People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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23 [00:17:37] <jhutchins> millaus564578568: You keep saying that.
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49 [00:40:25] <millaus564578568> saaalve!!!
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79 [01:06:49] <karlpinc> inna: Just for grins, you could try completely powering down and booting first into MS Windows. That means removng the laptop battery, if it's a laptop or flipping the power switch on a desktop. Leave it without power for a minute before plugging back in.
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97 [01:16:58] <Ede|Popede> would this be enough? i mean, cmos battery, is something like this still a thing? or maybe some kind of non-volatile memory.
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105 [01:22:42] <inna> i just installed debian on a disk. setup asked me whether or not i want to install GRUB on the MBR.
106 [01:23:03] <inna> i chose no, and selected the disk manually to install grub on
107 [01:23:15] <inna> now when i boot from this disk it says "operating system not found"
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109 [01:23:19] <millaus564578568> saaalve!!!
110 [01:23:53] <inna> is there some kind of rescue mode with the installation images?
111 [01:23:54] <tomreyn> inna: whoops. so which did did you install it on then?
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113 [01:24:08] <tomreyn> inna: yes, you can choose rescue form grub
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115 [01:24:14] <inna> tomreyn: on the one where debian has been installed
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117 [01:24:59] <tomreyn> on the partition containing the root file system (which will be mounted at / )?
118 [01:25:03] <inna> yes
119 [01:25:06] <inna> oh
120 [01:25:08] <dvs> inna, you can boot up the installer iso and run in rescue mode
121 [01:25:14] <inna> no on the disk, not the partition.
122 [01:25:46] <tomreyn> that's actually find then, it should have worked if this was the first disk
123 [01:25:46] <inna> dvs: will there be some kind of "wizard" to reinstall grub or do i have to do it manually?
124 [01:26:00] <dvs> inna, it will be a rescue option
125 [01:26:07] <inna> awesome
126 [01:26:12] <inna> i'll try the rescue now
127 [01:26:14] <inna> thanks guys.
128 [01:27:02] <tomreyn> inna: note that almost always you'll want to install grub to the first raw disk (so not to a partition)
129 [01:27:25] <tomreyn> (so what the installer suggested initially.)
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141 [01:42:22] <melpy> isn't it dangerous having grub on raw disks, shouldn't you cook it first?
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158 [01:53:28] <Gigglebyte> Whatever happened to Leafpad? I don't find it in the Buster repository? I only found Mousepad which is ok but Leafpad was lighter, quicker, and less quirkier.
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160 [01:55:54] <debsan> Gigglebyte, I think it was orphaned
161 [01:56:26] <Gigglebyte> debsan> That is a big shame. It was a really good program.
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164 [01:58:05] <beavis> \/9
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166 [01:58:12] <debsan> Gigglebyte, replaced-url
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168 [01:59:48] <debsan> replaced-url
169 [01:59:49] <judd> Bug replaced-url
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174 [02:01:37] <Vondex> Good evening everyone. I have a Kingwin USB adapter to connect my SSD to my laptop through the USB port. It has worked in the past through Ubuntu, but not in Debian 10. Is there a package I need to make Debian detect it?
175 [02:02:09] <Vondex> It doesnt show up in dmesg
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177 [02:04:24] <tomreyn> Vondex: so lsusb doesnt list it either?
178 [02:04:37] <Vondex> no, it doesnt
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180 [02:05:12] <tomreyn> Vondex: have you tried a different usb port? which debian version are you on, which kernel (if not default)?
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183 [02:05:37] <tomreyn> and does it have an external power supply you used to use?
184 [02:06:25] <Vondex> I have tried all three ports (USB 3) and it works in none so far. Debian 10 - standard 4.19 kernel (unmodified). No external power supply.
185 [02:06:51] <tomreyn> hmm, and which ubuntu version were you using?
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187 [02:07:11] <Gigglebyte> Looks like the only problem with leafpad is that it needs to be updated to the gtk3; other than that it is reall light and quick. It is a shame someone won't pick it up. Liked it better than mousepad. Mousepad is slower.
188 [02:07:19] <tomreyn> Vondex: or which kernel version there if you still remember
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194 [02:10:12] <Vondex> I was using 18.04 and not really sure about the kernel version there. I read that kernel version 5 has better device support. I will try that maybe
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196 [02:10:24] <millaus564578568> Ciao a tutti :D
197 [02:10:39] <tomreyn> Vondex: you could try the kernel from backports replaced-url
198 [02:10:53] <Vondex> i will do that. thank you
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207 [02:17:10] <linux_user2> Yo, yo, yo! Anyone know what this error is and how to fix it?
208 [02:17:11] <linux_user2> GPG error: replaced-url
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210 [02:18:45] <themill> linux_user2: what release of Debian are you trying to run? what version of debian-archive-keyring do you have installed?
211 [02:18:50] <linux_user2> debian 10
212 [02:18:52] <linux_user2> well 10.1
213 [02:18:52] <LtL> linux_user2: is debian-archive-keyring and debian-keyring installed?
214 [02:19:03] <linux_user2> I don't know let me check if either is
215 [02:19:10] <linux_user2> those are package names, yeah?
216 [02:19:14] <themill> (debian-keyring is not required)
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218 [02:19:46] <LtL> they are, yes
219 [02:20:00] <linux_user2> well I have both!
220 [02:21:06] <linux_user2> should I reinstall them both?
221 [02:21:21] <themill> what version of debian-archive-keyring do you have?
222 [02:21:31] <linux_user2> 2019.1
223 [02:22:30] <themill> Can you pastebin "apt-cache policy debian-archive-keyring; apt-cache policy" for us?
224 [02:23:28] <linux_user2> one sec
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227 [02:25:38] <linux_user2> replaced-url
228 [02:27:17] <namll> hello, why would I not be able to all of a sudden not be able to access the canvas website for my school, also the schools website, and the local university?
229 [02:27:25] <namll> I can access all other web pages.
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232 [02:29:48] <tomreyn> linux_user2: why do you have apt sources point to stretch when you run buster?
233 [02:30:04] <linux_user2> huh? let me check...thats a darn good question!
234 [02:30:40] <tomreyn> and moreover, why dont you have the same apt sources for buster
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236 [02:32:12] <namll> well, now its working. But why wouldnt it have before? It was working from all other IP's but mine. I tested it on my cell phone network.
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238 [02:32:48] <tomreyn> namll: some possible explanations: you accidientially switched to a different network connection, such as from wireless to tethered / 4G. you switched to different nameservers.
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243 [02:37:59] <namll> tomreyn: thanks, was just odd with my laptop which was home all day and only had the lid closed.
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246 [02:38:44] <tomreyn> you're welcome.
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248 [02:39:35] <linux_user2> I don't!
249 [02:39:43] <linux_user2> its pointing to buster
250 [02:39:48] <linux_user2> let me post the sources.lst
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258 [02:45:27] <tomreyn> linux_user2: then maybe you just forgot to apt update
259 [02:46:06] <themill> linux_user2: are you looking at the same machine? your output of apt-cache policy is not consistent with that statement
260 [02:47:47] *** Parts: namll (~user@replaced-ip ) ("ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.1)")
261 [02:47:55] <inna> is there still a need to recompile freetype with a config option set in order to get proper hinting?
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265 [02:48:17] <inna> obviously yes, small font sizes look ugly.
266 [02:48:58] <tomreyn> linux_user2: cat /etc/apt/sources.list{,/*} | nc termbin.com 9999; sudo apt update 2>&1 | nc termbin.com 9999; apt policy 2>&1 | nc termbin.com 9999
267 [02:49:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1516
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272 [02:51:47] <linux_user2> back
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274 [02:51:56] <linux_user2> one sec.
275 [02:52:09] <linux_user2> I did an apt update and that is where the issue showed up
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277 [02:52:28] <linux_user2> themill: I have only one machine
278 [02:53:00] <warsoul> why i cant connect via ssh to a IP but other friend can connect to the same ip
279 [02:53:06] <warsoul> my connection attempt gets time out
280 [02:53:18] *** Joins: millaus564578568 (~xdccMule@replaced-ip )
281 [02:53:19] <millaus564578568> Ciao belli
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284 [02:55:43] <linux_user2> one sec
285 [02:55:43] *** Joins: datacrusher (~dtcrshr@replaced-ip )
286 [02:55:57] <linux_user2> let me run that and paste it
287 [02:56:17] <linux_user2> nc is not on my system
288 [02:56:22] <linux_user2> let me see if I can install it
289 [02:56:25] <linux_user2> probably not
290 [02:56:30] *** Joins: njka (~njka@replaced-ip )
291 [02:56:31] <linux_user2> but I'll try to install it
292 [02:56:42] <LtL> linux_user2: why not just apt upgrade
293 [02:56:44] *** Quits: toxync12- (~toxync12@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
294 [02:56:56] <linux_user2> that didn't work either
295 [02:57:05] <linux_user2> that did work
296 [02:57:06] <linux_user2> but
297 [02:57:12] <linux_user2> something is still broken no?
298 [02:57:37] <tomreyn> probably, unless you fixed it in the meantime
299 [02:57:49] <linux_user2> themill: I didn't fix anything yet, I am going but what you all tell me
300 [02:58:01] <linux_user2> I cannot run that command I don't have nc
301 [02:58:04] <linux_user2> it fails
302 [02:58:24] *** Quits: dtcrshr (~dtcrshr@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
303 [02:58:44] <tomreyn> okay, i don't know of how to use a pastebin from a tty on a default debian installation unfortunately.
304 [02:59:08] <tomreyn> do you have curl?
305 [02:59:09] <linux_user2> tomreyn: your idea did not work, I ran apt upgrade, it said nothing to upgrade, then when I ran apt-get update it failed again
306 [02:59:11] <linux_user2> yes
307 [02:59:27] <linux_user2> no I have wget
308 [02:59:28] <linux_user2> not curl
309 [02:59:48] <tomreyn> linux_user2: i did not say you should run "apt upgrade"
310 [02:59:49] <linux_user2> let me try to apt install curl
311 [02:59:56] *** Quits: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip ) (Client Quit)
312 [03:00:01] <linux_user2> sure you did
313 [03:00:05] <linux_user2> you said why not just apt upgrade
314 [03:00:08] <linux_user2> that is what you said
315 [03:00:16] *** Joins: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip )
316 [03:00:17] <tomreyn> no, *i* did not
317 [03:00:21] <LtL> linux_user2: i said that, try replaced-url
318 [03:00:33] <linux_user2> sorry
319 [03:00:48] <linux_user2> other in channel chatter and messages it gets confusing
320 [03:01:08] <tomreyn> no problem ;)
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322 [03:01:16] <linux_user2> I am just trying to fix this
323 [03:01:42] <linux_user2> I am thinking, I am gonna likely have to reinstall the whole machine, I can't believe Debian can get this messed up
324 [03:02:11] <linux_user2> apt install curl hit some depenancy issue it could not install curl
325 [03:02:16] *** Joins: data_crusher (~dtcrshr@replaced-ip )
326 [03:02:18] <linux_user2> this system is really broken
327 [03:02:46] <linux_user2> its my fault as I did an upgrade this time instead of installing from scratch (which is what I normally do for Debian)
328 [03:02:53] *** Quits: njka (~njka@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
329 [03:02:59] <LtL> linux_user2: is anything in, /etc/apt/sources.list.d/
330 [03:03:04] <themill> There is no need to reinstall anything.
331 [03:03:18] <linux_user2> hang on let me check ltl
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334 [03:04:44] <linux_user2> ltl: cat base.list
335 [03:04:45] <linux_user2> deb replaced-url
336 [03:04:45] <linux_user2> #deb-src replaced-url
337 [03:04:55] <linux_user2> should I delete that file?
338 [03:05:01] <LtL> linux_user2: get rid of that
339 [03:05:10] <linux_user2> ok!
340 [03:05:22] *** Quits: datacrusher (~dtcrshr@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
341 [03:06:30] <LtL> linux_user2: run update/upgrade after you run this, # apt-get install -f
342 [03:06:44] <linux_user2> ok
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344 [03:07:19] <linux_user2> apt-get update still failed but apt-get upgrade says nothing to upgrade
345 [03:07:40] <LtL> same gpg error?
346 [03:07:50] *** Quits: toxync12 (~toxync12@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
347 [03:08:41] <LtL> linux_user2: try # dpkg --configure -a
348 [03:08:47] <linux_user2> ok
349 [03:08:59] <linux_user2> no change
350 [03:09:11] <linux_user2> it just came back to a pound prompt and apt-get update failed again
351 [03:09:35] <themill> What is actually in your sources.list now?
352 [03:10:09] *** Joins: NeppNepp (~free-spee@replaced-ip )
353 [03:10:50] <LtL> linux_user2: paste.debian.net
354 [03:11:07] <linux_user2> huh?
355 [03:11:29] <LtL> paste your /etc/apt/sources.list there
356 [03:11:35] <linux_user2> ok
357 [03:12:39] *** Parts: grisher (~dan@replaced-ip ) ()
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360 [03:14:00] <linux_user2> replaced-url
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364 [03:15:19] <linux_user2> replaced-url
365 [03:15:51] <linux_user2> that is the most current data from their associative commands as executed and shown in the paste
366 [03:16:31] <linux_user2> I notices that apt-key list shows stretch keys
367 [03:16:35] <linux_user2> could that be a problem?
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369 [03:17:03] <linux_user2> replaced-url
370 [03:17:17] *** Quits: sidmo (~ident@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
371 [03:17:46] <LtL> paste your /etc/apt/sources.list /* not the error output */
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378 [03:21:04] <linux_user2> I deleted the stretch keys with apt-key
379 [03:21:16] <themill> yeah, this is not going to go well
380 [03:21:34] <themill> randomly deleting keys was probably how we got here to begin with
381 [03:21:44] <whislock> linux_user2: You REALLY need to learn how to follow instructions.
382 [03:22:00] <linux_user2> huh?
383 [03:22:17] <linux_user2> I did
384 [03:22:23] <whislock> You were told to paste your sources.list. Three minutes later, you talked about deleting keys.
385 [03:22:23] <linux_user2> I paste the apt sources.list it is there
386 [03:22:23] *** Quits: fmaurer_ (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
387 [03:22:26] <whislock> No one told you to delete keys.
388 [03:22:27] <themill> linux_user2: do you have /var/lib/cache/apt/archives/debian-archive-keyring*deb
389 [03:22:36] <linux_user2> let me see
390 [03:22:43] <linux_user2> lets first deal with the sources.list
391 [03:22:43] <whislock> Thus you're being told to learn how to follow instructions.
392 [03:22:46] <linux_user2> it was pasted and is there.
393 [03:22:54] <tomreyn> he did indeed post sources.list (if on a different pastebin) replaced-url
394 [03:23:03] <whislock> No one told him to delete keys.
395 [03:23:06] <linux_user2> perhaps whitlock needs to learn how to read
396 [03:23:29] <whislock> I'm not the one mangling my system. Guess my reading skills are adequate.
397 [03:23:43] <themill> let's calm this back down and finish fixing it
398 [03:24:28] <jeddi> 'm getting 'unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages' -- but looking at held (apt-mark showheld, dpkg get selections | grep -v install etc ..) show there are no held packages.
399 [03:24:32] <linux_user2> themill: there is no /var/lib/cache directory thus none of the subordinate structure
400 [03:24:54] <themill> linux_user2: bah /var/cache/apt/archives/debian-archive-keyring*deb
401 [03:24:59] <LtL> linux_user2: goto replaced-url
402 [03:25:10] <linux_user2> ok
403 [03:25:11] <linux_user2> one sec
404 [03:25:11] <LtL> not what i asked for... again.
405 [03:25:12] <themill> «wget replaced-url
406 [03:25:30] <linux_user2> you said do I have it
407 [03:25:35] <linux_user2> that means are those files there
408 [03:25:43] <linux_user2> they are not as no such directory exists
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410 [03:26:40] <LtL> themill: i don't think he has wget
411 [03:26:55] <themill> LtL: did earlier
412 [03:27:00] <linux_user2> actually I do
413 [03:27:16] <LtL> my mistake, use wget then linux_user2
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416 [03:27:40] <linux_user2> I could not do it as wget said some certificate was expired
417 [03:27:47] <linux_user2> let me paste bin the whole mess of output
418 [03:27:56] <themill> linux_user2: what's the output of "date"
419 [03:28:03] <tomreyn> jeddi: this error message is a bit misleading. most of the time it means that you requested a change which, with the current cached information on available packages and the current systems' state (installed packages and versions), and most of all in the combination you may have requested, is not satisfiable.
420 [03:28:11] <warsoul> why my connection is getting timed out when try ssh to a ip
421 [03:28:15] <warsoul> was working fine
422 [03:28:28] <linux_user2> that is very strange! It says it's the year 2037!?! WTF?
423 [03:28:33] <themill> bingo
424 [03:29:11] <LtL> good call themill
425 [03:29:16] <themill> jeddi: what are you trying to upgrade from and to?
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427 [03:30:40] <linux_user2> themill: hang on a sec
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429 [03:30:43] <themill> jeddi: apt's solver calls a package 'held' when it can't upgrade it and it calls it broken when other parts of the same upgrade would break it. It's not always about what you've configured in terms of holds
430 [03:30:59] <linux_user2> granted there was a lot of residual crap there to be cleaned up too
431 [03:31:16] <linux_user2> let me see what it does now
432 [03:31:30] <linux_user2> apt-get update looks very healthy...its still running but no errors yet
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437 [03:35:15] <linux_user2> themill: the apt-get update is stuck
438 [03:35:17] *** Quits: monstar_ (~mitya@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
439 [03:35:27] <linux_user2> let me make sure nothing on my network is slowing things down.
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446 [03:38:44] <linux_user2> I must take a break, I have to return an HDMI cable too walmart.
447 [03:38:51] <linux_user2> I will be back in an hour or so
448 [03:39:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1508
449 [03:39:07] <linux_user2> right now I am going to let apt-get update run and take as long as it needs
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452 [03:40:25] <millaus564578568> Ciao a Tutto il Canale!!!
