People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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2 [00:04:28] <LtL> frogwine: that looks fine, but firmware isn't loading properly and i can't say whats wrong, unless you used non debian firmwares
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5 [00:07:04] <LtL> frogwine: i also see a debian bug mentioned, but it's dinner time so i'll have to get back to you. hopefully someone has ideas. sorry
6 [00:07:28] <frogwine> LtL: okay, thanks.
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8 [00:07:56] <frogwine> have a good dinner
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23 [00:12:24] <dionysus70> hey all
24 [00:12:36] <dionysus70> need help with some digital voodoo
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26 [00:13:33] <dionysus70> I am looking for a software being able to record both screen and the sound outgoing from the aux/speakers, without the microphone!
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34 [00:15:49] <at0m> dionysus70: obs replaced-url
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36 [00:16:52] <dionysus70> thanks at0m allot! will get started
37 [00:17:06] <at0m> dionysus70: in repo's as obs-studio
38 [00:17:17] <at0m> ,v obs-studio
39 [00:17:18] <judd> Package: obs-studio on amd64 -- stretch: 0.15.4+dfsg1-1+b1; bullseye: 22.0.3+dfsg1-1; buster: 22.0.3+dfsg1-1; sid: 22.0.3+dfsg1-1; stretch-multimedia: 1:19.0.2-dmo2+deb9u1; buster-multimedia: 1:23.2.1-dmo1; bullseye-multimedia: 1:23.2.1-dmo2; sid-multimedia: 1:23.2.1-dmo2
40 [00:17:25] <dionysus70> even better
41 [00:17:53] <at0m> dionysus70: as for "without the microphone", that depends on your audio route/settings
42 [00:17:54] <LtL> frogwine: what kernel are you using? 'uname -a'
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44 [00:18:35] <dionysus70> LtL: 4.9.0-8-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.130-2 (2018-10-27) x86_64 GNU/Linux
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48 [00:19:19] <LtL> dionysus70: um, i asked frogwine
49 [00:19:24] <dionysus70> it's my 3-4 year laptop, cannot use latest kernels, bugs like freezing due to (I assume intel graphics)
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52 [00:20:12] <dionysus70> oh, right ok
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68 [00:30:39] <preyalone> package g++-ia64-linux-gnu exists in repo, but does not show an entry on the package web explorer
69 [00:31:23] <klys> ,v g++-ia64-linux-gnu
70 [00:31:25] <judd> No package named 'g++-ia64-linux-gnu' was found in amd64.
71 [00:33:28] <preyalone> er looks like an alias of g++:ia64
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73 [00:34:44] <LtL> dionysus70: you mentioned wificard installed or cosimo did, perhaps that interferes with iwlwifi
74 [00:35:13] <preyalone> ... and g++:ia64's /usr/bin/ia64-linux-gnu-g++ is not actually runnable on amd64 hosts. that's some goofy packaging right there :P
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76 [00:36:57] <LtL> dionysus70: be sure you have, firmware-linux firmware-linux-free firmware-linux-nonfree and firmware-misc-nonfree installed, i believe they all exist on stretch. reinstall if needed
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81 [00:40:34] <LtL> dionysus70: that was for frogwine, who left, so sorry.
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91 [00:49:08] <jimm> I'm looking at debian live images, and one is called "standard" (filename is debian-live-10.0.0-amd64-standard.iso)... what's on this image?
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100 [00:57:06] <EdePopede> jimm: i'd say it's the one without a DE (825M vs. 2.2G for the others)
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103 [01:03:54] <EdePopede> couldn't find a wm here > replaced-url
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118 [01:12:03] <bazzle__> Hey guys!
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122 [01:14:52] <preyalone> no g++-powerpcspe-linux-gnu exists? how are devs supposed to build stuff for powerpcspe from non-powerpcspe?
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131 [01:22:22] <jimm> EdePopede, so possibly not X either
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133 [01:22:59] <EdePopede> there are some packages, no idea if it is enough to have X running. and if, what wm they use.
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141 [01:26:12] <Eryn_1983_FL> hey guys can u help me out with thunderbird please
142 [01:26:14] <Eryn_1983_FL> INFO -> [[ ... using verbose mode ... ]]
143 [01:26:16] <Eryn_1983_FL> DEBUG -> call '/usr/lib/thunderbird/thunderbird '
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145 [01:26:18] <Eryn_1983_FL> lock: Permission denied
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147 [01:26:30] <Eryn_1983_FL> i got no process running where is the lockfile
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154 [01:28:56] <ayekat> Eryn_1983_FL: is that the output to the terminal when you invoke `thunderbird` from a shell? could you please paste the full output to a paste service?
155 [01:29:01] <Eryn_1983_FL> yeah
156 [01:29:08] <Eryn_1983_FL> ok
157 [01:29:45] <lembron> hi, munin-apt_all -- has been updated with buster to automatically determin the repos - but this also grabs "buster-updates" throwing it into 'E: The value 'buster-updates' is invalid for APT::Default-Release as such a release is not available in the sources' seems borky?
158 [01:29:49] <Eryn_1983_FL> replaced-url
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160 [01:30:33] <lembron> the distros it checks used to be a list, but with buster was changed to parsing `apt-get update --print-uris`
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163 [01:33:20] <ayekat> Eryn_1983_FL: I'm not really familiar with thunderbird, but... 'permission denied' sounds like a problem that could arise from running thunderbird as root - have you ever done that?
164 [01:34:15] <ayekat> (unless it's really just thunderbird's way of telling you there is a lockfile, but the choice of words would be a bit awkward/confusing then)
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166 [01:35:36] <Eryn_1983_FL> nope ayekat
167 [01:35:43] <jimm> can I set up a live image so I can install packages?
168 [01:35:44] <Eryn_1983_FL> yeah...
169 [01:35:51] <Eryn_1983_FL> im going to uninstall and install again
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191 [01:48:38] <cr0w3> how to ditch my ipv6 address
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200 [01:52:41] <kreyren> `SysV init version: 2.95`
201 [01:52:42] <kreyren> :3
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214 [02:06:48] <SerajewelKS> is there a way to revert an LVM logical volume back to the state of an existing snapshots (e.g. move all of the COW'd blocks from the snapshot back into the parent volume)?
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216 [02:07:03] <SerajewelKS> lvconvert --merge looks promising but this talks about "split snapshots" which AIUI isn't what i'm talking about
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225 [02:11:35] <jmcnaught> SerajewelKS: --merge is how I've always done it.
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241 [02:22:15] <bazzle__> Hey guys how do I get hibernation to work?
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243 [02:25:00] <jmcnaught> What have you tried? What happened instead?
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249 [02:32:34] <annadane> dig a hole, bring some nuts, sleep for the winter
250 [02:33:14] <uRock> ^^^works for me
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252 [02:34:02] <uRock> maybe add in some wine or mead for nutrition and warmth.
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261 [02:50:29] <SerajewelKS> jmcnaught: gotcha thanks
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268 [02:56:10] <SerajewelKS> i'm asking because on my home server i have 10% free VG space for snapshots (i use them for nightly backups) and am considering taking a snapshot before upgrading so if things go sideways i can just revert to the snapshot to try again
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270 [02:57:05] <SerajewelKS> so now i need to figure out what services to mask while i upgrade
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275 [03:03:02] <jimm> hi, update on the missing gpt partition table: gdisk found the correct partition table, but it says the mbr is corrupt... what's the best approach?
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289 [03:14:18] <kreyren> How do i nuke libsystemd0 from my system? replaced-url
290 [03:14:21] <kreyren> it's causing issues
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294 [03:17:17] <jmcnaught> !bat
295 [03:17:17] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
296 [03:17:32] <kreyren> replaced-url
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298 [03:17:58] <kreyren> replaced-url
299 [03:18:00] <jmcnaught> What issues is libsystemd0 causing? Is it not enough to have something else as init, do you really need to get all of systemd off your system?
300 [03:18:18] <kreyren> yep since this franken debian is running openrc
301 [03:18:42] <jmcnaught> By frankendebian you mean a mix of distros or releases?
302 [03:18:52] <kreyren> currently releases
303 [03:18:52] <jmcnaught> Or do you think that openrc makes it a frankendebian?
304 [03:19:03] <kreyren> i have 430 nvidia drivers from experimental
305 [03:19:08] <kreyren> on bullseye
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307 [03:19:14] <jmcnaught> !debian-next
308 [03:19:14] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
309 [03:19:19] <Henry151> hi #debian; I'm having one odd issue since my update to 10 -- when I go to take a screenshot with xfce4-screenshooter, the interface/dialog-box for saving it and such has changed a little, but the issue is, there's a noticeably longer delay between when i run "xfce4-screenshooter" and when that dialog pops up and the capture occurs. It's probably 1.5 seconds or more, where it was almost instantaneous
310 [03:19:20] <kreyren> meh
311 [03:19:25] <Henry151> previously. Any ideas for how I might improve that?
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313 [03:19:48] <jmcnaught> kreyren: only stable is supported in this channel, in #debian-next you'll find other users using testing/sid/experimental
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315 [03:20:21] <Henry151> i'm sorry, i mis-stated that, the delay is not between running the command "xfce4-screenshooter' and seeing the dialog, it's between clicking "OK" on the dialog, and the actual capture occurring
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318 [03:21:31] <Henry151> oh wait nevermind entirely i just figured it out. Previously, the "delay before capturing" setting would be greyed out if you selected "select a region", but now, it is not, and so, it delays for however many seconds that is set for, even when selecting a region.
