People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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3 [00:02:40] <mystic> user friendly software in linux kingsley? draem on lol
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38 [00:32:59] <crestfallen> hi this is an ongoing problem I'm bringing here again today. while booting buster the system hangs with a blinking cursor. it's a dell optiplex 9010 believed to be built in 2011. In recovery mode I appended contrib non-free to the first two sources.list entries. I was unable to run journalctl -b | nc termbin.com 9999, so following I have hand-written the main errors from that output: [drm:radeon_pci_probe [radeon]] *ERROR* radeo kernal modesett
39 [00:32:59] <crestfallen> ing for R600 or later requires firmware installed - see wiki.debian.org the 2nd error/bug message follows:
40 [00:33:30] <crestfallen> Conflicts with OpRegions use driver ACPI if available, instead of native drivers
41 [00:34:07] <crestfallen> I'm booting from a usb drive
42 [00:34:19] <crestfallen> no.. I installed from a usb drive
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44 [00:35:47] <crestfallen> it just occured to me if I need to do $ source /etc/apt/sources.list after the edits : contrib non-free
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46 [00:36:28] <crestfallen> thanks for any input
47 [00:36:35] <coruja> !firmware iso
48 [00:36:36] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD images containing non-free Debian <firmware> packages are available from replaced-url
49 [00:36:47] <LtL> crestfallen: apt update will do
50 [00:37:44] <LtL> crestfallen: apt update && apt upgrade - even better.
51 [00:38:07] <crestfallen> LtL you mean for the entire problem?
52 [00:38:29] <crestfallen> or to update sources.list ?
53 [00:38:38] <LtL> crestfallen: i only read the edit sources.list part
54 [00:38:47] <crestfallen> ok thanks
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56 [00:39:38] <crestfallen> so dpkg if you would kindly walk me through that. I did see that page but do not know which items and how to install those items
57 [00:40:14] <LtL> crestfallen: dpkg is a bot
58 [00:40:41] <crestfallen> I am chatting here on another machine. sadly I need to power down and share the internet with the machine in quesiton. oh : ) how about LtL then :)
59 [00:41:47] <crestfallen> so LtL will updating/upgrading with contrib non-free take care of this booting issue?
60 [00:42:30] <crestfallen> pen and paper ready :)
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63 [00:44:22] <crestfallen> can I just use apt-get install <firmware_package_name> from the recovery shell?
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67 [00:45:21] <crestfallen> coruja: show me the way :)
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69 [00:48:44] <coruja> crestfallen, there you may download a netinstall iso including non-free firmware if you want/need to start over again: replaced-url
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72 [00:50:33] <crestfallen> does that need to be copied to the usb drive with the buster image on it? coruja
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74 [00:51:11] <allizom> crestfallen: from your description it seems you're missing firmware for your gpu, just install it: firmware-amd-graphics (non-free)
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76 [00:51:38] <coruja> crestfallen, maybe try repairing your installation first
77 [00:51:57] <crestfallen> allizom: thank you, is that an apt-get install command?
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79 [00:52:31] <allizom> it's the name of the package containing the firmware you apparently need
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82 [00:53:04] <crestfallen> $ sudo apt-get install firmware-amd-graphics (non-free)
83 [00:53:05] <coruja> apt install firmware-amd-graphics (after having done apt update before)
84 [00:53:11] <crestfallen> is that correct^ ?
85 [00:53:42] <allizom> crestfallen: do not literally write non-free, else is correct
86 [00:53:56] <crestfallen> ok thanks coruha allizom excellent!
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88 [00:54:21] <crestfallen> back for more drama in 12 minutes..
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90 [00:55:44] <allizom> coruja: why do you suppose her/his install is somewhat broken?
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100 [00:59:12] <coruja> in this case broken meaning not working as wanted/expected, maybe kind of bad wording
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103 [01:01:46] <allizom> I would rather not reinstall to fix an issue which can be easily solved, that's all I mean
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152 [01:42:12] <crestfallen> hi so I went into recovery (new install booting issue) and ran apt install firmware-amd-graphics and this line was added (commented out #) :
153 [01:43:15] <crestfallen> deb cdrom:[DEBIAN GNU/Linux 10.1.0 _Bustr? - Official amd64 NETINST 20190908-01:07]/ buster main
154 [01:43:31] <crestfallen> oops _Buster_ ..
155 [01:44:02] <crestfallen> but then it says to run $ apt-cdrom
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157 [01:44:32] <crestfallen> some error about security is returned
158 [01:45:08] <crestfallen> it also says do not apt update but 'add' instead, but that command is not recognized
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160 [01:45:38] <crestfallen> I tried $ add cdrom: .... to no avail
161 [01:46:04] <crestfallen> should that deb line be commented out ? (it's at the top of sources.list)
162 [01:46:22] <crestfallen> how to get system to recognize the added line ?
163 [01:47:00] <crestfallen> also member suggested 'repairing the install usb drive, but I do not understand that
164 [01:47:56] <crestfallen> also if the 'deb cdrom: [DEBIAN GNU/Linux .... ]/ buster main line should include 'contrib non-free'
165 [01:48:21] <crestfallen> if it's uncommented , that is.. phew
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167 [01:48:32] <LtL> crestfallen: are you internet connected? you need to comment out the cdrom line in sources.list so it searches repositories and not install media
168 [01:48:50] <Someone_Else> anyone around here who knows about xinetd?
169 [01:49:43] <crestfallen> LtL yeah I am. also yes it was added as a comment#
170 [01:50:09] <crestfallen> but I tried it both commented and uncommented, also with and without contrib non-free
171 [01:50:22] <RoyK> crestfallen: don't use the cdrom line - just use the network targets
172 [01:50:33] <LtL> crestfallen: after that do 'apt show firmware-amd-graphics' see if it lists your card.
173 [01:50:42] <crestfallen> please explain RoyK
174 [01:50:57] <RoyK> crestfallen: deb replaced-url
175 [01:51:15] <RoyK> and perhaps add "contrib" and "non-free" to that line if you need those as well
176 [01:51:30] <crestfallen> just add that to sources.list RoyK ?
177 [01:51:37] <RoyK> crestfallen: most people don't use a cdrom these days ;)
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179 [01:51:59] <RoyK> I have this
180 [01:52:00] <RoyK> deb replaced-url
181 [01:52:05] <RoyK> and comment out the cdrom line
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183 [01:52:24] <crestfallen> but that was added to the list using $ apt install firmware-amd-graphics
184 [01:52:26] <RoyK> then run apt update and apt install <somepackage>
185 [01:52:26] <crestfallen> RoyK:
186 [01:52:42] <RoyK> you don't need the cdrom line
187 [01:52:56] <crestfallen> <somepackage> ?
188 [01:52:59] <RoyK> unless you're installing from a cdrom, that is, but I somewhat doubt you are
189 [01:53:28] <RoyK> crestfallen: just the name of the package you want to install - perhaps firmware-amd-graphics
190 [01:54:22] <crestfallen> ok comment out the cdrom line and use your (brilliant) line above. ok that was already done (but in the correct sequence?) RoyK
191 [01:54:42] <crestfallen> the install command was already done i.e.
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193 [01:55:04] <RoyK> yes, should do
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195 [01:56:36] <crestfallen> excellent thanks kindly RoyK LtL
196 [01:56:40] <LtL> crestfallen: new firmware requires a reboot. fyi
197 [01:56:58] <crestfallen> copy that thnx
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201 [01:58:50] <allizom> Someone_Else: I do not, however explaining your issue in more details may lead people to comment on it
202 [01:59:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1531
203 [02:00:00] <Someone_Else> allizom: right, but my question is very specific. anyway, I want xinetd to listen on 2 specific IP adresses: one IPv4, one IPv6
204 [02:00:50] <Someone_Else> I only get it to listen on one, as if there simple put isn't an option to specify multiple IP addresses. It looks like one or all-in
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209 [02:03:44] <whislock> Someone_Else: You will need individual xinetd configuration blocks per IP.
210 [02:04:14] <whislock> xinetd configuration only recognizes a single bind instruction per service.
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212 [02:04:51] <whislock> Someone_Else: So, why are you trying to do things this way, exactly?
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214 [02:05:20] <Someone_Else> whislock: multiple IP's on one server, need it to listen to one specific
215 [02:05:33] <whislock> Someone_Else: Host-based firewalling seems far less kludgy.
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217 [02:05:55] <Someone_Else> not in this case...
218 [02:06:33] <whislock> I have yet to see a detail provided that supports that response.
219 [02:06:48] <Someone_Else> I'm working with some *popular control panel* to make things easy for the person that is going to use it
220 [02:07:08] <Someone_Else> and their firewall config method is flaky at best
221 [02:07:29] <whislock> Sounds like it would be better to teach them proper sysadmin skills instead of saddling them with a broken by design panel.
222 [02:07:56] <Someone_Else> maybe, but time and cost is in effect as well
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226 [02:11:02] <Someone_Else> whislock: anyway, thanks for the info, this specific bit was hard to find
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232 [02:13:35] <kadiroooo> my vdr-sxfe use that xine thing
233 [02:14:36] <mystic> vd isnt safe
234 [02:14:46] <kadiroooo> what
235 [02:14:52] <mystic> on the end of that urine thing
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237 [02:15:37] <kadiroooo> vdr not vd
238 [02:16:24] <kadiroooo> ah lol you are the guy get banned from linux channel
239 [02:16:47] <whislock> dpkg: ops Can we please do someabout about mystic?
240 [02:16:47] <dpkg> Hydroxide, dondelelcaro, LoRez, RichiH, mentor, abrotman, Maulkin, stew, peterS, Myon, Ganneff, weasel, zobel, themill, babilen, SynrG, jm_, somiaj, jelly, petn-randall, bremner: whislock complains about a problem (see above)
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247 [02:21:11] <themill> whislock: thanks
248 [02:21:35] <whislock> (insert thumbs up here)
249 [02:22:21] <blob> anyone running debian on a lenovo x1 carbon 7th gen?
250 [02:22:31] <kadiroooo> thank you op
251 [02:22:44] <crestfallen> very sorry I followed the instructions to a T: comment out the cdrom line in sources.list ; added the line:
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253 [02:23:16] <crestfallen> deb replaced-url
254 [02:24:24] <crestfallen> when I add the line and update, I get errors : "Error:1 deb.debian.org buster InRelease'
255 [02:24:34] <crestfallen> also:
256 [02:25:08] <crestfallen> Could not resolve ftp.no.debian.org also:
257 [02:25:25] <crestfallen> Could not resolve security.debian.org
258 [02:25:33] <kadiroooo> crestfallen, I think ( not sure ) you have a typo in that line
259 [02:25:45] <crestfallen> which line?
260 [02:26:05] <kadiroooo> deb replaced-url
261 [02:26:20] <kadiroooo> after debian there must be a slash
262 [02:26:34] <kadiroooo> not very sure though
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264 [02:27:13] <LtL> crestfallen: use this, deb replaced-url
265 [02:27:17] <crestfallen> yes actually I'm pretty sure that is how I wrote it (with the last slash) .. but all those domains are 'unresolved'
266 [02:27:56] <kadiroooo> try what LtL say
267 [02:28:00] <LtL> !tell crestfallen about buster sources.list
268 [02:28:21] <crestfallen> LtL in place of what line in sources.list (that's where I'm doing the edits)
269 [02:28:38] <LtL> crestfallen: dpkg sent you a proper sources.list just add contrib non-free to each line
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271 [02:29:44] <crestfallen> I see , should all the existing lines be commented out LtL ? including the //ftp.no.debian.org/debian/ line ?
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274 [02:31:21] <crestfallen> I don't understand, there's nothing about contrib non-free in the bot message. wtf
275 [02:31:34] <crestfallen> totally confusing mess
276 [02:31:35] <LtL> crestfallen: yes or erase them, then edit in and apt update && apt upgrade
277 [02:32:11] <LtL> crestfallen: contrib and non-free are optional
278 [02:32:39] <crestfallen> ok LtL but member gave me the deb replaced-url
279 [02:32:50] <crestfallen> nix that as well?
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281 [02:33:11] <kadiroooo> norvege
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283 [02:33:14] <aZz7eCh> ... why is half our network suddenly unable to sftp between machines?
284 [02:33:14] <RoyK> crestfallen: you can replace ftp.no.debian.org with http.debian.org - perhaps a bit better, since .no. just implies norway, ftp is going out some day
285 [02:33:22] <LtL> crestfallen: yes, but that address does work.
286 [02:33:24] <aZz7eCh> literally problem come out of no where
287 [02:34:30] <RoyK> damn - use ftp.debian.org - not http
288 [02:34:36] <RoyK> thought it worked - it doesn't
289 [02:34:42] <LtL> crestfallen: just use dpkg's 3 lines and and optional stuff, i.e., contrib non-free .. the options you definetly need.
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291 [02:35:30] <LtL> crestfallen: don't use quotes either.
292 [02:35:49] <crestfallen> ok RoyK LtL so not ftp.no... but ftp.debian.org/debian ...
293 [02:36:21] <LtL> crestfallen: dpkg is not wrong, do as you wish.
294 [02:36:39] <RoyK> crestfallen: yes
295 [02:37:00] <crestfallen> ok but I thought this was a case of slightly older hardware LtL requiring some prodding :)
296 [02:37:24] <crestfallen> signing off . more drama later
297 [02:37:28] <LtL> crestfallen: hardware has nothing to do with this.
298 [02:37:32] <RoyK> crestfallen: both probably work well, but still replaced-url
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300 [02:38:14] <RoyK> finding the nearest mirror is nice, but usually not that important
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325 [02:59:48] <ryouma> i use an old computer but i want to partition an external drive to boot off of whatever i might get if this computer dies. i will be able to get my existing debian onto its boot and root partitions. i want to know what partitioning to use for maximum flexibility. is it ok to use mbr and make an extended mbr, then a tiny partition, boot, root, and home?
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329 [03:01:53] <RoyK> ryouma: probably - but if you're looking for the easiest approach, I'd suggest just disconnecting the internal drive and running the debian installer, installing directly onto the external drive, avoiding grub messups
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334 [03:06:25] <crestfallen> replaced-url
335 [03:06:45] <crestfallen> btw it still hangs
336 [03:08:53] <crestfallen> I think I need to install packages after the sources list is correct :P
337 [03:09:48] <RoyK> crestfallen: the first and last line point to the same repo, just different mirrors - remove the last one
338 [03:10:15] <crestfallen> will that solve it; is there a conflict? just curious
339 [03:10:30] <RoyK> deb.debian.org will cycle between some hosts near you
340 [03:10:40] <RoyK> there shouldn't be any conflicts
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342 [03:11:04] <crestfallen> but yeah I have to install the package *after the sources.list is correct, right RoyK ? sorry for confusion
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344 [03:11:32] <crestfallen> It looked like it installed but perhaps I had error messages there as well
345 [03:11:40] <RoyK> deb replaced-url
346 [03:11:44] <RoyK> might be there as well
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349 [03:12:15] <crestfallen> yeah I have that one second
350 [03:12:28] <crestfallen> oh its different
351 [03:12:36] <RoyK> replaced-url
352 [03:13:02] <RoyK> but I need sleep - ttyl
353 [03:13:10] <crestfallen> RoyK: thanks , but to confirm , install the package again right? just so I know for future
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355 [03:13:16] <SymbioticFemale> how do i remove docker?
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359 [03:13:58] <SymbioticFemale> oh apt remove docker-ce
360 [03:14:06] <RoyK> crestfallen: just install the package - or run "apt upgrade" to fix things if they're out of sync, or even "apt dist-upgrade"
361 [03:14:12] <RoyK> but nighttime
362 [03:14:26] <crestfallen> thanks RoyK !!
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364 [03:14:46] <SymbioticFemale> why is it that these days apt update never shows me any available updates? i remember the days when i would have package updates daily
365 [03:14:49] <SymbioticFemale> is debian teh kill?
366 [03:15:01] * SymbioticFemale is on buster
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382 [03:24:24] <de-facto> Everytime i update php7.3-fpm I have to do that config file nightmare to port my changes into the package versions config files
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384 [03:25:07] <de-facto> is there a simple way to leave the package config files in default state and overwrite only some variables with an extra file (outside the packages file tree)?
385 [03:25:27] <ksk> de-facto: eh? if php stays 7.3 I would assume it would not come with a new config (option)!?
386 [03:25:45] <ksk> ..so you would then choose to "keep local version", and be done.
387 [03:26:07] <de-facto> well but then i dont get the package version's updates in config files
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389 [03:27:06] <de-facto> what i meant was: a) leave the package config files untouched in original state and b) overwrite some vars with my own file so it never collides and stays untouched by dpkg
390 [03:27:23] <de-facto> if something like that is possible
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392 [03:28:40] <de-facto> e.g. overwrite /etc/php/7.3/fpm/php.ini and /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/replaced-url
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396 [03:29:52] <de-facto> that would be awesome because 1) only my differences (overwrites), so its shorter and much better to read and 2) it would never collide with updates
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413 [03:36:44] <ksk> in theory that works yes. until update introduces new features, changes a known behaviour..
414 [03:37:01] <ksk> not that php would ever do that. ehm..
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417 [03:37:34] <de-facto> well in major version upgrades I would have to do the full diff of course
418 [03:38:02] <de-facto> do you know if overwriting variables in /etc/php/7.3/fpm/php.ini and /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/replaced-url
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420 [03:38:49] <ksk> iirc php has a place where configs starting with numbers are stored - I suppose they are loaded in that specific order - take a look at that.
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423 [03:39:18] <de-facto> yeah there is a modules directory in /etc/php/7.3/fpm/conf.d
424 [03:40:34] <de-facto> just not sure when that is loaded and which file would be overwritten by those
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431 [03:46:19] <de-facto> hmm not sure about that conf.d directory, cant see it mentioned anywhere
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434 [03:47:14] <de-facto> but in /etc/php/7.3/fpm/php-fpm.conf there is include=/etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/*.conf so i guess i could do zzz-custom.conf in there to overwrite?
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437 [03:48:15] <de-facto> that would possible overwrite /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/replaced-url
438 [03:48:25] <de-facto> how about /etc/php/7.3/fpm/php.ini ?
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442 [03:51:08] <de-facto> hmm i guess /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/zzz-custom.conf could overwrite everything?
