People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
0 [00:00:48] <at0m> just make sure the user isn't logged in or running anything when moving its home
1 [00:01:03] <RoyK> duude__: the best way is perhaps to change /etc/passwd and change the path to the home dir and then move the data over to the new path.
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3 [00:01:44] <duude__> RoyK eh, I changed my mind a bit
4 [00:01:46] <at0m> (ie. don't user@hostname:~$ sudo mv .. )
5 [00:02:07] <duude__> I won't move the entire /home/ directory
6 [00:02:28] <duude__> I'll just move the Downloads, Pictures and other subdirectories and same symlinks for them
7 [00:02:41] <duude__> make*
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11 [00:07:11] <jhutchins> duude__: What might be a better approach would be to mount a partition on your hard drive at /home
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14 [00:10:11] <duude__> jhutchins, I thought about that, I kinda agree
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16 [00:10:27] <duude__> but my concern is retaining the speed of the SSD
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18 [00:10:45] <duude__> I want some things in /home/ to be on the SSD and others to be on the HDD
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20 [00:11:28] <datapioneer_> Fairly sure you can't split the /home between devices
21 [00:11:40] <BCMM> datapioneer_: sure you can, just symlink it
22 [00:11:42] <at0m> duude__: if you're after freeing space on that SSD, moving the largest dirs could do, too, indeed. "du -hsx ~/* | sort -h | tail"
23 [00:12:02] <datapioneer_> Why would you want to?
24 [00:12:07] <at0m> that will give you the 10 largest items in your ~/
25 [00:12:09] <BCMM> for example, i keep my /home/ on an ssd, but have symlinks to a filesystem on a hard drive for stuff like photos, videos, documents
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28 [00:12:34] <BCMM> i.e. directories that will contain a relatively small number of relatively large files
29 [00:12:37] <datapioneer_> I've never done that and I've worked with Linux since 1996
30 [00:12:43] <BCMM> nobody cares what the seek time on a video is
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32 [00:13:11] <BCMM> datapioneer_: *never* used a symlink to put an arbitrary directory on a different storage device?
33 [00:13:29] <datapioneer_> yes, but not anything in the /home directory
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35 [00:13:46] <BCMM> well, i don't see why not!
36 [00:13:52] <at0m> ^^
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38 [00:14:09] <BCMM> as to why you'd want to: in my case, because my photos and videos won't fit on my ssd
39 [00:14:28] <BCMM> but i appreciate applications launching faster when their config files and so on are on fast storage
40 [00:14:29] <at0m> i got media files on spinning rust, and symlink that to my home which is on SSD
41 [00:14:44] <at0m> yea, same here
42 [00:14:57] <BCMM> and linux applications are almost invariably completely well-behaved about symlinks, so it "just works"
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44 [00:15:52] <BCMM> a more 1996 example might be moving some files that aren't performance-critical on to a NFS share
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60 [00:21:11] <duude__> BCMM: Hey that's exactly what I'm looking to do
61 [00:21:17] <duude__> How's the preformance of viewing pictures? Any issues?
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64 [00:21:28] <BCMM> duude__: none, basically
65 [00:21:35] <duude__> Awesome!
66 [00:21:43] <duude__> Could I ask you to give me a brief guide how to do it please?
67 [00:21:43] <BCMM> duude__: the symlink itself has negligible overhead, if that's what you meant
68 [00:21:50] <duude__> Yup that's what I meant
69 [00:22:28] <BCMM> as for the performance impact of having it on a spinning disc, well, it taking a few milliseconds longer to open a photo is simply not perceptible to a human
70 [00:22:44] <duude__> so I know that I need to do it as root, the I'll go ln -s /home/username/pictures /mnt/hdddata/pictures
71 [00:22:49] <duude__> And that should be it?
72 [00:23:01] <BCMM> however, it will probably make a noticable difference when, for example, thumbnailing a large directory
73 [00:23:04] <duude__> I went through the man page and the targets are very confusing
74 [00:23:09] <duude__> Not sure what goes first
75 [00:23:11] <BCMM> duude__: you don't want to be root to create the symlink
76 [00:23:15] <duude__> I see
77 [00:23:27] <BCMM> duude__: first of all, do you have a sensible filesystem on the hdd?
78 [00:23:32] <duude__> BCMM: oh yes the HDD is slower I know that :)
79 [00:23:40] <BCMM> i mean, not ntfs or fat32 basically
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81 [00:23:57] <duude__> Yes, it's ntfs which I automatically mount upon system boot through fdisk and ntfs-3g
82 [00:24:25] <BCMM> do you already have files on it? is it too late to pick a better filesystem?
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84 [00:24:46] <BCMM> ntfs-3g is a fairly significant performance hit, if only because it's a FUSE filesystem
85 [00:25:03] <brutser> BCMM: maybe you can help me out, i am scratching my head on this, i got in crypttab line with crypt_hdd /dev/disk/by-id/xxx keyfile luks,discard,noauto,header=header,keyscript=script - and for some reason on real hardware it prompts during boot "cryptsetup: Waiting for encrypted source device /dev/disk/by-id/xxx - on qemu it's not prompting for
86 [00:25:03] <brutser> this and everything works as expected - i know it's the crypttab, because if i change /dev/disk/by-id to the actual /dev/sdb (or whatever the disk is called), it prompts for "cryptsetup: Waiting for source device /dev/sdb" - whyyy???
87 [00:25:04] <duude__> I do have files on it unfortunately.
88 [00:25:14] <duude__> Why? Because I dual boot windows
89 [00:25:16] <BCMM> brutser: sorry, i know almost nothing about disk encryption
90 [00:25:23] <duude__> I want to be able to access those files from both windows and linux
91 [00:25:25] <brutser> BCMM: ok np
92 [00:25:29] <brutser> anyone else maybe?
93 [00:25:39] <duude__> Unfortunately Linux mounts NTFS much better than Windows mounts EXT4
94 [00:25:50] <BCMM> duude__: fair enough. well, if you're OK with the reduced performance, this should work fine
95 [00:25:57] <duude__> I'm fine with it :)
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97 [00:26:31] <BCMM> duude__: *if* we're just talking about some boring data like photos, videos, documents. don't try and put, like, your .ssh directory or install programs on it basically, or you'll be fighting the lack of Unix permissions
98 [00:26:47] <duude__> It is boring stuff like a lot of videos :P
99 [00:26:51] <duude__> Movies mainly
100 [00:27:20] <duude__> So in the "ln -s, path1 path2" The second path is the path of symlink and the 1st path is the path of the directory
101 [00:27:24] <BCMM> duude__: so, first of all, make sure you've got a directory that your user can read and write on the target filesystem
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103 [00:27:31] <duude__> I got a bit confused, I'm literally checking out the man page again
104 [00:27:45] <duude__> Alright, check
105 [00:28:17] <BCMM> duude__: 2. move your stuff over to the new location 3. create symlinks in the location that your stuff used to be
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108 [00:28:50] <duude__> The directory which I want to symlink is /home/myusername/Downloads, and the target directory is /mnt/hdd_data/Nix/Downloads
109 [00:28:53] <duude__> They're both empty.
110 [00:29:05] <BCMM> duude__: the *second* argument will be the location where the link is created. the first argument is the target of the link
111 [00:29:08] <duude__> My only issue is that I confuse what goes first in the "ln -s" command
112 [00:29:17] <BCMM> duude__: if it helps, that kind of follows the way `cp` works
113 [00:29:47] <duude__> ah
114 [00:29:51] <BCMM> except instead of creating a copy of your file, it creates a thing which kind of looks like a copy but will stay in sync
115 [00:30:12] <duude__> So if I want the data to be on the hdd, and the symlink to be on the ssd, then it goes ln -ls hdd_path ssd_path
116 [00:30:14] <duude__> Neat!
117 [00:30:35] <duude__> Will the "ln" command automatically overwrite a directory? or do I have to remove it first?
118 [00:30:50] <BCMM> i think it will warn if it's going to overwrite
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120 [00:31:33] <BCMM> so, for example, `mv ~/Downloads /mnt/spinning_rust/; ln -s /mnt/spinning_rust/Downloads ~/Downloads`
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125 [00:33:58] <duude__> BDMM: That's it! Should work :) Gonna do it now
126 [00:34:30] <BCMM> it might be a good idea to have backups, if that's practical. just in case you do somehow overwrite something
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128 [00:35:09] <BCMM> (but it shouldn't be possible unless you pass -f)
129 [00:35:30] <BCMM> duude__: oh, by the way, is it windows 10?
130 [00:35:51] <BCMM> you need to watch out for something when sharing an ntfs partition with windows 10
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136 [00:38:52] <duude__> BCMM: it is win10
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141 [00:41:47] <BCMM> duude__: i apologise if you already know this, but the default "shut down" behaviour in win10 is weird
142 [00:42:24] <BCMM> basically, when you tell it to shut down, what it actually does is more like "log out then hibernate" (turns out that resuming from hibernation is faster than a clean boot in NT)
143 [00:42:59] <BCMM> so if you shut down win10 and then boot up linux, you'll find the NTFS drive was never unmounted by windows
144 [00:43:27] <BCMM> there's an option you can change to make it do a real, old-fashioned shutdown, but i can't remember what it's called. something to do with "fast boot", maybe
145 [00:43:49] <duude__> Oh no need to apologize for anything man, I didn't know that :)
146 [00:44:02] <duude__> I bet you're actaully twice my age. I'm still in HS.
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148 [00:44:29] <duude__> If anything, I should apologize for taking your time. Thank you so much for helping me out
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150 [00:45:26] <duude__> BCMM: I just checked, yes it is indeed fast boot. It's disabled on Windows LTSC by default.
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152 [00:45:30] <duude__> Mine doesn't hibernate haha
153 [00:45:42] <BCMM> ah, that's ok then
154 [00:45:56] <duude__> I actually have another problem with Debian
155 [00:45:59] <BCMM> watch out that they don't flip it on in the next ltsc release or whatever!
156 [00:46:07] <duude__> I will
157 [00:46:23] <duude__> Whenever Debian suspends, it shows a blank screen and is unresponsive
158 [00:46:56] <duude__> CTRL Alt F2 brings me up to the TTY
159 [00:47:00] <duude__> and everything works fine
160 [00:47:25] <duude__> However I can never go back to my desktop environment
161 [00:47:32] <duude__> I'm a bit unsure how to proceed. Any ideas?
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175 [01:00:21] <BCMM> duude__: what happens if you do ctrl+alt+f7?
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177 [01:00:41] <BCMM> oh, this is specifically after suspend and resume... nvidia?
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181 [01:02:11] <duude__> BCMM: Intel actually
182 [01:02:21] <duude__> oh!
183 [01:02:29] <duude__> ctrl alt f7 worked straight out of the box
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190 [01:06:03] <PETURBG> hi
191 [01:06:17] <dvs> oi
192 [01:06:19] <PETURBG> other day i ask how to compile coturn... can someone repeait it again.
193 [01:06:31] <PETURBG> ! compile
194 [01:06:32] <dpkg> tar -zxvf tarball, cd blah, ./configure, make, make install or install by hand., but for an easier way to compile the kernel, apt-get install kernel-package, or something you should only do if you're SURE there isn't already a debian package that meets your needs, and never into places that could conflict with dpkg
195 [01:06:57] <PETURBG> dpkg no... it was with debian rules..
196 [01:06:57] <dpkg> PETURBG: I don't know, could you explain it?
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198 [01:08:11] <PETURBG> dpklg what i ermember was... First download apt-get source coturn... after that apt-get download-dependency coturn when everything is download then move source debian from debian to coturn source git and then dpkg-buildpackage
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200 [01:09:02] <PETURBG> i need to confirm it .
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203 [01:10:53] <BCMM> dpkg: dpkg is a bot, fyi
204 [01:10:54] <dpkg> ...but dpkg is already something else...
205 [01:11:01] <BCMM> uh, meant to highlight PETURBG there
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207 [01:11:32] <PETURBG> BCMM thanks... can you confirm if this was what to work.
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210 [01:11:51] <PETURBG> i to want to give thanks to that person who comment it...
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214 [01:12:10] <PETURBG> ! compile dpkgf
215 [01:12:12] <PETURBG> ! compile dpkg
216 [01:12:24] <BCMM> PETURBG: have a look at replaced-url
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218 [01:12:48] <BCMM> !ssb
219 [01:12:48] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
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223 [01:13:09] <BCMM> ^if you happen to be trying to backport a package, have a look at that
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227 [01:15:00] <PETURBG> BCMM no i just want coturn to compile latest coturn from git but to use debian directory...
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235 [01:18:06] <BCMM> PETURBG: get the debian source package, replace the sources with sources from git, and try to buidl
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238 [01:19:21] <PETURBG> BCMM when you mean replaces sources... you mean source directory ?
239 [01:19:25] <BCMM> yeah
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241 [01:19:45] <BCMM> debian-specific patches and configuration are kept separately
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246 [01:20:34] <PETURBG> BCMM remember source is only one... and sources is multiply... so apt-get download source apache2, and download apache2 from git... then enter in debian source apache2 and move source directory in apache2 git directory... after that make...