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322 [03:29:14] <Henry151> ok maybe i have a real question too! how do i tell timidity not to start automatically when i reboot?
323 [03:29:45] <Henry151> oh i got that one too i think, systemctl disable timidity, right? :)
324 [03:31:44] <jmcnaught> Yes, and if you find that something is still starting it anyways then you can also 'systemctl mask timidity' which won't allow it to be started even manually.
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328 [03:35:17] <Henry151> i see
329 [03:36:37] <Henry151> maybe i could get a little more insight into systemctl... when I do systemctl start/stop/whatever servicename on my laptop, i do it as my primary user account, "henry", and it says "Authenticating as: Henry Romp,,, (henry)"
330 [03:36:55] <Henry151> when i do it on my server, it requires me to authenticate as root
331 [03:37:10] <Henry151> where are the settings for that, and what is the "best practice"?
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333 [03:37:28] <jmcnaught> Henry151: are you in the sudo group on both systems?
334 [03:38:13] <Henry151> ..that's ringing a bell, I think not on the server
335 [03:38:21] <Henry151> I did "visudo" and added a line "henry ALL=(ALL:ALL) ALL"
336 [03:38:51] <Henry151> but then on the laptop i think i also ran a "adduser henry sudo" to add myself to the sudo group, which i guess is probably the way i was supposed to do it to begin with
337 [03:38:58] <jmcnaught> Henry151: on Debian you can simply add a user to the sudo group and not have to touch sudoers
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339 [03:39:14] <Henry151> ok, i see
340 [03:39:25] <Henry151> and if i do that, then that user can do systemctl stuff, right?
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345 [03:41:47] <jmcnaught> Henry151: I normally 'sudo systemctl …". When you do it as a regular user it's PolicyKit that authenticates and authorizes you. There's an "action" in /usr/share/polkit-1/actions/org.freedesktop.systemd1.policy for using systemctl to manage services and other units, and it requires auth_admin.
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349 [03:42:14] <jmcnaught> auth_admin in policykit means su or sudo, and I guess it decides which to use based on sudo group membership
350 [03:42:22] <Henry151> hmm. interesting
351 [03:42:27] <Henry151> replaced-url
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354 [03:42:39] <Henry151> the behavior here was a little odd, almost inconsistent it looks like
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356 [03:43:16] <Henry151> but i'll just go ahead and use sudo systemctl ... from now on, and remove my line in the sudoers conf and just add myself to the sudo group
357 [03:43:24] <Henry151> to have things all tidy and proper
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359 [03:43:47] <jmcnaught> Henry151: you don't need sudo/root to use read-only systemctl commands that don't change anything, like status and list-units for example
360 [03:44:28] <jmcnaught> but 'status' won't show you that service's journal entries unless you're in the systemd-journal group (or root)
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363 [03:44:50] <Henry151> i see.. in the past, i seemed to be able to do all my usual systemctl commands as user "henry" without sudo (like starting and stopping openvpn, for example, by far my most frequent usage of systemctl)
364 [03:45:23] <Henry151> but i had forgotten that i had added myself to the sudo group
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366 [03:45:58] <Henry151> does it automatically do the sudo for me if i'm in the sudo group, and i try to do a systemctl command that requires sudo? when it says "authenticate as henry" is that basically like, giving it my password so it can run sudo?
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368 [03:47:00] <jmcnaught> Doing it that way is probably less tested which could be why you encountered that bug in your paste of being unable to disable timidity because it was an LSB initscript
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372 [03:48:05] <Henry151> i see.. so it is sorta "running sudo for me" if i don't explicitly say sudo systemctl but it requires sudo; but that isn't as well tested and so may have more buggy behavior
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378 [03:51:03] <jmcnaught> It's probably not really running sudo for you, it's just getting you to authenticate as your user and not as root because you are a member of the sudo group, but it would be a policykit agent and its backend that are facilitating the privilege escalation
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388 [03:57:51] <kreyren> need help replaced-url
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390 [03:58:10] <kreyren> jmcnaught, blaming you for sending me to that cursed land
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392 [03:59:24] <jmcnaught> kreyren: I'm also in #debian-next and can see that you did not ask anything there.
393 [04:00:40] <jmcnaught> !systemd paranoia
394 [04:00:41] <dpkg> There is no need to waste your time or ours trying to eliminate the string "systemd" from the output of dpkg -l. Installed libraries that are unused are unused; libsystemd0 takes up a whopping 180kB on disk. Having the "systemd" package installed does not imply booting with systemd (that's the systemd-sysv package). Not all packages with "systemd" in their name are even from the systemd source package (see <systemd-shim>).
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402 [04:06:58] <kreyren> jmcnaught, debian-next on OFTC asked twice thre
403 [04:07:00] <kreyren> *there
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405 [04:09:08] <petn-randall> kreyren: I don't see you asking there.
406 [04:09:37] <kreyren> petn-randall, replaced-url
407 [04:09:46] <kreyren> OFTC debian-next.. am i in wrong channel?
408 [04:10:03] <kreyren> note that #debian-next on freenode is invite only
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412 [04:11:18] <petn-randall> Yeah, because that one is closed. The one on OFTC doesn't have your message in there for the last 3 days, and jelly seems to have written the same:
413 [04:11:26] <petn-randall> 16:59 < jelly > kreyren, sorry, I don't see your question here in the last 48 hours, I might be missing some logs
414 [04:11:41] <petn-randall> So it seems as though something broke on your side.
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417 [04:12:23] <kreyren> petn-randall, replaced-url
418 [04:12:35] <kreyren> doubt that it's on my side i'm identified and it works everywhere else
419 [04:13:22] <petn-randall> When was that?
420 [04:13:27] <kreyren> just now
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422 [04:13:50] <kreyren> pinged you on #debian-next
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425 [04:15:10] <kreyren> petn-randall, replaced-url
426 [04:16:07] <petn-randall> kreyren: I don't see you pinging me, and I can ping the bot.
427 [04:16:26] <kreyren> wtf then.. am i muted or something
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429 [04:16:39] <petn-randall> So either you're muted, in which case your IRC client should tell you, or you're on the wrong network.
430 [04:16:41] <kreyren> i can't ping dkpg
431 [04:16:48] <jmcnaught> kreyren: are you registered on OFTC?
432 [04:16:54] <kreyren> yes i'm registered
433 [04:17:04] <kreyren> and it doesnt output anything about me beeing muted and i can see your messages
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453 [04:32:29] <rant> I can see you talking in there
454 [04:32:48] <rant> and so can dpkg, it responded
455 [04:33:29] <petn-randall> rant: kreyren fixed it already, they weren't identified with OFTC.
456 [04:34:10] <rant> yeah, I just noticed that was ~20 min ago.. my eyes are still adjusting to the light :P
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458 [04:34:24] <rant> I was out looking at rather bright LED lights
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464 [04:42:03] <exedore6> Looking for a bit of direction - is there anywhere that lays out 1. What parts of systemd debian uses with a minimal install, 2. How the parts fit together by default (The above install has both SysV style scripts floating arount for example) but it also applies to networkd v NetworkManager v ifupdown, cron vs timers, fstab vs mounts. Not looking for an editorial on systemd, just trying to get my head around
465 [04:42:05] <exedore6> what's considered 'ideal' for Debian in 2019. Really looking for someone to point to the appropriate mailing list, howto, doc where I could find this sort of answer.
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467 [04:43:34] <exedore6> I buy into the 'there's more than one way to do it' mindset, but even on a minimal install, there seems to be a lot of overlap. I'm trying to get an idea of what's considered 'not ready', and what's 'legacy'
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477 [04:48:26] <petn-randall> exedore6: ifupdown is the legacy, the newer replacement is network-manager. systemd will use unit files for services, and if they don't exist, fall back to using the init scripts. So this is transparent to you as a user.
478 [04:48:37] <themill> exedore6: there are some things that don't have units or timers and so use init scripts or cron jobs
479 [04:48:51] <petn-randall> I still use /etc/fstab, which to my knowledge generates the *.mount units.
480 [04:49:38] <jmcnaught> the systemd.mount man page actually says that /etc/fstab is preferred
481 [04:49:39] <exedore6> petn-randall: Does it? That's suprising. I wonder what triggers it.
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483 [04:50:00] <themill> there are generators in place that translate things like /etc/fstab into actions
484 [04:50:05] <petn-randall> this ^
485 [04:50:17] <exedore6> petn-randall: I thought ifupdown was better suited for servers, and network-manager roams better.
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487 [04:50:47] <exedore6> themill: Using inotify, or does the unit read fstab as part of its startup?
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489 [04:51:00] <petn-randall> Sure, it's a matter of taste, though. Sysadmin tend to use well-tested, old things, which ifupdown is.
490 [04:51:05] <petn-randall> *Sysadmins
491 [04:51:18] <petn-randall> Speaking of, Happy Sysadmin Day! (It's still Friday here)
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493 [04:52:39] <exedore6> petn-randall: Which will bite you in the ass if you like to manually edit your /etc/resolv.conf
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497 [04:53:51] <themill> If you've configured your network to use dhcp, then you (almost always) should be using the dns info the dhcp server is providing
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500 [04:56:01] <exedore6> So here's an example - I'm setting up a weird network protocol - if I use ifupdown, it'll be a ton of scripting do plug into pre-up post-up pre-down and post-down.
