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• 9[00:02:30] <jmcnaught> ongo: you should have su so you can still become root. Did you use wireless network during the installer?
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• 11[00:02:53] <ayekat> doesn't the installer give you a root shell on tty3 or tty4 anyway...? or do I misremember
• 12[00:03:22] <ayekat> also, wpa-supplicant is probably not there, but wpa_supplicant might be :-P
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• 32[00:08:30] <ongo> ayekat: don't have wpa supplicant either
• 33[00:08:37] <ongo> wpa_supplicant
• 34[00:08:50] <ayekat> ongo: are you in a root shell? how did you determine you don't have it?
• 35[00:08:52] <ongo> jmcnaught: I'm not sure I did, cause I wasn't looking through most the process
• 36[00:09:00] <ongo> ayekat: well I can use su, but sudo isn't instaleld
• 37[00:09:13] <nkuttler> how would sudo help you?
• 38[00:09:15] <ongo> actually almost nothing is, I guess cause it's a netinstall and it couldn't get net settings
• 39[00:09:15] <ayekat> ... that's not what I asked
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• 41[00:09:58] <jmcnaught> ongo: if you absolutely cannot plug in an ethernet cable then you should probably just redo the installer and pay attention this time, there's an opportunity to connect to a wireless network, it asks you
• 42[00:10:03] <ongo> ayekat: because wpa_cli isn't on the system
• 43[00:10:19] <ayekat> O_o
• 44[00:10:32] <ongo> jmcnaught: I remember it trying to configure the network with dhcpd but I ran into problems, it wouldn't configure
• 45[00:10:33] <ayekat> ongo: again: do you have a root shell? how did you determine you don't have wpa_supplicant?
• 46[00:10:44] <ongo> I do have a root shell
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• 48[00:11:12] <ayekat> so $PATH should include /sbin and /usr/sbin, right?
• 49[00:11:18] <ongo> well, as I said, cause I can't run any wpa_supplicant commands
• 50[00:11:44] <jmcnaught> ongo: your wireless care might need a non-free firmware. You can look up the PCI-ID with "lspci -nn" and we can look it up here to if firmware is required
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• 52[00:12:13] <ongo> oh yeah, I had that prompt, however when I pressed yes to install it, nothing would happen
• 53[00:12:32] <jmcnaught> or look for firmware errors with "dmesg | grep -i firmware"
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• 55[00:14:15] <ayekat> hmm... actually, the busybox shell does indeed not have any wpa_supplicant executable - I suppose the installer extracts it from elsewhere?
• 56[00:14:22] <ongo> there's a bunch of failed to load *.fw jmcnaught
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• 58[00:14:33] <jmcnaught> !firmware image
• 59[00:14:33] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD installer images containing non-free Debian firmware packages are available for installing Debian 9 "Stretch". See replaced-url
• 60[00:14:37] <ongo> so I guess it's the firmware stuff
• 61[00:14:54] <jmcnaught> ongo: try using that installer that comes with firmware ^^
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• 63[00:16:09] <ongo> jmcnaught: which one of those should I install?
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• 65[00:16:37] <jmcnaught> you probably want replaced-url
• 66[00:17:26] <jmcnaught> most computers made in the last decade are 64bit which Debian calls amd64
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• 74[00:21:56] <agio> if you have the ability to write to the root directory of your installer OS, you can just add the firmware packages to the /firmware directory - of the official installer
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• 84[00:26:53] <ongo> jmcnaught: I ran into the same problem again, I press yes for load missing fimware from removable media, it loads something, but gives me the same prompt again
• 85[00:26:57] <ongo> so it never loads in the end
• 86[00:27:09] <Sleaker> ayekat: installer generally has tty1 as the interactive installer, tty2-3 as shells, tty4 as the running syslog
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• 88[00:28:28] <ongo> says Detect network hardware, then goes back
• 89[00:28:32] <agio> ongo: alternatively you can finish the install, then plugin your USB (containing the firmware .deb package/s) and install them manually
• 90[00:28:45] <ongo> I'll try that
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• 94[00:29:09] <agio> it means you won't be connected to the network during the install
• 95[00:29:39] <agio> and - as a consequence - you may have to manually define /etc/apt/sources.list
• 96[00:29:41] *** Joins: Unit193 (ukikie@replaced-ip)
• 97[00:29:57] <agio> because the installer won't be able to find the nearest apt mirror
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• 99[00:30:55] <ongo> yeah, it does say that network autoconfiguration failed
• 100[00:31:20] <agio> you usually can just continue anyway
• 101[00:31:31] <ongo> yeah
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• 103[00:31:59] <agio> also, you will have to find your wifi adapters model number
• 104[00:32:08] *** Quits: mvanorder__ (~mvanorder@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
• 105[00:32:27] <agio> or obtain the giant firmware-misc***.deb package
• 106[00:32:45] *** Quits: joshbright (~joshbrigh@replaced-ip) (Quit: zzzzzz)
• 107[00:32:47] <agio> which I think is all the non-free/firmware installer provides
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• 113[00:34:58] <ongo> agio: where can I get the firmware packages I need and how exactly do I install them?
• 114[00:35:02] *** Quits: amwl (~amwl@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 115[00:35:34] <agio> packages.debian.org
• 116[00:36:33] <agio> easiest way - is probably to grab the massive firmware-misc-**.deb for your release (stretch, buster etc)
• 117[00:36:48] <agio> it has all non-free firmware
• 118[00:37:08] <agio> so you won't need to match the package to your wi-fi hardware module
• 119[00:37:17] <agio> and it contains dependencies
• 120[00:37:20] <ongo> alright, I'll look for that, thanks
• 121[00:37:22] <agio> to install:
• 122[00:37:42] <agio> dpkg --install <packagename> (as root)
• 123[00:37:42] <dpkg> wish i knew, agio
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• 125[00:38:06] <ongo> replaced-url
• 126[00:38:44] <agio> you will poss. need to reload the corresponding kernel module for the device driver and reflash firmware microcode
• 127[00:39:04] <agio> are you on buster?
• 128[00:39:08] <kreyren> yes
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• 135[00:40:43] <ongo> okay, I just installed the base system
• 136[00:40:56] *** Joins: ebarch (~ebarch@replaced-ip)
• 137[00:40:58] <ongo> gonna put the firmware stuff on my usb
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• 145[00:47:38] <agio> nice
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• 148[00:50:08] <ongo> okay, done, what should I do now?
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• 151[00:52:06] <ongo> agio: since I still don't have any way to connect to wifi :/
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• 160[00:59:30] <ongo> agio: or was I supposed to swap my usb out for the one with the firmware during installation?
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• 177[01:10:56] <LtL> ongo: do you have a running system? copy the firmware to the running system into /lib/firmware/ then reboot. why didn't you install withe the firmware install usb?
• 178[01:11:03] *** Quits: Rogalian (~cools@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 179[01:11:49] <agio> ongo: no, you probably can't swap or remove the installer USB during install
• 180[01:12:07] <ongo> LtL I did
• 181[01:12:11] <ongo> but it wouldn't install the firmware
• 182[01:12:22] *** Quits: mvaenskae (~mvaenskae@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 183[01:12:25] <ongo> agio: okay, I'm very confused then
• 184[01:12:35] *** Quits: tagomago (~tagomago@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 185[01:12:38] <rant> ongo: obviously you didn't.. the image LtL is talking about has the firmware included in the installer
• 186[01:12:47] *** Quits: Essadon (~Essadon@replaced-ip) (Quit: Qutting)
• 187[01:12:56] <rant> its the fimware-netinst.iso or w/e
• 188[01:13:03] <agio> ongo did you get the firmware packages?
• 189[01:13:29] <ongo> agio: yes
• 190[01:13:39] <ongo> and installed them with dpkg --install firmware.deb
• 191[01:13:52] <agio> awesome, now reboot the system
• 192[01:14:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1483
• 193[01:14:02] <rant> heh
• 194[01:14:05] <agio> to load the firmware and device drivers
• 195[01:14:11] <rant> thats not gonna work
• 196[01:14:17] <agio> why not?
• 197[01:14:24] <rant> ,depends firmware-misc-nonfree
• 198[01:14:25] <judd> Package firmware-misc-nonfree in stretch/amd64 -- depends: .
• 199[01:14:54] <rant> ok maybe I'm wrong
• 200[01:15:10] <ongo> okay, rebooted
• 201[01:15:12] <rant> I thought that was just a metapackage as there are specific firmware-realtek and such packages
• 202[01:15:17] <ongo> so how do I get networking working now though
• 203[01:15:30] <ongo> I don't have wpa_supplicant or any package really
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• 205[01:15:42] <agio> firmware-realtek depends on the misc package
• 206[01:15:54] <rant> I thought it was the other way around :P
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• 208[01:16:12] <Sveta> how do i make a wifi-connected debian laptop share the internet over an ethernet cable?
• 209[01:16:17] <agio> ongo: which installer did you use, netinstaller or ful l?
• 210[01:16:29] <ongo> (debian-9.8.0-amd64-netinst.iso )
• 211[01:16:57] <agio> ,depends firmware-realtek
• 212[01:16:58] <judd> Package firmware-realtek in stretch/amd64 -- depends: .
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• 214[01:17:22] <Sveta> .
• 215[01:17:32] <agio> ,depends firmware-realtek_20161130-3_all.deb
• 216[01:17:32] <rant> Sveta: replaced-url
• 217[01:17:32] <judd> No package named 'firmware-realtek_20161130-3_all.deb' was found in stretch/amd64.
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• 219[01:18:09] <ongo> but I installed the firmware package after installation agio
• 220[01:18:21] <agio> wait - is stretch still stable? or has buster become stable?
• 221[01:18:34] <LtL> ongo: you should install using this, if you are 64 bit. replaced-url
• 222[01:19:09] <agio> ongo and did you reboot?
• 223[01:19:09] <ongo> LtL: that is what I used
• 224[01:19:11] <LtL> agio: stretch is currently stable, 9.8
• 225[01:19:32] <agio> cool :)
• 226[01:19:39] <rant> Sveta: I vaguely recall we once had and maybe still do, a GUI firewall frontend.. firehol maybe it was, that could do it with basically one click. but it required leaving that gui up and running.. the methods on the wiki are a bit involved
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• 228[01:19:45] <ongo> but it doesn't matter if I have firmware
• 229[01:19:54] <ongo> if I can't run networking
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• 231[01:20:19] <agio> ongo did you use the netinstaller or full?