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446 [03:55:45] <de-facto> hmm nope :/
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468 [04:04:56] <de-facto> ah it seems i can create /etc/php/7.3/fpm/conf.d/99-custom,ini to overwrite /etc/php/7.3/fpm/php.ini and /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/zzz-custom.conf to overwrite /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/replaced-url
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473 [04:11:58] <ryouma> RoyK: believe it or not, i have already solved the hard problem of putting my running debian on any drive a long time ago, and for health reasons cannot open the computer at this time. so it's just a plain question about partitioning / booting / mbr/efi/whatever
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476 [04:15:46] <melpy> health reasons?
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478 [04:16:24] <ryouma> i cannot physically open a computer or do anything like that
479 [04:18:36] <ryouma> also, installing and setting up what i had is a huge effort for me (even dist-upgrade is), so i prefer copying my existing running system. and i figured out that part already. even though doing so much more complex than the question i am asking.
480 [04:18:57] <ryouma> (i'm weird)
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517 [04:55:11] <darsie> synaptic asks me for the superuser/fg password. The rood pw doesn't work. What should I do?
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519 [04:55:46] <darsie> set a password for the fg user?
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548 [05:22:53] <darsie> replaced-url
549 [05:23:16] <ryouma> fg is a user on your system?
550 [05:23:23] <darsie> yes
551 [05:23:32] <ryouma> and it has no password?
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557 [05:24:28] <darsie> looks like it has a pw.
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559 [05:24:56] <darsie> Who is fg?
560 [05:25:29] <darsie> hmm, has a home directory.
561 [05:25:59] <darsie> flightgear
562 [05:27:27] <darsie> Synaptic says: "Password for fg:"
563 [05:28:08] <darsie> Looks like I (tried to) install flightgear which wasn't in a debian version.
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565 [05:29:48] <darsie> k, I changed the fg pw and it works now. But it shouldn't ask for that users pw.
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571 [05:35:10] <darsie> Hmm, package install claims success, but W: Download is performed unsandboxed as root as file '/root/.synaptic/tmp//tmp_sh' couldn't be accessed by user '_apt'. - pkgAcquire::Run (13: Permission denied)
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612 [06:15:34] <darsie> deluser --remove-all-files seems to scan an NFS mount for files to delete. Would deluser delete files of the user on the remote machine with the same id as the user I want to delete?
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624 [06:22:29] <jelly> darsie: yes, if they're accessible and deletable
625 [06:22:38] <darsie> thx
626 [06:22:43] <darsie> I aborted.
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628 [06:23:21] <darsie> Since it said "Looking for files to backup/remove ..." I assume nothing was deleted, yet.
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631 [06:25:45] <b_and_w> HI. :-) 1. are there any specific resources someone can point me to, to learn the difference between roff, troff, groff, and nroff? 2. also, are there any utilities that ship with debian (or linux in general) which can convert either .txt and/or .html files into man/roff/troff/groff/nroff/whatever-it's-called format (iow, the format used by man pages)?
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635 [06:26:52] <jelly> darsie: deluser is a perl script. Looking at the code it seems your assumption might be right.
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638 [06:27:56] <jelly> there's a "Removing files ..." right before unlinking
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641 [06:28:59] <darsie> Haven't hit that.
642 [06:29:10] <ryouma> pandoc?
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644 [06:30:14] <ryouma> pandoc can convert stuff b_and_w
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650 [06:35:47] <b_and_w> ryouma: thx. is pandoc a huge utility?
651 [06:35:58] <b_and_w> ryouma: im looking for the smallest tool for the job. i was hoping there would be a GNU coreutil or some bash built in command or something.
652 [06:36:06] <b_and_w> ?
653 [06:36:22] <b_and_w> if not, i will go with pandoc
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655 [06:37:07] <Skuppa> I am trying to schedule a machine to reboot every 3 days, i tried crontab -e and sudo crontab -e with the line "30 1 * * 3 /sbin/shutdown -r now
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659 [06:41:51] <rwp> Skuppa, That should work. Does it?
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665 [06:47:21] <b_and_w> ryouma: i just skimmed through their (pandoc) homepage. nice. that IS a lot of formats.
666 [06:47:26] <Skuppa> it doesn't, i have crontab running another hourly task and that one works fine
667 [06:48:21] *** Parts: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip ) ("vergissmeinnicht")
668 [06:48:55] <Skuppa> also "sudo /sbin/shutdown -r now" absolutely works rebooting the box from command line
669 [06:48:59] <annadane> maybe it's a problem with sudo in crontabs
670 [06:49:10] <annadane> i've heard of this before, i forget the issue
671 [06:49:16] <CombatVet> Skuppa, run it as root
672 [06:49:47] <annadane> (also reboot is a root thing so no, reboot with crontab -e as your normal user isn't ever going to work)
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675 [06:50:09] <Skuppa> i am not super linux adept, how would you do that
676 [06:50:27] <annadane> become root with su
677 [06:50:29] <annadane> or better, su -
678 [06:50:40] <CombatVet> su - and crontab -e
679 [06:50:41] <annadane> and *then* crontab -e, and it'll be root's crontab
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684 [06:51:36] <annadane> sudo in a script like crontab... it's going to depend on the password for authentication and being a cron job it's not going to prompt, so that'd be why it doesn't work (i think)
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686 [06:53:11] <jpw> why use sudo / su in crontabs?
687 [06:53:25] <jpw> configure the crontab to run as that specific user.
688 [06:53:30] <annadane> ^
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693 [06:56:19] <Skuppa> how would you do that
694 [06:56:53] <annadane> we said it: at your terminal, become root by typing su - <enter>. then, type crontab -e. put all your cron stuff in there, it'll run as root
695 [06:56:58] <annadane> which you need, in order to reboot
696 [06:57:20] <wskyx> you still can reboot from user lvel
697 [06:57:25] <annadane> as your regular user it's just crontab -e as non-root
698 [06:57:26] <wskyx> level
699 [06:57:26] <darxmurf> morning all
700 [06:57:36] <annadane> can you? i didn't know.
701 [06:57:46] <wskyx> well i can from my desktop environment
702 [06:58:01] <wskyx> if my de can do that it's possible using terminal too
703 [06:59:25] <Skuppa> with su - for some reason i dont know the password, i tried sudo passwd and it allows me to change passwd but this doesnt work for su -
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705 [07:02:19] <jpw> (as root) crontab (-e | -l) [-u username]
706 [07:02:30] *** Quits: magic_ninja_work (~sparkie1@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
707 [07:02:45] <jpw> or if you want to consolidate coontabs in to a single crontab for seruciry / vsiability you can also specify the user on the crontab line.
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710 [07:03:04] <jpw> m h dom mon dow [user] command
711 [07:03:14] <wskyx> also your crontab line was wrong if you want it once every 3 days
712 [07:03:16] <jpw> obvs only works as root
713 [07:03:29] <alphazulu> should i have cpufreqd installed on a laptop?
714 [07:03:54] <wskyx> yes if you want to change the governor from terminal
715 [07:04:09] <Skuppa> was that not every 3 days at 1:30
716 [07:04:09] <alphazulu> i keep seeing kernel CPU temperature messages in syslog
717 [07:04:15] <rwp> Skuppa, Since you said "sudo crontab -e" I thought you were editing root's crontab.
718 [07:05:26] <rwp> jpw, sudo is designed to be an interactive command but cron is not interactive when run. By default sudo will need to ask for a password. But sudoers can be configured otherwise of course. But not by default.
719 [07:05:48] <ryouma> b_and_w: bash isn't going to have a builtin for creating man pages. idk about coreutils but you can check info. emacs org can export to man page directly with a plugin or similar. emacs is big but that would work if you already have emacs.
720 [07:06:16] <wskyx> 30 1 * * 1,4,7
721 [07:06:20] <ryouma> • ‘ox-man.el’: export to a man page.
722 [07:06:32] <wskyx> no, this is wrong too
723 [07:07:01] <wskyx> this will reboot it monday, thursday and sunday
724 [07:07:33] <wskyx> write a script that counts that up and put into /etc/cron.daily
725 [07:07:59] <jpw> rwp: i'm well aware of that. i'm also aware that if you value security you don't put NOPASSWD in to sudoers.
726 [07:08:00] <wskyx> that's the best approach to it, crontab is bad for that task
727 [07:08:01] <rwp> If I am creating a system crontab I always put it in /etc/cron.d/something-local
728 [07:08:25] <rwp> jpw, Right. That is why sudo is almost never appropriate in a crontab command.
729 [07:08:33] <jpw> pretty much yah
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733 [07:09:24] <rwp> It's kind'a like when people set up an ssh-agent for ssh access elsewhere. Then try to run an ssh command in a crontab. Not a good design. Won't normally work. Because it is a detached command without access to the interactive ssh-agent. By default.
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735 [07:10:09] <rwp> I must say "by default" a lot because while it is possible to configure things otherwise doing so isn't usually a good thing.
736 [07:11:23] <jpw> that less so, you can use hsm's to make that kind of setup secure
737 [07:11:37] <jpw> thinks like the nitrokey and yubikey hsm
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739 [07:11:55] <rwp> wskyx, I think you were alluding to something like "test $(( $(date +%j) % 3 )) -eq 0 && echo do it" in a daily crontab to do something every 3rd day throughout the year. :-)
740 [07:12:17] <wskyx> that would do too
741 [07:12:31] <wskyx> i'd just use a script and a text file that contains the number of days
742 [07:12:59] <rwp> jpw, I am not even thinking about security. I just think it's a less than great design to an interactive ssh-agent to a crontab. Instead, think of a better design! :)
743 [07:13:32] <wskyx> every time the text file contains "3" the script is executed it pus 0 there and launches the reboot routine
744 [07:13:46] <wskyx> or puts 1 actuallly
745 [07:13:58] <rwp> Well... Skuppa has left so I hope the problem was solved.
746 [07:14:11] <wskyx> stalin approach
747 [07:14:35] <wskyx> there is a human, there is a problem, no human - no problem
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749 [07:14:46] <rwp> People are the problem! :-)
750 [07:15:16] * wskyx suspects rwp is a bot nd calls sarrah connor
751 [07:15:35] <rwp> Judgement day is coming!
752 [07:15:42] <rwp> Do you have stairs in your house?
753 [07:15:52] <wskyx> i have no house
754 [07:16:07] <wskyx> living in an apt
755 [07:16:15] <wskyx> in an apt building
756 [07:16:46] <wskyx> but there is staircase riht outside my front door
757 [07:16:54] <rwp> Sorry. It's an in joke. Somewhat like me failing a Turing test. :-)
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759 [07:18:34] <rwp> Rebooting from the cron.daily does have a small problem if the reboot happens in the middle of the run. It means that the later tasks don't get run on that day.
760 [07:19:03] <rwp> Soo... It would be good if doing that if the script were ensured to be the last one run that day so that the other scripts in cron.daily didn't get skipped.
761 [07:19:09] <wskyx> you can care about that inside the script
762 [07:19:21] <wskyx> the script can be in memory untill whatever happens
763 [07:19:26] <wskyx> in a loop
764 [07:19:37] <rwp> I don't quite follow.
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766 [07:20:08] <wskyx> well you can wait untill the tasks are done by checking the logs were the tasks ran
767 [07:20:17] <wskyx> in a while loop with sleep 1
768 [07:20:21] <rwp> run-parts is running each script in /etc/cron.daily/* sequentially.
769 [07:20:45] <rwp> Look at /etc/crontab for the invocation that makes cron.daily work.
770 [07:20:46] <wskyx> the script can reside in memory untill then and execute the reboot routing only when all the tasks are done
771 [07:21:03] <rwp> If a script doesn't exit then run-parts won't sequence to the next script in that directory.
772 [07:21:03] <wskyx> cron/dail can run _whatever_ script
773 [07:21:15] <wskyx> you don't quite follow
774 [07:21:24] <wskyx> you just program it all in the script
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776 [07:21:48] <rwp> I think you are suggesting that a cron.daily script could launch something in the background which sleeps for long enough and then runs the reboot.
777 [07:22:07] <wskyx> just check the logs until all the tasks are done in a loop
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779 [07:22:19] <wskyx> then launch the reboot routine
780 [07:22:27] <rwp> Run that in the background and then exit. run-parts would then sequence to the next script. If the sleep was long enough then all of the daily housekeeping tasks finish before the reboot.
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782 [07:23:17] <rwp> I don't think checking log files is really general enough. But one could check process status listings. Either ps or scan through /proc and wait until cron has no more children listed.
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784 [07:24:15] <rwp> Another related thought... I never apply upgrades or reboots in the middle of the night. If things go bad then there is no one around to fix things. So things can end up down for a long time.
785 [07:24:16] <wskyx> whatever gives you the recognition whether the jobs are done already
786 [07:24:32] <wskyx> you can ommit using cron at all
787 [07:24:39] <wskyx> and load the script at boot
788 [07:24:43] <rwp> Therefore I always schedule things like that in the middle of the work day. That way if things don't work people are around to notice and fix it quickly.
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790 [07:25:07] <jpw> don't put upgrades in to cron it will end in tears. use the unattended-upgrades package
791 [07:25:09] <wskyx> well i'm unsure what issue he was fixing in there
792 [07:26:13] <rwp> jpw, Well... long ago I have written my own equivalent of unattended-upgrades. Since I know what my program does I always use it. However if unattended-upgrades were documented better so that it was more easily understood then I might use it. But until then I will continue with my own program.
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795 [07:27:22] <rwp> With all of the years of using Debian I can only recall a few times when I had to step in and prevent a security upgrade from going out.
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797 [07:28:50] <rwp> wskyx, Right. What was the problem that a reboot every 3rd day would be solving?
798 [07:28:55] <jpw> the one time for me was when the dedault behavious of mysql joins was changed from right to left (or vice verca i don't remember)
799 [07:29:01] <rwp> Seems like a sledge hammer to kill a fly.
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801 [07:29:19] <jpw> that was a 'fun' weekend
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803 [07:29:40] <rwp> The one time for me was a bad sudo "security" upgrade that ended up getting reverted pretty quickly.
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805 [07:30:11] <rwp> jpw, That sounds like a pretty major change in mysql. In Stable?
806 [07:30:42] <rwp> That sounds like the kind of change that should only be allowed in a major suite upgrade from one release to the next.
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811 [07:33:54] <annadane> i'd use unattended-upgrades only for servers
812 [07:33:55] <rwp> Well... Time for me to say goodnight all! It's off to dreamland for me.
813 [07:34:01] <annadane> desktop, i want to see what apt does
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819 [07:38:00] <annadane> i have some stuff in dmesg | grep firmware for which i need the firmware-atheros and firmware-realtek packages, afaik it's mostly to do with wifi, which i don't even really use, is it a good idea to just install them or leave it alone?
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821 [07:39:24] <annadane> replaced-url
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829 [07:46:05] <lembron> hu, not sure if im just specifically dense right now... but id need a sample of a "basic nftables.conf" for a server... so in closed but ping&ssh, out whatever, rest ded - dont understand how that is not a sample in /usr/share/doc/nftables/examples or such - replaced-url
830 [07:46:06] <lembron> doesnt even contain the word "default" once - how is one supposed to get a grab on any of this...
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855 [08:04:53] <b_and_w> ryouma: TU!
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887 [08:32:50] <jim> hi... I'm looking to install sphinx, the documentation generator for python projects... I need to know the package name(s)... also, being upfront, this is a crosspost with #python, I'll tell each what the other said
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889 [08:35:49] <jim> so far, they're recommending two things: (1), install it into a python virtual environment... or, install python3-sphinx.
890 [08:36:48] <jim> also, sphinx is a python "package", which is a dir containing python modules, and has the (likely empty) file __init__.py
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894 [08:38:12] <Ede|Popede> jim: i've read the upgrade pdf to buster these days, it mentions python 2 going away and recommends going with 3 now
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896 [08:38:39] <jim> lastly, the sphinx python package can be seen at replaced-url
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898 [08:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1514
899 [08:39:17] <jim> Ede|Popede, noted... I've been coding in python3 for at least 3-5 years
900 [08:39:29] <Ede|Popede> ah, got it. debianPython 2 (sic!) isn't supported anymore after this year
901 [08:39:46] <Ede|Popede> ah, that's good. so it's not a 2 vs 3 then i guess
902 [08:39:49] <annadane> well, AFAIK it's supposed to go away entirely as of bullseye
903 [08:40:00] <annadane> they wouldn't stop supporting it in the middle of buster
904 [08:40:15] <Ede|Popede> debian hopes to get rid of 2.7 in 11
905 [08:40:35] <jim> that's probably bullseye
906 [08:40:41] <han-solo> Yep, and use 3.6 as default
907 [08:40:42] <Ede|Popede> indeed
908 [08:40:42] <jelly> jim: both suggestions are valid, virtualenv if you need the latest, or python3-sphinx if the packaged one is good enough. What's your question?
909 [08:40:43] <annadane> it is bullseye, yes.
910 [08:40:48] <annadane> why 3.6? buster uses 3.7
911 [08:41:04] <han-solo> buster has 3.7, just 3.6 is everywhere
912 [08:41:10] <han-solo> kinda like old 2.7 :)
913 [08:41:13] <annadane> fair enough i guess
914 [08:41:19] <jelly> ,v python3
915 [08:41:20] <judd> Package: python3 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.4.2-2; stretch: 3.5.3-1; buster: 3.7.3-1; bullseye: 3.7.5-1; sid: 3.7.5-1; experimental: 3.7.5-2
916 [08:41:23] <jim> jelly, I'm trying to help someone find the man page for youtube-dl
917 [08:41:37] <han-solo> Yeah, i hadto install 3.6 from source
918 [08:41:37] <annadane> ...what
919 [08:41:44] <han-solo> they jumped :)
920 [08:42:13] <jim> buster has 3.7 now?
921 [08:42:25] <annadane> it does
922 [08:42:26] <Ede|Popede> jim, it is in the package with everything in it at least, top level
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924 [08:42:45] <kfvn_> has anyone tried Debian on the thinkpad p1 gen2? It's not on the /installingdebianon/thinkpad so I hope to find some luck here
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927 [08:43:54] <han-solo> well, i can't see any breaking changes between 3.6 and 3.7, expect a small one mainly
928 [08:44:08] <han-solo> so better use 3.6, i guess, which will most probably will work for 3.6 as well
929 [08:44:15] <han-solo> er, 3.7
930 [08:44:26] <han-solo> which will most likelyw ork for 3.6 as well
931 [08:44:43] <annadane> or just use 3.7 unless you absolutely have to use 3.6
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934 [08:45:08] <han-solo> Yeah, using 3.7 is fine, i guess.