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454 [03:43:31] <linux_user2> themill: date was the issue, no one likes a bad date! :) I ran apt-get update, it took a bit, but it worked 100%, disc-upgrade is running now and its upgrading java. Later I will look at why NTP which I always setup to use time.nist.gov is jacked up
455 [03:43:41] <linux_user2> disc-upgrade = dist-upgrade
456 [03:43:59] <linux_user2> its loading JRE 11
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458 [03:44:15] <linux_user2> be back in a bit
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519 [04:23:19] <millaus564578568> Hellooooooooooo!!!
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524 [04:24:59] <AndikaSagala> hey.. Saint Vincent College really good... i found something good in their scientific article.
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528 [04:28:45] <bolt> ...
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532 [04:31:10] <grisher> ...
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536 [04:35:07] <jeddi> tomeyn, themill - thanks. i just did a dist-upgrade (via apt-get) from buyllseye to sid - was working okay before, with kde / sddm but after upgrade no session for kde was recognised. tried uninstalling kde-full metapackage and then when i went to install that package again i'm getting a lot of 'REcommends ... but is it not going to be installe
537 [04:35:07] <jeddi> d' with a summary - you have held broken packages.
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545 [04:39:09] <tomreyn> jeddi: you're on sid now, such can happen
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548 [04:40:46] <jeddi> tomreyn yeah ... i've been teetering on sid since the 90's : )
549 [04:41:27] <tomreyn> maybe you can install apt-forktracer and it can help you sort out the held packages issue.
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555 [04:45:50] <grisher> any idea when ff70 will be in the sid repo?
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557 [04:47:06] <dvs> ,v firefox
558 [04:47:07] <judd> Package: firefox on amd64 -- sid: 69.0.2-1
559 [04:48:39] <jeddi> ooh - forktracer looks interesting tomreyn -- it's reporting a bunch (maybe 60 ) of packages that include some that are definitely off-menu (spotify, postgresql pipeline) that i have installed over the past few months from third party repos.
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561 [04:50:32] <jeddi> okay .. removing everything forktracer picked up as potentially uncool (68 packages)
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568 [04:58:35] <jeddi> and ... that didn't help - same error (you have held broken packages' and many 'recommends ... but it is not going to be installed'
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587 [05:10:22] <millaus564578568> Ciao a Tutti!!!
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589 [05:10:56] <dvs> aloha
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638 [05:53:19] <millaus564578568> Hellooooooooooo!!!
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644 [06:00:48] <loadmasther> Alo
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652 [06:10:51] <m1kr0n3t> test
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655 [06:14:04] <m1kr0n3t> exit
656 [06:15:34] <berndj> in which package might "lasem" live? apparently something to do with MathML and SVG and a few other things. but nothing in apt-cache search lasem
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663 [06:18:15] <diogenes_> ,file lasem
664 [06:18:21] <judd> No packages in buster/amd64 were found with that file.
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686 [06:40:24] <millaus564578568> Ciao a tutti :))
687 [06:41:14] <warsoul> need help
688 [06:41:23] <warsoul> cant connect to an ip via ssh
689 [06:41:39] <warsoul> everything is working fine just got connected on my phone
690 [06:42:17] <han-solo> it the sshd running on the machine you are trying to connect to ?
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692 [06:42:29] <warsoul> yes
693 [06:42:39] <warsoul> just got connected on my phone with an app
694 [06:42:58] <han-solo> and it is saying `connection refused` when you try `ssh <username>@<ip>` >
695 [06:43:01] <warsoul> i tried to connect with my debian machine and laptop macosx connection gets timed out
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699 [06:43:43] <han-solo> is this machine an AWS instance ?
700 [06:43:54] <warsoul> AWS was that?
701 [06:43:59] <han-solo> never mind
702 [06:44:00] <warsoul> sorry
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704 [06:44:37] <warsoul> just got the vps re-installed
705 [06:44:42] <warsoul> and still the same thing
706 [06:46:00] <han-solo> `iptables -L -v` says anything regarding port 22 ?
707 [06:46:34] <warsoul> bash: iptables: command not found
708 [06:46:39] <warsoul> but dont think so
709 [06:46:45] <warsoul> i get connected to others vps
710 [06:46:49] <warsoul> with no issue
711 [06:48:28] <han-solo> Okay
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715 [06:51:49] <han-solo> last one, what does `nc -vz -w 2 <ip> 22` say ?
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721 [06:54:34] <warsoul> han-solo, vps provider changed the ip and is working
722 [06:54:38] <warsoul> :/
723 [06:54:57] <han-solo> *shrugs*
724 [06:55:24] <warsoul> dont know what cause the issue
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763 [07:23:19] <millaus564578568> Ciao belli
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824 [08:10:26] <millaus564578568> Ciao a tutti :P
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826 [08:12:33] <LilD> hello, i fogot my password for irc
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828 [08:12:45] <LilD> anybody know how to retrieve it
829 [08:12:59] <Unit193> See /msg NickServ help sendpass
830 [08:13:12] <LilD> ty
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841 [08:19:07] <mrig> Hello, my buster instillation of sqlite3 is apparently not complied with readline support, is there perhaps another binary that I could use that is?
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849 [08:24:10] <superlinux> hello. iptables -L is showing my rules, but they are not effective after updating to debian 10. what should I do to get them working?
850 [08:24:18] <somiaj> mrig: what makes you tink that, sqlite3 depends on libreadline7, which to me suggests it was complied with libreadline support
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852 [08:25:24] <somiaj> superlinux: So you can see the rules, but tests say they aren't working? I do know there is a switch from iptables to nftables in buster, but there is compadbility between the two.
853 [08:25:30] <mrig> somiaj: well it is not working, this is my first assumption, could it be that it is missing the libreadline7 binaries?
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855 [08:25:57] <superlinux> somiaj, yes exactly.
856 [08:26:13] <superlinux> I have removed nft right now
857 [08:26:23] <superlinux> I will reboot.
858 [08:26:28] <mrig> dpkg is listing libreadline7.
859 [08:26:28] <dpkg> mrig: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox?
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861 [08:26:37] <mrig> heh
862 [08:26:42] <somiaj> mrig: libreadline7 is the libaries, it won't have binaries. I don't know what isn't working, but from what I see libreadline7 support is included in sqlite3
863 [08:27:03] <somiaj> superlinux: what does ls -l /etc/alternatives/iptables point at?
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867 [08:27:24] <mrig> Yes only if it is compiled with the flag --enable-readline=yes
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870 [08:27:44] <mrig> as it is not working I am assuming that it was not set at compile time.
871 [08:27:56] <somiaj> mrig: you could look at the build source to double check this, but I still don't understand what isn't working, could it be some other issue you are running into.
872 [08:28:12] <superlinux> somiaj, I have just read the debian wiki about the alternatives and switched everything to legacy.
873 [08:28:37] <somiaj> superlinux: hmm, wonder if there is some issue with how you did that. I'm not quite sure on this nft change, and any other things one might need to do.
874 [08:28:38] <mrig> somiaj: the tab completion, sorry if I was not being very explicit.
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877 [08:29:13] <somiaj> mrig: so the tab completion in bash?
878 [08:29:23] <mrig> When in the shell and opening a file, the tab completion for the files name does not function.
879 [08:29:26] <somiaj> (I don't use sqlite so not quite sure what you are talking about)
880 [08:29:37] <superlinux> somiaj, there is a bridge I made to create a transparent squid proxy
881 [08:29:51] <mrig> inside its own shell.
882 [08:29:53] <superlinux> I know I have to use ebtables.
883 [08:30:06] <superlinux> but this is a different issue
884 [08:30:13] <somiaj> superlinux: you might need to wait around for someone who understands this more than I do, I was just double checking the issue wasn't related to the nft switch.
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890 [08:31:09] <superlinux> thanks
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895 [08:32:13] <somiaj> mrig: hmm, not sure what the issue is. But it appears that sqlite is compiled with libreadline7 support in debian. Wonder if there is another reason tab completion is not working for you.
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897 [08:32:29] <mrig> Yes when running sqlite3 it has its own shell and command prompt, it is here that the tab completion is not present and can be.
898 [08:32:52] <somiaj> I checked debian/rules, and I don't see any mention of libreadline, though I expect the ./configure script detects it, hence the depends on libreadline
899 [08:33:24] <mrig> It could be that there is some other reason that it does not work, no idea though what that might be.
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902 [08:33:48] <somiaj> mrig: Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 11), autoconf (>= 2.59), libtool (>= 1.5.2), automake, chrpath, libreadline-dev, tcl8.6-dev -- libreadline-dev is a build depends, so it is building it with libreadline support
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905 [08:34:20] <mrig> Will that set --enable-readline=yes ?
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907 [08:34:57] <mrig> I imagine that it will also require readline for data entry too?
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909 [08:35:12] <somiaj> not exactly, but it will ensure the libreadline-dev files are available during build time, and the ./configure script will automatically detect it and enable it. It mostly like doesn't require one use the --enable-readline=yes flag because of htis.
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911 [08:35:46] <somiaj> having never built this, I can't say for certain, but everything I see suggests libreadline support is included.
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914 [08:37:32] <somiaj> so my guess is there is something else causing tab completion to not work for you, and not that libreadline support is missing.
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916 [08:38:09] <mrig> What might be the cause of this, have you any ideas?
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919 [08:38:43] <mrig> I have not noticed any problem in other programs, just trying to think of one that would also use the same lib?
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927 [08:41:01] <Lope> I've debootstrapped an installation, I've got dev,proc,sys bind mounted and /dev/sda1 mounted at $chroot/boot run `grub-install dev/sda; update-initramfs -u; update-grub`. There were no kernels in /boot so I uninstalled and reinstalled the kernel. That worked. But then it gave the error: cannot find a GRUB drive for /dev/sda1 check your device.map
928 [08:41:11] <Lope> I tried rebooting, but it won't boot.
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930 [08:41:24] <Lope> This is a LUKS installation.
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932 [08:41:57] <Lope> I've got /etc/crypttab setup where it specifies the UUID of /dev/sda2
933 [08:41:59] <Lope> then I've got
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935 [08:42:41] <Lope> /etc/fstab specifying for root, the UUID of the opened LUKS volume
936 [08:42:47] <Lope> ratrace, any ideas?
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965 [09:00:58] <Lope> my bad. I had attempted to wipe grub earlier and forgot that I would also wipe out the partition table. (DD'd zeros to the first 1MB)
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967 [09:01:05] <Lope> I re-created the partition table exactly as it was (from memory), re-mounted everything, `grub install /dev/sda; update-initramfs -u; update-grub`
968 [09:01:09] <Lope> Now it booted just fine.
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997 [09:19:55] <MACscr> whats the proper way to disable cron job email alerts only for certain cron jobs and these cronjobs are installed/managed by a package manager, etc? i know how to do it for tasks i setup in crontab or if i create something in /etc/cron.daily or whatever, but there doesnt seem to be a solid way to manage it for third party managed jobs. Does that make any sense?
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1045 [09:47:17] <mrig> I have bash-completion installed and active in my shell, is there any other reason that this might not be working?
1046 [09:48:13] <mrig> Is there something that needs configuring when launching a shell within a terminal process?
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1051 [09:51:47] <Strum> hi
1052 [09:53:02] <Strum> how does display position arrangement work with the display properties app?
1053 [09:53:18] <Strum> i can't seem to position the screens
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1055 [09:53:27] <Strum> click and drag doesn't work
1056 [09:53:34] <klys> try xrandr?
1057 [09:54:49] <Strum> what is that?
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1060 [09:55:04] <Strum> sounds like some sort of random number generator
1061 [09:55:15] <Strum> got it eventually
1062 [09:55:35] <klys> strum, xrandr can be used from the commandline and can position monitors --left-of or --right-of for example.
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1065 [09:57:17] <Strum> can you run multiple monitors without having X running?
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1069 [09:59:31] <klys> strum, I have done that with a matrox G450 or G550 using matroxfb_crtc2.ko
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1071 [09:59:55] <ratrace> mrig: for bash, it should JustWork(tm). You sure that the completion you're trying is supported?
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1073 [10:00:25] <klys> strum, for multihead you probably want X + Xephyr.
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1075 [10:01:07] <mrig> ratrace: not certain of this, I see that it works on a mac system, no idea if it should on linux, I would have thought so.
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1079 [10:01:47] <mrig> Says here that it need be set at compile time : replaced-url
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1081 [10:02:09] <klys> strum, the con2fbmap utility may work with some cards, if you get another /dev/fb? device for your other monitor.
1082 [10:02:52] <mrig> I was thinking about trying to compile it myself to see, tried asking in #debian and it was suggested that the flag would have been set to yes automagicaly.
1083 [10:03:16] <klys> strum, also modern cards don't work with fbset, it seems. there was an efort some time ago to replace it. more at: replaced-url
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1085 [10:04:43] <Strum> thanks
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1096 [10:10:12] <mrig> Oh sorry am in debian :| how embarrassing, thought that this was ##linux, I do apologise.
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1098 [10:10:28] <millaus564578568> Ciao a Tutto il Canale!!!
1099 [10:11:03] <jelly> millaus564578568: hi, can you disable the script that says hello automatically every time you join the channel?
1100 [10:11:29] <colo-work> :D
1101 [10:11:59] <jelly> once a day is probably more than enough
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1103 [10:12:45] <ratrace> oh jelly where's your frisky youthfulness! CIAO RAGAZZI! *giggles and anime sounds*
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1114 [10:19:34] <rabbitear_g> 5 + none,
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1120 [10:22:27] <shtrb> Is there a way I could get ink levels when I use cups with double filtering (a laptop that has local cups print to a remote cups machine that has a usb printer) ? the ink app is installed on both cups servers and I am using ipp (Debian buster)
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1142 [10:34:08] <boktan> replaced-url
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1148 [10:38:57] <ratrace> boktan: no, like we told you yesterday, ask in #ubuntu
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1150 [10:39:27] <boktan> no one did help in any room so i try everywhere :/
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1152 [10:40:08] <boktan> everybody is talking about linux codes martix click cklack bom but if i ask any question about a driver everybody is silence :D
1153 [10:40:10] <ratrace> boktan: well you can't do that, there's a reason there are separate channels on IRC and not one giant room with thousands of users :)
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1157 [10:42:24] <ratrace> boktan: there are also ubuntu forums and mailing lists where more technically knowledgeable people gather.
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1162 [10:44:55] <klys> boktan, in this channel I might help with debian kernels. you can get one from replaced-url
1163 [10:45:38] <ratrace> shouldn't use debian kernels on ubuntu though. ubuntu userland relies on their SAUCE patches
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1165 [10:46:13] <boktan> :/
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1168 [10:46:48] <colo-work> that's a nice feature of Debian kernels, by which you are encouraged to use the Debian userland, too :)
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1171 [10:47:21] <colo-work> ubuntu themselves have this, though: replaced-url
1172 [10:47:55] <boktan> i was on kali linux they said me backbox is better but was giving problems then they said me ubuntu is better and i choice ubuntu now they saying me debian is better but no i will stay ubuntu man :D
1173 [10:48:25] <ratrace> boktan: so... #ubuntu then :)
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1175 [10:48:38] <klys> boktan, alternatively I would be willing to help you compile this kernel, replaced-url
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1177 [10:49:20] <colo-work> most USB wifi sticks are crap
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1179 [10:49:52] <ratrace> colo-work: mine isn't. it only disconnects once per hour or so, and not every few minutes like the crappy ones :))
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1181 [10:50:15] <boktan> colo-work it was working fine on kali linux zero problem but kali linux cannot let my internal wifi work so i change to ubuntu but yeah internal or external wifi one of them must give problem :D
1182 [10:50:51] <boktan> older laptops works better with linux i think
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1223 [11:09:20] <fireba11> boktan: haven't had issues with notbook hardware in years. only using lenovo here though :-D
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1243 [11:27:41] <at0m> fireba11: sounds like my old mentor when someone asked him for help. he'd go "i use x i never had that problem"
1244 [11:28:26] <at0m> (we'd get along very good, and had better discussions than that, fortunately)
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1259 [11:41:47] * shtrb slips fireball replaced-url
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1264 [11:42:52] <ratrace> at0m: hence the WorksForMe(tm) FOSS-y meem.
1265 [11:43:46] <at0m> ratrace: eh. always found that quite condescending. doesn't fix anyone's problem.
1266 [11:44:36] <ratrace> indeed.
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1271 [11:49:03] <at0m> in the case of my old mentor, he'd seen and know things that few others had, and many relied on his skills. big dude, ex soviet military. people would shiver as he walked up to them or entered the room. talked english to him, as that was his native tongue. i talked our local language to him (he had lived here for 20y+, so..) and i guess he much appreciated that :)
1272 [11:50:07] <at0m> *as if* that was his native tongue
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1280 [11:54:36] <seb__> hi
1281 [11:55:03] <seb__> what is liboost ?
1282 [11:56:20] <seb__> l don't no, optimisation ?
1283 [11:56:21] <at0m> libboost? or single b? the latter doesn't show up in apt search here
1284 [11:57:09] <shtrb> ,v libboost
1285 [11:57:11] <judd> No package named 'libboost' was found in amd64.
1286 [11:57:17] <at0m> ,v libboost1.62
1287 [11:57:18] <judd> No package named 'libboost1.62' was found in amd64.