• 232[01:20:26] <ongo> netinstaller
• 233[01:20:44] <agio> then you won't have the wpa_supplicant packages
• 234[01:20:57] <ongo> right, that's what I'm saying
• 235[01:21:07] <ongo> do I have to reinstall full then?
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• 238[01:21:19] <rant> people these days act like wifi is the only way to get online :D
• 239[01:21:29] <ongo> rant: well I don't have access to ethernet rn
• 240[01:21:46] <rant> its not convenient but I can always just plug my machine in to grab a few things :P
• 241[01:21:49] <agio> ongo no - not necessarily need to re-install. do you have a non-WPA / open wifi available to you?
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• 243[01:22:06] <ongo> agio: I do, though the connection is a bit trashy
• 244[01:22:07] <rant> ongo: are you in the US?
• 245[01:22:11] <ongo> nope, NL
• 246[01:22:31] <agio> ongo, well you should be able to connect to the open wifi
• 247[01:22:37] <ongo> agio: using what?
• 248[01:22:40] <nkuttler> usb networking?
• 249[01:22:58] <rant> ongo: do you have iwlist and iwconfig ?
• 250[01:23:00] <agio> ongo: ip a
• 251[01:23:07] <nkuttler> but really, still this? could have reinstalled a few times by now
• 252[01:23:08] <agio> to get your network adapter name
• 253[01:23:46] <ongo> no iwlist or iwconfig
• 254[01:24:07] <agio> ongo then, sudo iwlist <iface> s
• 255[01:24:23] <agio> do you get a list of available wifi's?
• 256[01:24:38] <ongo> interesting, my wifis don't show up
• 257[01:25:04] <agio> damn, then you prob havent got firmware/drivers loaded
• 258[01:25:05] <ongo> only lo enp2s0
• 259[01:25:19] <ongo> how come? I installed firmware-misc-*
• 260[01:25:33] <ongo> and amd64 netinst firmware
• 261[01:25:35] <rant> someone should've said dmesg|grep firmware and/or lspci -nn a long time ago
• 262[01:25:46] <rant> or lsusb depending on if its usb
• 263[01:26:02] <agio> ongo: what rant just said is right
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• 268[01:26:36] <agio> dmesg or journalctl -k | grep firmware
• 269[01:26:37] <rant> I personally dont even start chasing rabbits until I know I actually saw a rabbit :P
• 270[01:26:50] <ongo> failed to load a bunch of firmware
• 271[01:26:55] <Sveta> rant: leaving a gui up and running is ok, do you have a guide for firehol ?
• 272[01:27:09] *** Quits: ghost43 (~daer@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 273[01:27:14] <ongo> b43/ucode30_mimo.fw b43-open/ucode30_mimo.fw
• 274[01:27:20] <rant> Sveta: idk if thats even the right one.. I am vaguely recalling something I used MANY years ago
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• 278[01:28:03] <agio> Sveta: why a GUI, why not iptables?
• 279[01:28:39] <agio> (soon it will be nftables)
• 280[01:28:45] <ongo> so what do I do?
• 281[01:29:00] <ongo> how ridiculous is this, I thought debian would be easy to install lol
• 282[01:29:12] <rant> Sveta: no, sorry it was firestarter replaced-url
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• 284[01:29:15] <Sveta> agio: I would like to receive internet over wifi and share it via ethernet
• 285[01:29:17] <jcb2016> ongo: its easy in virtualbox
• 286[01:29:25] <rant> Sveta: it has a wizard for internet connection sharing as shown on that page
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• 288[01:29:50] <agio> ongo what is output of "sudo ip link set <iface> up" ?
• 289[01:30:03] <ongo> agio: my wifi interface doesn't even show up though
• 290[01:30:26] <Sveta> rant, nice, not packaged for debian though? I am unable to locate a download file on the official website
• 291[01:30:44] <agio> ongo sorry, then you need to get hardware wifi module working
• 292[01:30:56] <ongo> yeah, how do I do that, if it doesn't show up though
• 293[01:31:12] <ongo> is it the firmware?
• 294[01:31:38] *** Joins: Whiskey (~Whiskey@replaced-ip)
• 295[01:32:45] <ongo> how is this going wrong though, I installed all the firmware, the generic one even
• 296[01:33:14] *** Joins: ledixus (ledixus@replaced-ip)
• 297[01:33:24] <rant> Sveta: they must've removed it.. last package I see on the archives is from 2012 replaced-url
• 298[01:33:38] *** Joins: volter (~volter@replaced-ip)
• 299[01:34:19] <ongo> I'm going ubuntu, how is this so difficult lol
• 300[01:34:30] <ongo> Installing arch on this machine was easier
• 301[01:35:16] <rant> Sveta: ah, it was removed cause apparently its no longer developed and lacks ipv6 support
• 302[01:37:56] <agio> ongo well , there is a non-official instller - that should be easier
• 303[01:37:58] *** Quits: tehnull (tehnull@replaced-ip) (Quit: watchdog watchdog0: watchdog did not stop!)
• 304[01:40:26] <Sveta> rant: ok
• 305[01:40:27] <ongo> okay, it's def my hardware, ubuntu install doesn't configure dhcp network either
• 306[01:40:42] <ongo> agio: it's probably my laptop proprietary wifi card being stupid
• 307[01:40:42] *** Quits: Cabanossi (~Cabanossi@replaced-ip) (Quit: Bye, bye...)
• 308[01:41:01] <rant> Sveta: I'm looking into an alternative
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• 311[01:43:33] <Sveta> rant: thanks, i'll express interest in a debian package to the firestarter maintainers while you are searching. i'm writing them an email
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• 314[01:46:53] <ongo> stallman was right
• 315[01:47:05] <tehnull> eating foot fungus is magical
• 316[01:47:28] <rant> Sveta: well the last debian package said it was dropped because its no longer being developed
• 317[01:47:45] *** Quits: Secret-Fire (~Secret-Fi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 318[01:47:50] <Sveta> rant: i understand
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• 322[01:49:41] <agio> I keep having problems with the standalone firefox (downloaded from mozilla.org) it keeps freezing up my X server. does the debian firefox-esr package receive bug fixes for problems like that?
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• 325[01:51:57] <ongo> so what do I do about this proprietary wifi adapter for my laptop? Those debian firmware packages don't seem to help
• 326[01:52:28] <agio> ongo did you run : lspci -nn | grep -i net ?
• 327[01:52:40] <agio> to find out your wifi model?
• 328[01:53:02] <ongo> lemme see
• 329[01:53:05] <agio> its usually not this much of a problem
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• 331[01:53:44] <ongo> Broadcom Limited BCM43227
• 332[01:54:38] *** Quits: woshty (~woshty@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 333[01:54:46] <agio> ok , now search online for the debian package for that wifi module
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• 337[01:57:34] <ongo> replaced-url
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• 340[01:59:13] <agio> looks like it - and install it, then reboot
• 341[01:59:30] *** Joins: Gazooo (~Gazooo@replaced-ip)
• 342[01:59:45] <ongo> agio: how do I install it without networking in the first place tho :o
• 343[02:00:01] <agio> copy it to the computer with networking
• 344[02:00:05] <agio> save it onto USB
• 345[02:00:32] *** Quits: Brainium (~brainium@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 346[02:00:36] <agio> plug USB into the new install and run dpkg --install bcm43xxx..deb
• 347[02:01:05] *** Quits: innoix (~innoix@replaced-ip##) (Quit: The Lounge - ##replaced-url
• 348[02:01:10] *** Quits: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip) (Quit: See you around.)
• 349[02:01:25] <agio> sorry, I mean "download" it using the computer which is network capable
• 350[02:01:29] *** Joins: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip)
• 351[02:01:33] <ongo> what's the latest debian called? stretch, jessie, buster?
• 352[02:01:38] <ongo> (9.8.0)
• 353[02:01:55] *** Quits: rgr (~user@replaced-ip) (Quit: ERC (IRC client for Emacs 26.1))
• 354[02:01:55] <rant> Sveta: well shit... heh.. you're probably not gonna believe this
• 355[02:02:04] *** Quits: gislaved (b9e814cd@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 356[02:02:10] <rant> Sveta: but the network-manager-gnome applet seems to do it fairly easily
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• 362[02:03:42] <rant> Sveta: you right click the network-manager applet, goto edit connections, select your wired connection you want to plug a machine into and share with.. click the edit button..
• 363[02:04:20] *** Quits: greatgatsby (~greatgats@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 364[02:05:10] <rant> Sveta: then on the IPv4 and IPv6 tabs that "Method:" pulldown you change both IPv4 and IPv6 to "Shared to other computers" then plug in another computer and it'll get an IP via dhcp and its online
• 365[02:05:18] *** Joins: krytarik (~krytarik@replaced-ip)
• 366[02:06:25] <rant> Sveta: if you already had it plugged in, IE the connection is already showing active, you'll have to left click the applet and click on the wired network again to make it "reconnect" in the sharing mode
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• 369[02:09:17] <ongo> agio: says the package depends on b43-fwcutter, which is not installed
• 370[02:10:13] <agio> wow, are you sure you need that package? you may need to get it if so...
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• 375[02:12:37] <agio> ongo installing debian is not usually this much hassle. in the future you may want to use the full installer (or get a laptop with less proprietary wifi)
• 376[02:13:04] <ongo> yeah, this crappy laptop is really old, wouldn't buy such a laptop at this point in time for sure
• 377[02:13:15] <ongo> sorry for the hassle, I need to get some sleep
• 378[02:13:25] <ongo> got another error installing the firmware, gonna continue tomorrow I think
• 379[02:13:28] <ongo> thanks for the help agio
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• 382[02:13:34] <rant> Sveta: I'll have to update the wiki, to include this information.. its really pretty easy even if you wanted to go the other way around or share over a 2nd wifi connection
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• 385[02:13:54] <agio> rant do you know of - or can link to - a libre wifi module which can be purchased online ?
• 386[02:13:55] <ongo> it's trying to contact replaced-url
• 387[02:14:24] <rant> agio: you mean merely something that doesnt require non-free firmware?