935 [08:45:10] <jim> no doubt :) I seem to have py3.7.3
936 [08:45:46] <han-solo> 3.8 is out, and it has a few major new things, so i think that's something
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938 [08:46:10] <annadane> it's mainly just compiling stuff in debian against python whatever
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940 [08:46:16] <ratrace> 3.7 has some breaking changes for programs using async
941 [08:46:20] <annadane> if you want another python version just get it from source
942 [08:46:25] <han-solo> it's a keyword now
943 [08:46:29] <ratrace> ya
944 [08:46:29] <jelly> jim: why are you doing this and not them? How is youtube-dl installed? Which Debian release?
945 [08:46:47] <han-solo> i think, most were aware than, async will be keyword even when using 3.6
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947 [08:46:56] <annadane> (though that being said python really doesn't have clear answers on how to do that lol)
948 [08:47:01] <han-solo> async/await
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950 [08:47:22] <han-solo> annadane: the usual answer is `pyenv`
951 [08:47:35] <annadane> i've seen anaconda recommended too
952 [08:47:37] <ratrace> han-solo: there were some reports here already about some major pakcages breaking on buster due to that.... eh... what was it... telegram?
953 [08:47:38] <annadane> and 9 other solutions
954 [08:47:40] <jelly> jim: why not just point them at replaced-url
955 [08:47:53] <jim> jelly, it looks like -I- have both the package and the git clone of it... when I say which youtube-dl, it shows the one from the repo
956 [08:47:54] <annadane> yep. you want to be using the latest youtube-dl, anyway
957 [08:47:57] <han-solo> but i get from source, which went smooth as far
958 [08:47:58] <annadane> a lot breaks without it
959 [08:48:16] <han-solo> ratrace: can't recall
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961 [08:48:47] <ratrace> han-solo: well anyway, there's that, with the async thing. didn't see any other issues.
962 [08:48:47] <jim> jelly, I want to show him how to generate the docs for it, and before I can do that, I need to know how myself :)
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964 [08:49:05] <han-solo> ratrace: Yeah, i don't see any other major things
965 [08:49:37] <han-solo> well, atleast 2.7 is on it's way out. So that's a great step forward
966 [08:49:38] <jim> annadane, yep, all I have to do is run git pull in there
967 [08:49:40] <Ede|Popede> "youtube-dl installed". throws a heavy parsing error here. even greycat is in favour of getting it upstream due to its release cycle, and he's usually the first one to call up for !frankendebian ;)
968 [08:49:51] <han-solo> 2.x
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970 [08:50:13] <han-solo> Ede|Popede: what's the error ? Is it on git ?
971 [08:50:13] <jelly> jim: how is that close to a debian-specific issue?
972 [08:50:43] <Ede|Popede> han-solo: no problems here
973 [08:51:52] <jim> jelly, I was gonna give him the man page I have, which was installed from a debian package in the archive
974 [08:51:54] <ratrace> jim: you can pip install it fresh new in a virtualenv
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977 [08:52:22] <jim> ratrace, yep :)
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979 [08:52:54] <han-solo> Ede|Popede: Okay
980 [08:53:02] <annadane> i use python3-venv and weekly cron job
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983 [08:54:08] <annadane> 0 0 * * 6 /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/pip install --upgrade youtube-dl && cp /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl /usr/local/bin
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986 [08:55:18] <han-solo> you could just `ln -s` it ?
987 [08:55:22] <jelly> annadane: why not a symlink
988 [08:55:33] <han-solo> oh, so it was not just me :)
989 [08:55:52] <annadane> link it to what?
990 [08:56:05] <jelly> /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl
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993 [08:56:50] <annadane> 0 0 * * 6 /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/pip instal --upgrade youtube-dl && ln -s /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/pip /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl?
994 [08:57:00] <eb0t> hey when installing google chrome on buster should i use this method replaced-url
995 [08:57:26] <eb0t> i normally use firefox but for some reason it is slowing my machine down
996 [08:57:39] <Ede|Popede> annadane, where does that pip executable come from? is it the normal one linked/copied (in)to that subdirectory?
997 [08:58:02] <annadane> what?
998 [08:58:08] <jelly> annadane: make a symlink once. Never run anything but the first part of the command again
999 [08:58:42] <jelly> annadane: link this -> /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl there -> /usr/local/bin
1000 [08:59:20] <annadane> well, i'd link it to /usr/local/bin/placeholderyoutubedlname
1001 [08:59:29] <jelly> why?
1002 [08:59:47] <jelly> what's wrong with "youtube-dl" as executable name?
1003 [08:59:50] <annadane> because you're asking me to link the entire /usr/local/bin directory? i'm assuming i'm missing something
1004 [08:59:55] <han-solo> Ede|Popede: I think, he created a virtualenv
1005 [08:59:56] <Ede|Popede> annadane: /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/pip
1006 [09:00:23] <annadane> because i'm using pip to upgrade youtube-dl...
1007 [09:00:24] <han-solo> `python3 -m venv /usr/local/youtube-dl`
1008 [09:01:05] <jelly> !symlink
1009 [09:01:05] <dpkg> Symlink rule of thumb / The link must be at the end / The filename comes first, or ln -sn target linkname
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1011 [09:01:55] <jelly> annadane: /usr/local/bin is the destination where symlink will be put. If it's a directory, ln -s will create a link with the same name as the target
1012 [09:02:06] <annadane> okay, yeah, i didn't know that
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1014 [09:02:35] <annadane> still, none of this really matters, it all comes down to the same thing
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1019 [09:03:26] <Ede|Popede> ah. i think i installt virtualenv once and found it disgusting. clobbered *every* user's environment with tons of functions from inside /etc/profile.d or where it was.
1020 [09:03:36] <Ede|Popede> installed even
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1022 [09:03:51] <jelly> I'd even go with ln -s ../youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl /usr/local/bin
1023 [09:04:23] <annadane> there's no compelling technical argument for other than "less typing when setting up your crontab -e"?
1024 [09:04:29] <annadane> for it*
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1026 [09:04:46] <han-solo> well, why copy when you can link :)
1027 [09:04:46] <annadane> i'm all in favor of good habits, though
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1030 [09:05:17] <annadane> i'll keep it in mind, i just don't feel like changing it on this machine now that it's already set up
1031 [09:05:29] <jelly> useless use of cp
1032 [09:06:34] <jelly> and some disk space is wasted on an additional copy of a file
1033 [09:07:28] <annadane> okay so i'll delete /usr/local/bin/youtube-dl, ln -s /usr/local/youtube-dl/bin/youtube-dl /usr/local/bin and disable the cp entry in my crontab
1034 [09:07:36] <han-solo> haha
1035 [09:07:38] <han-solo> Yay!
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1037 [09:08:03] <annadane> making me do work grumble grumble
1038 [09:08:04] <Ede|Popede> symlink or hardlink in this case?
1039 [09:08:20] <annadane> idk.
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1044 [09:09:01] <fredl> hi folks.
1045 [09:09:02] <Ede|Popede> usually i prefer to see more than "there's a link pointing to something"
1046 [09:09:36] <annadane> well i'll follow whatever recommendations, i never expected to get into this debate in the first place
1047 [09:10:15] <fredl> I'd like to install Debian in a chroot on my phone
1048 [09:10:23] <fredl> replaced-url
1049 [09:10:25] <jim> Ede|Popede, ln -s makes a symlink
1050 [09:10:37] <han-solo> i think, a symlink since, no need to do anything after upgrade ?
1051 [09:10:38] <Ede|Popede> annadane: well, it wasn't the spanish inquisition at least
1052 [09:10:42] <fredl> Problem is my phone doesn't have an SD card. Any suggestions how else to get it on there?
1053 [09:10:52] <Ede|Popede> jim: i know, it is only about the BCP for such a situation
1054 [09:10:57] <han-solo> or, wait,
1055 [09:11:07] <jim> put a sdcard in there first?
1056 [09:11:09] <annadane> i quit debian forever, and moving back into the caves
1057 [09:11:21] <fredl> jim - I mean it doesn't have an SD slot :)
1058 [09:11:27] <jim> annadane, aww...
1059 [09:11:50] <jim> fredl, EBADPHONE!
1060 [09:12:02] <fredl> Just a Nexus...
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1062 [09:12:51] <jim> is that shapmoo?
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1064 [09:14:04] <han-solo> annadane: use a symlink :)
1065 [09:14:12] <annadane> replaced-url
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1067 [09:14:21] <han-solo> create a symlink once, and keep upgrading only :)
1068 [09:14:31] <annadane> oh because i forgot to delete it
1069 [09:14:43] <han-solo> :)
1070 [09:16:00] <annadane> thanks i just wasted a whole 10 minutes of my life
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1072 [09:17:18] <annadane> why use good practice when you can be lazy???
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1075 [09:17:43] <mrmaks> Hi. Who was run LCD panel Innolux N116HSE-EBC? This LCD panel from Lenovo ThinkSmart Hub 500.
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1077 [09:17:58] <saber88> Hello, i need to ask about if anyone know something better than that script. replaced-url
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1079 [09:18:43] <saber88> i need to host php websites and WordPress, this script is so easy and good but the devs is not that active
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1081 [09:19:03] <saber88> i need to know if there is something better
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1092 [09:25:27] <ratrace> saber88: script that does what?
1093 [09:26:04] <saber88> easy install for WordPress or php website in general
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1096 [09:26:39] <saber88> i have to host a lot of php websites
1097 [09:26:44] <ratrace> well, apt install wordpress does it on debian, if that's sufficient for you
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1108 [09:30:53] <annadane> to be clear i'm joking
1109 [09:30:57] <annadane> this is good to know
1110 [09:31:16] <fredl> Hrmm I just did a debootstrap and tarred it up, then adb push'ed it to the phone and untarred it...
1111 [09:31:49] <fredl> but seems somehow I can't change permissions of files on the phone
1112 [09:32:18] <fredl> which... is rather odd if you ask me...
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1121 [09:37:13] <fredl> aha... success
1122 [09:37:15] <fredl> sorta
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1284 [11:54:45] <chieta> how to know that my apt-get dist-upgrade is still running or not? the process is still listed on the top command?
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1294 [12:02:49] <rav30> hey all
1295 [12:02:53] <rav30> i have an issue
1296 [12:02:59] <rav30> I fresh installed debian netinst
1297 [12:03:00] *** Quits: p_quarles (~pquarles@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Lawlbai)
1298 [12:03:05] <rav30> But now I have extremely slow internet
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1302 [12:03:25] <rav30> Wifi doesn’t work, so the only way I’m connected is through USB tethering
1303 [12:03:35] *** Joins: armin (~a@replaced-ip )
1304 [12:03:41] <rav30> The thing is Wifi worked fine in the installer
1305 [12:03:54] <han-solo> ps aux | grep 'apt-get' # should do ?
1306 [12:03:54] <rav30> Now, when I actually have Debian it’s not working
1307 [12:04:04] <rav30> huh?
1308 [12:04:12] *** Joins: njka (~njka@replaced-ip )
1309 [12:04:23] <han-solo> rav30: sorry, that was not for you
1310 [12:04:26] <rav30> ah okay
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1312 [12:04:39] <rav30> anyways, but even the usb tethering is extremely slow
1313 [12:04:48] <rav30> I can’t even go to google
1314 [12:05:02] <rav30> can anyone please help, please!!!
1315 [12:05:21] *** Joins: g3org3 (~xyz@replaced-ip )
1316 [12:05:27] <Ede|Popede> chieta: cpu usage, maybe by looking at its open file descriptors (htop is a handy tool here)
1317 [12:05:35] <rav30> important deets: i’m using debian 10 from netinst, and my wifi adapter is the mt7601
1318 [12:05:45] <rav30> but all networking is slow rn
1319 [12:05:48] <rav30> halp
1320 [12:05:55] <chieta> checking Ede|Popede
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1325 [12:07:03] <rav30> hello? Bump
1326 [12:07:31] <rav30> i really wanna know how to fix this (i’ve had this issue so many times on debian, and only debian it happens)
1327 [12:07:31] *** Quits: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1328 [12:07:49] *** Joins: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip )
1329 [12:07:49] <rav30> i keep switching to other distros whose internet works but I really wanna use debian
1330 [12:08:13] <rav30> the most infuriating thing is that this issue affects all networking
1331 [12:08:17] <rav30> not just wifi
1332 [12:08:25] <rav30> but also ethernet and usb tethering
1333 [12:09:35] *** Quits: njka (~njka@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
1334 [12:09:49] <rav30> hello? is anyone there?
1335 [12:09:58] <annadane> yes, but not everyone can instantly respond
1336 [12:10:02] *** Quits: dselect (~dselect@replaced-ip ) (Quit: ouch... that hurt)
1337 [12:10:18] <rav30> sorry sorry its just that its really late and i havent had sleep since yesterday
1338 [12:10:26] <rav30> trying to figure this out
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1340 [12:10:56] <annadane> if it's *only* debian i'd assume it's a missing firmware issue but you said you had access during the install, so...
1341 [12:11:03] <rav30> i know right
1342 [12:11:14] *** Joins: dselect (~dselect@replaced-ip )
1343 [12:11:17] *** Quits: corvo (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip ) (Quit: corvo)
1344 [12:11:30] <rav30> the thing is the wifi is recognized in installed debian
1345 [12:11:31] <rav30> but
1346 [12:11:36] <rav30> it just wont connect
1347 [12:11:37] <chieta> ping Ede|Popede... it's on D state?
1348 [12:11:44] <chieta> the apt one process
1349 [12:11:57] <rav30> it always ends up as “network has been disconnected”
1350 [12:12:15] <rav30> i’ve tried the nonfree images, the nonfree live image, NONE OF THEM WORK
1351 [12:12:25] <rav30> they all have the same issue
1352 [12:12:42] <rav30> networking is extremely slow and I have no idea why
1353 [12:13:01] *** Quits: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
1354 [12:13:29] <Ede|Popede> chieta: dead. have this often when everything is overloaded again. lack of ram, swapping out, if i'm in luck, it happens while i'm about to copy a huge file, often it is firefox while closing down after a long time. usually they come back here at some point.
1355 [12:13:41] <rav30> help
1356 [12:13:56] <rav30> is there anything I can do to fix this
1357 [12:14:12] *** Quits: lel (lel@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC - ##replaced-url
1358 [12:14:14] *** Quits: rav30 (~Mutter@replaced-ip##) (Quit: Mutter: ##replaced-url
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1363 [12:15:27] *** Joins: careta (~careta@replaced-ip )
1364 [12:15:30] <rav30> Hi hi sorry it disconnected
1365 [12:15:36] *** Joins: SniperCZE (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip )
1366 [12:15:42] <rav30> anyways yeah i have no idea how to fix this
1367 [12:15:49] <rav30> the nonfree images also have this issue
1368 [12:15:50] <Ede|Popede> rav30: if it works with the installer then i'd say it is either some driver used there or some default setting not present in the default installation
1369 [12:16:23] <rav30> but what do I do
1370 [12:16:37] <annadane> just for fun, you can at least check dmesg | grep firmware
1371 [12:16:40] <rav30> all networking and internet is slow
1372 [12:16:43] <rav30> not just wifi
1373 [12:16:45] <rav30> ok
1374 [12:17:08] <Ede|Popede> wait for someone who knows what specific firmware you may need or try to find out the differences between the installer and the normal system here
1375 [12:17:09] <rav30> one sec
1376 [12:17:17] <annadane> sorry... if i knew more, i'd sure give advice on it
1377 [12:17:20] *** Quits: rav30 (~Mutter@replaced-ip ) (Client Quit)
1378 [12:17:27] *** Quits: SniperCZE (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
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1380 [12:19:43] *** Joins: rav30 (~Mutter@replaced-ip )
1381 [12:19:48] <rav30> hi hi hi
1382 [12:19:52] <rav30> it disconnected again
1383 [12:19:54] <rav30> im so sorry
1384 [12:20:05] <rav30> anyways here is the output of dmesg grep firmware
1385 [12:20:12] <rav30> replaced-url
1386 [12:20:30] <annadane> the image... doesn't load. lovely.
1387 [12:20:31] <rav30> help
1388 [12:20:37] <rav30> oh
1389 [12:20:41] <rav30> one moment
1390 [12:21:38] *** Joins: asymptotically (~asymptoti@replaced-ip )
1391 [12:22:02] <rav30> replaced-url
1392 [12:22:09] <rav30> here
1393 [12:22:12] <rav30> the image should work
1394 [12:22:23] <annadane> apt install firmware-realtek, reboot
1395 [12:22:32] <annadane> (not with the comma, i mean reboot after you do that)
1396 [12:22:55] *** Quits: flo2marsnet (~flo2marsn@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
1397 [12:23:08] <rav30> e: unable to locate package firmware-realtek
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1399 [12:23:37] *** Quits: platvoeten (~platvoete@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1400 [12:23:39] <rav30> anyways this network is extremely slow anyways
1401 [12:23:40] <annadane> apt edit-sources, put contrib non-free next to your entries
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1403 [12:23:54] <rav30> is it possible to download the deb and just dpkg it
1404 [12:23:56] <annadane> then close the editor and 'apt update'
1405 [12:24:15] <rav30> e:invalid operation edit-sources
1406 [12:24:15] <annadane> probably, yeah, but i wouldn't think that'd be any faster
1407 [12:24:26] <rav30> no, i can hop on over to my other computer
1408 [12:24:30] *** Quits: SniperCZE (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1409 [12:24:31] <annadane> uh, what...
1410 [12:24:35] *** Quits: ARKANOID (~DINOWILLI@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1411 [12:24:36] <rav30> and then download the deb, transfer it to my pc and then install it
1412 [12:24:56] <rav30> im not kidding thats what it literally says
1413 [12:25:03] <Ede|Popede> but check for dependencies
1414 [12:25:09] <rav30> unless you meant find the sources list itself?
1415 [12:25:27] <annadane> well, try nano /etc/apt/sources.list then
1416 [12:25:45] <annadane> anyway, assuming you're on buster, replaced-url
1417 [12:25:57] <annadane> (i don't think there *are* any dependencies, that shouldn't be an issue)
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1420 [12:26:55] <rav30> one moment let me try that
1421 [12:27:02] <Ede|Popede> are firmwares free of them? the only non-free thing i ever used was some nvidia blob years ago
1422 [12:27:18] <annadane> idk.
