People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
0 [00:00:04] <SerajewelKS> k-man: who is user 1000000!?
1 [00:00:09] <k-man> no idea!
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3 [00:00:44] <k-man> no user of that uid in /etc/passwd
4 [00:00:50] <SerajewelKS> maybe check syslog for output from that sshd
5 [00:03:06] <k-man> hmm... Missing privilege separation directory: /run/sshd
6 [00:03:38] <k-man> replaced-url
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13 [00:09:12] <kodapa85> Hey, I'm running Ganeti (2.16.0) on Buster. After the last update qemu is reporting an invalid parameter -balloon
14 [00:09:32] <kodapa85> The vms now won't start
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18 [00:15:59] <mason> kodapa85: Buster isn't supported yet, is it?
19 [00:16:15] <mason> kodapa85: Maybe try #debian-next on OFTC?
20 [00:17:09] <mason> !debian-next
21 [00:17:09] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
22 [00:17:19] <kodapa85> @mason not yet and thanks
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24 [00:18:35] <kodapa85> #debian-next Cannot join channel (+i) - you must be invited :(
25 [00:18:54] <mason> kodapa85: On the OFTC network, not Freenode.
26 [00:19:08] <karlpinc> kodapa85: That means you didn't read the part about it being on the otfc network.
27 [00:19:17] <kodapa85> mason: ops, just seen
28 [00:19:22] <mason> no worries
29 [00:19:37] <k-man> how do i force removal of a package when the pre-removal script fails? replaced-url
30 [00:21:30] <k-man> ok, this did the trick: replaced-url
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35 [00:24:00] <SerajewelKS> k-man: generally you figure out why the script failed and fix it
36 [00:24:07] <SerajewelKS> e.g. manually stop the openvpn service and see what the error is
37 [00:24:13] <SerajewelKS> sometimes it's just a dangling pidfile that you can rm
38 [00:24:33] <k-man> SerajewelKS, the problem with that is I want it gone. i don't really want to invest time in determining why i can't remove it
39 [00:24:48] <k-man> but yes, i guess in a perfect world, one would do that
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41 [00:24:52] <SerajewelKS> sure. but if the stop script is failing then there may still be a process running.
42 [00:25:11] <SerajewelKS> the sledgehammer approach is sometimes warranted but it is a last resort
43 [00:25:23] <SerajewelKS> it will work but there may be collateral damage
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47 [00:26:40] <k-man> the process isn't running
48 [00:27:49] <k-man> so i installed the systemd-cron package
49 [00:28:00] <k-man> and I seem to have a few cron jobs that don't work
50 [00:28:20] <ryouma> i use sux - to run a gui program as a specified user. i know that sux is old but idk a replacement. the REAL problem is, even after the program terminates, there are dbus processes running as that user. and also /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gconf/gconfd-2. however, i do not use a de. i use fluxbox. so wy are those processes lying around?
51 [00:34:26] <rant> ryouma: gksu
52 [00:36:05] <ryouma> rant: think that will fix the issue?
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54 [00:36:45] <rant> ryouma: nfc, but I know sux isn't in debian and gksu, kdesu, gksudo, etc are..
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68 [00:44:08] <johnnyfive> Howdy! I have a flat-file repository, and reference it in my sources.list using an absolute path entry, as detailed here: replaced-url
69 [00:44:24] <johnnyfive> Is this expected behavior, a bug, or is there another way to handle this?
70 [00:44:42] <SerajewelKS> change the release in your sources.list to match it?
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74 [00:46:01] <johnnyfive> SerajewelKS, that can't be the only answer. I don't feel comfortable changing the release to "main/", since that is a) non-standard b) could cause other issues in apt if i'm trying to pin thing based on codename/suite?
75 [00:47:56] <johnnyfive> Changing the release:codename or release:suite definitely works, but this can't be the expected behavior
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85 [01:02:58] <k-man> my auto mounting of usb flash disks is broken
86 [01:03:12] <somiaj> what desktop to you use?
87 [01:03:20] <k-man> nothing happens when i insert a usb stick. but in dmesg i can see that the device was detected upon insertion
88 [01:03:22] <k-man> gnome
89 [01:03:52] <somiaj> hmm, check your .xsession-errors log, see if xorg is spitting out any errors
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92 [01:05:20] <k-man> nothing obvious in there
93 [01:05:43] <k-man> why doesn't it timestamp the lines in there
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155 [01:50:45] <rant> k-man: gvfsd is whats responsible for automounting though encrypted drives or exfat may not be automounted without additional packages/configuration
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167 [01:57:47] <awal1> any suggestion for an usb wifi adapter 5 ghz supported by debian *free or non-free* (if you have tried it yet)?
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169 [01:58:23] <awal1> ^ (preferably with injection support)
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172 [01:59:21] <awal1> i want this replaced-url
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174 [01:59:48] <somiaj> I would just try to get info about the chipset, and then check linux support
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180 [02:02:45] <awal1> already checked this before i ask but I am not sure about what i am reading replaced-url
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182 [02:03:29] <somiaj> often times if you can get the usbid that can help out a lot
183 [02:03:39] <somiaj> I'm not in a place i can look at that though, others might be able to
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185 [02:06:25] <awal1> no problem somiaj, thanks for your interest anyway
186 [02:06:46] <awal1> i think it is not supported officially replaced-url
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188 [02:07:29] <awal1> probably via ppa in ubuntu (which I won't use :P)
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191 [02:10:21] <de-facto> How does the chain of trust work in a debian repo? Background: I am thinking about setting up an own little repo for my packages, which GPG infrastructure is most common for this?
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194 [02:13:15] <de-facto> It seems its a common pattern that one would have the clients do something like "wget -qO- replaced-url
195 [02:14:28] <de-facto> and of course a /etc/apt/sources.list.d/reponame.list entry
196 [02:14:50] <de-facto> but how does that chain of trust work? is there a howto for a setup somewhere?
197 [02:19:20] <somiaj> !secure apt
198 [02:19:20] <dpkg> [apt-secure] Starting with version 0.6, <APT> performs signature checking of the Release file for all archives. See replaced-url
199 [02:19:32] <somiaj> that is how the trust that the package you get from the repo is valid works
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205 [02:22:55] <de-facto> yes im already reading it
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207 [02:24:38] <somiaj> I don't know the details, but if you have a more specific question you might get a better answer from others.
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209 [02:25:01] <de-facto> is the trust anchor itself just dangling, i.e. the download over https and hence the ca-certificates (e.g. lets encrypt et al) provide for it?
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212 [02:25:47] <somiaj> apt often just uses http, and dosen't need https to help with its chain of trust
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217 [02:27:18] <de-facto> yes thats good because it can be cached then, i mean is the trust anchor from "wget -qO- replaced-url
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219 [02:27:48] <somiaj> replaced-url
220 [02:28:18] <de-facto> thats not my question
221 [02:28:37] <somiaj> yea, I was just slow at adding that to the above response.
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223 [02:29:16] <somiaj> I don't know the answer to that question, as to ensure you add the correct public key in the first place.
224 [02:29:29] <de-facto> yes exactly
225 [02:29:49] <somiaj> but my understanding is provided you have valid keys in your apt-key database, apt will make sure packages are correctly signed before installing them.
226 [02:30:27] <de-facto> yup it seems to verify them over a chain of hashes with Release.gpg
227 [02:30:43] <somiaj> as to issues getting a good key (ensuring someone doesn't inject a false key). But I think they have to also ensure you get false packages.
228 [02:30:53] <somiaj> but unsure on the details here, maybe someone else can provide better explination.
229 [02:31:12] <de-facto> but yeah the trust anchor probably is just a dangling import, so the transport or something like that would have to make sure its authentic
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232 [02:32:19] <de-facto> I mean if it just would be like "yeah httpS is Safe, dont worry" any trust anchor in ca-certificates could forge it (and i have to admit i dont know the majority of the trust anchors in there)
233 [02:32:56] <de-facto> i mean for importing the public gpg key of a new repo
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235 [02:34:12] <somiaj> The wiki does have this, replaced-url
236 [02:34:46] <somiaj> that to mee seems to be your question, but maybe I missunderstood
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243 [02:38:44] <de-facto> Jup thats exactly it, it tells me that its good to be paranoid about security LOL, yet it makes one would have to emply a GPG chain/web or trust around it (based on social links) to make a vote for trust about signing a key
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245 [02:39:41] <de-facto> they also say that not all apt repos have it, hence dangling trust anchors, so i assume its fine to stop at that point and worry about it later how to sign the trust anchor
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261 [02:54:15] <karlpinc> de-facto: I think the basic idea is that people would hear about it if the public apt key was compromised, whether that happened if the website was hacked or whatever. If somebody was going to target you specifically, they could and you wouldn't know. I can't say if they'd have to keep intercepting all your apt traffic to keep you from discovering that you'd initially been given a bad key. (That's in interesting question.)
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284 [03:13:59] <de-facto> karlpinc, yes it seems it all boils down to having the initial import of a trust anchor somewhat trustworthy and of course also to keep the private key always safe.
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289 [03:17:32] <user37> im having issues with loading TLS and SSL in browsers
290 [03:17:43] <user37> is there something major im missing?
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292 [03:18:47] <user37> ive tried chromium and firefox, and it used to happen with some sites after i visit them a few dozen times, now happening more easily
293 [03:19:55] <de-facto> i guess you would have to provide exact error messages with your "issues"
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296 [03:21:11] <user37> browsers time out or partially load pages, in cli trying to wget yt-dl i get "GnuTLS: The TLS connection was non-properly terminated."
297 [03:21:35] <de-facto> e.g. what do you do, what does(n't) it do and tell you, what did you expect?
298 [03:21:56] <user37> browsers also hang on "waiting for TLS handshake"
299 [03:22:12] <user37> sometimes everything works fine, other times i have these problems
300 [03:22:14] <de-facto> are you behind a proxy which may not be properly setup?
301 [03:22:53] <user37> not to my knowledge. would that show up in a traceroute? i will run one now
302 [03:22:56] <de-facto> is it a wifi or a wired connection
303 [03:23:04] <user37> wifi :(
304 [03:23:22] <user37> traceroute has the * * * after leaving gateway
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308 [03:25:18] <de-facto> hmm you also can try to view the ssl cert chain of an url when it does not work properly e.g. openssl s_client -connect replaced-url
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310 [03:25:29] <de-facto> but it very well could just be a bad wifi i guess
311 [03:25:35] <wyoung> Hi gang!!