• 388[02:14:35] <agio> yes
• 389[02:14:46] *** Quits: laidback_01 (~laidback_@replaced-ip##) (Quit: KVIrc 5.0.0 Aria ##replaced-url
• 390[02:14:47] <rant> does it matter if its old and 2.4ghz only? :P
• 391[02:14:54] *** Quits: jubo2 (~juboxi@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
• 392[02:15:06] <agio> rant thats fine
• 393[02:15:06] <ongo> I won't buy a wifi card just for this laptop, I just want to get it running for 0$ and store it in a dusty corner where noone can see it's sorry butt
• 394[02:15:28] <epony> The older atheros devices would work, but there is really no point chasing the "open and libre firmware" ghost.
• 395[02:15:31] *** Quits: Nekojimi (~jimj316@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 396[02:15:34] <ongo> also I'm prolly gonna have it connected through ethernet as it's a server
• 397[02:15:59] <ongo> anyways, thanks for the help, gonna continue this tomorrow :)
• 398[02:16:12] <agio> ongo cool, good luck
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• 400[02:17:17] <agio> epony: why, do you say that?
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• 403[02:19:01] <epony> Cause hardware makers are secretive and lying people.
• 404[02:19:07] <rant> agio: I have here a Netgear WG111v3 USB that has a RTL8187B chip in it, and it works without any non-free firmware
• 405[02:20:07] <agio> rant nice, I think FSF has links to libre wifi modules too ?
• 406[02:20:35] *** Quits: ongo (~weechat@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
• 407[02:20:47] <rant> agio: replaced-url
• 408[02:20:49] <epony> There will be non free firmware in the HDD/SSD, the motherboard, the disk controller, the network controller, the video controller, the central processor, the audio controller, and everywhere you look around.
• 409[02:21:07] <rant> agio: 2.4ghz 802.11b/g
• 410[02:21:18] <epony> So, running a wifi with a free firmware, makes no difference.
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• 413[02:22:21] <agio> epony: understood
• 414[02:22:26] <epony> It's better to have a well documented, stable and reliable device with whatever firmware it likes to use.
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• 418[02:23:19] <epony> Than a free firmware running on a device that is reverse engineered but has a lot of quirks and nuances of failures and timing problems, hangs and random instabilities.
• 419[02:24:22] <agio> but it can be updated, the proprietary still will never be updated - vendor will just direct you to buy the latest gen model
• 420[02:24:25] <epony> But yes, I would prefer a free and open well designed firmware device (matching the hardware spec) where possible, any day as long as it is running the devices as it is designed to be run.
• 421[02:25:05] *** Parts: lmat (~lmat@replaced-ip) ()
• 422[02:25:26] *** Quits: zachre_ (Zerkalerka@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 423[02:25:31] <epony> agio vendors always have these powers over people with connectors, operation modes / standards, and whatever colour trend of the year / planned obsolescence in the hardware (capacitors, traces, burn in silicon bridges etc)
• 424[02:25:52] <epony> Hardware maker is an offensive term :-)
• 425[02:26:04] <epony> better call them liars and thieves
• 426[02:26:41] *** Quits: kouni (~kouni@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
• 427[02:27:03] <epony> btw the wifi devices are more likely to have free firmwares and good drivers (for some very common models of the previous e.g. G mode devices)
• 428[02:27:39] <agio> do you know of any?
• 429[02:27:59] <agio> preferrably in a mini-pci form factor
• 430[02:28:05] *** Quits: CyberManifest (~CyberMani@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 431[02:28:48] <epony> my netbook came with an AR9285 (very common mediocre performance non-free firmware device) that works very fine as a G mode AP for my home
• 432[02:29:18] *** Quits: mandeep (~mandeep@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 433[02:29:19] <epony> it's not MIMO and has only 1 antenna, so forget about N
• 434[02:29:21] <epony> :-)
• 435[02:29:29] <epony> sucks but works stable as an AP
• 436[02:29:32] <agio> yeah, thats non-free - im asking if you know of any libre wifi modules
• 437[02:29:46] <epony> let's check the kernel and debian wikis :-)
• 438[02:30:09] <agio> whats the benifit of N? improved bandwidth?
• 439[02:30:43] <epony> replaced-url
• 440[02:30:49] <epony> (3 links)
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• 443[02:31:50] <agio> I need to setup a browser first to follow those links
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• 446[02:32:23] <epony> last one is most useful for me
• 447[02:32:50] <epony> you can do a search for "wikipedia open source wireless driver"
• 448[02:33:02] *** Joins: Dark-Jedi (~dark-jedi@replaced-ip)
• 449[02:33:49] <agio> yeah, but that only finds the libre chipset, you need to then find a device for sale using the given libre chipset - like the one rants linked to
• 450[02:34:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1477
• 451[02:34:10] <epony> yeah, indeed
• 452[02:34:17] *** Joins: dez (uid92154@replaced-ip)
• 453[02:34:21] <epony> that's a problem with device listings for sale
• 454[02:34:44] <agio> heh yeah
• 455[02:35:35] <agio> you can't message the seller "does the device use a chipset from this set of FSF approved firmwares" lol
• 456[02:35:49] *** Quits: GenteelBen (~Ragenix@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 457[02:36:32] <epony> well typically they have a picture with a sticker on top of the RF shield, where it lists the chipset on the label
• 458[02:36:35] <jcb2016> agio: whats a FSF?
• 459[02:37:04] <agio> free software foundation
• 460[02:37:52] <agio> epony: you never did mention the benefit of 802.11n ? is it bandwidth?
• 461[02:37:58] *** Quits: ebarch (~ebarch@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 462[02:38:26] <epony> for me, it does not work, but yeah, typically, higher transfer speed
• 463[02:39:04] <agio> what does not work for you?
• 464[02:39:13] <epony> N mode
• 465[02:39:19] <agio> oh
• 466[02:39:31] *** Joins: ebarch (~ebarch@replaced-ip)
• 467[02:39:58] <agio> so what 802.11b,g can transfer up to 50Mbits and N is what? 300Mbits?
• 468[02:40:11] <agio> I never get close to 50Mbits
• 469[02:40:35] <epony> (my device is not MIMO and has only 1 antenna connected and I'm not entirely sure it had a second antenna connector onboard at all, despite marketed as N device and sold as such and windows driver advertised as such, it is a LIE)
• 470[02:40:44] *** Joins: joe9 (~joe@replaced-ip)
• 471[02:41:34] <epony> Well real throughput for G is about 75% of that, so 30-40 Mbps.. which is just fine on par with the broadband at home.
• 472[02:42:01] <agio> well I think the spec just allows for 2 bands - the device doesn't have to implement 2.4 and 5Ghz - i think
• 473[02:42:02] <tomreyn> if you can actually get this much, and consistently.
• 474[02:42:14] <joe9> I am trying to add some kernel modules to my debian kernel replaced-url
• 475[02:42:56] <joe9> Building out-of-tree kernel modules section 4.7 talks about it. But, I could not figure out the build directory.
• 476[02:43:01] <tomreyn> replaced-url
• 477[02:43:09] <epony> yeah, with a good driver and a real (not a fake knock off imitation) device, it should get about that.. mine does confirmed by the mobile phone wifi
• 478[02:43:17] <joe9> I do not see a /usr/src directory
• 479[02:43:44] <agio> joe9: can't you load the module dynamically - or do you want to compile it in?
• 480[02:43:50] <epony> I have no real use for that, since the mobile clients can't handle that much at all.
• 481[02:44:08] <epony> and anything above N is proprietary territory..
• 482[02:44:48] <joe9> agio: I cannot build it. I can use insmod to load it in after building it.
• 483[02:45:16] <joe9> agio: I need to compile the module first so I have the .ko object to load. Does that make sense?
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• 489[02:49:27] <joe9> agio: figured it out, I just needed to install the headers.deb
• 490[02:49:57] <epony> ..and remember, things can really get more complicated in reality, devices can have versions (by the maker), may have been reflashed by the seller, may have a falsified sticker, or lack some minor component onboard and be unstable
• 491[02:50:09] *** Quits: Dragon092 (~Dragon@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
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• 497[02:50:45] <epony> so, order a couple, try and good luck (atheros older devices and some ralinks are more likely to be a success)
• 498[02:50:55] *** Joins: atomi (~atomi@replaced-ip)
• 499[02:52:19] <epony> If a device does not have an Ethernet port, I don't want it.
• 500[02:52:25] <epony> :-)
• 501[02:52:33] <agio> cool, thanks for tips
• 502[02:52:53] *** Quits: jcb2016 (~jcb@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 503[02:53:02] <epony> not very useful info, but blame it on the vendors and sellers
• 504[02:53:40] <agio> cool, well i need to get a browser working - then I will check it out
• 505[02:53:47] *** Quits: GaneshR (~ganeshraj@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 506[02:54:16] <epony> also, you may have a good chance of finding a device recommendation on the mailing lists / wikis
• 507[02:55:15] <agio> yeah, I will check out the device rant linked to - less than $10 - can't complain with that
• 508[02:55:34] <epony> fine
• 509[02:56:49] <epony> I got very lucky, 2 out of 2 portable (laptops) both came with the same atheros device, both work well in G mode as AP (host mode).
• 510[02:57:08] <epony> So, my access point is a netbook :-)
• 511[02:57:44] <epony> Can't beat that, runs a free OS.
• 512[02:58:16] <agio> nice
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• 515[03:01:45] <IcemanV9> in my past experience with atheros wifi device, it rocks SOLID especially no dropped connection
• 516[03:01:54] <epony> And is an audio server for the local network, because it has the cleanest sounding audio card. That's a second win in one device. Plus it plays TV over the Internet (streaming SD client). And serves as a backup HDD enclosure. All battery backed up. Lots of wins for this thingie.
• 517[03:01:55] *** Quits: Thedarkb-T60 (~Thedarkb-@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
• 518[03:02:05] <epony> IcemanV9 Same here.
• 519[03:02:14] *** Quits: mandeep_ (~mandeep@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
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• 521[03:03:12] <IcemanV9> sounds like you're all set, epony : )
• 522[03:03:33] <Sveta> rant, thanks a lot. network-manager doesn't show up in the tray icon, do you know what command it uses to open the gui?