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251 [01:22:30] <mmx_in_space> hello all, help with this?
252 [01:22:32] <mmx_in_space> replaced-url
253 [01:22:56] <mmx_in_space> trying to ssh into my server via windows client putty
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255 [01:24:20] <PETURBG> mmx you try it with key or with words...
256 [01:24:37] <PETURBG> mmx ssh key or words...
257 [01:24:47] <mmx_in_space> words
258 [01:24:54] <mmx_in_space> that was a question right?
259 [01:24:57] <PETURBG> mmx then this is strange...
260 [01:25:15] <PETURBG> mmx... if you ask me... reinstall openssh-server... do you have something important on it..
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263 [01:25:54] <mmx_in_space> nothing important on it
264 [01:26:07] <PETURBG> mmx then apt-get purge openssh-server
265 [01:26:14] <mmx_in_space> how do i reinstall openssh-server?
266 [01:26:15] <PETURBG> apt-get install openssh-server
267 [01:26:18] <mmx_in_space> okay
268 [01:26:32] <PETURBG> apt-get purge openssh-server this will delete everything for ssh...
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273 [01:29:33] <PETURBG> mmx what has you do so openssh-server get this error.
274 [01:29:51] <PETURBG> is your ssh server has internet access. so someone can enter...
275 [01:30:35] <mmx_in_space> please re-ask the question
276 [01:30:42] <mmx_in_space> i don't understand
277 [01:31:42] <PETURBG> mmx you put ssh-server " openssh-server " in your debian... so you can connect from windows... so is this computer with ssh is open outside " that someone can enter who is not from your house in your ssh " is your port 22 open for internet.
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281 [01:34:09] <tomreyn> mmx_in_space: i think PETURBG is asking whether your SSH server is accessible form the Internet.
282 [01:34:32] <PETURBG> tomreyn maybe someone has hacked his openssh
283 [01:35:00] <mmx_in_space> this happens on the exact same debian setup on my local machine in a vm
284 [01:35:17] <tomreyn> PETURBG: that or one of the million other possibilities
285 [01:35:27] <PETURBG> mmx... did you repair your openssh-server issue ...
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287 [01:36:03] <PETURBG> tomreyn... if he is user then someone has hacked him... this happend when i first time run server...
288 [01:36:33] <tomreyn> mmx_in_space: do you have access to this debian server by other means?
289 [01:37:07] <tomreyn> i.e. are you able to make changes to it now until you'll be able to login?
290 [01:37:24] <mmx_in_space> i can access it by other means, yes
291 [01:37:44] <tomreyn> good. so did you check what the server logged about this connection attempt?
292 [01:37:44] <PETURBG> mmx is that server ?
293 [01:37:58] <mmx_in_space> looks like reinstalling openssh-server fixed the problem
294 [01:38:12] <mmx_in_space> :)
295 [01:38:28] <PETURBG> mmx... now if you don't use openssh-server from outside intenret... just disable in router port 22.
296 [01:38:54] <mmx_in_space> peturbg: okay. thanks a million and you too tomreyn
297 [01:39:04] <PETURBG> mmx_in_space thank on you man.
298 [01:39:11] <tomreyn> you're welcome
299 [01:39:19] <mmx_in_space> :)
300 [01:39:52] <PETURBG> mmx if someone day you wan tto run openssh-server from internet... use key digital or good password.
301 [01:40:09] <PETURBG> and install maldetect.
302 [01:40:18] <PETURBG> ! maldetect
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304 [01:40:26] <mmx_in_space> peturbg okay.
305 [01:40:33] <PETURBG> replaced-url
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307 [01:41:37] <PETURBG> here is manual: replaced-url
308 [01:42:53] <mmx_in_space> thank you
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312 [01:48:23] <PETURBG> i just remember... my friend has sslh server for xmpp and 100 he uses web server https... so question is when someone visit his: yourdomain.com it comment it come from 127.0.0.1 he speak with sslh developer and he didn't understand him good. include he speak with xmpp who make manual how to run sslh.. soe someone know how to make sslh to show
313 [01:48:23] <PETURBG> original ip in apache2 latest upgrade to show... someone comment o use stunel or other. he need proxy transparent... he need to compile it to use it becouse in .deb don;t come with transparency proxy... and for that i enter too in debian just in the moment i remember it .
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339 [02:06:24] <PETURBG> correct sitll don't correct. my friend just confirm it.
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392 [02:49:43] <hays> is there something that would prevent systemd from running mail in ExecStart?
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418 [03:21:27] <shiin> something seems off with the linux-headers-4.19.0-5-amd64 package on mirrors right now, can someone confirm that, or is it just me?
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424 [03:26:28] <Joit> yay i am back with debia 10 and even more ranting. 1. why is there no firefox normal anymore, just firefox esr
425 [03:26:34] <LtL> shiin: if the name is correct apt doesn't see it at all
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427 [03:28:29] <LtL> Joit: firefox esr is the only FF for at least the last 3 releases as far as i know
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430 [03:29:33] <Joit> LtL: weird, at mx i think i remebered to see 2 firefox at synaptic, esr and normal and both with the same release number
431 [03:30:33] <Joit> this esr has some options missing like the minipreviews at 'new tab' also it doesnt set my langugae, just stays at english
432 [03:31:10] <Joit> language-+ even, this typing ..
433 [03:31:41] <Joit> also seems the paranoia reached debian too, that a normal user can not realy be root too
434 [03:32:27] <shiin> LtL, you gave me the right hint. It's the vagrant-vbguest plugin that already has an update.
435 [03:32:34] <shiin> Thank you
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437 [03:33:14] <Joit> also nvidia drivers are very hard to install, but seems its a source problem, and not sure how you really can solve that easy. but thats a moment too, where you want have root access
438 [03:33:45] <Joit> or they are scared to add it to the reps atm
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440 [03:36:43] <LtL> Joit: do you have non-free in sources.list?
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442 [03:38:31] <Joit> LtL: i did add it now, and have it installed but it did take a long time until i figured it out
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444 [03:38:47] <LtL> Joit: add contrib also
445 [03:39:20] <Joit> i had to add 6 lines into sources.list, over synaptic it is a pain, because it relaod every time when you add a new line
446 [03:39:30] <LtL> to all lines, and are you thinking of iceweasel?
447 [03:39:34] <Joit> esle the depencies are not satisfied
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449 [03:40:11] <LtL> Joit: meh, edit /etc/apt/sources.list manually
450 [03:40:46] <Joit> yes, did that after some reading. but well, that is not really user friendly
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452 [03:42:06] <LtL> Joit: i picked up FF 52 at mozilla.debian.net years ago and updated it manually for years
453 [03:43:01] <LtL> its at 69.0.1 at the moment, esr is still intact but i never use it.
454 [03:43:27] <Joit> how can you avooide the auto update from it over software management?
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458 [03:44:14] <LtL> Joit: apt doesn't know about it. what it doesn't know can't hurt it... right!
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463 [03:47:19] <Joit> LtL: yes, right. sometimes i got the feeling the last months, that this devs starting to work against the users as with thm
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465 [03:49:46] <LtL> Joit: hmm, well debian has always swayed towards the server use case, but the desktop user still has plenty to work with.
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467 [03:51:58] <LtL> the command line will most likely continue to be the most prevalent way to administer debian
468 [03:52:20] <Joit> well that is at all distributions from say 18-19.xx
469 [03:53:11] <LtL> case in point, synaptic won't even work under wayland, it still does in Xorg though, as you know apparently.
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474 [03:56:28] <Joit> LtL: again because of the user rights ?
475 [03:57:10] <Joit> i avoide wayland where i can, i dont have any good for this server.. until now every system on it did not work for me
476 [03:57:49] <Joit> and i think they only make the mess greater as it is already
477 [03:58:11] <LtL> Joit: not that I know of, no. it's just when Xwayland was deployed synaptic just didn't build right, many other things too.
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479 [03:58:26] <LtL> Joit: yeah, you may be right.
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482 [03:58:53] <LtL> and not just because wayland btw
483 [03:59:27] <Joit> i still dont know anyway why they want a new shiny server, x11 worked stable and there are not really such shiny applications what need a super server
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485 [04:00:07] <LtL> makes me wonder where debian is going though, it's come a long way since i started with it, not always for the best but thats my opinion
486 [04:00:23] <Joit> and at the other hand i still dont know, what the guys from x11 did know, what now the new "devs" seems to do not
487 [04:01:08] <Joit> i had debian as first installation, but then run into the problem, that a lot of the libs been to old for some of my things
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489 [04:01:30] <Joit> now i tried alsmost al others and have to sasy all of it sucks hard, very disapointing
490 [04:01:55] <Joit> mint, mandriva with grub2, ubuntu mx
491 [04:02:15] <LtL> Joit: its always been behind on the latest, greatest, but it's damn stable and quite secure out of the box.
492 [04:02:23] <Joit> mint have a source on it what hangs on every idiotic update 10 minutes
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494 [04:03:21] <LtL> i haven't used anything but debian since woody, i did look at ubuntu.. no thanks to debian derivatives for me.
495 [04:03:21] <Joit> and it does not even load something from there, that is so noobish, to set up a system like this
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500 [04:05:33] <LtL> gotta run, see ya :)
501 [04:05:44] <Joit> well i do some graphic things and other stuff, trying around.
502 [04:05:53] <Joit> ok have a good evening or aftrenoon. bye
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514 [04:14:10] <srg> Hi. In a debian Docker image, when performing automated package installs, should I use apt, apt-get, aptitude, or something else? What is recommended?
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520 [04:20:29] <met> it doesn't really matter as the result is the same, but apt-get is available everywhere, even in the most minimal installs
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523 [04:20:57] <themill> apt is explicitly not for scripting
524 [04:21:21] <srg> themill: Ah, didn't know that
525 [04:21:34] <srg> Ok so I guess apt-get is the best choice
526 [04:21:37] <srg> Thanks
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553 [04:46:07] <jim> themill, is there some apt-alike that -is- explicitly and specifically for scripting?
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574 [04:56:59] <themill> jim: apt-get
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577 [04:58:03] <themill> (not that it is particularly well designed for scripting, but the developers have undertaken not to introduce behaviour changes such that people's scripts broke)
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603 [05:22:48] <jim> themill, I thought that was the original, meant as a test of the apt libs?
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646 [06:17:36] <Rothgar> Is it possible or best to get LIS working so I use the normal Network Adapter rather than Legacy? If so is there an article on how to get it working because I am struggling on Debian 10 to find details
647 [06:17:54] <Rothgar> this is for Hyper-V Host
648 [06:17:59] <rawf> what is the proper way to update the symlinks for /vmlinuz and /initrd.img? Right now they are pointing to a kernel I've uninstalled.
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650 [06:19:35] <Rothgar> Or should I just save myself the hassle and use a Legacy NIC >_<
651 [06:20:34] <jim> rawf, do you install kernels by installing a linux-image* package?
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653 [06:21:02] <rawf> jim: I did. Right now I'm trying to undo the changes made by installing the realtime linux package
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655 [06:21:36] <jim> and uninstalling that package doesn't do that?
656 [06:21:55] <rawf> removing and/or purging does not update those symlinks
657 [06:22:46] <jim> generally you don't need those symlinks, at least on a normal system... do you make use of them for your own purposes?
658 [06:22:58] <rawf> I have a nonstandard bootloader and it uses those symlinks to know which kernel/initrd to use
659 [06:24:23] <rawf> I think for now I'll just replace the symlinks manually..
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661 [06:27:01] <jim> I don't know what to tell you about the boot loader... I just know that lilo uses block lists written to a boot sector together with boot code, and grub has stages (in a bios/dos booting situation), stage1 also uses block lists written to the boot sector like lilo, but instead of booting a kernel from the block list, it boots grub stage 2 that way... from this point forward (aka with grub stage 2), grub knows how to find files (like config files and
662 [06:27:01] <jim> kernels) by name
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664 [06:27:49] <jim> rawf, what had you decide to go with this boot loader?
665 [06:28:20] <jim> oops hold that thought, brb
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668 [06:31:29] <rawf> this machine's BIOS reads/loads ther kernel / initrd itself, I don't have a normal bootloader setup
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671 [06:32:06] <rawf> a manual call to linux-update-symlinks fixed my symlinks. now I can reboot
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673 [06:37:44] <jim> rawf, very cool... you found a script that does it
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692 [07:02:21] <saul> im running buster and installed the legacy nvidia drivers nvidia-detect recommended
693 [07:03:15] <saul> but i noticed the NVIDIA persistence daemon was failing to start
694 [07:03:28] <saul> it says it failed to query NVIDIA devices
695 [07:03:49] <saul> and i noticed that i dont have any nvidia nodes under /dev
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698 [07:08:08] <thehidden> helo
699 [07:08:12] <thehidden> hello*
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705 [07:17:32] <hanasaki> how do you specify all packages to come from stable. except one from testing?