1423 [12:27:29] <annadane> i just know of firmware-realtek because i've installed it and it's only ever installed that
1424 [12:27:57] *** Quits: Slashman (~Slash@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
1425 [12:28:01] <rav30> i wish there was a debian discord server lol
1426 [12:28:04] *** Quits: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC 1.7.4 - ##replaced-url
1427 [12:28:05] <rav30> irc is so hard
1428 [12:28:43] <FinalX> never going back to Discord again, intrusive piece of crap
1429 [12:28:49] <Ede|Popede> ah, nice. i have a non-networked pc i ran for some time from live and that's how i also added some really needed tools there. took some time to get all the dependencies for all of them xD
1430 [12:28:49] <rav30> eh
1431 [12:29:09] <FinalX> can't even disable it hooking into audio equipment.. there's simply no options for it
1432 [12:29:11] <annadane> irc is an open protocol, discord is closed, i know what i prefer
1433 [12:29:16] <annadane> unfortunately network effects blah blah blah
1434 [12:29:28] <FinalX> I don't want it to take over my audio equipment just because some Discord channel has voice chat enabled
1435 [12:29:48] <Ede|Popede> and irc is text only, discord is electron crap
1436 [12:30:04] <FinalX> plus my guild on WoW was raiding and Discord didn't work properly with the voice chat for half the team while they were in the middle of a fight, they all went back to TS3 right after
1437 [12:30:16] *** Joins: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip )
1438 [12:30:30] *** Joins: MenschZwoNull (~MenschZwo@replaced-ip )
1439 [12:30:31] <FinalX> Discord changes my audio output settings, too, suddenly had phone stero instead of regular audio on my BT headset, etc.
1440 [12:30:41] <FinalX> like wtf, don't touch it unless I tell you to. and no option to diable it touching it either.
1441 [12:30:42] <rav30> what is ts3
1442 [12:30:43] <annadane> re: firmware dependencies, you're talking about really small units, so i wouldn't expect dependencies
1443 [12:30:48] <annadane> obviously nvidia pulls in a million things
1444 [12:30:54] <Ede|Popede> heh. definitely better. had TS for some time, ressources never were an issue. start electron and watch everything slowing down thanks to swapping
1445 [12:30:54] <FinalX> teamspeak
1446 [12:31:17] <FinalX> I have a 500-user license for TS, works great.. multiple guilds on the same server, don't even notice it resource-wise.
1447 [12:31:21] <annadane> 'apt depends firmware-realtek' doesn't have anything
1448 [12:31:32] <FinalX> and neither do they, it just works
1449 [12:32:14] <Ede|Popede> using electron first of all means "we don't care"
1450 [12:32:26] *** Quits: nalakawula (~nalakawul@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1451 [12:32:26] <annadane> at least on irc you can begin with a discussion of a frustrating internet problem and end up bitching about discord and bad features
1452 [12:32:33] <FinalX> haha
1453 [12:32:42] *** Joins: SniperCZE_ (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip )
1454 [12:33:10] *** Joins: nalakawula (~nalakawul@replaced-ip )
1455 [12:33:18] <Ede|Popede> had a look at Franz when it came up, nice idea, one client to tame them all. but only activating some modules (not even connecting to any server) had to be paid with a lot of load.
1456 [12:33:37] *** Joins: Gaaab (~Gaaab@replaced-ip )
1457 [12:33:43] <Ede|Popede> (why Franz? well, electron again)
1458 [12:33:52] <annadane> there's kinda no such thing as 'free as in beer but also we will guarantee we'll always act in the interests of the user'
1459 [12:34:01] <annadane> i half expect signal to start tracking people and showing ad
1460 [12:34:02] <annadane> s
1461 [12:34:28] <Ede|Popede> yeah, the old "the devs don't owe you anything"
1462 [12:34:47] <annadane> which is true but like, to talk to my friends on discord or whatever other walled garden i need to use it
1463 [12:34:50] *** Quits: SniperCZE (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
1464 [12:34:54] <annadane> "just switch" doesn't work, sorry
1465 [12:34:55] <Ede|Popede> which is literally correct, but things should still be done the right way
1466 [12:35:44] <annadane> i don't know if GDPR has problems or not but at least it will *start* marketing departments on the right direction of "hey, don't treat consumers like an asshole"
1467 [12:35:45] <Ede|Popede> it's not even about the software, but of the data you exchange, if in form of a file or stream
1468 [12:36:08] *** Quits: alex-helfet (~alex@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1469 [12:36:23] *** Joins: Anderson69se (~Anderson6@replaced-ip )
1470 [12:36:31] <Ede|Popede> i don't think it will affect the real big ones. france makes fb pay some millions, who cares.
1471 [12:36:48] <annadane> so uh... did rav fix the problem? :P
1472 [12:36:50] *** Joins: Aussie_matt_ (~quassel@replaced-ip )
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1474 [12:37:04] *** Quits: ahalo (~fx@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
1475 [12:37:09] <Ede|Popede> and half of the people responsible don't care, while the other half has no clue about this "internet"
1476 [12:37:29] <Ede|Popede> rav30, how's it working?
1477 [12:38:03] <annadane> discord was also meant to be the skype replacement, which people abandoned because it is basically the single worst piece of software i've ever used
1478 [12:38:06] <annadane> (thanks, microsoft)
1479 [12:38:18] *** Quits: Gaaab (~Gaaab@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
1480 [12:38:28] <rav30> im rebooting rn
1481 [12:38:35] <rav30> figers crossed
1482 [12:38:46] * annadane looks at arthritic hands
1483 [12:38:56] <han-solo> we still use skype for internal meetings, going Okayish
1484 [12:39:05] *** Quits: Anderson69s (~Anderson6@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1485 [12:39:25] <Ede|Popede> i had to drop it twice: first time when they switched to "pulseaudio only" until i got this thing running, then later again when they switched to electron. a messenger in need of a dedicated machine, that's ridiculous.
1486 [12:40:05] <rav30> ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME
1487 [12:40:07] <rav30> it doesnt work
1488 [12:40:10] <rav30> UGHHHHHHHHHHHH
1489 [12:40:24] <annadane> what did you do? install it via apt or through downloading the .deb?
1490 [12:40:26] <Ede|Popede> still doesn't load?
1491 [12:40:32] *** Quits: atrio69 (~atrio69@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1492 [12:40:36] <rav30> downloading the deb
1493 [12:40:43] <annadane> you did dpkg -i?
1494 [12:40:44] <rav30> it installed fine i suppose
1495 [12:40:46] <rav30> yes
1496 [12:41:02] <rav30> the only thing weird is that it spouted stuff about nvidia firmware
1497 [12:41:08] <rav30> but that shouldn’t be relevant
1498 [12:41:09] <annadane> well, i'm out of ideas. at least people are waking up now on the east coast so if you stick around you may get some answerd
1499 [12:41:11] <annadane> answers
1500 [12:41:16] *** Quits: TwistedFate (~quassel@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ##replaced-url
1501 [12:41:18] <rav30> oh nooooo
1502 [12:41:22] <rav30> FUUUUU
1503 [12:41:31] *** Joins: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip )
1504 [12:41:39] <annadane> hey FinalX, any hints? you're much smarter than i am
1505 [12:41:52] <rav30> maybe its a network config thing?
1506 [12:41:56] <Ede|Popede> someone was mentioning 'apt install' as better alternative to 'dpkg -i' though i don't remember exactly why.
1507 [12:42:00] <rav30> this also happened to me in void install
1508 [12:42:05] *** Quits: Xeyame (~Xeyame@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1509 [12:42:19] <han-solo> Ede|Popede: takes care of dependencies ?
1510 [12:42:21] <rav30> when I was trying out void linux an extremely similar issue happened
1511 [12:42:30] <Ede|Popede> han-solo: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
1512 [12:42:30] *** Quits: avantgardist (~desktop@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1513 [12:43:13] <han-solo> i don't think, dpkg resolves dependencies on teh fly, i mean, it doesn't install atleast. But apt certainly can, i'd guess
1514 [12:43:14] *** Joins: alex-helfet (~alex@replaced-ip )
1515 [12:43:38] <rav30> help
1516 [12:43:43] *** Joins: Gaaab (~Gaaab@replaced-ip )
1517 [12:43:44] <annadane> rav30, if people here really don't know then try ##linux
1518 [12:43:49] <annadane> it has more people
1519 [12:44:10] <rav30> HNGNGNRNUWUFNJSUAHWBDKIC
1520 [12:44:14] *** Quits: Haudegen (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Bin weg.)
1521 [12:44:18] <Ede|Popede> i used dpkg -l on that other machine, had just some .deb files in a directory, netsurf didn't install due to missing deps. well, dpkg complained about it.
1522 [12:44:18] *** Quits: SniperCZE_ (~SniperCZE@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1523 [12:44:20] <rav30> its 3am in the morning where I live
1524 [12:44:23] *** Quits: n_1-c_k (~n_1-c_k@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1525 [12:44:35] <rav30> i really wanna get this done. does anyone have any ideas plz
1526 [12:44:39] <Ede|Popede> !ugt
1527 [12:44:39] <dpkg> Universal Greeting Time (UGT) asserts that whenever somebody enters an IRC channel it is always morning, and it is always late when the person leaves. The local time of any other people in the channel, including the greeter, is irrelevant.
1528 [12:44:52] <rav30> ?
1529 [12:45:04] <rav30> no idea what that means
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1531 [12:45:17] <Ede|Popede> 3am is an argument if you feel like bedtime, but at any local time there may be someone around
1532 [12:45:36] *** Joins: ensamvarg (~ensamvarg@replaced-ip )
1533 [12:46:01] <Ede|Popede> so if you feel tired maybe it would be best you'd stop it for now and retry later when you're fit again
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1537 [12:46:27] *** Joins: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip )
1538 [12:46:28] <rav30> nooooo
1539 [12:46:32] <annadane> it's a weekday, and it's early morning on the east coast when people are waking up, so i bet there'll be some people coming in.
1540 [12:47:44] <rav30> what default network system does debian use
1541 [12:47:53] <rav30> (i.e, network manager)
1542 [12:47:59] <rav30> how do I switch to another one
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1544 [12:48:14] <rav30> because fedora, arch, and ubuntu all work with my wifi
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1546 [12:48:19] *** Quits: nalakawula (~nalakawul@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1547 [12:48:19] <rav30> that must be the issue i think
1548 [12:48:32] <rav30> Help
1549 [12:48:40] *** Quits: mossylane (~mossylane@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
1550 [12:48:55] <rav30> how do I switch from whatever extremely shitty network system debian has to one that works with my hardware
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1553 [12:49:33] <annadane> what desktop are you using, and do you know which program you're trying to use to connect?
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1555 [12:49:59] <annadane> (latter question is more important, really)
1556 [12:50:03] <rav30> sorry went offline again
1557 [12:50:09] <rav30> you were saying?
1558 [12:50:10] <annadane> do you know which program you're trying to use to connect?
1559 [12:50:26] <rav30> well, I have debian xfce if that helps
1560 [12:50:37] <annadane> did you select 'xfce' within the installer?
1561 [12:50:42] <rav30> Yes
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1563 [12:50:45] <annadane> okay, one moment
1564 [12:51:16] <annadane> "recommends: network-manager-gnome"
1565 [12:51:37] <rav30> so do I install that?
1566 [12:51:53] <annadane> no, that's what's already installed
1567 [12:51:58] <annadane> i'm looking for alternatives
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1569 [12:53:11] <annadane> i suppose you can try wicd-gtk
1570 [12:53:24] <annadane> (keep in mind i'm not an expert in this, sorry)
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1572 [12:53:52] <sponix> annadane: you should be
1573 [12:54:04] <annadane> !lart sponix
1574 [12:54:05] * dpkg hauls sponix up by the scruff of the neck and spanks him until he waddles
1575 [12:54:34] <sponix> rav30: are you using Wireless for your network ?
1576 [12:55:20] <annadane> i know some people really don't like network-manager so while i wouldn't think using a different tool would make a difference normally...
1577 [12:55:35] <rav30> yes but also no
1578 [12:55:36] <Ede|Popede> heh. my nm-applet was gone. again. didn't even realize it.
1579 [12:55:45] <rav30> i do have wifi but it doesnt work
1580 [12:55:52] <rav30> But i also have usb tethering from my phone
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1582 [12:55:57] <rav30> That doesnt work either
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1589 [12:57:29] <sponix> rav30: this on a laptop ?
1590 [12:57:40] <rav30> no
1591 [12:57:41] <rav30> Desktop
1592 [12:58:48] *** Joins: rav31 (70cf6721@replaced-ip )
1593 [12:58:52] <rav31> hello
1594 [12:58:54] <sponix> rav30: sudo install inxi && inxi -Nxx | nc termbin.com 9999
1595 [12:59:03] <rav31> i'm on my laptop now so I can type much faster
1596 [12:59:06] <sponix> drop the link provided here
1597 [12:59:09] <rav31> one moment
1598 [12:59:12] <rav31> wait
1599 [12:59:18] <rav31> i can't download shit because it's so slow
1600 [12:59:20] <rav31> uhhh
1601 [12:59:31] <sponix> That should be very small
1602 [12:59:32] <rav31> one sec
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1604 [12:59:50] <Megaf> Hi all, I accidentally removed the /dev/initctl file, is that too bad?
1605 [12:59:54] <loupe> I would like to know how to recommend a software for inclusion into Debian. This is the software:
1606 [12:59:55] <loupe> replaced-url
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1610 [13:00:37] <sponix> ,v drm
1611 [13:00:38] <judd> No package named 'drm' was found in amd64.
1612 [13:00:42] <ratrace> Megaf: /dev stuff repopulates on boot
1613 [13:00:55] <ratrace> meanwhile it seems to be a symlink into /run
1614 [13:01:02] <rav31> sponix by sudo install you mean sudo apt install right?
1615 [13:01:10] <Megaf> So I figured, but just to be sure, thanks
1616 [13:01:13] <sponix> rav31: Yeah
1617 [13:01:16] <annadane> loupe, we're not developers, most of us. take a look at replaced-url
1618 [13:01:21] <jelly> !rfp
1619 [13:01:21] <dpkg> Request For Package (RFP) is the way to ask for a piece of software to be included in Debian. See replaced-url
1620 [13:01:25] <annadane> yeah, or that.
1621 [13:01:25] <jelly> loupe: ^
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1623 [13:01:40] <ratrace> dearmotherofpenguin, initctl that's upstart.... still in buster....
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1628 [13:02:35] <rav31> I might as well recap what's going on here. I have extremely slow internet. All methods of connection share the issue; Wifi, Ethernet, USB Tethering.
1629 [13:02:44] <rav31> I do get internet, but it's very very extremely slow
1630 [13:02:56] <rav31> Like, can't even reach front page of youtube slow
1631 [13:03:16] <annadane> rav31 shared the output of dmesg | grep firmware, i said to install firmware-realtek, which was installed via dpkg -i, and the problem has apparently persisted
1632 [13:03:18] <rav31> I'm checking apt right now as it's downloading and it seems I'm getting around 8b per second
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1635 [13:03:46] <han-solo> rav31: been there, so long ago :)
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1637 [13:04:00] <rav31> han-solo well what did you do to fix it?
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1639 [13:04:11] <han-solo> i mean, the 8b per second
1640 [13:04:16] <rav31> oof
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1643 [13:04:51] <rav31> @spo
1644 [13:05:02] *** Quits: dpkg (~dpkg@replaced-ip ) (Quit: buh bye!)
1645 [13:05:04] <rav31> sponix even installing the thing is taking forever
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1648 [13:05:19] <rav31> i don't think i'll be able to as it's downloading some dependencies
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1650 [13:05:41] <sponix> rav31: hard to tell what you need without knowing your hardware :)
1651 [13:05:54] <sponix> annadane: you know his stuff is realtek ?
1652 [13:05:59] <annadane> yep
1653 [13:06:01] <annadane> it was rtl_nic
1654 [13:06:07] <rav31> I have a MediaTek mt7601u wifi adapter
1655 [13:06:11] <rav31> and a realtek ethernet adapter
1656 [13:06:14] <rav31> both of which don't work
1657 [13:06:23] <rav31> the wifi doesn't connect at all
1658 [13:06:32] <rav31> and ethernet / usb tethering "works" but with extremely slow speeds
1659 [13:06:39] <sponix> annadane: you go over how to add contrib non-free to sources.list -- so he can install that firmware package ?
1660 [13:06:53] <annadane> yep
1661 [13:06:54] <rav31> she did but uhhh
1662 [13:06:57] <rav31> it didn't work
1663 [13:07:04] <rav31> my mirror that i'm using is mirror.rise.ph i think
1664 [13:07:05] <annadane> replaced-url
1665 [13:07:09] <rav31> since it's the one thats closes to my country
1666 [13:07:16] <jelly> rav31: mt7610u ? It's a pain in the ass to make it work, get a better wifi stick
1667 [13:07:31] <rav31> ikr, but it's cheap af
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1670 [13:07:39] <rav31> don't have money for a wifi card
1671 [13:07:46] <rav31> and at least this one has a lot of people using it
1672 [13:07:53] <annadane> rav31 also said that the installer and all that was fine *shrug*
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1675 [13:08:02] <rav31> i had a very similar internet issue with void linux
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1677 [13:08:05] <annadane> yet was really slow when the system was actually booted into
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1679 [13:08:16] <rav31> so maybe again, its because they might use the same shitty network config
1680 [13:08:22] <rav31> so i might switch to a new one
1681 [13:08:45] <jelly> find an atheros-based one if you can
1682 [13:09:31] <rav31> okay, but that still doesn't explain why ALL internet for debian is shit
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1684 [13:09:45] <rav31> fedora, ubuntu, manjaro, even fucking arch works with it
1685 [13:09:58] <rav31> it's just debian and void that are not working with my networking hardware
1686 [13:10:11] <annadane> if that mirror is in the sources.list, presumably it means the same mirror was used for the install...