• 523[03:03:36] <epony> An access point. A sound server. A TV screen. A music player. A backup device. An access point.. (and one more thing, runs a free OS)
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• 525[03:04:35] <Sveta> rant, forget it, i think `nm-connection-editor` is it
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• 527[03:04:51] <Sveta> rant, i'll keep you updated on progress
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• 561[03:44:21] <agio> does anyone know the new iw command to show 802.11 info on your wireless interface?
• 562[03:44:51] <agio> I thought it was something like: iw dev <iface> info ?
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• 569[03:53:33] <tehnull> by the way
• 570[03:53:45] <tehnull> whoever said using nvidia drivers from their site is bad
• 571[03:53:48] <tehnull> u wrong
• 572[03:54:05] <tehnull> upgraded kernel rebooted everything works perfect still
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• 580[04:03:05] <IcemanV9> agio: iw <iface> info would do it? no?
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• 584[04:04:39] <agio> IcemanV9: thanks, but that only prints some basic info. Im wanting the iw command that dumps all the 802.11 info on the device
• 585[04:05:01] <feynhat> hello
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• 587[04:05:47] <IcemanV9> agio: ip is a new one that replaces ifconfig
• 588[04:07:02] <agio> thats for the tcp/ip interface, I'm meaning the wireless ( i think its called the "link" layer ) interfacce
• 589[04:07:21] <feynhat> I am using Stretch (with xfce). Whenever I mount a partition from Thunar, it gets mounted without write permission. How do I fix this?
• 590[04:08:22] <agio> you do mean the the mount-point dir - or the sub-dirs inside the mounted file system?
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• 592[04:10:15] <feynhat> agio: the sub-dirs
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• 594[04:11:15] <agio> those sub-dirs will carry their own file permissions - they will be whatever they are - regardless of thunar - Im guessing
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• 596[04:11:53] <agio> feynhat: i.e. if you mount that filesystem from the command line, I'll bet you still don't have write permissions
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• 604[04:13:05] <feynhat> my fstab entry looks like this: LABEL="Data" /media/kss/Data ntfs rw,noauto,user,defaults 0 2
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• 608[04:14:23] <agio> I don't understand - what are you trying to fix? thunar or your fstab?
• 609[04:15:51] <feynhat> agio: I want that whenever I mount a partition from thunar, it should get mounted with write permission.
• 610[04:16:04] <feynhat> I thought fstab might have something to do with that.
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• 615[04:17:13] <agio> the mounting of a pre-existing file system doesn't affect the permissions of the file/dirs contained within, you need to set them directly
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• 618[04:20:18] <feynhat> agio: When I try to chmod, it tells me that its a readonly file system.
• 619[04:20:33] <agio> oh?
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• 622[04:22:36] <agio> feynhat: I've got to go. sorry I don't know how to fix that anyway also!
• 623[04:22:53] <feynhat> agio: No problem.
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• 650[05:04:09] <SuperBawlz> Anyone have a guide handing for increase the size on /dev/xvd filesystem?
• 651[05:04:15] <SuperBawlz> *handy
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• 671[05:16:17] <SuperBawlz> replaced-url
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• 673[05:16:46] <SuperBawlz> is it safe to delete and re-create 2 and 5
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• 702[05:37:52] <tomreyn> SuperBawlz: UUID=$(blkid -s UUID -o value /dev/xvda5) && swapoff /dev/xvda5 && sync && parted /dev/xvda rm 5 && parted /dev/xvda rm 2 && echo "Either remove or replace /dev/xvd5 ( UUID=$UUID ) in /etc/fstab now!"
• 703[05:38:22] <tomreyn> so generally yes, but need to swapoff first, and delete in correct order.
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• 706[05:43:06] <jcb2016> other then the website. how do you query backports from the command line? all i know is -t strech-backports install is there any other commands i need to know?
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• 711[05:48:47] <SuperBawlz> tomreyn, I wish I swap that when you wrote it.
• 712[05:48:50] <SuperBawlz> LOL.
• 713[05:49:01] <SuperBawlz> I got it resolved but did it the hard way.
• 714[05:49:07] <SuperBawlz> Thank you!
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• 723[06:03:28] <mandeep> what can i do if i can't register on OFTC to ask in #debian-next?
• 724[06:04:30] <mason> mandeep: You shouldn't have to register there, unless it's changed.
• 725[06:04:36] <mason> I think you only register there for a cloak.
• 726[06:05:04] <Butt3rfly> you know ofct is a different network right?
• 727[06:05:09] <Butt3rfly> OFTC*
• 728[06:05:41] <Butt3rfly> you need irc.OFTC.net
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• 734[06:12:19] <mandeep> Butt3rfly: yeah im on it, but i cant remember my password so i sent for a sendpass
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• 736[06:12:33] <mandeep> but the email never came, so i tried registering a new nick but the email never came
• 737[06:12:41] <mandeep> so i figured it was a problem with oftc
• 738[06:12:43] <mason> mandeep: Can't you just pick a random nick there?
• 739[06:13:07] <mason> I could be misremembering, but I thought you only had to register to get a cloak.
• 740[06:13:37] <mandeep> mason: nope i have to be registered and identified
• 741[06:14:02] <mason> hrm, sorry then
• 742[06:14:10] <mandeep> :(
• 743[06:15:02] <Butt3rfly> I haven't been over to OFTC for a while, so long that I'm not even sure which services they even use :o
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• 745[06:15:33] <jcb2016> oftc's debian channel is dead they answer randomly
• 746[06:16:16] <mason> Hm, I evidently don't have a current password there.
• 747[06:16:29] <jcb2016> mason: why do you want to go to oftc?
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• 749[06:16:43] <mandeep> jcb2016: i want to go to oftc to discuss on debian-next
• 750[06:16:45] <mason> jcb2016: mandeep does
• 751[06:16:53] <mandeep> ran into some problems today
• 752[06:19:25] <mason> That's what testing is about. :)
• 753[06:19:46] <mason> I used to live on it on desktops, but new things aren't interesting to me any more.
• 754[06:21:22] <hatesec> the lead developer of pursuance project separated from barrett brown and is coming on hate radio tonight to explain why replaced-url
• 755[06:22:53] <mandeep> mason: unfortunately i need testing for opengl dev work
• 756[06:23:06] <mason> mandeep: What about stable with backports?
• 757[06:23:27] <mandeep> mason: i havent checked backports lately. ill give it a look
• 758[06:23:42] <mandeep> it has to do with glibc6
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• 760[06:24:19] <mandeep> libc6*
• 761[06:24:36] <mason> That might be a tough backport.
• 762[06:24:46] <jcb2016> libc6?
• 763[06:25:10] <mason> I'd still want to look at a chroot or something.
• 764[06:25:33] <mandeep> jcb2016: replaced-url
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• 766[06:26:07] <jcb2016> mandeep: are you on stable?
• 767[06:26:11] <mandeep> nope
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• 770[06:26:39] <mandeep> libc6 on stable is 2.24 i believe
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• 772[06:27:01] <jcb2016> ,v libc6
• 773[06:27:03] <judd> Package: libc6 on amd64 -- wheezy: 2.13-38+deb7u10; wheezy-security: 2.13-38+deb7u12; jessie: 2.19-18+deb8u10; jessie-security: 2.19-18+deb8u10; stretch-security: 2.24-11+deb9u1; stretch: 2.24-11+deb9u4; sid: 2.28-5; buster: 2.28-7
• 774[06:27:09] <mason> mandeep: I got the password reset email and was able to register, so the service is working.
• 775[06:27:16] <mandeep> hmmm
• 776[06:27:35] <mandeep> i dont get anything in my inbox or span
• 777[06:28:03] <mason> Hm. Last time I was in there was 2015.
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• 779[06:28:51] <friendlyGoat> helloo how would i go about removing something from the sudo apt-get update list? replaced-url
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• 783[06:30:05] <mandeep> mason: i just registed a new nick. looks like there is no email service just a web site
• 784[06:30:28] <mason> friendlyGoat: man apt-mark
• 785[06:30:44] <mason> mandeep: It reset me via email. But, either way, glad you're in.
• 786[06:30:54] <mandeep> thanks
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• 788[06:31:02] <friendlyGoat> gonna try it now, thanks!
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• 796[06:37:24] <jcb2016> mandeep: im new to debian but if 2.28-7 for libc6 is there why not install it?
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• 802[06:42:29] <mandeep> jcb2016: it's only on testing
• 803[06:42:58] <jcb2016> oh ok
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• 808[06:47:10] <friendlyGoat> just wondering, im running debian on a server in command line only and i wanted to know if there was a way i can lock the command line when im not using it?
• 809[06:48:56] <mason> friendlyGoat: logging out is the best bet
• 810[06:49:24] <mason> friendlyGoat: Do your stuff inside a screen session, and detach and log out when you want to close up the console.
• 811[06:49:25] <friendlyGoat> pardon if i sound stupid but is there a way i can logout without turning off the bots im hosting?
• 812[06:49:34] <mason> man screen
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• 814[06:50:01] <friendlyGoat> no manual entry for screen
• 815[06:50:23] <friendlyGoat> i did a very minimal install and its not like anyone can get into my house and navigate to my stuff in a command line but im rather security minded
• 816[06:50:38] <mason> apt install screen ; man screen
• 817[06:51:38] <jcb2016> i got to learn screen again. i used to be good at it
• 818[06:51:56] <mason> It's useful, and it sounds like what you need.
• 819[06:51:58] <themill> !tmux
• 820[06:51:59] <dpkg> tmux is a terminal multiplexer. It enables a number of terminals (or windows) to be accessed and controlled from a single terminal and is intended to be a simple, modern, BSD-licensed alternative to programs such as GNU <screen>. replaced-url
• 821[06:52:07] <themill> all the cool kids seem to use tmux these days, not screen
• 822[06:52:29] <mason> tmux doesn't double as a terminal emulator for serial communications
• 823[06:52:34] <friendlyGoat> i installed screen now im in the manual, thanks for being patient with me!