1288 [11:57:25] <seb__> yes l'm
1289 [11:57:44] <shtrb> seb__, apt-cache show liboost will give you some info
1290 [11:57:55] <at0m> ,v libboost1.62-dev
1291 [11:57:56] <judd> Package: libboost1.62-dev on amd64 -- stretch: 1.62.0+dfsg-4; sid: 1.62.0+dfsg-10+b1
1292 [11:58:01] <seb__> l try
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1295 [11:58:53] <at0m> seb__: what version is running? cat /etc/debian_version
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1302 [12:03:38] <seb__> sorry is oldsable
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1304 [12:05:24] <seb__> l'm on amd64
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1309 [12:06:52] <at0m> seb__: no problem. got an oldstable, too. apt references replaced-url
1310 [12:07:16] <seb__> ok , thancks
1311 [12:07:19] <at0m> if double 'b', at least
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1313 [12:08:16] <seb__> aptitude is my prefenre
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1315 [12:08:40] <plantroon> is there any way to specify luks version in preseed file? :D
1316 [12:09:04] <seb__> soory
1317 [12:09:56] <at0m> seb__: whatever works for you. "aptitude search $term" defaults to returning just package name search results, while "apt search $term" returns results from description, too
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1319 [12:10:31] <at0m> but getting single/double 'b' right is important for both =)
1320 [12:10:39] <seb__> l have the liboost, another soft for opimise my distro
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1323 [12:11:14] <at0m> seb__: that's not in debian, afaik
1324 [12:11:19] <seb__> thx atom
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1326 [12:13:04] <seb__> thx
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1334 [12:15:05] <seb__> whith aptitude, l have liboost in 64 bits
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1343 [12:24:03] <seb__> l'm install maybe soft, for metaexploit l chosse tout install soft, bug tarifaire
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1345 [12:25:38] <elm_> yesterday noon I have started reportbug to report a kernel issue (non-vanilla issue) but the program is still hanging at "gathering additional data, this may take a while ..."
1346 [12:25:43] <elm_> what can I do?
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1348 [12:28:08] <seb__> l don' t no, l'm use the 4.09.11, no rt
1349 [12:29:18] <ratrace> elm_: try trace it and see where it's hanging? or ctrl-c/pkill it and start again
1350 [12:29:33] <seb__> what additionnel ?
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1354 [12:31:20] <seb__> what is use trace please
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1356 [12:32:29] <seb__> sory for my débutant
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1358 [12:33:32] <seb__> l'm french
1359 [12:34:04] <elm_> replaced-url
1360 [12:34:16] <ratrace> !fr
1361 [12:34:16] <dpkg> Pour l'aide en francais, veuillez rejoindre le canal #debian-fr or #debian-quebec. Francophone users: for help in french, please go to #debian-fr or #debian-quebec.
1362 [12:34:32] <seb__> <ok
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1364 [12:36:46] <wrksx> Is this possible to change a file's "owner group" (not sure what's the correct term for that) from user x if x is the owner of the file? I want to do x@server:~$ chown :replaced-url
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1368 [12:37:12] <ratrace> elm_: I'm not sure what that output means... is that the correct PID?
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1370 [12:37:36] <wrksx> Currently the permissions are drwxr-xr-x userx nogroup
1371 [12:37:46] <ratrace> wrksx: only root can chown
1372 [12:38:25] <elm_> replaced-url
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1377 [12:40:02] <ratrace> elm_: can you add f to ps? I'd like to see the tree there
1378 [12:40:31] <seb__> ps is a good comma,d*
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1381 [12:42:20] <seb__> ok bon à savoir
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1383 [12:42:55] <elm_> the process does not exist any more
1384 [12:43:06] <elm_> ltrace has terminated the process
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1388 [12:45:20] <elm_> now it hangs again at "gathering information"
1389 [12:45:38] <elm_> isn`t there a template to send a report by hand?
1390 [12:46:03] <wrksx> Okay, I'm goin to describe my problem a bit better.
1391 [12:46:04] <wrksx> I have a deploy script for my website that runs under a user called 'deployer'. Once the file have been copied to the correct location, I need to change the permissions on the app/tmp folder to allow the 'replaced-url
1392 [12:46:04] <wrksx> How would you handle such a situation?
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1396 [12:47:04] <ratrace> wrksx: I'd run the application in its dedicated user:group and then I'd make replaced-url
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1399 [12:47:46] <ratrace> wrksx: that way makes (s)ftp access to the files compatible with replaced-url
1400 [12:48:03] <ratrace> replace (s)ftp with your deployer script for same effect
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1402 [12:48:46] <wrksx> my application doesn't really "run", its a php script
1403 [12:48:51] <wrksx> it's run by apache
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1405 [12:49:00] <wrksx> But I think I get the idea
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1407 [12:49:02] <ratrace> oh mod-php? that's so 1990s
1408 [12:49:07] <wrksx> yeah =)
1409 [12:49:31] <ratrace> you can STILL do the same. make replaced-url
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1412 [12:50:00] <ratrace> alternatively run the deployer as root (dropping privs for any network access) so it can chown/chmod where appropriate
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1414 [12:50:20] <wrksx> I'm really unconforatable running anything as root
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1417 [12:50:52] <honigkuchen> Is it possible, for Installing Debian, not to boot from the installing medium but run the installer from a running linux =?
1418 [12:50:57] <ratrace> at some point you'll have to, so better get that fear in check :)
1419 [12:51:34] <ratrace> honigkuchen: you can use debootstrap. not directly what you wanted, but gives you far more control ov the installation process
1420 [12:52:16] <seb__> ratrace tou have the stace protol ?
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1422 [12:52:44] <ratrace> the what?
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1425 [12:53:06] <seb__> sry
1426 [12:53:10] <wrksx> ratrace: Thx for the help
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1428 [12:54:36] <ratrace> wrksx: as another option if you want to retain replaced-url
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1443 [13:12:03] <elm_> reportbug is hanging again
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1446 [13:13:22] <ratrace> elm_: file a bug against reportbug? :)
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1450 [13:16:05] <elm_> replaced-url
1451 [13:16:10] <elm_> what shall I report?
1452 [13:16:18] <elm_> I have no backtrace yet
1453 [13:16:29] <elm_> which process would you trace
1454 [13:16:41] <elm_> the kernel bug is far more important
1455 [13:16:58] <elm_> how can I gain standard system information to attach to the report
1456 [13:17:12] *** Quits: wrksx (~wrksx@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1457 [13:17:38] *** Quits: Haxxa (~Harrison@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC 1.6.2+deb1+jessie0 - ##replaced-url
1458 [13:17:40] <ratrace> elm_: maybe this helps: replaced-url
1459 [13:18:55] <seb__> help distroy trace, lol
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1461 [13:20:18] <elm_> I don´t see the script to gather system information
1462 [13:20:27] <elm_> what shall I attach for a kernel report
1463 [13:20:34] <ratrace> elm_: you were tracing the topmost process, but does it not hang at thte innermost child, the `dd`?
1464 [13:20:59] <elm_> i have marked the processes of reportbug with a star
1465 [13:22:13] <themill> it's in /usr/share/bug/linux-image-$(uname -r)
1466 [13:22:46] <seb__> scripttday
1467 [13:23:17] <funabashi> Hi all maybe someone can be nice and help me out with my problem with source.lst... replaced-url
1468 [13:23:56] <seb__> source list lol
1469 [13:25:04] <themill> funabashi: "stretch/sid" isn't a thing; what release of Debian do you actually want to be running
1470 [13:25:37] <seb__> l don't no
1471 [13:25:38] <ratrace> that's ubuntu.... :)
1472 [13:26:38] <seb__> l know
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1474 [13:27:29] <seb__> aptitude maybe
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1481 [13:28:02] <jelly> how can you tell it's ubuntu?
1482 [13:28:27] <seb__> is fepotery
1483 [13:28:38] *** Quits: elm_ (~elm@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
1484 [13:28:56] <themill> seb__: I think that's enough, thanks
1485 [13:29:31] <seb__> l don't no, my engl​h ​ medi#debian,#debian-facile,#df-flood,#debianfrcre
1486 [13:29:35] <ratrace> jelly: that's the content of debian_version on ubuntu, no?
1487 [13:29:43] <themill> ratrace: no
1488 [13:30:03] <jelly> "it depends"
1489 [13:30:37] <ratrace> it depends on ubuntu version yes. eg. bionic has buster/sid
1490 [13:30:58] <ratrace> I think stretch/sid was xenial but don't quote me on that
1491 [13:31:04] <seb__> why unbutu ?
1492 [13:31:26] <themill> ratrace: it was also stretch, 3 years ago.
1493 [13:31:40] <funabashi> any one know how to make a source.lst which can work ?
1494 [13:31:42] <ratrace> themill: hmmm?
1495 [13:31:47] <seb__> ok
1496 [13:31:57] <themill> funabashi: what release of Debian do you actually want to be running
1497 [13:32:23] <themill> funabashi: you have a machine that you have not looked after for about 3 years
1498 [13:32:33] <seb__> streche
1499 [13:32:35] <funabashi> themill: i want to be able to install a program with aptget install
1500 [13:32:45] <themill> funabashi: that doesn't answer the question
1501 [13:33:02] <funabashi> themill: i dont know what release of Debian im running to be honest
1502 [13:33:05] <seb__> sry
1503 [13:33:21] <jelly> funabashi: what does "lsb_release -a" command say? pastebin the whole thing
1504 [13:33:26] <themill> funabashi: you can try upgrading that to stretch. That might work.
1505 [13:33:53] <funabashi> Description: Ubuntu 17.10 artful
1506 [13:33:58] * ratrace drops mic and leaves the stage with a smug face
1507 [13:34:23] <themill> ratrace: do understand that is nothing but luck
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1509 [13:34:36] <seb__> pt update && apt install pluma terminator most mlocate locate rar unrar sudo
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1511 [13:35:46] <seb__> not luck, l have a diplome
1512 [13:35:59] <funabashi> jelly and next ? :)
1513 [13:36:24] <themill> funabashi: it looks like you have a mess of Debian and Ubuntu. Reinstall it.
1514 [13:37:01] <funabashi> themill: do you know any other solution else i wait for anyone else who can find one, thanks
1515 [13:38:02] <seb__> gnu/linux is not reinst all
1516 [13:38:07] <jelly> funabashi: this may have been an ubuntu installation, or a derivative that mixed both ubuntu and debian, or a custom mix. Was it you or someone else that installed it? Can you find out precisely which distro was there initially?
1517 [13:38:27] <seb__> ok
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1519 [13:39:01] <funabashi> jelly: i dont remeber the iso file was few years ago
1520 [13:39:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1532
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1522 [13:39:51] <humpled> what is making you prefer to upgrade over reinstall?
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1524 [13:40:05] <jelly> funabashi: then the sanest way forward is what themill said
1525 [13:41:02] <funabashi> :/
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1528 [13:41:26] <jelly> funabashi: I can't, in good faith, tell you to do a release upgrade to ubuntu 18.04 lts (xenial), or to debian 9 (stretch), because it might break things that work right now
1529 [13:41:54] <jelly> backup home and all the other data, reinstall, restore data
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1531 [13:42:47] <funabashi> i wont reboot that server
1532 [13:43:32] <funabashi> If i clear the source.lst file and i do apt-get update i still get lots of shit. any idea how can i purge it?
1533 [13:44:08] <jelly> I wouldn't touch that kind of setup for less than $200/hour, sorry
1534 [13:44:21] * themill looks suspiciously at jelly's m
1535 [13:44:28] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1536 [13:44:37] <ratrace> dollars? u cheap. I wouldn't touch that for less than 200€
1537 [13:44:39] <Fox> 200 is not that much
1538 [13:45:11] <ratrace> also.... server? in a role that shouldn't be rebooted? All hands to facepalm stations. All hands to facepalm stations. Capt'n picard has insufficient hands of facepalm. Yellow alert!
1539 [13:45:13] <funabashi> a linux geek has that kind of 200 per hour?
1540 [13:45:26] <funabashi> its more then me :/
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1543 [13:46:25] <ratrace> funabashi: that's per incident, 200€ / hr sounds about right. that's not regular sysadmin salary unless maybe you're a fortune 5 company
1544 [13:46:31] <funabashi> aha
1545 [13:46:35] <funabashi> thats nothing
1546 [13:46:52] <funabashi> i do 150 per hour for security guy
1547 [13:47:02] <funabashi> euro
1548 [13:47:08] <jelly> that's very similar.
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1555 [13:49:53] <brokencycle> that they overlap.
1556 [13:50:07] <brokencycle> Hi! I am struggling with a 4T disk with a GPT partition. It claims I have two partitions, but saying 'i' or 'p' print only one. The problem is it claims
1557 [13:50:10] <brokencycle> that they overlap.
1558 [13:50:18] <brokencycle> sorry for the typo. :(
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1569 [13:56:49] <tsglove> Is there a directory that is NOT preserved during a reboot? I thought /var/tmp was preserved, yet I was wrong. --- reading this --> replaced-url
1570 [13:57:23] <funabashi> jelly: cant u please help me
1571 [13:58:18] <ratrace> tsglove: traditionally /var/tmp should be and on debian at least, is, by default.
1572 [13:58:36] <ratrace> funabashi: they did, recommended the sanest solution: reinstall.
1573 [13:59:01] <tsglove> ratrace, so /var/tmp is preserved during a reboot?
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1575 [13:59:34] <ratrace> tsglove: should be per hier(7) and I'm not aware of a default mechanism (other than a custom tmpfiles setup) that would clear it out
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1577 [14:00:08] <tsglove> ratrace, ok thanks. Just learned that. Which is an error on my side, truthfully.
1578 [14:00:13] <ratrace> /tmp must not be considered reboot-survivable, and many distros (I also change my setup) mounts it as tmpfs
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1580 [14:00:35] <tsglove> So something inside /tmp will not survive a reboot?
1581 [14:00:55] <ratrace> tsglove: depends on the setup, but per hier(7) /tmp must not be considered persistent.
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1584 [14:01:22] <tsglove> hier(7) ??? searching...
1585 [14:01:32] <ratrace> `man 7 hier`
1586 [14:01:49] <funabashi> anyone know how to delete all from source.lst and secure keys.. etc?
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1588 [14:02:10] <tsglove> ratrace, cool! Thanks. REading up now.
1589 [14:02:18] <ratrace> tsglove: i'm also not aware of a default mechanism on debian that clears out /tmp (note:default) but then I don't install debian from installer, I use debootstrap so my setup could be different in that regard.
1590 [14:02:41] <ratrace> (and I mount it as tmpfs)
1591 [14:02:57] <CrystalMath> ratrace: RAMTMP=yes
1592 [14:03:08] <ratrace> CrystalMath: where?
1593 [14:03:19] *** Joins: iViLe (~bob@replaced-ip )
1594 [14:03:21] <CrystalMath> /etc/default/tmpfs
1595 [14:03:38] <ratrace> I don't have that file... lemme see what apt-file says
1596 [14:03:45] <CrystalMath> there's also RAMSHM
1597 [14:03:52] <ratrace> initscripts? that's before systemd?
1598 [14:04:27] <CrystalMath> yeah, i don't run crap
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1600 [14:04:28] <ratrace> doesn't look like package installed regularly
1601 [14:04:49] <ratrace> right, so for 99.9999% of debian users, that advice is moot :)
1602 [14:04:51] <funabashi> replaced-url
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1604 [14:05:35] <CrystalMath> sysvinit-core pulls in initscripts
1605 [14:05:36] <jelly> funabashi: I can help after 17:00UTC, you know my hourly rate. /msg if interested.
1606 [14:06:12] <ratrace> CrystalMath: that's not installed by default afaik
1607 [14:06:16] *** Parts: malm (~nil@replaced-ip ) ()
1608 [14:06:21] <CrystalMath> my modified debian installer stuff installs sysvinit-core by default
1609 [14:06:36] <ratrace> so you're not talking about stock Debian?
1610 [14:06:42] <CrystalMath> i don't consider it a fork of debian though... it's just a slight difference
1611 [14:07:08] <CrystalMath> debian fully supports sysvinit-core...
1612 [14:07:16] <ratrace> not for long :)
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1614 [14:07:52] <funabashi> jelly: $ sudo apt-get update
1615 [14:07:52] <funabashi> Reading package lists... Done
1616 [14:07:57] <funabashi> ;)
1617 [14:08:14] <CrystalMath> i may switch to runit
1618 [14:08:20] <CrystalMath> i'm using OpenRC now
1619 [14:08:24] <ratrace> funabashi: you know the rates, when that system fails apart in the near future :)
1620 [14:08:35] <ratrace> CrystalMath: thats cool.
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1622 [14:09:12] <CrystalMath> so i don't even use my own set defaults, heh
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1625 [14:09:45] <ratrace> CrystalMath: I'd love to use openrc, but it doesn't support the features I need (and systemd provides).
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1628 [14:10:30] <CrystalMath> ratrace: what sort of feature?
1629 [14:11:26] <ratrace> CrystalMath: kernel security features, filesystem view restrictions, seccomp and caps, all nicely configurable within single unit file, per service.
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1631 [14:11:41] <CrystalMath> isn
1632 [14:11:44] <ratrace> also resource management
1633 [14:11:45] <CrystalMath> *isn't that just cgroups stuff?
1634 [14:11:49] <ratrace> it's not
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1637 [14:12:37] <rsarson> hi! i'm on debian 10 with buster-backports. when i type 'dpkg -l 'gcc-9*' i see lots of 'gcc-9-<arch>-linux-gun' but not 'gcc-9', so i can't install gcc-9. why does dpkg -l show all of these?
1638 [14:12:43] <CrystalMath> well okay caps aren't, but, i'm sure that wrapper scripts can be written for that
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1640 [14:13:21] <ratrace> CrystalMath: yes they can. I tried. gave up after a week of getting nowhere :)
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1645 [14:13:45] <CrystalMath> anyway, systemd also has some harmful features i don't want, specifically logind
1646 [14:13:48] <ratrace> systemd is a steaming pile in many ways, but right now it's the most feature complete middleware on the market. nothing comes close to that.
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1652 [14:15:02] <CrystalMath> ratrace: i see no logical reason for you to hate the alternatives though
1653 [14:15:20] <CrystalMath> i mean, i'm not asking for systemd to be removed..
1654 [14:15:32] <CrystalMath> i'm advocating for the status quo
1655 [14:15:36] <ratrace> CrystalMath: I don't hate them. What I hate is Debian's split-mind about it. It should go full systemd and leave alternatives to dedicated efforts like devuan.