1687 [13:10:21] <annadane> i *guess* you can try switching to deb.debian.org
1688 [13:10:30] <jelly> rav31: missing firmware, and possibly older kernel
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1690 [13:10:36] <jelly> but usually it's firmware
1691 [13:10:50] <annadane> yeah hence my saying to install firmware-realtek
1692 [13:10:56] <rav31> ubuntu 18 has the same kernel as debian 10
1693 [13:10:58] <rav31> yet that works
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1696 [13:11:34] <jelly> as for mt7610u it doesn't work _reliably_ well even with the driver
1697 [13:11:37] <jelly> and firmware
1698 [13:12:13] <rav31> i mean i have downloaded entire 20gb games with that thing
1699 [13:12:19] <rav31> ON LINUX
1700 [13:12:51] <jelly> that's good news, at least it works for someone
1701 [13:13:52] <sponix> rav31: Ubuntu ships with "nonfree" firmware .. Debian 10 does not (has it split off)
1702 [13:14:25] <rav31> that's not it
1703 [13:14:42] <rav31> because I SPECIFICALLY downloaded the nonfree debian image
1704 [13:14:47] <rav31> and it still has the same issue
1705 [13:14:51] <sponix> odd
1706 [13:14:54] <rav31> ikr
1707 [13:15:02] <rav31> i might just switch to fedora or something idk
1708 [13:15:29] <rav31> they do have a really good discord server
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1710 [13:15:42] <rav31> (but I like debian's stance on free software more)
1711 [13:15:46] <sponix> rav31: you might try booting the "MX Linux" live USB installer stick, and see if it does better for you network wise out of the box. It is _based_ on Debian 10, but has extras
1712 [13:15:47] <rav31> although fedora is close enough
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1715 [13:16:57] <rav31> the thing is I do want my operating system to be as close to free software as possible
1716 [13:17:14] <rav31> i am making an exception for nonfree firmware
1717 [13:17:18] <rav31> since thats necessary
1718 [13:17:38] <rav31> but like, for example I can't use arch, since it mixes some nonfree stuff in its normal repositories
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1720 [13:17:46] <rav31> would like the main repository and nonfree one to be seperate
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1723 [13:19:15] <annadane> i am actually gonna reboot for a minute, brb (though i doubt i'm very much help to you anyway)
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1726 [13:20:00] <rav3119> hi sorry it disconnected
1727 [13:20:02] <rav3119> brb for a sec
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1812 [14:03:29] <MarioMey> Hello, there. I have this command I want to use to convert 3gp files to mp4 without reencoding. It doesn't work (I think) because spaces in paths and files names. How to fix it?
1813 [14:03:32] <MarioMey> find . -name "*.3gp" | while read f; do echo "Converting $f"; ffmpeg -i "$f" -c:v copy -c:a copy "${f:0: -4}.mp4"; done
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1815 [14:05:00] <dvs> MarioMey, Use the -exec option for find?
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1817 [14:05:27] <themill> !using find
1818 [14:05:27] <dpkg> using find is probably replaced-url
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1853 [14:22:56] <MarioMey> dvs: Yes, maybe (I'm reading themill link), but how to reproduce the "${f:0: -4}.mp4" thing?
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1875 [14:38:24] <unixfu-> ok so i have debian 10, i have installed vlc, but when going to Places in mate desktop.. whenever i choose to browse a directory under Places thru the panel, it launches vlc.. hmm maybe it's my auto default for opening a dir somehow got switched, hehe
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1878 [14:38:55] <unixfu-> so when i try to goto my home folder in Places in mate desktop, it wants to load each file in my homedir into vlc queue list, :/
1879 [14:39:29] <unixfu-> instead of popping up caja or equal filebrowser
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1881 [14:39:49] <unixfu-> it opens vlc and loads my homedir files into vlc queue list, hmmmf
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1883 [14:40:38] <Ede|Popede> unixfu-: mate should have something similar to xfce's mime type editor (would probably be inode/directory)
1884 [14:40:57] <unixfu-> yah i lookn around
1885 [14:41:14] <unixfu-> not that big of an issue, i just didnt want the bug to go unnoticed if it is a bug.. that's all.. ^_^
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1887 [14:41:34] <unixfu-> i'm the reason the paths of the shell hafta be encapsulated now ' ' hehe
1888 [14:41:50] <unixfu-> i'll keep you guys up2date if i find anymore bugs, thx
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1892 [14:42:31] <Ede|Popede> hm, there may be multiple options what to do with a specific mime type... like for a directory to cd into it or to enqueue it to vlc. wrong priorities maybe?
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1894 [14:43:01] <unixfu-> perhaps but how to tell the shell or gui to open folders into caja not vlc
1895 [14:43:11] <unixfu-> if i right click and goto properties after opening caja thru Applications menu
1896 [14:43:25] <unixfu-> it tells me no option for "Open with this prefix or app", etc
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1898 [14:43:37] <unixfu-> im looking in mate tweak for the mime default types
1899 [14:43:47] <unixfu-> does this relate to gid 022 prob.?
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1901 [14:44:31] <unixfu-> like the properties panel doesn't give a sub menu tab for like it would for say, if you right click any other file besides a dir, you can select 'Open with this app.. or custom cmd' option
1902 [14:44:34] <unixfu-> maybe that needs to be fixed
1903 [14:44:36] <Ede|Popede> 022 looks like dmask to me
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1905 [14:44:47] <unixfu-> cool cool, thx m8
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1909 [14:46:11] <a0z> MarioMey: not sure, but try ${f[@]/%3gp/mp4}
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1927 [15:01:51] <Ede|Popede> is this to replace the extension? i always use that {%/.foo} or whatever bash thing (and everytime i have to remember the exact syntax)
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1933 [15:04:59] <inch> Is it possible to make a debian binary package depend on the exact version of a build-dependency without writing the version number to the control file?
1934 [15:05:37] <inch> I mean depend on the version of package foo that happens to be installed at compile time.
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1944 [15:13:05] <jelly> inch: if it's a dynamic library, the version will depend on actual symbols used
1945 [15:17:59] <unixfu-> inch: if you compare filesize of the dependency and compare it to be not equal due to version difference
1946 [15:18:12] <unixfu-> as versions have code updates wheteher added or subtracted or altered, it changes filesize most the time
1947 [15:18:15] <unixfu-> you can count the bytes
1948 [15:18:50] <unixfu-> so it wont run if certain dependency file != required size..
1949 [15:19:05] <unixfu-> yes it's possible without having to write the ver. #
1950 [15:19:08] <unixfu-> ;)
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1952 [15:19:56] <unixfu-> Ede|Popede, usually {} means to get the hard value of what's inside the brackets or squigglys { }
1953 [15:20:54] <unixfu-> how do u chk or change dmask? i forgot
1954 [15:20:57] <ilikeyou> hi. I'd like to blacklist a package from being installed from DebianLive live-build environment. Nouveau is being loaded by default despite having installed a proprietary. is this possible?
1955 [15:21:07] <unixfu-> blacklist it
1956 [15:21:12] <unixfu-> edit your grub
1957 [15:21:17] <unixfu-> don't forget to update-grub or build initramfs
1958 [15:21:29] <unixfu-> or add it to modules blacklist file and reboot
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1960 [15:24:25] <swordsing> any znc users here ?
1961 [15:24:41] <ilikeyou> unixfu-: was that meant for me? its a live build I'm working with. live iso
1962 [15:25:00] <unixfu-> ahh\
1963 [15:25:06] <unixfu-> i forgot u said that
1964 [15:25:08] <unixfu-> i'm sry
1965 [15:25:14] <unixfu-> ye swordsing, whats the prob.?
1966 [15:25:34] <unixfu-> try apt build-dep znc (to resolve dependency issue of compiling a znc module)
1967 [15:25:40] <unixfu-> if you installed it from the src
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1969 [15:26:20] <swordsing> i have a really odd problem with a somewhat messed around with default debian install on a vps, i can alunch and run znc and i can ping my server, but i cant connect to my znc instance ether via browser or via client
1970 [15:26:55] <swordsing> i can p[ing the server and my server instance is up and authed
1971 [15:27:02] <unixfu-> can u see it running on a port tho
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1973 [15:27:13] <unixfu-> netstat -axte | grep $znc_port_#
1974 [15:27:26] <unixfu-> so if u listen znc on +1777
1975 [15:27:30] <unixfu-> then netstat -axte | grep 1777
1976 [15:27:35] <unixfu-> see if it list it as running and listening on 1777
1977 [15:27:44] <unixfu-> would be 1st option to chk out ^^
1978 [15:27:50] <swordsing> kk 2 secs
1979 [15:27:52] <unixfu-> or ps -auxgw | grep znc
1980 [15:27:59] <unixfu-> to see if znc is running at all
1981 [15:28:04] <unixfu-> np, brb
1982 [15:28:09] <unixfu-> 8)
1983 [15:28:21] <unixfu-> btw, you set znc port# in config when u first configure it after installing, u kno
1984 [15:28:37] <swordsing> znc is definatel y running i checked that the account is up and authed
1985 [15:28:41] <unixfu-> usually too, if you cant telnet i.p.a.b:port then nothing else is going to connect to it either
1986 [15:28:50] <inch> unixfu-: I don't get it. What can I write to control file to make it compare sizes? And how will that change the version in Depends in the binary package?
1987 [15:28:50] <unixfu-> if the account is up and authorized
1988 [15:28:54] <swordsing> this is a migration btw
1989 [15:28:55] <unixfu-> then how did you connect to it?
1990 [15:29:00] <unixfu-> when u said you couldn't connect via client
1991 [15:29:05] <unixfu-> ahhh
1992 [15:29:06] <unixfu-> i see
1993 [15:29:14] <unixfu-> i dunno, i brb tho, i gots to peeeeeeeeeeeee
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1995 [15:29:37] <unixfu-> inch: only if you were making custom scripting would you utilize what i said
1996 [15:29:43] <unixfu-> it's not for the normal user to comprehend that level
1997 [15:29:44] <unixfu-> sry
1998 [15:29:45] <unixfu-> xD
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2000 [15:30:27] <inch> I'm not exactly a normal user.
2001 [15:31:21] <swordsing> well i confermed it from this irssi instance on the swame server lol
2002 [15:31:41] <inch> Sure I could write a script that looks a version and puts it in the control file.
2003 [15:35:54] <swordsing> unixfu-: set znc port number in previous config, dont see anything znc on netstat for znc or that port tho
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2007 [15:40:00] <jelly> inch: I think that was meant for some other support question. Try asking in #packaging over on irc.oftc.net if there's no progress here
2008 [15:40:11] <swordsing> i did have a problem with this server where i had to create and add the user to the ssd and sftp defauly groups becouse they did not gety set up .. am i missing sometyhing dumb here
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2012 [15:45:27] <jelly> swordsing: debian does not need or use groups to limit ssh or sftp access by default
2013 [15:45:59] <jelly> even root can do ssh, but only with key not password
2014 [15:46:23] <swordsing> jelly: this is sadly an isps install iso where they have clearly fucked around with some configs
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2016 [15:48:32] <swordsing> are there any defult groups users need to be in to do any networking task ? even if they are a depriciated method ?
2017 [15:48:47] <greycat> No.
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2021 [15:50:28] <greycat> Debian is extremely traditional. By default, everything works the way Unix/Linux has always worked: only root can listen on ports under 1024, but listening on ports above 1024 is allowed, and all outgoing stuff is allowed.
2022 [15:50:49] <nevyn> to configure networking you need to be in netdev
2023 [15:50:59] <jelly> swordsing: there might be a firewall blocking incoming connections by default. Does your VPS have a public IP address at all?
2024 [15:51:51] <swordsing> jelly: my public faceing ip is what im msging from /whois and it should pop right up
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2027 [15:52:24] <swordsing> let me try adding user to netdev
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2032 [15:53:29] <nevyn> swordsing: if you're just trying to listen on a port then you don't need it
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2036 [15:54:10] <nevyn> as long as the port isn't below 1025 then you shouldn't have an issue.
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2038 [15:54:43] <Habbie> (below 1024)
2039 [15:54:46] <tradar> greycat: there is a list of all system groups used in debian? (used from the available packages in debian's repos)
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2041 [15:55:14] <greycat> No, because the list is not "fixed". There are some created during installation, but a bunch more are created when you install a package that needs one.
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2044 [15:55:36] <tradar> Yeah. I would like to know if they are documented somewhere.
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2046 [15:55:46] <greycat> So, two different Debian systems may have different system users/groups, depending on what's installed, and the order in which it was installed.
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2049 [15:56:29] * nevyn wishes debian actually fixed gid's for those groups
2050 [15:56:33] <tradar> Yeah. It would be nice to have a list telling you "installing package ABC will create the group _AAAB"
2051 [15:57:23] <nevyn> and for large installs it would be handy to be able to prepopulate them into ldap and have consistancy
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2053 [15:57:43] <pemensik> hello. I have issue with systemd-networkd configuring forewer in my debian container
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2061 [16:00:25] <unixfu-> 12134
2062 [16:00:29] <unixfu-> 1234
2063 [16:00:45] <unixfu-> pemensik, netplan is your friend
2064 [16:01:15] <jelly> unixfu-: netplan is not available in debian 10 at all
2065 [16:01:21] <pemensik> unixfu-, is networkd unsupported?
2066 [16:01:39] <pemensik> i have debian unstable and unable to upgrade just now
2067 [16:01:56] <jelly> pemensik: which OS and kernel on the host?
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2069 [16:02:30] <pemensik> Fedora 29, kernel 5.2.18-100.fc29.x86_64, connected to libvirt managed network
2070 [16:02:42] <jelly> that seems fresh enough
2071 [16:02:52] <ratrace> and netplan is NOBODY'S friend
2072 [16:02:54] <tradar> nevyn: easier, i wish mantainers tell in advance if their packages add new groups (and it would be nice this information be available from dpkg-query)
2073 [16:03:00] <pemensik> used to work, but do not remember when it was last time
2074 [16:03:05] <jelly> pemensik: wait libvirt, are you using a full VM or an actual container?
2075 [16:03:07] *** Joins: archios (~archios@replaced-ip )
2076 [16:03:10] *** Joins: stoffepojken (stoffe@replaced-ip )
2077 [16:03:34] <pemensik> jelly, this is container. libvirt is reused to provide network interface
2078 [16:03:49] <pemensik> systemd container
2079 [16:03:56] <ratrace> libvirt does LXC too yeah
2080 [16:03:59] <swordsing> ok i think im in lol
2081 [16:04:01] <jelly> unixfu-: best avoid commenting on tech issues unless you have actual hands-on experience with subject matter on Debian
2082 [16:04:08] <unixfu-> oh i was unaware jelly, didnt know that. thanx
2083 [16:04:18] <unixfu-> how do you get ifconfig back or is that way deprecated now>?
2084 [16:04:25] <greycat> install the net-tools package
2085 [16:05:07] <unixfu-> cool
2086 [16:05:16] <pemensik> have systemd 241-3
2087 [16:05:17] <unixfu-> i idle now until i find new bug(s) :D
2088 [16:05:29] <jelly> pemensik: sorry, I have no clue. Presumably networkd ought to work if you have a systemd inside container. But it's unstable so things might be broken
2089 [16:05:33] *** Quits: Plan_IX (~P9@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2090 [16:05:35] <jelly> !debian-next
2091 [16:05:35] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
2092 [16:05:52] *** Joins: njka (~njka@replaced-ip )
2093 [16:05:59] <jelly> pemensik: ^ for your testing or unstable needs. Be prepared to do your homework and check for existing bug reports
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2096 [16:07:05] <unixfu-> so any1 know how i can bridge network with aqemu settings like virtualbox bridgenetworking, ofc i need to set pre defined mac addr
2097 [16:07:10] *** Quits: deleuze6 (~deleuze@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2098 [16:07:20] <tradar> greycat: different Debian systems have different system users/groups not only depending on what is installed, but also on what *was* installed. Because the leftovers are uhm left over.
2099 [16:07:30] <greycat> correct
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2102 [16:07:48] <swordsmanz> thankyou everyone for your assiatance
2103 [16:07:51] *** Joins: Plan_IX (~P9@replaced-ip )
2104 [16:07:54] <unixfu-> bc i think i would rather run virtualization containers with aqemu other than oracles virtualbox, personal preference tho. tryin to stay away from oracle but their virtualbox bridge networking feature seems to be beneficial to my current setup with VPS's networkin probs i ran into
2105 [16:08:12] *** Quits: talooooo (~talooooo@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2106 [16:08:23] <unixfu-> taboo
2107 [16:09:01] <unixfu-> any1 know how to do same thing as bridge networking in virtualbox as to with aqemu ?
2108 [16:09:09] <unixfu-> thx in advanced!
2109 [16:09:30] <unixfu-> it's came a long ways..
2110 [16:09:48] *** Joins: cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip )
2111 [16:10:12] <unixfu-> how does ip end with 0. is that a oper spoof?
2112 [16:10:17] <unixfu-> cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip ) has joined
2113 [16:10:23] <unixfu-> cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip ) has joined
2114 [16:10:26] *** Quits: njka (~njka@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2115 [16:10:36] <unixfu-> or tor / ipv6 design flaw?
2116 [16:10:50] <unixfu-> got rid of VLC ug
2117 [16:10:54] <unixfu-> got rid of VLC bug
2118 [16:11:01] <ratrace> !enter
2119 [16:11:01] <dpkg> The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
2120 [16:11:02] <unixfu-> resolution: apt remove vlc && apt purge vlc
2121 [16:11:03] <greycat> An IP address with .0 on the end is perfect legal if the network's netmask is large enough.
2122 [16:11:17] <unixfu-> o cool
2123 [16:11:25] <unixfu-> so like, a /28 ?
2124 [16:11:34] <greycat> A /23 or larger would do it.
2125 [16:11:36] <unixfu-> with 256 addresses, hmm
2126 [16:11:40] <unixfu-> cool man, thx
2127 [16:11:44] <ratrace> tradar: I like how it's dealt with on FreeBSD ports. there's a list, so package maintainers have a reference and can't clobber each other's uids
2128 [16:12:02] <greycat> A /24 has 256 (really 254) legal addresses. A /23 has 512 (really 510), and one of them ends with 0.
2129 [16:12:23] <unixfu-> nice
2130 [16:12:27] <unixfu-> doesn't make much sense to me tho
2131 [16:12:41] <unixfu-> i guess you hafta have the broadcast and gateway so 256-2 = 254
2132 [16:12:43] *** Quits: finalbeta (~finalbeta@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2133 [16:12:54] <tradar> ratrace: yeah ... too bad there is no list for debian.
2134 [16:12:54] <unixfu-> but how do you get 512 or 510 addresses within one octect of ipv4/
2135 [16:12:58] <greycat> An IPv4 address has 32 bits, which are divided between the network and the host. A /24 uses 24 bits for the network, 8 bits for the host, so it has 2^8 = 256 possible host addresses.