312 [03:25:44] <user37> thanks de-facto, ill try that
313 [03:25:54] <de-facto> if you have the opportunity you might want to test a wired connection to debug it with same url
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315 [03:26:00] <de-facto> from your box of course
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317 [03:26:15] <user37> unfortunately, dont really have the opportunity at the moment
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319 [03:27:00] <user37> openssl is actually looks like a great tool
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321 [03:27:26] <de-facto> curl is too: curl -Iv replaced-url
322 [03:28:18] <de-facto> user37, all of those base their trust on ca-certificates package CA trust anchors on your system
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324 [03:28:38] <de-facto> e.g. dpkg --get-selections | grep ca-certificates
325 [03:29:35] <de-facto> user37, wireshark also is a great tool for debugging network problems, you can watch stuff at the packet level and browse the semantics of each known packet
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327 [03:30:55] <LtL> de-facto: dpkg -l ca-certificates = much quicker :)
328 [03:31:30] <LtL> unless theres more than one i guess
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330 [03:34:46] <de-facto> basically i have to admit i dislike ca-certificates because i dont know the majority of the CAs in it, but its still the way to go nowerdays
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332 [03:35:52] <de-facto> besides being able to cache http with squid et al, its a very good reason for secure-apt not relying on it in my opinion
333 [03:36:27] <user37> i still use apt-get instead of apt... am i going to hell?
334 [03:36:36] * user37 drinks
335 [03:36:50] <de-facto> lol you are using it with apt-get already :)
336 [03:37:06] <de-facto> its transparent unless something bad happens it will tell you
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338 [03:38:18] <user37> okay, im convinced. apt is better. il switch immediately
339 [03:39:53] <de-facto> nope both are fine, its implemented in the backend afaik
340 [03:40:18] <de-facto> it all depends on which keys you tell it to trust: replaced-url
341 [03:40:28] <de-facto> i also just read about it earlier
342 [03:42:14] <user37> i just tried to cat /etc/apt/trusted.gpg to see what keys apt trusts, but that was a nope
343 [03:42:30] <user37> although i do see one legibly
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348 [03:43:37] <de-facto> try sudo apt-key list
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352 [03:46:42] <user37> that looks better
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354 [03:48:09] <de-facto> i think they are in /etc/apt/trusted.gpg.d or such
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357 [03:51:29] <awal1> ,v rtl8812au-dkms
358 [03:51:30] <judd> No package named 'rtl8812au-dkms' was found in amd64.
359 [03:52:28] <awal1> I have D-Link DWA-182 rev C1 . i hope something is being done for rtl8812au-dkms
360 [03:53:12] <de-facto> awal1, its unofficial (not trusted?), but I got quite some good results with replaced-url
361 [03:54:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1506
362 [03:54:52] <awal1> de-facto, ok thanks. i am usually react to 3d party stuff, but i may try it in a different/testing machine
363 [03:55:06] <awal1> d-link dwa'182 too?
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365 [03:55:29] <de-facto> Alpha AWUS036AC
366 [03:55:30] <awal1> or another dongle using that chipset?
367 [03:55:38] <awal1> ah, ok
368 [03:55:39] <de-facto> its RTL8812AU
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370 [03:56:06] <awal1> ubuntu and mint have pkged officialy rtl8812au-dkms for that chipset
371 [03:56:17] <awal1> maybe it will be available soon on debian
372 [03:56:21] <awal1> hopefully
373 [03:56:24] <de-facto> yeah its quite old version of it though
374 [03:57:04] <de-facto> 4.3.8.12175.20140902+dfsg-0ubuntu8 vs 5.2.20.2
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376 [03:57:29] <awal1> does that chipset support injection?
377 [03:57:44] <awal1> haven't tried it for that even if i I have it
378 [03:58:10] <de-facto> not quite sure about that, its not based on official linux kernel modules but rather Realtek's own implementation afaik
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380 [03:58:42] <strixdio> hey
381 [03:58:50] <strixdio> I have an audio device that isn't outputting sound
382 [03:58:56] <strixdio> Audio device [0403]
383 [03:58:56] <awal1> looks like it have support for monitor mode and supports injection
384 [03:59:08] <strixdio> 00:04.0 Audio device [0403]: Intel Corporation Device [8086:a348] (rev 10)
385 [03:59:08] <de-facto> try it out?
386 [03:59:09] <strixdio> Subsystem: Dell Device [1028:087d]
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388 [03:59:24] <strixdio> I only have a dummy output for pavucontrol
389 [03:59:25] <awal1> maybe a wishlist bug about rtl8812au-dkms may help
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391 [04:00:06] <strixdio> any thoughts?
392 [04:00:34] <de-facto> alsamixer? i dunno much about audio stuff...
393 [04:00:45] <strixdio> well, I think it's a driver issue
394 [04:00:53] <strixdio> iirc, I tried once before but it was loading the wrong driver
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396 [04:01:15] <de-facto> load another one and look at dmesg?
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398 [04:02:06] <strixdio> well, I was loading the correct one.
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401 [04:02:43] <de-facto> i had once a audio problem and searched a lot until i realized it was just muted in alsamixer
402 [04:02:46] <strixdio> I can add nonfree right
403 [04:02:56] <strixdio> to /etc/apt/sources.lst
404 [04:02:57] <strixdio> list*
405 [04:03:39] <de-facto> you can do everything i guess, just make sure you actually want it :)
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416 [04:10:50] <strixdio> grrr
417 [04:10:55] <strixdio> idk what is going on with this.
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426 [04:23:34] <strixdio> ah, it's an Intel Corporation Device a348
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429 [04:24:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1497
430 [04:25:32] <strixdio> omg seriously
431 [04:25:45] <strixdio> needs a newer kernel from stretch-backports
432 [04:25:49] <strixdio> freaking.. hell...
433 [04:25:56] <strixdio> yet again, burned by debian being old.
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438 [04:33:22] <rwp> strixdio, If you want bleeding edge bits there is always the Sid Unstable suite.
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495 [05:35:42] <Deihmos> do you prefer debian on desktop as opposed to another distro like ubuntu
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499 [05:37:57] <Deihmos> wrong channel
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529 [06:00:39] <ksqsf> Hi, I've been experiencing an annoying problem. After upgrading to buster, my laptop's keyboard and touchpad don't work after waking up from suspending, but not always
530 [06:00:59] <ksqsf> Could somebody give me some pointer on how to debug this problem?
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532 [06:01:24] <ksqsf> My dmesg: replaced-url
533 [06:01:46] <ksqsf> Also tried enabling all devices found by xinput list, but no luck
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535 [06:03:43] <mal10c> I'm using debian for my first time ever. It's so much more stable than Ubuntu!
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542 [06:06:53] <guoruei> nice
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544 [06:07:43] <blueingress> Hi, I have problem update chromium.. anyone help? error message: replaced-url
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546 [06:08:55] <guoruei> You might want to run 'apt --fix-broken install' to correct these.
547 [06:09:31] <guoruei> Try 'apt --fix-broken install' with no packages (or specify a solution).
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550 [06:10:12] <blueingress> guoruei, replaced-url
551 [06:10:19] <blueingress> still have problems
552 [06:11:15] <guoruei> The following packages were automatically installed and are no longer required:
553 [06:11:16] <guoruei> chromium-sandbox libre2-5
554 [06:11:16] <guoruei> Use 'sudo apt autoremove' to remove them.
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556 [06:12:35] <blueingress> guoruei, it seems a dead cycle... replaced-url
557 [06:12:43] <guoruei> lol
558 [06:14:20] <blueingress> :-(
559 [06:14:37] <guoruei> emmm
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568 [06:18:30] <guoruei> If you need browser badly , you can try Iceweasel (Firefox)
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571 [06:19:25] <blueingress> guoruei, I have firefox and chrome installed. For testing reason, I need the chromium as the 3rd browser..
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573 [06:22:03] <guoruei> ok
574 [06:22:12] <blueingress> guoruei, maybe I should not use the testing debian version: replaced-url
575 [06:22:28] <blueingress> Codename: buster
576 [06:22:39] <guoruei> debian 10 ?
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578 [06:23:04] <guoruei> no,, if you want update all day
579 [06:23:06] <blueingress> there are still many bugs there, for example, Brave browser has been dead for some days...
580 [06:23:47] <guoruei> I do not want my SSD dead for this
581 [06:24:54] <jmcnaught> blueingress: try asking on irc.oftc.net #debian-next, that's the official testing support channel
582 [06:25:18] <blueingress> guoruei, got to leave, Thank you.
583 [06:25:33] <blueingress> jmcnaught, thanks a lot. :-)
584 [06:25:35] <guoruei> blueingress: see you
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618 [06:59:36] <Marz> is it recommended to enable non free software
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620 [07:04:15] <well_laid_lawn> that is a choice you have to make yourself
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622 [07:04:29] <well_laid_lawn> sometimes it is handy
623 [07:05:38] <diogenes_> get the red pill Neo
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626 [07:06:53] <perseiver> I need expert help in resolving package dependencies... for Freeswitch in Debian 9. I am not sure where to get help regarding this. Since its an issue with debian 9 pacakages I am posting here
627 [07:07:58] <perseiver> paste.debian.net/plain/1069613
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629 [07:09:24] <perseiver> main error is libudev-dev : Depends: libudev1 (= 232-25+deb9u8) but 232-25+deb9u9 is to be installed
630 [07:13:03] <Marz> the software app on debian and ubuntu looks the same but on ubuntu it can open deb files for install
631 [07:13:23] <Marz> is there something i need to add to allow it to install software
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633 [07:14:09] <diogenes_> gdebi
634 [07:15:32] <Marz> i did that before. it is a separate app and does not open in the software app
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637 [07:16:54] <themill> perseiver: it looks like you used to have security.debian.org in your sources.list but no longer do so
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639 [07:17:31] <perseiver> yes themill: it was creating error, so I comment that
640 [07:17:40] <diogenes_> Marz, software app is a separate app too.
641 [07:17:45] <themill> well lack of that entry is your new error
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645 [07:18:52] <perseiver> ok themil: when I have enabled that I got issue regarding "source repository is not secure.. Ignoring the repository"
646 [07:19:59] <themill> err can you pastebin the entire output and your sources.list?
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649 [07:22:19] <perseiver> I can just paste the sources.list content on pastebin..
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653 [07:24:11] <perseiver> replaced-url
654 [07:24:33] <themill> !stretch sources.list
655 [07:24:33] <dpkg> A suitable /etc/apt/sources.list for "Stretch" has three lines: "deb replaced-url
656 [07:24:40] <themill> perseiver: it's updates not updated.