1656 [14:16:02] <ratrace> because... due to that split mind, by default systemd units in debian are crap, they have to be, in order to support sysv
1657 [14:16:04] <CrystalMath> idk, i wouldn't like that at all... i think the init system should be interchangeable
1658 [14:16:21] <ratrace> not everything can be interchangeable
1659 [14:16:24] <CrystalMath> like, why not make separate packages
1660 [14:16:37] <CrystalMath> somepackage-scripts (for sysvinit)
1661 [14:16:39] <ratrace> also the reason why I take advantage of full PostgreSQL SQL dialect and don't rely on abstract ORMs
1662 [14:16:42] <CrystalMath> somepackage-systemd (for systemd)
1663 [14:16:55] <ratrace> CrystalMath: who will do that :) and who will pay them :)
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1665 [14:17:16] <jezebel> was systemd even designed for that possibility?
1666 [14:17:20] <CrystalMath> well like, they'd be separate add-on packages, where somepackage depends on somepackage-scripts | somepackage-systemd
1667 [14:17:32] <CrystalMath> or the other way around
1668 [14:17:37] <CrystalMath> to respect the chosen default
1669 [14:17:44] <ratrace> abstractions, portability, freedom of choice.... all lukewarm debilitation of software that has full potential if used dedicatedly.
1670 [14:18:00] <ratrace> instead, approaches like having dedicated distros for specific purpose, that's the ticket.
1671 [14:18:02] <CrystalMath> i don't really see any difficulty in this
1672 [14:18:11] <ratrace> that's why I think Devuan is a good thing, it fills the proper niche.
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1674 [14:18:37] <CrystalMath> devuan still isn't a proper fork though, it's just a set of patches really
1675 [14:18:39] <ratrace> CrystalMath: the difficulty is in TIME and EFFORT needed. Who is going to do that? build and configure services for different inits? lolno.
1676 [14:18:54] <CrystalMath> ratrace: everyone configures things for the init they care about
1677 [14:19:10] *** Quits: oish (~charlie@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1678 [14:19:29] <ratrace> jezebel: what possibility?
1679 [14:19:36] <CrystalMath> let's say, someone maintains "somepackage", and creates "somepackage-systemd" only
1680 [14:19:47] <ratrace> CrystalMath: sure, that's why for all the services I use, I write custom systemd units, because defaults stink.
1681 [14:19:48] <CrystalMath> then someone says "ah, i want somepackage, but with sysv"
1682 [14:19:59] <CrystalMath> so they make "somepackage-sysv"
1683 [14:20:01] <ratrace> and you can't change defaults, they have to be like that because the service must be able to run under sysv too....
1684 [14:20:44] <jezebel> ratrace… splitting it up, integrating with it without it taking your software over
1685 [14:21:14] <CrystalMath> ratrace: if there's a devuan, there can be people writing init script replacements for everything
1686 [14:21:19] <ratrace> jezebel: the splitting CrystalMath suggested is not of systemd, but of programs that would run under either of the inits
1687 [14:21:31] <jelly> CrystalMath: if you want to help with that, there's an init-diversity team
1688 [14:21:45] <CrystalMath> jelly: oh, nice :)
1689 [14:21:51] <ratrace> jezebel: systemd itself doesn't care. distro maintainers can configure it to be pure init only, or full shebang with all of its components replacing things like ntp, dnsmasq, ...
1690 [14:22:16] <CrystalMath> ratrace: can one disable logind and seat management?
1691 [14:22:24] <jelly> CrystalMath: they have a mailing list. replaced-url
1692 [14:22:29] <CrystalMath> ratrace: that would make me consider systemd
1693 [14:22:42] <jezebel> then other tings that integrate with that would break it seems
1694 [14:22:45] <jezebel> things*
1695 [14:22:46] <ratrace> CrystalMath: you don' thave to run it. but then you'll have problem with programs that are migrating to that api, that's why elogind is now replacing consolekit
1696 [14:22:57] <CrystalMath> ratrace: i don't use consolekit
1697 [14:23:02] <CrystalMath> consolekit is just as bad
1698 [14:23:04] <jezebel> too many tentacles
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1702 [14:23:27] <CrystalMath> the way i see it, consolekit never left, it just turned into an init system, and that's horrible
1703 [14:23:51] <ratrace> jezebel: systemd isn't taking over anything. systemd THE PROJECT has a lot of components because it wants to be full OS middleware. one can still run just PID 1, "the init" and not care about the otehr components.
1704 [14:24:31] <ratrace> that's still the case in debian from what I know. still doesn't use systemd-resolved, systemd-networkd by default for example.
1705 [14:24:58] <CrystalMath> oh, networkd is a terrible idea too
1706 [14:25:02] <ratrace> CrystalMath: meanwhile the pacakge is dead, and (desktop) applications nowadays expect the logind API to be available. hence elogind.
1707 [14:25:03] <CrystalMath> i don't use networkmanager
1708 [14:25:15] <jezebel> get ready for homed
1709 [14:25:29] <CrystalMath> ratrace: right, but no application i use requires that interface
1710 [14:25:32] <ratrace> why? you don't have to use homed
1711 [14:25:44] <funabashi> I have now found out it runnning ubuntu xenial
1712 [14:26:16] <jezebel> until other things are built assuming homed and then they break if i dont use homed
1713 [14:26:59] <ratrace> I think you don't understand homed at all then :) applications can't "assume" homed because homed doesn't do anything but encapsulate a portable, encrypted ~/ (with caveats)
1714 [14:27:12] <jezebel> give it time
1715 [14:27:15] <ratrace> ~/ itself will not change in any way.
1716 [14:27:37] <CrystalMath> meh, i can do that myself with FUSE
1717 [14:27:48] <ratrace> CrystalMath: no you can't :) not what homed is trying to achieve.
1718 [14:28:13] <ratrace> or maybe you can if you wrote a full daemon that uses FUSE but then you ...... wrote homed-fused :)
1719 [14:28:56] <ratrace> jezebel: give what time? there's a nice talk about homed, I can unearth the link if you want, it explains what it wants to achieve. I personally dislike that approach but who cares, it's just a daemon I can completely ignore.
1720 [14:29:11] <jezebel> mounted home dirs are nothing new really
1721 [14:29:23] <jezebel> why hang it off systemd?
1722 [14:29:30] <ratrace> watch the talk and you'll see
1723 [14:29:48] <ratrace> meanwhile you're hating something and displaying pure ignorance by hating something you obviously do not understand one bit.
1724 [14:29:56] <CrystalMath> anyway, my problem is logind and "seat management" as a concept
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1726 [14:30:21] <CrystalMath> i just log into a terminal
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1728 [14:30:36] <Habbie> ratrace, my debian buster most definitely uses systemd-resolved by default
1729 [14:30:36] <CrystalMath> and i believe that getting to root without setuid should be forbidden
1730 [14:30:39] <CrystalMath> it makes things simpler
1731 [14:30:51] <jezebel> i've forgotten the specifics admittedly but systemd just isnt my thing
1732 [14:31:10] <ratrace> Habbie: weird because mine doesn't. installed via installer, no desktop (using i3-wm)
1733 [14:31:20] <Habbie> ratrace, i have gnome
1734 [14:31:36] <ratrace> Habbie: I think NM then called upon it
1735 [14:31:41] <Habbie> ratrace, possible
1736 [14:31:43] <Habbie> ratrace, i did not investigate
1737 [14:31:59] <ratrace> jezebel: if you're interested: replaced-url
1738 [14:32:40] <jezebel> i'll need to watch it again sometime
1739 [14:32:48] <ratrace> that's about homed specifically.
1740 [14:33:13] <ratrace> I can see why they want to do it, it's not something I'd ever use it but I can imagine corporate and school environments that benefit from those concepts
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1742 [14:33:27] <ratrace> especially the mechanism that erases encryption key when the laptop goes to sleep
1743 [14:34:05] <CrystalMath> right, it sounds useful
1744 [14:34:14] <CrystalMath> but as long as it's a part of systemd, it will have a logind dependency
1745 [14:34:30] <jezebel> tentacles
1746 [14:34:34] <CrystalMath> and depend on a way to get root access without setuid
1747 [14:34:37] <ratrace> well yes, the session needs to be managed
1748 [14:34:46] <CrystalMath> i strongly oppose any such thing
1749 [14:34:47] <ratrace> if it's not logind, then it's consolekit, if you want managed sessions
1750 [14:34:51] *** Quits: MasterNayru (~quassel@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ##replaced-url
1751 [14:35:03] <CrystalMath> ratrace: i explicitly do not want managed sessions
1752 [14:35:11] <CrystalMath> ratrace: you know how i check whether a distro is good or not?
1753 [14:35:16] *** Joins: nyov (~nyov@replaced-ip )
1754 [14:35:20] <ratrace> I really don't care :)
1755 [14:35:21] <CrystalMath> ratrace: i try typing "reboot" (without sudo) as a regular user
1756 [14:35:24] *** Quits: Ericounet_ (~Eric@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1757 [14:35:32] <CrystalMath> ratrace: if it reboots, it sucks
1758 [14:35:42] *** Joins: Ericounet_ (~Eric@replaced-ip )
1759 [14:35:44] <CrystalMath> simple test
1760 [14:35:45] <ratrace> CrystalMath: are you confusing suid with (configurable) polkit policies?
1761 [14:35:59] <CrystalMath> i support setuid, i oppose polkit
1762 [14:35:59] <jezebel> anyways, autofs
1763 [14:36:19] <CrystalMath> if /sbin/reboot is a setuid binary, then that's fine
1764 [14:36:28] <CrystalMath> but if it's using polkit, the distro is bad
1765 [14:36:48] <CrystalMath> there should be zero routes to root outside suid
1766 [14:37:14] <ratrace> messaging via dbus is more secure than suid
1767 [14:37:28] <CrystalMath> it's too complicated and shouldn't be allowed
1768 [14:37:33] <ratrace> with suid, you give temporarily full root privilege to perform an action.
1769 [14:37:36] <CrystalMath> besides, if you add anything other than suid, you have to keep suid
1770 [14:37:49] <CrystalMath> this is a *nix..
1771 [14:37:50] <ratrace> with messaging you don't give ANY privilege to the user, you just send a message to a daemon that listens for it.
1772 [14:37:51] *** Quits: Downer (downer@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
1773 [14:38:01] <ratrace> CrystalMath: LINUX = Linux Is Not UniX
1774 [14:38:23] <ratrace> so no, this is not unix. unix is unix, you can use BSDs if you want pure unix. stop preventing linux from evolving away from 1980s
1775 [14:39:28] <avu> that's so not where the name comes from but I like it nontheless :)
1776 [14:39:34] <ratrace> avu: I know :)
1777 [14:39:46] <ratrace> the acronym accidentally fits nicely ;)
1778 [14:39:47] <CrystalMath> ratrace: the thing is, you can't drop suid compatibility
1779 [14:40:02] <ratrace> CrystalMath: what's "suid compatibility"?
1780 [14:40:08] <CrystalMath> ratrace: suid has to work
1781 [14:40:15] <Habbie> CrystalMath, so?
1782 [14:40:15] <Fox> maybe #debian-offtopic would be the right place to talk about that ? :)
1783 [14:40:16] *** Quits: preview (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1784 [14:40:33] <ratrace> CrystalMath: and it does. it's still less secure than messaging over dbus
1785 [14:40:42] <CrystalMath> Fox: and to think the conversation started with just tmpfs
1786 [14:40:44] <ratrace> %s/dbus/ipc/
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1788 [14:40:54] <Fox> stick to tmpfs then :)
1789 [14:41:27] *** Joins: oish (~charlie@replaced-ip )
1790 [14:41:31] <CrystalMath> ratrace: anyway, i definitely want to use linux as a typical unix system
1791 [14:41:43] <funabashi> jezebel: themill its fixed :)
1792 [14:41:43] <ratrace> CrystalMath: you totally have that option. :)
1793 [14:42:26] <CrystalMath> ratrace: what i did, was add a critical package that conflicts with dbus
1794 [14:42:40] <CrystalMath> it's a variant of "your-sanity"
1795 [14:42:51] <ratrace> so basically you're not using any desktop application?
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1798 [14:43:17] <ratrace> on debian at least, they're built with dbus support where applicable
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1800 [14:43:39] <CrystalMath> i am..
1801 [14:43:42] <ratrace> (and as an offtopic side note, I used to run gentoo 100% dbus-free until FF started to hard depend on it being _present_ though not necessarily run, to work)
1802 [14:43:52] <CrystalMath> ratrace: libdbus is installed
1803 [14:44:16] <CrystalMath> although i've been working on replacing the library with a trojan that will completely avoid doing anything
1804 [14:44:26] <ratrace> I think you mean "a shim" :)
1805 [14:44:39] <CrystalMath> yeah, i guess
1806 [14:44:44] <ratrace> call it elibdbus :)
1807 [14:44:58] <CrystalMath> i have a shell script that autogenerates a clone of a library
1808 [14:45:06] <CrystalMath> but all the functions just do "return 0;"
1809 [14:45:18] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
1810 [14:45:18] <CrystalMath> (the script uses various binutils to generate C code and then gcc)
1811 [14:45:34] <ratrace> sounds like a security disaster waiting to happen, esp. with things wanting polkit around
1812 [14:46:12] <CrystalMath> why is it a security disaster? they will want root through polkit, and won't get it
1813 [14:46:32] <ratrace> CrystalMath: apps don't want "root through polkit"
1814 [14:46:48] <ratrace> they ask for specific permissions. polkit is more like RBAC, it doens't give out root at all
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1816 [14:47:05] <CrystalMath> ratrace: yeah but they won't get any permissions
1817 [14:47:07] *** Joins: PHiZiX (~joba@replaced-ip )
1818 [14:47:50] <ratrace> why not just build a LFS, or even gentoo, and set it up grounds up the way you want it?
1819 [14:48:03] <ratrace> far easier than trying to bend Debian into that
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1821 [14:49:15] * jelly blinks
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1823 [14:49:30] <jelly> ratrace: Debian is an excellent plaform.
1824 [14:49:46] <CrystalMath> ratrace: debian has a ton of great packages :)
1825 [14:49:47] *** Quits: sorressean (~tyler@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1826 [14:49:52] *** Quits: joba (~joba@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
1827 [14:49:52] <CrystalMath> ratrace: i don't want to compile stuff
1828 [14:49:54] <ratrace> jelly: for a fork? yes, I agree.
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1830 [14:50:28] <jezebel> i find that smells a bit 'leave if you dont like it'
1831 [14:51:04] <CrystalMath> ratrace: right now, i just don't have dbus installed
1832 [14:51:06] <ratrace> jelly: with what I said? not at all, I genuinely think gentoo or LFS are better suited for building such a very custom system.
1833 [14:51:10] <CrystalMath> ratrace: everything works
1834 [14:51:12] <ratrace> jelly: ^^^
1835 [14:51:17] <ratrace> argh! jezebel ! :)
1836 [14:51:40] <CrystalMath> i know which packages require dbus
1837 [14:51:59] <CrystalMath> they actually require dbus, rather than just libdbus
1838 [14:52:08] <ratrace> yeah the client side
1839 [14:52:23] <CrystalMath> so i avoid those of course
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1841 [14:52:27] <CrystalMath> but there's nothing i'm missing here
1842 [14:52:56] <CrystalMath> i have tons of desktop applications
1843 [14:53:06] <CrystalMath> even some gnome stuff (dia)
1844 [14:53:37] <ratrace> I think it should be possible to use elogind, so you can reap the benefits of managed sessions
1845 [14:53:48] <CrystalMath> i don't want managed sessions
1846 [14:53:52] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1847 [14:54:09] <CrystalMath> i would rather use systemd, but without logind....
1848 [14:54:20] <jelly> ratrace: I genuinely do not want to deal with lfs ever.
1849 [14:54:38] <CrystalMath> systemd without logind would not be so bad at all
1850 [14:54:49] <CrystalMath> it wouldn't be any different from any unix-respecting init
1851 [14:54:52] <ratrace> jelly: indeed it's a pain :)
1852 [14:55:20] <ratrace> CrystalMath: why you hate logind so much, what do you think it does and it shouldn't :)
1853 [14:55:20] <CrystalMath> also, i don't want to stop you from evolving away from the 80s, but as for me, i want to stay there
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1855 [14:55:32] <CrystalMath> ratrace: it shouldn't allow things to get root without suid
1856 [14:55:42] <jelly> CrystalMath: you'll want to look at elogind stuff in experimental and see how hard it is to backport it to make things that really really want logind stop complaining
1857 [14:55:52] <ratrace> CrystalMath: logind does no such thing
1858 [14:56:14] <jelly> but that's out of scope for #debian
1859 [14:56:17] <humpled> back to the bbc micro
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1861 [14:57:07] <ratrace> elogind, btw, is currently the reason for drama over whether Debian should continue support "init freedom" or go systemd full monty.
1862 [14:57:48] <klys> sysvinit to the max: install a basic development kit, which exposes inittab internals to the user. encourage all users to rewrite /sbin/init from scratch!
1863 [14:58:02] <CrystalMath> i wrote an 83-byte init
1864 [14:58:41] <CrystalMath> oops, sorry, 89-byte
1865 [14:58:43] <klys> be stepping through there with gdb right out of the box!
1866 [14:58:44] <CrystalMath> but it's 32-bit
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1868 [14:59:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1538
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1870 [14:59:37] <klys> jelly, thank you for linking the debian-init-diversity ml. I may be reading that today.
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1873 [15:00:52] <strk1> apt-get -qqy --purge remove ... #still prints lots of (Reading database ... 5% ... What switches would stop doing that ?
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1879 [15:02:36] <klys> strk1, have you tried setting Dpkg::Progress
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1885 [15:04:09] <strk1> nope, how to do that globally once and for all ? (it is for CI work)
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1894 [15:07:47] <klys> zless /usr/share/doc/apt/examples/configure-index.gz
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1897 [15:09:19] <jak2000> hi all, with php how to get server uptime?