2136 [16:13:29] <unixfu-> exactly, but u just said a /23 has 512 or really 510 addresses but that can't fit into normal ip routing unless you can do 0-999 a.b.c.d
2137 [16:13:38] <unixfu-> i thought ipv4 was limited to 255
2138 [16:13:40] <unixfu-> 0-255
2139 [16:13:41] *** Quits: Pjusur (~Pjusur@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2140 [16:13:55] <greycat> You're assuming that the octets match up with the host or network addresses. That ONLY happens in a /24, because 24 is a multiple of 8.
2141 [16:14:03] *** Joins: twobitsprite (~isaac@replaced-ip )
2142 [16:14:03] <nevyn> unixfu-: a network.. can be on any bit boundary
2143 [16:14:05] <inch> fg
2144 [16:14:12] <greycat> In a /23 network, the host address spills over into the third octet.
2145 [16:14:20] <unixfu-> ok fml running sidewayz, i learned networking by trial n error, hehe
2146 [16:14:31] <unixfu-> i see, very interesting- thx fellas
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2149 [16:14:53] <unixfu-> much to same as how you can bitmask the octets by multiplying by the max mask or bit
2150 [16:14:53] <nevyn> Course this is in a CIDR world which we've been in for a while
2151 [16:14:56] <unixfu-> eh?
2152 [16:15:02] <nevyn> but class A
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2154 [16:15:13] *** Joins: sissylog (~apm@replaced-ip )
2155 [16:15:18] <nevyn> and B could always have a host address ending in .0
2156 [16:15:24] <unixfu-> i think _gateway is a hidden keyword in the routing of networks even tho it's not suppose to be valid with the underscore _
2157 [16:15:41] <greycat> My IP here is 10.76.172.97/23 . This network has 10.76.172.* and 10.76.173.* . 10.76.173.0 is one of the possible hosts on this network.
2158 [16:15:43] <unixfu-> is it a.b.c.d or d.a.b.c, i forget
2159 [16:15:51] <inch> I figured my earlier question out. Write a script that edits debian/binary_package_name.substvars and run that in rules file after dh_shlibdeps using override_dh_shlibdeps.
2160 [16:16:15] <unixfu-> mov eax, 24a
2161 [16:16:27] <unixfu-> retn regardless w/ detailed err msgs
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2163 [16:16:50] <unixfu-> hi omnio, how's romania?
2164 [16:16:56] <unixfu-> Omnicidio
2165 [16:16:58] <unixfu-> ??
2166 [16:16:58] <greycat> 10.76.172.97 is just a human-readable version of a 32-bit number. The dots are not actually part of the address, and don't mean anything to the computer, other than indicating how to convert the base 10 digits into the 32-bit binary value.
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2169 [16:17:28] <unixfu-> supurb greycat, nice
2170 [16:17:37] *** Quits: oish (~charlie@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2171 [16:17:50] <unixfu-> very insightful and knowledgable greycat, keep up the good answers and explanations!
2172 [16:17:53] <unixfu-> i go bug hunting now!
2173 [16:18:36] <ratrace> tradar: this is the most I know about uid/gid policy in Debian: replaced-url
2174 [16:18:50] <ratrace> doesn't seem to have a reservation list like FreeBSD ports.
2175 [16:18:51] <jelly> unixfu-: this isn't a chat channel we have #debian-offtopic for chat. Try to reduce your lines that are not questions to ask or constructive support to provide.
2176 [16:18:51] * nevyn wonders if this jessie -> stretch upgrade is going to work ok.
2177 [16:18:52] <unixfu-> the umask is 022
2178 [16:18:55] <unixfu-> not dmask
2179 [16:19:12] <unixfu-> if i'm not mistaken, 022 is the attribute hexadecimal for the running filesystem
2180 [16:19:22] <nevyn> ish
2181 [16:19:23] <greycat> 022 is base 8 (octal), not hexadecimal
2182 [16:19:34] <greycat> !umask
2183 [16:19:35] <dpkg> The umask or user mask is the set of permissions which are *not* set on files and directories that are created with a default set of permission. Ask me about <umask example>, <set default umask>.
2184 [16:19:40] *** Joins: enoq (~enoq@replaced-ip )
2185 [16:19:56] <unixfu-> !help
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2187 [16:19:59] *** Joins: shibboleth (~shibbolet@replaced-ip )
2188 [16:20:23] <pemensik> jelly, thanks!
2189 [16:20:48] *** Quits: malmalmal (~malmalmal@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2190 [16:21:48] <cdown> unixfu-: I'm flattered.
2191 [16:23:34] *** Quits: lorenzo (~lorenzo@replaced-ip ) (Quit: lorenzo)
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2195 [16:25:06] <tradar> yes thank you ratrace, that is the policy. It turns out to be somehow useful because it lists the user `nobody` =)
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2198 [16:26:40] *** Joins: flo2marsnet (~flo2marsn@replaced-ip )
2199 [16:26:50] <unixfu-> any idea how to lock down grub bootloader in EFI
2200 [16:27:06] <unixfu-> as to stop some1 from spawning a rootshell if they had physical access to the box
2201 [16:27:07] <unixfu-> ?
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2205 [16:27:18] <unixfu-> &grub edit
2206 [16:27:30] *** Joins: dtcrshr (~dtcrshr@replaced-ip )
2207 [16:27:48] *** Quits: monstar_ (~mitya@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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2209 [16:27:57] *** Quits: leftist (~interrupt@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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2211 [16:28:07] <greycat> if they have full physical access, they can boot from alternative media and do whatever they want to the hard drive
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2217 [16:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1553
2218 [16:29:06] *** Quits: gnufr33dom (~gnufr33do@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
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2221 [16:29:31] <unixfu-> so what's best way to go about it, write a .rom file for EFI to preseed grub boot sequence with custom security measures?
2222 [16:29:41] <tradar> greycat: that's why everybody should take advantage of luks
2223 [16:29:42] <unixfu-> i have security issues is why i'm wondering
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2227 [16:30:09] <unixfu-> i like RSi's bootchess, play chess in your bios!
2228 [16:31:03] <greycat> The best way to go about it? That's extremely subjective and situational. My preferred strategy is "don't be so damned paranoid; the NSA does not want my PC".
2229 [16:31:17] *** Quits: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2230 [16:31:48] *** Quits: encod3 (~encod3@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2231 [16:32:00] <omnio> Hello. I need "to generate" the main/applications menu in icewm and windowmaker but I have no idea how to do it. In LXQT the menu looks fine, all the apps are there (I guess the menu just reads the entries from /usr/share/applications) but in icewm and wmaker the menus look odd, not all the apps are there
2232 [16:32:03] <omnio> I installed "menu" and ran "update-menus" but no improvement
2233 [16:32:17] *** Quits: Colti (Miramar-FL@replaced-ip ) (Excess Flood)
2234 [16:32:23] *** Quits: vizius00 (vizius00@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2235 [16:32:25] <unixfu-> dconf editor ?
2236 [16:32:46] <nevyn> whole disk encryption and require a pasphrase to unlock on boot
2237 [16:32:48] *** Joins: encod3_ (~encod3@replaced-ip )
2238 [16:32:48] <tradar> is it possible to keep the EFI fat32 partition on an external USB drive you carry always with you?
2239 [16:32:57] *** Joins: finalbeta1 (~finalbeta@replaced-ip )
2240 [16:32:59] <unixfu-> yes anythings possible
2241 [16:33:03] <unixfu-> afraik
2242 [16:33:17] <unixfu-> i never realized the importance of encrypting the root, /
2243 [16:33:18] <tradar> so you've found a solution ĸeĸ
2244 [16:33:19] <ratrace> wth, why is net.core.somaxconn so small by default on debian, only 128? silly socket queue, 128 is for kids.
2245 [16:33:23] *** Joins: Colti (Miramar-FL@replaced-ip )
2246 [16:33:30] <unixfu-> i always just settled with encrypting my data dir, such as /home/$user
2247 [16:33:43] <tradar> yeah root is important to encrypt
2248 [16:33:45] *** Quits: encod3_ (~encod3@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2250 [16:34:01] *** Quits: encod3 (~encod3@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2251 [16:34:04] <nevyn> depends on the risk assessment
2252 [16:34:05] *** Joins: n4dir (~n4dir@replaced-ip )
2253 [16:34:11] <unixfu-> but you can rewrite boot grub menu editor to flaw upon intruder detected access thru monitoring your natural partake in your PC
2254 [16:34:14] <unixfu-> true
2255 [16:34:28] *** Quits: finalbeta (~finalbeta@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
2256 [16:34:38] <unixfu-> so what's best, veracrypt for encrypting the root
2257 [16:34:39] <unixfu-> ?
2258 [16:34:40] *** Quits: gdot2 (~gdot@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2259 [16:34:46] <unixfu-> or rjindael ;)
2260 [16:34:57] <unixfu-> i been using ecryptfs for home dir
2261 [16:35:11] <unixfu-> i guess let the installer handle it is the best approach eh/
2262 [16:35:14] <nevyn> luks
2263 [16:35:14] <tradar> you can do proper FDE with luks
2264 [16:35:28] <unixfu-> what is that acronym m8, FDE?
2265 [16:35:39] <tradar> full disk encryption
2266 [16:35:39] <unixfu-> fully defensive environment?
2267 [16:35:43] <unixfu-> ahhh, kewl
2268 [16:35:43] <tradar> ĸeĸ
2269 [16:35:45] <unixfu-> kek
2270 [16:35:47] <unixfu-> keke
2271 [16:35:54] <ratrace> orcs
2272 [16:35:55] <unixfu-> oops, TR108
2273 [16:36:02] <unixfu-> ask nasa
2274 [16:36:05] *** Quits: azizLIGHT (~azizLIGHT@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2275 [16:36:06] <greycat> unixfu-: please switch to decaf. Slow down, calm down. Type less, think more.
2276 [16:36:09] *** Joins: djdduty (~textual@replaced-ip )
2277 [16:36:11] *** Joins: diogenes_ (~diogenes_@replaced-ip )
2278 [16:36:25] <unixfu-> yes ofc, i am dumbfounded and have bad short term memory- my apologies..
2279 [16:36:31] *** Joins: vizius00 (vizius00@replaced-ip )
2280 [16:36:46] <unixfu-> i'll just switch environment and go outside for a walk, thx for your concern and remark
2281 [16:37:32] *** Joins: TheFuzzball (~TheFuzzba@replaced-ip )
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2283 [16:37:40] <tradar> you're welcome unixfu-
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2287 [16:38:48] *** Quits: leftist (~interrupt@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2288 [16:39:04] <annadane> besides, everyone knows the NSA runs systemd
2289 [16:39:08] *** Quits: Ycarus (~Ycarus@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
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2292 [16:40:12] <Ede|Popede> so at least it doesn't have a russian or chinese backdoor ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2293 [16:40:19] *** Joins: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip )
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2295 [16:40:27] <diogenes_> annadane, they run everything, sha256, openssl etc. )
2296 [16:40:33] *** Quits: m0u (~m0u@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2297 [16:40:44] <unixfu-> every1 knows that 'her' that 'bitch' can 'go sit on a knife & twist' they call her, 'olympic games', lol.. SIGDIE
2298 [16:40:51] *** Quits: vizius00 (vizius00@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2301 [16:41:16] <unixfu-> NSA is very fine & cool
2302 [16:41:16] *** Quits: cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2303 [16:41:22] <ratrace> > encrypts /home only > doesn't encrypt swap > NSA has field day cherry picking seekrits from the swap
2304 [16:41:23] <unixfu-> they are my enemy tho
2305 [16:41:24] *** Joins: vizius00 (vizius00@replaced-ip )
2306 [16:41:29] <unixfu-> well i randomize my swap
2307 [16:41:38] <unixfu-> with ecryptfs-setup-swap
2308 [16:41:40] <unixfu-> and then make fstab entry
2309 [16:41:52] <unixfu-> so upon reboot, the ram is randomized n encrypted
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2311 [16:42:00] <annadane> okay, quiet.
2312 [16:42:02] <ratrace> why do people bother with such convoluted setups. just slap all that on a LUKS container and call it a FDE :)
2313 [16:42:41] *** Joins: RebelCoderRU (~RebelCode@replaced-ip )
2314 [16:42:57] <unixfu-> green cape
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2317 [16:45:12] <MarioMey> a0z: Find manual says to use -exec with {}. And what you suggest me to use ${f[@]/%3gp/mp4} has my previous command, that uses $f as variable. So, I don't think it will work...
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2320 [16:45:33] <greycat> MarioMey: you'd have to -exec bash there, and it'll be pretty complicated
2321 [16:45:47] <unixfu-> well, can u balance a 33 dimensional array in every step and square it makes in branching those forks?
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2323 [16:45:55] <greycat> find ... -exec bash -c '... something with "${f[@]}" ...' x {} +
2324 [16:45:58] <unixfu-> precise ^_^
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2330 [16:47:08] <greycat> MarioMey: unless you're following an example of the general form while IFS= read -r file; do ...; done < <(find ... -print0)
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2360 [16:55:01] <Sicarii> Hello Team!
2361 [16:55:17] <Sicarii> apt-get upgrade hangs my debian based distro where the mouse pointer simply appears, disappears and re-appears in front of a black backdrop and never recovering from that over a 3 b+ rasp. pi.
2362 [16:55:29] <Sicarii> Also, once I reboot the device in an effort to see if I can refer to a system log that could reveal root cause, but device loops through the same blinking mouse point with black backdrop. My mini SD card is 64 GB Samsung of the known and tested preferred to use with Pis.
2363 [16:55:35] <greycat> !raspbian
2364 [16:55:35] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian (or #raspberrypi) on irc.freenode.net for support. replaced-url
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2372 [16:56:47] <Sicarii> Yes, but the linux distro I'm using to is debian based and simply wondering how I could refer to what's causing the symptom.
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2374 [16:56:55] <greycat> !based on debian
2375 [16:56:55] <dpkg> Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare replaced-url
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2379 [17:00:25] <Sicarii> Oh, I see! Thanks for the clarification!
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2381 [17:01:12] <pemensik> is there some way to update geoip2 database?
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2411 [17:13:49] <MarioMey> greycat: finally, I used:
2412 [17:13:52] <MarioMey> find . -name "*.3gp" -exec bash -c 'file=$1; echo "Converting $file"; ffmpeg -i "$file" -c:v copy -c:a copy "${file[@]/%3gp/mp4}"; gio trash' _ {} \;
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2414 [17:14:03] <MarioMey> Thanks, everybody.
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2416 [17:14:23] <greycat> you're treating "file" as an array variable, but it's only a string variable
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2418 [17:14:33] <greycat> I guess it works by good fortune
2419 [17:15:10] <greycat> the more normal way would be "${file%.3gp}.mp4" and that would work in sh as well as bash
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2425 [17:17:45] <jelly> $file:r.mp4 in zsh
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2427 [17:18:33] <greycat> for problems of this form, I would follow the general practice of using the "lightest" shell/tool that will work; sh is lighter than bash or zsh, and is more than adequate for this
2428 [17:18:49] <greycat> you'll probably get a tiny speed-up using sh
2429 [17:18:58] <jelly> for -exec {} ; yes
2430 [17:19:47] <greycat> granted, one may assume that the bulk of the time spent here is in ffmpeg, so the milliseconds of shell time saved may be insignificant; still, it's good to learn the standard tools
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2442 [17:24:36] <ruffni> i try to upgrade (and `apt --fix-broken`) LaTex (which had been held for some time). now apt is kinda broken. `apt --fix-broken` quits quickly. what's the easiest way to remove all of LaTeX (or texlive) and reinstall it from scratch? `apt purge tex*`?
2443 [17:25:26] <RoyK> dpkg --configure -a
2444 [17:25:26] <dpkg> RoyK: are you using Windows?
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2446 [17:25:34] <RoyK> dpkg: no ;)
2447 [17:25:34] <dpkg> no idea, RoyK
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2449 [17:26:37] <gh00p> So.... My `isc-dhcp-server` seems to not be starting up even though it's configured to, and it *might* be because the start script is getting run before the interface it uses is initialized. I can solve this by running a `restart` on the daemon 30 seconds after boot, or perhaps in a script in /etc/network/if-up.d/. Is it worth doing a root cause analysis on this? Is it a problem others have solved too?
2450 [17:27:16] <greycat> gh00p: assuming the interface is configured in /etc/network/interfaces, make sure it's configured with "auto ifname" and not "allow-hotplug ifname".
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2454 [17:30:03] <gh00p> greycat, I've got `auto br0`, but also `iface br0 inet manual`. Its IP address is set by dhcpcd.
2455 [17:30:35] <greycat> you're trying to be the DHCP server on an interface that's configured by DHCP !??
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2457 [17:31:50] <ruffni> replaced-url
2458 [17:32:09] <greycat> Also, interfaces(5) tells me that "manual" means "no configuration is done by default. Such interfaces can be configured manually by means of up and down commands or ... scripts"
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2460 [17:32:42] <greycat> Anyway, I don't understand how you can be the DHCP server on a network where your interface is configured by some other DHCP server.
2461 [17:34:51] <gh00p> greycat: No, dhcpcd is being used for a different interface, so I'm just using it to assign a static IP to the interface running the dhcp server.
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2466 [17:35:26] <gh00p> This is a router, so br0 is the internal IP (bridged between eth1 and wlan0), and eth0 is a DHCP client assigned IP from my ISP.
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2469 [17:38:02] <gh00p> Re "manual", yes, I have that so that dhcpcd will take care of the IP address assignment. Do you have a recommendation? Should I look at the order in which startup scripts are running and make sure dhcpcd runs before isc-dhcp-server? Or should I move my static assignment out of dhcpcd and into interfaces?
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2476 [17:39:59] <gh00p> greycat: for reference, I freely admit that I have things to learn with this stuff. That's why I'm asking questions. I'm grateful for your advice.
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2479 [17:40:44] <greycat> I would use a static assignment in /e/n/i and see if that fixes it.
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2483 [17:42:29] <JordiGH> What exactly are buster/updates?
2484 [17:42:46] <JordiGH> Looks like I'm getting qt5 updates. I mean, cool, thanks, but why?
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2486 [17:43:32] <greycat> buster/updates is the name of the security repository
2487 [17:43:39] <greycat> buster-updates is the proposed-updates thing
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2490 [17:44:17] <greycat> dpkg proposed-updates
2491 [17:44:18] <dpkg> stable-proposed-updates is a repository containing packages being prepared for the next <point release>. While they have already been, your additional testing is most welcome prior to wider release. replaced-url
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2497 [17:46:58] <somiaj> JordiGH: replaced-url
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2499 [17:47:49] <JordiGH> Huh, I thought we had a separate security repo.