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659 [07:24:53] <themill> (see what dpkg said)
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661 [07:25:26] <b4d> Hi! Can and how can I list multiple packages for pinning in /etc/apt/preferences, currently I have one entry for pinned package and I would like to merge more of them into one pin? Thanks in advance
662 [07:26:35] <themill> b4d: see apt_preferences(5), but note that if you're doing lots of pinning, you're probably accumulating problems for the future and there is almost always an easier way
663 [07:26:40] <perseiver> ok
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666 [07:27:06] <b4d> themill: thanks, will check. Yeah I know the pitfalls, but would like the latest vim version :)
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668 [07:28:05] <themill> istr vim pulls a *lot* with it
669 [07:28:14] <themill> !ssb
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671 [07:28:14] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
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673 [07:30:02] <perseiver> SID repository is really a risky choice, the main problem it creates is package conflicts...
674 [07:30:45] <perseiver> sometime software require a particular version of package and SID is always updated one...
675 [07:30:56] <perseiver> Try sid at your own risk
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837 [09:45:33] <w17t> what is the difference between sid and unstable mini.iso's?
838 [09:45:35] <Sandlayth> Hello guys. I have 4 debian vbox VMs on 2 different virtual internal networks. One of them belongs to both networks, let's call it "router". Every vm can ping the "router", and, given that i've enabled net.ipv4.ip_forward, they can ping each other. Everything is fine until now. Now, I've created a host only network, and set an ip address to my host. I've created a new host-only adapter interface to my
839 [09:45:37] <Sandlayth> "router". I can ping the "router" from my host, which is fine. However, I can't ping the other machines on the other "router"'s networks, even if IPv4 forwarding is enabled. Do you know why? Is it related to debian or vbox?
840 [09:45:41] <w17t> namely replaced-url
841 [09:45:49] <w17t> and replaced-url
842 [09:46:13] <w17t> replaced-url
843 [09:46:44] <w17t> or are they the same (symlinked directories etc)?
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862 [10:03:07] <_wrksx> mornin guys
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865 [10:03:30] <_wrksx> I dunno how, I created a file called "?:q"
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867 [10:04:14] <_wrksx> but maybe some invisible chars or I dunno, because rm '?:q' doesn work, no such file
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872 [10:04:50] <_wrksx> any idea how can I make sure of the name, and delete it ?
873 [10:05:16] <_wrksx> or maybe using the file id or something
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875 [10:06:52] <_wrksx> using cmd line completion it shows as ^[:q
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877 [10:08:32] <Sandlayth> put the file name into quotes?
878 [10:08:47] <Sandlayth> it doesn't work?
879 [10:08:58] <Sandlayth> what does your ls return?
880 [10:09:29] <_wrksx> nope
881 [10:09:43] <_wrksx> rm '?:q' no such file
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883 [10:10:12] <_wrksx> I have no idea how I created it, I just noticed it today
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888 [10:12:25] <blackflow> _wrksx: hah, from vim
889 [10:12:44] <blackflow> _wrksx: try rm \?<hit tab>
890 [10:12:59] <_wrksx> I just manage to read it using vim
891 [10:13:15] <_wrksx> it garbage, a manpage dump
892 [10:13:45] <blackflow> ah, from the manpage pager then. neway, \?<tab>
893 [10:13:47] <_wrksx> rm \?<tab> doesn't work from the shell
894 [10:14:08] <blackflow> then type out the filename, but lead that ? with \?
895 [10:14:36] <_wrksx> blackflow, I didn't get it
896 [10:15:05] <blackflow> rm \?:q
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898 [10:16:15] <Sandlayth> remove it with the inode number?
899 [10:16:18] <blackflow> and if that doesn't work... you'll need some find .... -delete magick but be careful you don't delete unwanted, so first make sure the find filter is working as expected, before you add -delete
900 [10:16:20] <Sandlayth> ls -il
901 [10:16:42] <Sandlayth> and then find . -inum <Number> -delete
902 [10:16:51] <blackflow> even better.
903 [10:17:14] <perseiver> hi themill: You are rockstar...
904 [10:17:28] <perseiver> My issue regarding broken dependencies is solved.. thanks
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907 [10:18:11] <mymosh> Hello! Is firewalld or ufw the preferred way of setting up a firewall on Debian Jessie?
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910 [10:21:10] <at0m> !iptables
911 [10:21:11] <dpkg> [iptables] The user-space process used to administer iptables kernel parts on top of netfilter. Ask me about <netfilter docs>. For a proper Debian-way of setting up iptables, see replaced-url
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919 [10:23:48] <_wrksx> Sandlayth, ty I was just lookin indo how to delete by inode
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921 [10:24:05] <_wrksx> but a friend just manage to remove it using rm ?\:q
922 [10:24:28] <_wrksx> i worked while rm '?:q' wouldn't worked
923 [10:24:36] <_wrksx> no idea what was goin on
924 [10:24:40] <_wrksx> ty guys
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934 [10:32:45] <blackflow> looking back, ?\:q might've worked as a regex indeed. next time look into using inodes, it's way more precise.
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956 [10:51:43] <afidegnum> even though i have chmod to 777 my home directory, i still face an empty directory listing when connected. here is my config file replaced-url
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959 [10:54:38] <Schiziot> afidegnum: just a lucky shot until somebody else picks it up: #local_umask=022
960 [10:55:08] <Schiziot> means the default is used which results in 0700, right?
961 [10:55:08] <afidegnum> i was hesitating on that, let me check
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971 [10:55:54] <jelly> afidegnum: when connected as normal user or anonymous? Why do you use ftp at all?
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974 [10:56:32] <afidegnum> jelly: both
975 [10:57:03] <afidegnum> well I have my Linux PC, but had problem with my cable, so i decided to share files via FTP
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978 [10:57:52] <jelly> afidegnum: use sftp
979 [10:58:27] <klys> afidegnum, aren't there any files in /home/ftp
980 [10:58:32] <Schiziot> a tricky thing are these offset permissions. a "7" in the config means "0" in the filesystem, right?
981 [10:58:53] <afidegnum> no i m rather using /home/$user
982 [10:58:58] <Schiziot> and "2" translates to "5"
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984 [10:59:19] <klys> afidegnum, does it let you upload too
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986 [10:59:50] <afidegnum> i haven't tried the uploading yet, since i can't list the directories and files,
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989 [11:00:07] <klys> afidegnum, grep ftp /etc/passwd
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993 [11:02:18] <afidegnum> ftp:x:14:11::/srv/ftp:/sbin/nologin
994 [11:02:33] <klys> afidegnum, ls -ltac /srv/ftp
995 [11:03:06] <afidegnum> dr-xr-xr-x 2 root ftp 4096 Dec 15 16:09 .
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997 [11:03:07] <afidegnum> drwxr-xr-x 4 root root 4096 Dec 15 16:09 ..
998 [11:03:11] <klys> okok
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1000 [11:03:40] <klys> you might want to mkdir /home/ftp; touch /home/ftp/0001; touch /srv/ftp/0002 and login again
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1003 [11:04:18] <Schiziot> i want an ftp too now
1004 [11:04:40] <MrHyde> hello
1005 [11:04:41] <klys> schiziot, sftp?
1006 [11:04:44] <klys> hi
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1008 [11:05:20] <MrHyde> any idea why two boxes both on testing, on mine I can find python3.6 but my colleague cant ...
1009 [11:06:02] <klys> mrhyde, dpkg -l python; report your versions
1010 [11:06:05] <MrHyde> apt-cache search python3.6 is alright on mine but on his he cets only 3.5 and 3.7
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1013 [11:06:47] <MrHyde> klys: i have only 2.7.15
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1015 [11:07:01] <MrHyde> didnt install the 3.6
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1018 [11:07:09] <klys> mrhyde, dpkg -l python3
1019 [11:07:12] <MrHyde> but was wondering
1020 [11:07:16] <afidegnum> klys: permission denied, should i chown ?
1021 [11:07:25] <MrHyde> ii python3 3.7.1-3
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1023 [11:07:44] <klys> afidegnum, you can change perms and chown as much as you like, as long as it solves the problem
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1026 [11:08:06] <MrHyde> python3.6 is already the newest version (3.6.7-1).
1027 [11:08:07] <MrHyde> python3.6 set to manually installed.
1028 [11:08:08] <klys> mrhyde, is that on the one with python3.6 ?
1029 [11:08:26] <MrHyde> that's on my box
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1031 [11:08:42] <klys> it seems you have a python3.6 leftover and also a python3.7 binary probably
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1033 [11:08:49] <MrHyde> on his we cant see the python3.6 pkg with a search
1034 [11:09:16] <klys> do you need python3.6 ?
1035 [11:09:19] <klys> ,v python3
1036 [11:09:20] <judd> Package: python3 on amd64 -- wheezy: 3.2.3-6; jessie: 3.4.2-2; stretch: 3.5.3-1; buster: 3.7.2-1; sid: 3.7.2-1
1037 [11:09:32] <MrHyde> yep
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1040 [11:10:30] <MrHyde> he's compiling it right now but was wondering why he cant find it ...
1041 [11:10:49] <klys> mrhyde, it seems you will have to browse the pool for those packages. replaced-url
1042 [11:10:56] <afidegnum> kygus: no luck.. the feedback im having is "150 here comes directory listing" "500 OOPS"
1043 [11:11:56] <MrHyde> klys: thanks
1044 [11:12:13] <klys> afidegnum, you may need to start the ftpd binary by hand (su ftp) with strace and pipe all stderr output to a file that you would browse with your pager.
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1046 [11:13:29] <afidegnum> klys: su ftp comes with authentication failure, is there an appropriate command?
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1048 [11:13:53] *** HappyLoaf_ is now known as HappyLoaf
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1050 [11:14:01] <klys> afidegnum, sudo su ftp; after providing user ftp with a shell such as /bin/sh
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1052 [11:14:43] *** Quits: b4d (~b4d@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 268 seconds)
1053 [11:14:59] <afidegnum> "This account is currently not available."
1054 [11:15:05] *** Quits: dustinm` (~dustinm@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
1055 [11:15:09] <Schiziot> what goodies to share now that sources.debian.org exists :P
1056 [11:15:41] *** Joins: XmmD_ (~XmmD@replaced-ip )
1057 [11:15:53] <Schiziot> thanks to the people who worked on that project
1058 [11:15:53] *** Quits: XmmD_ (~XmmD@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
1059 [11:15:54] <klys> afidegnum, edit your passwd file directl if you mean to do as I described. ftp:x:14:11::/srv/ftp:/bin/sh
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1061 [11:17:58] <afidegnum> ?
