People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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19 [00:15:16] <otyugh> hey. Using debian XFCE I get a strange behaviour. Just after lightdm, I get a weird black screen for 20-30sec, then the X environement pops and everything is fine. But there is no trace of this big waiting time in systemd-analyze. What could it be ? Using xfce (lightdm+xfce4-session)
20 [00:16:03] <jhutchins> otyugh: Once you're in the GUI, you're no longer at system level, so systemd isn't part of it.
21 [00:16:16] <jhutchins> (Yet.)(Thankfully.)
22 [00:17:06] <otyugh> Any clue how I could trace the thing that is crippling GUI's start ?
23 [00:17:07] <jhutchins> otyugh: It sounds like it's just blackframe while lightdm hands off to xfce. You could look at Xorg.0.log, but xfce itself doesn't really log anywhere.
24 [00:18:23] <jhutchins> otyugh: Too many variables. What features and plugins and applets do you have active? What startup apps? What hardware? What CPU & RAM? What are the chances that one of us has had the exact same combination of all that and maybe seen this happen?
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26 [00:18:43] <otyugh> there is logs from 21" to 120" whhich would make a leap of almost 2 minute. Could be that.
27 [00:19:11] <jhutchins> otyugh: You could try a different DM, you could try a different Desktop, you could try creating a different user.
28 [00:19:38] <otyugh> I know I used the exact same system in a virtualbox and didn't get this behaviour. Guess it's a driver thingy, then.
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30 [00:20:56] <jhutchins> otyugh: Something reacting to the physical hardware.
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37 [00:26:46] <annadane> systemd-as-a-service.service
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47 [00:32:41] <otyugh> jhutchins I found the problem. Around 120s the gui was starting fine. Same time as in dmesg I could see "crng init done". Which is about making random numbers. Installing haveged trims down my boot time from 120sec to 18sec now o/
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55 [00:36:13] <ryouma> i vaguely remember that. wiggling mouse might do it too. maybe.
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62 [00:40:51] <otyugh> ryouma, wigglig mouse is a lot of work every time :D
63 [00:41:10] <otyugh> But it would be fun if it was part of a normal boot on every computer ^^
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128 [01:24:39] <nvz> ryouma: if you wiggle it more than twice, you're just playing with it..
129 [01:25:20] <ZaZaGX> wiggle wiggle
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134 [01:30:35] <ZaZaGX> when is the exact time and during which time zone will the debian 10.1 happen?
135 [01:30:43] <ZaZaGX> update
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142 [01:32:22] <nvz> ZaZaGX: replaced-url
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144 [01:34:06] <ZaZaGX> i only see about it updates every 2 months
145 [01:34:23] <brutser> guys, i do expert install and then go to shell and perform these commands: replaced-url
146 [01:34:32] <brutser> what am i forgetting here?
147 [01:34:45] <nvz> ZaZaGX: 10.1 is scheduled for tomorrow
148 [01:35:09] * dvs raises lots of bug reports
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150 [01:35:41] <nvz> replaced-url
151 [01:35:52] <nvz> seems like its the wrong place to say that
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153 [01:36:23] <ZaZaGX> yeah i just found that same website
154 [01:36:30] * nvz updates the wiki cause it seems to not include the most obvious place to look
155 [01:37:07] <ZaZaGX> you think it'll happened at midnight Pacific Standard Time?
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163 [01:48:55] <astra> anyone having issues installing modprobe on buster?
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169 [01:51:48] <LtL> astra: looks like it's in the kmod package
170 [01:51:55] <nvz> ,i kmod
171 [01:51:56] <judd> Package kmod (admin, important) in buster/amd64: tools for managing Linux kernel modules. Version: 26-1; Size: 88.1k; Installed: 237k; Screenshot: replaced-url
172 [01:52:17] <nvz> ,file sbin/modprobe
173 [01:52:22] <judd> Search for sbin/modprobe in buster/amd64: kmod: sbin/modprobe
174 [01:52:38] <nvz> dpkg point release =~ s#by referencing a Debian <mirror> in /etc/apt/sources.list, then#with#;s# replaced-url
175 [01:52:39] <brutser> guys, i do expert debian install and then go to shell and perform these commands: replaced-url
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177 [01:53:06] <astra> thank you, dear ones
178 [01:53:20] <nvz> hmm apparently it can't do multiple edits in same line or my syntax is wrong :P
179 [01:53:21] <astra> i'll read those carefully :)
180 [01:53:21] <brutser> is there some extra config i need to do for fde + lvm? i do this from expert install shell, not from debian installer direct, so perhaps i am missing something?
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183 [01:56:07] <nvz> brutser: 1) don't EVER use pastebin.com, use paste.debian.net or something sane 2) install cryptsetup-initramfs
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185 [01:56:19] <nvz> !pastebin.com
186 [01:56:20] <dpkg> pastebin.com mangles input, takes forever to load, is full of js, often makes us enter a CAPTCHA to see your paste and fills the screen with ads. Please use a different site, like replaced-url
187 [01:56:58] <brutser> nvz: ok I did not know!
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189 [01:57:55] <nvz> brutser: now you know ;) and to get the prompt at boot to unlock LUKS you need cryptsetup in initramfs
190 [01:58:32] <nvz> brutser: if you don't see it updating initramfs when installing that, you may have to do it manually.. idk.. I never done it, I normally just let the installer put it in there
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192 [01:58:52] <brutser> nvz: ok, i was wondering what was the debian installer doing different than me, i guess that's it
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194 [01:59:06] <nvz> but since you claimed to be an expert and didn't tell the installer to install it.. heh.. you apparently didnt do this
195 [01:59:07] <brutser> nvz: do i need /etc/crypttab?
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197 [01:59:31] <nvz> brutser: uh yeah..
198 [02:00:00] <brutser> nvz: true lol, but at same time i try to understand how the fde is done without trusting too much on an installer
199 [02:00:12] <brutser> + i have more control when doing it manually
200 [02:00:30] <nvz> brutser: well you see where that landed you :P
201 [02:00:47] <brutser> nvz: yea, but that's where the learning curve starts :)
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205 [02:00:54] <brutser> so i need to chroot into the system and configure /etc/crypttab?
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207 [02:01:09] <brutser> i never thought the installer would do all that, but i guess i was wrong :)
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209 [02:01:31] <nvz> I didn't require anything fancy.. I just have a laptop with a 120gb ssd and I just let the partitioner setup encrypted lvm with auto partition.. made me a /boot then and encrypted lvm with root and swap.. works fine for me
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211 [02:02:17] <brutser> nvz: yea, i am testing this in qemu, just to learn really
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213 [02:02:36] <nvz> brutser: without /etc/crypttab cryptsetup has no way of knowing what things are needing to be mapped so fstab can use them
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215 [02:03:45] <brutser> ok, i thought by selecting the logical volumes in the partitioning part, the debian installer would take care of all that, but i guess that's only when you let the installer do the encryption too
216 [02:03:53] <nvz> brutser: I'm guessing you grasp the basics that a crypt container is just indeciperable garbage to a system.. that cryptsetup opens the container exposing it through the dm to /dev/mapper/mycrypt or such, and that is done in crypttab, then fstab can mount /dev/mapper/mycrypt
217 [02:04:12] <brutser> yes
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219 [02:05:23] <brutser> i guess only fstab is configured by the installer when selecting the logical volumes, but cryttab must be done manually this way
220 [02:05:45] <brutser> well it's time to find out :)
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223 [02:06:32] <nvz> well how the heck do you expect it to know you manually did a cryptsetup? :P
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225 [02:07:13] <brutser> nvz: yes true
226 [02:08:09] * nvz writes the cagey-bee installer that spies on brutser to accomodate things he does in secret
227 [02:08:27] <brutser> :P
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230 [02:09:06] <brutser> nvz: by the way, if you do let debian installer do all the work, or if you do it manually the good way, always when you start it still complain about not finding the volume groups right? and then it prompt for passphrase, at least i noticed this
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232 [02:09:23] <nvz> brutser: does on my system
233 [02:10:05] <nvz> brutser: which I find some of that early startup messages rather curious.. idk why they haven't addressed that.. because it also says "resuming from suspend" every boot regardless if it was suspended or not
234 [02:10:22] <brutser> nvz: yes !! here too
235 [02:10:56] <nvz> it would make more sense if it were to just say "checking for suspend state..." or something
236 [02:10:57] <brutser> it's little confusing, but i guess i can live with it
237 [02:11:04] <brutser> yea
238 [02:11:48] <brutser> i just did basic debian install lvm+luks with nothing special and after reboot, it says cannot find or open vg_root, then it prompt for passphrase and continue
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240 [02:12:32] <nvz> but I been using debian a long time and in my experience developers can be crabby.. you need only watch Linus Tovalds to know this.. heh.. most things I suggest they just tell me to STFU anyhow
241 [02:13:10] <brutser> :)
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243 [02:13:26] <nvz> I looked at an old bug report I'd filed about wicd not working when network-manager was installed.. and the maintainer just griped about adding it as a conflicts and flat out said they were never going to do it
244 [02:13:35] <brutser> well you helped me here, which is also a rara occasion these days on irc :)
245 [02:13:38] <nvz> as though it were something complicated or unreasonable
246 [02:14:26] <brutser> nvz: yea, but there are good ones out there, i am in contact with a guy who work on coreboot and he is so super friendly and always listening and explaining
247 [02:15:04] <brutser> i always feel ashamed when i get an e-mail from him, because it's so long and so detailed, that i feel obligated to write him at least the same amount back :)
248 [02:15:17] <brutser> lol, to a point that it gets annoying lol
249 [02:15:37] <brutser> anyway, im off testing again
250 [02:15:40] <nvz> yeah they are rare..