706 [07:18:20] <thehidden> well
707 [07:18:27] <thehidden> in etc/apt/sources.list
708 [07:18:47] <thehidden> you can list the stable package source
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710 [07:19:13] <thehidden> and then the program you want from testing I assume you can download the debian website as a .deb file.
711 [07:19:20] <thehidden> does this answer your question?
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715 [07:22:20] <hanasaki> thehidden: helps. more info... actually want to be able to apt-get the package from testing yet keep the rest at stable
716 [07:23:40] <beavis> what could be the cause i have no hibernation available in mate>
717 [07:23:44] <beavis> it was there before
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734 [07:41:00] <xormor> is it a good idea for me to use the latest stable kernel?
735 [07:41:06] <xormor> Linux debianvakaavainamoinen 5.3.1 #1 SMP Fri Sep 27 21:45:31 EEST 2019 x86_64 GNU/Linux
736 [07:43:27] <c0rnelius> does is work? if so ur fine.
737 [07:43:45] <xormor> c0rnelius, yes.
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739 [07:44:06] <c0rnelius> all good then.
740 [07:44:13] <swivel> replaced-url
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742 [07:44:47] <c0rnelius> i'm on 5.2.15 i thinks? and all seems fine to me.
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744 [07:47:40] <xormor> c0rnelius, since it is the latest stable kernel, it has been debugged properly and well. I have never encountered kernel bugs in a way that the effects of them are displayed on my screen. I used to have kernel panics, but that was 10 years ago and once it was because I did an "optimization" the system told me not to do, it was on the hard drive.
745 [07:49:38] <c0rnelius> generally new kernels ae the best route to roll down which is why I'm on 5.2.x, but nothing wrong with rolling 5.3. if it's working for you that is.
746 [07:49:51] <c0rnelius> aren't*
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748 [07:51:19] <ratrace> except this is #debian and we're using Debian because we want very stable, very tested and not SNS. so while it's okay to use latest kernel "if it works for you", consider why you're using debian in the first place ;)
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750 [07:51:58] <c0rnelius> thats just software
751 [07:52:06] <c0rnelius> the kernel is the kernel
752 [07:52:25] <ratrace> and kernel is hardware? ;)
753 [07:52:54] <c0rnelius> exactly
754 [07:53:00] <ratrace> ho-kay.
755 [07:53:13] <beavis> something made my system forget it's swap file
756 [07:53:20] <c0rnelius> which isn't software related
757 [07:53:41] <ratrace> so lemme be blunt. xormor: "is it a good idea for me to use the latest stable kernel?" The one in Debian Stable repository? Yes. The "upstream labeled stable"? No.
758 [07:53:44] <beavis> also, any ,materials on how to properly dual booot with windows regarding time issues>
759 [07:53:52] <ratrace> xormor: emphasis on "good idea" ;)
760 [07:54:16] <xormor> ratrace, I understood.
761 [07:54:44] <beavis> and how do i turn time synchronisation on?
762 [07:55:09] <ratrace> beavis: with systemd-timesyncd service? which should be on by default, in buster at least
763 [07:56:15] <beavis> replaced-url
764 [07:56:22] <ratrace> beavis: ah for dual boot with windows, use timedatectl in debian and use its "set-local-rtc 1" command, to tell the system RTC is in local time, not UTC
765 [07:56:40] <xormor> ratrace, this is just a desktop environment I wipe regularly with a reformat and repartition. I do not want to use "unstable" and "testing" Debian, so I use stable but sometimes I want to test out things. That is why I may use backports sometimes, and "more experimental" software. The kernel is the main program of the system, and while I often use the latest stable Debian kernel, from time to time I try the replaced-url
766 [07:56:40] <xormor> difference in performance of the system.
767 [07:56:53] <beavis> ratrace: yeah but tjen it shows up my time incorecrtly
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773 [07:57:30] <ratrace> xormor: well there's nothing wrong or illegal with that :)
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775 [07:58:12] <ratrace> beavis: then set it with `date`, once you set-local-rtc 1, and then enable systemd-timesyncd.service
776 [07:58:20] <ZaZaGX> whats illegal?
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778 [07:59:40] <ratrace> xormor: what you said last implies you know what you're doing, while your original question did not. if you know what you're doing, then sure, it's okay to use latest upstream "stable" kernel, because you know it's not been fully tested and things _might_ go wrong.
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785 [08:04:59] <beavis> so back to time syncing
786 [08:05:05] <beavis> what could be preventing this>
787 [08:05:10] <beavis> ?
788 [08:05:37] <ratrace> beavis: did you "timedatectl set-local-rtc 1"?
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791 [08:05:50] <beavis> yes
792 [08:06:00] <ratrace> okay, now set your local time with `date` command
793 [08:06:06] <beavis> i did
794 [08:06:33] <ratrace> okay, start and enable systemd-timesyncd.service
795 [08:06:43] <beavis> replaced-url
796 [08:07:35] <beavis> System clock synchronized: is still "no"
797 [08:07:59] <ratrace> huh... RTC is never updated, it says? well... I guess you're out of luck then
798 [08:08:21] <ratrace> beavis: what I did when I was dualbooting was deliberately letting windows have wrong time , and always use UTC and sync in linux
799 [08:08:38] <ratrace> I used windows ONLY for games, in dual boot scenarios, so windows local time being off didn't matter
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804 [08:09:17] <ratrace> if that's not okay with you, then I suppose you will just need to leave time unsynced in linux, and rely on your regular reboots to windows, to adjust RTC
805 [08:09:19] <pclover> ratrace, you can tell windows to use UTC time
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809 [08:09:45] <ratrace> pclover: oh? that's new to me
810 [08:09:50] <pclover> Yes
811 [08:10:05] <ratrace> which version?
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815 [08:10:47] <pclover> ratrace, since 7 afik
816 [08:11:28] <ratrace> beavis: then that's your answer if you have win7 or newer . Found this on arclinux wiki: replaced-url
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818 [08:12:56] <ratrace> this being #debian and me not using windows for many years now, not even in dual boot, I suppose I can be forgiven for not knowing that :)
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821 [08:14:25] <pclover> I wish i could use it as a primary desktop os. For my use case i can't. And rather not mess with VFIO when i need to use windows. :)
822 [08:14:28] <pclover> tho getting ot now
823 [08:14:34] <free_speech> ratrace, you could even be forgiven if you wouldn't even know that there's an operating system out there called "windows" ...
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827 [08:17:10] <ratrace> free_speech: :)
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829 [08:17:55] <c0rnelius> whats windows?
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831 [08:19:49] <free_speech> c0rnelius, something that you can open to let fresh air into your rooms :-)
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833 [08:20:29] <beavis> ratrace: thanks
834 [08:21:06] <c0rnelius> ;)
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845 [08:28:02] <free_speech> my wife asked me to please clean the windows, so I downloaded a GNU/Linux distribution and installed it on her PC at first place ... seemed not to be a good idea ...
846 [08:28:20] <free_speech> ( and no, I'm not married ... it's just a joke, no more, no less)
847 [08:28:31] <pclover> lmfao
848 [08:30:12] <]BFG[> what needs a good healthy clean is system(d) out of all inux distros forever
849 [08:30:23] <free_speech> *SIGN*
850 [08:30:31] <]BFG[> like that bulk amount of shit what i did in the toilet in the morning
851 [08:30:35] <]BFG[> was nice pulling it down
852 [08:30:38] <ratrace> ]BFG[: #devuan is that way tho ---> :)
853 [08:30:39] <]BFG[> that was systemd
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855 [08:32:47] <free_speech> since #devuan is installed on my laptop, I can do useful things there instead of bothering with systemd ... so my tower PC will experience the same switch ...
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857 [08:35:29] <free_speech> same for my public server ... systemd on a server is even more a sin than systemd on a workstation ...
858 [08:35:30] <c0rnelius> why are peps crying about systemd?
859 [08:35:49] <swivel> haters gotta hate
860 [08:36:02] <pclover> I've learned to accept it but personally, I think it's doing too much.
861 [08:36:09] <c0rnelius> move to an OS that doesn't use it if it's such a prob for you. prob solved.
862 [08:36:37] <c0rnelius> does it work? yes? good
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864 [08:37:00] <c0rnelius> i use systems that don't use it and all is good.
865 [08:37:06] <c0rnelius> who cares?
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867 [08:39:12] <c0rnelius> bunch of social media I wanna cry about something nonsense is all this is. go get on twitter and vent ur endless cries. no one in the real world gives any shits from what I can tell.
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869 [08:39:56] <humpled> :D
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872 [08:41:40] <swivel> vocal minority has definitely become much louder
873 [08:41:58] <c0rnelius> it's just bs
874 [08:42:18] <humpled> starting to sound like the anti-gnome3 people now
875 [08:42:31] <swivel> hey it's a whole lot easier to be part of the peanut gallery than actually go build something
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877 [08:42:46] <c0rnelius> no one is forcing anyone to use systemd
878 [08:43:28] <c0rnelius> well gnome3 does suck. but thats just my opinion and guess what? i don't use it.
879 [08:43:31] <c0rnelius> simples
880 [08:43:53] <pclover> and i use both lol
881 [08:44:34] <swivel> c0rnelius: that's not really all that relevant, there's a valid frustration when the distributions you've used for ages have embraced systemd and you're not interested but it was your preferred distribution for greater reasons
882 [08:45:06] <swivel> i don't think anyone has claimed to have a gun to their head forcing them to use systemd
883 [08:45:10] <c0rnelius> swivel: thats ur prob
884 [08:45:18] <c0rnelius> learn other distro's
885 [08:45:28] <c0rnelius> plenty out there
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887 [08:45:42] <swivel> c0rnelius: when it's their problem, they bitch, and that's what we see.
888 [08:45:51] <pclover> swivel, And that is the reason I've learned to accept it for what it is. It's mostly been ok otherwise.
889 [08:45:55] <c0rnelius> or... not care about what they embrace and give it a try and stop being bias
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891 [08:46:30] <swivel> it's not unexpected, nor is it unwarranted imho, there's some seriously legitimate complaints WRT systemd - especially when it was first embraced it was so broken
892 [08:47:04] <pclover> c0rnelius, in commercial applications it may really difficult to drop a distro that is supported.
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894 [08:47:23] <c0rnelius> i'm not a big lover of it myself, but do i hate it? and wish it was dead? nope.
895 [08:47:57] <c0rnelius> its all a use case. if i'm not liking it in this use case I use a dif distro. prob solved,
896 [08:47:58] <swivel> i worked for coreos a few years ago, and when i was hired one of the first things i was tasked with was to improve systemd-journald performance. Within a few minutes of my first attempt to measure its performance, just spamming it with od /dev/urandom | systemd-cat I was able to cause systemd-journald to segfault randomly
897 [08:48:25] <swivel> that was a production OS shipping systemd as stable
898 [08:48:56] <c0rnelius> pclover: why should a care about commercial?
899 [08:49:12] <c0rnelius> ridiculous
900 [08:49:19] <c0rnelius> I*
901 [08:50:17] <pclover> sure if your not bound and it's all personal your free to do as you wish.
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903 [08:50:32] <c0rnelius> as we all are
904 [08:50:41] <c0rnelius> and so are commercial products
905 [08:50:58] <c0rnelius> the argument is mute
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915 [08:56:47] <c0rnelius> i find it fascinating how peps found a way to make a buck off gnu/linux and yet to still love and want to complain about it and at the same time add nothing to the venture.
916 [08:57:05] <c0rnelius> cry cry cry
917 [08:57:39] <c0rnelius> ur all free to do whatever you want... the license is right there, do it!
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923 [09:02:23] <swivel> c0rnelius: i find it fascinating the utter lack of empathy you're demonstrating
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925 [09:06:03] <humpled> empathy!
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927 [09:10:28] <c0rnelius> thats because i'm not
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930 [09:12:32] <c0rnelius> if you want empathy and shoulder to cry on go to church. we are talking about linux, yes? and all the way we can run it.
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932 [09:13:24] <c0rnelius> well excuse me
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934 [09:14:13] <c0rnelius> you do have options in this case
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1005 [10:14:58] <ozfalcon> Need some help to compile xsane ie. where is the source for xsane located?
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1010 [10:17:16] <swivel> ozfalcon: `apt-get source xsane`
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1012 [10:18:36] <ozfalcon> No, That requires dep of sane (1.0.27) and I need to use sane 1.0.28 to support canoscan LiDE 400
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1015 [10:19:02] <ozfalcon> I have sane 1.0.28 compiled and installed, I just need to install xsane to talk to it.
1016 [10:19:48] <ozfalcon> The scanner is working (Using scanimage from sane).
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1018 [10:21:23] <ozfalcon> Can I install xsane with apt and ignore dependencies?
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1032 [10:29:45] <ozfalcon> I think I have found it
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1039 [10:31:54] <xormor> "r8169 0000:03:00.0: Direct firmware load for rtl_nic/rtl8168f-1.fw failed with error -2" and "r8169 0000:03:00.0: Unable to load firmware rtl_nic/rtl8168f-1.fw (-2)"
1040 [10:32:03] <xormor> from dmesg
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1044 [10:32:39] <xormor> I think I do not need the RealTek firmware, even though I might want to install it for fun.