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1902 [15:10:51] <Habbie> jak2000, read /proc/uptime
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1905 [15:11:54] <jelly> jak2000: system("uptime");
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1907 [15:11:58] * jelly hides
1908 [15:12:20] <jak2000> i read but not get the correct.... date/time
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1910 [15:13:09] <strk1> I did not understand apt-config, am I right it does NOT write any file on disk ?
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1912 [15:14:22] <Habbie> jak2000, uptime is a length of time, not a date/time
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1921 [15:20:34] <nsa_> jak2000: 'uptime' shows the local OS's uptime
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1925 [15:21:27] <nsa_> jak2000: 'date' shows the local time
1926 [15:21:29] <jelly> jak2000: do you want the answer to the question "when was this system booted" instead?
1927 [15:21:46] <jelly> because that one is _not_ easy to find out in general case
1928 [15:22:03] <CorvetteZR1> hello. is chromium-browser 77+ coming to deb mirrors?
1929 [15:22:13] <jelly> (uptime does not increase while a system is suspended, for example)
1930 [15:22:14] <greycat> It's kind of a difficult thing for the system to keep track of. The clock may not be set correctly at the moment of boot.
1931 [15:22:28] <jelly> CorvetteZR1: that's very likely.
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1933 [15:22:37] <ratrace> sudo journalctl | head -n 1 | awk '{ print $6, $7, $8}'
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1939 [15:23:35] <nsa_> date might show the local time, linux is like a firery red headed companion
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1941 [15:24:08] <greycat> date shows the system time, represented in the time zone you asked it to use (unless you use the -u option, in which case it's shown in UTC)
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1943 [15:24:36] <nsa_> yes, precision of indecision
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1948 [15:28:16] <MarioMey> Hello there. Yesterday I installed Buster. After installing wifi USB firmware, device finds all available connections, but it doesnt connect to internet.
1949 [15:28:32] <MarioMey> Why? And how to fix this?
1950 [15:29:02] <klys> mariomey, can you ping your router
1951 [15:29:09] *** Quits: dionysus69 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1952 [15:29:14] <MarioMey> Before yesterday, Stretch connected well.
1953 [15:29:22] <MarioMey> Klys no.
1954 [15:29:27] *** Joins: dionysus69 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip )
1955 [15:29:37] <MarioMey> It doesnt connect to router.
1956 [15:29:43] *** Quits: walnut_burl (~oak@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1957 [15:29:49] <ratrace> MarioMey: does it get an IP? via DHCP presumably
1958 [15:29:52] <klys> mariomey, can you paste the output of iwlist wlan0 scan; or similar?
1959 [15:30:42] <MarioMey> Unfortunatly, computer is not connected to internet. Im with phone
1960 [15:30:42] *** Joins: Lope2 (~lope@replaced-ip )
1961 [15:31:02] <MarioMey> It's a desktop computer and router is far
1962 [15:31:02] *** Joins: fflori (~fflori@replaced-ip )
1963 [15:31:08] <klys> mariomey, just a screenshot would be okay, or you could try and describe it
1964 [15:31:31] *** Quits: winy (~vince@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
1965 [15:31:39] <klys> mariomey, are you saying there is no router at your present location?
1966 [15:31:40] <MarioMey> Wait
1967 [15:32:24] *** Quits: frgo (~frgo@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1968 [15:32:56] *** Quits: b00^ (~void@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
1969 [15:33:21] <MarioMey> Klis all availables connections appear
1970 [15:33:30] *** Quits: Lope (~lope@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
1971 [15:33:58] <MarioMey> Isnt any Telegram group for #debian?
1972 [15:34:02] <klys> mariomey, does your preferred network have pairwise cipher: CCMP and group cipher: CCMP ? or does it say TKIP?
1973 [15:34:08] <MarioMey> I could takw photos
1974 [15:34:19] *** Quits: Mo7Qt0 (~Mo7Qt0@replaced-ip##) (Quit: KVIrc 5.0.0 Aria ##replaced-url
1975 [15:34:19] <karlpinc> MarioMey: If necessary you can take a picture with your phone and post it to a paste site.
1976 [15:34:21] <karlpinc> !paste
1977 [15:34:21] <dpkg> Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: replaced-url
1978 [15:34:56] <MarioMey> Klis: CCMP
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1984 [15:36:45] <klys> mariomey, replaced-url
1985 [15:37:26] <klys> mariomey, save this paste and edit it, to something like ~/net/wpa_supplicant.conf
1986 [15:37:53] <klys> mariomey, # wpa_supplicant -Dwext -iwlan0 -c ~/net/wpa_supplicant.conf &
1987 [15:37:55] *** Joins: beaver (~beaver@replaced-ip )
1988 [15:38:14] <klys> mariomey, you may have to kill network-manager first
1989 [15:39:30] *** Quits: dvs (~hibbard@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1990 [15:39:34] <klys> mariomey, please report if you see a message such as CTRL-EVENT-CONNECTED
1991 [15:40:15] *** Joins: fightthewalrus (~user@replaced-ip )
1992 [15:40:18] <wrksx> ratrace: I successfuly used your group setup suggestion, thank you for that =) working great
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1994 [15:40:23] *** Quits: gie (~gie@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1995 [15:40:33] <ratrace> wrksx: you're welcome.
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1999 [15:42:22] <MarioMey> Klis: to kill gvfsd-network?
2000 [15:42:30] <klys> mariomey, go ahead
2001 [15:42:46] <klys> make sure to kill any remaining wpa_supplicant process also.
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2009 [15:45:50] <MarioMey> How do i know my drivers name?
2010 [15:45:55] <MarioMey> Klis
2011 [15:46:02] <MarioMey> Klys
2012 [15:46:11] <klys> mariomey, your driver is running because you see the wlan0 or similar interface
2013 [15:46:28] <klys> if it was not running that would not work with iwlist either
2014 [15:46:52] *** Quits: dtux (~dmtucker@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2015 [15:46:56] <klys> mariomey, lsmod > lsmod.txt and look through that when you feel it's time to identify your hardware.
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2019 [15:48:12] <OS-58094> /msg NickServ REGISTER ah4jnF3S! studio98recordings@gmail.com
2020 [15:48:32] <klys> os-58094 get outta here
2021 [15:48:45] <OS-58094> lmao
2022 [15:48:52] <klys> :)
2023 [15:48:54] <OS-58094> major fail right here
2024 [15:48:59] <OS-58094> big yikes
2025 [15:51:02] <ratrace> OS-58094: EVERY TIME
2026 [15:51:11] <ratrace> you're just doing it on purpose
2027 [15:51:44] <greycat> users with names like OS-digits are all taking "how to be evil" classes and are really not welcome here, or anywhere
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2031 [15:52:21] <OS-58094> I mean my bad just passing through really
2032 [15:52:25] <ratrace> offsensive security wannabe haxxor fail
2033 [15:52:27] <greycat> so yes, it's quite possible that this "slip" was intentional and is a honeypot, or a joe job
2034 [15:52:32] *** Joins: Tempesta (Tempesta@replaced-ip )
2035 [15:52:36] <ratrace> greycat: it happens once or twice a week
2036 [15:53:07] <ratrace> always a OS-\d+ user "accidentally" registering a new account...
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2039 [15:55:08] <klys> mariomey, do you have a problem with wpa_supplicant (the command I posted above)?
2040 [15:55:44] *** Quits: eipip1e0 (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
2041 [15:56:14] *** ChanServ sets mode: +o jelly
2042 [15:56:14] *** Parts: OS-58094 (~OS-58094@replaced-ip ) (requested by jelly (bad S from OS))
2043 [15:56:15] *** ChanServ sets mode: -o jelly
2044 [15:56:30] <MarioMey> Klys: no, i can run it correctly, but wait...
2045 [15:57:30] <klys> mariomey, if that connected, you must also do this: # dhclient -d wlan0; or this: # pump -i wlan0
2046 [15:59:13] <MarioMey> Yes, it's connected
2047 [15:59:24] <klys> mariomey, then you have access now?
2048 [16:00:28] <MarioMey> I mean, CTRL-EVENT-CONNECTED is the last message
2049 [16:00:39] <klys> mariomey, go ahead and press return
2050 [16:01:09] <klys> if return doesn't give you a prompt then hit ctrl-Z and then type # bg
2051 [16:01:09] *** Quits: n_1-c_k (~n_1-c_k@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2052 [16:01:56] <klys> then you can run either of the commands I mentioned
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2055 [16:02:11] *** Joins: OS-58094 (~OS-58094@replaced-ip )
2056 [16:02:16] <klys> and if they don't return your prompt when complete, just press ctrl-c
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2058 [16:02:20] *** Joins: MarioMey1 (~mario@replaced-ip )
2059 [16:02:31] *** Quits: edwardly (~edwardly@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2060 [16:02:37] <MarioMey1> klys: I'm here, from the computer now
2061 [16:02:39] <MarioMey1> :)
2062 [16:02:40] *** Quits: zamuro (~Samantha@replaced-ip ) (Quit: [IRSSI])
2063 [16:02:42] <klys> cool!
2064 [16:02:54] <MarioMey1> I gotta go now.
2065 [16:03:00] <klys> okay, save those commands to a script...
2066 [16:03:02] <klys> :)
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2071 [16:03:25] <MarioMey1> But I want to know how to connect using network-manager... or I won't can do it?
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2073 [16:04:02] <klys> network-manager may or may not work, I'm not sure. you may need to contact #gnome or #freedesktop or /msg alis keyword
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2086 [16:09:50] <wild_buffalo> How do I turn off inactive sleep or sleep when closing the lid *when no one is logged in* in the Debian Gnome DE?
2087 [16:11:09] <klys> wild_buffalo, /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon/gsd-power ?
2088 [16:11:26] <klys> oh you have a stipulation
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2090 [16:11:40] <klys> afraid I am not familiar with your stipulation.
2091 [16:11:41] <greycat> .oO( if nobody is logged in, then gnome is not running )
2092 [16:13:02] <wild_buffalo> Well, I'm not super familiar how it works but I'm guessing GDM is running?
2093 [16:13:20] <wild_buffalo> There's the blue login screen
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2095 [16:13:46] <wild_buffalo> On my user I used dconf to deactivate going to sleep due to idleness or closing the lid
2096 [16:13:54] <wild_buffalo> But I need to be logged in for it to work
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2100 [16:14:24] <dob1> hi, can I do something like tcpdump host *.google.com ? (this doesn't work)
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2102 [16:14:33] <wild_buffalo> I would like to know how can apply that change to whatever default process or user runs before I'm logged in, if anyone has that info
2103 [16:15:23] <greycat> it's definitely a display manager (gdm3 or lightdm or sddm or similar)
2104 [16:15:32] <wild_buffalo> I tried `sudo -u Debian-gdm dbus-launch gsettings set org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.power sleep-inactive-ac-type 'nothing'` but I get a "No protocol specified" message
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2106 [16:15:42] <wild_buffalo> I got the suggestion from here:
2107 [16:15:47] <wild_buffalo> replaced-url
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2110 [16:17:14] <jak2000> command for find/looking this file: shutdown ?
2111 [16:17:32] <greycat> !buster su
2112 [16:17:33] <dpkg> In buster, su no longer overrides PATH by default, requiring that you use "su -" or "su -l" for login shells (which is not really a new thing at all...). To use the previous behaviour, put "ALWAYS_SET_PATH yes" in /etc/login.defs. See replaced-url
2113 [16:17:34] <greycat> My guess.
2114 [16:18:24] <greycat> if my guess is not correct, please restate your question in the form of an English sentence
2115 [16:18:58] <wrksx> is /etc/default specifically for systemd?
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2118 [16:19:08] <greycat> No. It comes from the sysv-rc days.
2119 [16:19:22] <greycat> Any systemd units that use it are doing so for backward compat.
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2122 [16:19:35] <wrksx> oky ty.
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2128 [16:20:56] <wild_buffalo> Found the solution, I think
2129 [16:21:21] <wild_buffalo> For reference: /etc/gdm3/greeter.dconf-defaults has the setting I was looking for
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2132 [16:21:43] <tkuester> Can someone help me understand why libc6-armhf-cross doesn't have files for /etc/ld.so.conf.d/*, but libc6:armhf does?
2133 [16:22:57] <wrksx> Indeed it looks like my package is not systemd orientied
2134 [16:23:03] <wrksx> oriented
2135 [16:23:19] <wrksx> it starts from /etc/init.d
2136 [16:23:29] <tkuester> I'm cross compiling a program, and if I only have libc6-armhf-cross, I need to run "qemu-arm -L /usr/arm-linux-gnueabihf program" instead of just "qemu-arm program"
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2156 [16:27:08] <SerajewelKS> tkuester: if you install qemu-user-binfmt, there is magic installed that allows you to just run "program"
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2160 [16:27:45] <tkuester> SerajewelKS: I'll look into that, thanks for the tip. (Though I'm still hoping to understand my question!)
2161 [16:28:03] <wwilliam> Can anyone recommend an open source change management tool i can install on a debian server please?
2162 [16:28:25] <SerajewelKS> wwilliam: what kind of change management? something like etckeeper?
2163 [16:28:31] <ratrace> wwilliam: SaltStack, Ansible
2164 [16:28:35] <wwilliam> no no
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2167 [16:28:50] <SerajewelKS> oh, more like chef
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2169 [16:29:16] <wwilliam> lets say i network card is going to be changed open ticket send the approvals get the approvals send emails etc.
2170 [16:29:52] <wwilliam> Not just software changes or upgrades everything
2171 [16:29:54] <ratrace> oh you want the whole red tape?
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2173 [16:30:07] <wwilliam> needs to have a change ticket with all the approvals.
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2175 [16:30:31] <ratrace> wwilliam: maybe you can integrate gitlab with saltstack
2176 [16:30:34] <centrix> I find WebContent eating 100% cpu. Luckily I have 2 CPUS allocated, but still the load is too high. What may be the cause? Debian Buster/XFCE/firefox 60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1. Thank you for a clue.
2177 [16:31:02] <greycat> close your bitcoin mining javascript advertisements
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2179 [16:31:15] <ratrace> wwilliam: infact... you can integrate any issue/bug management software with saltstack, you'll have to write some hooks, but it's definitely doable.
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2181 [16:31:34] <wwilliam> I dont think you get me.
2182 [16:31:53] <greycat> I suspect he wants a turnkey system, ready to go, no development required.
2183 [16:31:57] <ratrace> wwilliam: well maybe explain one full such process example
2184 [16:31:59] <wwilliam> Thank you all.
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2186 [16:32:58] <wwilliam> ok lets say ok a change on a file a change ticket needs to be open this change ticket must have many fields change owner approvers change to be made back out plan etc.
2187 [16:33:03] <wwilliam> like that.
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2189 [16:33:12] <wwilliam> is there something like that in Linux?
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2196 [16:34:00] <SerajewelKS> there's OTRS, but it will require some configuration and possibly a small amount of Perl development if you need it to integrate with a system that would actually apply a change
2197 [16:34:28] <wwilliam> OK Thank you.
2198 [16:34:57] <ratrace> we use gitlab. saltstack configs are in a gitlab repo. an issue is opened, staltstack mods applied, a commit closes the issue
2199 [16:35:12] <wwilliam> and the approvals?
2200 [16:35:16] <wwilliam> and the emails?
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2202 [16:35:24] <wwilliam> and the backout plans?
2203 [16:35:49] <ratrace> we don't do that much detail but you can look into gitlab permissions and see if it's clicky-clicky configurable
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2206 [16:36:29] <ratrace> like, group A can open issues, but only group B (the approvers) can close issues, definitely group C is allowed to submit pull requests and you can define who can accept and merge pull requests
2207 [16:37:02] <ratrace> then CI hooks can take that to saltstack event reactors and actually perform the change (which we don't do, we require a hooman, me, do the thing)
2208 [16:37:41] <wwilliam> hmm yes something like that could work. Thanks ratrace will check.
2209 [16:37:48] <wwilliam> thanks for your time.
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2213 [16:41:10] <ratrace> wwilliam: yeah now that I think about it, you can definitely pull it off with permissions in gitlab. change request done via pull request on the code/config, and only folks with permission can merge it. CI hooks can trigger on merge and exec optional tests and actual config change.
2214 [16:42:05] <ratrace> the only scripting required is interaction between CI / merge-hook and your actual config management tool (salt, ansible, chef, whatever)
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2217 [16:44:30] <wwilliam> Thank you ratrace
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2228 [16:48:46] <losgb1> Hi, I am on Debian 10.1 Buster Xfce with Manjaro's Vertex-Maia theme and icons and I have an issue with the systray icon for the power manager utility. The icon doesn't follow the theme and I'd like to fix that. Anybody got any idea on how to fix this ?
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2246 [16:59:50] <SerajewelKS> what's the ip/bridge equivalent of "brctl show" to display bridges and their ports?
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2248 [17:00:17] <SerajewelKS> "bridge" doesn't seem to actually show bridges, only ports. "ip link" doesn't tell me which ports are added to which bridges.
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2250 [17:00:48] <MarioMey> Klys, thaks for your help.
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2252 [17:00:59] <SerajewelKS> the only equivalent i can find is 'bridge link | grep "master $BRNAME "' which seems like an awful hack
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2254 [17:01:52] <SerajewelKS> i'm hopeful that there actually is a way to ask which ports are added to a bridge in the non-deprecated tools, surely that feature of brctl wouldn't be left out if it's being kicked to the curb?
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2264 [17:04:34] <DonKichot> Is it possible to compile lib Angle on Debian Testing or should I use Sid?
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2266 [17:05:14] <greycat> !debian-next
2267 [17:05:14] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
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2280 [17:14:32] <netcrash> Hello, I'm trying to compile gearman in debian and it uses a lot of network and such, I believe it can be due to testing, what (where) should I look for what's causing this?