251 [02:15:41] <brutser> tahnks for your help
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254 [02:16:32] <nvz> I can count on one hand the number of DD/DM that have been easy going with fingers to spare probably :P
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256 [02:18:58] <nvz> not that I am one of those whiny PC people who sits in the corner of safe zones peeing my pants.. but I expect folk to at least be well reasoned when they're being an arse :P
257 [02:20:10] <nvz> I bet dpkg has something to say about that ..
258 [02:20:17] <nvz> dpkg, opinons?
259 [02:20:18] <dpkg> no idea, nvz
260 [02:20:24] <nvz> maybe not
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277 [02:42:30] <LtL> dpkg: opinions
278 [02:42:30] <dpkg> opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, they all stink, and it's really not polite to air yours in public, or be prepared to defend yours if you do show it in #debian. Your opinion, not your arsehole. Well, maybe both.
279 [02:42:51] <nvz> LtL: didn't realize I'd made a typo
280 [02:43:00] <LtL> heh
281 [02:43:32] <LtL> nvz: you very seldom do!
282 [02:43:51] <nvz> LtL: yeah well we don't all have your level of commitment to patience with typing :D
283 [02:44:13] <nvz> things taken for granted I suppose
284 [02:44:33] <LtL> I'm the slowest, worst typist present.
285 [02:45:11] <Unplesantry> good
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287 [02:45:22] <Unplesantry> u wont be trolling too much
288 [02:45:57] <nvz> yeah but you have a valid reason. I can't believe how much you contribute given your situation and still doing it manually
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293 [02:48:15] <nvz> LtL: I had tried your method and it wasn't easy.. I think I'd have tried to find another way or just given up
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308 [02:57:21] <LtL> thanks nvz
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312 [02:58:06] <ryouma> rsi?
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316 [02:59:49] <nvz> ryouma: more complicated than that
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318 [03:00:24] <SerajewelKS> someone is trying to argue with me that raid5 is not a bad idea in production -_-
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321 [03:01:15] * dvs puts on his arguing hat
322 [03:01:17] <nvz> SerajewelKS: I wouldn't mind hearing your thoughts cause I'd always defaulted to RAID5 as I dont really know much about it and it seemed like an effecient compromise to get some redundancy with minimal investment of hardware
323 [03:01:39] <nvz> though I'm considering for my personal use in the future maybe trying unraid
324 [03:01:56] <SerajewelKS> nvz: rebuilding a raid5 requires reading the entire surface of every remaining disk
325 [03:02:27] <nvz> SerajewelKS: so you are arguing what, raid6 is better?
326 [03:02:35] <SerajewelKS> the odds of a consumer drive failing during that process * the number of drives in the array... you're easily looking at 60%+ odds of another disk crapping out during the process.
327 [03:02:49] <SerajewelKS> with those odds you may as well use raid0
328 [03:03:01] <nvz> idk thats a bit of a stretch..
329 [03:03:02] <nvz> heh
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331 [03:03:27] <nvz> but things like this are why I really like the sound of unraid
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333 [03:04:02] <SerajewelKS> we use raid10 with a hot spare
334 [03:04:06] <nvz> it keeps each disk usable on its own so its fault tolerance is actually less a hard limit and more a you'll lose "some" data
335 [03:04:55] <SerajewelKS> you don't get as much capacity per $ as raid5/6 but you still get a performance boost, and rebuilding only stresses one drive
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339 [03:06:03] <SerajewelKS> storage is cheap, it seems silly me to gamble on raid5/6
340 [03:07:12] <SerajewelKS> the figures i've seen relate it to total array size since URE rates tend to be based on the number of sectors in the drive, so the number of drives doesn't matter as much as the array capacity
341 [03:07:38] <SerajewelKS> at 12TB array the probability of a second disk failure during rebuild is ~96%
342 [03:07:50] <SerajewelKS> maybe it's fine with smaller arrays
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347 [03:08:38] <SerajewelKS> _any_ URE during raid5 rebuild will kill the array
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349 [03:09:01] <dvs> I guess it depends on how the remaining drives are used during the rebuild. I thought it would only be a sequencial read during a rebuild.
350 [03:09:18] <SerajewelKS> you're still gambling you're not going to have any URE's on any remaining disk
351 [03:09:40] <SerajewelKS> keep in mind that URE's during normal operation are "hidden" because the array can repair that one sector by reading one sector from the other disks and rewriting it
352 [03:10:33] <SerajewelKS> and the rebuild will be sequential, but unless you're taking the machine offline you probably have service activity happening on the drives so there's still going to be seeking around to satisfy the services you're running
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354 [03:10:57] <SerajewelKS> and if you go offline to rebuild.... why are you using raid? :)
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358 [03:12:37] <SerajewelKS> basically the math is that on most consumer drives, the URE rate is approximately 1 in 10^14 which is ~= 12.5TB
359 [03:13:10] <SerajewelKS> so you're expected to get 1 URE in every 12.5TB of data read. if your array is 12.5TB+ then you're all but guaranteed to fail the rebuild unless you're super lucky.
360 [03:13:42] * dvs sticks with his 2TB drives
361 [03:14:11] <SerajewelKS> yeah the math says that smaller drives in a raid10 is better :)
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363 [03:14:52] <Foxfir3> curious. why Raspian on raspberry pi? why a custrom distro, when the extras could be installed with a simple shellscript?
364 [03:14:57] <SerajewelKS> lower B/$ (same as RAID1) but you get the performance of striping, plus a hot spare can replace any drive in any of the mirrored pairs
365 [03:15:23] <SerajewelKS> Foxfir3: well then there wouldn't be an excuse to operate painfully slow mirrors
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367 [03:15:47] <Foxfir3> SerajewelKS: thats a good point
368 [03:15:58] * SerajewelKS taps his forehead
369 [03:16:10] <Foxfir3> SerajewelKS: struggling just to install ERlang on a Pi3.
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371 [03:17:47] <SerajewelKS> you should have seen my effors to run ardour and netjack on one
372 [03:18:02] <SerajewelKS> i actually got it working decently well and it was able to run DSP on several channels before being overloaded :)
373 [03:18:43] <SerajewelKS> still it's impressive that a $35 computer can be a several-channel digital mixer with all the bells and whistles like multiband compression and eq
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376 [03:19:48] <Foxfir3> SerajewelKS: so how much did they mess up the original Debian?
377 [03:20:31] <Foxfir3> they use their own mirrors. but why not just support the debian arm project (assuming there is one)
378 [03:20:36] <SerajewelKS> not really sure. most stuff seems to work well enough.
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381 [03:21:59] <Foxfir3> SerajewelKS: that It does. It just gets frustrating when I can install Erlang because of mysterious 'broken packages'. Telling that something will not be installed, is useless information.
382 [03:22:28] <SerajewelKS> Foxfir3: one possibility is that, since pis tend to use very similar CPUs, the packages can be compiled specifically for that one CPU, enabling a lot of optimizations you can't use when compiling for "anything ARM"
383 [03:23:00] <SerajewelKS> generally you shouldn't mix raspbian and debian repos
384 [03:23:10] <SerajewelKS> hopefully that's not what you're doing, then you get a frakendistro
385 [03:23:29] <Foxfir3> and they stick to the broadcom. so they can squize out some extra juice.
386 [03:23:51] <SerajewelKS> that's probably a big part of it
387 [03:24:56] <Foxfir3> not mixing. no. and erlang is the only issue. will try to compile erlang otp now (wondering how many hours that will take). seems that Elixir is not a priority on RPi.
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389 [03:25:43] <SerajewelKS> i'd ask in #raspbian
390 [03:25:44] <Foxfir3> Best succes i had with the rpi3, was running Arch/i3. like a chicken in Etiopia.