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1067 [10:51:57] <jelly> ozfalcon: apt can't work with broken dependencies. Sometimes you can use equivs.
1068 [10:52:00] <jelly> !equivs
1069 [10:52:00] <dpkg> equivs is a package that enables you to create dummy packages that tell <apt> you really have installed (through some other means) the package. apt install equivs, and read /usr/share/doc/equivs/*, see also <usrlocal>. A better plan is often to adapt the Debian packages to your needs, ask me about <package recompile> <uupdate> <ssb>.
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1071 [10:54:37] <ozfalcon> jelly, I downloaded the xsane & xsane-common packges & used dpkg --force-depends as a workaround for now.
1072 [10:55:44] <swivel> you can also just crack open the .deb files and update their metadata to depend on the version you have, if they otherwise work OK with what you have (as implied by --force-depends), and put the .deb back together and install w/tweaked metadata.
1073 [10:56:22] <swivel> or I imagine you can just do it in the apt metadata under /var too
1074 [10:56:50] <ozfalcon> swivel, Problem is I have installed sane from source - So it has no package version as such.
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1076 [10:57:55] <ozfalcon> Currently xsane IS working with compiled sane and the scanner is detected ok.
1077 [10:59:00] <swivel> oh, if I were in your shoes i probably would have let xsane install with all its dependencies, and stick the built from source sane in /usr/local, that should take precedence and everything would look happy
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1079 [10:59:53] <jelly> ozfalcon: that breaks any further usage of apt
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1081 [11:01:05] <ozfalcon> swivel, Sane compile notes says: Please check that there aren't any older versions of SANE installed on your
1082 [11:01:06] <ozfalcon> system. Especially if SANE libraries are installed in a different prefix
1083 [11:01:06] <ozfalcon> directory (e.g. /usr/lib/) this may cause problems with external
1084 [11:01:06] <ozfalcon> frontends.
1085 [11:01:22] <jelly> and if you choose to repack changing the control file (dependencies) as swivel suggests, you'll have to put the packages on hold
1086 [11:01:58] <ozfalcon> Which it did. I initially just installed the compiled sane and xsane still picked up the old version.
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1089 [11:02:43] <jelly> safest thing to do would likely be making a proper local backport
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1092 [11:03:02] <ozfalcon> Not sure how to do that
1093 [11:03:26] <jelly> ozfalcon: which version of sane do you need?
1094 [11:03:43] <jelly> ,v save
1095 [11:03:44] <judd> No package named 'save' was found in amd64.
1096 [11:03:45] <jelly> ,v sane
1097 [11:03:46] <judd> Package: sane on amd64 -- jessie: 1.0.14-9; stretch: 1.0.14-12; buster: 1.0.14-13+b1; bullseye: 1.0.14-15; sid: 1.0.14-15
1098 [11:04:06] <jelly> huh, there's no 1.0.28 at all, yet
1099 [11:04:23] <ozfalcon> Need sane 1.0.28. (sane-backends)
1100 [11:04:30] <jelly> ,v sane-backends
1101 [11:04:31] <judd> No package named 'sane-backends' was found in amd64.
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1103 [11:04:49] <ozfalcon> replaced-url
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1105 [11:05:04] <jelly> ,v libsane-extras
1106 [11:05:05] <judd> Package: libsane-extras on amd64 -- jessie: 1.0.22.3; stretch: 1.0.22.4
1107 [11:05:19] <jelly> ,v libsane
1108 [11:05:20] <judd> Package: libsane on amd64 -- jessie: 1.0.24-8+deb8u2; stretch: 1.0.25-4.1; bullseye: 1.0.27-3.2; buster: 1.0.27-3.2; sid: 1.0.27-3.2
1109 [11:05:54] <ozfalcon> Yes, Sorry it's libsane
1110 [11:06:15] <jelly> ah. You'd have to try update the packaging for source package sane-backends from 1.0.27 to 1.0.28, and the try to build the debs
1111 [11:06:23] <jelly> !simple sid backport
1112 [11:06:23] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
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1114 [11:07:42] <jelly> instead of step 4) as is, you'd do just "apt source sane-backends", you'd download the newer tarball, then use "uupdate"
1115 [11:07:46] <jelly> !uupdate
1116 [11:07:46] <dpkg> uupdate (in the <devscripts> package) upgrades a source code package from an upstream revision, or e.g. if the newest foo in debian is 1.2, and upstream is at 1.4: apt-get source foo; wget -nd replaced-url
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1119 [11:09:03] <ozfalcon> I'm lost
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1122 [11:10:19] <jelly> the end result would be .deb packages with 1.0.28
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1127 [11:11:35] <jelly> which works better with apt than the same thing compiled and installed, but not packaged
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1130 [11:14:26] <ozfalcon> Yes it would indeed, But I'm still unsure what exactly to do.
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1136 [11:16:25] <jelly> ozfalcon: basically: enable deb-src repo for sid (unstable). Do an apt-get update. make and cd a directory you're going to do building in. Do an apt-get source sane-backends. Put the 1.0.28 source tarball in the same directory.
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1138 [11:16:50] <irssi3> RMS is gone?
1139 [11:17:10] <zamuro> !offtopic
1140 [11:17:10] <dpkg> #debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
1141 [11:17:19] <jelly> irssi3: that's not a Debian specific question, this is a tech support channel for a distro.
1142 [11:17:26] <irssi3> jelly: FUCK you
1143 [11:17:32] <irssi3> you have no respect for RMS?
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1148 [11:17:37] <zamuro> !offtopic
1149 [11:17:37] <dpkg> #debian is primarily a support channel for Debian users. Please keep the discussions in #debian on-topic and take longer discussions and non-support questions to #debian-offtopic. Imagine the chaos if each of the hundreds of people in the channel felt the need to wander off topic for a few minutes every day.
1150 [11:17:46] <jelly> zamuro: no need to repeat
1151 [11:18:10] <zamuro> I know. But he/she/it didn't
1152 [11:18:45] <ozfalcon> jelly. Shouldn't I do deb-src for buster (Showing same ver of libsane as sid) as I'm using buster.
1153 [11:18:50] <jelly> zamuro: and they wouldn't, and repeating would not help.
1154 [11:18:54] <jelly> ozfalcon: no.
1155 [11:19:51] <jelly> ozfalcon: the idea is to pick very latest source package scaffolding that is closer to your even newer upstream version
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1161 [11:26:33] <jelly> ozfalcon: running uupdate in the older source tree, should result in it transplanting the packaging bits to a newer 1.0.28 tree, and then you can try building packages from that using for example: dpkg-buildpackage -b -uc -us
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1164 [11:28:42] <ozfalcon> Ok, You will need to help me - I still don't quite understand what I'm doing. I have apt-get source sane-backend from sid sources. It has some tar files and .dsc file and directory now.
1165 [11:30:39] <ozfalcon> (I have just uninstalled source compiled version ready for build/install newer deb version)
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1168 [11:33:04] <ozfalcon> The new source folder is "sane-backends-1.0.28-511-gb6eef086" Should I put that in the same folder as the sid source sane-backends?
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1179 [11:38:21] <jelly> ozfalcon: no, you need to put the new source _tar file_ in parent of sid source.
1180 [11:38:58] <jelly> if you do not have a tar file but got the source using eg. git clone, you'll have to make it
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1182 [11:42:19] <ozfalcon> Ok, I have the tar file. I'll copy that to parent dir of sid source.
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1185 [11:42:40] <tdn> How viable is it to run ZFS in Debian 10? And if ZFS is not well supported or easy to use, then what other alternative options do I have in Debian if I want to ensure the integrity of my stored data? (protect agains data rot basically)
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1187 [11:42:45] <ozfalcon> Basically I'll have to tar files in there the 1.0.27 and the new 1.0.28
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1191 [11:43:50] <jelly> no
1192 [11:44:15] <jelly> ozfalcon: where/how precisely did you get the new source from?
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1194 [11:45:08] <jelly> tdn: judging by the traffic here, it seems a decent number of people use ZFSonLinux on Debian
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1198 [11:45:39] <snooky> moin
1199 [11:46:58] <ozfalcon> jelly, From here: replaced-url
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1201 [11:47:37] <tdn> jelly, ok
1202 [11:47:59] <tdn> jelly, and there are not other real alternatives, right?
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1206 [11:49:16] <ozfalcon> jelly, sane-backends-1.0.28-511-gb6eef086.tar.gz
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1208 [11:50:05] <jelly> good
1209 [11:50:40] <jelly> tdn: maybe there are but I don't know, have never used zfs in real life
1210 [11:51:01] <jelly> ozfalcon: good.
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1212 [11:51:23] <ozfalcon> jelly, there is a specific 1.0.28 branch instead of Master should I use that?
1213 [11:51:52] <jelly> ozfalcon: if 1.0.28 is good enough for your needs, sure
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1216 [11:52:30] <ozfalcon> Yeah, I'll use the 1.0.28 branch just to keep things clean.
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1222 [11:54:16] <ozfalcon> Ok I have dropped the "sane-backends-1.0.28.tar.gz" file in my "update" folder where I downloaded the sid source.
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1226 [11:55:00] <ozfalcon> ie. it is sitting next to the "/update/sane-backends_1.0.27.orig.tar.gz" file
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1229 [11:57:27] <ozfalcon> (I might actually learn something if this is successfull)
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1233 [12:01:01] <ozfalcon> jelly, I know I shouldn't paste folder contents in irc, But it's only 5 lines. Should I post it so you can see what's in there sofar?
1234 [12:02:02] <jelly> !pastebin
1235 [12:02:02] <dpkg> Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: replaced-url
1236 [12:02:54] <jelly> ozfalcon: that's good so far, so now you "cd sane-backends-1.0.27" and run "uupdate ../sane-backends-1.0.28.tar.gz"
1237 [12:03:03] <ozfalcon> replaced-url
1238 [12:03:13] <tdn> jelly, what do you use? ext4?
1239 [12:03:50] <jelly> tdn: ext4 on main filesystems and for backup storage, yes
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1243 [12:04:57] <ozfalcon> need to install uupdate command, What package is that in?
1244 [12:05:03] <jelly> devscripts
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1249 [12:06:33] <tdn> jelly, ok. Me too. But I keep worrying about bit rot.
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1252 [12:06:42] <no_gravity> Hello! I need to convert a few hundred images to jpg while also resizing them to a max-width. What's a good tool for it? "convert" from the debian repos?
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1256 [12:07:55] <ozfalcon> jelly, ok that seemed to work ok. replaced-url
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1260 [12:10:13] <ozfalcon> update folder now looks like this: replaced-url
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1281 [12:17:53] <trucy> no_gravity: yup, convert looks like it'd fit your needs
1282 [12:18:16] <trucy> replaced-url
1283 [12:19:12] <no_gravity> trucy: Ok.. will install convert and see if I can cook up a set of parameters that does it all.
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1291 [12:22:57] <ozfalcon> jelly, Would "dpkg-buildpackage -b -uc -us sane-backends-1.0.28" be next?
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1293 [12:23:49] <ozfalcon> (No, that didn't work)
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1318 [12:32:31] <jelly> ozfalcon: no, just cd into the new directory and "dpkg-buildpackage -b -uc -us"
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1333 [12:38:45] <ozfalcon> ok
1334 [12:38:46] <ozfalcon> jelly, That failed miserably
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1338 [12:42:28] <jelly> ozfalcon: can you pastebin the output?
1339 [12:42:30] <ozfalcon> replaced-url
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1343 [12:45:10] <jelly> ozfalcon: okay, if it were me I'd probably try to update those debian/patches/0710-sane-desc.c_debian_mods.patch that failed, but it might be too much work for you. Use equivs then.
1344 [12:45:39] <jelly> ozfalcon: which dependencies are missing for xsane?
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1348 [12:48:17] <ozfalcon> I think it's just libsane & sane-utils
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1353 [12:49:37] <jelly> then make fake packages for those two with equivs tool and install them
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1357 [12:50:17] <jelly> and put them on hold
1358 [12:50:20] <jelly> !hold
1359 [12:50:20] <dpkg> hold is a status flag that tells the package manager to not automatically upgrade a package. To hold a package 'echo $package hold|dpkg --set-selections' or 'aptitude hold $package'. Note that prior to <stretch> "aptitude hold" is ignored by other package managers and aptitude won't necessarily use holds set with dpkg; see Debian bug #137771. See also <hold list>, <unhold>.
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1367 [12:53:36] <ozfalcon> looks like it might only be libsane for the dependency, not sane-utils
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1372 [12:57:12] <jelly> so make a fake libsane package with version, say, 1.0.28-0~0.ozfalcon.1
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1374 [13:00:53] <jelly> ozfalcon: use eg. "equivs-control libsane.control" to create a template control file, fill just enough of it to match package name and version, like here: replaced-url
1375 [13:00:53] <ozfalcon> ok, So I have created a default control file "equivs-control libsane" and changing some defaults now.