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2293 [17:18:03] <wwilliam> Hello how can I fix this please?
2294 [17:18:05] <wwilliam> replaced-url
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2302 [17:20:21] <trek00> wwilliam: you have 2 options: compile yourself a newer version of ruby or upgrade you system to debian buster
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2305 [17:21:08] <wwilliam> !upgrade
2306 [17:21:08] <dpkg> Upgrades keep your box from getting r00ted and reboots let you run new kernels. Stop obsessing about uptime already. It's not 1996. Refresh the lists of available packages "apt update", and then an "apt upgrade". Ask me about <security>. If you upgrade to a new stable version of Debian, read its release notes first. Ask me about <stretch->buster>.
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2310 [17:22:15] <wwilliam> msg dpkg stretch->buster
2311 [17:22:40] <ratrace> there's no redmine in buster though
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2314 [17:23:32] <greycat> replaced-url
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2316 [17:23:37] <wwilliam> im getting it from source
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2319 [17:24:15] <wwilliam> hmm i will do vm and try buster and redmine and see.
2320 [17:24:25] <wwilliam> Thank you.
2321 [17:24:30] <ratrace> wwilliam: there's no redmine in buster
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2324 [17:24:43] <ratrace> you could try running a sid chroot with redmine
2325 [17:24:43] <wwilliam> what about from source?
2326 [17:24:51] <wwilliam> I can not install from source?
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2328 [17:25:10] <trek00> wwilliam: yes, it's ok
2329 [17:25:28] <ratrace> wwilliam: I think the issue is dependency compatibility
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2331 [17:25:33] <wwilliam> Will check will download the buster Iso now
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2334 [17:26:01] <ratrace> which might mean you'll run into same problems that got redmine removed from buster. TIAS, but again, you can always run a sid chroot for it.
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2339 [17:29:02] <jhutchins_wk> redmine isn't really an end-user software product. It's more of a programming framework.
2340 [17:29:16] <wwilliam> ah ok ratrace.
2341 [17:30:15] <wwilliam> Its for me.
2342 [17:30:22] <wwilliam> my personal use.
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2350 [17:34:53] <jhutchins_wk> ,checkbackport redmine
2351 [17:34:55] <judd> Backporting package redmine in sid→buster/amd64: unsatisfiable build dependencies: Build-Depends: debhelper-compat (= 12).
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2358 [17:37:42] <wwilliam> jhutchins_wk: what is that for?
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2365 [17:38:25] <gvth> Hi. Short question: Can it intentionally happen that stable contains a newer version of a given package than testing?
2366 [17:38:31] <greycat> Checking whether it's possible to build a backport of redmine from sid's source onto a buster target.
2367 [17:38:42] *** Quits: Ericounet (~Eric@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Je m'en vais ...)
2368 [17:38:54] <greycat> The result is misleading because apparently Debian decided to change how they package shit. Again.
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2371 [17:39:24] <trek00> gvth: usually not
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2373 [17:39:29] <greycat> !debian epoch
2374 [17:39:29] <dpkg> The version number of a package has a prepended number called the "epoch". It is only added when the system for upstream version numbers changes. Example: in sarge, X was version 6.8 but in etch it was 1.1 (xfree86->xorg). But 1 < 6, so we add an epoch "2:" to signify that everything with 2: is newer (if there is no : the epoch is assumed to be "0"). See section 5.6.12 of <policy> or ask me about <compare versions> <debian revision>.
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2378 [17:40:55] <gvth> greycat: no, there is no number with colon pretended
2379 [17:41:07] <gvth> the package I am referring to is firefox-esr
2380 [17:41:24] <gvth> greycat: *prepended
2381 [17:41:28] <greycat> In that case, the version in testins is probably just stupidly old.
2382 [17:41:34] <greycat> ,v firefox-esr
2383 [17:41:35] <judd> Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; stretch: 60.7.1esr-1~deb9u1; buster: 60.8.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 60.8.0esr-1; jessie-security: 60.9.0esr-1~deb8u2; stretch-proposed-updates: 60.9.0esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 60.9.0esr-1~deb9u1; buster-proposed-updates: 60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1;
2384 [17:41:36] <judd> sid: 68.2.0esr-1
2385 [17:42:05] <trek00> gvth: this is because security updates are done for stable before any other release
2386 [17:42:12] <greycat> Looks basically the same to me. buster: 60.8.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 60.8.0esr-1;
2387 [17:42:33] <trek00> greycat: buster has 60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1
2388 [17:42:54] <greycat> then the bot's out of date.
2389 [17:43:02] <wwilliam> installing buster now.
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2393 [17:43:08] <greycat> oh, buster-security. duh. my fault.
2394 [17:43:16] <gvth> when I loaded packages.debian.org/firefox-esr about 10 minutes ago, the version for buster is shown as 60.9.0esr-1~deb10u1
2395 [17:43:18] <greycat> yes, buster-security is ahead of bullseye.
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2407 [17:47:07] <jak2000> hi friend. i shared a folder with samba here more details: replaced-url
2408 [17:47:11] <wwilliam> what is the stable version of Debian?
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2410 [17:47:38] <jhutchins_wk> wwilliam: 10.1 buster
2411 [17:47:40] <greycat> buster, debian 10
2412 [17:47:48] <wwilliam> Thank you.
2413 [17:48:08] <jhutchins_wk> wwilliam: See also channel topic /topic
2414 [17:48:41] <wwilliam> ok Thank you.
2415 [17:48:48] <wwilliam> sorry.
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2421 [17:54:38] <trek00> jak2000: what do you mean with cut the files? delete or truncate?
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2423 [17:55:46] <jak2000> delete
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2426 [17:56:36] <trek00> jak2000: i guess he can't create files too
2427 [17:57:11] <jak2000> read only = yes
2428 [17:57:12] <jak2000> removed
2429 [17:57:44] <trek00> jak2000: it's ok now?
2430 [17:57:52] <jak2000> but now ask me a suer and password... how to remove this
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2432 [17:58:30] <humpled> put read only = no and restart the service?
2433 [17:58:40] <jak2000> ask me a suer and pass
2434 [17:59:08] <whislock> Should it not ask for authentication?
2435 [17:59:49] <jak2000> not auth
2436 [17:59:56] <humpled> have a look in man smb.conf
2437 [18:00:05] <jak2000> and contiunue say permission denied, creating new paste
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2439 [18:01:02] <jak2000> replaced-url
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2443 [18:01:25] <trek00> jak2000: be careful that with no authentication, even viruses can write on that share, but you can add "security = share" to remove auth
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2446 [18:02:15] <jak2000> changed to share and then service samba reload
2447 [18:02:25] <jak2000> continue ask user pasword
2448 [18:02:28] <jak2000> and cant remove files
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2452 [18:03:30] <jak2000> note: i only want cut files, not write....
2453 [18:03:33] <jak2000> is possible?
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2456 [18:03:57] <whislock> Deleting is writing. And it's 'delete,' not 'cut.'
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2458 [18:04:21] <SerajewelKS> to my knowledge, neither linux nor samba have a mechanism to permit deleting files but forbid creating them
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2460 [18:04:35] <greycat> it's kind of the *opposite* of what most people would want
2461 [18:04:50] <trek00> jak2000: you could setup some mandatory access control on the linux server, but it's not that simple
2462 [18:04:53] <jak2000> i want share a folder (here created backups of mysqldb)
2463 [18:05:11] <jak2000> ok then delete and write how to? any advice?
2464 [18:05:11] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i don't even think extended ACLs can do this
2465 [18:05:18] <whislock> Sharing backups without authentication. Love it.
2466 [18:05:45] <greycat> jak2000: what are you actually trying to do?
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2468 [18:06:24] <jak2000> actually i shared a folder.. can access (with user/password) and can copy files, but cant delete...
2469 [18:06:34] <jak2000> here my config replaced-url
2470 [18:06:51] <SerajewelKS> jak2000: greycat is asking what the _purpose_ of sharing the folder is
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2472 [18:07:17] <SerajewelKS> because there is a good chance that what you're trying to accomplish can be done in a better way
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2480 [18:10:40] <jak2000> cant delete, need do a chmod 777 to folder?
2481 [18:10:49] <whislock> This gets better and better.
2482 [18:11:30] <trek00> jak2000: you need to set force user to the owner of the files
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2484 [18:12:22] <SerajewelKS> what the heck... is there a way i can ask open-iscsi what portal it is using for a volume?
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2487 [18:12:50] <SerajewelKS> because somehow i got a lun automatically connected and available even though the interface to the storage network is not configured with an IP
2488 [18:12:58] <SerajewelKS> so somehow by magic it connected to the volume without a local IP
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2492 [18:15:04] <SerajewelKS> hmm nevermind, i see what happened
2493 [18:15:37] *** Quits: enseneo (~madneap@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2494 [18:15:52] <trek00> SerajewelKS: in reply about acl, you can do this with selinux
2495 [18:16:15] <SerajewelKS> ah right, i like to pretend that selinux doesn't exist
2496 [18:16:32] <trek00> :)
2497 [18:17:06] <trek00> SerajewelKS: instead, the apparmour feature to do this is in development
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2499 [18:17:25] <_Fremen_> hello everyone
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2505 [18:19:34] <_Fremen_> I just installed a debian machine with printer server configuration to share it over network with other computers. Linux and Mac devices are working fine with it without further configuration. However windows devices does not work correctly. I read online that I need to configure samba and etc. to make it visible to Windows computer. Is it possible for me to configure windows machines to enable them to see this printer, rather than configuring the Debian
2506 [18:19:34] <_Fremen_> machine?
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2510 [18:20:40] <trek00> _Fremen_: probably windows needs some drivers to work with a printer server
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2513 [18:22:21] <trek00> _Fremen_: this is a bit outdated but may be it can help you replaced-url
2514 [18:22:51] <jhutchins_wk> Has anyone gotten cups printing to connect over ipv6?
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2516 [18:24:28] <_Fremen_> trek00: that seems very good :) I will try it. Thank you very much :)
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2520 [18:25:05] <trek00> _Fremen_: :)
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2522 [18:28:53] <trek00> jhutchins_wk: may be this can help you? replaced-url
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2525 [18:31:24] <mzs114> Hi, on debian 10(running on a VPS) is there a way to change the bright colors on terminal?
2526 [18:31:56] <trek00> mzs114: yes, but the configuration depend by the terminal program you are using
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2528 [18:32:15] <jhutchins_wk> Not exactly the problem. Our mac prints to it just fine, but my wife's desktop has not been able to connect in quite a while. It detects and adds the printer using the ipv6 address, but then says it can't connect when I try to send a job. There's no restriction on the network sharing on the server, but I'll check for ipv6 settings and try an "Allow" statement.
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2530 [18:32:38] <mzs114> I use xfce4-terminal on my PC, on a freebsd server(VPS) it shows sober colors
2531 [18:32:41] *** Parts: Cristhoffer (~Cris___@replaced-ip ) ()
2532 [18:33:12] <SerajewelKS> why would mdadm --re-add be "not possible?"
2533 [18:33:27] <mzs114> this is on fbsd => replaced-url
2534 [18:33:27] <mzs114> this is on debian => replaced-url
2535 [18:33:28] <jhutchins_wk> trek00: It does, however, imply that at least some versions/configurations of cups can talk over ipv6.
2536 [18:33:33] <SerajewelKS> the events only differ by 30
2537 [18:33:33] <trek00> mzs114: check this replaced-url
2538 [18:33:40] <SerajewelKS> surely that's within the threshold for re-adding?
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2541 [18:34:31] <jhutchins_wk> mzs114: Most terminal emulators have color settings, and you can adjust bash colors as well.
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2545 [18:35:06] <SerajewelKS> are there some other constraints for --re-add?
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2550 [18:36:03] <mzs114> thanks trek00 and jhutchins_wk, but I don't understand same client different servers, why is the color rendered differently, like I did spend sometime and setting everything to xterm-256, but this did not solve it.
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2571 [18:43:48] <trek00> mzs114: may be the servers have different termcap installed?
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2576 [18:44:26] <trek00> SerajewelKS: may be they failed to resync and then it needs manual confirmation with --force
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2578 [18:44:46] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i think i figured it out... debian-installer created the mirror with no bitmap
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2584 [18:45:58] <SerajewelKS> trek00: yep that was it. "mdadm --grow /dev/md0 --bitmap=internal" and i can now re-add
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2586 [18:46:35] <SerajewelKS> this all seems very fragile. using raid1 on iscsi devices that hold / has lots of weird problems.
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2588 [18:46:44] <SerajewelKS> for example, when the system reboots, only one side of the mirror is active
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2594 [18:47:37] <SerajewelKS> "mdadm /dev/md0 --re-add missing" fixes it
2595 [18:47:42] <mzs114> trek00: idk, on debian vps ncurses is installed, on freebsd there is none, or perhaps something different,
2596 [18:47:47] <SerajewelKS> but it seems odd that md-raid doesn't see the iscsi device and put it in the array itself
2597 [18:48:04] <SerajewelKS> oh, hmm... looks like a shutdown problem
2598 [18:48:29] <SerajewelKS> during shutdown iscsi is stopped and so the mirror device fails the remote disk. which is why it's not re-added on boot.
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2601 [18:48:46] <Gigglebyte> how do I add a network mirror to my recent Debian Buster Installation? I can't do updates and upgrades.
2602 [18:49:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1545
2603 [18:49:02] <SerajewelKS> i wonder if there's a way to get that not to happen on shutdown
2604 [18:49:05] <mzs114> I am using tmux on both
2605 [18:49:11] <greycat> !buster sources.list
2606 [18:49:11] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Buster" has the lines: "deb replaced-url
2607 [18:49:23] <SerajewelKS> i bet it's when the network is deconfigured actually
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2610 [18:49:40] <SerajewelKS> i wonder how people usually set this kind of thing up
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2612 [18:50:05] <trek00> mzs114: the termcap definitions are installed on each server and can differ sometimes, try setting TERM=xterm
2613 [18:50:42] <trek00> SerajewelKS: i think iscsi should be stopped after mdadm
2614 [18:51:09] <SerajewelKS> i don't think iscsi is actually being stopped. i think the network is being deconfigured and so iscsi loses connection to the volume.
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2616 [18:51:29] <mzs114> I have set this as xterm-256, after reading the stackoverflow answers.. will it help if I try setting it back to xterm?
2617 [18:51:31] <jhutchins_wk> I think the color settings for the shells are different as well.
2618 [18:51:35] <SerajewelKS> is there an ifupdown stanza that will ask the shutdown scripts to leave an interface up?
2619 [18:52:03] <trek00> SerajewelKS: a workaround is to have a script that stop mdadm arrays on iscsi before the network is deconfigured
2620 [18:52:10] <Gigglebyte> My mistake. It looks like the upgrade feature is working afterall.
2621 [18:52:13] <SerajewelKS> trek00: but the array contains /
2622 [18:52:20] <jhutchins_wk> mzs114: It depends on the termcap file on the server. This is not something that's constant across different OSs.
2623 [18:52:32] <trek00> SerajewelKS: root on iscsi?
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2625 [18:52:49] <mzs114> yeah, so how do I determine termcap? I am new to this, never heard about this ..
2626 [18:52:53] <SerajewelKS> trek00: yes. this has been a supported config for awhile, but i'm guessing there's some changes you have to make to the network config to make everything clean.
2627 [18:53:06] <SerajewelKS> trek00: hell the debian-installer even sets up iscsi in the initramfs for you
2628 [18:53:13] <greycat> termcap is no longer used in any modern version of Linux. everything moved to terminfo a long time ago.
2629 [18:53:33] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i have an idea...
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2631 [18:53:59] <trek00> mzs114: xterm-256 it's not always defined/installed
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2634 [18:54:36] <SerajewelKS> trek00: it may not be shutdown that's the problem after all. it could be during boot, ifupdown re-takes control of the interface after the kernel did DHCP during boot. drops the interface and runs DHCP on it again.
2635 [18:54:45] <jhutchins_wk> greycat: All I have is a vague notion that it's a file somewhere that defines what features are available for what terminal id, and that bash may have it's own set of color definitions.
2636 [18:55:02] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i think removing the interface from /etc/network/interfaces completely will do the trick
2637 [18:55:14] <greycat> /etc/termcap was a single monolithic file. That is no longer used. Terminfo is a database, one file per terminal type, compiled into a bytecode form.
2638 [18:55:20] <SerajewelKS> trek00: then ifupdown will leave it configured at boot, and not deconfigure it during shutdown
2639 [18:55:24] <jhutchins_wk> That's the kind of thing that wants a lot of digging to figure out for a very small return, and then has to be done all over if you change systems.
2640 [18:55:46] <greycat> You can see your current terminal's terminfo entry (in non-compiled form) with "infocmp". Or a given terminal with "infocmp termtype".
2641 [18:55:48] <jhutchins_wk> greycat: Makes sens.
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2648 [18:56:24] <SerajewelKS> trek00: well i'll be fucked, debian-installer was one step ahead there too
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2650 [18:56:33] <SerajewelKS> trek00: it's set to "inet manual"
2651 [18:56:35] <trek00> SerajewelKS: yes this can be an useful workaround, or tweak the initialization system to not have to stop networking
2652 [18:57:10] <mzs114> greycat: on debian => infocmp: couldn't open terminfo file /usr/share/terminfo/t/termtype.
2653 [18:57:33] <greycat> *sigh*
2654 [18:57:38] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i removed the interface from the file completely, let's see what that does
2655 [18:57:52] <greycat> mzs114: do you know what the English word "placeholder" means?
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2657 [18:58:23] <mzs114> nope
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2661 [18:58:34] <trek00> mzs114: try infocmp without arguments and infocmp xterm or infocmp xterm-256 on both servers
2662 [18:58:44] <SerajewelKS> trek00: hmm that didn't help at all
2663 [18:58:54] <jhutchins_wk> On mine its xterm-256color
2664 [18:59:11] <mzs114> ah
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2668 [19:01:00] <trek00> SerajewelKS: I had the same problem in the past (not with root fs, but others mount point) and it was resolved with workarounds, as iscsi + mdadm was uncommon configuration
2669 [19:01:26] <SerajewelKS> trek00: what did you wind up doing? what was the issue for you?