391 [03:25:49] <SerajewelKS> maybe they know why it doesn't work, we can only guess
392 [03:26:31] <Foxfir3> but to make a real pi, i could run pure debian arm?
393 [03:27:01] <SerajewelKS> you could try, i've never done it myself
394 [03:27:11] <SerajewelKS> you'd have to use armhf, i think. armel is a diffirent arch.
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396 [03:27:33] <Foxfir3> hf and l??
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398 [03:28:25] <SerajewelKS> armhf is the pi arch. debian also supports armel but that's something else.
399 [03:29:31] <Foxfir3> okay. thanks. that would be a nice experiment on the pi3.
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401 [03:30:13] <Foxfir3> I will buy the pi4, but put Arch on it, since Arch is less painfull (for a fakir)
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404 [03:31:25] <Foxfir3> not blaming the company behind RPi. they made the right choice to get out to as many users as possible. Great thing for Debian.
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408 [03:37:45] <nvz> SerajewelKS: yeah the times I'd used it I was only using like 3 disks that are fairly small
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428 [04:02:15] <SerajewelKS> nvz: that's probably okay, it still seems very risky to me though in comparison to other options.
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431 [04:03:22] <nvz> SerajewelKS: your logic sounds like it makes sense considering large arrays of large disks
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433 [04:03:46] <nvz> SerajewelKS: and I would imagine its supported by having seen it happen before
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441 [04:08:32] <nvz> should Debian 10 Live be able to resize a Win10 partition in gparted reasonably safely?
442 [04:08:45] <nvz> to make room for a new install
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464 [04:35:06] <SerajewelKS> nvz: not in person but fellow IT people have had it happen
465 [04:35:12] <SerajewelKS> "why does this happen every time we rebuild this array"
466 [04:35:19] <SerajewelKS> turns out, math. math is why.
467 [04:35:45] <SerajewelKS> nvz: probably about as safe as anything else
468 [04:36:07] <SerajewelKS> nvz: i personally use the gparted live cd for that kind of stuff, but if debian live has gparted then it should work as well
469 [04:36:21] <SerajewelKS> obviously take a backup, yadda yadda
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500 [05:15:27] <GenTooMan> As I was afraid the Nvidia X drivers aren't likely to work right. So to not use them I just need to remove the xorg.conf files and remove the blacklist information in /etc/modprobe.d?
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518 [05:28:10] <Foxfir3> Elixir up'n running on RPi3. the RPi guys must really hate Erlang :D
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520 [05:28:59] <Foxfir3> how do I swap capslock/ctrl?
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522 [05:30:49] <nkuttler> one way is xmodmap
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528 [05:35:29] <Foxfir3> nkuttler: I will try that then :)
529 [05:36:51] <GenTooMan> Now I know why people practically do rm -rf to uninstall nvidia's drivers. Geesh.
530 [05:37:18] <Foxfir3> GenTooMan: yeah.. its a hate/hate relationship
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533 [05:38:12] <Foxfir3> 5% of all internet traffic is related to Nvidia issues
534 [05:39:12] <Foxfir3> nkuttler: package does not exist. any idea as what to do next?
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536 [05:39:43] <Foxfir3> nkuttler: forgot. its an RPi3. yummie repo :/
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539 [05:41:00] <Foxfir3> Raspian rocks. I get Wolfram lang instead of useful packages
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544 [05:43:49] <GenTooMan> foxfir3 in words of one syllable SIGH. It's not unexpected however it is annoying.
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547 [05:47:55] <Foxfir3> GenTooMan: you said It! There is something deeply wrong with the Raspian approach. well.. swapping keys. if not xmodmap (use that on my Arch lappie), then what? Compile xmodmap?
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631 [07:14:35] <sourcream> What tool in debian could I use to rate limit packets per second per ip?
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639 [07:23:06] <fling> How to tell dist-upgrade to actually upgrade from stretch to buster?
640 [07:23:21] <fling> I run it on bbb, it upgraded like two packages
641 [07:23:31] <fling> and I still have stretch in /etc/apt/sources.list
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643 [07:25:02] <fling> looks like I should edit it
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651 [07:36:51] <nvz> !tell fling about stretch->buster
652 [07:36:59] <fling> thanks
653 [07:37:59] <fling> How do I not install docs and other stuff? For more minimal system
654 [07:39:46] <nvz> don't install them
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656 [07:41:11] <fling> How to? :D
657 [07:41:52] <nvz> fling: you know how you just pressed those buttons H-o-w- -t-o-? try not doing that..
658 [07:42:00] <nvz> thats how you not do something
659 [07:42:33] <nvz> fling: maybe you should be more specific
660 [07:43:02] <fling> How do I not install anyting to /usr/share/doc for example?
661 [07:43:09] <nvz> for example I am using a system which has both MATE and XFCE on it.. if I removed XFCE I'd only save about 43MB
662 [07:43:12] <fling> In gentoo it would be FEATURES="nodoc" added to make.conf
663 [07:43:22] <fling> Or just /usr/share/doc added to INSTALL_MASK
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665 [07:43:59] <fling> The storage is only 4G, trying to make the system more minimal
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669 [07:44:30] <nvz> debian doesn't have anything like that, we just have a modular system and you don't install what you don't want
670 [07:44:58] <fling> so I can't want to not install anything to /usr/share/doc ?
671 [07:46:15] <nvz> no, there is no provision for such a thing.. there is a way to divert things elsewhere, there are ways to avoid installing certain packages, but no way to just tell the system don't install to /usr/share/doc
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673 [07:46:40] <nvz> most packages only have a small README.Debian, a Changelog, and maybe a manpage in there anyhow
674 [07:46:51] <nvz> if they have more than that its usually in a seperate -doc package
675 [07:46:53] <fling> How can I remove already installed suggested/recommended packages?
676 [07:47:11] <fling> -doc package! ok, got it
677 [07:47:14] <nvz> that also isn't possible
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679 [07:47:22] <nvz> you can avoid installing those automatically
680 [07:47:37] <fling> already did this
681 [07:47:42] <nvz> but you can't differentiate between an auto installed package that was a dependency and one that was a suggested or recommended
682 [07:47:57] <fling> this is odd
683 [07:47:58] <nvz> what you could do is go mark things you want as manual and autoremove the rest
684 [07:48:19] <fling> ok, will do
685 [07:48:34] <fling> will ugprade it to buster first
686 [07:48:59] <nvz> what I was starting to explain with my mention of MATE/XFCE was that for things like this there are huge all-inclusive metapackages like task-mate-desktop
687 [07:49:05] <nvz> then there are smaller and smaller ones
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689 [07:49:26] <fling> is root of f2fs supported in debian?
690 [07:49:33] <fling> s/of/on/
691 [07:49:41] <nvz> ,depends task-mate-desktop
692 [07:49:42] <judd> Package task-mate-desktop in buster/amd64 -- depends: tasksel (= 3.53), task-desktop, mate-desktop-environment, lightdm.
693 [07:49:54] <nvz> ,depends mate-desktop-environment
694 [07:49:55] <judd> Package mate-desktop-environment in buster/amd64 -- depends: mate-desktop-environment-core (= 1.20.0+5).
695 [07:50:02] <nvz> ,depends mate-desktop-environment-core
696 [07:50:03] <judd> Package mate-desktop-environment-core in buster/amd64 -- depends: caja (>= 1.20.2-2~), fonts-cantarell | fonts-ubuntu, gvfs-backends, marco (>= 1.20), mate-control-center (>= 1.20), mate-desktop (>= 1.20), mate-icon-theme (>= 1.20), mate-menus (>= 1.20), mate-notification-daemon (>= 1.20.0-2~) | notification-daemon, mate-panel (>= 1.20), mate-polkit (>= 1.20), mate-session-manager (>= 1.20), mate-
697 [07:50:04] <judd> settings-daemon (>= 1.20), mate-terminal (>= 1.20), mate-themes (>= 3.22.16), dconf-gsettings-backend | gsettings-backend.
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702 [07:50:46] <nvz> fling: never heard of it, but all that would be required in any linux for something to be usable as a roofs is for it to be supported by the kernel
703 [07:51:01] <nvz> !f2fs
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705 [07:51:16] <nvz> dpkg, hello
706 [07:51:16] <dpkg> hey
707 [07:51:21] <nvz> dpkg, f2fs
708 [07:51:21] <dpkg> no idea, nvz
709 [07:51:21] <fling> also might need mount.f2fs userspace helper in initramfs probably
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711 [07:51:40] <nvz> its a userspace filesystem?
712 [07:51:45] <fling> No.
713 [07:52:21] <fling> general purpose filesystem for non-rotating media
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715 [07:53:09] <fling> might also need fsck.f2fs in initramfs
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717 [07:54:01] <st431> hi, is there anyway to accept dkms license automatically?