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1065 [11:18:51] <klys> afidegnum, change the line in /etc/passwd then you can start strace on ftpd after sudo su ftp
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1069 [11:21:34] *** Joins: mynameisjohn (50bb636f@replaced-ip )
1070 [11:21:36] <mynameisjohn> Hi all
1071 [11:21:37] *** Joins: tymczenko (~tymczenko@replaced-ip )
1072 [11:21:42] <Schiziot> hello
1073 [11:21:43] <klys> hi
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1076 [11:22:21] <mynameisjohn> I was here a few days ago with a RAM issue (added two more DIMM slots of RAM into the PC, and whenever i open Chromium (or probably any other large executable that uses a lot of memory) the system freezes, although usually the mouse can still move
1077 [11:22:28] * Schiziot nominates Penguin_ for cool vhost award
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1079 [11:22:41] <mynameisjohn> I ran memtest86+ from a boot disk, checked the RAM, and apparently there are no issues
1080 [11:22:52] <mynameisjohn> So now i think it really is a software issue and not a hardware issue :
1081 [11:22:56] <afidegnum> klys: i will come back and resume
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1085 [11:23:37] <klys> mynameisjohn, do you have swap space too?
1086 [11:23:56] <mynameisjohn> uh
1087 [11:23:58] <mynameisjohn> ...
1088 [11:24:02] <mynameisjohn> maybe not O-O
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1090 [11:24:07] <mynameisjohn> I haven't looked
1091 [11:24:16] <at0m> mynameisjohn: easy check: remove the 2 new DIMMs. problem persists? install the new ones remove old ones? problem persists?
1092 [11:24:26] <mynameisjohn> The system worked well for a long time with just 2Gb of RAM. I added another 2Gb of exactly the same type
1093 [11:24:48] <mynameisjohn> I've tried every combo of DIMM and they all work, so long as there is only two of them
1094 [11:24:57] <mynameisjohn> doesn't matter the slots or the sticks used
1095 [11:25:08] <mynameisjohn> And 4 will boot, but eventually freeze
1096 [11:25:15] <at0m> then you can start swapping one old for one new, and later swap these 2 again. you'll know which DIMM is at fault.
1097 [11:25:18] <at0m> if any
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1099 [11:25:39] <mynameisjohn> I don't think any DIMM is at fault, because i put them all in all the DIMMs, ran memtest86+, no issues
1100 [11:25:53] <mynameisjohn> Ran that 7x over just to make sure
1101 [11:26:01] <at0m> ok
1102 [11:26:09] <mynameisjohn> I also blew them out with a lot of compressed air
1103 [11:26:32] <klys> mynameisjohn, you could create a swap file; dd if=/dev/zero of=/root/dat/swap.swp bs=1048576 count=2048; mkswap /root/dat/swap.swp; swapon /root/dat/swap.swp; cat /proc/swaps; top; (meanwhile): dbus-launch chromium &
1104 [11:26:42] <mynameisjohn> I'll give that a try right now :)
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1111 [11:28:52] <mynameisjohn> Am i still online? I've moved quite far from the wifi
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1113 [11:28:56] <klys> yes
1114 [11:29:09] <mynameisjohn> great :)
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1117 [11:30:57] <mynameisjohn> so "cat /proc/swaps" shows Filename="/dev/dm-2", Type="partition", Size="1835004", Used="0", Priority="-1"
1118 [11:31:07] <klys> looks right
1119 [11:31:16] <mynameisjohn> And i have 4Gb of RAM now, not 2Gb, so maybe since my swap < ram, this is happening?
1120 [11:31:32] <mynameisjohn> I had that to begin with though, i haven't run the mkswp yet
1121 [11:31:36] <mynameisjohn> ah ok
1122 [11:31:45] <mynameisjohn> maybe i should just reinstall the OS?
1123 [11:31:51] <mynameisjohn> With 4Gb to begin with?
1124 [11:31:54] <klys> well chromium isn't too much of a hog when you first start it
1125 [11:32:05] <mynameisjohn> oh
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1128 [11:32:20] <mynameisjohn> The system has frozen and i haven't even opened chromium yet, just the terminal
1129 [11:32:35] <mynameisjohn> yeah the mouse works but not the keyboard
1130 [11:32:36] <klys> okok
1131 [11:32:38] <klys> what version is your kernel
1132 [11:32:50] <mynameisjohn> i'll reboot and find out :)
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1134 [11:33:11] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
1135 [11:34:13] <klys> kernel 5.0 should be released any day now, 4.20.11 is still on track for linux stable.
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1138 [11:34:47] <mynameisjohn> Debian GNU/Linux 9.7 (strech)
1139 [11:34:56] <rant> uname -r
1140 [11:34:57] <mynameisjohn> stretch
1141 [11:34:59] <klys> stretch has a kernel
1142 [11:35:12] <mynameisjohn> 4.9.0-7-amd64
1143 [11:35:13] <klys> it's the numbers after vmlinuz-
1144 [11:35:15] <klys> ok
1145 [11:35:28] <klys> try dding some things to your kcmdline:
1146 [11:35:33] <blackflow> klys: "on track for linux stable"?
1147 [11:35:34] <rant> your kernel is out of date, but it probably has nothing to do with your issue
1148 [11:35:42] <mynameisjohn> hm
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1150 [11:36:01] <klys> adding*: irqpoll noacpi noapic
1151 [11:36:20] <klys> can you do that? it should be on the same line as vmlinuz
1152 [11:36:22] <mynameisjohn> klys: sorry, i'm not so good at this low level stuff. dd is for writing disk images right?
1153 [11:36:29] <mynameisjohn> or... something
1154 [11:36:31] <klys> I meant adding
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1156 [11:36:48] <klys> you just basically go to the entry and press `e'.
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1158 [11:36:51] <rant> its like the blind leading the blind
1159 [11:36:57] <blackflow> lolyeah
1160 [11:36:57] <mynameisjohn> i also don't really know much about vmlinuz
1161 [11:36:58] <mynameisjohn> hahaha
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1163 [11:37:18] <rant> doesnt matter its not called that anyhow
1164 [11:37:23] <klys> blackflow, that's the current stable at kernel.org
1165 [11:37:33] <rant> the line in question starts with "linux"
1166 [11:37:55] <Schiziot> let rant run the debian channels
1167 [11:38:04] <blackflow> klys: right. thought you meant "on track for debian stable", which it isn't
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1170 [11:39:10] <rant> mynameisjohn: are you using a desktop environment?
1171 [11:39:10] <klys> in that case it would be gnu/linux =)
1172 [11:39:15] <mynameisjohn> rant yup
1173 [11:39:21] <mynameisjohn> XCFE
1174 [11:39:21] <rant> mynameisjohn: which one?
1175 [11:39:23] <mynameisjohn> or XFCE
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1180 [11:40:28] <klys> mynameisjohn, are you still at the grub menu?
1181 [11:40:28] <mynameisjohn> Because the system only had 2Gb of RAM to start, i went minimal. But i need a browser to access my server app, and, eh
1182 [11:40:48] <rant> well the process montior in xfce isn't quite as easy to read as the one in say MATE, but perhpas you could try htop, it runs in a terminal
1183 [11:40:54] <mynameisjohn> klys: oh i got all that data from terminal from the Desktop, but it's frozen again. I can reboot into Grub menu now
1184 [11:41:04] <rant> chances are you're just running out of memory
1185 [11:41:16] <klys> it's only advised to have extra swap partition room if you mean to hibernate.
1186 [11:41:51] <mynameisjohn> rant: ah, well, the whole system works absolutely fine with 2Gb of RAM
1187 [11:42:01] <klys> so, at the grub menu, press e
1188 [11:42:06] <mynameisjohn> any 2 Gb of the 4 that i have, in any two DIMM slots of the same colour
1189 [11:42:08] <klys> and move your cursor to linux
1190 [11:42:19] <klys> and go to the end of the line to the right
1191 [11:42:20] <mynameisjohn> actually i haven't tried different DIMM colours, or 3Gb
1192 [11:42:37] <rant> @.@
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1194 [11:42:43] <mynameisjohn> yah
1195 [11:42:44] <klys> and add this: irqpoll noacpi noapic
1196 [11:42:47] <mynameisjohn> klys ok trying
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1198 [11:43:08] <rant> mynameisjohn: the different color slots are different channels, you WANT it in two different colors because it runs faster that way
1199 [11:43:28] <rant> mynameisjohn: however sounds to me like you're not real savvy and may be setting something up wrong
1200 [11:43:31] <mynameisjohn> wait WHAT?!
1201 [11:43:35] *** Quits: Namarrgon (~Namarrgon@replaced-ip ) (Quit: WeeChat 2.5-dev)
1202 [11:43:36] <mynameisjohn> my whole life is a lie....
1203 [11:43:47] <mynameisjohn> I thought you had to fill up a channel before using another
1204 [11:43:49] <mynameisjohn> hahaa
1205 [11:44:06] <rant> mynameisjohn: no, in many boards you just have to match pairs in each channel
1206 [11:44:33] <klys> the line says: linux vmlinuz-4.9.0-7-amd64 root=... irqpoll noacpi noapic
1207 [11:44:34] <rant> mynameisjohn: most can run in both channels without matched pairs but will not in fact run in dual-channel mode that way
1208 [11:44:48] <klys> and then you press F10 to boot it
1209 [11:44:51] <mynameisjohn> ok so, GRUB 2.02-beta3-5+deb9u1
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1211 [11:45:02] <mynameisjohn> Debian GNU/Linux is highlighted
1212 [11:45:08] <klys> hit e here
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1215 [11:45:26] <klys> and it will give you a text editor
1216 [11:45:27] <mynameisjohn> er
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1218 [11:45:33] <mynameisjohn> "e" doesn't seem to do anything
1219 [11:45:37] <mynameisjohn> weird, it did before
1220 [11:45:42] <klys> mm I forget then
1221 [11:45:50] <mynameisjohn> oh i had CAPs on
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1223 [11:46:03] <klys> okok
1224 [11:46:12] <rant> mynameisjohn: we have various names for this.. PEBKAC, PICNIC.. :
1225 [11:46:30] <blackflow> rant: PICNIC?
1226 [11:46:39] *** Joins: Namarrgon (~Namarrgon@replaced-ip )
1227 [11:46:56] <rant> Problem Exists Between Keyboard And Chair / Problem In Chair Not In Computer
1228 [11:47:33] <Haohmaru> "don't adjust your TV.."
1229 [11:47:33] <blackflow> yeah I know PEBKAC/PEBCAK, wasn't sure about PICNIC :)
1230 [11:47:55] <klys> > Each line in the menu entry can be edited freely, and you can add new lines by pressing RET at the end of a line. To boot the edited entry, press Ctrl-x.