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502 [04:56:19] <exedore6> It's also not supported directly elsewhere.
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508 [04:58:10] <exedore6> What's the recommended method from a packaging standpoint? Is spending time with ifupdown a waste, al things equal?
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511 [04:59:11] <exedore6> Like, being lazy's not an option, I'm going to have to write for my thing. Which path is more useful for the project (or where are such things even discussed?)
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513 [04:59:49] <petn-randall> What package are you talking about?
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532 [05:12:18] <exedore6> petn-randall: Right now, it's batman-adv - I'm building a bunch of mesh nodes - identical hardware that sort of thing.
533 [05:12:30] <exedore6> petn-randall: But it's just an example.
534 [05:13:15] <exedore6> petn-randall: Point being, even on a minimal install, there's a lot of overlap for where to put the configuration for stuff.
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536 [05:14:12] <exedore6> petn-randall: If one's not careful, then bits and pieces of network config (or filesystem config, or scheduler config, or services) could get everywhere.
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605 [06:30:51] <Cyanoxygen> I have one question, when I start a voice chat in Discord while audio playing, the output will glitch endlessly until I pause audio playback
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608 [06:31:29] <Cyanoxygen> Microphone is on back socket of ALC887, audio output is on HDMI
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612 [06:32:35] <Cyanoxygen> No glitch if there's no audio playing while start a voice chat
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646 [07:06:51] <jim> hi... I wonder if someone could tell me what the name of this package from a description... "if pavucontrol shows the output, that probably just means you're missing the ALSA plugin for pulseaudio (that allows it to emulate ALSA for compatibility with other software)"
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672 [07:24:18] <fraktor> I'm running Debian testing, and for some reason my ~/.profile isn't loaded when I log in. I'm using lightdm as my session manager. How can I make my profile be loaded on startup?
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676 [07:27:28] <SerajewelKS> jim: ... why?
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709 [07:58:35] <jim> SerajewelKS, oh, because I'm told it could be the reason I'm not getting output to the headphones even though pavucontrol sees audio when I play a youtube
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712 [08:01:02] <annadane> void has a alsa-plugins-pulseaudio package or something and i thought maybe stretch did too but no luck searching through buster
713 [08:01:26] <Cyanoxygen> me too
714 [08:01:36] <annadane> void makes sense because it has minimal versions of everything
715 [08:01:46] <annadane> debian may include more, no idea
716 [08:02:08] <jim> annadane, Cyanoxygen, thanks for taking a look :)
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719 [08:05:17] <jim> it looks like apulse is the package name for that
720 [08:05:40] <annadane> right
721 [08:05:51] <jim> installed that
722 [08:05:53] <annadane> yeah i don't know why i didn't think of that
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727 [08:08:13] <Cyanoxygen> oh ye
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740 [08:16:20] <jim> annadane & *, that didn't give me audio however... what I'm looking to do at the moment is get lmms (a daw) to make instrumental sounds
741 [08:16:48] <jim> do I need drivers for hdmi audio?
742 [08:17:19] <Cyanoxygen> have you choose the right output device?
743 [08:17:39] <SerajewelKS> jim: if pavucontrol sees activity then the audio client can communicate with pulseaudio just fine
744 [08:17:48] <SerajewelKS> jim: so the alsa plugin isn't going to help you
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746 [08:18:19] <SerajewelKS> the problem lies between pulseaudio and the sound device, not pulseaudio and the other program playing audio
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749 [08:19:42] <SerajewelKS> possible issues: pulseaudio is sending to the wrong device; the device pulseaudio is sending to is muted; the device pulseaudio is sending to is not plugged in (e.g. speakers); the audio driver is defective
750 [08:19:58] <jim> SerajewelKS, right, that's where I'm thinking the issue is as well... this is a fresh install of debian after solving some problems with some partitions and another issue with the partition table
751 [08:20:17] <SerajewelKS> check the playback devices in pavucontrol. if the right device shows activity then start looking at that specific device.
752 [08:20:36] <jim> Cyanoxygen, I do not know... I could do the speaker-test thing
753 [08:20:40] <SerajewelKS> presumably it's sending to an ALSA device. so open an ALSA mixer and see if that device or the PCM channel is muted.
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756 [08:22:36] <jim> it doesn't look like it's muted
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758 [08:23:10] <SerajewelKS> (my audio setup is unconventional: pulse on JACK on ALSA, with ardour mixing the audio at the JACK layer. so each audio stream has no less than six volume settings in its path.)
759 [08:23:20] <SerajewelKS> possibly seven
760 [08:23:46] <jim> it's getting to pulseaudio from the application (example, both youtube videos, and also lmms, show audio activity on the playback devices
761 [08:24:22] <SerajewelKS> the application's own volume control (maybe), the pulseaudio stream volume, the pulseaudio device volume, the ardour trim, the ardour channel fader, the ardour master fader, the ardour monitor fader, the ALSA PCM fader, the ALSA master fader
762 [08:24:44] <SerajewelKS> so nine volume controls
763 [08:24:58] <SerajewelKS> it's not uncommon for one to wind up muted. :) you have fewer but the basic principle is the same.
764 [08:25:13] <SerajewelKS> does pavucontrol show that the audio is being sent to the correct device?
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767 [08:25:51] <SerajewelKS> if you have a sound card with both analog and digital outputs (most seem to think they have digital outputs these days, even if they do not) then the default device might not be the right one
768 [08:26:26] <SerajewelKS> it's very likely that pulse is using the wrong ALSA device
769 [08:26:44] <Cyanoxygen> Choose different output?
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771 [08:27:15] <SerajewelKS> jim: pavucontrol will let you switch a playback stream to another device on the fly. try sending it different places and see what happens.
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773 [08:27:50] <SerajewelKS> but my guess is that pulse is just using the wrong alsa device, and you need to reconfigure alsa to have the correct default
774 [08:28:14] <SerajewelKS> you might try stopping all audio and terminating pulseaudio, then using some ALSA playback utility from the command line to verify that the default ALSA device even works
775 [08:28:23] <SerajewelKS> i gotta run to bed... good luck, i know audio issues suck
776 [08:30:30] <jim> one quesdtion before
777 [08:31:00] <jim> did you say something about combining alsa, jack and pulse? if so, does it involve cadence?
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780 [08:33:15] <BazookaTooth> cadence is the easy way. just bridge pulse to jack and use jack sinks
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788 [08:37:04] <jim> BazookaTooth, cadence -is- great in just the way you say... but it does not have the proper metadata in the packaging to keep the things that it should depend on
789 [08:38:00] <jim> in other words, I can't trust it
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791 [08:38:36] <petererer> And I just came here because qjackctl is failing on my fresh Buster install :/
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793 [08:39:05] <jim> it should not be any of cadence's business if I do an apt autoremove
794 [08:39:34] <petererer> (jackd runs from the command line, but qjackctl "cannot connect to server socket err = No such file or directory"
795 [08:39:38] <petererer> -(
796 [08:39:42] <BazookaTooth> dunno about debian but i use cadence and jack on arch with no issues
797 [08:40:41] <jim> there's no dependency system on arch, or is there?
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800 [08:42:09] <BazookaTooth> there is but if you check the wiki entry, you can use either jack or jack2 but you need the proper pulse bridge to go along
801 [08:43:09] <BazookaTooth> getting the devices set how you need them is usually more of a problem than figuring out the dependencies
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809 [08:46:14] <jim> BazookaTooth, ok, so the dep system is something you would need to know and assist... good to know
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817 [08:53:10] <astronavt> maybe stupid question, but the debian wiki is suggesting i switch from iptables to nftables... ok, but it looks like i currently have iptables enabled and running. should i disable it with chkconfig before starting nftables? or something else?
818 [08:53:22] <astronavt> this is in buster
819 [08:54:15] <cosimo_> astronavt, well if its enabled and running and you are cool with that you just don't have to switch
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822 [08:55:26] <astronavt> cosimo_ im still setting up the server, it came from the VPS like this. im not sure if it's running as such? i can type 'iptables -L' and i see some output, a bunch of ACCEPT targets + some stuff docker apparently installed for itself
823 [08:55:55] <cosimo_> astronavt, are you running buster ?
824 [08:55:58] <astronavt> yes
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827 [08:56:51] <cosimo_> astronavt, i don't have much experince with iptables and it should be running nftables by default as wiki says replaced-url
828 [08:57:09] <astronavt> i had to install the nftables packages
829 [08:57:15] <astronavt> are those just frontends?