718 [07:54:02] <nvz> dpkg, f2fs is <reply>f2fs is a flash friendly filesystem a guide on installing debian to f2fs can be found at replaced-url
719 [07:54:03] <dpkg> okay, nvz
720 [07:54:11] <st431> apt install -y zfs-dkms
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723 [07:56:09] <fling> but zfs has no eula
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725 [07:57:41] <fling> Err:548 replaced-url
726 [07:57:43] <nvz> ,i zfs-dkms
727 [07:57:44] <judd> Package zfs-dkms (contrib/kernel, optional) in buster/amd64: OpenZFS filesystem kernel modules for Linux. Version: 0.7.12-2+deb10u1; Size: 1366.7k; Installed: 10575k; Homepage: replaced-url
728 [07:57:48] <fling> 500 Bad redirection (path)
729 [07:58:04] <nvz> its in contrib which means it requires something non-free by debian's standard
730 [07:58:30] <fling> non-debian-free :>
731 [07:58:40] <nvz> non-dfsg
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733 [07:59:12] <nvz> dpkg, dfsg?
734 [07:59:12] <dpkg> DFSG is the Debian Free Software Guidelines, which are explained at replaced-url
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736 [07:59:25] <nvz> dpkg, contrib?
737 [07:59:25] <dpkg> [contrib] Debian packages that contain <DFSG>-compliant software, but have dependencies not in main (possibly packaged for Debian in non-free). To get contrib packages, add lines like "deb replaced-url
738 [07:59:43] <nvz> ,depends zfs-dkms
739 [07:59:44] <judd> Package zfs-dkms in buster/amd64 -- depends: dkms (>> 2.1.1.2-5), lsb-release, debconf (>= 0.5) | debconf-2.0, perl:any,spl-dkms (<< 0.7.12.), spl-dkms (>= 0.7.12).
740 [07:59:57] <nvz> ,i spl-dkms
741 [07:59:58] <judd> Package spl-dkms (kernel, optional) in buster/amd64: Solaris Porting Layer kernel modules for Linux. Version: 0.7.12-2; Size: 390.4k; Installed: 3064k; Homepage: replaced-url
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743 [08:01:07] <fling> How do I install gstreamer properly if I want rtmp and aac but no X for a headless system
744 [08:01:34] <nvz> fling: if you want to exclude a dependency of something you can use equivs
745 [08:01:45] <nvz> dpkg, equivs
746 [08:01:45] <dpkg> equivs is a package that enables you to create dummy packages that tell <apt> you really have installed (through some other means) the package. apt install equivs, and read /usr/share/doc/equivs/*, see also <usrlocal>. A better plan is often to adapt the Debian packages to your needs, ask me about <package recompile> <uupdate> <ssb>.
747 [08:01:50] <fling> thanks
748 [08:02:05] <nvz> dpkg, package recompile
749 [08:02:05] <dpkg> 1) Add a <deb-src> line for your current release to your sources.list 2) apt update; apt install build-essential devscripts fakeroot; apt build-dep packagename 3) as any user, apt-get source packagename 4) cd packagename-version/; ask me about <debian/rules>; 5) dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us 6) as root, apt install ../packagename-version.deb. Ask me about <debian/rules>, <nocheck>, <nostrip>, <apt-get source>.
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751 [08:02:37] <nvz> fling: you would however have to satisfy the dependency if its actually something the software needs to work
752 [08:02:42] <fling> There are many gstreamer related packages just not sure which ones should be installed like marked manual
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756 [08:02:58] <nvz> fling: installing vnc4server satisfies the need to X in my experience
757 [08:03:27] * fling writes this down
758 [08:03:35] <nvz> ,depends vnc4server
759 [08:03:36] <judd> Package vnc4server in buster/amd64 -- depends: tigervnc-standalone-server.
760 [08:03:51] <nvz> its just a metapackage that depends on tigervnc-standalone-server
761 [08:04:01] <fling> E: Failed to fetch replaced-url
762 [08:04:12] <nvz> but I'd used it in the past on headless machines to install X apps and it didn't require me to install X
763 [08:05:13] <nvz> ,provides tigervnc-standalone-server
764 [08:05:14] <judd> Package tigervnc-standalone-server in buster/amd64 provides: vnc-server, xserver.
765 [08:05:37] <nvz> fling: ^ it satisfies the requirement for an xserver
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768 [08:07:57] <nvz> fling: (apt policy; apt policy libavresample4)|nc termbin.com 9999
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790 [08:27:13] <localbuddha> Hello! This is my first time using an IRC client :)
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792 [08:27:35] <nvz> I'm sorry to hear that
793 [08:27:44] <localbuddha> Why's that?
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796 [08:28:01] <nvz> its just one of those trite canned phrases I use :P
797 [08:28:13] <localbuddha> Ahhh
798 [08:28:18] <nvz> I could've gone with "I'm not gay" instead
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801 [08:29:07] <nvz> localbuddha: this is a support channel, we're narrowly scoped to deal with support questions, the social channel is #debian-offtopic you can /j #debian-offtopic
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803 [08:29:25] <nvz> specifically we deal with support of Debian stable releases here
804 [08:29:41] <localbuddha> Got it, I'll keep that in mind. Thanks :)
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807 [08:30:43] <nvz> come back again when you can't stay so long :P
808 [08:31:13] <nvz> newbies..
809 [08:31:34] <fling> nvz: restarted and it works
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811 [08:32:01] <nvz> um.. ok..
812 [08:32:11] <nvz> I'm sorry to hear that :P
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821 [08:44:14] <fling> haha
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823 [08:45:28] <nvz> rebooting all the time was one of the reasons I became a windows refugee many years ago
824 [08:46:00] <nvz> the microsoft(r) way(tm) of boot, boot, reboot... reinstall.. is not one I think very highly of
825 [08:46:37] <nvz> its not the debian way(tm)
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827 [08:47:01] <nvz> we don't have black box software and sweep our issues under the rug.. thats against our social contract
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831 [08:48:28] <fling> nvz: no, restarted apt
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833 [08:51:40] <saul> what's the best way to install nvidia drivers
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836 [08:52:30] <annadane> install nvidia-detect and run it and install the one it tells you to using apt
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839 [08:55:32] <saul> annadane: replaced-url
840 [08:56:34] <fling> saul: the best way is nouveau
841 [08:56:58] <annadane> it highly depends what you use your computer for. nouveau is very limited, because nvidia doesn't cooperate
842 [08:57:08] <annadane> so, no. not "the best way"
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845 [08:57:59] <annadane> saul, sorry, i'm not entirely sure how to untangle that. i probably shouldn't be doing tech support at 3 AM either, maybe someone else can answer
846 [08:58:07] <saul> annadane: no worries
847 [08:58:13] <saul> i should sleep too
848 [08:58:47] <saul> so far i'm just using desktop but i may try quake at some point i guess
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853 [09:01:47] <annadane> what i like to do is to use aptitude to investigate why dependencies won't resolve
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856 [09:02:42] <nvz> saul: (apt policy; dpkg -l *nvidia*)|nc termbin.com 9999
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891 [09:30:13] <at0m> ,v libcurl3
892 [09:30:14] <judd> Package: libcurl3 on amd64 -- jessie: 7.38.0-4+deb8u11; jessie-security: 7.38.0-4+deb8u15; stretch: 7.52.1-5+deb9u9; stretch-security: 7.52.1-5+deb9u9
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899 [09:36:31] <basilic> hello all
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905 [09:44:13] <fling> So what packages should I install for gstreamer?
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911 [09:46:02] <fling> How do I update my kernel?
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915 [09:51:05] <ratrace> fling: generally you want to upgrade all the software with pending upgrades, using `apt upgrade`, having previously updated the package database with `apt update`
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919 [09:53:59] <nvz> fling: what kernel are you running?
920 [09:54:10] <nvz> fling: and what are you trying to update to?
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923 [09:58:47] <fling> 4.14.71-ti-r80
924 [09:58:50] <fling> idk
925 [09:59:10] <nvz> o.O where did you get that from?
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927 [10:00:57] <fling> idk
928 [10:01:11] <fling> from deb [arch=armhf] replaced-url
929 [10:01:24] <fling> it is on bbb
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934 [10:05:04] <nvz> bbb?
935 [10:05:26] <nvz> !bbb
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937 [10:06:04] <nvz> I'm guessing this is some sbc but I'm unclear what exactly you got goin on there
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942 [10:08:41] <nvz> yeah, you're not running debian if you have that in there.. thats not just merely like armbian with some kernels and a few support packages thats closer to a full repo
943 [10:08:49] <nvz> it has cryptsetup, chromium browser, etc
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959 [10:18:08] <fling> nvz: I don't have cryptsetup and chromium on it
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962 [10:19:49] <nvz> yes but my point is that repo could easily make your system a frankedebian
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971 [10:30:52] <humpled> dun dun durrr...