• 824[06:52:46] <mason> although I still prefer cu for that
• 825[06:53:17] <friendlyGoat> im rather new to debian. on my PC i use Xubuntu and on my server i got a tiny image of debian and installed it and only installed packages i need for general security and the stuff i like hosting
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• 940[08:53:42] <nix64bit> sudo apt install linux-headers-$(uname -r)
• 941[08:53:52] <nix64bit> I get a mismatch with headers
• 942[08:54:04] <nix64bit> Unable to locate package linux-headers-4.18.0-2-amd64
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• 944[08:55:23] <nix64bit> uname -r
• 945[08:55:49] <nix64bit> 4.18.0-2-amd644.18.0-2-amd64
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• 1020[09:53:22] <StyXman> is it possible to boot with the same resolution for grub2, the VTs and the Xorg server? this is a TP T430 with (non-VESA) 1600x900 resolution...
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• 1025[09:54:23] <StyXman> in particular, currently grub sets a mode, but then switches back to the old 80x25 (in terms of characters, not pixels)
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• 1048[10:09:26] <StyXman> it seems that even if I add i915-kms into the initramfs, I still have grub2's resolution, then 80x25, the whatever that module manages
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• 1136[11:01:46] <julius> morning
• 1137[11:02:25] <julius> ive added: https_port 3129 intercept ssl-bump generate-host-certificates=on dynamic_cert_mem_cache_size=4MB cert=/home/julius/example.com.cert key=/home/julius/example.com.private tls-cert=/home/julius/example.com.pem to my squid.conf but ss -tplna only shows squid listening on 3128 not 3129...why is that?
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• 1222[12:07:38] <_2E0LNX> julius: just a though, did you restart squid?
• 1223[12:07:42] <_2E0LNX> *thought
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• 1225[12:08:55] <julius> yes i did
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• 1228[12:09:09] <julius> just trying something else currently
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• 1249[12:19:12] <RalphBa> hi all, I would like to set up a debian 10 base system providing xorg/wayland but no ui. instead uses a --user flatpak gnome installation. Is there some information out there how to do this best? The main idea is, I want to strictly separate between userspace and system. So I want to install everything for usage but not for operating the machine only into userspace
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• 1253[12:22:01] <RalphBa> It is not about the gnome version and staying actual but about keeping the system itself as clean as possible
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• 1255[12:22:35] <RalphBa> I do not want system state to change in any way just because a user needs some software
• 1256[12:23:03] <RalphBa> (quickly rebooting, be back in 2 mins)
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• 1266[12:25:58] <RalphBa> back
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• 1272[12:32:31] <oiaohm> RalphBa: flatpak as far as I know does not contain the gnome windows manager. So completely no ui is not possible. Debian would have to provide the basic windows manager stuff.
• 1273[12:33:07] <RalphBa> so gnome shell and stuff is not in flatpak gnome package?
• 1274[12:33:10] <RalphBa> hm
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• 1279[12:36:50] <oiaohm> RalphBa: double check no gnome shell in flatpak at this stage.
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• 1282[12:37:00] <oiaohm> RalphBa: gnome applications yes.
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• 1285[12:39:58] <RalphBa> oiaohm: *lol* onle a lot of people are spaeking about the desktop environment beein available, but noone provides a link :-D Well, I fear you are right. It would have been great.
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• 1287[12:40:55] <RalphBa> So the DE is still to provide. gladly debian 10 has 3.30 on board
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• 1290[12:41:49] <RalphBa> debian in the meantime is releasing in a similar intervall as ubuntu lts right?
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• 1304[12:47:09] <StyXman> RalphBa: every ~2 years, but no promises
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• 1306[12:47:28] <StyXman> it used to be more like january, but has been slowly sliping into march
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• 1312[12:49:15] <RalphBa> StyXman: every 2 years without promise is ok. I prefer a stable system over a punctual released system. Just many years and helplessly outdated as when I began my distri roundtrip which interestingly led back to here after one and a half decades :-D
• 1313[12:50:19] <RalphBa> you guys are still the most trustworthy and reliable (for server there never was anything else than debian)
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• 1326[13:00:32] <glongo> hey guys, I've installed nvidia-drivers and now X is broken, looking at log file looks like nvidia driver is not found, details here: replaced-url
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• 1332[13:04:02] <diogenes_> glongo, do you have /etc/X11/xorg.conf file?
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• 1334[13:04:24] <glongo> diogenes_: no I don't have
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• 1336[13:05:21] <diogenes_> glongo, is it an optimus system? intel+nvidia?
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• 1339[13:05:51] <glongo> no, video card is a geforce gt 520
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• 1347[13:09:46] <glongo> ok, re-installing drivers and linux headers fixed the issue
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• 1349[13:10:20] <glongo> xorg.conf is no longer used?
• 1350[13:10:55] <diogenes_> right
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• 1352[13:12:51] <glongo> I still have an issue with X, I can't have 2560x1440 resolution...anyone have experienced something like that?
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• 1354[13:13:31] <diogenes_> did you have it with nouveau?
• 1355[13:13:46] <diogenes_> it's recommend nouveau, i use it and i can even play on it
• 1356[13:14:18] <glongo> I have it with nouveau and nvidia
• 1357[13:15:15] <glongo> is it better to use nouveau?
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• 1359[13:15:50] <diogenes_> yes, with some tweaking, nouveau can perform almost the same as nvidia
• 1360[13:16:35] <glongo> interesting, if I want to switch to nouveau driver what do I have to do?
• 1361[13:16:59] <diogenes_> glongo, to remove your nvidia installation
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• 1363[13:17:22] <glongo> ok, I always changed xorg.conf for that
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• 1365[13:17:47] <diogenes_> you could try that, but no clue how it will go
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• 1367[13:18:22] <glongo> removing nvidia is fine
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• 1374[13:21:13] <glongo> oh no xorg is broken again
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• 1378[13:21:58] <glongo> "(EE) Failed to load module "nv" (module does not exist, 0)"
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• 1415[13:44:04] <jmcnaught> glongo: look in /etc/modprobe.d/ for a file that blacklists nouveau (if you're trying to return to default), or take a look at replaced-url
• 1416[13:45:42] <glongo> jmcnaught: fixed, thanks :)
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• 1456[14:02:32] <laidback_01> I have a problem with a nic that appears to be fragmenting packets in only one direction, it's part of a firewall, igb driver. intel 1G nic. if I download from the thing I can get full sped, no packet drops. if I upload to it, all kinds of packaet drops, wirewhark shows fragmentation like mad going on...
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• 1458[14:02:48] <laidback_01> I'm hoping that somoen else ran into this issue... but... google not turning up much yet.
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• 1496[14:32:28] <ongo> Hello, yesterday I installed debian netinst, however I couldn't get a connection going since I needed proprietary firmware to connect
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• 1498[14:32:37] <ongo> now I'm booted into my minimal install with the firmware installed
• 1499[14:32:46] <ongo> however I'm not sure how to connect to wifi without wpa_supplicant
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• 1501[14:33:47] <ongo> and no iwconfig or ipconfig
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• 1505[14:34:44] <ongo> could someone help me out?
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• 1543[14:53:25] <wald0> is "live-build" still used as the best Live builder tool to make debian-based live systems ?
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• 1550[14:58:08] <n4dir> i sure haven't heard of a different/better option yet. refractasnapshot is nice, i think antix has an according tool too, but debian itself, i'd say live-build
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• 1552[14:58:45] <n4dir> wald0: ^^
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• 1578[15:17:53] <wald0> thx n4dir, i will make a look to the new live-build sources then
• 1579[15:18:19] <wald0> what is the best testing/sid "live" systems based in debian actually? is still sidux active and good ?
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• 1584[15:22:08] <n4dir> wald0: i always get confused by the names. might be sidux is gone, and it now is called siduction (might be that is already gone too, no idea)
• 1585[15:22:37] <n4dir> there was a second distro which was created after the one went south, but i forgot the name of the second one.
• 1586[15:22:52] <n4dir> i guess wikipedia knows the exact names (if you enter sidux)
• 1587[15:23:30] <n4dir> then there is grml. but i think it is more like a liveCD for sysadmin work, not sure. Worth to look at though
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• 1653[16:04:53] <pierrot> Hi
• 1654[16:05:35] <pierrot> when I try to install the kde-full package I get the following error: replaced-url
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• 1657[16:07:20] <pierrot> what can I do to solve it?
• 1658[16:07:47] <n4dir> probably something is wrong/weird with your sources.list file
• 1659[16:07:55] <n4dir> !bat
• 1660[16:07:55] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
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• 1662[16:08:46] <n4dir> i probably won't be able to tell you what exactly is wrong, but the info required by dpkg-bot might help others to help you, pierrot
• 1663[16:08:54] <StyXman> pierrot: did you add sources by hand? mixing stable and unstable and/or experimental, for instance?
• 1664[16:10:32] <pierrot> StyXman : This is my sources.list file replaced-url
• 1665[16:11:15] <StyXman> ok, was it like that all the time or did you modify it at any point?
• 1666[16:11:30] <StyXman> I mean, did you install stretch?
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• 1668[16:11:50] <pierrot> Yeah, but it was like a year ago
• 1669[16:11:53] <n4dir> and are there more files at /etc/apt/sources.list.d (or such) ?
• 1670[16:12:03] <pierrot> I haven't modified that file
• 1671[16:12:12] <pierrot> yes, there are
• 1672[16:12:45] <StyXman> paste them, then :)
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• 1681[16:19:42] <pierrot> there are some files there like google-chrome.list, vscode.list, etc but I don't think they're a problem. this happened to me after doing `sudo apt update` and `sudo apt upgrade`. I got the message "The following packages have been kept back: (list of 4 or 5 packages)". I copied that list, let's say L, and did `sudo apt install L`. During that process, a large list of packages from kde were removed and I
• 1682[16:19:48] <pierrot> now when I try to install them, I got the error of my first message
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• 1690[16:22:42] <StyXman> ouch
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• 1693[16:23:35] <StyXman> pierrot: 'usted ha retenido paquetes rotos' <-- have you ever used aptitude? it can help solving these issues
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• 1695[16:23:57] <pierrot> No, I didn't use `aptitude`
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• 1699[16:24:07] <pierrot> I use `apt`
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• 1703[16:27:17] <StyXman> try to use it, it has a very good package handling, more powerful than dselectś
• 1704[16:27:26] <StyXman> it can also be confusing
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• 1706[16:28:41] <DonaldDuck> StyXman, Out of curiosity, any reason why? apt and dselect have been around since a decade longer... More support?