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832 [08:58:15] <cosimo_> astronavt, nope its about all of the traffic everything
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839 [08:59:07] <cosimo_> astronavt, thats weird that you had to install packaged hmm
840 [08:59:46] <astronavt> its possible the VPS did something weird
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842 [08:59:57] <astronavt> assuming that most people would be familiar with iptables instead, idk
843 [09:00:04] <cosimo_> astronavt, i believe not can you send me the output of iptables -L with paste.debian.ent
844 [09:00:17] <cosimo_> paste.debian.net sorry
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847 [09:00:51] <astronavt> replaced-url
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850 [09:03:01] <cosimo_> astronavt, can you chech the status of nftables ? systemctl status nftables.service
851 [09:03:15] <StyXman> why do I get -300 for nodejs and can't install it? replaced-url
852 [09:03:23] <astronavt> cosimo_ inactive (dead)
853 [09:03:31] <astronavt> i literally just apt installed it 10 mins ago
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855 [09:03:50] <astronavt> was mildly surprised it didnt enable itself
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857 [09:04:00] <StyXman> astronavt: I think that's normal for services that are not daemons
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859 [09:04:38] <cosimo_> astronavt, go switch into nftables before you set your rules
860 [09:04:58] <cosimo_> astronavt, replaced-url
861 [09:05:03] <astronavt> cosimo_ to drive the point home, i did `apt list --installed | grep tables` a little while ago and only saw 'iptables' and 'libxtables12'
862 [09:05:27] <astronavt> both of which are marked as manually installed, oddly
863 [09:05:50] <astronavt> right now everything is "accept" and i plan to uninstall docker anyway so i'm happy to start fresh
864 [09:06:06] <astronavt> i just am not sure how to properly and safely decommission iptables
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866 [09:06:37] <cosimo_> astronavt, can you just write nft to your terminal
867 [09:06:56] <cosimo_> astronavt, debian wiki says "Starting with Debian Buster, nf_tables is the default backend when using iptables, by means of the iptables-nft layer (i.e, using iptables syntax with the nf_tables kernel subsystem)"
868 [09:06:57] <astronavt> its installed. nft: no command specified
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870 [09:07:23] <astronavt> i see. so i assume iptables is translating its configuration to the new backend
871 [09:07:28] <cosimo_> yes
872 [09:07:38] <astronavt> so im gonna just leave it
873 [09:07:50] <cosimo_> yes thats why its not enabled i assume
874 [09:08:11] <astronavt> that said im happy to learn the latest and greatest. this is a "personal project" server basically
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876 [09:08:32] <astronavt> so i dont mind switching to the nftables syntax and frontend too. but again, removing iptables is the question. do i just apt remove iptables?
877 [09:09:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1514
878 [09:09:02] <cosimo_> everyone should has a personal project server hehe
879 [09:09:15] <StyXman> astronavt: it's just another package, remove it
880 [09:10:11] <cosimo_> astronavt, check that wiki link above if you want to transfer your ruleset before removing it
881 [09:10:32] <cosimo_> astronavt, other than that you can just remove it as StyXman said
882 [09:10:35] <astronavt> yeah that is helfpul, thank you
883 [09:10:50] <cosimo_> no problem :)
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887 [09:12:05] <astronavt> is there a list of the debian core packages?
888 [09:12:18] <astronavt> e.g. if i use the expert installer and unselect everything in tasksel
889 [09:12:42] <cosimo_> astronavt, replaced-url
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892 [09:13:07] <themill> astronavt: «aptitude search ~prequired ~pimportant» but note that is not a system that can even boot
893 [09:13:26] <themill> (and the dependencies must also be satisfied)
894 [09:13:47] <astronavt> i just found that in the wiki, thank you. and yes i intend to include dependencies. and what does the installer add on top of those, just grub?
895 [09:13:55] <astronavt> this is mostly out of curiosity
896 [09:14:23] <themill> and a kernel, and also other packages to match hardware that it sees
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902 [09:15:54] <astronavt> makes sense
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908 [09:21:34] <StyXman> andwering myself: apt-listbugs + automatic install pinned nodejs with prio -3000 because of a bug that doesn't affect me
909 [09:27:48] <astronavt> huh, iptables is one of the packages in ~pimportant
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911 [09:28:38] <astronavt> ah, its required by docker... no wonder
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913 [09:29:10] <no_gravity> Hello! How can I figure out if my machine had a kernel panic this morning?
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917 [09:29:54] <StyXman> no_gravity: I guess the best shot is in dmesg's output
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919 [09:30:14] <StyXman> altho if you had a panic, most probably it didn't write anything on disk
920 [09:30:26] <no_gravity> Let's see...
921 [09:30:27] <StyXman> sorry, I meant journalctl
922 [09:30:42] <StyXman> (dmesg will only show messages since reboot)
923 [09:30:46] <no_gravity> journalctl begins after the restart
924 [09:31:33] <StyXman> oh, hmm
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926 [09:32:02] <no_gravity> dmesg too
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928 [09:32:59] <StyXman> no_gravity: use --since, check the manpage for the format
929 [09:34:50] <no_gravity> For journalctl? It only gives me a log beginning from the restart, no matter what date I feed --since.
930 [09:34:57] <StyXman> beh
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932 [09:35:28] <no_gravity> /var/log/syslog starts earlier.
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936 [09:37:59] <alkisg> no_gravity: you can enable persistent journal by creating a directory, but it will only take effect in subsequent boots
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938 [09:38:41] <no_gravity> alkisg: I am looking through /var/log/syslog now. Do you think I will find useful info there?
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940 [09:39:31] <alkisg> no_gravity: usually no, many kernel panics don't log anything to disk. Netconsole frequently helps seeing kernel panics, if you have another pc around available to send the panics to
941 [09:39:54] <alkisg> I think systemd has done something to log them to journalctl, but I'm not sure if it's reached the distros defaults yet
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943 [09:40:25] <no_gravity> I see this right before the machine went bonka: INFO: rcu_sched self-detected stall on CPU
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945 [09:40:27] <alkisg> I kept this notes for when I had to use netconsole last time: replaced-url
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947 [09:42:37] <no_gravity> From there on, syslog goes into some kind of loop. Logging the same 100 or so lines forever.
948 [09:42:53] <alkisg> Which cpu?
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950 [09:43:13] <alkisg> (exact model from cat /proc/cpuinfo)
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952 [09:43:34] <no_gravity> Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2640 v4 @ 2.40GHz
953 [09:43:55] <no_gravity> But that machine is a VM, so not directly on the metal.
954 [09:44:04] <alkisg> Ah
955 [09:44:36] <alkisg> You could use netconsole to forward panics to the host then
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958 [09:44:49] <no_gravity> I don't own the host.
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960 [09:45:13] <alkisg> Try enabling persistent journal, it might log more info
961 [09:46:12] <no_gravity> Well, it is not that important. I would just have been curious if I can see what caused last nights crash.
962 [09:46:57] <alkisg> It's a "mkdir" command, it's not important either, it might help in satisfying the curiosity in subsequent crashes :)
963 [09:48:51] <no_gravity> I think the "rcu_sched self-detected stall on CPU" tells me that either the host CPU went bonka or the kernel or a driver is defective.
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965 [09:49:24] <no_gravity> Whatever it is, I think it means "Do not use this VM provider in the future".
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967 [09:51:34] <no_gravity> One moment, switching Wifi, this might break irc ...
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1010 [10:27:43] <gidna> Hello
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1012 [10:29:00] <gidna> My wireless adaptor which has always be recognized by simple plugging on other distribution is not activated on debian
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1014 [10:30:02] <antto> maybe it requires a non-free driver
1015 [10:30:20] <gidna> with lsusb is seen: Bus 001 Device 008: ID 0cf3:9271 Qualcomm Atheros Communications AR9271 802.11n
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1018 [10:31:59] <gidna> I've never had to install any driver
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1024 [10:34:50] <gidna> the chipset AR9271 should be supported natively by the kernel
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1029 [10:38:16] <gidna> BCMM, if debian does not include any non-free software by default, How is it possible that I'm able to play mp4 videos?
1030 [10:38:22] <gidna> aren't the codecs non free?
1031 [10:38:30] <wuseman> gidna: did you install linux-firmware?
1032 [10:38:32] <BCMM> gidna: there are plenty of free software mp4 decoders
1033 [10:39:07] <wuseman> nvm, wrong chan
1034 [10:39:10] <BCMM> gidna: they might be patent-encumbered in some situations. not sure how that works for debian, honestly (i don't care much because i don't live in a country with software patents)
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1037 [10:41:59] <gidna> I get: E: Unable to locate package firmware-linux-nonfree
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1039 [10:43:03] <Mathisen> gidna, did you update after adding non-free ?
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1043 [10:44:11] <gidna> Mathisen, update what?
1044 [10:44:27] <EoflaOE> sudo apt update
1045 [10:45:05] <gidna> All packages are up to date.
1046 [10:45:26] <Mathisen> and how did you add non-free to your sources.list or .d
1047 [10:45:50] <Bushmills> gidna: apt update doesn't upgrade packages
1048 [10:46:28] <gidna> hmm I didn't add non-free
1049 [10:46:53] <Mathisen> well you need to, if you want to install that
1050 [10:47:30] <gidna> I'd like to add non-free only to install this package and then remove it
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1052 [10:48:15] <BCMM> gidna: there's not much need for that. it's not like it's going to automatically install non-free replacements for other packages behind your back
1053 [10:49:21] <BCMM> gidna: but if you're concerned about other non-free packages, you can do `aptitude search '~i ?section(non-free)'` to see all the non-free packages that are currently installed
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1055 [10:50:49] <gidna> ok. How do I add the non-free repo?
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1057 [10:51:36] <EoflaOE> Edit the sources.list file and add that
1058 [10:51:41] <BCMM> !non-free
1059 [10:51:41] <dpkg> [non-free] a component which contains software that does not comply with the <DFSG>. To add non-free packages to your packages index, ask me about <non-free sources>. To see which non-free packages are installed ask me about <non-free list>.
1060 [10:51:47] <BCMM> !non-free sources
1061 [10:51:48] <dpkg> Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
1062 [10:51:58] <BCMM> gidna: sorry, i meant this one ^
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1065 [10:54:23] <gidna> Is ok to add this line: deb replaced-url
1066 [10:54:39] <Mathisen> no
1067 [10:54:41] <BCMM> gidna: combine it with an existing line. don't add a new line
1068 [10:54:49] <BCMM> gidna: read what the bot said above!