2500 [17:49:04] <greycat> We do, and its name is currently "buster/updates".
2501 [17:49:10] <greycat> deb-src replaced-url
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2503 [17:50:12] <somiaj> JordiGH: deb.debian.org is a redirect repo that works for both debian and debian-security
2504 [17:50:13] <greycat> In bullseye they're changing it to "bullseye-security".
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2509 [17:52:05] <pink_vampire> hi
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2511 [17:52:39] <avu> pink_vampire: replaced-url
2512 [17:52:40] <JordiGH> Wasn't there a repo that had relatively unimportant updates, like, uhhhhh, new translations for Firefox or something like that, and another repo that had security fixes?
2513 [17:53:13] <somiaj> JordiGH: buster-updates (updates go there before point releases, and then get merged at point release)
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2515 [17:53:24] <somiaj> JordiGH: there is also buster-proposed-updates (these may or may not make it into a point release)
2516 [17:53:41] <somiaj> JordiGH: hence I'm glad they are renaming buster/updates because it looks like buster-updates (which is not the same)
2517 [17:53:58] <JordiGH> Okay, so that's what's confusing me, I guess?
2518 [17:54:03] <somiaj> could be
2519 [17:54:09] <JordiGH> Until that last sentence I didn't even realise you were talking about different things.
2520 [17:54:16] <JordiGH> I thought buster/updates and buster-updates were the same thing.
2521 [17:54:31] <somiaj> buster/updates = security, buster-updates = updates shortly before they are put into a point release
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2523 [17:54:43] <somiaj> You are not alone on that confusion.
2524 [17:54:44] <JordiGH> Okay, thanks.
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2529 [17:55:49] <pink_vampire> avu: I know how to use the comand line, but all the systemd is new to me, I have debian Squeeze on my computer, and also my CNC machine is running debian
2530 [17:56:05] <avu> pink_vampire: you don't need to do anything systemd
2531 [17:56:13] <avu> pink_vampire: did you actually read what I linked?
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2533 [17:56:23] <avu> pink_vampire: it's all good old /etc/network/interfaces
2534 [17:56:48] <avu> pink_vampire: just like the people in #systemd already told you, you don't need systemd-networkd for what you're trying to do
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2536 [17:56:54] <greycat> 11:43 greycat> buster/updates is the name of the security repository
2537 [17:56:54] <greycat> 11:43 greycat> buster-updates is the proposed-updates thing
2538 [17:56:59] <greycat> I thought I was clear :(
2539 [17:57:12] <pink_vampire> avu: this installation is debian 10 (buster), so all the commands are different,
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2541 [17:58:45] <greycat> Debian does not use systemd-networkd by default. Interfaces are still configured in /etc/network/interfaces via ifupdown. If you choose not to use /e/n/i but you have network-manager installed, n-m will take over the ones that are not listed in /e/n/i.
2542 [17:59:58] <pink_vampire> graytron: there is no gui on this install
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2544 [18:00:32] <pink_vampire> by "network-manager" you mean /etc/network/interfaces?
2545 [18:00:37] <greycat> Absolutely not.
2546 [18:00:54] <greycat> If you choose not to use /e/n/i but you have network-manager installed, n-m will take over the ones that are not listed in /e/n/i.
2547 [18:01:40] <greycat> If you aren't using e/n/i AND you aren't using n-m then you're in a tiny minority. In that case, there's something called connman, and something called systemd-networkd. Neither of which I've ever used.
2548 [18:01:40] <annadane> e/n/i? what is this, slackware?
2549 [18:01:51] <greycat> I SPELLED IT OUT
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2551 [18:02:01] <greycat> AFTER MY INITIAL SPELLING-OUT, I ABBREVIATED IT
2552 [18:02:05] <ratrace> !greycatsnack
2553 [18:02:05] <dpkg> hey greycat, here's a peanut butter cookie for all the hard work
2554 [18:02:07] <somiaj> network-manager doesn't require a gui (see nm-cli), you can choose how to manage your network, just don't use multiple tools.
2555 [18:02:48] <pink_vampire> what is the default tool in debian net-install?
2556 [18:03:13] <greycat> By default, it will use /etc/network/interfaces which is often abbreviated /e/n/i after the initial sentence.
2557 [18:03:44] <roycroft> hello, folks
2558 [18:03:52] <pink_vampire> what is "/e/n/i "??
2559 [18:03:54] *** Quits: platvoeten (~platvoete@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2560 [18:03:59] <greycat> *PLONK*
2561 [18:04:11] <greycat> I'm going to lunch. When I get back, there'd better be fewer trolls.
2562 [18:04:26] <roycroft> i'm trying to solve a problem at a remote colo facility, and would appreciate any opinions/experiences from anyone who might have some insights
2563 [18:04:35] <annadane> /etc/network/interfaces
2564 [18:04:38] <annadane> e/n/i
2565 [18:04:39] <roycroft> i have a machine at this remote colo that has been running debian for several years
2566 [18:04:55] <roycroft> it's some old dell machine, and it had an adaptec raid controller in it
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2568 [18:05:13] <roycroft> the machine is used primarly as an offsite backup server and caching dns server
2569 [18:05:25] <roycroft> the problem is that those adaptec raid controllers are horrible, and difficult to manage
2570 [18:05:27] <pink_vampire> annadane: ok ok I got it now thank you
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2573 [18:05:59] <annadane> 'slackware' was just a joke, in slackware you install packages in the installation of various groups which are named by letter :P
2574 [18:06:20] <roycroft> in our primary data center i'm using freenas for storage and debian virtual machines to provide the various services, with a combination of vmware esxi and proxmox ve as the hypervisors
2575 [18:06:33] <annadane> replaced-url
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2577 [18:06:48] <ratrace> annadane: they're kids, they wouldn't remember :)
2578 [18:06:51] <roycroft> i got a proper lsi hba for the offsite machine, intending to replace the adaptec after yet another disk failure for which i received no notification
2579 [18:07:10] <pink_vampire> annadane: OMG, this is way I'm with debian
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2581 [18:07:15] <roycroft> my intent was to use freebsd's bhyve hypervisor on the freenas machine and install the backup server and dns server vms using that
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2583 [18:07:38] <roycroft> i've come to the conclusion that bhyve is utterly useless, at least in my environment
2584 [18:07:46] <ratrace> aye
2585 [18:07:47] <roycroft> so now i'm stuck with figuring out a solution
2586 [18:08:25] <roycroft> i have a bunch of hard drives that i intend to configure as raid 10 with zfs for the storage
2587 [18:08:33] <roycroft> but i have a pair of ssds for the operating system
2588 [18:08:42] <ratrace> roycroft: think you can summarize the question in one or two posts? :)
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2591 [18:08:56] <roycroft> with freenas the os is mirrored on the ssds
2592 [18:09:02] <ratrace> !enter
2593 [18:09:03] <dpkg> The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
2594 [18:09:03] <unixfu-> sometimes vps have trouble with hosting dns because port 53 isn't forwarded well with the host using it
2595 [18:09:05] <roycroft> i'm down to the crux right now - the above was background
2596 [18:09:08] <unixfu-> roycroft ^^^
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2598 [18:09:16] <roycroft> i want to install debian with mirrored boot devices
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2600 [18:09:49] <roycroft> is that reliabily feasible these days?
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2602 [18:09:52] <jim> annadane, and yet, debian at the very beginning picked up ideas from slackware for what was about to become debian, in particular its package format... having said that, even the name slackware was probably a joke
2603 [18:09:52] <unixfu-> but the virtualizor uses port 53 for the gateway & routing i assume if it's like it was last i checked, you hafta have another allocated ip to host dns, can't share host ip with vps and host port 53 onv irtualizor
2604 [18:10:05] <roycroft> the last time i tried mirroring linux was about 20 years ago and it was a horrible experience
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2607 [18:10:11] <roycroft> i swore then to never attempt to repeate it
2608 [18:10:14] <unixfu-> poor pat, bless him- in his name we /
2609 [18:10:21] <roycroft> but linux has matured greatly since then
2610 [18:10:26] <ratrace> roycroft: you want debian (with root) on zfs, and mirrored /boot ?
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2612 [18:10:41] <roycroft> ratrace: i don't necessarily need root on zfs
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2614 [18:10:45] <roycroft> i'm fine with xfs root
2615 [18:10:47] <unixfu-> freebsd doesn't perform was well as linux when virtualizing vps with virtualbox i know off
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2617 [18:10:53] <ratrace> roycroft: then please summarize your actual question in ONE post pls :)
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2619 [18:11:02] <roycroft> i did, above
2620 [18:11:18] <ratrace> roycroft: again please in ONE post
2621 [18:11:18] <roycroft> i want to install debian with a mirrored root - the storage can be zfs and i can handle that
2622 [18:11:28] <ratrace> alright. and the question is?
2623 [18:11:41] <roycroft> the question is, is it feasible and reliable to do so?
2624 [18:11:49] <ratrace> yea
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2626 [18:12:01] <roycroft> no special tricks?
2627 [18:12:07] <roycroft> i just do manual disk configuration
2628 [18:12:12] <roycroft> and install grub on both disks
2629 [18:12:15] <ratrace> !entre
2630 [18:12:17] <roycroft> and it will work fine?
2631 [18:12:17] <ratrace> !enter
2632 [18:12:33] <ratrace> see now you made me break the bot..... please don't raid the enter key so much
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2636 [18:12:48] <zodd__> roycroft, check linux software raid
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2638 [18:12:53] <jhutchins_wk> roycroft: You're describing a bit of a niche case. I haven't found a lot of good info on booting linux from raid.
2639 [18:12:54] <ratrace> roycroft: yes it'll work fine. software raid with mdadm, or zfs, or btrfs
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2642 [18:13:20] <roycroft> my reading about zfs on linux indicates that it can be a struggle to install root with zfs
2643 [18:13:26] <ratrace> jhutchins_wk: hardly a niche case
2644 [18:13:26] <roycroft> but again, that does not matter to me
2645 [18:13:31] <roycroft> as long as zfs is the storage
2646 [18:13:38] <ratrace> roycroft: WILL YOU STOP RIDING THE DAMN ENTER KEY?
2647 [18:13:50] <roycroft> what?
2648 [18:13:52] <somiaj> !enter
2649 [18:13:52] <dpkg> The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
2650 [18:13:52] <ratrace> THAT
2651 [18:14:02] <roycroft> oh brother
2652 [18:14:10] <roycroft> see you all
2653 [18:14:13] *** Parts: roycroft (~roycroft@replaced-ip ) ()
2654 [18:14:22] <ratrace> ...
2655 [18:14:33] <annadane> excellent. back to talking about slackware
2656 [18:14:38] <ratrace> at least it's quiet again.
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2658 [18:14:57] <somiaj> I guess not talking at all is better than learning to use complete sentences/thoughts on a single line.
2659 [18:16:18] <annadane> we've left a nice, orderly chat for greycat to come back to after lunch
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2661 [18:16:41] <ratrace> and all that novella could've really been summarized into one post. "oha, I wants debian on raid1, what are my options, kthnkxinadvance."
2662 [18:16:44] <ratrace> *ohai
2663 [18:17:01] <ratrace> annadane: indeed he'll be pleasantly surprised :)
2664 [18:17:03] <MarioMey> greycat: What does % really do?
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2667 [18:17:52] <MarioMey> "${file%.3gp}.mp4"
2668 [18:18:09] <MarioMey> Deletion?
2669 [18:19:08] <ratrace> MarioMey: replaced-url
2670 [18:19:39] <annadane> does tldp have any articles after 1995?
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2674 [18:20:30] <MarioMey> ratrace: thanks.
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2678 [18:22:56] <uuuu> hey guys
2679 [18:23:07] <uuuu> how can i install the newest version of zlib on debian?
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2681 [18:23:49] <uuuu> im running debian 9.11
2682 [18:24:11] <uuuu> and it says "zlib1g-dev is already the newest version (1:1.2.8.dfsg-5)."
2683 [18:24:23] <annadane> ,v zlib1g-dev
2684 [18:24:24] <judd> Package: zlib1g-dev on amd64 -- jessie: 1:1.2.8.dfsg-2+b1; stretch: 1:1.2.8.dfsg-5; buster: 1:1.2.11.dfsg-1; bullseye: 1:1.2.11.dfsg-1+b1; sid: 1:1.2.11.dfsg-1+b1
2685 [18:24:32] <uuuu> but i need zlib >=1.2.3.4
2686 [18:24:57] <annadane> judd, checkbackport zlib1g-dev --fromrelease sid --torelease stretch
2687 [18:24:58] <judd> Backporting package zlib1g-dev in sid→stretch/amd64: all build-dependencies satisfied using stretch, archignore.
2688 [18:25:01] <uuuu> ohh wait
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2690 [18:25:10] <annadane> backport it yourself, then
2691 [18:25:21] <uuuu> i think 1:1.2.8.dfsg-5 meets the requirement, right?
2692 [18:25:29] <uuuu> i dunno what "1:" is
2693 [18:25:33] <annadane> yeah, it would
2694 [18:25:36] <annadane> i can't read
2695 [18:25:42] <uuuu> but it looks like i have zlib version 1.2.8?
2696 [18:25:50] <annadane> yes
2697 [18:25:57] <uuuu> hmm ok
2698 [18:26:03] <uuuu> whats that "1:"
2699 [18:26:38] <ratrace> epoch
2700 [18:26:51] <uuuu> like epoch time??
2701 [18:27:18] <ratrace> say you have version 2010 and switched to 3.0 for the NEXT release. Since 2010 > 3, you raise the epoch from implicit 0 to 1: and 1:<any number> is always > than 0:anynumber
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2703 [18:27:33] <dvs> uuuu, no. in case the packages undergoes a huge transformation
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2705 [18:28:11] <uuuu> ok, so that 1 is just a counter of how many times i installed this package?
2706 [18:28:15] <ratrace> epoch is integer so you can have 2: or 3: if that's needed to change the versioning scheme but that's very very very very rare
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2708 [18:28:30] <ratrace> no, like, I just explained to you what it means
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2710 [18:29:23] <annadane> what actual decimal place does the epoch apply to? i'm assuming before patches
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2712 [18:29:32] <annadane> so, up to minor versions
2713 [18:29:53] <annadane> 1.2.8, not 1.2.8.dfsg-5
2714 [18:30:05] <greycat> annadane: the epoch comes *before* all of that, and overrides all of that
2715 [18:30:15] <greycat> 2:1.0.0 is higher than 1:7.8.9
2716 [18:30:25] <annadane> right right right
2717 [18:30:26] <annadane> gotcha
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2749 [18:46:13] <maxrazer> Does anyone know how to set xdg open for a default application that uses "xyz://" from the browser where xyz is the application type/name?
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2751 [18:46:35] <maxrazer> Chromium is launching xdg open, but the type isn't configured.
2752 [18:46:44] <Akuw> apt-cache policy is used for?
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2758 [18:48:36] <greycat> Akuw: it tells us where your system thinks it's getting packages from, among other things
2759 [18:49:46] <dka> Can i use archlinux tutorial for debian such as this : replaced-url
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2774 [18:57:30] <uuuu> how can i find the files contained in a package?
2775 [18:57:50] <greycat> if the package is installed, dpkg -L pkgname
2776 [18:58:25] <uuuu> thx
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2780 [19:00:14] <uuuu> greycat: what if i dont have the package installed?
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2782 [19:00:55] <greycat> Then you find the package lists on packages.debian.org but they are known to be incomplete/broken.
2783 [19:01:13] <greycat> Or, you download the .deb and then extract it with dpkg -x.
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2811 [19:15:12] <Lope> Have you guys had much luck booting Linux from a SD card from a laptop's internal SD cardreader? Whenever I've tried it (not on many laptops) it hasn't worked for me, so I'm curious if any of you have had success with this?
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2814 [19:15:57] <jhutchins_wk> Lope: That would be controlled by the BIOS, but a lot of SD card readers don't work in Linux.
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2817 [19:20:16] <cybrNaut> the OLPC works entirely off SD card - so certainly it's possible in that obscure case. Not sure about the general case. My laptop used to take some manual work just to get the internal SD card reader to function, but I'd be surprised if I could boot from it.
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2836 [19:33:39] <n-iCe> Guys, everytime I boot Debian, all my windows are restored, how do I stop this?
2837 [19:33:41] <HajinctoQQ> Hi. Fresh Debian Gnome install here. But Adwaita icons are old. How to install Adwaita icon from the source (replaced-url
2838 [19:34:19] <somiaj> HajinctoQQ: I think you can just copy it into $HOME/.icons/ and then select that theme from some controll tool
2839 [19:34:27] <somiaj> n-iCe: what desktop do you use?
2840 [19:34:55] <HajinctoQQ> n-iCe Gnome, on Debian 10
2841 [19:36:23] <somiaj> HajinctoQQ: acutally looks like $HOME/.local/share/icons/ is the new place, replaced-url
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2843 [19:38:51] <n-iCe> somiaj: xfce4
2844 [19:39:17] <HajinctoQQ> somiaj: On Adwaita repository files are odd: *.sh, *.py, *.ac; I don't know, but the icons themes have a file called 'index.theme' and Adwaita repository the file is 'index.theme.in'
2845 [19:40:34] <greycat> configure.ac is one of the files used by autoconf. *.sh and *.py are common suffixes for shell scripts and Python scripts, respectively.
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2848 [19:41:43] <greycat> a file named *.in is most likely a template that has to be run through a macro preprocessor, or some other step, to produce the regular output file
2849 [19:42:10] <jhutchins_wk> ,v adwaita-icon-theme
2850 [19:42:12] <judd> Package: adwaita-icon-theme on amd64 -- jessie: 3.14.0-2; stretch: 3.22.0-1+deb9u1; buster: 3.30.1-1; bullseye: 3.34.0-2; sid: 3.34.0-2
2851 [19:42:26] <somiaj> n-iCe: look into xfce4 sessions manager (there should be a config tool for this) and tell it to not restore.
2852 [19:42:29] <HajinctoQQ> greycat: the process to install is: 1) ./configure; 2) make & 3) make install
2853 [19:42:42] <greycat> sounds pretty common
2854 [19:43:27] <Ankman> oh adwaita. just tested my web pages in the gnome web browser. background is grey and fonts white per default. had to add some CSS to have a white background and black fonts as it is default in every other browser i know
2855 [19:43:30] <HajinctoQQ> greycat: sorry, I'm askin to you
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2857 [19:44:38] <Ankman> i wonder if i should file a bug report and report this as design flaw?