• 1707[16:29:05] <StyXman> apt is good, I use it all th time
• 1708[16:29:19] <StyXman> but when problem occurs, aptitude gives you tools to solve them
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• 1710[16:29:39] <StyXman> and I'm not only talking about about the automatic resolver
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• 1712[16:30:06] <StyXman> you can go to boken packages and see why they're broken, in particular related to deps and versions
• 1713[16:30:24] <StyXman> and AFAIK dselect is in life support
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• 1716[16:31:19] <pierrot> StyXman : thanks for the suggestion!
• 1717[16:31:23] <StyXman> sure
• 1718[16:32:01] <StyXman> in particular, I have been using sid since 2001 and really, aptitude is the best of them to solve weekly upgrades
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• 1720[16:33:36] <DonaldDuck> StyXman, thanks, will give it a try. I'm on debian since 1996, always avoided aptitude and did with apt or file editing. Old habit I guess.
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• 1734[16:42:00] <digdilem> DonaldDuck, fwiw, i'm also a long term debian user who doesn't use aptitude much. Nothing against it, just never found I had to
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• 1744[16:45:33] <bncn> to back up my debian server daily, which tool should I use?
• 1745[16:45:41] <klys> rsync?
• 1746[16:46:05] <digdilem> bncn, backup-manager is nice and works fine for many peoples' needs
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• 1750[16:48:02] <bncn> well I'm new about it, I have a debian vps server, and I need to back up everything (files, mysql, logs etc) daily.
• 1751[16:48:32] <bncn> in any case of crash etc, to go back
• 1752[16:49:00] <digdilem> also check your vps supplier - they may offer a snapshotting service
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• 1754[16:49:27] <Hercules> You can always use rsync
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• 1756[16:49:40] <Hercules> replaced-url
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• 1758[16:50:09] <DonaldDuck> bncn, all depend. How much data are we talking about....
• 1759[16:50:21] <digdilem> the reason i mention backup-manager is it does sequential backups (and uses rsync for the xfer)
• 1760[16:50:47] <bncn> I see digdilem
• 1761[16:51:11] <bncn> DonaldDuck, not much data I think, I just have couple of websites
• 1762[16:52:02] <bncn> and to monitor what's going on which tool would you suggest?
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• 1764[16:52:49] <digdilem> what do you mean by "what's going on"?
• 1765[16:53:44] <bncn> cpu, disk, traffic, bandwidth etc.
• 1766[16:53:57] <bncn> or any service is down
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• 1769[16:54:03] <digdilem> htop does some nice stuff for immediate. munin is easy and builds nice graphs
• 1770[16:54:16] <bncn> heard zabbix ages ago, but don't know if's still popular
• 1771[16:54:19] <digdilem> prtg does nice alerting, but isn't freee.
• 1772[16:54:26] <Hercules> how about webmin?
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• 1774[16:54:47] <digdilem> does webmin do service monitoring and alerting?
• 1775[16:55:15] <digdilem> nagios is the standard response to linux management, but is pure pain to set up and maintain
• 1776[16:55:26] <Hercules> Webmin prolly can?
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• 1779[16:56:01] <Hercules> I haven't used it for long now.
• 1780[16:56:13] <Hercules> afaik you can see processes, uptime, load and stuff with its interface
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• 1782[16:56:51] <bncn> how about zabbix?
• 1783[16:56:52] <bncn> when I search about it I see that is popular in my country, have no idea about it though
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• 1790[16:59:37] <Hercules> bncn, why not try it yourself on a local machine?
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• 1797[17:02:05] <digdilem> yes, zabbix is used for that
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• 1799[17:02:25] <bncn> Hercules, would like to hear what people think to decide where to start
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• 1805[17:06:05] <pierrot> StyXman : I could solve it with `aptitude`! Thanks!
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• 1821[17:14:20] <n4dir> !webmin
• 1822[17:14:21] <dpkg> Webmin is a lame web-based interface for unsafe system administration for Unix. Check it out at replaced-url
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• 1825[17:17:04] <bncn> dpkg perfect timing! Really I sshd and was about to install webmin lol, has just added its repo, now cancelling
• 1826[17:17:05] <dpkg> bncn: You are person #1 to send an unparseable request
• 1827[17:17:41] <bncn> n4dir, thanks
• 1828[17:17:42] <bncn> (:
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• 1830[17:18:03] <n4dir> all i know is the factoid of dpkg is there. so not much to thank for :-)
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• 1833[17:19:58] <bncn> lol, and what would you suggest then n4dir
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• 1840[17:21:10] <n4dir> bncn: over the years i heard most people state webmin is utter crap and they recommended highly against it. I guess they are right, but i can't say.
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• 1854[17:31:49] <ksk> bncn: the bot did suggest something itself
• 1855[17:31:53] <ksk> !free whcp
• 1856[17:31:53] <dpkg> FOSS Web Hosting Control Panels include: <DTC>, <GNUPanel>, <ISPConfig> and <ispCP> Omega. Don't use <Webmin>. replaced-url
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• 1858[17:32:52] <ksk> I think it is in the nature of such admin panels that sysadmins do not like them, and view the way they do things as ugly. Same for the paid things like plesk or whatnot.
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• 1866[17:35:57] <ClickTek> Alrighty, a real quick 1-2 lines... why Debian instead of Fedora?
• 1867[17:36:01] <ClickTek> Please. :)
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• 1874[17:39:24] <n4dir> mainly cause i know shit about fedora.
• 1875[17:40:11] <jsubl2> debian lots of packages and stable
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• 1879[17:42:53] <blackflow> nobody can answer that. you'll have to try both and then see which one fits your use case and preferences best.
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• 1885[17:44:41] <ClickTek> Google Chrome on Debian? Is the considered blasphemy around these parts? :)
• 1886[17:44:50] <ClickTek> that*
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• 1891[17:46:36] <jcb2016> hey all. im dualbooting archlinux and debian i don't want archlinux anymore. arch is on /dev/sda2 and grub still sees it. can i just delete /dev/sad2 update grub and i should be fine?
• 1892[17:46:56] <n4dir> i'd say yes.
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• 1896[17:47:10] <klys> clicktek: replaced-url
• 1897[17:47:23] <jcb2016> n4dir: how do i do this?
• 1898[17:48:37] <jcb2016> n4dir: i was thinking of using gparted delte the /dev/sda2 reboot into debian and update grub
• 1899[17:48:43] <klys> jcb2016, if using gpt, fire up gdisk and remove your /dev/sda2. if using mbr, fire up fdisk and remove your /dev/sda2.
• 1900[17:49:15] <ClickTek> klys: what do the app stores have to do with what I asked?
• 1901[17:49:46] <at0m> jcb2016: no need to reboot, you can do this from within debian. just make sure sda2 is not mounted when you format or remove it
• 1902[17:50:02] <n4dir> jcb2016: i guess you could also mount /dev/sda2 and then simply rm the whole shebang. But what you said should work too.
• 1903[17:50:08] <klys> clicktek, if you're at that level where you want a gnu/linux and still undecided about which one, odds are you don't know how you want to install your packages. those are some of the newer available options.
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• 1906[17:51:12] <n4dir> jcb2016: as long you are sure sda2 is the partition, i for one can't see anything going horribly south. (but i am sure exhausted like hell)
• 1907[17:51:32] <ClickTek> I have used Ubuntu, Solus, MX, Arch, Manjaro, and Fedora. Yes, I am still unsure which I prefer the most. As a SysAdmin/InfoSec I am always looking at others.
• 1908[17:51:35] <ClickTek> Thanks for the link.
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• 1912[17:53:03] <at0m> ClickTek: re: Chrome, chromium i think would be more used. that's chrome without the google blobs
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• 1914[17:53:15] <klys> it used to be that there were more distributions using .rpm than there were .deb now there are more different distributions using .deb this may or may not indicate which distribution's packaging system is more safe with foreign packages available on the web.
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• 1918[17:54:07] <at0m> i don't see "more distributions" as an indicator for nothing
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• 1920[17:54:20] <at0m> err anything =)
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• 1922[17:54:37] <klys> at0m, what would be your perspective on which distributions are more safe, then?
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• 1924[17:55:00] <at0m> klys: the one you know better.
• 1925[17:55:36] <klys> at0m, this guy is the one we're trying to help. he really doesn't know the one or the other better.
• 1926[17:55:43] <at0m> if you don't know what you're working with, you're gonna spend your time getting it to work instead of hardening it.
• 1927[17:55:49] <jcb2016> at0m: how do i update grub i deleted /dev/sad2
• 1928[17:55:58] <jcb2016> ./dev/sda2*
• 1929[17:56:05] <n4dir> as root: update-grub
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• 1931[17:56:43] <jcb2016> ok let me reboot to see what happend
• 1932[17:56:48] <ClickTek> Alrighty, thanks kyls
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• 1934[17:56:57] <at0m> not sure why you /deleted/ the partition. want to resize the other to include the previously used space? otherwise, an mkfs would probably have sufficed
• 1935[17:57:09] <narutowaifu> what's the difference between "deb replaced-url
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• 1937[17:57:23] <ksk> Id argue every professional linux distribution has the same kind of security. Maybe you want to take a look at how long $distri needs to fix serious CVEs and such
• 1938[17:57:45] <karlpinc> Debian stable is pretty secure because it uses older software which has had time for the bugs to be exposed, and it backports just security fixes to fix security problems. Running newer software to fix security problems introduces new code, which can introduce new security problems.
• 1939[17:57:53] <at0m> !sources.list
• 1940[17:57:53] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
• 1941[17:58:17] <ClickTek> If I run Debian Stable - can like newer Firefox's and such be used on it? Will they still update?
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• 1944[17:58:44] <n4dir> usually stable-backports
• 1945[17:58:52] <karlpinc> ClickTek: Yes. There's a page for firefox on wiki.debian.org.
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• 1948[17:59:29] <karlpinc> ClickTek: See also the "don't break debian" page on the wiki. There are ways to run non-debian software safely and other ways (the ways that replace parts of debian) that break debian.
• 1949[17:59:31] <narutowaifu> at0m: what do I make of that?