1376 [13:02:06] <ozfalcon> Should I leave the "Standards-Version: 3.9.2" as is?
1377 [13:02:12] <jelly> yes
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1380 [13:03:16] <Eightynine> Please, replace Firefox with Chromium. I have no idea why they put that garbage (Firefox) in every distribution. It's ancient crap and deserves dying and being forgotten. Never worked properly, bad architecture.
1381 [13:03:54] <jelly> Eightynine: both Chromium and Firefox (ESR) are available in debian
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1384 [13:05:16] <Eightynine> I know, but Firefox ESR is default. replaced-url
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1387 [13:06:28] <themill> Eightynine: the default is the package that you choose to install.
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1389 [13:07:11] <themill> (also, firefox-esr gets better security support than chromium)
1390 [13:07:11] <jelly> Eightynine: distro defaults of what ships with a specific Desktop Environment do not get changed because of a single bug report in upstream
1391 [13:07:59] <Eightynine> themill But when I installed Debian it came with Firefox ESR. Isn't it default? Sorry for being angry but that issue is really annoying.
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1394 [13:08:38] <jelly> Eightynine: annoying for _you_ is not reason enough to change defaults for everyone who installs Debian (with Gnome, presumable)
1395 [13:08:58] <ozfalcon> jelly, ok, Got that created.
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1397 [13:09:17] <jelly> ,depends task-desktop
1398 [13:09:18] <judd> Package task-desktop in buster/amd64 -- depends: tasksel (= 3.53), xorg, xserver-xorg-video-all, xserver-xorg-input-all, desktop-base.
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1400 [13:09:29] <jelly> ,recommends task-desktop
1401 [13:09:31] <judd> Package task-desktop in buster/amd64 -- recommends: task-gnome-desktop | task-xfce-desktop | task-kde-desktop | task-lxde-desktop | task-cinnamon-desktop | task-mate-desktop | task-lxqt-desktop, xdg-utils, avahi-daemon, libnss-mdns, anacron, eject, iw, alsa-utils, libu2f-udev, sudo, firefox | firefox-esr.
1402 [13:09:33] <ozfalcon> Will cleanup and install it then xsane.
1403 [13:09:36] <jelly> there it is
1404 [13:09:51] <Eightynine> jelly Thanks for clarification. I didn't knew it depends on desktop.
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1408 [13:10:57] <Eightynine> Is there anyone who tried Vivaldi? I tried it not long ago, it lacks performance. Works better in Windows on the same PC.
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1411 [13:11:37] <jelly> it also lacks a serious security team AFAIR
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1416 [13:12:56] <JyZyXEL> mozilla supposedly has a debian team, but their front page still claims Stretch to be the stable :P
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1418 [13:13:53] <ozfalcon> Looks like it does need sane-utils. I'll just create another dummy package.
1419 [13:13:56] * jelly had been using Opera for a loong while but never felt a pressing need to try Vivaldi when Firefox ESR + NoScript works well enough
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1421 [13:14:24] <Eightynine> JyZyXEL And yet they don't have deb package, only tar archive or something like that? What idiots. Chrome, Opera and Vivaldi have both deb and rpm packages.
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1424 [13:15:19] <jelly> ozfalcon: you can use "apt-get -s -f install" to see if apt thinks you have a consistent state or something is missing/extra
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1426 [13:16:52] <jelly> Eightynine: mozilla's firefox builds, including esr, have its own update system that Just Works _if_ you've unpacked the thing as the same user that is running it
1427 [13:16:53] <JyZyXEL> Eightynine: they have 60.9 for buster and 68/69 for sid
1428 [13:17:46] <jelly> but there's probably little reason to go with mozilla's build instead of debian's if you want esr
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1432 [13:18:44] <ozfalcon> ok
1433 [13:19:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1529
1434 [13:19:15] <Eightynine> jelly No, to be honest I don't care ESR or not if that works properly (which in my case is not truth).
1435 [13:19:16] <dgriffi> Why is the preseed line of "d-i preseed/late_command string apt-get install -y sysvinit-core" no longer working to create an install that doesn't use systemd?
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1439 [13:21:01] <jelly> dgriffi: do you also install a desktop environment task at the same time?
1440 [13:21:18] <dgriffi> mate
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1442 [13:22:04] <ozfalcon> jelly, do I need to hold the packages if it's a higher version to what might be updated anyway?
1443 [13:22:14] <dgriffi> and I tried to take a freshly installed system (using systemd) and did "apt-get install sysvinit-core" and it wiped out pretty much everything, including networking.
1444 [13:22:31] <themill> Eightynine: feel free to install whatever browser you want. If you're doing less than 20 installations, the defaults don't matter to you as you just install the package you want. If you're doing more than that then you have a configuration management system doing it for you and the defaults still don't matter.
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1446 [13:23:00] <ozfalcon> jelly, Also xsane installed happily with the fake packages.
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1448 [13:24:24] <jelly> dgriffi: task-mate-desktop depends on... mate-settings-daemon depends on... policykit-1 and then -> libpam-systemd -> systemd-sysv which can't be installed together with sysvinit-core
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1450 [13:24:43] <dgriffi> jelly: wasn't there a shim to take care of that?
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1452 [13:25:44] <dgriffi> I'm intent on getting rid of systemd now because with the release of Buster, systemd has been a constant source of freeze-ups and panics
1453 [13:26:07] <jelly> dgriffi: I _think_ shim is for logind dependencies, not pam_systemd
1454 [13:26:29] <dgriffi> why wasn't care taken with the mate packages to avoid this problem?
1455 [13:26:33] <jelly> dgriffi: there's a libpam-elogind-compat for that, but not in buster, so far only in experimental
1456 [13:26:50] <jelly> dgriffi: because it's a lot of work?
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1458 [13:27:24] <dgriffi> jelly: it's less work to do something right the first time round.
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1462 [13:28:08] <jelly> dgriffi: the right thing would have delayed buster for 6+ months
1463 [13:28:31] <dgriffi> jelly: and?
1464 [13:29:26] <Eightynine> Which player is better in yout opinion, VLC or Gnome MPV? By "better" I mean supports more formats, works faster and (if possible) supports graphics acceleration.
1465 [13:29:27] <jelly> dgriffi: you can join the init team and volunteer there to make things better in time for bullseye
1466 [13:29:52] <dgriffi> jelly: how would one do this?
1467 [13:29:57] <jelly> Init Diversity Team*
1468 [13:31:21] <dgriffi> jelly: this? replaced-url
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1470 [13:32:48] <jelly> that's their mailing list, right
1471 [13:33:38] <dgriffi> okay
1472 [13:33:55] <jelly> Eightynine: vlc and mpv are comparable. I don't know what Gnome MPV is, probably a frontend
1473 [13:34:34] <jelly> vlc sometimes guesses which acceleration options exists better. mpv sometimes needs to be told.
1474 [13:34:57] <jelly> vlc also works better with some streaming options
1475 [13:35:08] <jelly> mpv needs youtube-dl installed
1476 [13:35:36] <jelly> however vlc crashed more for me and ate more resources
1477 [13:35:49] <Eightynine> jelly Yes, you're right. Gnome MPV is GUI (used in Gnome of course). They later renamed it in Celluloid but Debian still uses old one.
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1479 [13:36:14] <jelly> Eightynine: I usually just run mpv from command line.
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1481 [13:37:55] <Eightynine> jelly I would like to have GUI, maybe I should switch to mpv and something for YouTube? There's some stuttering when watching YouTube in VLC.
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1485 [13:38:41] <jelly> dgriffi: sadly there seems to be a lot of the non-technical issues around that, replaced-url
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1494 [13:40:41] <ozfalcon> jelly, Thanks for you help.
1495 [13:41:06] <Sabandija> Hi all, some can help me?? i-m looking for a guide to transfer files of a PC with linux to a PC with win10 and vice versa in my local net, using the terminal
1496 [13:41:10] <Sabandija> thanks in advance
1497 [13:41:29] <ozfalcon> jelly, xsane currently not working now. But I'll get it going (Had it working before).
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1503 [13:45:24] <jelly> Eightynine: mpv can work but you need to keep youtube-dl up-to-date, and that often means "newer than what's in debian"
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1508 [13:46:14] <jelly> Sabandija: if you install openssh-server on your linux you can use WinSCP or Filezilla to access files on linux over "sftp"
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1511 [13:46:44] <Eightynine> jelly Is that possible on Debian? Maybe I can update it from snap/flatpak?
1512 [13:46:54] <Sabandija> Thanks jelly
1513 [13:46:58] <EdePopede> tip: the download link redirects to the actual file, which has the version in its name. with curl, grep and a little bit of bash magick it's a oneliner to compare it to the installed version and download the new version if needed
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1515 [13:47:41] <EdePopede> Eightynine --^
1516 [13:48:13] <jelly> Eightynine: upstream has a custom self-update method that's supposed to be really easy. I just make packages from newer sources, or steal binary debs from sid.
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1520 [13:48:53] <jelly> ,v youtube-dl
1521 [13:48:54] <judd> Package: youtube-dl on amd64 -- stretch: 2017.05.18.1-1; stretch-backports: 2019.01.17-1.1~bpo9+1; bullseye: 2019.01.17-1.1; buster: 2019.01.17-1.1; sid: 2019.09.01-1; bullseye-multimedia: 2019.09.12.1-dmo1; buster-multimedia: 2019.09.12.1-dmo1; sid-multimedia: 2019.09.28-dmo1
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1530 [13:49:55] <EdePopede> upstream: 2019.09.28, so sid-multimedia is up to date (after just 1 day)
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1533 [13:50:25] * jelly avoids dmm
1534 [13:50:37] <EdePopede> "multimedia"? i don't suppose they have something to do with the mm repos we shouldn't use?
1535 [13:50:46] <EdePopede> or do they?
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1539 [13:52:03] <jelly> EdePopede: those ARE them dmm repos yes
1540 [13:52:15] <EdePopede> ok, so <buster multimedia> is an alias for <dmm>
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1545 [13:55:20] <Unit193> Amusing that one shouldn't use them, yet judd fetches package info for them.
1546 [13:56:34] <jelly> USE AT YOUR OWN RISK
1547 [13:56:39] <jelly> etc
1548 [13:56:58] <Logg> it just breaks so quick I don't know why they bother packaging it for debian
1549 [13:57:04] <Logg> just install with pip
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1552 [13:57:21] <jelly> blasphemy!
1553 [13:57:25] <Logg> :)
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1555 [13:57:41] <EdePopede> why pip?
1556 [13:57:47] <Logg> pip repo stays up to date faster.
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1558 [13:57:51] <jelly> it's python
1559 [13:58:02] <EdePopede> it's a bloody tgz with s single packaged python binary
1560 [13:58:34] <jelly> that's just one deliverable
1561 [13:58:37] * d3sync brings wood for the stake
1562 [13:58:39] <user99> when my system went into suspend mode came back and went to log in...have a light on the keybd but no response to any input...mouse worked fine...but cannot login because no keybd...had to reboot...looking for event logs...tried deebug .1 no luck...nothing in kernel. where should i look...messages?
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1565 [13:59:06] <EdePopede> as long as pip doesn't keep hands off apt land it is considered a hostile intruder
1566 [13:59:37] <jelly> user99: is the keyboard built in or could you unplug and plug it back in if it happened again?
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1568 [14:00:05] <jelly> EdePopede: pip can be used as user
1569 [14:00:09] <user99> jelly could plug/unplug
1570 [14:00:10] <Unit193> While likely about equal to using dmm, I just maintain ytdl in my own apt repo, tends to work well. The watchfile is pretty much setup to do everything automatically.
1571 [14:00:13] <user99> didn't
1572 [14:00:25] <user99> had a light will try if/when
1573 [14:00:41] <EdePopede> jelly: i only don't like putting such things into $HOME, /usr/local is me favorite
1574 [14:00:55] <EdePopede> if it can use this as default prefix, ok
1575 [14:01:05] <user99> pip? is?
1576 [14:01:25] <EdePopede> python installer stuff
1577 [14:01:34] <user99> k
1578 [14:03:15] <MonkeyWrench84> Remote system with likely HDD failure - getting "Input Output" errors when running many commands including SUDO. Root file system has switched to read only. I can view some of the root file system via sftp but not /usr/bin or /sbin. A working NFS share is still mounted and working. If I copy the SUDO files/directory from a working system to the already mounted NFS share can I run SUDO from there?
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1582 [14:04:28] <user99> Rs780 working with buster(10.1) now and no more filesystem crap....after installing the fw blobs wvwn have decent res for display
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1584 [14:04:47] <user99> s/even
1585 [14:04:56] <Logg> MonkeyWrench84, sure, why not. I'd try it. `/mnt/nfsShare/bin/myBin $1`
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1593 [14:10:25] <nb-ben> hi, I have a chroot environment, and I'd like to hide some devices from it from /dev
1594 [14:10:28] <nb-ben> what are my options?