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1030 [11:13:01] <ZaZaGX> its the 7th. i still didn't get the Debian 10.1 update yet
1031 [11:13:38] <humpled> the 7th waht ?
1032 [11:14:27] <divrppav> 7th day of September
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1034 [11:14:51] <ZaZaGX> yeah
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1036 [11:15:32] <divrppav> There is 10.1 planned at the moment
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1039 [11:16:50] <ratrace> that reminds me to start the before tests for before-after comparisons. something tells me zfs performance is gonna take a deep dive with the 10.1 update as the kernel bumps beyond 4.19.37
1040 [11:18:01] <divrppav> There is no* 10.1 at the moment
1041 [11:18:43] <ratrace> but it's supposed to come up today
1042 [11:19:27] <ratrace> SUA 167-1, announcing 10.1 on Sep 7th 2019
1043 [11:19:56] <nvz> ok so I just imaged a 940G Win10 partition to my ext4 and then like a du-mass deleted the image file accidentally and rather than try recover it which is rather futile anyhow I am just going to rsync the partition to the users home on the server minus on directory that is like 780G already backed up elsewhere.. I was wondering if someone not as sleepy as me could make sure I type the right rsync command I'm
1044 [11:20:02] <nvz> thinking just rsync -avc --exclude /mnt/foo/path /mnt /home/user/ does that sound right?
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1046 [11:20:07] <ninja> what's new in update?
1047 [11:20:34] <nvz> ninja: nothing you won't already have if you have security repos and update your packages that way
1048 [11:20:59] <ninja> nvz: running testing :)
1049 [11:21:44] <nvz> ninja: ah.. well stable point releases are only for making new isos that have the latest security updates basically and testing support is on irc.oftc.net in #debian-next fwiw
1050 [11:22:14] <nvz> I guess nobody savvy and more rested than me is here yet.. so here goes nothing..
1051 [11:23:01] <ratrace> nvz: there's version bumps in some cases too
1052 [11:23:08] <fireba11> hm .. dist-upgrading to buster somehow removed my mariadb .. and sadly it doesn't install php 7.3 counterparts to all installed php 7.0 modules :-)
1053 [11:23:18] <ratrace> like the kernel that becomes available only with the SU
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1055 [11:23:35] <annadane> afaik point releases actually can involve new things on the point release even with a full sources.list, at least i've seen that before
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1057 [11:23:37] <divrppav> you want rsync to be recursive too, need -r flag?
1058 [11:23:43] <annadane> unless my system wasn't "doing it right" at the time...
1059 [11:23:44] <ratrace> annadane: true
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1061 [11:23:51] <ratrace> no, I've seen it too, numerous times
1062 [11:23:57] <humpled> -a covers -r ?
1063 [11:24:01] <annadane> yeah so it's not a sources.list thing
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1065 [11:24:35] * nvz will toss -r in there anywho :P
1066 [11:24:37] <ratrace> annadane: some updates become available only with the publication of SU, so something extra comes along, not just all the updates you already have since previous (point) release
1067 [11:24:39] <divrppav> true, nvm
1068 [11:24:56] <nvz> a redundant flag wont kill anything
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1070 [11:26:23] * nvz stops and remembers to start screen first :P
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1072 [11:26:48] <annadane> maybe simulate it first i suppose if it's that important
1073 [11:27:02] <annadane> -n
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1075 [11:27:11] <annadane> add ALL the flags!
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1078 [11:27:26] <nvz> its not really important just trying to cover bases backing up my mother's hdd before reinstalling to correct the failed win10 upgrade and the fact nobody seems to know the password to recover it :P
1079 [11:27:39] <jaggz> is there a diff util to look at the difference between my config file and what came from the package?
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1081 [11:28:03] <fireba11> nvz: win password recovery is trivial :-P
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1083 [11:28:59] <ratrace> nvz: I'd always include -aAX too.
1084 [11:29:23] <ratrace> specially if you're rsyncing system files or files installed by packages
1085 [11:29:40] <annadane> rsync -abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
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1087 [11:29:50] <nvz> yeah well I haven't used windows since like xp/7 ish and I tried.. apparently its not linked to a MS account, attempts to switch out binaries with a cmd.exe to trigger a admin shell failed..etc
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1090 [11:29:55] <annadane> [kernel panic]
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1092 [11:30:04] <ratrace> lol
1093 [11:30:20] <nvz> all utils I seen that claim to be able to easily recover win10 passwords are commercial and windows only.. and I'm on linux so..
1094 [11:30:37] <nvz> I've done it back in the day with hirens but idk that it will work on win10
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1102 [11:33:21] <astra> still having some issues pertaining modprobe
1103 [11:34:06] <nvz> they claim that system didn't even have a password.. but the recovery tools insist on a password and leaving it blank didnt work.. so.. screw it.. going to backup to a samba share and reinstall
1104 [11:34:08] <astra> perhaps the sources.list or something since its been giving me an error after updating
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1106 [11:37:12] <astra> replaced-url
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1111 [11:38:00] <nvz> astra: whats the background on your issue, are you upgrading a system or what?
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1117 [11:38:38] <astra> clean install on ssd from dvd
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1119 [11:38:58] <nvz> astra: then whats with all the unofficial repos that seem to be the source of the errors you just pasted?
1120 [11:39:48] <astra> that's got to be it
1121 [11:39:54] <nvz> were it me, it'd set a standard debian sources.list with deb.debian.org
1122 [11:40:02] <astra> the cdrom error was baffling as well
1123 [11:40:12] <astra> thank you, dear
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1125 [11:40:16] <nvz> if you're online now comment all that out, just put normal sources
1126 [11:40:19] <nvz> !sources.list
1127 [11:40:20] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Buster" has the lines: "deb replaced-url
1128 [11:40:23] <narbeh> Hello, I have Ubuntu 18.04 server and I'm seeing ksoftirqd/3 process that freezes my server every 10-15 mins, Could anyone help me on this issue? Resources are: 30GB RAM, 8 Cores CPU, SSD, Updated System, Virtualization: Opennebula
1129 [11:40:51] <astra> thank you, nvz
1130 [11:40:56] <astra> truly appreciated
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1133 [11:41:25] <annadane> narbeh, why not ask the ubuntu people? this is debian
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1135 [11:42:18] <narbeh> @annadane Sure, I also asked, I thought because it's kernel related.
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1138 [11:46:41] <zothix> i need help, tell me where do i start, " i have made a website with docker , i bought a server and a domain, my server will consist of multiple sites, right now the server at port 80 does show my website but i want to configure it with domain " where do is start?
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1140 [11:52:50] <narbeh> zothix you need to run dns server on linux (bind9 or named) and configure your webserver. You need to register the domain at first of course
1141 [11:52:55] <ratrace> zothix: easiest thing would be you point your domain at your server's IP from your registrar's panel
1142 [11:53:24] <ratrace> I wouldn't recommend diving into Bind right now
1143 [11:54:25] <narbeh> Yeah maybe he already has the domain panel
1144 [11:54:30] <zothix> ratrace, there was a option " add name server " i added my server ip, but that wasnt accepted
1145 [11:55:01] <ratrace> zothix: doesn't your registrar offer nameserver services?
1146 [11:55:41] <ratrace> you really want to learn all this step by step. you can always run your own Bind server later, when you've learned enough of it
1147 [11:56:25] <zothix> ratrace, let me try explain i am newbie so tell me where m wrong, what i think is i somehow need to put a name server on my own server so that the domain provider can somhow just point t my ip then my ip resolves it to the specified docker running that specific website
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1154 [11:57:59] <ratrace> zothix: nope. if you're running a nameserver then the namserver responds with an IP address when requested for (your) domain
1155 [11:58:32] <ratrace> so what actually happens is the nameserver would respond with the IP your http server is listening on
1156 [11:58:43] <ratrace> whether it's dockerized or not, is orthogonal to this issue
1157 [11:59:09] <zothix> sooo... i cant run multiple websites on a single server then?
1158 [11:59:14] <ratrace> however... you're asking a very broad question with many components and moving parts, too broad to handle everything if you never did it and have only irc to guide you
1159 [11:59:35] <ratrace> zothix: sure you can. the http server (let's say nginx) can be configured to run multiple domains.
1160 [12:00:01] <ratrace> also why docker. I'd recommend you don't use docker until you've grasped basic concepts. In fact don't use it at all, but eh...
1161 [12:00:33] <zothix> it was just easier to put on server with docker xD
1162 [12:00:44] <ratrace> I doubt that
1163 [12:01:23] <zothix> well i just composed with docker push it to hub, then pull it from server by making a docker compose file there
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1165 [12:02:26] <ratrace> what's in the docker?