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2672 [19:02:19] <trek00> SerajewelKS: sadly i don't remember exactly, but it was something about the shutdown order (may be iscsi was stopped before mdadm)
2673 [19:02:31] <mzs114> ok, on freebsd the command is not available, searching around, 'termname' outputs => xterm-256color
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2675 [19:02:38] <mzs114> on debian I see a page size output
2676 [19:03:06] <mzs114> xterm|xterm-debian|X11 terminal emulator, the second line
2677 [19:03:20] <mzs114> so can I deduce that xterm-256 is not available on debian?
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2679 [19:03:45] <trek00> mzs114: well try setting your TERM to xterm and then connect to the server, something like: TERM=xterm ssh yourusername@yourserver
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2682 [19:04:03] <trek00> mzs114: what version of debian do you have? cat /etc/debian_version
2683 [19:04:11] <greycat> replaced-url
2684 [19:04:19] <greycat> replaced-url
2685 [19:04:25] <mzs114> amd64 10, wait, I ran one more command and it listed this => xterm-256color|xterm with 256 colors,
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2687 [19:04:46] <mzs114> Debian GNU/Linux 10 \n \l
2688 [19:06:05] <trek00> mzs114: it's important that the TERM environment variable is set to a valid termcap (xterm should be safe) and be the same on the client and on the server you are connecting to
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2690 [19:07:36] <mzs114> ok, I connected by setting the TERM variable, once with xterm and once with xterm-256color, both produce the same result.
2691 [19:07:49] <mzs114> produce same colors.
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2697 [19:08:18] <SerajewelKS> trek00: aha here we go
2698 [19:08:37] <SerajewelKS> trek00: in /etc/default/open-iscsi: ISCSI_ROOT_KEEP_ALL_SESSIONS_AT_SHUTDOWN=0
2699 [19:08:41] <SerajewelKS> trek00: let's change that to 1 and see what happens
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2707 [19:10:43] <SerajewelKS> trek00: bingo, that was it
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2710 [19:11:18] <SerajewelKS> trek00: there's scripts that run to determine what sessions are safe to stop. it tries to avoid stopping / by looking through multiple layers, including LVM and crypto. but md-raid is not something it considers.
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2713 [19:12:54] <trek00> mzs114: just to be sure: are you using the same instance of xfce-terminal (same window) to connect both servers via ssh and the colors are different? or are you connecting to a graphical session and then starting xfce-terminal on each server?
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2715 [19:13:17] <wwilliam> Hello i install buster with both kde and gnome is booting straight to gnome how do i switch please?
2716 [19:13:24] <mzs114> yes trek00
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2719 [19:13:41] <mzs114> wwilliam: from the login screen, there will be an option to change the DE
2720 [19:13:42] <trek00> SerajewelKS: you are the lucky winner of a new bug! :)
2721 [19:13:52] <wwilliam> There is not
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2723 [19:14:08] <SerajewelKS> trek00: maybe, i'd call it a feature request
2724 [19:14:17] <mzs114> what is the login manager wwilliam?
2725 [19:14:21] <SerajewelKS> trek00: at any rate i have a workaround and it's simple. *takes notes for blog post*
2726 [19:15:00] <oerheks> wwilliam, logout, click username, then the option to change DE
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2728 [19:15:36] <trek00> SerajewelKS: if they manage lvm and crypto but not mdraid it should be simple to add another check, so please to fill a bug report (with your workaround)
2729 [19:15:53] <wwilliam> Thank you I see the little sucker now.
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2731 [19:16:52] <trek00> mzs114: sorry i don't know how to help you with this issue, the same xfce-terminal with same termcap definitions on both servers should results in same colors
2732 [19:18:21] <mzs114> trek00, I usually solve my problems by searching around, but sometimes like this, it confused me too, :)
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2734 [19:19:08] <greycat> mzs114: the other piece of the puzzle is; what are you actually doing on the server side to produce the "colors"?
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2738 [19:19:21] <greycat> mzs114: some application, or some shell script with tput commands, or ...?
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2740 [19:21:47] <mzs114> I am using Salt to run commands on agents/targets, this produces colors, that differentiates the pass/fail/nochange.
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2744 [19:22:03] <mzs114> Ansible, terraform too produce this..
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2746 [19:22:48] <greycat> Well, ultimately, the question is what this application is *doing* to produce the colors. It must be sending some sort of escape sequence, which the terminal interprets. In a *sensible* universe, each application would consult the terminfo database to see "what sequence do I send for color 1 (red)" and send that.
2747 [19:23:14] <greycat> But in reality, people take shortcuts, and they hardwire escape sequences into their applications, so they can get "pumpkin spice latte orange" or some other crazy bullshit.
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2749 [19:23:25] <SerajewelKS> trek00: yeah i could make a report
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2753 [19:23:45] <greycat> So, one or more of your applications are probably sending different escape sequences for their own special-snowflake colors.
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2756 [19:24:56] <mzs114> hmm, makes sense.. cuz I did not make any changes on client side(xfce4-term), but whereas on the server side, debian is a running a older release of salt, fbsd is on a newer version
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2761 [19:25:56] <mzs114> maybe that could be the reason.
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2766 [19:27:08] <greycat> Terminfo isn't even *designed* with the concept of supporting more than the regular 8 colors that *most* terminals offer.
2767 [19:27:27] <greycat> all this "256 color" stuff is just kiddie crap
2768 [19:27:49] <greycat> (16 colors if you include "bright" variants of the basic 8)
2769 [19:28:20] <trek00> mzs114: to help diagnose further, you can try running top on both servers and the press 'z' key to enable colors and see if they are different
2770 [19:28:46] <greycat> or capture the actual data sent by app1 and app2 and compare the escape sequences
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2772 [19:28:51] <mzs114> replaced-url
2773 [19:29:08] <mzs114> the unreadble one is debian, just sharing to illustrate the pain
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2782 [19:30:49] <mzs114> the 'z' key does not work on bsd top
2783 [19:31:01] <mzs114> on debian it shows shades of red/orange.
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2785 [19:31:34] <SerajewelKS> trek00: hmm, i don't think this is a problem specific to /
2786 [19:31:51] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i think if an iscsi device is added to _any_ md-raid device, you'd have this issue with that raid device
2787 [19:31:56] <trek00> mzs114: may be setting a black background could help readability (may be there is a check "inverted colors" in xfce-terminal preferences)
2788 [19:32:15] *** Joins: linux_user2 (~Roger@replaced-ip )
2789 [19:32:59] <trek00> SerajewelKS: yes, it seems not yet supported replaced-url
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2791 [19:33:39] <mzs114> yeah there is, it comes black by default trek00, but I my eyes start to see lines once I move away from the screen. :)
2792 [19:33:54] <mzs114> eyeburn?
2793 [19:34:01] <mzs114> like screen burn.
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2800 [19:38:02] <SerajewelKS> trek00: another thing i found is that iscsi support in the debian installer doesn't let you specify an initiator name, which can be required in certain configurations
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2805 [19:38:56] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i bet you can switch to VT2 and edit /etc/iscsi/initiatorname.iscsi by hand, but it would make sense to me for the installer to ask for it
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2807 [19:39:29] <mzs114> thanks trek00 and greycat, I will have to manage with --no-color for sometime before I find out why this happens and fix it.
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2813 [19:40:58] <trek00> mzs114: you could change the termcap definition for debian, but i still searching for a simple method to do it
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2817 [19:41:09] <SerajewelKS> trek00: filed this: replaced-url
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2819 [19:41:30] <greycat> I really doubt it's using terminfo (or termcap) to issue the color sequences.
2820 [19:41:34] <trek00> mzs114: the issue of bright yellow was already sent to debian, but i can't find by now
2821 [19:41:38] <greycat> It's probably hard-coding its own special color handling.
2822 [19:42:18] <trek00> SerajewelKS: good job :)
2823 [19:42:45] <greycat> As an example, although it's not directly relevant here, terminfo does not encode a sequence for "red". Or even "color 1". It only has a sequence for "set foreground color" (setaf), and this sequence takes an argument. So, "tput setaf 1" sets the foreground color to 1 (red).
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2825 [19:42:54] <greycat> But this API only works for the traditional 8 colors.
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2827 [19:43:35] <greycat> 256-color crap is kiddie bullshit, and applications that do it tend to roll their own escape sequence generators.
2828 [19:43:45] <mzs114> sent to debian? trek00
2829 [19:43:56] <trek00> greycat: it seems to me yellow (color 3) is too bright (255,255,0) it could be (255,127,0)
2830 [19:43:57] <greycat> I hope he's talking about "apt upgrade".
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2832 [19:44:22] <greycat> trek00: you can control that at the terminal level, FYI. "rxvt -color3 brown" or something.
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2834 [19:44:28] <trek00> mzs114: i don't remember if it was a bug report/forum/chat
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2839 [19:45:18] <greycat> But seriously, "apt upgrade" using yellow as a foreground color with no configuration knobs can go die in a fire.
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2842 [19:47:24] <mzs114> greycat it is not from apt upgrade, it renders in nice shade of green, this is from salt stack.
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2844 [19:47:41] <greycat> different question, same conceptual issue, I think
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2847 [19:49:23] <mzs114> replaced-url
2848 [19:49:31] <mzs114> this is the debian script capture.
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2851 [19:50:00] <SerajewelKS> trek00: in all of this experience, i don't suppose you've figured out how to configure two interfaces during early boot?
2852 [19:50:02] <mzs114> I mean capture while I connected and ran the command to produce the ugly fruits colors
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2854 [19:50:17] <SerajewelKS> trek00: in my case, i run dropbear-initramfs on the public interface to unlock luks volumes remotely
2855 [19:50:33] <SerajewelKS> trek00: however, adding iscsi devices on the second NIC presents a new issue
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2857 [19:50:52] <SerajewelKS> trek00: both interfaces must be up before the root pivots.... i'm not sure how to accomplish that in the initrd
2858 [19:51:13] <trek00> SerajewelKS: iscsi could manage interfaces if i remember right?
2859 [19:51:14] <Ede|Popede> yellow on white is as bad as blue on black. the problem with 8 colors only is you're stuck to 3 primary, 3 secondary, black, white. done. and you don't want to use primary colors as background.
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2861 [19:51:28] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i'm not sure what that means
2862 [19:52:00] <SerajewelKS> IMO yellow on white is worse than blue on black
2863 [19:52:09] <SerajewelKS> the latter is at least somewhat readable without squinting
2864 [19:52:11] <trek00> mzs114: as greycat said, you could force some colors (like yellow) to another palette (brown)
2865 [19:52:28] <greycat> that won't work if it's not using the standard color set, though
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2867 [19:52:55] <greycat> or at least, I'm not aware of any way to tell rxvt "whenever they ask for color number 176, use #aabbcc". only colors 1 through 7.
2868 [19:52:59] <trek00> SerajewelKS: check this file replaced-url
2869 [19:53:36] <greycat> maybe you could work around your problem by only using terminals with 8 colors :)
2870 [19:53:48] <SerajewelKS> trek00: hmm interesting
2871 [19:54:03] <mzs114> greycat: how? using just xterm ?
2872 [19:54:55] <greycat> you can try it. can't hurt.
2873 [19:56:07] <trek00> mzs114: try with rxvt
2874 [19:56:57] <mzs114> installed on the remote node?
2875 [19:57:30] <trek00> mzs114: installed where you launch xfceterminal
2876 [19:57:51] <greycat> *sigh*
2877 [19:58:04] <SerajewelKS> trek00: it just seems odd to me that there's very little documentation on configuring multiple network interfaces in the initrd environment
2878 [19:58:10] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i wouldn't think this would be a very unique setup
2879 [19:58:10] <mzs114> ok
2880 [19:58:32] <greycat> When you said "using just xterm", I thought you meant "launching an XTerm window on my PC". But now I think *you* might have meant "something something TERM=xterm".
2881 [19:58:59] <trek00> SerajewelKS: i don't know, but i always install the root partition on local disks
2882 [19:59:03] <Ede|Popede> SerajewelKS: i'm on xfce with adwaita dark. also some dark theme for hexchat. had to brighten up half of the dark colors, and then also the bright ones a bit to keep them brighter than the dark ones. some are still rather unreadable, like darkmagenta on black. and i also have problems reading the normal blue on a black terminal. given, i use a smaller font than i maybe should (59 lines on a 22" monitor), but if white is readable, the other fg
2883 [19:59:04] <Ede|Popede> colors should also. i'm simply not an artist ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
2884 [19:59:34] <greycat> blue on black is *terrible*. leads to many deaths in nethack.
2885 [20:00:00] <greycat> I haven't played nethack in a long time, but when I do, I override the blue color to make it actually visible on the -rv (black background) terminal.
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2887 [20:00:49] <SerajewelKS> why that's as bad as wall-hacking!
2888 [20:00:50] <Ede|Popede> blue is good for a night light (think of the panel in a car) to not be too disturbing. but the difference to black is simply too small
2889 [20:01:19] <mzs114> greycat: :)
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2891 [20:01:53] <berndj> is *anyone* able to run gchem3d and do File > Save As Image and then make, say, ammonia.png without the program crashing? go to Tools > Import molecule and enter "InChI=1S/H3N/h1H3" (without quotes) to make something show up
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2893 [20:02:08] <thePiGrepper> hi, quick question. I tried installing eclipse-cdt in buster, however there isnt a package for it. there is one for previous releases, and for sid though
2894 [20:02:13] <thePiGrepper> why is that?
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2900 [20:03:55] <greycat> replaced-url
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2902 [20:04:10] <greycat> it says "removed from unstable" too
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2907 [20:05:38] <jhutchins_wk> Does wayland accept X forwarding?
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2910 [20:06:36] <greycat> Oh hey, let's see if anyone answered my basic questions at replaced-url
2911 [20:07:11] <trek00> Ede|Popede: it seems some colors are not configured fine with white or black backgrounds
2912 [20:07:54] <greycat> *crickets*
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2921 [20:11:08] <Ede|Popede> trek00: to be fair, there's a GPU and then a monitor between the terminfo and the eyes. still have this old Eizo here, my old LCD is pretty dead unluckily, the LED is what i'm using, and then there's a TV which should target other scenarios than text on a static background.
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2925 [20:11:43] <humpled> hmm
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2927 [20:12:37] <Ede|Popede> i think they tried to make black being as black as possible on the LED, was a revelation compared to the LCD. but that maybe also means that the colors may be darker than they maybe should.
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2946 [20:25:49] <wwilliam> that redmine never installed :(
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2952 [20:27:47] <tangarora> so idiot here deleted a 4 TB file by mistake on a WD EX4100 ... it uses a busybox env, and ext2. How can I undelete the file? Recover it somehow...
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2957 [20:28:25] <greycat> !undelete
2958 [20:28:25] <dpkg> Linux doesn't generally support 'undeleting' files. For ext3/ext4, ask me about <ext4magic>, <ext3grep>. For ext2 *only*, use mc (Midnight Commander), umount the filesystem, and select "Undelete files" from menu. With reiserfs, jfs, xfs, you're SooL. Some desktops (GNOME/KDE) offer a trash bin. See also <photorec>, <fatback>.
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2974 [20:46:15] <SerajewelKS> trek00: it looks like that iface iscsi config is only read from firmware, not any config files
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3005 [21:03:37] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i think i figured it out
3006 [21:04:12] <tangarora> greycat, thank you. The WD NAS only runs debian+busy box though. no mc.
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3012 [21:06:36] <SerajewelKS> trek00: an initramfs premount script that just directly invokes ipconfig does the trick
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3014 [21:07:07] <SerajewelKS> trek00: replaced-url
3015 [21:07:09] <greycat> If it "runs debian", just install mc on it.
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3023 [21:12:59] <no_gravity> Funky: When you "apt install npm" on Debian 10 and then run npm it complains that the javascript version is too old. Really? The JS version shipped with the latest Debian release?
3024 [21:13:00] <ctrlrisc> apt install mc
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3029 [21:19:54] <somiaj> node.js stuff still is evolving too quickly to be fully supplied in a frozen release.
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3032 [21:20:44] <no_gravity> somiaj: Is Selenium in a better state?
3033 [21:21:46] <ctrlrisc> so, I can't install both 64-bit and 32-bit versions of libllvm9 on sid?
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3035 [21:22:03] <somiaj> no_gravity: I don't use node.js, but I think it is probably best to install it third-party
3036 [21:22:25] <greycat> for any rapidly evolving tool, I think that's wise
3037 [21:23:33] <no_gravity> *shudders*
3038 [21:23:37] <somiaj> ,v npm
3039 [21:23:38] <judd> Package: npm on amd64 -- jessie: 1.4.21+ds-2; stretch-backports: 5.8.0+ds6-2~bpo9+1; bullseye: 5.8.0+ds6-4; buster: 5.8.0+ds6-4; sid: 5.8.0+ds6-4
3040 [21:23:53] <somiaj> hmm, nope isn't being provided via backports yet either.
3041 [21:24:21] <greycat> stretch-backports through sid are all basically the same version
3042 [21:25:12] <somiaj> Yea, and the first link I found suggests using an ppa....don't do that, but it also suggests using nvm (this is node.js version of virtual enviroment), so probably setup nvm, which as a newer node.js install locally in $HOME or something like that
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3045 [21:25:45] <sklv1> does debian automatically print dmesg to the serial port?
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3047 [21:26:36] <somiaj> no_gravity: replaced-url
3048 [21:26:56] <no_gravity> somiaj: I just did "apt install npm" and so far it works.
3049 [21:27:02] <greycat> I'm kinda unimpressed by programming environments that realize they are so flaky and dangerous that they recommend using themselves in an isolated sandbox.