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1597 [14:12:06] <user99> Sep 24 16:27:10 debian kernel: [ 6.742685] random: 7 urandom warning(s) missed due to ratelimiting
1598 [14:12:06] <user99> Sep 24 16:59:27 debian kernel: [ 7.088583] random: 7 urandom warning(s) missed due to ratelimiting
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1603 [14:13:13] <user99> nb-ben seems counter to what I would expect...seems like you should have to grant access
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1608 [14:16:44] <nb-ben> user99: what do you mean?
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1613 [14:18:17] <MonkeyWrench84> Logg, I have copied sudo from /usr/bin to /nfsshare/temp/bin and /usr/lib/sudo directory to /nfsshare/temp/sudo . When i run sudo from temp/bin it errors on finding libsudo_util.so.0 Is there a way to point at new temp/sudo directory?
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1615 [14:19:33] <Logg> gg. idk, if you can do what you want to do from a chroot, that would be clean. I know there _is_ a way to link to the library without the root filesystem but it's some environmental variable shenanigan...
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1619 [14:21:59] <MonkeyWrench84> hmm, I will see what I can find. Don't suppose there is something I'm missing ref a way to run shutdown or reboot or even sysrq for REISUB as root without being able to run SU or SUDO?
1620 [14:22:32] <Logg> LDFLAGS="-L$HOME/local/lib" CFLAGS="-I$HOME/local/include" ./configure --prefix=$HOME
1621 [14:22:45] <Logg> that's what I had to do on a vps without root access, i built it that way
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1623 [14:24:11] <Logg> If you reboot, you're gonna lose the system entirely probably. last time I had a problem like that, it was fsck required, and I think the hdd died shortly after.
1624 [14:24:48] <Logg> Time to get in the car and be prepared to restore from backup on a new hdd imo
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1627 [14:26:18] <MonkeyWrench84> Yes, I have backups of everything I need thankfully, I'm just keen to try a reboot on the off chance that it's not actual hardware failure....
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1629 [14:28:53] <Logg> Can you maybe switch to a different tty and just log in as root?
1630 [14:29:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1535
1631 [14:29:03] <Logg> or like ssh in as root?
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1633 [14:31:49] <MonkeyWrench84> with chvt #? nope, input/output error
1634 [14:32:03] <MonkeyWrench84> can't ssh in with root either
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1666 [14:47:49] <user99> nb-ben I meant seems like that would be in the scripts that created the chroot. That a chroot would not have access to much of anything on start.
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1681 [14:58:36] <user99> buster seems pretty stable. gnome on wayland is working here pretty snappy on low grade hardware...nice work guys
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1684 [15:00:37] <user99> 10.1 far better than 10.0 eh? :)
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1696 [15:11:45] * user99 cat /var/log/messages | grep error > ~/error --> replaced-url
1697 [15:12:09] <user99> client bug help? what's that about?
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1706 [15:22:55] <user99> Sep 25 11:10:27 debian gsd-power[933]: Error setting property 'PowerSaveMode' on interface org.gnome.Mutter.DisplayConfig: Timeout was reached (g-io-error-quark, 24)
1707 [15:22:55] <user99> Sep 25 11:10:27 debian gsd-power[933]: Error setting property 'PowerSaveMode' on interface org.gnome.Mutter.DisplayConfig: Timeout was reached (g-io-error-quark, 24)
1708 [15:24:14] <jelly> sounds like some desktop enviroment overly verbose stderr
1709 [15:25:19] <jelly> if things work ignore it. There may be a way to somehow tell journald/rsyslog not to pollute /var/log/messages with that stuff
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1715 [15:30:05] <user99> well...I may actually do that at some point...otoh I am having issues resuming from standby so I ran the reportbug tool.
1716 [15:30:17] <user99> -> @jelly\
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1718 [15:30:56] <user99> that was non intuitive. no idea what it did (reportbug)
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1735 [15:46:06] <user99> omg what a mess...hth u peeps track bugs is crazy
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1737 [15:46:57] <user99> can't tell what's new...hasn't been looked at and replying to a bug is counter intuitive
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1755 [15:51:51] <jelly> user99: ah. I'd say ignore any entries "gnome" searching for the cause
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1759 [15:56:29] <user99> I'll turn suspend off for now and see what happens.
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1761 [15:57:33] <jsubl2> cant seem to find kdm package. any help
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1763 [15:57:49] <humpled> think it's sddm now jsubl2
1764 [15:57:57] <jsubl2> tx humpled
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1774 [16:02:54] <amosbird> hi, which dh command writes to DEBIAN/conffiles?
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1809 [16:32:51] <jsubl2> bought a laptop with a solid state drive. to make the drive last would it be best to keep most files on network drive
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1819 [16:37:35] <no_gravity> Is there a way to do what "nc -l 80" does but without nc?
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1830 [16:43:24] <toruvinn> no_gravity, well if you're in bash you could use /dev/tcp
1831 [16:43:32] <toruvinn> but why no netcat?
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1834 [16:44:15] <no_gravity> toruvinn: Well, then I would not have to install netcat.
1835 [16:44:32] <no_gravity> But ok, I'll install it.
1836 [16:45:47] <no_gravity> Now I see that when I run Docker with "-p 80:80" and then send a request on my host machine to 127.0.0.1, it arrives inside docker from the IP 172.17.0.1. Is it possible to make it come from 127.0.0.1?
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1851 [16:50:39] <xormor> how do I use Bluetooth in my Debian buster stable 10.1? I installed firmware-realtek and noticed that sudo dmesg reported that Bluetooth should be ready to use.
1852 [16:50:53] <xormor> I have the GNOME on Xorg desktop environment.
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1857 [16:53:32] <toruvinn> no_gravity, netcat is tiny, tbh.
1858 [16:53:34] <toruvinn> and very useful
1859 [16:53:41] <no_gravity> Yeah. I installed it now.
1860 [16:54:19] <toruvinn> no_gravity, you can also look at socat (a lot of features, but i find it not too userfriendly) and cryptcat, but those are gonna be larger ;-)
1861 [16:54:46] <toruvinn> i think you could also open connections and listen port with openssl, but im not sure if you can do so without any encryption
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1864 [16:56:35] <user99> dpkg not responding to /msg
1865 [16:56:35] <dpkg> user99: I give up, what is it?
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1867 [16:57:11] <user99> dpkg, apt suite changed
1868 [16:57:12] <dpkg> If you were already using Debian 10 "Buster" prior to it being released as stable, or you use 'testing' in your sources.list, apt-get will complain about changes to the release information on the mirror. apt(8) will prompt you to accept changes; apt-get(8) will need --allow-releaseinfo-change
1869 [16:57:19] <no_gravity> My issue at hand: I have a web application inside docker that works different when used locally. So to test the local access, I would like the requests to come from 127.0.0.1
1870 [16:57:29] <no_gravity> Which is probably not easy to accomplish.
1871 [16:57:33] <no_gravity> Maybe a solution would be to change the default "Docker Network Bridge" to something like 127.0.0.2 and then teach the application running inside docker to treat that IP as local too.
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1876 [17:00:50] <toruvinn> no_gravity, if you have bash you can use /dev/tcp i believe. if this is a one-off.
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1878 [17:01:37] <no_gravity> toruvinn: I used nc now. All is fine :)
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1891 [17:07:02] <jackal> hello, why lsb_release -d returns 'Description: Debian GNU/Linux bullseye/sid'?
1892 [17:07:27] <themill> !why bullseye/sid
1893 [17:07:27] <dpkg> Debian doesn't distinguish if a system runs testing or unstable. "buster/sid" means a system is either tracking testing or unstable (or a mix). If you want the list of releases your system really tracks, ask me about <tracked suites>. Also ask about <list repositories>, <not available>. See also /usr/share/doc/base-files/FAQ ("Questions about /etc/issue and /etc/debian_version").
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1904 [17:11:02] <debish> Hi guys, just a quick question, what happened to dpkg-reconfigure in debian testing? Was it replaced by a different command? Thanks!
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1906 [17:11:23] <user99> what command runs the packaging tutorial?
1907 [17:11:26] <jackal> debish, im using testing and it works
1908 [17:11:55] <jackal> themill, thanks
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1912 [17:15:24] <cyboman33> How can i change de screen resolution in Wayland Debian Buster?
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1926 [17:26:17] <user99> cyboman33, right click desktop background > display settings> resolution ...for me anyway
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1929 [17:28:22] <cyboman33> user99: I tried it, but i can't change it. Should i use xandr?
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1941 [17:36:31] <debish> Well, in my case the command does not even show in the terminal... No idea why
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1943 [17:39:50] <LtL> debish: xrandr is in the x11-xserver-utils package.
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1946 [17:40:43] <debish> Sorry for the misunderstanding LtL, I was referring to a previous conversation with jackal, who already left the channel
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1948 [17:40:55] <debish> Nothing to do with xrandr
1949 [17:41:34] <LtL> debish: oh, okay my mistake.
1950 [17:41:35] <debish> For some reason dpkg-reconfigure command dissapeared from my terminal when I upgraded to testing
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1952 [17:42:26] <humpled> disappeared?
1953 [17:42:35] <LtL> ,v dpkg-reconfigure
1954 [17:42:36] <judd> No package named 'dpkg-reconfigure' was found in amd64.
1955 [17:42:44] <humpled> you mean it responds: command not found?
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1957 [17:43:31] <humpled> dpkg-reconfigure is in /usr/sbin and will only be in your path if you import settings properly when becoming root
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1960 [17:45:07] <LtL> yeah, it's gotta be there.
1961 [17:45:48] <LtL> or debconf is gone, which can't be.
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1967 [17:48:12] <Ajizu> LtL: my be can you use tasksel to install what you need ?
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1971 [17:49:12] <LtL> Ajizu: I don't need anything :)
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1976 [17:51:04] <Ajizu> LtL: I made a mistake Lol!!!
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1984 [17:52:13] <LtL> Ajizu: no worries :)
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1987 [17:52:49] <Ajizu> LtL: I think you were down with your system!
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1992 [17:54:51] <LtL> Ajizu: i am 'down with my system' but my system is not down /euphemism :)
1993 [17:56:08] <Ajizu> LtL: Oo
1994 [17:56:11] <cyboman33> Hehe ;-)
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1996 [17:57:02] <Ajizu> Yeah that cool!!! Good stat of spirit!!!
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2013 [18:07:25] <LtL> that what a stupid version command to ask the bot when reconfigure is a sub-command of dpkg, more coffee, more cowbell.
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2022 [18:11:14] <ortzi> Hello.
2023 [18:11:24] <ortzi> I installed 1h ago Debian 10.1 in my laptop.
2024 [18:11:35] <ortzi> I have some problems...
2025 [18:12:07] <ortzi> root@debian-AspireVN7:~# deluser
2026 [18:12:07] <ortzi> bash: deluser: command not found
2027 [18:12:07] <ortzi> root@debian-AspireVN7:~# userdel
2028 [18:12:07] <ortzi> bash: userdel: command not found
2029 [18:12:07] <ortzi> root@debian-AspireVN7:~# whoami
2030 [18:12:08] *** ortzi was kicked by debhelper (flood)
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2032 [18:12:16] <ortzi> Sorry.
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2034 [18:12:42] <ortzi> bash: deluser: command not found, also bash: userdel: command not found and whoami tells me that I am root
2035 [18:12:58] <ortzi> I just installed and configured WIFI, no more...
2036 [18:13:30] <LtL> ortzi: become root with 'su -' or your $PATH won't be set properly.
2037 [18:13:55] <ortzi> Thanks
2038 [18:14:12] <LtL> ortzi: you're welcome.
2039 [18:14:15] <ortzi> That is new, what is the reason for that?
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2042 [18:14:58] <mtn> replaced-url
2043 [18:15:05] <LtL> ortzi: it is new, but most of us have been doing it that way for years, now it is mandatory.
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2047 [18:16:28] <LtL> ortzi: adduser and deluser are better, although both work.
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2050 [18:17:26] <ortzi> LtL, I have a laptop with nvidia 840m & intel card, if at the moment I dont want to use nvidia propietary drivers, will be better intel driver with nvidia than noveau for nvidia?
2051 [18:18:45] <ortzi> Yes, now $PATH is ok and it is working perfect. Nothing was working I was worried xD
2052 [18:18:48] *** Quits: m0u (~m0u@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
2053 [18:18:52] <LtL> ortzi: i have nvidia/intel on my laptop and i use intel, probably nouveau but i'm not on the laptop at the moment.
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2055 [18:19:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1554
2056 [18:19:44] *** Parts: vincitt (be73208f@replaced-ip ) ()
2057 [18:19:49] <ortzi> LtL, there is vulkan for intel, maybe I should use it
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2060 [18:20:07] <ortzi> It is using noveau by default
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2063 [18:20:47] <CarlFK> why does this give me 2 dhcp IPs? ( 192...118 and .119 ) replaced-url
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2065 [18:21:09] <LtL> ortzi: if what you are using works, i would stay with it.
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2067 [18:21:58] <fryguy> CarlFK: what do you want lines 39/40 to do?