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• 1951[17:59:42] <ksk> ClickTek: debian X gets released with a firefox version of Y. apart from backporting security fixed, it will not get new updates, no. This is true for every softwar eine in devbibian
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• 1953[18:00:07] <karlpinc> ksk: Yes, but he can also just install the latest firefox.
• 1954[18:00:46] <ClickTek> That's what MX reminded me of. Debian Stable but newer apps. Unless I read incorrectly
• 1955[18:00:59] <klys> note: third-party installers typically go to /opt rather than /usr
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• 1957[18:01:19] <karlpinc> If you want to run something secure, run OpenBSD.
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• 1959[18:01:42] <karlpinc> ClickTek: How good is their security team keeping up with vulnerabilities?
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• 1962[18:02:23] <ClickTek> No idea, I know very little about MX. I read more on Debian from privacytools.io which is what made more interested. I want a very secure but able to be daily driver ditro
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• 1970[18:07:23] <jcb2016> at0m: or n4dir how do i remove archlinux from grub?
• 1971[18:07:50] <n4dir> as said: run the command "update-grub" as root (either via su or sudo, whatever you use)
• 1972[18:08:23] <Greyztar> anyone using lxd with lxc on debian stable using snapd,if so does it work out of the box or does it need tweaking?
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• 1977[18:09:22] <ksk> Greyztar: last time I checked It was said LXD was not safe on debian because of missing apparmor rules - not sure if that changed
• 1978[18:10:46] <Greyztar> ksk: yeah i thought i heard something the same,my main server os is another distro i thought switching but need lxc docker doesnt fit thanks for input
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• 1996[18:15:04] <SuperBawlz> Not sure where to start with this one. I have two text files, I want to merge File B into File A after a specific line like "# MERGE HERE #"
• 1997[18:15:15] <SuperBawlz> Which command should I be exploring for this?
• 1998[18:15:36] <ksk> #bash most likely ;)
• 1999[18:15:46] <SuperBawlz> Need to script it?
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• 2001[18:16:29] <ksk> as far as I can tell. #bash might know better.
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• 2004[18:17:23] <n4dir> why not simply open file 1 in a text-editor, copy whatever you want to copy, open file 2 and insert?
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• 2006[18:19:09] <jhutchins> SuperBawlz: You could do it with sed, but you'd have to learn the syntax.
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• 2009[18:20:01] <SuperBawlz> n4dir, I need to automate the process
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• 2014[18:20:30] <n4dir> then i guess jhutchins is right.
• 2015[18:20:41] <SuperBawlz> jhutchins, I'm writing a bash script to use sed to insert it as we speak.
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• 2018[18:21:16] <jhutchins> SuperBawlz: Very good. It's always nice to get some hands on with the core tools.
• 2019[18:21:30] <n4dir> let me quote the sed-howto: "it is not your fault you don't understand sed". lol
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• 2021[18:22:09] <jhutchins> That gives me great comfort.
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• 2034[18:27:40] <StyXman> SuperBawlz: meld should help, but I'm not sure you can add arbitrary lines
• 2035[18:27:49] <StyXman> and of course it's not automatic
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• 2063[18:51:29] <SuperBawlz> StyXman: Thanks for the info. I already finished the bash script though. I will keep it in my list of commands to read up on.
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• 2201[20:16:59] <expert975> I can't install mariadb-server on Debian testing. Dpkg says "installed mariadb-server-10.3 package post-installation script subprocess returned error exit status 1". Is this a known problem?
• 2202[20:18:00] <at0m> expert975: yes. also, #debian-next
• 2203[20:18:12] <at0m> on OFTC, not here
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• 2205[20:18:21] <at0m> dpkg: tell expert975 about testing
• 2206[20:18:24] <tdn> Will libressl be included in Debian 10?
• 2207[20:18:33] <at0m> ,v libressl
• 2208[20:18:34] <judd> No package named 'libressl' was found in amd64.
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• 2210[20:19:43] <at0m> tdn: no mention of it in testing/sid for now.. replaced-url
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• 2213[20:21:52] <tdn> Yeah, I couldnt find it on packages.d..o.. But I was hoping there were plans to include it since openssl seems broken beyond repair
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• 2220[20:24:03] <at0m> tdn: maybe more in mailing list then..
• 2221[20:24:24] <tdn> at0m, where can I search those?
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• 2224[20:25:37] <at0m> tdn: replaced-url
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• 2228[20:29:39] <tdn> at0m, thanks
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• 2379[21:52:30] <Azrael_-> hi
• 2380[21:52:45] <Azrael_-> how can i manually mark a package for not to be upgraded?
• 2381[21:52:50] *** Joins: starquake8 (~starquake@replaced-ip)
• 2382[21:53:41] <warai_otoko> Azrael_-: complicated. Google!? DuckDuckGo!? Startpage!?
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• 2386[21:54:34] <Getattrovskaya> hello, I need a program to merge two sqlite files. I found sqlite studio but is there a direct alternative that is available for debian?
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• 2388[21:54:43] <Azrael_-> ok, was thinking i had the wrong keywords and thought it was more difficult. got it
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• 2399[22:02:46] <Getattrovskaya> is i.e. sqlitebrowser one?
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• 2406[22:06:27] <Peyam> hi
• 2407[22:06:38] <Peyam> debian can not find win 10
• 2408[22:06:50] <Peyam> I do os-proper and update-grub
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• 2413[22:08:08] <lacesz> replaced-url
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• 2415[22:10:01] <Peyam> I have a nvm disk
• 2416[22:10:03] <Peyam> or ssd
• 2417[22:10:27] <petn-randall> That's shouldn't matter for that issue.
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• 2419[22:10:33] <petn-randall> *That
• 2420[22:11:02] <Peyam> blkid can not be found
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• 2425[22:15:03] <Peyam> replaced-url
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• 2429[22:17:01] <petn-randall> Peyam: Are you booting both Windows and Debian in the same mode, e.g. both in UEFI mode, or both in legacy BIOS mode?
• 2430[22:17:40] <Peyam> Im not sute now
• 2431[22:18:01] <Peyam> sure
• 2432[22:18:16] <Peyam> how do I check it without going to bios or eufi
• 2433[22:18:51] <petn-randall> That would be my first guess. You can check the boot mode on Linux, but it's impossible to check for Windows without looking into the BIOS.
• 2434[22:19:05] <Peyam> okey I reboot now
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• 2441[22:23:02] <Peyam> secure boot disable and legacy boot enable
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• 2449[22:28:01] <jcb2016> ping
• 2450[22:28:09] <jcb2016> any reason why i can't talk earlier? wierd
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• 2455[22:30:29] <Peyam> there is not any efimanager in /sys/...
• 2456[22:30:48] <Peyam> so the system is running on legacy
• 2457[22:30:56] <Peyam> in /sys/firmware/
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• 2459[22:32:24] <StyXman> Peyam: then setting up windows10 on legacy/bios mode should be easy
• 2460[22:32:37] <Peyam> I cant get in to win 10
• 2461[22:32:40] <StyXman> note: I hadn't dualbooted since,.. 2007
• 2462[22:32:55] <Peyam> it is some work thing
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• 2464[22:33:12] <Peyam> I wouldn't doulboot either
• 2465[22:33:53] <Peyam> but i havent change the EUFE. I installed Debian while win 10 was installed
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• 2467[22:34:08] <Peyam> does debian installer change the eufi configurations?
• 2468[22:34:15] <StyXman> what I meant is that my knowledge might be a little rusty, take with a grain of salt, etc...
• 2469[22:34:24] <Peyam> okey
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• 2471[22:34:37] <StyXman> if the machine is booting in UEFI mode, I hope the installer can handle that
• 2472[22:34:55] <Peyam> well update-grub doesnt solve my problem
• 2473[22:35:00] <StyXman> but you said it's not
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• 2476[22:35:20] <Peyam> yeah
• 2477[22:35:27] <StyXman> is there a windows 10 entry in grub?
• 2478[22:35:29] <Peyam> I said update-grub does Not solve it
• 2479[22:35:32] <Peyam> no
• 2480[22:35:36] <StyXman> right
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• 2482[22:35:48] <StyXman> did you follow the wiki page?
• 2483[22:35:57] *** Joins: wald0 (~wald0@replaced-ip)
• 2484[22:35:58] <StyXman> you said something about blkid
• 2485[22:35:59] <Peyam> yes
• 2486[22:36:07] <Peyam> yeah I needed to have sudo
• 2487[22:36:11] <Peyam> I forgot to have it.
• 2488[22:36:23] <StyXman> ok, and then?
• 2489[22:36:43] <Peyam> and /dev/nvme0n1p1: LABEL="System Reserved" UUID="E0822B86822B6070" TYPE="ntfs" PARTUUID="824b708d-01"
• 2490[22:36:46] <Peyam> and then
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• 2493[22:37:57] <StyXman> did you use the partition where windows resides?
• 2494[22:38:14] <StyXman> remember there might be two windows-like paritions... or more
• 2495[22:38:23] <Peyam> replaced-url
• 2496[22:38:39] <Peyam> yeah I took the one with system reserved
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• 2500[22:39:34] <StyXman> WTH is that til thing?
• 2501[22:39:39] <StyXman> tail*
• 2502[22:40:12] <Peyam> replaced-url
• 2503[22:40:30] <Peyam> StyXman, it is from the wikipage
• 2504[22:41:13] <Peyam> StyXman, I dont know. it was there before
• 2505[22:41:30] <StyXman> yeah, i just see the menuentry, that's all
• 2506[22:41:57] <Peyam> tried
• 2507[22:42:00] <Peyam> didn't work
• 2508[22:42:19] <StyXman> so you put that in /etc/grub.d/40_custom and run update-grub
• 2509[22:42:55] <Peyam> with sudo
• 2510[22:42:58] <StyXman> yes
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• 2512[22:43:10] <Peyam> yes
• 2513[22:43:11] <Peyam> i did
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• 2515[22:43:32] <StyXman> and.. does /boot/grub/grub.cfg file include that menuentry?
• 2516[22:43:45] <Peyam> replaced-url
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• 2518[22:43:51] <Peyam> lets see
• 2519[22:44:05] <StyXman> /boot/grub/menu.lst
• 2520[22:44:11] <StyXman> that's grub1?