3050 [21:27:24] <somiaj> yea, it will mostly warn you that your version is outdated, but if you start tying to install packages with npm, you could run into issues, so I would just use upstream for node.js
3051 [21:27:27] <sklv1> and ones that reimplement the package manager on a whim because windows doesn't
3052 [21:27:43] <tds> sklv1: no, you'll want to put something like console=ttyS0,115200 on your kernel cmdline
3053 [21:27:45] <somiaj> what I would worry about by using npm on the machine.
3054 [21:27:47] <no_gravity> greycat: That is the new way. Every piece of software is a steaming piece of junk that has to be kept in a container.
3055 [21:28:07] <no_gravity> greycat: I don't think there is a way back to green fields and blue skyes.
3056 [21:28:12] <sklv1> tds: thanks
3057 [21:28:19] <tds> on modern debian systems, that will also cause systemd to start a getty on that port, fyi
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3059 [21:28:43] <SerajewelKS> no_gravity: there is a debian repository provided by node.js. you could also use a container.
3060 [21:29:17] <no_gravity> SerajewelKS: I *do* use a container. In the container, there runs Debian 10. And in that Debian 10 I installed npm via "apt install npm". It works.
3061 [21:30:19] <SerajewelKS> no_gravity: if you use docker or something that uses compatible images, consider using the node:12-buster image
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3063 [21:31:55] <SerajewelKS> the version in stretch is 10 which is out of LTS one year sooner than 12 (the current LTS, which was released monday)
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3067 [21:34:06] <no_gravity> SerajewelKS: I only use official Debian images.
3068 [21:34:29] <SerajewelKS> then it would be advisable to use the nodesource repository for packages, or avoid node altogether
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3070 [21:35:07] <somiaj> hmm so the nodesorce packages are designed for debian 10 (I was just a bit worried when the page I found called them a PPA)
3071 [21:36:29] <SerajewelKS> i believe so. or the packages are at least compatible between debian and other debian-based distros.
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3073 [21:37:14] <SerajewelKS> yeah there is a separate repo for debian vs ubuntu
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3083 [21:40:18] <trek00> SerajewelKS: is that premount script based on ifaces config of iscsi?
3084 [21:40:27] <SerajewelKS> trek00: no
3085 [21:40:38] <SerajewelKS> trek00: it's based on me reading the ipconfig documentation :)
3086 [21:41:12] <trek00> SerajewelKS: ok, this is a workaround you made yourself, not included in iscsi package
3087 [21:41:26] <SerajewelKS> trek00: right. there doesn't seem to be a universal way to configure multiple interfaces.
3088 [21:41:40] <SerajewelKS> trek00: this seems to work well, and ipconfig keeps state on what is configured in /run in the initrd environment
3089 [21:41:46] <trek00> SerajewelKS: good to know
3090 [21:42:02] <SerajewelKS> trek00: and the other scripts seem to also use ipconfig, so they won't stomp on each other. the first script to run ipconfig for an interface "wins" for its config.
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3105 [21:50:12] <jhutchins_wk> SerajewelKS: ipconfig's windows, linux has ifconfig.
3106 [21:50:24] <greycat> (had)
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3109 [21:51:08] <todi> A wonderful good evening
3110 [21:52:58] *** Quits: Grldfrdom (uid391113@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
3111 [21:53:07] <todi> No one is awake anymore
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3113 [21:54:18] <jhutchins_wk> todi: We don't tend to respond to casual chat but wait until there's a question we can answer.
3114 [21:54:49] <jhutchins_wk> Most of the U.S. is awake and still working, so they may only drop in once in a while.
3115 [21:55:25] <jhutchins_wk> Getting late in the evening in Europe, those folks are starting to drop off.
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3117 [21:55:39] <Habbie> judging from the host, todi is in my timezone, where it's 21:55
3118 [21:55:51] <greycat> they also said "evening"
3119 [21:55:58] <Habbie> yes :)
3120 [21:56:59] <jhutchins_wk> greycat: buster still has ifconfig (has to be manually installed); did they pull it from bullseye/
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3122 [21:57:02] <jhutchins_wk> ?
3123 [21:57:05] <trek00> jhutchins_wk: ipconfig comes from klibc
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3126 [21:57:38] <Habbie> jhutchins_wk, net-tools provides ifconfig on bullseye
3127 [21:57:39] <greycat> ,v net-tools
3128 [21:57:40] <judd> Package: net-tools on amd64 -- jessie: 1.60-26+b1; stretch: 1.60+git20161116.90da8a0-1; bullseye: 1.60+git20180626.aebd88e-1; buster: 1.60+git20180626.aebd88e-1; sid: 1.60+git20180626.aebd88e-1
3129 [21:57:41] <Habbie> jhutchins_wk, just like on buster
3130 [21:57:47] <greycat> still there, for now
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3134 [21:58:38] <SerajewelKS> jhutchins_wk: actually no :) ipconfig is in the initrd
3135 [21:58:41] <jhutchins_wk> Habbie: Yup, got a nice shiney copy on my systems for when I reflexively use it instead of working to learn the new tools.
3136 [21:58:59] <SerajewelKS> jhutchins_wk: however, ipconfig being the windows tool makes finding documentation rather difficult, but i found it
3137 [21:59:16] <sklv1> literally 5th time trying to make it past the debian grub screen without it rando freezing. never have i seen such an overly complicated grub config
3138 [21:59:22] <SerajewelKS> jhutchins_wk: zless /usr/share/doc/klibc-utils/README.ipconfig.gz
3139 [21:59:30] <todi> I'm from Germany I do not understand English very well but I take Google
3140 [21:59:41] <todi> translator
3141 [21:59:47] <trek00> sklv1: graphics problems?
3142 [22:00:05] <Habbie> todi, don't worry, we're patient with non-english speakers
3143 [22:00:32] <trek00> todi: guten nacht :)
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3145 [22:00:52] <sklv1> ... if i leave it on the 1st entry it reliably boots evreytime. my issue is i need to select the 2nd entry. i don't have any problems with graphics, but i'd say a grub config that has pretty pictures but poor stability, does have graphics problems
3146 [22:00:56] <Habbie> trek00, abend, it's too early for nacht :)
3147 [22:01:15] <somiaj> sklv1: have you tried the text based installer (not grahical)? Also random freezes, could your memeory just be bad?
3148 [22:01:26] <trek00> Habbie: :)
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3150 [22:01:37] <Habbie> trek00, (also Abend and Nacht because German capitalises nouns)
3151 [22:01:49] <sklv1> it's not random, it's extremely predictable. it happens only when i try to enter input into the grub menu
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3153 [22:02:20] <trek00> sklv1: then it freeze?
3154 [22:02:23] <sklv1> i have already completed the installer, i have created a custom menu entry for the thing i'm trying to work with, and finding it literally impossible to select it and then press enter
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3156 [22:02:40] <sklv1> well, about 75%-95% of the time, yes
3157 [22:02:43] <todi> I'm going to go in tomorrow gonna go to bed now I'm tired of all a good night until tomorrow
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3160 [22:04:30] <trek00> sklv1: you can try to disable graphical menu, uncommenting GRUB_TERMINAL=console in /etc/default/grub and then run update-grub
3161 [22:04:36] <SerajewelKS> trek00: for reference, here is my write-up: replaced-url
3162 [22:04:50] <sklv1> thanks, i will try that
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3167 [22:06:52] <trek00> SerajewelKS: just a tip about partitions: i would create a boot partition on both disks, so if one fails you can boot with the other :)
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3172 [22:10:54] <SerajewelKS> trek00: normally i do that
3173 [22:11:23] <sklv1> i changed the default selection to 1 to avoid regenerating /boot/grub/grub.cfg
3174 [22:11:23] <SerajewelKS> trek00: but /boot on an iSCSI volume isn't going to help :)
3175 [22:11:57] <sklv1> trying to make bioses, bootloaders and other similar components pretty is fundamentally misguided and pointless and can only result in low quality software and issues like this
3176 [22:12:41] <trek00> SerajewelKS: right
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3180 [22:13:41] <trek00> sklv1: i agree, but many users care more about graphical design than stability
3181 [22:13:42] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i do need to figure out one thing though... open-iscsi will not continue boot until it has established a session
3182 [22:14:00] <SerajewelKS> trek00: if the remote volume has failed then boot will stall, even though there is a locally-present side of the mirror as well
3183 [22:14:12] <SerajewelKS> i need to figure out how to get the scripts to eventually give up and try booting
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3187 [22:15:34] <jhutchins_wk> SerajewelKS: Isn't your os on the iscsi?
3188 [22:16:10] <SerajewelKS> jhutchins_wk: / on LVM on md-raid raid1. one side of the mirror is local SATA, the other is remote iSCSI.
3189 [22:16:31] <SerajewelKS> even with two remote iSCSI devices in a mirror, it would be nice to be able to boot if one of them is not available
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3199 [22:21:28] <trek00> SerajewelKS: may be the login_timeout option in iscsid.conf?
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3202 [22:22:14] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i can try but i think that just controls the timeout for each attempt
3203 [22:22:27] <SerajewelKS> trek00: i think the initrd scripts loop until the connection works
3204 [22:22:58] <SerajewelKS> but i can check the scripts and see if there is some setting i can change to affect its behavior
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3220 [22:32:49] <Morg0th> Hello, do you know why I'm getting that bunch of text replaced-url
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3223 [22:34:11] <trek00> Morg0th: they are hardware problems, see replaced-url
3224 [22:36:56] <cilkay> Hello. I'm doing a Buster preseed install where I don't have a DHCP server. I'm looking at replaced-url
3225 [22:36:56] <cilkay> attempts DHCP.
3226 [22:37:01] <trek00> Morg0th: when you close the lid, may be it hibernates?
3227 [22:37:29] <Morg0th> trek00: thanks, i'll have a look. no it doesn't hibernate, the screen just goes black
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3229 [22:38:17] <ctrlrisc> this isn't the channel for discussing issues with sid, is it?
3230 [22:38:39] <nkuttler> !debian-next
3231 [22:38:39] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
3232 [22:38:42] *** Quits: johnnyfive (~johnnyfiv@replaced-ip ) (Quit: I quit now.)
3233 [22:39:01] <cilkay> Just to get the preseed install working with a static IP configuration, I got rid of the second network interface specification but the installer is still attempting DHCP, timing out, and prompting me for what to do, which defeats the purpose of a preseed install.
3234 [22:39:02] <ctrlrisc> thank you
3235 [22:39:03] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1532
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3237 [22:40:05] <trek00> cilkay: have you tried the Static network configuration part commented in the preseed file?
3238 [22:40:19] <cilkay> I also tried using "d-i netcfg/dhcp_options select Continue" and then "d-i netcfg/dhcp_options select Configure network manually" but that didn't make any difference.
3239 [22:40:37] <cilkay> @trek00, Yes, I did. The Internet is full of reports of this failing, btw.
3240 [22:40:39] <trek00> ctrlrisc: i think it is #debian-next on oftc.net but you can try to ask here
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3242 [22:41:46] <cilkay> I also tried "d-i preseed/early_command string kill-all-dhcp; netcfg" based on one report of it working. Didn't work.
3243 [22:41:47] <Morg0th> trek00: any idea how i can get rid of those error messages? the link doesn't provide much information
3244 [22:42:09] <trek00> cilkay: to disable the predictable interface names you can boot with net.ifnames=0 biosdevname=0
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3246 [22:42:50] <cilkay> trek00, I do that after it has been installed. Is it possible to do during the preseed install, too?
3247 [22:43:09] <cilkay> I have many scripts that depend upon eth0 and eth1 naming.
3248 [22:43:32] <trek00> Morg0th: may be some cable on your laptop make a shortcircuit when opening it
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3250 [22:44:02] <trek00> cilkay: yes, it's a boot parameter you can set on installer too
3251 [22:44:39] <cilkay> trek00, Oh that's cool! How do you set boot parameters when I'm booting from the ISO? Do I have to remaster the ISO?
3252 [22:45:09] <cilkay> That's also how people are setting static IP, btw, as a boot parameter.
3253 [22:45:24] <cilkay> For that, you need to specify the interface name.
3254 [22:45:57] * cilkay recalls reading something about a limit of 256(?) characters for boot parameters.
3255 [22:46:05] <trek00> cilkay: i think you can specify it when you select the installation mode (expert, graphical, etc)
3256 [22:46:09] <jhutchins_wk> Morg0th: Other than the messages, are there any signs of actual problems once you are up again?
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3258 [22:47:54] <cilkay> trek00, I'm using Packer to build this VM on a VMware ESXi host. The relevant bit seems to be this: "boot_command": ["<down><esc><wait>auto url=replaced-url
3259 [22:48:02] <sklv1> Morg0th: i'd hazard a guess that it's to do with your CPU changing power states. I also suspect they're harmless. If they weren't causing me a concrete problem i wouldn't bother spending time fixing them
3260 [22:48:12] <Morg0th> jhutchins_wk: no, everything seems fine, I don't notice any issues... it's just those damned messages that mess up all my terminals
3261 [22:48:25] <cilkay> That's like an expect script where I can see it typing one character at a time. Ugly, but it works.
3262 [22:49:03] <Morg0th> sklv1: yes that's very possible. but the problem is that these messages appear in all my terminals and mess up what was previously displayed in them. I'd just want to hide them.
3263 [22:49:07] <sklv1> Morg0th: yea I don't work in tty0 for this reason :) if they're appearing outside tty0 you should definitely be able to do something about that
3264 [22:49:37] <cilkay> trek00, thanks for the tip. I'll research how I can pass boot parameters to Packer's "boot_command".
3265 [22:49:52] <Morg0th> sklv1: i'm in my xmonad desktop environment, using irssi. tty0 is the full terminal mode (before running startx), right?
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3267 [22:50:26] <jhutchins_wk> Morg0th: On a linux system yes.
3268 [22:50:34] <sklv1> Morg0th: right, your issue is not the mce, your issue is that syslogd is sending it to your terminals. google "disable message from syslog" and that covers how to stop syslog doing that
3269 [22:50:45] <jhutchins_wk> Does wayland accept X forwarding?
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3272 [22:52:36] <Morg0th> sklv1: that makes total sense, thanks! checking it now
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3275 [22:53:33] <zapatista> I observed a similar behavior when I was using wayland and now I am using gnome classic and that problem is gone.
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3307 [23:18:07] <Morg0th> About my problem with error messages that appear in the terminals, I just rebooted after having adapted /etc/rsyslog.conf but now my whole system freezes for like 20 seconds when i close/open the lid. I guess it's not related to my rsyslog.conf changes, but this is clearly worse than having messages in terminals :/
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3321 [23:24:32] <Abdullah> which vim has +clipboard in debian?
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3323 [23:24:45] <Abdullah> I have vim.nox but no clipbaord
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3325 [23:26:10] <somiaj> maybe you just need to turn it on via some set foo
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3327 [23:27:17] <somiaj> hmm google seems to suggest set clipboard=unamedplus (thinking that is the + clipboard)
3328 [23:28:23] <somiaj> Abdullah: in vim run :echo has('clipboard') and see if it outputs a 1
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3330 [23:28:45] <somiaj> or from the shell, vim --version | grep clipboard and look for +clipboard
3331 [23:29:00] <somiaj> I have vim-gtk, so unsure if vim.nox has different compile flags or not
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3333 [23:29:03] <Abdullah> somiaj: I came here after checking it. btw thanks
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3335 [23:29:37] <Abdullah> and I have to install vim-gtk. yeah. I thought vim.nox has everything included.
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3337 [23:30:04] <somiaj> yea, I dont have vim-nox installed, so not something I can check here.
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3340 [23:31:08] <somiaj> just checked in a vm, vim-nox doesn't have +clipboard, might be the matainer assumes you don't need this if you aren't using X (to keep from pulling in xlib depends)
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3343 [23:31:55] <Abdullah> somiaj: here is replaced-url
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3345 [23:33:13] <somiaj> It appears in this case vim.nox is compiled -clipboard, so you don't have access to it if using vim-nox.
3346 [23:33:13] <Abdullah> I think maintainer should compile it with clipboard support. else we have to compile it ourselves.
3347 [23:33:24] <somiaj> why not just install vim-gtk or some other vim variatn.
3348 [23:33:55] <Abdullah> somiaj: installed vim-gtk but I don't need gui for vim.
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3350 [23:34:25] <somiaj> that is fine, vim still runs in a terminal, gvim runs in a gui
3351 [23:34:41] <somiaj> vim.gtk isn't a gui, gvim.gtk is
3352 [23:35:02] <somiaj> I think the idea of vim-nox is to not have any X dependencies, which probably is why -clipboard is used (my guess)
3353 [23:35:21] <somiaj> well I guess gvim is just vim with :gui ran
3354 [23:36:16] <Abdullah> somiaj: I have got gvim binary
3355 [23:36:22] <Abdullah> with vim-gtk
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3359 [23:37:10] <Abdullah> and I sometimes edit too files in different instances of urxvtc without using vimdiff so I need clipboard
3360 [23:37:43] <Abdullah> lemme try it in ttys
3361 [23:37:58] <somiaj> well without running X, you won't have access to the X clipboard.
3362 [23:37:58] <Abdullah> oh but there we have tmux clipboard ;-)
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3364 [23:38:12] <somiaj> so that is why vim-nox doesn't include it.
3365 [23:38:18] <somiaj> and yea, tmux has a nice clipboard you can use.
3366 [23:38:19] <Abdullah> hmm
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3369 [23:38:47] <somiaj> I don't think tty's by default have a clipboard, and so unless you are running multiple filies in the same vim instance, you can't use vim's internal clipboard.
3370 [23:38:58] <trek00> Abdullah: vimdiff is awesome, thank you mentioned it!
3371 [23:38:59] <Abdullah> yeah I use that. here is tmux.conf replaced-url
3372 [23:41:01] <Abdullah> somiaj: I have something in .zprofile which on login checks if I'm not on tty1, it opens/attachs new/existing tmux session
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