1166 [12:02:34] <zothix> the website
1167 [12:02:42] <zothix> i want to host
1168 [12:02:43] <ratrace> what's "the website"? static HTML files?
1169 [12:02:55] <zothix> no its a django based Blog site
1170 [12:03:08] <ratrace> django. and what else is in the docker? which application server for django?
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1172 [12:03:57] <zothix> in docker i got a postgre container, go access container, nginx container, and a web (django )container
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1176 [12:04:58] <ratrace> can't you install all those components in debian directly?
1177 [12:05:29] <zothix> i could, but shifting em here n there is a drag.. so i used docker also it was a new tech and i found it cool :(
1178 [12:07:03] <ratrace> but it's preventing you from learning how to manage individual components and how they work together
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1180 [12:07:31] <ratrace> you can't just stick a docker into a server and expect it all to run just like that without carefully configuring all the parts
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1182 [12:07:47] <humpled> dial the number and turn the key!
1183 [12:08:00] <ratrace> friendly advice, dich the docker and install all the compoents with apt. configure them properly, individually as they should be
1184 [12:08:25] <ratrace> you can always go back to docker later once you've learned how every part of "running a website" works.
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1186 [12:09:19] <zothix> ratrace, after installing it, how do i make my domian point towards my server ip
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1188 [12:09:41] <ratrace> zothix: you go to your registrar and find their "nameserver" service, then use that to point *their* nameservers to your IP
1189 [12:10:07] <ratrace> or install Bind9, learn how to configure it and especially all the security gothcas of running a easy-to-abuse authoritative DNS server
1190 [12:10:46] <zothix> alright ill look into bind9
1191 [12:10:52] <ratrace> lol
1192 [12:11:08] <zothix> xD whaat
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1194 [12:11:31] <zothix> u gotta start somehwere xD this is testing so i might just go all the way
1195 [12:12:18] <ratrace> well that'd be okay if you did it on LAN. but you're installing easy to abuse programs on public server.
1196 [12:12:36] <zothix> ill try it on my pc first then
1197 [12:12:38] <ratrace> you're opening yourself to criminal liability AND you're putting other servers online in danger
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1199 [12:13:22] <ratrace> zothix: or go step by step. you don't need to run your own nameserver right now, do you?
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1202 [12:13:38] <zothix> the domain m using isnt giving me a name server
1203 [12:13:39] <zothix> ..
1204 [12:13:44] <ratrace> you want to run a django site. django, python and nginx are the minimum components you need to install, and postgres yeah
1205 [12:13:47] <zothix> it says " add your own name server "
1206 [12:13:53] <ratrace> zothix: change your registrar then
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1208 [12:14:12] <zothix> ratrace, umm thats a good idea
1209 [12:14:13] <zothix> thanks
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1248 [12:46:39] <phiwer> Anyone doing kernel dev using debian as distribution here? I have some questions related to it.
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1393 [14:27:43] <nvz> phiwer: usage polls are not really constructive.. if you ask your question we know the scope of what you're looking for and perhaps could redirect you.. generally speaking this is a channel of users helping users with debian stable the developers of debian hang out elsewhere
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1418 [14:53:28] <ws2k3> hoping someone can advise. i have 2 debian 7 boxes. both running mysql. allmost identical setup. but when i do "mysql" one box nicely includes debian.cnf as it should. but the other one doesnt. so im wondering where is it defined/configured that mysql client should include debian.cnf?
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1421 [14:53:47] <ws2k3> i searched in the my.cnf and there is nothing about include there
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1432 [15:02:03] <abrotman> ws2k3: which mysql packages are you using?
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1458 [15:22:18] <UnknownSh-t> hello
1459 [15:22:30] <UnknownSh-t> anybody here?
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1461 [15:23:24] <UnknownSh-t> here have 1543 people online right?
1462 [15:24:23] <whislock> You're welcome to ask your question or describe your issue. If someone is available and can assist, they will.
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1465 [15:24:56] <nvz> dpkg, person?
1466 [15:24:56] <dpkg> it has been said that person is like a bot, but squishier
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1605 [17:21:01] <Greyztar> hello,are there any popular alternatives to evernote in debian? Maybe one with android app aswell, i used keepnote awhile but theres no android app i could find though
1606 [17:21:14] <XsiSec> Hi guys I am on debian stretch (9.9) I should need to mount a lvm2 partition though when I trying I get "Unsupported LUKS version 2." I have that installed as well :(
1607 [17:21:38] <cluelessperson> Greyztar I like simple text files inside a git repository
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1609 [17:22:14] <cluelessperson> XsiSec I think `cryptsetup` is usually used to mount luks volumes
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1611 [17:22:38] <XsiSec> cluelessperson, thats what I have been trying with --> sudo cryptsetup luksOpen /dev/sda5 /mnt/120GB
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1615 [17:22:54] <XsiSec> then I get that error :(
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1617 [17:23:07] <Greyztar> cluelessperson: thanks !
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1623 [17:23:47] <XsiSec> though when I open pcmanfm, I can see the disk on lefthandside in the list, but when I click also using the passphrase, it says Not authorized to perform operation
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1627 [17:24:06] <cluelessperson> Greyztar using a git repo, you can maintain a todo list and every change to it over time
1628 [17:24:16] <cluelessperson> and the files/entries you make over time
1629 [17:24:18] <cluelessperson> pretty neat I think
1630 [17:24:57] <cluelessperson> XsiSec what version of cryptsetup do you have installed?
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1634 [17:25:54] <XsiSec> 2:1.7.3-4
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1636 [17:26:19] <Greyztar> cluelessperson: im already using it for my scripts,to be honest i just didnt think of it to use as taking notes which might work great with the change history thanks for the tip again
1637 [17:26:42] <XsiSec> How can I make my regular user be able to perform the authorized operation?
1638 [17:26:49] <XsiSec> that's maybe solves it
1639 [17:27:07] <XsiSec> it says Not authorized to perform operation
1640 [17:27:27] <cluelessperson> XsiSec my version of cryptsetup is 2.1
1641 [17:27:35] <cluelessperson> maybe you need to upgrade that to support version 2
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1643 [17:27:54] <XsiSec> it's over 2? --> 2:1.7.3-4
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1647 [17:28:19] <XsiSec> how do I upgrade it from command line? sudo apt-get install cryptosetup -upgrade?
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1650 [17:30:08] <XsiSec> "Reading state information... Done
1651 [17:30:08] <XsiSec> cryptsetup is already the newest version (2:1.7.3-4).
1652 [17:30:08] <XsiSec> "
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1655 [17:31:14] <cluelessperson> XsiSec maybe you need to install it from another repo
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1657 [17:31:52] <XsiSec> how? :/
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1659 [17:32:10] <XsiSec> I have been trying partitionmanager also kvpm
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1687 [17:47:10] <nvz> ,v cryptsetup
1688 [17:47:11] <judd> Package: cryptsetup on amd64 -- jessie: 2:1.6.6-5; stretch: 2:1.7.3-4; buster: 2:2.1.0-5; buster-proposed-updates: 2:2.1.0-5+deb10u2; bullseye: 2:2.2.0-1; sid: 2:2.2.0-1
1689 [17:47:50] <nvz> they left already, but thats version 1.7 obviously.. and the crypt was created on a system with 2.x and it would appear there wasnt a backport made
1690 [17:48:02] <nvz> ,depends cryptsetup
1691 [17:48:03] <judd> Package cryptsetup in buster/amd64 -- depends: cryptsetup-initramfs (>= 2:2.0.3-1), cryptsetup-run (>= 2:2.0.3-1).
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1700 [17:59:29] <Gerowen> Random question. This is the first system I've ever encrypted the drive on. TRIM is a "mount" argument, which means it shouldn't be hindered by the encryption and should work just fine on an encrypted drive, correct?
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1702 [18:01:06] <ratrace> Gerowen: if that's LUKS encryption, you'd also need to tell it to allow_discards, because trim has some security implications on
1703 [18:01:36] <ratrace> %s/allow_discards/allow discards/
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1705 [18:01:53] <Gerowen> ratrace: Yeah it's LUKS, the default encryption method that's included in the Debian installer.
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1707 [18:02:09] <Gerowen> I was just curious, educating myself. I don't have any particular concerns about performance.
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1709 [18:02:28] <Gerowen> I'll probably just leave it off, but I got to wondering whether or how it would work on an encrypted drive.
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1711 [18:03:17] <ratrace> Gerowen: they don't interact directly. trimming is hardware command, encryption is mathematical conversion of data before hardware gets to store it
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1713 [18:04:02] <ratrace> ie. the hardware has no idea it's storing "encrypted" bits -- assuming we're talking about LUKS here
1714 [18:04:22] <Gerowen> ratrace: That's what I understood about TRIM, that it was a command sent to the drive, hence my curiosity about it and encryption. Which, I guess whether it's encrypted or not doesn't matter.