• 2521[22:44:23] <Peyam> replaced-url
• 2522[22:44:29] <Peyam> StyXman, i dont know
• 2523[22:44:39] <StyXman> what version of debian are you using?
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• 2532[22:46:47] <Peyam> replaced-url
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• 2534[22:47:07] <b0t> I am creating a chat application in JAVA that the user uploads images to a server by a HTTP POST. The user "A" uploads the image via POST (limit 5MB), The user "B" receives a notification and downloads the image, after downloading the image is deleted. I want to know if this could recharge my server a lot and if there is another better method to do it.
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• 2536[22:47:58] <JyZyXEL> im literally about to start crying after doing "crontab -r" instead of "crontab -e"
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• 2538[22:48:03] <StyXman> Peyam: Y have the impresison that the problem is that update-grub is writing on a legacy file
• 2539[22:48:15] <StyXman> can you try and move /boot/grub/menu.lst and try again?
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• 2541[22:48:20] <Peyam> StyXman, it does
• 2542[22:48:56] <Peyam> there is not any Efimanager in sys/firmware
• 2543[22:49:05] <Peyam> and it means that debian is runing on legacy
• 2544[22:49:13] <StyXman> Peyam: so? supposedly you don't need it
• 2545[22:49:25] <Peyam> so where should I move menu.list
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• 2547[22:49:39] <StyXman> no, legacy as in grub1's config file instead of grub2's, sorry for the confusion
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• 2550[22:50:02] <StyXman> Peyam: wherever, your home directory, just move it out of the way
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• 2552[22:50:17] <StyXman> not /tmp, it might get deleted
• 2553[22:50:31] <Peyam> done
• 2554[22:50:32] <StyXman> in a path easy to type, you might need to type it later
• 2555[22:50:38] <Peyam> what do I do now
• 2556[22:50:40] <StyXman> try update-grub againa
• 2557[22:51:18] <Peyam> StyXman, replaced-url
• 2558[22:51:21] *** Quits: blackest_mamba (~blackest_@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2559[22:51:33] <Peyam> still no win
• 2560[22:52:11] <StyXman> please run dpkg -l | grep grub
• 2561[22:52:11] <Peyam> secure boot is disabled in EUFI
• 2562[22:52:35] *** Quits: Ricardo__ (~rick@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 257 seconds)
• 2563[22:52:35] <Peyam> replaced-url
• 2564[22:52:37] <StyXman> yeah, well, you're botting BIOS style, I don't think you get secure boot
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• 2567[22:52:47] <StyXman> i don't know much details about that
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• 2570[22:53:09] <StyXman> right, so you *have* grub1
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• 2572[22:53:19] <StyXman> and I think that menuentry only works for grub2
• 2573[22:53:20] <Peyam> so how do I install grub2?
• 2574[22:53:22] *** Quits: OS-43993 (~OS-43993@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
• 2575[22:53:53] <StyXman> this is what I have replaced-url
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• 2578[22:55:12] <Peyam> hmm
• 2579[22:55:16] <StyXman> you probably should read about migrating before doing anything rush :-P
• 2580[22:55:19] <Peyam> can not find grub2 in syaptic
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• 2582[22:55:33] <StyXman> hmm, I don't know, I'm not using stable
• 2583[22:55:33] <Peyam> Ive done it before but this time I can't figure it out
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• 2585[22:55:40] <Peyam> it is not stable
• 2586[22:55:44] <Peyam> it is strech
• 2587[22:56:31] <Peyam> isnt stretch unstable?
• 2588[22:56:32] <StyXman> same thing right now
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• 2590[22:56:38] <StyXman> no, that's sid
• 2591[22:56:43] <StyXman> always sid
• 2592[22:56:49] <Peyam> u do unstable?
• 2593[22:57:03] <StyXman> yeap
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• 2596[22:58:01] <StyXman> all the grub packages in stretch are grub2, except for grub-legacy: replaced-url
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• 2602[22:59:17] <StyXman> so i have no idea in what state your system is in
• 2603[22:59:32] <StyXman> can yo uexplain a little the history of your debian install?
• 2604[22:59:37] <Peyam> I will install unstable
• 2605[22:59:40] <Peyam> but cant find it
• 2606[22:59:47] <Peyam> it is like debian doesnt want you to find it
• 2607[22:59:55] <StyXman> you can't, you can only do a dist-upgrade
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• 2609[23:00:06] <StyXman> no, because it's unstable :)
• 2610[23:00:11] <Peyam> you cant download upgrade?
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• 2612[23:00:19] <Peyam> you can download the .iso?
• 2613[23:00:29] <StyXman> it means it breaks, and you have to know how to get out of those sandpits
• 2614[23:00:36] <StyXman> no, you can't
• 2615[23:00:48] <Peyam> how do I do a dist upgrade>
• 2616[23:00:49] <Peyam> ?
• 2617[23:00:50] *** Quits: jcb2016 (~jcb2016@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
• 2618[23:01:13] <Peyam> sudo: dist-upgrade: command not found
• 2619[23:01:20] <StyXman> I can tell you, but first i would like to know that your system is stable
• 2620[23:01:32] <Peyam> it is new fresh install
• 2621[23:01:32] <StyXman> heeh, it's not going to be that easy :)
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• 2623[23:01:51] <StyXman> then why can it find grub2?
• 2624[23:02:01] <Peyam> it cant find it
• 2625[23:02:08] <Peyam> the backports are in sourcelist
• 2626[23:02:10] <StyXman> it should have *installed* grub2, I think
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• 2628[23:02:18] <StyXman> lemme check
• 2629[23:02:51] <StyXman> no, there's nothing to check, grub2 *is* in stretch
• 2630[23:02:51] <Peyam> replaced-url
• 2631[23:02:55] *** Parts: izh_ (~denis@replaced-ip) ()
• 2632[23:03:10] <StyXman> yes, ... ... ?
• 2633[23:03:23] <StyXman> why did it install grub-legacy?
• 2634[23:03:41] <StyXman> anyways, are you *sure* you can't find for installing grub2?
• 2635[23:03:57] <Peyam> I install it I think. Now I did an update and grub2 came up. I think I have done bleachbit before and it removed something
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• 2639[23:04:19] <StyXman> bleahcbit?
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• 2642[23:04:45] <Peyam> it found it
• 2643[23:04:47] <Peyam> grub2
• 2644[23:04:50] <Peyam> you were right
• 2645[23:04:52] <Peyam> thanks
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• 2647[23:05:17] <StyXman> but bleachbit is windows only?
• 2648[23:05:51] <Peyam> no bleachbit is a ccleaner variant on linux
• 2649[23:06:03] <Peyam> it is linux only I guess
• 2650[23:07:11] <Peyam> thank you very much StyXman
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• 2662[23:11:18] <truexfan81> does the debian buster installer support nvme ootb?
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• 2664[23:11:39] <truexfan81> this guy has been struggling with it for over an hour replaced-url
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• 2683[23:21:15] <JordiGH> Is syslogd some systemd service?
• 2684[23:21:45] <JordiGH> I'm trying to figure out how outdated are syslogd online tutorials in the face of systemd.
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• 2705[23:29:33] <ksk> JordiGH: you can use (r)syslog in combination with system/journald
• 2706[23:29:52] <t3st3r> JordiGH> By default systemd-based systems usually use journalctl and own systemd-jorunald journalling.
• 2707[23:30:06] <ksk> and if you havfe it installed on a systemd system, it will be started via systemd unit/service file
• 2708[23:30:16] <JordiGH> t3st3r: I'm talking Debian here.
• 2709[23:30:21] <t3st3r> These do things differently - so yes, things referring to syslog could and would be outdated.
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• 2711[23:30:39] <JordiGH> So rsyslogd is just another optional systemd service, but it's no longer the "canonical" logger, right?
• 2712[23:30:43] <t3st3r> JordiGH> Recent debians use journald as well by default if I remember.
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• 2714[23:30:49] <ksk> I think its true for debian, no syslog installed (might depend on the installation though)
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• 2716[23:31:07] <jmcnaught> JordiGH: rsyslog is the old syslog, journald comes with systemd
• 2717[23:31:08] <JordiGH> Hm, my two stable installations seem to have syslog.
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• 2720[23:31:21] <ksk> might be because you upgraded them.
• 2721[23:31:25] <JordiGH> *to have rsyslogd
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• 2724[23:31:35] <t3st3r> I can imagine it depends on version and whether it upgraded system or so
• 2725[23:31:40] <JordiGH> ksk: I haven't done anything non-default around rsyslogd
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• 2728[23:31:55] <jmcnaught> on Debian the default is to have both, but only rsyslog writes to disk, journald is not persistent unless you create a directory
• 2729[23:32:10] <JordiGH> jmcnaught: Ah, that's useful to know.
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• 2731[23:32:34] <ryouma> in jessie, i have 1) /boot/initrd.img-3.16.0-6-amd64 2) /boot/initrd.img-3.16.0-7-amd64. 1) is compressed. 2) is not. is this a change by debian?
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• 2736[23:34:12] <ryouma> the file -zk output is, respectively, "/boot/initrd.img-3.16.0-6-amd64: ASCII cpio archive (SVR4 with no CRC) (gzip compressed data, last modified: Sat Jul 14 17:59:17 2018, from Unix)" and "/boot/initrd.img-3.16.0-7-amd64: ASCII cpio archive (SVR4 with no CRC)"
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• 2769[23:51:20] <ryouma> ok, veeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeery weird. the second initrd only contains intel microcode. what gives?
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• 2772[23:52:15] <ksk> interesting.. not sure what to make out of this :)
• 2773[23:52:58] <ryouma> computer seems to boot...
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• 2775[23:54:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1494
• 2776[23:54:33] <ksk> I would think this is normal, but cannot really explain. Also I know that microcode updates need to be applied at every boot, as they are not permament.
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• 2778[23:55:19] <ryouma> but the -6 and -7 are the only differences, so it makes it seem like -7 is just a newer version of -6
• 2779[23:56:04] <ryouma> but -6 is a populated initrd, while -7 is intel microcode, just like 1 file or so
• 2780[23:56:36] <ryouma> specifically GenuineIntel.bin
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• 2784[23:58:11] <ksk> does `uname -a` show the -7 version?
• 2785[23:58:42] <ryouma> yes
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