1069 [10:56:51] <gidna> where sources.list is located?
1070 [10:56:59] <Mathisen> this is mine as an example replaced-url
1071 [10:57:10] <Mathisen> and im using buster = debian 10
1072 [10:57:39] <BCMM> gidna: /etc/apt/sources.list
1073 [10:57:51] <BCMM> gidna: i'm sorry, but have you read what dpkg said?
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1075 [10:58:45] <gidna> so in both these lines: deb replaced-url
1076 [10:58:58] <gidna> I add non-free after main?
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1078 [10:59:22] <Mathisen> yes
1079 [10:59:37] <BCMM> gidna: non-free sources don't exist
1080 [10:59:41] <BCMM> that's what makes those packages non-free
1081 [10:59:53] <Bushmills> not necessarily
1082 [11:00:17] <Bushmills> non-free doesn't relate to sources availability alone
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1084 [11:00:21] <gidna> BCMM, so I edit only this: deb replaced-url
1085 [11:00:45] <EoflaOE> gidna: yes. Add non-free at the end
1086 [11:01:24] <BCMM> Bushmills: ah, fair enough. there is in fact a source repo for non-free. gidna, sorry, ignore what i said :)
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1088 [11:01:45] <BCMM> Bushmills: i had assumed that sort of thing went in contrib, but that doesn't make sense on reflection
1089 [11:01:55] <gidna> so I add to both lines non-free?
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1093 [11:02:06] <EoflaOE> gidna: Yes.
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1095 [11:02:20] <BCMM> gidna: did you change the security line?
1096 [11:02:26] <BCMM> (you do have a security line, right?)
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1100 [11:02:48] <Bushmills> but my guess is that gidna could probably delete the deb-src line completely, unlikely that sources of a package will be needed in foreseeable future
1101 [11:03:49] <gidna> have I also to edit the other lines? security and volatile?
1102 [11:03:52] <BCMM> gidna: it would probably be a good idea to have a look at this replaced-url
1103 [11:04:01] <BCMM> ... what is volatile?
1104 [11:04:16] <gidna> # buster-updates, previously known as 'volatile'
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1106 [11:04:32] <Bushmills> BCMM: contrib contains packages which are free as such, but depend on packages in non-free
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1108 [11:05:16] <BCMM> gidna: yes, change the buster-updates line too
1109 [11:05:19] <Mathisen> gidna, yes add non-free to the security lines and no dont add anything to the buster-updates lines
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1111 [11:05:29] <BCMM> Mathisen: um, what?
1112 [11:05:35] <Mathisen> i would just say same
1113 [11:05:39] <BCMM> gidna, Mathisen: it's all here replaced-url
1114 [11:05:40] <Mathisen> huh ?
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1117 [11:07:11] <Mathisen> my bad... seems i missed somethings...
1118 [11:07:39] <gidna> BCMM, but in that link deb replaced-url
1119 [11:07:49] <BCMM> yes, as it should be
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1122 [11:08:36] <gidna> you said: "and no dont add anything to the buster-updates lines"
1123 [11:08:36] <allpubblic> Hey john
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1125 [11:10:52] <BCMM> gidna: no, Mathisen said that
1126 [11:10:52] <rant> 05:05 BCMM> gidna: yes, change the buster-updates line too
1127 [11:11:16] <Mathisen> gidna, and i was wrong listen to BCMM
1128 [11:11:22] <gidna> BCMM, sorry
1129 [11:11:33] <BCMM> no problem
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1131 [11:12:25] <Mathisen> but now i must say the backports repo confuses me. why is it there by default ?
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1134 [11:12:53] <BCMM> Mathisen: it's not there by default. what are you looking at?
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1136 [11:13:07] <gidna> can I install only this: apt-get install firmware-atheros?
1137 [11:13:23] <Mathisen> BCMM, replaced-url
1138 [11:13:35] <gidna> and not all the package amd64-microcode firmware-amd-graphics firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-misc-nonfree
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1141 [11:13:52] <Mathisen> i never added the stre-updates lines atleast what i can remember
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1144 [11:14:08] <rant> there is no backports in there
1145 [11:14:21] <Mathisen> ok what is it for then ?
1146 [11:14:34] <rant> what is _what_ for?
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1148 [11:14:46] <Mathisen> deb replaced-url
1149 [11:15:01] <rant> its buster updates.. formerly known as volitile
1150 [11:15:12] <rant> !volitile
1151 [11:15:12] <dpkg> Debian Volatile was a project aiming at keeping Debian releases up-to-date for fast moving packages such as virus scanners, spam scanners and firmware downloaders. It was replaced by the <stable-updates> suite as of Debian 6.0 "Squeeze". replaced-url
1152 [11:15:14] <klys> volatile?
1153 [11:15:24] <rant> !stable-updates
1154 [11:15:25] <dpkg> buster-updates is a suite providing updates to some packages (from <proposed-updates>) prior to a <point release>. All packages from buster-updates will be included in point releases. replaced-url
1155 [11:15:34] <rant> !security
1156 [11:15:35] <dpkg> Put "deb replaced-url
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1158 [11:16:08] <BCMM> gidna: yes, you can install just firmware-atheros
1159 [11:16:18] <BCMM> see replaced-url
1160 [11:16:41] <BCMM> gidna: however, it's probably a good idea to have microcode updates for your intel or amd cpu
1161 [11:16:45] <BCMM> for security reasons
1162 [11:17:35] <gidna> ok it is now recognized thank you
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1164 [11:18:10] <BCMM> Mathisen: backports is different from updates
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1167 [11:18:49] <Mathisen> yeah i get that i missunderstood the line,
1168 [11:18:55] <rant> replaced-url
1169 [11:20:36] <rant> fairly complete list of official sources suitable for most anyone
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1171 [11:21:06] <Mathisen> so last question, if i understand this right the buster-updates line is more or less not needed, it just an "extra" layer of security if im using specific packagaes ? that if i use it i can get updated versions
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1173 [11:21:34] <rant> that's a horrible way to look at it
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1176 [11:22:12] <BCMM> Mathisen: it's mostly for data that needs to be up-to-date
1177 [11:22:23] <BCMM> Mathisen: e.g. timezone information
1178 [11:22:46] <BCMM> if your country decides to change how daylight saving works, you don't want your system to just be wrong until the next debian release, for example
1179 [11:23:04] <Mathisen> ok, il just let it be then.
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1191 [11:27:37] <gidna> I have a keyboard volume dial. Is there a way to have it working on icewm?
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1196 [11:28:28] <Filystyn> helo
1197 [11:28:44] <Filystyn> I need help
1198 [11:28:49] <Filystyn> I need to upgrade kernel
1199 [11:29:02] <Filystyn> on my server
1200 [11:29:23] <Bushmills> what keeps you from doing it?
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1203 [11:29:49] <Filystyn> probably the thing that it is so not user friendly
1204 [11:30:07] <Filystyn> like on obsd i would have it done in seconds but ofc debian.. anyway lets not complain anymore
1205 [11:30:13] <Filystyn> I will tell you what I allready tried
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1207 [11:30:41] <Filystyn> I did this; apt-cache search linux-image
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1209 [11:31:13] <Filystyn> After going though list i found: linux-image-4.19.0-5-amd64-unsigned - Linux 4.19 for 64-bit PCs
1210 [11:31:25] <Filystyn> so i guess this is the img i should install
1211 [11:31:45] <Bushmills> yes, that's current kernel for buster
1212 [11:31:51] <Bushmills> what is installed now?
1213 [11:32:12] <Bushmills> i mean, if you're still in squeeze, consider upgrading to buster
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1216 [11:32:55] <Filystyn> ok stop seems i still remember something
1217 [11:33:00] <Filystyn> aptitude as superior as always
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1219 [11:33:10] <Filystyn> apt failed but i got it fixed with aptitude -f ;-)
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1222 [11:33:55] <Bushmills> the fact that something needed to be fixed is not a good sign
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1226 [11:34:38] <Bushmills> what does uname -a show?
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1228 [11:35:04] <Filystyn> actuly it did not fix it
1229 [11:35:07] <Filystyn> it failed ;-)
1230 [11:35:11] <Filystyn> let me shwo you... uname
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1234 [11:37:20] <Filystyn> Linux server 2.6.35 #1 SMP Mon Feb 20 20:05:53 MSK 2017 x86_64 GNU/Linux
1235 [11:37:32] <Bushmills> what does cat /etc/debian_version show?
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1237 [11:37:56] <Filystyn> it seems i manaed to install the new kernel version
1238 [11:38:06] <Filystyn> 10.0
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1240 [11:38:20] <Filystyn> but it shoes the old in uname ...
1241 [11:38:20] <Bushmills> that's not the kernel which comes with 10.0
1242 [11:38:34] <Filystyn> linux-image-4.19.0-5-amd64-unsigned is already installed at the requested version (4.19.37-5+deb10u1)
1243 [11:38:45] <Bushmills> what does dpkg -l linux-image-amd64 show?
1244 [11:39:14] <Bushmills> when did you reboot last time?
1245 [11:39:31] <Filystyn> ages ago
1246 [11:39:34] <Filystyn> do i need to do...
1247 [11:39:42] <Filystyn> like use initrd ?