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2861 [19:48:02] <HajinctoQQ> Let's by sid repository. Thaks guys!
2862 [19:48:23] <jim> how much does it cost to by it?
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2865 [19:49:48] <Ankman> buy what?
2866 [19:49:54] <jim> HajinctoQQ, just so you know... you may have other options open to you, that are debian specific
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2869 [19:51:28] <n-iCe> somiaj: but is not selected, save session option
2870 [19:52:00] <HajinctoQQ> jim, I tried install from sources, but on Adwaita repository the info ain't clear, at least for a noob like me.
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2873 [19:52:30] <jim> HajinctoQQ, is it packaged for debian?
2874 [19:52:40] <greycat> ,v adwaita-icon-theme
2875 [19:52:41] <judd> Package: adwaita-icon-theme on amd64 -- jessie: 3.14.0-2; stretch: 3.22.0-1+deb9u1; buster: 3.30.1-1; bullseye: 3.34.0-2; sid: 3.34.0-2
2876 [19:52:46] <greycat> as jhutchins_wk already told us
2877 [19:53:01] <HajinctoQQ> judd, thanks, for the tip
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2879 [19:53:08] <jim> oh, is that the package he wants?
2880 [19:53:16] <HajinctoQQ> Yep
2881 [19:53:29] <jim> ok. what version of debian do you have?
2882 [19:53:33] <HajinctoQQ> Finally I've installed from Sid
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2885 [19:54:13] <HajinctoQQ> I'm Buster. But that package is harmless
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2887 [19:54:32] <HajinctoQQ> no Debian-Frankestien (for the moment)
2888 [19:54:33] <jim> , depends adwaita-icon-theme
2889 [19:54:34] <judd> Package adwaita-icon-theme in buster/amd64 -- depends: hicolor-icon-theme, gtk-update-icon-cache, librsvg2-common.
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2895 [19:56:44] <jim> HajinctoQQ, you may wish to run: apt -f install to make sure your package database is ok
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2897 [19:58:46] <somiaj> n-iCe: that saves your current session, it defaults to saving the session on exit
2898 [19:58:51] <HajinctoQQ> alright jim
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2901 [19:59:32] <somiaj> n-iCe: replaced-url
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2903 [20:00:34] <jim> HajinctoQQ, all the dependencies of adwaita-icon-theme are available in buster, so it might be ok (it won't cause your system to want sid's libc, which would cause major havok
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2905 [20:00:59] <Lope> jhutchins_wk, thanks
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2908 [20:01:59] <somiaj> jim: I would still suggest a local install vs getting it from sid.
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2910 [20:02:11] <jim> agreed
2911 [20:02:23] <somiaj> copying the theme to $HOME/.local/share/icons should work
2912 [20:02:39] <jim> do you know whether he wanted that version?
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2915 [20:04:01] <jim> it's like a frankendebian with everything normal except frankie's forehead
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2919 [20:04:39] <ratrace> you mean frankie's monster's forehead. /nitpick /evil-laughter
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2925 [20:05:47] <jim> yeah, never saw those movies :P
2926 [20:05:57] <ws2k3> im trying to configure an vrack ip on my machine 165.132.23.210 netmask 255.255.255.240 and then i do route add default gw 165.132.23.254 but then i get network unreachable what am i doing wrong here?
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2937 [20:07:21] <jim> ws2k3, I guess my first question... is, can you ping 165.132.23.254 ?
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2951 [20:09:28] <jim> I'm not sure I have a second question :)
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2955 [20:09:56] <ws2k3> jim yes
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2959 [20:11:46] <ws2k3> jim i think its because that ip is outsode of my range.
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2985 [20:23:16] <jak2000> hi all, i have a web system with java and glassfish, is possible kknow the ip activity (ip date/time connection)? thanks
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2990 [20:27:25] <JPT> jak2000: You can check if your glassfish writes logs. Most webservers and application servers write access logs by default afaik.
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2992 [20:27:44] <GNU\colossus> ,v linux-image-amd64
2993 [20:27:45] <judd> Package: linux-image-amd64 on amd64 -- jessie: 3.16+63+deb8u2; jessie-security: 3.16+63+deb8u6; stretch-security: 4.9+80+deb9u6; stretch: 4.9+80+deb9u9; stretch-backports: 4.19+105+deb10u1~bpo9+1; buster: 4.19+105+deb10u1; buster-backports: 5.2+107~bpo10+1; bullseye: 5.2+107; sid: 5.3.7-1
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2999 [20:28:46] <JordiGH> Wow, Firefox 68 has crashed three times on me today.
3000 [20:28:48] <JordiGH> :-(
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3002 [20:29:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1559
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3004 [20:29:21] <JordiGH> Maybe that's a subtle hint telling me to get off YouTube and back to work.
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3012 [20:33:07] <somiaj> JordiGH: and here I was thinking of finally switching back to firefox, as chromium is being annoying too...I want this to be fixed replaced-url
3013 [20:33:08] <judd> Bug replaced-url
3014 [20:33:33] <JordiGH> But I was told Rust was gonna fix crashes.
3015 [20:33:47] <somiaj> JordiGH: have you maybe tried to start over with a default profile, maybe there is some artifact in your old profile causing problems with the newer esr version
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3017 [20:34:00] <cybrNaut> or it's an indication that you should view youtube videos from invidio.us.. maybe the j/s is more lightweight
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3020 [20:34:21] <jim> ws2k3, ok, one thing is true, and you may have already said it: the gateway IP must be in the net/netmask (aka subnet)
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3026 [20:36:20] <islamic_death> to follow the teachings of a person whose notable accomplishments include leading the massacre of a city (Mecca) and "marrying" a nine year old girl is frankly evil
3027 [20:36:36] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o greycat
3028 [20:36:37] <islamic_death> the so-called "prophet" was by all standards a criminal
3029 [20:36:41] <islamic_death> islam is death
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3037 [20:38:07] <jak2000> JPT thanks
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3056 [20:46:56] *** Quits: AlexZion (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3057 [20:47:05] <jim> ws2k3, it may be 165.132.23.210 that's out of the range, but not sure yet
3058 [20:47:52] <jhutchins_wk> ws2k3: Yes, your gateway needs to be within your subnet.
3059 [20:48:23] *** Quits: Vizva (~Vizva@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3060 [20:48:56] <greycat> that's the usual arrangement, anyway
3061 [20:49:14] <greycat> if the gateway is *not* on your network, then you have to explain to the routing table how to reach that IP address
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3063 [20:53:39] <jim> for 165.132.23.210/28, the net addr is 165.132.23.208 and the bcast addr is 165.132.23.223, which are the min and max of your subhnet
3064 [20:54:05] <jim> so yes, .254 is outside of that
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3068 [20:55:18] <anti-savage> to follow the teachings of a man whose notable accomplishments include leading the massacre of a city and "marrying" a 9-year-old girl is quite simply evil.
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3070 [20:55:24] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o somiaj
3071 [20:55:24] *** somiaj sets mode: +b *!*@5.181.235.186
3072 [20:55:24] *** anti-savage was kicked by somiaj (you should know better)
3073 [20:55:25] *** somiaj sets mode: -o somiaj
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3076 [20:58:12] <JordiGH> The hell?
3077 [20:58:14] <JordiGH> Ah.
3078 [20:58:17] <JordiGH> Sorry, never mind.
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3094 [21:08:12] <gh00p> If I'm running nginx and php-fpm with multiple virtualhosts, can I recycle the same unix socket for each virtualhost, or should I create a new socket for each one in /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/ ? And if the unix socket *can* be recycled, what might be the benefit of having multiple sockets? Are different sockets handled by different CPUs or something?
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3101 [21:12:07] <ws2k3> i just cloned a debian machine. but it looks like it not reading /etc/network/interfaces. how would i debug this?
3102 [21:12:34] <greycat> there's a good chance the network interface name is different. double-check that. edit the file with the correct interface name.
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3104 [21:13:52] <ratrace> gh00p: recycle? one pool can only talk over one socket, you can't share a socket with multiple pools
3105 [21:14:27] <gh00p> ratrace: ok, but can multiple virtualhosts share a pool?
3106 [21:14:37] <gh00p> er .. a socket? What the hell am I asking, anyway?
3107 [21:14:44] <ratrace> gh00p: that they can, yes, as in yes you can have more than one vhost do fastcgi_pass to the same unix socket
3108 [21:14:54] <ws2k3> greycat i checked and thats not it
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3112 [21:15:45] <gh00p> ratrace: okay, yes, that's what I was asking. But I see that the configuration allows for multiple sockets, each configured in a file in the pool.d/ directory. What would that be used for?
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3115 [21:16:16] <ratrace> gh00p: multiple pools, you can run one pool per website, each running under separate user and having different options
3116 [21:16:50] <ws2k3> greycat only thing im seeing is [ 0.632598] xen_netfront: Initialising Xen virtual ethernet driver but normaly i also see something like eth0 renamed.....
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3118 [21:17:24] <ws2k3> greycat and i ran ifconfig eth0 .... netmask ... up then it works just fine
3119 [21:18:14] <ratrace> ws2k3: perhaps start getting used to ip instead of ifconfig which is deprecated and has issues
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3121 [21:18:53] <ws2k3> ratrace yeah ur right on that matter
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3123 [21:20:15] <gh00p> ratrace: ok, so it's a layer of abstraction that helps with access control and limits. Sounds good -- I guess for a simple environment where I'm in charge of all sites on the server and nothing will ever be slashdotted, I can probably get away with a single pool. :)
3124 [21:21:38] *** ChrisQ is now known as FrankieQ
3125 [21:21:52] <ratrace> gh00p: I still wouldn't. isolating them has benefits from managing resources (Eg. # of workers needed, min, max, preforked, ...), through isolation and security
3126 [21:22:16] <ratrace> infact that's how we run our client sites, each in its own apparmored pool
3127 [21:22:42] <ratrace> running pools with separate users combines neatly with single apparmor policy and "owner" rules that does the MLS role
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3129 [21:25:54] <gh00p> ratrace: related question... I see that I get only one pidfile for the php-fpm master process. Is there a way to restart a single pool without restarting the master process and taking down everything?
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3135 [21:28:49] <ratrace> gh00p: you can send a HUP signal to the specific PIDs
3136 [21:29:04] <ratrace> gh00p: that's why we run each pool as a separate master process as a systems service
3137 [21:29:12] <ratrace> *systemd
3138 [21:29:28] <ratrace> gh00p: ah, no wait, not HUP but TERM
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3141 [21:32:51] <gh00p> ratrace: erm.. With two pools configured, I have only one pid file, named similarly to one of the pools, containing the pid of "php-fpm: master process", which is the PPID of the four pool processes. So systemd (pid 1) owns the master process, not the pools.
3142 [21:33:01] *** Quits: FrankieQ (~ChrisQ@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3143 [21:33:16] <gh00p> But I see that if I kill one of the pool pids, the master process behaves like a superserver and restarts it. So that's good. :)
3144 [21:33:20] <ws2k3> how can i configure 2 ip's using the interfaces file?
3145 [21:33:27] <ws2k3> on the same interface*
3146 [21:33:38] <ratrace> gh00p: yes one pid file for the master fpm, but you can signal individual processes. also: pidfiles are EVIL
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3149 [21:34:02] <ratrace> ws2k3: that's the thing ifconfig is bad about you need to alias interfaces somethingsomething
3150 [21:34:16] <ws2k3> i see okay thx ratrace
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3154 [21:34:49] <gh00p> ws2k3: what about old notation, like eth0 for the first IP, then eth0:1 for the second?
3155 [21:35:00] <ratrace> that's the aliasing I mentioned
3156 [21:35:08] <ratrace> you essentially create two nics
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3158 [21:35:42] <gh00p> ratrace: Other than querying the process table, how might I determine which pids are associated with a particular pool? Also, when do config files get read? When the master process gets bumped, or when the pool process is restarted? (I can experiment if necessary, but if you happen to know off-hand, that would save me lots of time.)
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3160 [21:35:59] <Morg0th> Hello, I installed a deb file manually (guitar pro) and now every time I try to install something via apt, it wants to delete guitar pro because of some unmet dependencies. Guitar Pro runs fine though, I don't want to uninstall it. Here's the full output: replaced-url
3161 [21:36:00] <ratrace> gh00p: pool names are reflected in process names so you can use pkill
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3163 [21:36:37] <ratrace> gh00p: (re)starting a worker process sources the php.ini, but you'll have to nuke the master to get the pool configs (php-fpm.conf) reloaded
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3165 [21:37:14] <ratrace> gh00p: also "reloading" won't add new pools, or take away deleted pools, you have to hard restart the master
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3167 [21:37:35] <gh00p> ratrace: right, that makes sense. Thanks very much for sharing all of this.
3168 [21:37:40] <ratrace> actually, I might be wrong on the adding new pools part, but TIAS, I'm not sure there
3169 [21:38:28] <gh00p> The man page spells it out in a section called, of all things, "SIGNAL":
3170 [21:38:30] <gh00p> SIGUSR2,SIGHUP graceful reload of all workers + reload of fpm conf/binary
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3174 [21:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1553
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3178 [21:39:32] <ratrace> gh00p: yes if you HUP the master which is usually the traditional "reload" action for daemons
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3180 [21:40:01] <ratrace> gh00p: I'm not sure individual workers respond to HUP, you can try that too
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3192 [21:47:27] <gh00p> ratrace: looks like a HUP to a pool process will cause it to terminate and be restarted by the master. Don't know whether it's the master or the child that reads the config file. But if the master is responsible for chroot, then it's gotta be the master that reads configs.
3193 [21:47:49] <ratrace> gh00p: chroot?
3194 [21:48:38] <ratrace> gh00p: also which config file? if you're reconfiguring the entire pool, you must HUP or restart the master process. if you're reconfiguring php.ini, you can kill individual PIDs, or HUP the master (which will restart the workers)
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3197 [21:50:11] <gh00p> ratrace: you can chroot each pool to a different location. replaced-url
3198 [21:50:45] <ratrace> gh00p: ah I see
3199 [21:50:47] <gh00p> The chroot would likely be applied as the master process forks the pool process.
3200 [21:51:04] <ratrace> probably, never used that feature, prefer apparmor instead
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3206 [21:56:29] <ratrace> gh00p: no wonder I haven't used it, where is that thing documented? ie. what must go into the chroot? any /dev facilities? syslog socket? pool's unix socket? ....
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3218 [22:00:22] <disi> i followed the debian subkey wiki a year ago and now my (main) key has expired. i dug out the main key and extended the expiration and pushed to the keyservers, should i need to update anything directly in my .gnupg folder? or can i just --recv-keys MYKEY? (asking because i tried the latter and it didnt seem to work
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3225 [22:02:47] <kavaliro> hey, i've just done a fresh install of debian (KDE) and have been having issues mounting a webDAV volume through dolphin, what are the specific packages that i need to make sure i have for webDAV functionality?
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3232 [22:06:09] <gh00p> ratrace: that was an excerpt from /etc/php/7.3/fpm/pool.d/replaced-url
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3234 [22:06:33] <gh00p> ratrace: tbh, I haven't used chroot either.
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3236 [22:07:05] <ratrace> gh00p: yeah but there's no expanded documentation in the official PHP docs
3237 [22:08:12] <ratrace> gh00p: because there used to be a non-obvious gotcha with open_basedir, you had to include PHP libs in that too
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3241 [22:09:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1544
3242 [22:09:30] <gh00p> ratrace: well... chroot is mentioned in replaced-url
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3244 [22:09:50] <ratrace> gh00p: I know, it's listed there but doesn't say things I need it to say :)
3245 [22:10:20] <gh00p> Makes one wonder if anyone at all besides the committer actually uses the feature. :)
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3247 [22:10:41] <gh00p> OTOH, I bet you'd get errors that would tell you what you need if you tried to use it.
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3249 [22:11:00] <ratrace> gh00p: systemd security options and MACs make chroots obsolete relics from the past, as they're nowhere near as secure as these modern features
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3251 [22:12:14] <gh00p> Good to know. I spend equal time in FreeBSD, where the security features are .. well, entirely different. I'm not particular familiar with systemd, other than basic usage.
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3253 [22:12:44] <gh00p> But I suspect `chroot` in PHP long predates systemd.
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3260 [22:13:57] <ratrace> gh00p: chroot syscall does at least
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3294 [22:34:52] <disi> is the subkeys wiki out of date? replaced-url
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3298 [22:35:40] <greycat> I stopped even trying to understand gnupg 2.x. If the wiki page was written for gnupg 1.x then yes, it will be out of date, because as far as I can tell, NOTHING is the same between them.
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3300 [22:36:35] <disi> i mean, it seems to address 2.x "If you are using GnuPG 2.1 or later, "
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3302 [22:36:55] <disi> but step 6 fails "error changing passphrase: No secret key"
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3343 [23:00:00] <alan_o> disi: I get that same message but the operation works.
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3346 [23:00:50] <disi> i threw away all my changes because i think the answer to my original Q was "yes" :p
3347 [23:01:08] <disi> that Q was:
3348 [23:01:09] <disi> i followed the debian subkey wiki a year ago and now my (main) key has expired. i dug out the main key and extended the expiration and pushed to the keyservers, should i need to update anything directly in my .gnupg folder? or can i just --recv-keys MYKEY? (asking because i tried the latter and it didnt seem to work
3349 [23:02:04] <alan_o> ah
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3405 [23:38:49] <graphicsv> Can I share a Telegram group for Debian here?
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3414 [23:44:29] <somiaj> not sure if it will get much response, and though it is about debian, advertising for different places isn't usually best
3415 [23:44:55] <somiaj> in general I suggest not sharing it here
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3424 [23:48:48] <KNERD> graphicsv: No...we don't do Censoship, and leaker Censorgram heere
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3427 [23:49:18] <graphicsv> ok, nothing againts this channel. just like to have Debian users on Telegram and Discord too :)
3428 [23:50:16] <KNERD> Yeah, two lovely censorship places
3429 [23:50:32] <KNERD> noooo thanls
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3431 [23:51:47] <somiaj> graphicsv: I'm unsure the best place to advertise such groups. This is a support channel, so we try to focus on just support. #debian-offtopic may be appropriate to get users.
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3433 [23:51:54] <graphicsv> KNERD: What makes you think TG does censorship?
3434 [23:52:01] <graphicsv> somiaj: That makes sense. Thank you
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context: nick names on moving displays as market values
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