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2069 [18:22:39] <ortzi> One last question LtL, should I configure sudo? is it more secure?
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2071 [18:23:44] <CarlFK> fryguy: get an IP for ... oh look, same thing as line 30
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2073 [18:23:52] <whislock> CarlFK: You're getting exactly what you're asking for.
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2075 [18:24:31] <LtL> ortzi: i use sudo, but that is a personal preference, i typically become root when needed. as for security that's debatable
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2077 [18:24:52] <whislock> By default configuration, no, there's no appreciable difference.
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2079 [18:25:08] <zmitya> hi all
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2081 [18:25:22] <zmitya> could you guys please give me a doc how to setup the geoip module for iptables on Buster ?
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2110 [18:39:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1562
2111 [18:39:25] <ortzi> I need libjpeg8 for Lightworks video editor...
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2113 [18:39:33] <ortzi> I dont want to return to Ubuntu ! xD
2114 [18:40:36] <ortzi> But I dont have it in debian :/
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2119 [18:47:09] <thecoffemaker> ortzi, compile it and then do a checkinstall -> replaced-url
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2123 [18:47:34] <LtL> ortzi: libjpeg62-turbo is the closest i can find, have you considered compiling it? I can't guarentee that won't break something.
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2127 [18:49:22] <ortzi> replaced-url
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2129 [18:49:33] <ortzi> That are the required packages...
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2139 [18:52:04] <LtL> ortzi: consider compiling, replaced-url
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2142 [18:53:01] <LtL> ortzi: install build-essential if you decide to compile.
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2145 [18:54:23] <jhutchins> ,v libjpeg*
2146 [18:54:24] <judd> No package named 'libjpeg*' was found in amd64.
2147 [18:54:32] <jhutchins> ,v libjpeg
2148 [18:54:33] <judd> No package named 'libjpeg' was found in amd64.
2149 [18:55:08] <ortzi> I cant compile all I need, I dont have time for that...
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2151 [18:55:29] <ortzi> I love debian but in this machine I may return to Ubuntu
2152 [18:55:34] <ortzi> thanks for your help LtL
2153 [18:55:48] <LtL> ortzi: best of luck
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2156 [18:57:45] <MrFukkr> bigpresh: i dicked your moms cunt
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2163 [19:02:04] <jhutchins> LtL: It looks like the *turbo* files are utilities, it's the 62 package that has the libraries. The question is whether 62 is greater than 8, and whether the propietary program will allow "8 or newer".
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2165 [19:02:20] <jhutchins> Don't see why compiling would offer any advantage.
2166 [19:02:56] <diogenes_> maybe a symlink would work.
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2170 [19:03:58] <LtL> jhutchins: point taken, seems he left.
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2178 [19:05:23] <jhutchins> diogenes_: Hit-or-miss, but worth trying if it didn't just accept 62.
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2190 [19:15:35] <nh2_> Hi, I have a broken upgrade (unmet dependencies) and need to understand how to invoke apt correctly to fix it.
2191 [19:15:35] <nh2_> My sources.list are at the new release, but many packages are at the older release version because my updateder crashed.
2192 [19:15:35] <nh2_> How can I specify in an `apt-get install -f packagename=version packagename...` invocation that I want specific versions for some package, and the *latest available version for any other package* (the latest version shown in `apt-cache policy` for that package?
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2197 [19:17:48] <MogKupo> ahh, I was building something on an old netbook and it's used all swap and almost all ram, at a system load of over 10 and not responding to keys etc. (though it is still working, the drive is seeking constantly), ssh doesn't respond either but apparently just turning it off is a bad idea, any idea how to proceed?
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2206 [19:24:38] <nh2_> MogKupo: You might press Ctrl+C a couple of times, and wait. Likely, eventually the command will get through, or your program get killed by the OOM killer. Linux is unfortunately quite bad in such situations
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2208 [19:25:16] <MogKupo> it's been like this over two hours, I can't press ^C as I can't actually get focus to the window, oh dear
2209 [19:25:32] <MogKupo> not had anything like this happen since I had my 486 in the 1990s, lol
2210 [19:25:37] <MogKupo> when compiling the kernel was an all day job
2211 [19:25:59] <nh2_> MogKupo: if the operation you are performing is OK to be interrupted, you can also use the magic sysrq keys to kill all userspace processes and shut down relatively cleanly from the kernel side: replaced-url
2212 [19:26:46] <nh2_> (it'd be shutting down cleanly because one of the keys syncs the filesystem to disk)
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2215 [19:27:14] <MogKupo> ah, that did the job, thought magic sysrq had to be compiled in
2216 [19:27:15] <MogKupo> thankyou
2217 [19:28:11] <nh2_> MogKupo: one way to avoid this situation is to disable swap, and use a something like `earlyoom` to prevent such lockups (while accepting more aggressive killing of large processes)
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2220 [19:29:58] <MogKupo> aye, I just need to find some more RAM for this unusually fussy MSI netbook (needs a 1GB DDR3 stick to upgrade it, but not just any 1GB DDR3 stick, oh no, it has to be one blessed by MSI)
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2253 [19:50:35] <seven-eleven> hi
2254 [19:51:14] <seven-eleven> i noticed debian uses dhcpcd.conf and not interfaces anymore; can I just `systemctl disable dhcpcd` and use interfaces instead seamlessly?
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2256 [19:51:21] <xok> hello all..
2257 [19:51:36] <xok> i'm on an old Debian system ( wheezy / 7 )...
2258 [19:51:41] <xok> I want to install vim...
2259 [19:51:53] <xok> can anyone help me find the suitable .deb package?..
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2261 [19:52:04] <xok> the apt way doesn't work as it got obsolete..
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2264 [19:54:45] <somiaj> seven-eleven: debian uses /etc/network/interfaces as its default network configuration tool still
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2266 [19:55:20] <somiaj> seven-eleven: but debian also provides many ways to configure your network, you can use the interfaces file, you can manually configure it, use network-manager, wicd, wpa_supplicant, systemd-netword, and so on
2267 [19:55:21] <MogKupo> xok, you think that's old, I dug an old 486 out of storage a few months ago to do some data recovery from ancient 5.25" floppies and it was running potato, heh. Perhaps you can find an old binary 1 iso for wheezy and add that as a source?
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2269 [19:55:33] <somiaj> seven-eleven: as the system admin you have to choose which method to use, just be consistant.
2270 [19:56:12] <somiaj> xok: debian wheezy is no longer support and has security holes. That being said, debian provides all packages of unsupported released on archive.debian.org
2271 [19:56:15] <somiaj> !wheezy sources.list
2272 [19:56:15] <dpkg> Debian 7 "wheezy" is archived. A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for wheezy has one line: «deb replaced-url
2273 [19:56:33] <seven-eleven> somiaj, gotcha
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2275 [19:57:23] <MogKupo> oh, do you archive /all/ the old distributions?
2276 [19:57:27] <xok> somiaj: thanks, I think that would help...
2277 [19:57:55] <somiaj> MogKupo: the extremaly old only have source packages (like the first 2-3 releases of debian)
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2279 [19:58:09] <somiaj> MogKupo: all the other ones have both source and binary packages archived on archive.debian.org
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2283 [19:58:32] <somiaj> so if you awnted to say use the first release of debian, you would have to compile all packages from source
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2285 [19:58:52] <MogKupo> oh yeah, potato is in there, I could actually update the ancient 486
2286 [19:59:05] <MogKupo> 20 years on
2287 [19:59:14] <MogKupo> that's some long term support there
2288 [19:59:20] <somiaj> its not support, its an archive
2289 [19:59:26] <somiaj> you get all the bugs and security holes in cluded
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2291 [19:59:43] <MogKupo> oh yes, I understand that, but it's still there
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2298 [20:05:33] <xok> somiaj: how about security?...
2299 [20:05:47] <xok> do we have something like archive.secuity.debian.org ??
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2301 [20:06:26] <xok> apparently not...
2302 [20:06:36] <CarlFK> xok: what would you expect to find there?
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2377 [20:56:58] <beavis> /.4
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2396 [21:10:27] <rabbitnightmare> hey I am looking for a Debian KDE live iso
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2399 [21:11:53] <rabbitnightmare> I would like a torrent of the amd64 image
2400 [21:12:08] <rabbitnightmare> pretty please I would love to try this distribution out for myself
2401 [21:12:53] <rabbitnightmare> every time I try anything *buntu it is a buggy mess but from what I have heard, Debian fixes most of that
2402 [21:13:15] <saptech> have you tried kubuntu?
2403 [21:13:20] <saptech> too late
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2407 [21:13:51] <rabbitnightmare> yes its buggy
2408 [21:13:53] <saptech> why not just try debian's version, though it's not live
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2410 [21:14:12] <rabbitnightmare> I don't need it to be, but I would like the whole thing to be there
2411 [21:14:35] <rabbitnightmare> netinst disks are impossible for me at the moment I need to grab it from public wifi
2412 [21:14:49] <rabbitnightmare> they are doing work at the pole near my house and its sunday
2413 [21:15:06] <rabbitnightmare> I can wait but I would love to give it a spin
2414 [21:15:11] <saptech> dowwnlaod the complete ISO and choose kde/plasma desktop
2415 [21:15:17] <rabbitnightmare> where
2416 [21:15:27] <rabbitnightmare> I looked now I am bugging yall
2417 [21:15:56] <rabbitnightmare> buster is fine I am going to install it on my desktop
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2419 [21:16:04] <saptech> hmmm
2420 [21:16:08] <saptech> replaced-url
2421 [21:16:10] <rabbitnightmare> amd64 image is fine
2422 [21:16:11] <saptech> did u see that
2423 [21:16:25] <rabbitnightmare> I did not thank you
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2425 [21:16:42] <rabbitnightmare> I appreciate you
2426 [21:16:56] <saptech> np, I just realize debian have live images also
2427 [21:17:18] <rabbitnightmare> I just couldn't find them
2428 [21:17:22] <rabbitnightmare> just netinst
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2430 [21:17:48] <saptech> I have debian installed but I use the netinst and choose. I'm currently using Mate & Openbox
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2432 [21:18:19] <rabbitnightmare> im a bloadwhore but I like mate too
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2435 [21:18:53] <saptech> I use plasma on my mageia install
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2437 [21:19:18] <rabbitnightmare> I use it on Arch and its wonderful
2438 [21:19:43] <saptech> yep
2439 [21:19:57] <rabbitnightmare> Gnome broke a lot of stuff in .34
2440 [21:20:16] <rabbitnightmare> I know of others but I have used Linux since 2004
2441 [21:20:28] <rabbitnightmare> kind of hard to break the kde habit
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2443 [21:21:44] <whislock> I haven't actually used KDE in ages. Wonder what it's like, now.
2444 [21:22:13] <rabbitnightmare> flat
2445 [21:22:20] <rabbitnightmare> you can change the themes though
2446 [21:23:02] <rabbitnightmare> it fell out of popularity so development for the apps kinda slowed over time but it's kicking back up
2447 [21:23:18] <rabbitnightmare> k3b remains the only way I found to burn ISO files to dvd
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2449 [21:23:40] <saptech> whislock kde is called Plasma 5 now
2450 [21:23:52] <saptech> more modern looking
2451 [21:23:54] <rabbitnightmare> it is but I am 35
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2453 [21:24:08] <saptech> lol
2454 [21:24:25] <saptech> I mostly use Brasero for my burning needsd
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2456 [21:24:30] <rabbitnightmare> even plasma is hard to describe it as, so I still call it KDE as it is all encompassing
2457 [21:24:46] <rabbitnightmare> must be a gtk4 bug
2458 [21:24:53] <bernyrd> plasma is interest
2459 [21:24:57] <bernyrd> redid lot of code also
2460 [21:25:01] <rabbitnightmare> one of the things it broke on me
2461 [21:25:21] <saptech> I don't think plasma use gtk
2462 [21:25:26] <saptech> QT it uses
2463 [21:25:26] <rabbitnightmare> kde plasma is one of those things you either love or hate right out
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2465 [21:26:13] <saptech> I get lost using it
2466 [21:26:13] <rabbitnightmare> it requires a lot of other stuff to be installed properly for it to be stable, Kubuntu does not do that
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2468 [21:26:43] <rabbitnightmare> its just as daunting now as it was in 3.5.10
2469 [21:27:11] <rabbitnightmare> you either like it or you don't its bloat and its awesome
2470 [21:27:39] <saptech> I like it just do not use it :)
2471 [21:27:46] <rabbitnightmare> you can rice it out or have nothing on your desktop (but then you are probably using i3 anyway)
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2474 [21:28:13] <rabbitnightmare> wobbly windows that burn up when you close them
2475 [21:28:38] <rabbitnightmare> desktop cubes and everything lol
2476 [21:28:46] <rabbitnightmare> as skeuomorphic or as flat as you want
2477 [21:29:45] <rabbitnightmare> I get so much work done because of KDE though, things you normally do in terminal KDE has tools for
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2479 [21:30:36] <rabbitnightmare> everyone who uses GTK desktops look at me funny
2480 [21:30:46] <rabbitnightmare> I came from a different era of Linux though
2481 [21:31:19] <rabbitnightmare> back when Mandrake ruled the world
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2483 [21:32:15] <rabbitnightmare> so mcdonalds blocks torrent traffic
2484 [21:32:21] <rabbitnightmare> that's a thing I guess
2485 [21:32:53] <rabbitnightmare> can see why, I only use it for Linux
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2488 [21:33:37] <saptech> all distros have tools to use instead of terminal
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2490 [21:33:47] <saptech> all DEs
2491 [21:34:10] <saptech> cli just let you do most things faster
2492 [21:34:15] <rabbitnightmare> do they? that's good, I could never live with how limited those DEs make me feel
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2496 [21:34:44] <whislock> saptech: I know what KDE is called now. I just haven't bothered to try it.