1231 [11:47:56] <fling> How to skip installing adwaita-icon-theme and other big packages on a minimal install
1232 [11:48:34] *** Quits: martastain (~martastai@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
1233 [11:48:41] <mynameisjohn> ok on that line that has "linux /vmlinus-4.9.0... root=/dev/mapper/tenne--vg-root ro quiet
1234 [11:48:49] <klys> yes
1235 [11:48:58] <klys> add this: irqpoll noacpi noapic
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1237 [11:49:00] <mynameisjohn> so after the quiet i'll add irqpoll noacpi noapic
1238 [11:49:05] <klys> yes
1239 [11:49:09] <mynameisjohn> got it :) thanks
1240 [11:49:24] <klys> then boot with F10 or ctrl-x I forget which
1241 [11:49:30] <rant> fling: don't install a desktop environment, login from terminal after install and manually install a more minimal system
1242 [11:50:03] <mynameisjohn> It says both - but also, wow greta memory
1243 [11:50:03] <rant> fling: if you have some idea what it is you want we could probably suggest more minimal metapackages
1244 [11:50:19] <fling> rant: I'm not installing a DE, I'm connected to a console and trying to install some gui apps but there are lots of deps!!
1245 [11:50:26] <mynameisjohn> i'm in
1246 [11:50:38] <mynameisjohn> anything you'd like me to type into the terminal?
1247 [11:50:43] <klys> mynameisjohn, okay make it crash again
1248 [11:50:43] <mynameisjohn> ...other than rm -rf /
1249 [11:50:47] <mynameisjohn> ok
1250 [11:50:53] <blackflow> (and that woulnd't work anyway)
1251 [11:51:08] <mynameisjohn> haha, done. Just had to open chromium
1252 [11:51:13] <fling> so how do I skip installing adwaita-icon-theme and other things?
1253 [11:51:13] <klys> right-o
1254 [11:51:24] *** Quits: pvoigt (~Linux@replaced-ip ) (Quit: WeeChat 2.4)
1255 [11:51:33] <klys> well I guess from this point we just google for it
1256 [11:51:42] <mynameisjohn> hahaha, ok ok
1257 [11:51:52] <mynameisjohn> it's an old PC, maybe i should just buy a new one
1258 [11:51:57] <mynameisjohn> save all of us the trouble
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1260 [11:52:04] <mynameisjohn> but i really apprechiate the help
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1262 [11:52:07] <rant> fling: if the package depends on those packages somewhere down the line, and you don't want them installed you have to satisfy the dependency somehow.. look into equivs perhaps
1263 [11:52:22] <rant> fling: it will likely result in something not working..
1264 [11:52:49] <mynameisjohn> i should point out that i am a programmer
1265 [11:52:57] <mynameisjohn> i just don't know linux that well
1266 [11:53:08] <mynameisjohn> i guess that doesn't make me immune to PBKAS
1267 [11:53:09] <blackflow> It's okay, I'm a doctor!
1268 [11:54:07] <mynameisjohn> I'm also a doctor, but not medical :P
1269 [11:54:21] <mynameisjohn> hahaha, which says a lot more than i wanted to say about my ability to program -_-
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1271 [11:54:36] <rant> klys: idk what you were after with the IRQ related options, but you need to modify GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX in /etc/default/grub and update-grub and grub-install to make the changes permanent
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1274 [11:55:18] <blackflow> only update-grub is really needed (unless installing it for the first time)
1275 [11:55:18] <rant> I can only imagine you were assuming this wasn't OOM but i/o wait type issues due to swapping or something
1276 [11:55:39] <klys> rant, I think we disproved the point there. it may still apply on 32-bit hardware.
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1279 [11:56:20] <blackflow> usually when chrome freezes the whole thing, it's due to gpu (driver) issues
1280 [11:56:32] <klys> there ye go
1281 [11:56:41] <mynameisjohn> i have onboard gpu
1282 [11:56:46] <mynameisjohn> intel or whatever
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1286 [11:57:19] <mynameisjohn> and i have to say, the graphics on this machine always sucked. lots of horizontal lines while watching video. but #non-free you know
1287 [11:57:35] <mynameisjohn> and on a 2Gb machine i guess that's to be expected
1288 [11:57:46] <rant> a gpu lockup would freeze the mouse typically and they said the keyboard doesnt respond but the mouse does
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1291 [11:58:27] <mynameisjohn> well, the last time it froze when i opened chromium, everything froze. Chromium didn't even load, the loading mouse icon froze and the whole system
1292 [11:58:42] <n1ce> I have an R9 390X and my screen have the same issue...
1293 [11:58:45] <mynameisjohn> before, the mouse would move around a little, and then the whole system would freeze
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1296 [11:59:19] <mynameisjohn> actually, when i came down today to check it after it froze last night and i just left it on, when i came down the screen was all mangled, like blocks of white and static
1297 [11:59:29] <mynameisjohn> but who knows when a computer crashes what broke first
1298 [11:59:52] <klys> mynameisjohn, do you get that with firefox?
1299 [12:00:03] <mynameisjohn> i don't have FF installed, but i'll try that now
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1304 [12:01:02] <klys> or, idk: other than chromium, you can probably get that with some other programs
1305 [12:01:37] * rant hands mynameisjohn a SAK
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1307 [12:03:31] <klys> mynameisjohn, is it a ryzen pc?
1308 [12:03:39] <rant> heh
1309 [12:04:01] <mynameisjohn> hehe
1310 [12:04:40] <klys> ah, it's an old pc. nm.
1311 [12:04:44] <mynameisjohn> i put it together myself over the years with parts from older PCs. It was originally a home theater but now it's a security-camera server
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1314 [12:05:15] <mynameisjohn> so it's, heh, past it's prime. But still a good machine. 2.4Ghz Intel Core Duo.
1315 [12:05:36] <klys> well I had that irqpoll issue on a 320bit amd box from ~2003.
1316 [12:05:42] <klys> 32-bit*
1317 [12:05:42] <mynameisjohn> 2Gb of RAM *upgraded* to 4Gb, although now it doesn't stay on. Blu-ray burning drive that i burnt all my christmas cash on once and have barely ever used
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1319 [12:06:33] <mynameisjohn> oh
1320 [12:06:42] <mynameisjohn> the screen is doing cool shit, one sec i'll take a photo
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1322 [12:09:26] <rant> you could also have bad ram, bad PSU, or be over your output wattage
1323 [12:09:55] <rant> cause sounds to me like you got the machine doing a lot and messing up when you do something intensive
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1325 [12:10:47] <rant> I was just looking at a machine earlier on amazon that had a Core i5 and only a 265W PSU for a full mid-tower.. would be real f'n easy to brown out a machine like that adding HW
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1329 [12:11:42] <mynameisjohn> oh
1330 [12:12:01] <mynameisjohn> i... do have like... 4 HDDs and a Bluray drive in this thing. Could be power
1331 [12:12:05] <mynameisjohn> maybe if i unplug some of these HDDs
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1333 [12:12:57] <mynameisjohn> replaced-url
1334 [12:13:25] <mynameisjohn> Although since uploading that, the screen has gone back to black, the mouse cursor appeared, and also moves around still
1335 [12:13:32] <klys> yeah if you're shopping for a psu this year, it's ~900W
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1337 [12:14:16] <mynameisjohn> 500W coolermaster
1338 [12:14:46] <klys> when shopping for a psu, i tend to search silent/quiet
1339 [12:15:34] <t3st3r> maybe GPU failire, something like loss of contact to GPU/VRAM
1340 [12:16:13] <toruvinn> last time i've seen something like this on my scren was fried ram on my GPU
1341 [12:16:23] <toruvinn> that was gf7300gs, passively cooled.
1342 [12:16:31] <t3st3r> what GPU this thing is?
1343 [12:16:45] <klys> t3st3r, interesting. it's integrated intel gfx.
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1345 [12:17:05] <t3st3r> then it shouldn't have vram and assoc problems...
1346 [12:17:13] <toruvinn> yeah.
1347 [12:17:17] <rant> mynameisjohn: 7200RPM 3.5" or more like 5400RPM green or something?
1348 [12:17:21] <t3st3r> so I guess it wrong idea.
1349 [12:18:00] <rant> mynameisjohn: there are sites online that have power consumption calculators or approx usage of various types of devices..
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1351 [12:18:33] <mynameisjohn> nope, i unplugged the two unused HDDs and the bluray but it still crashes
1352 [12:18:41] <mynameisjohn> although this time it also rebooted, which is unusually
1353 [12:19:23] <t3st3r> Maybe DC-DC circuits around GPU are giving up. Are papacitors on MB okay, etc?
1354 [12:19:29] <mynameisjohn> oh
1355 [12:19:46] <rant> yes it could be capacitors in a reulator dried out over time
1356 [12:19:53] <mynameisjohn> i just remembered, i've hooked this up to my house light circuit
1357 [12:19:59] <t3st3r> They can start to have very specific look due to "capacitors plague".
1358 [12:20:17] <mynameisjohn> because it's always on. Maybe if i switch over to a regular AC wall outlet instead of tapping a light it might work
1359 [12:20:20] <rant> they can be far out of spec without looking any different
1360 [12:20:34] <rant> you need an in-circuit esr meter to really know for sure
1361 [12:20:47] <t3st3r> Yeah, though most often they do get specific look fortunately.
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1363 [12:21:37] <t3st3r> current in CPU DC-DC is usually enough to heat 'em further and make them vent eventually.
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1365 [12:21:49] <rant> thats only if the magic smoke is coming out :P
1366 [12:22:09] <rant> the magic smoke doesnt have to come out to make em perform below spec.. it can just dry out
1367 [12:22:28] <mynameisjohn> er
1368 [12:22:32] <mynameisjohn> ...
1369 [12:22:34] <mynameisjohn> it didn't crash.
1370 [12:22:37] <mynameisjohn> wtf
1371 [12:23:01] <mynameisjohn> The screen resolution is also a bit different. It's like super low quality and zoomed in a little
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1373 [12:23:34] <klys> mynameisjohn, less /var/log/Xorg.0.log
1374 [12:23:49] <klys> it will give a reason for your resolution
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1379 [12:26:32] <mynameisjohn> oh, its NVIDIA drivers
1380 [12:26:40] <mynameisjohn> i can't get over this electrical socket thing
1381 [12:26:49] <mynameisjohn> its not supposed to be different, i wired it myself
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1383 [12:27:05] <mynameisjohn> i'm going to bust out the multimeter and see why the power is different
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1386 [12:27:21] <klys> the only difference I can see is if it isn't grounded properly
1387 [12:27:56] <mynameisjohn> i wired up the ground of the PSU to the ground of the wire, but maybe the wire isn't grounded
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1389 [12:28:35] <mynameisjohn> is there a way to grab the /var/log/Xorg.0.log file and post it online for you to see?
1390 [12:28:45] <mynameisjohn> it's very long and i have no idea what part is important and what is irrelevant
1391 [12:28:51] <mynameisjohn> like, from the terminal, somehow
1392 [12:28:57] <oiaohm> mynameisjohn: there is a difference between a floating ground and a real ground.