1715 [18:05:08] <ratrace> it only matters in the part where trimmed sectors "leak" cryptographical info
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1717 [18:06:11] <ratrace> the "leak" is actually in the fact that a sector is marked unused, so the "attacker" would have that information which would help them in cryptanalysis
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1724 [18:14:49] <ratrace> 80 packages upgradable, on otherwise up to date system (last run yesterday), with the 10.1 SU
1725 [18:15:10] <ratrace> yeah, there's always something new coming in. it's not just a cutoff for ISOs
1726 [18:15:54] <Habbie> 135 upgraded and one new here
1727 [18:15:58] <Habbie> but my last upgrade was not yesterday :)
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1742 [18:22:49] <RobV> does anyone have a purism laptop? i was considering getting one, by the reviews are not so good
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1748 [18:29:43] <phogg> RobV: What reviews? I don't know about you, but I find it hard to trust reviewers to evaluate using the kind of criteria that matter to me.
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1755 [18:34:09] <oer> purism offers more than 1 laptop ..
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1800 [19:11:57] <pvoigt> My upgrade to point release 10.1 just finished smothly. lsb_release, however, still shows version 10 instead of 10.1. Am I missing something?
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1803 [19:16:13] <nvz> pvoigt: debian afaik dropped lsb support years ago
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1805 [19:16:49] <nvz> pvoigt: cat /etc/debian_version
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1807 [19:17:04] <nvz> and you also should've seen a notice from apt that the release changed
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1810 [19:17:39] <jhutchins> pvoigt: Also notice that it's 10, not 10.0. It only shows the major version, not the point release.
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1816 [19:19:37] <nvz> at some point, after I get some sleep I need to figure out wth I did to break my system.. heh. I think its due to having installed then immediately removed xen
1817 [19:20:02] <nvz> my last upgrade showed errors with initramfs and my virtualbox modules failed to build
1818 [19:20:02] <phiwer2> any debian based kernel developers in the channel?
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1820 [19:20:45] <nvz> phiwer2: my answer is same as it was before.. usage polls aren't constructive.. ask your real question and either we answer it or we can redirect you
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1822 [19:21:10] <nvz> this is a channel of users supporting users, this is not the kernel development channel, this is not a developer channel at all
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1826 [19:22:18] <phiwer2> nvz, yes, but the question I have is borderline :)
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1828 [19:22:57] <nvz> yes, I'm familiar with schrodingers cat
1829 [19:23:17] <nvz> but lets face it.. that cat is alive or dead, it cant be both.. open the damn box :P
1830 [19:23:35] <Primer> It was a ruse! The box is empty!
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1832 [19:23:56] <phiwer2> The question is: How many patches are applied (or how custom maybe is a better word), is the debian kernel vs vanilla?
1833 [19:24:18] <Primer> packages.debian.org, linux-image, check the dsc
1834 [19:24:18] <nvz> really? thats a simple question well within the scope of this channel
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1836 [19:24:20] <phiwer2> Or is it only configuration that is different?
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1839 [19:25:29] <phiwer2> Primer, I'll check there first and see if there's enough information. Tnx.
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1849 [19:30:44] <nvz> phiwer2: replaced-url
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1855 [19:33:48] <phiwer2> nvz, thank you
1856 [19:33:55] <pvoigt> nvz, jhutchins: Thanks for clarification. Debian Stretch supported lsb_relase up to the latest point release, if I am not completely wrong. ;-)
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1858 [19:38:06] <nvz> !9.9
1859 [19:38:06] <dpkg> Debian 9.9 was released on Apr 27, 2019. This point release corrects some serious bugs and copies security updates across to the main archive. Given the <kernel ABI> has changed, apt-get will require a dist-upgrade to upgrade. Further details are at replaced-url
1860 [19:38:15] <nvz> !lsb
1861 [19:38:15] <dpkg> hmm... lsb is Debian is dropping LSB support; see replaced-url
1862 [19:38:29] <nvz> lsb was dropped in like 2015
1863 [19:38:35] <nvz> 9.9 was released in 2019
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1879 [19:51:45] <bandali> hi, i’m having trouble installing debian on an xps 15, with a uefi lvm-on-luks setup on a nvme disk
1880 [19:51:59] <karlpinc> !errors
1881 [19:51:59] <dpkg> If you don't tell us the exact error messages you get, we can't tell you what's wrong, and it's also useful to know exactly what command you're typing. Please look for the *first* error that occurs, as this is often the cause of later errors -- ask me about <localized errors> too. Please don't paste in the channel, use a pastebin instead; ask me about <pastebin>.
1882 [19:52:00] <bandali> the installation goes through just fine, but after rebooting, i’m dropped into grub’s shell
1883 [19:52:21] <bandali> i was wondering if there are any known issues with any part of this setup?
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1886 [19:53:36] <bandali> i don’t recall seeing any errors, except one grub error mentioning something about /dev/sda (which my machine doesn’t have, since it’s nvme, and has /dev/nvme0 instead)
1887 [19:54:07] <bandali> e.g. i was wondering if grub is hard-coded to look for and use /dev/sda rather than /dev/nvme0 ?
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1889 [19:54:54] <karlpinc> bandali: Do you have access to the grub info pages, perhaps at gnu.org?
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1892 [19:55:21] <karlpinc> bandali: You could poke around in the grub shell and see if grub can see your device.
1893 [19:55:36] <bandali> karlpinc, yes, but e.g. searching for “nvme” in the manual doesn’t yield anything
1894 [19:56:11] <bandali> sadly i’m very unfamiliar with the inner workings of grub, i always found it overwhelming
1895 [19:56:22] <bandali> (e.g. compared to syslinux, i believe it was called)
1896 [19:56:26] <karlpinc> bandali: grub 1 was fine. Grub 2 is complex.
1897 [19:56:44] <bandali> ha
1898 [19:56:46] <karlpinc> bandali: There's a way to bypass grub and boot the kernel right out of uefi. But I don't know details.
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1900 [19:57:24] <bandali> i think i’ve had trouble with uefi and debian installer in the past too
1901 [19:57:30] <karlpinc> bandali: You might run whatever command it is in the grub shell that looks for disks.
1902 [19:57:56] <karlpinc> bandali: You seem to have it installed.... It's just the booting part that needs work.
1903 [19:58:11] <bandali> yeah, the installation went through just fine
1904 [19:58:12] <karlpinc> Gotta run.
1905 [19:58:27] <karlpinc> bandali: Then it won't be debian specific, (probably)
1906 [19:58:30] <bandali> is there a short-ish grub tutorial one could read, without having to read all of grub’s manual?
1907 [19:58:36] <bandali> ha…
1908 [19:58:49] <bandali> i guess i can try a legacy boot setup on the same machine and see if it works
1909 [19:58:56] <cstls> is there a cli for controlling brightness?
1910 [19:59:19] <bandali> cstls, i use replaced-url
1911 [19:59:24] <cstls> thanks bandali
1912 [19:59:31] <bandali> cheers cstls
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1915 [20:00:01] <karlpinc> Speaking of screen brightness, redshift is kinda cool.
1916 [20:00:12] <bandali> ye
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1918 [20:00:33] <bandali> anyhow, if anyone knows of a short- to mid-length grub reference/tutorial please let me know
1919 [20:00:42] <cstls> ooh. will check that one, too. i'm on an old macbook pro and gnome is by daily driver, but when i want to get some more juice out of it i'm switching to i3
1920 [20:01:02] <cstls> i need to configure some bindings for the play buttons, brightness, etc.
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1954 [20:22:37] <f8e3> whats the probability that two programs on 2core have the same int(time()) epoch python?
1955 [20:23:07] <f8e3> on time.time() i get 1567880524.8242311, is it close to zero?
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1957 [20:23:24] <joze> no idea
1958 [20:24:00] <joze> divede amount of transistors per voltage?
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1961 [20:24:58] <f8e3> i like to have two programs and use time to have unique ordered, i dont want collision?
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1963 [20:26:18] <bandali> yay, 10.1 released :)
1964 [20:27:03] <joze> time to unjessie
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1966 [20:27:12] <joze> when in mood
1967 [20:27:25] <ratrace> f8e3: what's the actual problem you want to solve?