2497 [21:34:45] <rabbitnightmare> no desktop icons? when did that become popular?
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2500 [21:35:17] <rabbitnightmare> I love my desktop busy and messy
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2502 [21:35:27] <saptech> lol
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2504 [21:35:32] <saptech> I used to
2505 [21:35:33] <maxrazer> Anyone know why microphone input wouldn't be detected/working in Debian?
2506 [21:35:37] <rabbitnightmare> dl is done checking hash
2507 [21:35:47] <maxrazer> My built in audio often doesn't work, but my audio interface always works.
2508 [21:35:53] <rabbitnightmare> maxrazer what dE?
2509 [21:35:57] <maxrazer> XFCE
2510 [21:36:10] <rabbitnightmare> its not showing up in settings?
2511 [21:36:17] <maxrazer> I have to set the configuration of built-in audio to stereo duplex.
2512 [21:36:28] <free_speech> which audioenvironment? PulseAudio? JACK? OSS? ALSA?
2513 [21:36:29] <c0rnelius> have you tried unmuting it in alsamixer?
2514 [21:36:36] <maxrazer> It is showing up, but I only get background noise and not my voice.
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2516 [21:36:40] <c0rnelius> and turn on capture
2517 [21:36:46] <maxrazer> I checked ALSAmixer. saw no muting.
2518 [21:36:56] <rabbitnightmare> I was going to suggest alsa next because in Arch that's usually the issue people have
2519 [21:37:16] <maxrazer> Pavucontrol says the microphone is plugged in.
2520 [21:37:16] <rabbitnightmare> do yall deal with system?
2521 [21:37:22] <rabbitnightmare> systemD
2522 [21:37:32] <maxrazer> Also, in the past Audacity would have trouble recording the voice would be all fast.
2523 [21:37:50] <maxrazer> But that isn't even working now.
2524 [21:37:59] <rabbitnightmare> sounds like an issue systemD causes in Arch sometimes
2525 [21:38:04] <maxrazer> I think in the past once setting the config to of and back to duplex would wake it up.
2526 [21:38:06] <c0rnelius> in alsamixer if it's labeled MM is muted. If you then select F4 you'll see capture options
2527 [21:38:14] <c0rnelius> it's*
2528 [21:38:36] <c0rnelius> insert and delete will set the left and right of the mic input
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2530 [21:39:36] <rabbitnightmare> install pavucontrol and run it as root and see if it fixes it
2531 [21:39:39] <maxrazer> Capture is turned all the way up. Rear mic boost is all the way down.
2532 [21:39:48] <maxrazer> I have pavucontrol
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2534 [21:39:57] <rabbitnightmare> idk what the package manager Debian uses but that should sort it out
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2538 [21:40:19] <rabbitnightmare> sudo alsa force-reload
2539 [21:40:41] <rabbitnightmare> remove pulseaudio and reinstall it
2540 [21:40:46] <maxrazer> There is just something about bad support for microphone built-in audio in Linux. I have an Asus motherboard.
2541 [21:40:48] <maxrazer> ok
2542 [21:41:07] <maxrazer> I also have the pavucontrol-qt installed from another desktop. I removed it.
2543 [21:41:12] <rabbitnightmare> systemD can be wonky, its not a Debian centric thing
2544 [21:41:27] <maxrazer> The USB audio interface I have always works for microphone.
2545 [21:41:36] <rabbitnightmare> it likes control like a drunk cop
2546 [21:41:37] <maxrazer> But, not the built int audio.
2547 [21:42:17] <rabbitnightmare> sudo
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2549 [21:42:42] <maxrazer> I removed pavucontrol and now running with sudo. It says establishing connection to pulse audio. I may have to restart.
2550 [21:43:00] <rabbitnightmare> snd-hda-intel position_fix=1 <---- add this line then restart if that doesn't fix it try fix=2
2551 [21:43:22] <rabbitnightmare> if that doesn't help it might be Debian centric
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2553 [21:43:27] <maxrazer> Oh, it runs without sudo
2554 [21:43:31] <rabbitnightmare> but my guess is on systemD
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2556 [21:43:55] <maxrazer> The output sound works on headphones, but not microphone.
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2558 [21:44:05] <rabbitnightmare> oh they have a laxer security profile? neat
2559 [21:44:14] <rabbitnightmare> right
2560 [21:44:25] <rabbitnightmare> its detecting the mic as an audio output device
2561 [21:44:32] <rabbitnightmare> my guess
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2563 [21:44:59] <rabbitnightmare> this should exhibit across all XFCE with SystemD distros
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2565 [21:45:26] <rabbitnightmare> snd-hda-intel position_fix=1 or fix=2 in alsa-base.conf
2566 [21:45:50] <rabbitnightmare> try those if reinstalling things doesnt fix it
2567 [21:46:06] <rabbitnightmare> options snd-hda-intel index=0 model=laptop-dmic
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2569 [21:46:12] <rabbitnightmare> try that as well
2570 [21:46:22] <rabbitnightmare> even if its a desktop I have seen it work for people
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2574 [21:47:18] <rabbitnightmare> alright I gotta bounce I have to go deal with people in the real world UGH
2575 [21:47:36] <rabbitnightmare> why cant all life's problems be as simple as helping someone with their audio config
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2582 [21:50:25] <maxrazer> thanks rabbitnightmare. I'll try that.
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2658 [22:30:04] <swivel> ls
2659 [22:30:08] <swivel> oops
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2666 [22:32:14] <linearain> hi
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2669 [22:33:00] <linearain> can someone tell me why my debian takes up 4GB? it doesnt seem to have much programs, just lxqt, transmission, apache and ssh
2670 [22:33:51] <linearain> i installed it from DVD iso. Someone told me it copied the entire DVD over, is this true?
2671 [22:34:03] <EdePopede> linearain: sudo du -s /*
2672 [22:34:12] <EdePopede> err, copy?
2673 [22:34:22] <linearain> i mean all the packages?
2674 [22:34:27] <linearain> what will that command do?
2675 [22:34:31] <linearain> i cant check it right now
2676 [22:34:39] <EdePopede> or you may want to use something like ncd or a gui tool
2677 [22:35:02] <EdePopede> show you how much each of the items (in this case: the top level directories need)
2678 [22:35:19] <Zombozo> The du command recursively finds the estimated size of directories. It won't sort the output by size, though.
2679 [22:35:19] <EdePopede> du = disk usage
2680 [22:35:45] <linearain> thanks
2681 [22:35:58] * EdePopede uses mc's internal function for such things usually
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2683 [22:36:13] <ayekat> Zombozo: pipe it into sort :-)
2684 [22:36:28] <EdePopede> better sort -n ;)
2685 [22:36:31] <Zombozo> hm yea
2686 [22:37:02] <EdePopede> though i remember some GUI filemanager which sorted dates by ASCII order(!!!!)
2687 [22:37:31] <jelly> also, don't do /* and don't do -s because it won't show which specific dir stuff hides in
2688 [22:37:57] <linearain> so just do du?
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2690 [22:38:19] <EdePopede> probably java, office and tons of docs
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2693 [22:38:42] <linearain> i think it does have libreoffice
2694 [22:39:10] <linearain> im sure i dont need office, whats the best way of removing such software?
2695 [22:39:16] <linearain> through package manager?/
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2697 [22:39:25] <jelly> du -x / | sort -n, or du -xh / | sort -h
2698 [22:39:39] <jelly> sudo du -xh / |sort -hr | head -n20
2699 [22:39:46] <EdePopede> apt/apt-get/aptitude
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2701 [22:40:06] <jelly> if you're the kind of person that like -h
2702 [22:40:46] <linearain> what kind of docs, EdePopede
2703 [22:40:47] <linearain> ?
2704 [22:41:04] <linearain> removing directories manually is a bad idea?
2705 [22:41:52] <jelly> if you don't need a package, uninstall it.
2706 [22:41:52] <EdePopede> you shouldn't do such things outside $HOME and a few other places
2707 [22:42:02] <linearain> i see
2708 [22:42:07] <linearain> alright, got it
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2710 [22:42:14] <jelly> apt-get purge packagename
2711 [22:42:38] <linearain> what kind of "tons of docs" it might contain?
2712 [22:43:04] <jelly> read the output of apt before telling it to continue. It might want to remove other things you like as well.
2713 [22:43:24] <linearain> sure
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2715 [22:44:47] <EdePopede> linearain: /usr/share/doc is about 230M here
2716 [22:45:54] <linearain> one more question. I want my machine to run headless most of the time but I still want to use a desktop environment sometimes. Right now i disable sddm, so it boots into terminal. Is that enough to make sure CPU and memory are not doing anything related to the desktop environment (lxqt) ?
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2718 [22:46:17] <EdePopede> only ffmpeg is 27M, then 9M of HOWTOs. nearly 2k directories in total
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2720 [22:47:14] <user99> heh...4.9 GB but then I added build deps and a bunch of docs
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2722 [22:47:41] <EdePopede> as long as you don't login, only the DM and X should be running.
2723 [22:47:48] <EdePopede> user99: docs?
2724 [22:48:32] <user99> helpman, deb-ref etc
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2728 [22:48:57] <linearain> EdePopede, DM and X will be running even with sddm disabled? Are these processes cpu intensive?
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2736 [22:53:56] <linearain> are dm and x necessary to have just the terminal output?
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2751 [23:00:03] <Tom-_> hi linearain, i lost track of your questions. if you start no DM then yes that is enough to make sure no RAM or CPU is used by DM or X
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2753 [23:02:20] <linearain> Tom-_, thanks. If I start the desktop environment with "systemctl start sddm" and later stop it with "systemctl stop sddm", are RAM and CPU again free of anything related to it, without reboot?
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2756 [23:05:05] <Tom-_> yes, linearain
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2758 [23:05:18] <linearain> Tom-_, thanks, that sounds great
2759 [23:05:41] <Tom-_> yesh i appreciate Linux too
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2763 [23:08:09] <maxrazer> Can't install Viber voice program: replaced-url
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2766 [23:10:28] <jmcnaught> maxrazer: jessie was the last version of Debian to include the libssl1.0.0 package. You could install that package from jessie (which is supported by LTS until june 2020), find a newer version of this viber package that uses an up to date library, or just don't use viber.
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2768 [23:11:29] <maxrazer> jmcnaught, Ok, I thought that might be the option. Is installing that package normally safe? I guess Viber isn't very up to date with linux.
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2773 [23:12:43] <maxrazer> Would you add the jessie to sources.list or just download from website?
2774 [23:12:51] <maxrazer> replaced-url
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2776 [23:13:15] <jmcnaught> if you just download the package from the website then it won't get security updates
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2778 [23:13:52] <jmcnaught> Generally it's safe to install packages from an older release (as long as they still have security support), but it is unsafe to install packages from a newer release.
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2782 [23:16:23] <maxrazer> jmcnaught, Ah ok. Security updates is good as a practice. I doubt that will happen with this old version though.
2783 [23:17:05] <jmcnaught> maxrazer: replaced-url
2784 [23:17:32] <jmcnaught> so it could happen again before June 30 2020 when Jessie LTS finishes.
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2786 [23:17:57] <maxrazer> Ok. I'll have to add to sources.list and do the target command for that library to jessie on install.
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2789 [23:18:39] <jmcnaught> because the package doesn't exist except in jessie you probably don't even need to target the release. Can always test with "apt-get -s …" first
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2791 [23:20:06] <maxrazer> jmcnaught, Yeah looks like it because the version is in the package name.
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2793 [23:21:51] <maxrazer> jmcnaught, Ok, Viber started thanks! I'm trying Viber and Skype. I think they are two good options.
2794 [23:22:22] <maxrazer> There is also Signal, but no support for voice on desktop version yet.
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2796 [23:25:39] <maxrazer> jmcnaught, An interesting thought just occurred to me that somehow the package manager knows to keep the old version when I upgrade?
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2813 [23:43:23] <slee> hi, running debian for the first time...trying to stat a service for a program i just installed(sudo systemctl restart jellyfin) returns: Failed to restart jellyfin.service: No such method 'RestartUnit'
2814 [23:43:32] <slee> s/stat/start
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2818 [23:47:06] <maxrazer> slee, I've only messed with services a bit. It should recognize that service name.
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