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1394 [12:29:32] <klys> there's a program called pastebinit
1395 [12:29:39] <mynameisjohn> oiaohm: right right, but this is a house neutral/230v/ground, although
1396 [12:29:50] <mynameisjohn> although the cable is a 3-phase cable so actually it might only be 120v
1397 [12:29:58] <mynameisjohn> or whatever, i need to check
1398 [12:30:14] <mynameisjohn> i can't believe it runs now though
1399 [12:30:25] <mynameisjohn> i have stuggled with this for the best part of a week
1400 [12:30:39] <mynameisjohn> power supply. who'd have thought. god dammit.
1401 [12:30:50] <mynameisjohn> but i'm glad. don't get me wrong i'm glad. but damn.
1402 [12:30:58] <mynameisjohn> I'm *really* sorry for wasting everyone's time
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1404 [12:31:07] <klys> :.)
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1407 [12:31:35] <oiaohm> mynameisstupid: some power supplies your DC negitives ie what people would call grounds are meant to be floating grounds.
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1409 [12:31:58] <oiaohm> mynameisstupid: and if you start wiring them to normal ground magic issues can happen.
1410 [12:32:49] <mynameisstupid> while apt-get install pastebinit, "Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg recevied a segmentation fault
1411 [12:32:58] <mynameisstupid> and the sceen is all weird but it isn'T freezing
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1415 [12:33:19] <blackflow> mynameisstupid: is dmesg showing the kernel screaming bloody gore about errors?
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1418 [12:35:18] <klys> most new nvidia cards support function-level reset. that won't help you, though. I guess I was just thinking about restarting Xorg.
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1432 [12:41:53] <mynameisstupid> ok it froze again. Wall socket has 236V, light power had 228V, so, i mean, it's possible but unlikely that that is the issue. I think it was a co-incidence
1433 [12:41:57] <mynameisstupid> And now i think it's a driver issue
1434 [12:42:08] <mynameisstupid> although i don't know how adding RAM would affect a GPU
1435 [12:42:18] <t3st3r> 228V should be more than okay.
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1437 [12:43:08] <klys> 210-220VAC is standard
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1439 [12:43:33] <mynameisstupid> ok, hm.
1440 [12:43:59] <t3st3r> Most PSUs can live with rather broad range of voltage. Modern things with APFC are even could be full range.
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1442 [12:45:17] <SwedeMike> across europe it's everything from 220V-240V standard, and it can even be outside that. A modern switched-mode PSU doesn't care.
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1444 [12:45:47] <mynameisstupid> the honeybadger of power supply units
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1446 [12:46:08] <ws2k3> is it true that on debian 9 aptitude is not installed by default?
1447 [12:46:27] <rant> ,i aptitude
1448 [12:46:28] <judd> Package aptitude (admin, optional) in stretch/amd64: terminal-based package manager. Version: 0.8.7-1; Size: 1443.2k; Installed: 4452k; Homepage: replaced-url
1449 [12:46:39] <rant> ws2k3: its an optional package
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1454 [12:51:36] <mynameisstupid> ok, i've reached max drama. I'm going to try re-installing everything and see if that fixes it
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1486 [13:16:13] <wwilliam> hello how do i print the line that is not present like so "file $x is not present" the following loop prints everything in the morepdfs file
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1488 [13:16:34] <wwilliam> while read -r x;do if ! grep -R "$x" . ;then echo "$x was not transfer";fi;done < /home/afernandez/morepdfs
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1490 [13:17:17] <cusco> test -e
1491 [13:17:40] <wwilliam> ?
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1543 [14:00:32] <ws2k3> what does the -e do in #!/bin/sh -e in /etc/rc.local
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1561 [14:11:04] <karlpinc> ws2k3: -e means exit immediately on an error
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1563 [14:11:17] <karlpinc> ws2k3: Don't keep running the script
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1565 [14:12:01] <ws2k3> karlpinc thanks so if i dont want behavior i can just remove -e right? as long as there is an exit 0 at the bottum right?
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1570 [14:13:34] <karlpinc> ws2k3: Yes. You don't need an exit 0 at the bottom. It'll exit with the exit status of the last executed command if you leave that out.
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1608 [14:40:26] <rocketmagnet> hi everyone, i can't find lex or a package that contains lex
1609 [14:40:35] <rocketmagnet> i'm on stable
1610 [14:40:47] <rocketmagnet> is bison the new lex ?
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1612 [14:40:56] <rocketmagnet> or flex ?
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1614 [14:41:09] <rocketmagnet> flex is the ne lex .. is that right ?
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1618 [14:42:04] * esr saw a reference to an in-circuit esr meter and was amused.
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1620 [14:42:38] <esr> flex is the new lex. bison is the new yacc.
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1627 [14:45:28] <jelly> where "new" like "25 years old"
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1633 [14:49:57] <jelly> ,file bin/lex
1634 [14:50:02] <judd> Search for bin/lex in stretch/amd64: flex-old: usr/bin/lex; flex: usr/bin/lex
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1678 [15:16:16] <altker128> question: Is there a utility I can use to browse a remote apt repository that doesn't have a web front-end enabled?
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1680 [15:17:12] <altker128> This is for a different architecture (ARM) than my current machine ; but I'm trying to grab a deb and unpack it
1681 [15:17:39] <Brigo> altker128, ftp?
1682 [15:18:05] <Brigo> altker128, you can use apt for that, just with -d (download only)
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1684 [15:18:45] <Kobaz> sooooo, how would i see what process is sending another process a SIGTERM
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1686 [15:19:01] <ksk> you dont afaik.
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1691 [15:20:23] <Kobaz> i know there's tracing/profiling stuff you can hook into, i can't think of the name of the subsystem
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1694 [15:21:23] <blackflow> Kobaz: auditing? Like with AppArmor?
1695 [15:21:44] <Kobaz> oh
1696 [15:21:45] <Kobaz> i figured it out
1697 [15:21:46] <Kobaz> ugh
1698 [15:21:49] <Kobaz> god damn systemd
1699 [15:21:52] <Kobaz> Feb 22 09:20:31 asterisk01 systemd: asterisk.service start operation timed out. Terminating.
1700 [15:21:52] *** Kobaz was kicked by debhelper (flood)
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1702 [15:22:04] <blackflow> Kobaz: you should know better.
1703 [15:22:12] <Kobaz> well, this isn't my system
1704 [15:22:20] <blackflow> I meant flooding
1705 [15:22:24] <Kobaz> :P
1706 [15:22:47] <blackflow> as to the problem, it's probably not systemd's fault. what exactly is happening, what are you expecting instead?
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1711 [15:24:34] <Kobaz> meh
1712 [15:24:35] <Kobaz> well
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1714 [15:24:50] <Kobaz> asterisk *is* starting properly
1715 [15:24:54] <Kobaz> systemd doesn't think so, it kills it
1716 [15:25:15] <blackflow> Kobaz: is it _configured_ properly for systemd to recognize that?
1717 [15:25:22] <Kobaz> who knows
1718 [15:25:28] <Kobaz> it's not my system, but... we baby sit it
1719 [15:25:32] <blackflow> see, vast majority of "goddamn systemd" issues are due to bad config, misunderstanding systemd or bad distro defaults
1720 [15:25:39] <Kobaz> all i know is 'everything was fine' yesterday
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1723 [15:26:19] <blackflow> is there a TimeoutStartSec limit?
1724 [15:26:59] <Kobaz> sooooo
1725 [15:27:16] <Kobaz> <--- systemd newb.... where would that setting be located
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1729 [15:29:37] <blackflow> oic. well, systemctl status asterisk.service (or whatever the unit name is) will show you origin of the unit. probably /lib/systemd/system/... with optional overrides under /etc/systemd/system/...
1730 [15:30:07] <blackflow> you could also check what systemd sees (effective config after any overrides) with systemctl cat <service name>
1731 [15:30:21] <Kobaz> so basically what i did for the moment, since these people are screaming... was stop/disable asterisk and start it manually
1732 [15:30:28] <blackflow> and theres #systemd here on Freenode should you need more help about systemd
1733 [15:30:28] <Kobaz> so, current disaster averted, now we can debug
1734 [15:30:43] <Kobaz> /usr/lib/systemd/system/asterisk.service
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1738 [15:31:41] <Kobaz> no TimeoutStartSec
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1740 [15:31:57] <Kobaz> i have this though: Restart=on-failure RestartSec=1
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1742 [15:32:51] <blackflow> Kobaz: do you know what those directives do?
1743 [15:33:52] <Kobaz> looks like RestartSec is duration in between restarts
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1746 [15:34:07] <Kobaz> those look like the only restart related options that set set... no other timeouts, etc
1747 [15:34:14] <blackflow> Kobaz: btw, please pastebin the output of `systemctl cat asterisk.service`, as well as `journalctl -u asterisk.service -n 20` (assuming last 20 lines would suffice)
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1749 [15:35:56] <Kobaz> replaced-url
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1751 [15:35:57] <jmcnaught> It's odd that the service unit is in /usr/lib/systemd when Debian doesn't put unit files there
1752 [15:36:06] <Kobaz> oh, right
1753 [15:36:11] <Kobaz> it's umm... not debian
1754 [15:36:37] <Kobaz> i just was like, oh crap things are dieing... where should i ask about systemd.... oh here!
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1756 [15:37:00] <jmcnaught> probably better to ask in the distro's channel, or an asterisk or systemd channel
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1758 [15:37:19] <Kobaz> asterisk part i got.. that's not the issue
1759 [15:37:29] <blackflow> Kobaz: that's okay. I'm bored so I'll waste your time some more with debian specific solutions.
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1761 [15:37:34] <Kobaz> it's systemd and it's penchent for restarting a perfectly good service
1762 [15:38:07] <blackflow> Kobaz: I thought ou said you were systemd noob? or you have actual experience in order to be able to say there's a .... "penchent for restarting a perfectly good service"?
1763 [15:38:14] <blackflow> can't be both
1764 [15:38:24] <Kobaz> i'm not an asterisk noob
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1766 [15:38:40] <blackflow> nor did I say that. please re-read what I said.
1767 [15:38:50] <Kobaz> that's my thing.. that's why we're maintaing this system... i KNOW asterisk. that's not the issue. Yes asterisk is a perfectly good service. IT's 100% operational and gets restarted by systemd
1768 [15:39:05] <Kobaz> i'm backing up my statement of restarting a perfectly good service
1769 [15:39:33] <Kobaz> so yeah, i'll go bug the #systemd peoples
1770 [15:39:33] <blackflow> Kobaz: so other than those warnings, is there another log which might explain its startup problems?
1771 [15:39:41] <ksk> please rant in #systemd, thanks.
1772 [15:39:47] <blackflow> indee.d
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1774 [15:39:59] <Kobaz> the warnings are fine... the vendor who built this system didn't set up everything in the 'new way' to avoid the warnings
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1776 [15:40:33] <blackflow> Kobaz: the unit says Type=notify. Do you know what that means and why systemd would be sensitive about thinking asterisk is in failure mode?