1248 [11:39:59] <Filystyn> dpkg-query: no packages found matching linux-image-amd64
1249 [11:40:00] <Bushmills> then you probably installed a new kernel, but by not rebooting the previous kernel kept on running
1250 [11:40:06] <Filystyn> ok
1251 [11:40:10] <Filystyn> so lets reboot
1252 [11:40:17] <Bushmills> but hang on, don't reboot yet
1253 [11:40:30] <Filystyn> already did ;-)
1254 [11:40:31] <Bushmills> "no packages found matching linux-image-amd64" is not goof
1255 [11:40:33] <Bushmills> good
1256 [11:40:51] <fireba11> ah, it's check-your-sources-time :-D
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1259 [11:41:10] <Bushmills> kernel 2.6 !
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1261 [11:41:37] <BCMM> sounds more like Filystyn just doesn't have the metapackage installed
1262 [11:41:45] <BCMM> (which is likely to results in kernels not getting updated, i think)
1263 [11:41:46] <Filystyn> and it seems it broken ;-)
1264 [11:41:51] <Filystyn> Oh my God oh man ;-)
1265 [11:42:15] <Filystyn> this is 2 funny
1266 [11:42:17] <fireba11> BCMM: jup .. fixed that in about 10 environments while updating to buster already here .. :-D
1267 [11:42:18] <BCMM> unless you specifically want to use something other than the normal debian kernel, `apt install linux-image-amd64` (assuming you have an amd64 system!)
1268 [11:42:50] <Filystyn> ok never mine its alive
1269 [11:42:54] <fireba11> did a pot of "apt remove --purge linux-image-4.9*" :-D
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1271 [11:43:29] <Filystyn> uname -a gives same
1272 [11:43:40] *** alpha3031 is now known as Alpha3031[m]
1273 [11:43:47] <Filystyn> Linux server 2.6.35 #1 SMP Mon Feb 20 20:05:53 MSK 2017 x86_64 GNU/Linux
1274 [11:43:57] <Bushmills> do: ls /boot
1275 [11:44:06] <Filystyn> root@server:~# ls /boot
1276 [11:44:07] <Filystyn> System.map-4.19.0-5-amd64 initrd.img-4.19.0-5-amd64
1277 [11:44:07] <Filystyn> config-4.19.0-5-amd64 vmlinuz-4.19.0-5-amd64
1278 [11:44:28] <Bushmills> is that a virtual server or a dedicated server?
1279 [11:44:42] <Filystyn> VPS
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1281 [11:45:16] <Bushmills> depending on virtualisation software, it is possible that you have no effect on what kernel it boots into
1282 [11:45:18] <Filystyn> i did apt install linux-image-amd64
1283 [11:45:29] <Filystyn> oooh ;-(
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1285 [11:46:32] <Bushmills> kernel image in /boot is current
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1287 [11:47:10] <Bushmills> only way to not boot into it is - apart from virtualisation - that your boot loader wasn't updated. update-grub
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1289 [11:48:02] <alkisg> Filystyn: the output of `cat /proc/cmdline` might help
1290 [11:48:13] <Filystyn> quiet
1291 [11:48:35] <alkisg> What, it only has "quiet" there, no root or anything?
1292 [11:48:42] <Filystyn> yeah
1293 [11:48:51] <alkisg> It's not really using grub then
1294 [11:49:00] <alkisg> So no matter what you do with grub, it won't affect it
1295 [11:49:27] <Filystyn> so I should ask provider to do somethign to get newer kern version?
1296 [11:49:36] <alkisg> If you need it, yeah
1297 [11:49:43] <Filystyn> yeah i want it k
1298 [11:49:58] <alkisg> Or it may provide a control panel where you can select the VM type; and with different types, different kernels are used
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1303 [11:52:15] <Filystyn> Yeah there is some control panel but i never use it but Im askign right now so will get direct answer
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1307 [11:54:26] <Filystyn> they told me to ask via email so there is little chance
1308 [11:54:28] <Filystyn> tthx for help ;-)
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1310 [11:56:04] <Bushmills> dedi beats vps :)
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1321 [12:07:20] <Mathisen> Filystyn, out if curiostity what vps provider do you use
1322 [12:08:35] <Filystyn> polish one doubt you know him
1323 [12:08:49] <Filystyn> not a global company
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1325 [12:09:34] <Mathisen> ok, if this is for personal needs and not company stuff i can recommend vultr. i used many diffrent providers over the years and atleast in my optinoon they are cheap and good
1326 [12:09:38] <tds> if your box is using systemd, `systemd-detect-virt` may shed some light
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1328 [12:09:47] <Mathisen> i mean if you having issues with your current one
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1330 [12:10:15] <Filystyn> ok
1331 [12:10:20] <Filystyn> thank you for advice
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1507 [15:01:21] <g0zzy> I usually see as ignorant comments about Linux not being desktop-ready but i must admit i've got defeated by this - and i'm running Buster as well. In XFCE there seems to be no way of associating .pdf files with a preferred app and no way also in update-alternatives. Am i going to have to hand-craft a .desktop file?
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1513 [15:05:51] <ratrace> there must be, associating mimetypes with programs launching them has been a feature since the old days
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1515 [15:06:38] <ratrace> g0zzy: right-click, open-with, in thunar?
1516 [15:07:05] <humpled> iirc there was no pdf viewer with default debian 9 xfce
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1518 [15:08:14] <humpled> i use the browser(firefox) or evince(from gnome)
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1520 [15:08:37] <g0zzy> ratrace: sorry - i'm fairly sure that didn't persist before. It's seeming to now
1521 [15:08:52] <g0zzy> Anyone know what the underlying system is here?
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1526 [15:11:20] <g0zzy> Possibly mimetype? When i do mimetype -a foo.pdf, one of the entries is text/plain. That's wrong surely?
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1530 [15:14:00] <g0zzy> If i do mimeopen foo.pdf it opens with ImageMagick ;)
1531 [15:14:32] <alkisg> Try `xdg-mime` and `gio info` instead
1532 [15:14:35] <humpled> which pdf viewer do you use?
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1535 [15:15:14] <rant> g0zzy: right click a file, goto properties, and there is an Open With: pulldown in the thunar filemanager to select the default app
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1537 [15:15:58] <g0zzy> Yes, thanks. That's working now
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1550 [15:20:29] <nifker> Is there no Firefox ESR68 in the repositories yet?
1551 [15:21:15] <rant> ,v firefox-esr
1552 [15:21:16] <judd> Package: firefox-esr on amd64 -- jessie: 52.8.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch: 60.6.1esr-1~deb9u1; stretch-updates: 60.6.3esr-1~deb9u1; jessie-security: 60.7.1esr-1~deb8u1; stretch-proposed-updates: 60.7.1esr-1~deb9u1; buster: 60.7.2esr-1; stretch-security: 60.8.0esr-1~deb9u1; buster-proposed-updates: 60.8.0esr-1~deb10u1; buster-security: 60.8.0esr-1~deb10u1; bullseye: 60.8.0esr-1; sid:
1553 [15:21:17] <judd> 60.8.0esr-1
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1559 [15:22:49] <rant> replaced-url
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1583 [15:42:39] <jaggz> how do I keep speech-dispatcher from running?
1584 [15:42:47] <jaggz> I don't know why it loves me so much
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1600 [15:53:12] <rant> you could uninstall it
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1602 [15:53:57] <rant> jaggz: or use systemctl disable speech-dispatcher
1603 [15:55:10] <jaggz> rant, yeah.. uninstalled.. seems silly to have these things sitting around when they're not in use
1604 [15:55:47] <jaggz> running
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1606 [15:58:38] <coruja> it's not the worst idea to check installed packages regulary for ones not needed anymore
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1615 [16:03:29] <NetTerminalGene> ,firefox
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1617 [16:05:05] <humpled> ,v ?
1618 [16:05:06] <judd> No package named '?' was found in amd64.
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1626 [16:07:52] <annadane> wiki.debian.org/Firefox
1627 [16:08:19] <annadane> tl;dr if you're on stable firefox-esr is the only one packaged, 68 isn't due to replace 60 for a few months (i thought i saw october), if you want new firefox just download it from mozilla
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1632 [16:12:44] <jmcnaught> Or just use firefox-esr from Debian archives because it's probably good enough, and it makes fewer automatic connections than the mozilla download does: replaced-url
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1641 [16:21:02] <techie> I did a stupid thing where I removed the only Display Manager on my Debian Buster
1642 [16:21:17] <techie> how should I recover it now?
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1644 [16:21:34] <techie> I am unable to run network in the recovery mode
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1654 [16:23:56] <techie> Plasma was only thing I had..now after starting up Session box is empty & Im unable to log in to the system
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1669 [16:40:15] <Cyanoxygen> Run rescue mode on installation media
1670 [16:41:17] <humpled> what is Session box?
1671 [16:43:19] <Cyanoxygen> probably is the login session menu on the login screen
1672 [16:44:10] <techie> Session box is a drop-down widget which had name "Plasma".. but nothing there now
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1675 [16:44:33] <humpled> ah so you have the login screen but no desktop?
1676 [16:44:35] <techie> how to run rescue mode?