1968 [20:27:28] <ratrace> !xy
1969 [20:27:28] <dpkg> Slow down for a bit! Are you sure that you need to jump through that particular hoop to achieve your goal? We suspect you don't, so why don't you back up a bit and tell us about the overall objective... We know that people often falsely diagnose problems because they are too close to them -- it's easy to miss that there is a better way to proceed. See replaced-url
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1987 [20:35:23] <joze> seems like when i upgrade jessie to buster the mysql to maria upgrade is borked
1988 [20:35:35] <joze> how unconformtable
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1990 [20:36:45] <ratrace> joze: did you go through stretch first?
1991 [20:37:04] <joze> n-no
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1993 [20:38:04] <ratrace> joze: not sure skipping releases is a supported upgrade path
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1995 [20:38:50] <joze> I blame cosmic rays shooting in the mysql db
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2000 [20:41:57] <cristian_c> hi
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2002 [20:42:37] <cristian_c> I've created a samba share and I've tried to hide share's subfolders
2003 [20:43:03] <cristian_c> but unfortunately subfolders are still displayed
2004 [20:43:27] <cristian_c> what's the proper method in prder to hide sub-folders?
2005 [20:43:31] <cristian_c> Any ideas?
2006 [20:43:35] <teclo-> evening, when will the .iso and .torrent files for Debian GNU/Linux 10.1 be available on cdimage.debian.org ?
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2009 [20:44:13] <teclo-> cristian_c: hidden ? well, how did you try hiding subfolders ?
2010 [20:44:43] <Maws> Hava a program that runs (in terminal) fine if I'm in the program directory, but if I add the directory to PATH, it "runs" but give me an error message of "Unknown architecture 'x86_64'" - there is a sub directory called this, I suspect the program is looking for this folder - but adding that folder to PATH doesn't solve the problem - any tips/ideas ?.
2011 [20:44:46] <cristian_c> I've tried to use: hide files = /*(/)/
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2013 [20:45:01] <teclo-> cristian_c: ah...
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2017 [20:45:41] <cristian_c> teclo-: what's the proper syntax?
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2019 [20:46:20] <SerajewelKS> huh, ordered some RAM from newegg and they sent me two sticks. the product page doesn't say 2x anywhere and the order quantity is 1. *shrug*
2020 [20:46:21] <teclo-> cristian_c: I have no idea....
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2024 [20:46:29] <SerajewelKS> free upgrade, i guess
2025 [20:46:44] <teclo-> cristian_c: I don't see what could be useful in "hiding" files in a samba share
2026 [20:47:14] <cristian_c> teclo-: accessing just only to root directory
2027 [20:47:26] <cristian_c> *share root directory
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2044 [20:49:57] <cristian_c> Maws: I wonder if adding other directories to PATH return error messages again
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2056 [20:52:40] <Maws> cristian_c, Yea, it gives me same error even if the x86_64 folder is added to path
2057 [20:54:01] <SerajewelKS> i think i figured out how to deal with my desire to expand storage on my server but inability to find a nas that's inexpensive and reliable... everything i've found has been both expensive and had bad reviews
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2059 [20:54:23] <SerajewelKS> thinking of putting debian or a debian-based something on ODROID-HC2s and make them an iscsi target
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2061 [20:54:56] <SerajewelKS> only problem is each system is a single disk so i can't raid on the target itself, i'll have to raid two targets on the server... not sure how the network is going to like that
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2063 [20:55:20] <SerajewelKS> would be nice if iscsi writes could multicast
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2079 [21:00:12] <cristian_c> Maws: I've made a different question
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2090 [21:03:17] <Habbie> SerajewelKS, multicast would not solve a lot - you'd still want independent acknowledgements from each of the RAID1 parts
2091 [21:03:22] <Habbie> SerajewelKS, at best you're saving some bandwidth
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2096 [21:05:35] <AC3_> v identify ace@luci
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2101 [21:08:59] <SerajewelKS> Habbie: right, the acks have to come back but yeah, saving bandwidth as well as latency (the second write would have higher latency from initial fsync)
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2103 [21:09:33] <SerajewelKS> someone remind me, is it better to have 8GB RAM with two sticks or 12GB RAM with three sticks, condidering that one stick won't be paired
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2125 [21:14:17] <annadane> is pulseaudio just really broken in openbox? i'm trying to run a game and i keep gettting distorted sound...
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2130 [21:15:15] <annadane> as a side note it works better in buster than stretch but i'm tempted to just use something else...
2131 [21:15:27] <humpled> never had a problem
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2157 [21:22:55] <annadane> oh i think i might know what it is. i could set pulseaudio to autostart
2158 [21:23:11] <brutser> is there a 10.0.1 release planned soon?
2159 [21:23:17] <annadane> today, yes
2160 [21:23:23] <brutser> ok
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2163 [21:23:29] <annadane> it was officially released, may take time to hit your mirror
2164 [21:23:38] <brutser> yes sure np
2165 [21:24:22] <annadane> though it's 10.1, not 10.0.1 :P
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2174 [21:25:21] <Maws> Is it enough to add "include /usr/local/lib/" to /etc/ld.so.conf to have that "library folder available ? (when manually installing programs that need libs from this place ?
2175 [21:25:41] <Maws> how would I "reload that .conf file without a restart ?
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2245 [21:52:44] <karlpinc> Maws: ldconfig
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2422 [22:48:11] <davorin> evening (o;
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2425 [22:48:29] <davorin> is there a way to tell an ethernet interface not to set default gateway?
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2431 [22:48:52] <davorin> have two static interfaces..one wan, one lan....but it installs two default routers...
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2436 [22:49:19] <davorin> seems the "nogateay" option is not recognized..
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2453 [22:52:06] <velix> Hi there. Yesterday we talked about me having a problem to mix "moreutils" and a community package of "GNU parallel", which collide in "/usr/bin/parallel". Since I don't need the parallel of moreutils, I wanted to find a way to not break "dpkg". I came up with this solution. What do you think? replaced-url
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2476 [22:58:55] <davorin> bugger...no way to have an ethernet interface without default route
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2479 [22:59:14] <davorin> still getting two default routes...for two static interfaces...
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2494 [23:01:46] *** Quits: likevinyl (~likevinyl@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
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2497 [23:03:13] <aaro> davorin: assign a static address to it without gateway defined in /etc/network/interfaces
2498 [23:03:27] <davorin> i did that...
2499 [23:03:36] <davorin> seems dhcpcd messes with it
2500 [23:03:50] *** Quits: Uberius (~Uberius@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Quit)
2501 [23:03:53] <davorin> switched from dynamic wan to static wan
2502 [23:03:55] *** Joins: likevinyl (~likevinyl@replaced-ip )
2503 [23:04:04] *** Quits: Space_Man_ (~Space_Man@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2504 [23:04:05] *** likevinyl is now known as Guest83188
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2509 [23:05:37] *** Quits: progart1 (~kamee@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving.)
2510 [23:05:51] <aaro> if you use static addressing dhcpcd should not be running at all for that interface
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2515 [23:07:50] <davorin> but it is running...stopping does not help...removed now the lan side from dhcpcd.conf
2516 [23:07:54] <davorin> even worse now....
2517 [23:08:05] <davorin> Destination Gateway Genmask Flags MSS Window irtt Iface
2518 [23:08:05] <davorin> 0.0.0.0 10.0.0.1 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 enp1s0
2519 [23:08:05] <davorin> 0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 0.0.0.0 U 0 0 0 enp2s0
2520 [23:08:31] <aaro> are you using something like networkmanager or similar?
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2523 [23:08:44] *** Guest16508 is now known as argusbr
2524 [23:08:55] <davorin> only installed debian 9 headless
2525 [23:09:12] <davorin> running on an apu2
2526 [23:09:17] <lupine> apu2 ^5
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2529 [23:10:18] <davorin> on a fresh install i don't have the problem...so indeed the switch from dhcp to static caused the screwup
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2534 [23:12:57] <aaro> maybe you can paste your interfaces file on paste.debian.net
2535 [23:13:17] *** Quits: humpled (~i@replaced-ip ) (Quit: hello)
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2539 [23:14:27] *** Joins: BlueViola (~U6D9g3Rw_@replaced-ip )
2540 [23:14:48] <davorin> replaced-url
2541 [23:15:20] *** Joins: lankanmon (~LKNnet@replaced-ip )
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2543 [23:15:34] <davorin> and dhcpcd is still running...even when renaming /etc/dhcpcd.conf
2544 [23:16:09] *** Quits: bablux (~bablux@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC - ##replaced-url
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2559 [23:21:01] <davorin> ah now (o;
2560 [23:21:22] <davorin> update-rc.d -f dhcpcd remove (o;
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2563 [23:23:05] *** Quits: Jerrynicki (~niklas@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2564 [23:23:24] <davorin> so it seems dhcpcd doesn't care at all about static entries in /etc/network/interfaces (o;
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2624 [23:39:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1553
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2630 [23:40:41] <davorin> bugger..next problem...one debian server won't use ipv6 as default...
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