1777 [15:41:03] <Kobaz> I don't know what type=notify is, i can look that one up
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1779 [15:41:29] <blackflow> Kobaz: well basically, it is asterisk itself that signals systemd about startup success or failure
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1781 [15:42:05] <Kobaz> well, if you run the normal command line to start asteirsk on this system, the return is success/0
1782 [15:42:23] <Kobaz> which is exactly what I did to rescue the system... shut down the service in systemd and start it manually
1783 [15:42:27] <blackflow> Kobaz: "normal"? is that via systemctl?
1784 [15:42:45] <Kobaz> not sure what it returns via running from systemctl, not sure how to debug that
1785 [15:43:00] <blackflow> or did you use the "service" command which is... uhm.... systemctl
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1787 [15:43:04] <Coosh> window 5
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1789 [15:43:09] <blackflow> or do you actually have an init script there too?
1790 [15:43:22] <blackflow> (thought that success/0 looks like systemd)
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1793 [15:43:59] <Kobaz> basically, here's what I did... service asterisk stop.. /usr/sbin/asterisk -g -f -U asterisk (same commandline as systemd cfg)... echo $? : 0
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1796 [15:44:29] <blackflow> Kobaz: well that's not really the same thing, there's no systemd FDs for notify
1797 [15:44:37] <Kobaz> right, it's very manual
1798 [15:44:44] <blackflow> shoudl really investigate why asterisk is singalling failure
1799 [15:44:47] <Kobaz> just saying what i've done so far
1800 [15:46:24] <blackflow> and I'm telling you why systemd is doing what it's doing. It is TOLD SO. By the unit file (restart on failure, which it'll retry a few times and then hard fail, it's not gonna loop forever), and by asterisk itself.
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1802 [15:46:45] <blackflow> now, look up the logs and see if it says anythign there, and continue this in your distro specific channel please. or #systemd.
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1804 [15:47:17] <Kobaz> right, but what is failing, is the question
1805 [15:47:18] <Kobaz> it's not asterisk
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1807 [15:47:57] <blackflow> it most likely is asterisk and Type=notify
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1809 [15:48:11] <Kobaz> i'll check out the type=notify stuff
1810 [15:48:15] <blackflow> some daemons require explicit configuration option to know they're run under Type=notify. is that the case with asterisk?
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1812 [15:48:40] <eksegenis> # safe_asterisk runs Asterisk in a virtual console. This allows easy
1813 [15:48:40] <eksegenis> # access to the asterisk command-line without logging it.
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1815 [15:49:10] <blackflow> you can also change that to Type=simple (or just comment out #Type, that's default) to achieve the same thing as your command line
1816 [15:49:20] <blackflow> but eh... really, not a #debian issue.
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1823 [15:52:22] <Kobaz> right
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1825 [15:52:37] <Kobaz> agreed, just the first place i started asking
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1827 [15:53:42] <jelly> blackflow: a suboptimal service definition provided by the distro _is_ a #debian issue if the distro is, in fact, Debian
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1831 [15:56:50] <jelly> but debian usually takes some minimum care not to ship broken-by-default service unit definitions
1832 [15:57:01] <Kobaz> yeap
1833 [15:57:21] <blackflow> jelly: but we're told it isn't, so...
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1850 [16:06:04] <jelly> !spank Kobaz
1851 [16:06:05] * dpkg bends Kobaz over his knee and delivers a mighty *THWACK*
1852 [16:07:22] <Kobaz> thanks!
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1855 [16:08:26] <Kobaz> mmm
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1878 [16:15:39] <muhaha> How is started pulseaudio in debian ? I am using lightdm, seems that arch has a target replaced-url
1879 [16:16:18] <muhaha> or should I just put pulseaudio --start to .xsession ?
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1886 [16:19:51] <ksk> muhaha: pulseaudio seems to be started via systemd in debian, too. Its running on my fcxcfce installODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODODAnd OCi
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1888 [16:20:12] <ksk> dafuq. ignore these characters..
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1893 [16:21:29] <ksk> oh nvm, it seems not. systemctl status shows every process, did not know.
1894 [16:21:46] <ksk> seems to be started via my sessionsmanager. but I did not have to edit anything, seems to be default for xfce.
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1900 [16:23:38] <OerHeks> systemctl enable --user pulseaudio.service
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1904 [16:25:09] <muhaha> oh, thanks
1905 [16:25:16] <muhaha> Why --user space ?
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1911 [16:26:26] <ksk> because you want X related stuff (and I think pulseaudio is) in the users context.
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1913 [16:26:54] <OerHeks> not sure --user is demandatory, but it works for me
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1915 [16:27:26] <OerHeks> this 'enable' makes the service start on boot
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1917 [16:29:42] <ayekat> muhaha: the wiki article there actually mentions that it's a user service
1918 [16:31:19] <ayekat> or rather, a user socket, which then starts the user service
1919 [16:31:23] <muhaha> Thanks. Still its not working for me.. (Yes, I am that guy who want to run X11 app with flatpak on debian stretch without DE). Pulseaudio is running now, but I am not sure its connectable for user autologed with lightdm
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1928 [16:35:09] <blackflow> muhaha: tht was about kodi? its' been days now.... wouldn't it have been better if you just installed a regular desktop, even if it's in server role?
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1931 [16:36:32] <muhaha> Maybe
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2014 [17:26:06] <leonlemouton> replaced-url
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2019 [17:26:36] <leonlemouton> hi ! listen. I can help. No matter.
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2030 [17:32:48] <leonlemouton> I love mate and lxqt.
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2055 [17:51:54] <hetOrakel> Hi all, i posted this question about 2 weeks back in the Xen channel and they directed me here. I thought i solved the problem but i can reproduce it 100%. When i detach a bcache Debian crashes. Please see take a look in here: replaced-url
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2059 [17:57:50] <Tenkawa> yay now I have a fast linux dual boot portable system again with good amount of storage
2060 [17:58:03] <Tenkawa> that usb stick was reallly messing my system up
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2074 [18:06:25] <jelly> hetOrakel: file a bug report against linux-image-4.9.0-8-amd64 package after checking whether there's already a matching one. You might also ask in #bcache channel on irc.oftc.net if there is a known bug in 4.9.130
2075 [18:07:08] <jelly> longterm kernel branches like 4.9 do not always get all the fixes
2076 [18:09:11] <jelly> hetOrakel: you can also try the 4.19 build from stretch-backports if you're in a hurry
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2098 [18:21:07] <poseid> hello... I have a unix rsync question.... where could i ask it?
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2101 [18:23:01] <somiaj> poseid: if it is about rsync on debian systems, here is fine. If you want to ask about generic linux, there is also ##linux
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2104 [18:25:02] <jelly> !ask
2105 [18:25:02] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
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2138 [18:47:41] <muhaha> Is dbus launched with lightdm by default ?
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2144 [18:49:37] <jelly> muhaha: dbus runs at boot, before login
2145 [18:50:44] <muhaha> I have a problem that user autologged with lightdm has no access to dbus ( and pulseaudio) Any idea?
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2148 [18:52:23] <jelly> muhaha: autologged in to what kind of session?
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2150 [18:53:46] <muhaha> Xsession
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2152 [18:54:12] <jelly> if I log in to a KDE session on Debian 9, at some point "systemd --user" gets started, and it spawns both a "dbus-daemon --user" and a pulseaudio. I don't have a global, system pulseaudio process at all.
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2160 [18:58:15] <jelly> muhaha: so you pick "Default Xsession" in lightdm? Is this a fresh install of Debian 9 or an upgrade?
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2168 [19:01:15] <muhaha> Its fresh Stretch server install without any DE, just lightdm greeter... I am using xsession to run X11 app. But It has no access to dbus and pulseaudio
2169 [19:01:41] <muhaha> User is in groups: dialout cdrom audio dip video plugdev users input pulse-access
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2171 [19:02:27] <jelly> muhaha: does systemd --user get started?
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2176 [19:06:39] <muhaha> ps -ef | grep [p]ulseaudio root 1658 1655 0 17:38 ? 00:00:00 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --daemonize=no
2177 [19:06:42] <muhaha> yes
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2196 [19:14:29] <muhaha> jelly: or what do you mean?
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2205 [19:20:10] <jelly> muhaha: is there a process matching ps -ef | grep 'systemd --user' ?
2206 [19:21:44] <muhaha> yes
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2209 [19:23:08] <muhaha> 'dbus-daemon --user' is not running... pulseaudio is running, because I did systemd --user enable pulseaudio
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2211 [19:23:58] <jelly> sorry, that one should probably look like "dbus-daemon --session" ... not --user
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2216 [19:24:58] <jelly> muhaha: do things work better if you stop and disable the global pulseaudio service, and log off and on again?
2217 [19:25:17] <muhaha> This is running: message+ 534 1 0 19:20 ? 00:00:00 /usr/bin/dbus-daemon --system --address=systemd: --nofork --nopidfile --systemd-activation
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2220 [19:26:01] <jelly> that's global dbus
2221 [19:26:23] <OerHeks> oops, i gave bad advise :-(
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2224 [19:26:54] <muhaha> In this case,... I have no other dbus process running
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2231 [19:28:58] <jelly> muhaha: okay... can you enable user dbus.service just like you did with user pulseaudio
2232 [19:29:24] <jelly> perhaps there are undeclared dependencies
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2234 [19:31:00] * jelly has no idea how these things are supposed to be enabled manually
2235 [19:31:28] <jelly> muhaha: and then log off and back on I suppose
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2246 [19:34:51] <muhaha> systemctl --user enable dbus.service Failed to enable unit: File dbus.service: No such file or directory
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2248 [19:35:30] <muhaha> systemctl enable dbus.service -> replaced-url
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2255 [19:38:03] <jelly> don't mess with global dbus, noone asked for that
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2259 [19:39:24] <jelly> muhaha: is dbus-user-session package installed?
2260 [19:40:21] <jelly> if not, install it, reboot, see how things fare
2261 [19:41:13] <jelly> there's a /etc/X11/Xsession.d/20dbus_xdg-runtime so that bit probably starts it from Xsession
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2270 [19:46:08] <jelly> muhaha: dunno if that's the useful one or dbus-x11
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2277 [19:50:50] <muhaha> its started now, but pulseaudio still not working.
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2279 [19:51:42] <jelly> did you disable the global one
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2281 [19:51:58] <jelly> (global pulseaudio service)
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2283 [19:52:51] * jelly away for a while, sorry
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2287 [19:55:10] <muhaha> systemctl --user status pulseaudio.service -> this is enabled
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2314 [20:02:20] <nidhoegger> Hi, i am currently creating a package for a server that also will play sound. I have created a new user for that purpose and added him to the audio group. unfortunately, I cannot, from command line, enumerate the audio devices with SDL. Is there a group or an access right I am missing?