1677 [16:44:49] <techie> humpled, yes
1678 [16:44:49] <Cyanoxygen> Boot into your installation media
1679 [16:45:00] <Cyanoxygen> wait
1680 [16:45:15] <Cyanoxygen> just try switch to another tty to install
1681 [16:45:28] <Cyanoxygen> Like Ctrl-Alt-F1
1682 [16:45:33] <Bushmills> techie, you don't need recovery mode for installing a display manager
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1684 [16:45:51] <Cyanoxygen> no need for rescue mode or recovery mode
1685 [16:45:54] <Cyanoxygen> My fault
1686 [16:46:23] <Bushmills> You can simply apt install ... one of your choice from console
1687 [16:46:28] <Cyanoxygen> If you are on login screen, switch to another console, then login to your user and then apt install
1688 [16:46:46] <techie> on login screen I should try ctrl alt f1?
1689 [16:46:51] <Cyanoxygen> :v
1690 [16:46:54] <Cyanoxygen> yes
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1693 [16:47:57] <techie> Bushmills, only time I get a CLI is now in "recovery" mode & Im failing to get Network service running there.. apt install shows not found error & does nothing
1694 [16:48:19] <Cyanoxygen> no need for recovery mode
1695 [16:48:43] <techie> ill try different tty
1696 [16:48:51] <Cyanoxygen> :thinking: You just start your debian normally?
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1698 [16:49:05] <Bushmills> Don't you get a login prompt?
1699 [16:49:12] <techie> yes I do
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1701 [16:49:20] <Bushmills> Then log in
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1703 [16:49:51] <Bushmills> Become superuser, then apt install
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1706 [16:52:14] <techie> thanks Cyanoxygen..that worked
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1711 [16:53:46] <Cyanoxygen> np :)
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1738 [17:18:26] <nezZario> Hmm so
1739 [17:18:57] <nezZario> Is there a project or system thst works with systemd that provides a higher level interface to kernel namespacing?
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1741 [17:20:05] <koollman> nezZario: systemd-nspawn, nsenter, and I suppose most tools around cgroups and namespaces, like docker, lxc, runc, ...
1742 [17:20:12] <nezZario> I am aware of systemd slices..... Perhaps I am misunderstanding them but I am looking for something I can specify eg some isolation for a systemd service
1743 [17:20:20] <nezZario> Yea i don't want full containers
1744 [17:20:40] <nezZario> Just for example restrict syslog from reading a ssl private key
1745 [17:22:29] <nezZario> I'll look at nspawn and nsenter. I really haven't looked at lxc but it's only for full containers right?
1746 [17:25:01] <nezZario> I am pretty surprised this isn't more common...?.. These are effectively badass FreeBSD jails that don't need a whole copy of a system under each chroot... Why is everyone so nutters about containers? :)
1747 [17:25:54] <ratrace> nezZario: define higher level ; systemd already provides simple directives to confine a service into a readonly view of the filesystem, with specific rw overrides etc... restricting syslog from reading a ssl private key sounds like MAC/RBAC thing like AppArmor or SELinux
1748 [17:26:50] <ratrace> both work "with systemd" in that you can set specific profile or context from the service unit, if that's even needed
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1751 [17:31:43] <nezZario> Well you are right, it shouldn't be an only defense, but I am just surprised at the ecosystems that are popular (docker, lxc) when there is so much more that can be done here
1752 [17:32:28] <ratrace> like what?
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1754 [17:33:51] <nezZario> instead of copying a whole new copy of Debian over from debootstrap why not just push a minimal amou t of / into a new "container" as you will with most of the fs RO and portions blocked out? Options right here in nspawn, --inaccessible
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1756 [17:34:17] <nezZario> Maybe I'm dumb. I mean I get it's likely more work than just debootstrap and acting like it's a separate system
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1772 [17:43:35] <ratrace> nezZario: doesn't docker do that?
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1783 [17:50:57] <luna> will be on a picture at Debconf today and tommorow
1784 [17:51:14] <ratrace> what will?
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1789 [17:54:56] <Cyanoxygen> wow cool
1790 [17:55:14] <luna> ratrace: a picture of me
1791 [17:57:53] <Cyanoxygen> wish you a good time at debconf
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1796 [17:59:02] <luna> Cyanoxygen: i did not attend it in person, only via online
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1800 [17:59:21] <luna> also still 3 talks and 2 meetings left
1801 [17:59:42] <Cyanoxygen> oh but still :D
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1817 [18:16:25] <aypea[0]> hey. why would a package not find a dependency when there's another package that provides it via its Provides: list?
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1823 [18:19:56] <ratrace> aypea[0]: for example?
1824 [18:20:26] <pagetelegram> Got a wmaker/gnustep question, being that it is OT here please feel free to PM me if you are familiar / current user of the DE. Tried the wmaker channel and still having trouble. Thanks
1825 [18:22:07] <aypea[0]> ratrace: built a custom exim4 package using the mechanism and added exim4-daemon-custom to the provides line of the new package but it still does not satisfy the Depends: line of the exim4 package. spelling is right. versions appear correct. not sure what else would be required.
1826 [18:22:13] <Bjornn> what exactly is your question? pagetelegram ?
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1832 [18:27:28] <ratrace> aypea[0]: like this? replaced-url
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1836 [18:28:46] <g0zzy> Thanks folks
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1838 [18:29:16] * aypea[0] goes to look
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1841 [18:31:16] <OS-52294> /join #offsec
1842 [18:31:25] <aypea[0]> ratrace: AHA! I see the bug now. Thanks. The virtual package does not inherit the version number from the package itself and the dependency is, itself, versioned. much thanks. :)
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1848 [18:34:05] <OS-52294> /msg NickServ REGISTER <pulea> <cristi_k2003@yahoo.com>
1849 [18:34:15] <aypea[0]> tun tun TUNNNN!
1850 [18:34:37] <OS-52294> /msg NickServ IDENTIFY <pulea>
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1852 [18:35:11] <abrotman> offsec indeed ..
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1854 [18:35:35] <Mathisen> it is for students :)
1855 [18:35:39] <aypea[0]> someone's feeling a little spaced out
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1857 [18:36:51] <ratrace> this particular nick has been a "student" for too long :)
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1864 [18:41:58] * aypea[0] grumbles. ${source:Version} not ${Upstream-Version} :/
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1869 [18:44:14] <aypea[0]> HUZZAH!
1870 [18:44:26] <aypea[0]> ratrace: confirmed fixed. thanks again. :)
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1874 [18:46:59] <aypea[0]> gah. more problems. it's not getting its Depends: line filled like the other exim4-deamon-* packages. /sigh/
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1893 [19:04:44] <aypea[0]> ooo.
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1948 [19:58:43] <makspost> What are the minimum requirements for buster?
1949 [19:59:25] <SwedeMike> makspost: replaced-url
1950 [19:59:48] <makspost> Thank you
1951 [19:59:48] <JPT> It'll probably run on less than that
1952 [20:00:04] <makspost> Off topic
1953 [20:00:49] <makspost> Does anyone know the minimums for jessie on power pc x32?
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1955 [20:01:04] <makspost> Like very minimums
1956 [20:01:16] <rant> minimums?
1957 [20:01:29] <makspost> Minimum requirements
1958 [20:01:46] <JPT> I guess ... just install it and see how it goes. 128M of RAM will get a bit squeezy, depending on what you want to do.
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1961 [20:02:12] <makspost> Well my machine is 256 ram
1962 [20:02:20] <makspost> ibook g3
1963 [20:02:30] <makspost> Ik it’s old
1964 [20:02:38] <JPT> Unless you want the latest KDE on there, you should still be okay
1965 [20:02:41] <makspost> But i’m mostly a cli user
1966 [20:02:48] <makspost> Yeah
1967 [20:03:16] <makspost> Also i think the g3 machines can’t boot from usb
1968 [20:03:21] <makspost> Only cd rom
1969 [20:03:45] <makspost> And then the machines only have usb 1.1 ports
1970 [20:03:57] <JPT> USB1.1 is slow, but should work fine.
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1973 [20:04:44] <postg_lif3> The boot loader should be compatible right
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1975 [20:05:34] <JPT> Good point - i don't know about powerpc specifics. But in general, i expect a good chance of it mostly working out of the box.
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2057 [21:02:42] <somebody> Hello. I'm on Jesse, and I'm trying to enable two options for the keyboard simultaneously, from the "Alt/Win key behavior" group in the KDE's keyboard settings module, but if I check one box, the other gets unchecked. Is there any way to fix this inside the GUI thing, without resorting to editing the config files? Thanks.
2058 [21:03:32] <somebody> Oh, it's not Jesse, it's Stretch.
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2073 [21:17:39] <petn-randall> somebody: Which two settings? They might be exclusive.
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2077 [21:19:07] <somebody> petn-randall, They don't seem exclusive to me.
2078 [21:19:22] <somebody> If you check any second box in that section, other one gets unchecked automatically.
2079 [21:19:57] <petn-randall> somebody: What do those settings say? I don't have KDE installed right now.
2080 [21:20:49] <somebody> OK. I want "Alt and Meta are on Alt keys", which makes my right Alt work as Alt in Colemak layout, and the other one is "Win is mapped to PrtSc (and the usual Win key)".
2081 [21:21:04] <somebody> Agin, I don't really see how those two would be mutually exclusive.
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2083 [21:21:13] <somebody> petn-randall, ^
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2085 [21:24:02] <petn-randall> I see, and agree they shouldn't be mutually exclusive.
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2093 [21:30:57] <somebody> But the OS treats them as such, yes.
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2095 [21:32:23] <jhutchins> somebody: It's the desktop, not the OS, but yeah. KDE is wierd about that stuff.
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2097 [21:33:03] <somebody> Oh silly me, yes that's the desktop.
2098 [21:33:12] <somebody> I'm understanding that I should use some CLI stuff to set those options, but what?
