted into debian, which is installed on the hdd, and you're trying to dd a debian iso to the 16gb usb plugged in?
2519[20:02:55] <whislock> That's a hardware/controller error.
2704[21:40:08] *** Quits: c0rnelius (~c0rnelius@replaced-ip) (Quit: The Tall Man? That story about me blowing up my own house because it was infested with midgets. Mike, that wasn't real.)
2719[21:52:16] <tw> What are the chances I can get away with installing libglfw3+libglfw3-dev from sid w/o them breaking? Am I better off rebuilding it as a backport?
2820[22:46:36] <nvz> so I'd compiled my own 5.4.1 kernel and been using it the last few days and I just booted back to the stock kernel and now my trackpoint isnt working... it worked a bit at the lightdm login screen.. it was sluggish but then just stopped working at all.. I have no thoughts on why this might be
2821[22:46:46] <galvanoport> Use bugzilla for debian's bugs, jesus
2822[22:46:46] <nvz> luckily I had a usb mouse sitting here
2847[22:51:38] <nvz> oh well, reportbug is rather atrocious.. its like something I'd program.. barebones enough to make something functional then just give up on it :P
2848[22:51:50] <nvz> that has nothing at all to do with debian's bts
2849[22:52:14] <nvz> debian's bts is pure bliss.. its trivial to use with any email client
2853[22:52:58] <nvz> galvanoport: you might be of good use to me.. heh.. I been putting together ideas for a unified support interface for debian
2854[22:52:58] <galvanoport> I just want more easy and clear bug tracking system for to report bugs. I don't want to use "reportbug" because it is so more pointless question about mail. It should be more easy man for end users.
2864[22:56:33] <galvanoport> for example; youtube-dl is not downloading any video because it must be updated. it is so easy problem. But I must fill pointless questions about my mail and bla bla bla.
2881[23:00:28] <Paddy^> its done in less than 2 minutes and not worth a bug report
2882[23:00:39] <nvz> galvanoport: I use git for youtube-dl and mps-youtube as needed.. as its simple not possible for debian to keep up with that
2883[23:01:23] <galvanoport> I don't understand "git". I don't know that.
2884[23:01:30] <nvz> anyone overly concerned by it could work to become a DM and maintain the package and possible offer updates using the volitile system
2885[23:01:58] <nvz> galvanoport: its not that difficult.. if I werent very drunk right now I'd show you how :P
2886[23:02:34] <galvanoport> ok, thanks I will try :P
2887[23:02:39] *** Quits: gaab (~Gaaab@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2888[23:02:45] <nvz> I probably have video demo of it on my server somewhere
2889[23:02:50] * nvz looks
2890[23:03:11] *** Quits: dastier (~dastier@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)