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2102 [21:36:25] <jhutchins> somebody: I think any CLI settings will probably be overridden by KDE's keyboard map.
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2106 [21:38:04] <somebody> Goddamn.
2107 [21:38:20] <somebody> So do you think there is there any way to work around that?
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2113 [21:39:29] <humbot> what about xmodmap instructions
2114 [21:40:33] <jhutchins> somebody: I think you'd have to find somebody on the KDE project. Maybe forums or mailing list.
2115 [21:40:50] <jhutchins> Wow, chkrootkit's manpage is pretty useless.
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2119 [21:41:13] <somebody> humbot, I remember reading about xmodmap years ago, but I didn't follow up on that; thanks for the pointer though!
2120 [21:41:24] <pankid14_> Did debian 10 change from using /etc/network/interfaces to systemd-networkd? Which should I be using by default?
2121 [21:41:32] <somebody> jhutchins, You are right, this seems KDE-specific, so I'll talk to their IRC after updating to Buster.
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2124 [21:42:02] <somebody> How's Buster, by the way, did it break anything for the good people of this channel?
2125 [21:42:03] <ratrace> pankid14_: it didn't, use whichever you want, ifupdown is still the default
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2127 [21:42:42] <pankid14_> ratrace: Thanks!
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2137 [21:50:33] <alkisg> humbot: I didn't see your initial question and I don't know about kde, but mate, gnome2, lxde and xfce, all respect the xorg settings, if one doesn't specify anything about the keyboard in the DE settings; i.e. his gsettings list-recursively | grep kbd etc etc are clear
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2139 [21:51:06] <alkisg> (which is the default, as long as one doesn't go to the keyboard configuration GUI that the desktop environments have)
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2142 [21:51:40] <xxavi> hi to all
2143 [21:51:42] <xxavi> any tool for test the Wi-Fi speed ? ( not Internet speed )
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2146 [21:53:40] <petn-randall> xxavi: the network-manager applet will show you the raw wifi speed when you hover over it with the mouse.
2147 [21:53:45] <NetTerminalGene> guys, i installed snapd and installed a software. after that i removed the software and snap. but when i look lsblk output i see such things "loop1 7:1 0 88,4M 1 loop /snap/core/7169"
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2149 [21:54:09] <NetTerminalGene> what to do?
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2151 [21:54:43] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: reboot maybe?
2152 [21:55:15] <NetTerminalGene> petn-randall, iit is old thing. i rebooted lots of
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2157 [21:56:22] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: What does `dpkg -l '*snap*'` return?
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2161 [21:58:01] <NetTerminalGene> petn-randall, it lists some stuff that i don't understand
2162 [21:58:06] <xxavi> petn-randall: hi, thanks for your answer. My network-manager applet show: "Speed: 150 Mb/s". This is the maximun speed of my Wi-Fi card ?
2163 [21:58:09] <humbot> thanks for the gsettings tip alkisg
2164 [21:58:17] <alkisg> np
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2167 [21:58:59] <petn-randall> xxavi: This is the negotiated speed between your card and the AP.
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2169 [21:59:30] <xxavi> petn-randall: Oh, ok, thanks.
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2171 [22:00:38] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: Can you share it on replaced-url
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2173 [22:02:21] <NetTerminalGene> petn-randall, replaced-url
2174 [22:03:24] <astronavt> hi debian, i'm looking to help bump a package to its latest released version, but im a little lost reading the docs. do i just replace the .orig.tar.xz with the most recent version of the source?
2175 [22:03:30] <astronavt> this is the package btw replaced-url
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2177 [22:04:30] <xxavi> Another question. How can I connect to 5GHz network ?
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2179 [22:05:16] <petn-randall> xxavi: If you card supports it, it will just show up in the selection in the applet.
2180 [22:05:20] <petn-randall> *your
2181 [22:05:36] <dvs> yore
2182 [22:06:06] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: Try purging snapd, and maybe even remove those libs.
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2184 [22:06:45] <NetTerminalGene> petn-randall, thanks i won't do that. i don't want to break something
2185 [22:06:57] <xxavi> petn-randall: How can I know the 2.4 and 5 in selection applet ?
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2188 [22:08:26] <petn-randall> xxavi: I guess you can check the output of iwconfig if you care about that.
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2190 [22:08:55] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: What is there to break? You don't want to use the package anymore, and you already deinstalled it.
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2192 [22:10:07] <xxavi> petn-randall: ok, thanks.
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2197 [22:14:42] <somebody> alkisg, I was trying to check two options for the Alt and PrtSc keys, which are treated as mutually exclusive by the KDE's keyboard utility.
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2199 [22:15:00] <somebody> > OK. I want "Alt and Meta are on Alt keys", which makes my right Alt work as Alt in Colemak layout, and the other one is "Win is mapped to PrtSc (and the usual Win key)".
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2201 [22:15:41] <somebody> So what you are saying is, I can configure one of those in xorg, and it will be respected by the KDE, correct?
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2204 [22:17:13] <alkisg> somebody: does `sudo dpkg-reconfigure keyboard-configuration` provide the options you need?
2205 [22:17:29] <alkisg> If so, by default they work in console, xorg, and DEs
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2207 [22:18:08] <alkisg> And at the first time one goes to the DE UI for keyboard configuration, they're not respected anymore, until they're cleared from there
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2210 [22:18:22] <alkisg> i.e. overriden
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2212 [22:19:18] <somebody> Okay! So there was an option to make the right Alt work as the AltGr, which gives me the symmetric modifier keys, which is what I wanted in the first place.
2213 [22:19:28] <somebody> This is wonderful, alkisg, thank you!
2214 [22:19:33] <alkisg> np
2215 [22:19:53] <somebody> But can I open the KDE's GUI keyboard thing to set the PrtSc to work as the Meta key, without ruining this?
2216 [22:20:04] <alkisg> No idea, I don't use KDE
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2218 [22:20:45] <somebody> OK, let's try this...
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2227 [22:24:50] <somebody> Nope, doesn't work.
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2229 [22:25:04] <somebody> It gets overwritten as soon as I open the GUI thingie.
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2231 [22:26:44] <somebody> The right Alt not working correctly is what I get now, since by default it's bound to the AltGr on Colemak.
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2239 [22:29:03] <somebody> Is this utility going to influence the keyboard layout that's used for the FDE passphrase?
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2246 [22:36:45] <MoonKing1969> hi
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2250 [22:37:53] <kreyren> How do you overclock nvidia GPU on debian
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2261 [22:45:47] <mavhq> just upgraded to buster from stretch. after I rebooted got a load of irq errors: do_IRQ: 2.34 No irq handler for vector. This seemed to cause zfs to not import a pool and say it I should delete and restore it from backup, scary. Rebooted to 4.9.0.9 and everything's fine
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2276 [23:00:22] <aguitel> try to find fastest mirror with synaptic , but no show this option ; what need to install ?
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2282 [23:04:07] <Mathisen> aguitel, netselect-apt
2283 [23:04:28] <aguitel> Mathisen, this work in command line
2284 [23:04:56] <aguitel> talking about make this with synaptic
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2286 [23:05:21] <Mathisen> then i have no clue. was assuming you just wanted fastest mirror
2287 [23:05:33] <aguitel> yes
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2290 [23:06:37] <Mathisen> and running netselect-apt will show your 10 fastest
2291 [23:07:42] <aguitel> ok
2292 [23:07:46] <aguitel> thanks
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2295 [23:09:25] <aguitel> other question , best way to install last firefox version ( stable ) ?
2296 [23:10:29] <Mathisen> change dist :) nah just kidding. but there is no good way. if you want to stick to standard repos
2297 [23:11:04] <fraktor> IS there a good way to install the latest Firefox on testing?
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2299 [23:11:53] <Mathisen> ,v firefox
2300 [23:11:54] <judd> Package: firefox on amd64 -- sid: 68.0.1-2
2301 [23:12:12] <Mathisen> sid got it
2302 [23:12:53] <Mathisen> ,v mozilla-firefox
2303 [23:12:54] <judd> No package named 'mozilla-firefox' was found in amd64.
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2306 [23:13:42] <ChmEarl> firefox-esr
2307 [23:17:19] <aguitel> replaced-url
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2315 [23:20:39] <MoonKing1969> after upgrading nvidia drivers to the latest i lost my kde desktop. :(
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2317 [23:21:16] <aguitel> maybe wrong nvidia version you install or upgrade
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2319 [23:21:21] <def_jam> test
2320 [23:21:28] <dvs> !test
2321 [23:21:29] <dpkg> Test failed.
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2323 [23:21:39] <def_jam> thanks
2324 [23:21:49] <Habbie> !test
2325 [23:21:50] <dpkg> Test failed.
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2327 [23:21:55] <astronavt> what's the recommended tool for building packages in some kind of contained environment? i dont wanna have a bunch of miscellaneous libraries marked as non-auto
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2329 [23:22:22] <Habbie> pbuilder, last time i checked - this may no longer be the recommended tool but it might be a useful start to your Google journey
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2331 [23:22:49] <Habbie> personally i use docker with some scripting around it
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2333 [23:23:56] <astronavt> yeah i see it referenced a few times in the wiki
2334 [23:23:59] <astronavt> i'll start there thanks
2335 [23:24:10] <Habbie> good luck, we'll be here :)
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2370 [23:50:11] <preyalone> ay can we get valgrind for x32?
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context: nick names on moving displays as market values
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