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2318 [20:08:01] <nidhoegger> or will I need to put pulseaudio in system mode for that?
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2321 [20:09:31] <muhaha> alsa or pulseaudio? There is also pulseaudi-access group
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2331 [20:15:13] <nidhoegger> sorry, if someone wrote me something, my internet broke down (LTE)
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2401 [20:57:12] <star314> After an update to the latest version of Debian stretch yesterday, firewall logs, which normally go to /var/log/kern.log, start to flood dmesg. Any idea where I should look in order to disable this behavior?
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2405 [20:58:59] <jhutchins> star314: What firewall?
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2408 [21:00:10] <star314> jhutchins: Shorewall. Everything was fine before the update.
2409 [21:00:35] <star314> As far as I remember, the update involved a kernel update and a systemd update.
2410 [21:01:22] <star314> I guess this behavior is related to the systemd update
2411 [21:01:28] <jhutchins> I'd start with the docs for shorewall then, including the changelog.
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2414 [21:02:33] <star314> hmm, I can take a look at, but there was definitely no update of the shorewall package
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2416 [21:03:40] <jhutchins> Well, the docs should tell you what the log mechanism is, and obviously kernel & systemd changelogs.
2417 [21:03:48] * Old_Dog makes a dash for the door while nobody is looking gone!
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2500 [21:48:11] <xormor> hello. why is icedtea-netx "pending"/"waiting" to be upgraded, not upgraded right away after I have tried to upgrade the system?
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2504 [21:50:13] <xormor> if I remove icedtea-netx will my browser still be able to do banking and the normal stuff, like Facebook etc? I don't play Java games anymore
2505 [21:50:18] <muhaha> jelly: are You here? I solved pulseaudio issues with putting pulseaudio --start && /usr/bin/myx11app to .xsession, seems that systemctl --user enable/start pulseaudio does not work in this case. I dont know why :X
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2522 [22:05:15] <thavlik> How can I add the sid repository to my fresh stretch install? I am wanting to install this replaced-url
2523 [22:05:42] <thavlik> I've been modifying /etc/apt/sources.list and have had no luck
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2528 [22:06:04] <thavlik> `deb replaced-url
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2539 [22:10:09] <blackflow> thavlik: that's not correct usage.... "unstable" aka sid would be in place of "stretch". there's no component "unstable".
2540 [22:10:43] <blackflow> replaced-url
2541 [22:10:48] <thavlik> blackflow, I am wanting to install that software. The documentation for debian is *very* unclear about how to do this. It says a few words on it and provides precisely zero examples
2542 [22:11:04] <blackflow> thavlik: this link explains it
2543 [22:11:04] *** Quits: scream (~scream@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2544 [22:11:26] <thavlik> blackflow, and provides no examples
2545 [22:11:33] <blackflow> thavlik: meanwhile.... not sure you should be using sid, being unable to find this information on your own.
2546 [22:11:35] <thavlik> I have no idea what this one value needs to be :)
2547 [22:12:00] <blackflow> did you read the link? it explains ALL parts of the source entries
2548 [22:12:00] *** Joins: flokuehn (~flokuehn@replaced-ip )
2549 [22:12:02] <thavlik> I know what is going on here. I've read that twice. I've tried a handful of things that are tangential to what it suggests
2550 [22:12:05] <thavlik> Yes. Did you?
2551 [22:12:18] <thavlik> I have definitely RTFM on this one. It is insufficient.
2552 [22:12:52] *** Joins: apteryx (~maxim@replaced-ip )
2553 [22:13:14] <thavlik> guess I'll just wait for twelve hours while I build llvm from the source
2554 [22:13:33] <blackflow> thavlik: which part of this you ahve problems understanding? "The 'distribution' can be either the release code name / alias (jessie, stretch, buster, sid) or the release class (oldstable, stable, testing, unstable) respectively."
2555 [22:13:42] <apteryx> hello! Where can I find the sources (VCVS) for the GCC package of Debian 9 ?
2556 [22:13:48] <apteryx> I tried Salsa, but I'm lost.
2557 [22:14:04] <blackflow> thavlik: given this format of the sources entry, from that same page: "deb replaced-url
2558 [22:14:21] <blackflow> thavlik: so if you want unstable aka sid, which of those you think you should replace?
2559 [22:14:36] *** Joins: siloxid (~user@replaced-ip )
2560 [22:14:44] <blackflow> really if you can't do that, then sid is NOT for you. start stable, get used to it, familiar with internals, before you go unstable.
2561 [22:15:15] <zleap> hi
2562 [22:15:22] <siloxid> can anyone recommend a terminal emulator that goes to the next tab with C-Tab and to the previous tab with C-Shift-Tab?
2563 [22:15:44] *** Quits: banisterfiend (~textual@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2564 [22:15:49] <blackflow> apteryx: replaced-url
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2566 [22:16:22] <thavlik> blackflow, thanks. That is literally all I wanted to know.
2567 [22:16:45] <blackflow> thavlik: that's copy pasted from that link
2568 [22:16:58] <zleap> seem to have an odd issue with my desktop (deb 9, + xfce) in that the wall paper seems to be shifted to the right
2569 [22:17:36] <zleap> however that leaves about a 1.5" gap on the left, the file manager window won't move past that left edge, but the panel is shown unless I click in that blank area
2570 [22:17:43] <thavlik> blackflow, it was unclear if I wanted to REPLACE the repo for my distribution or include sid with it. Only by your suggestion has it been made clear that this is what is _necessary_ to accomplish what I am wanting. It did not seem like that was what I wanted before.
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2572 [22:18:05] *** Joins: krabador (~krabador@replaced-ip )
2573 [22:18:09] <jhutchins> thavlik: You ADD the src repo for sid.
2574 [22:18:10] <thavlik> blackflow, that seems undesirable to include sid packages at the exclusion of stable packages, hence why it is unclear
2575 [22:18:18] <thavlik> Oh
2576 [22:18:25] <jhutchins> !ssb
2577 [22:18:25] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
2578 [22:18:48] <blackflow> thavlik: no you can have both, and then explicitly select repo from which you install -- but that's very much advanced use and not recommended unless you know what you're doing
2579 [22:18:50] *** Quits: b30wulf (uid175355@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2580 [22:18:53] <siloxid`> ^ if anyone responded, please repeat as it looks like I went offline somehow
2581 [22:19:02] <blackflow> thavlik: though you'll need one line per "distribution" you want to enable
2582 [22:19:03] <jhutchins> thavlik: You should not attempt to install testing or unstable packages on stable.
2583 [22:19:10] <thavlik> blackflow, I am fine breaking my install for pedagogical purposes
2584 [22:19:16] <thavlik> jhutchins, this is a fresh install
2585 [22:19:18] <blackflow> good luck, then :)
2586 [22:19:21] <jhutchins> thavlik: Unless you enjoy doing system re-installs.
2587 [22:19:50] *** Quits: siloxid (~user@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2588 [22:19:58] <jhutchins> thavlik: The correct way to do it is as above from dpkg. Download the source, build the package against the stable headers and libraries.
2589 [22:20:01] <thavlik> jhutchins, nah :) just clone a new image
2590 [22:20:20] <thavlik> This is insane
2591 [22:20:23] <jhutchins> !frankendebian
2592 [22:20:23] <dpkg> When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall>
2593 [22:20:42] <thavlik> It's this big of a pain to get a modern binary for LLVM on debian?
2594 [22:20:54] *** siloxid` is now known as siloxid
2595 [22:21:33] <jhutchins> If you put a sid binary repo on your system, you don't have any control of which packages will be updated unless you use pinning.
2596 [22:21:52] <jhutchins> !pinning
2597 [22:21:52] <dpkg> Pinning is a method to choose which version of a package to install when multiple versions are available from <sources.list>. Bugs are explained at replaced-url
2598 [22:22:25] <jhutchins> ,v llvm
2599 [22:22:26] <judd> Package: llvm on amd64 -- wheezy: 1:3.0-14+nmu2; jessie: 1:3.5-25; stretch: 1:3.8-36; buster: 1:7.0-47; sid: 1:7.0-47
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2603 [22:23:41] <jhutchins> thavlik: If there are significant features or bug fixes, you can request a backport from buster.
2604 [22:24:10] <thavlik> jhutchins, sounds like a pain in the ass
2605 [22:24:15] <thavlik> to be completely honest
2606 [22:24:30] <blackflow> thavlik: the price of stability
2607 [22:24:48] <blackflow> but once you're familiar with the process, backporting becomes rather easy
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2609 [22:25:01] <jhutchins> thavlik: The point of Debian is stable reliability, not bleeding edge development.
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2611 [22:25:48] *** Joins: AmarOk1412 (~AmarOk@replaced-ip )
2612 [22:25:51] <AmarOk1412> hi !
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2614 [22:26:17] <thavlik> jhutchins, there comes a point where stability is achieved and offering ancient software with no quick or convenient means of acquiring anything newer is simply counterproductive
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2616 [22:26:35] <AmarOk1412> Do you know where can I find the source for the .deb of gcc-6-base (6.3.0-18+deb9u1)
2617 [22:26:47] <thavlik> I'm sure manpower has more to do with it than the system itself
2618 [22:26:47] <blackflow> thavlik: right tool for the job. if you want bleeding edge, debian stable is not the right tool
2619 [22:26:55] <AmarOk1412> There is a lot of different gcc in salsa
2620 [22:27:10] <thavlik> blackflow, I want stable. I also want pre-built binaries that are less than five years old.
2621 [22:27:12] *** Joins: Barones (~Barones@replaced-ip )
2622 [22:27:13] <jhutchins> tharkun: There are ways to get newer software. If there aren't significant advantages for enough people though, there won't be a backport.
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2624 [22:27:24] <jhutchins> thavlik: ^
2625 [22:27:29] <jhutchins> tharkun: Sry.
2626 [22:27:30] <AmarOk1412> but the one which seems offical don't have anythin related to 6.3.0-18+deb9u1
2627 [22:27:55] <Tenkawa> AmarOk1412: do you have a deb-src line in sources.list
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2629 [22:28:05] <blackflow> thavlik: you have conflicting desires
2630 [22:28:11] <AmarOk1412> and packages.debian.org doesn't seem to have the .tar.gz with the sources
2631 [22:28:14] <thavlik> blackflow, not at all conflicting.
2632 [22:28:17] *** Joins: mtn (~mtn@replaced-ip )
2633 [22:28:28] <zleap> back later need to figure out what this issue is
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2635 [22:28:44] <jhutchins> thavlik: Yes, "running Debian" and "wanting the latest packages".
2636 [22:28:51] <thavlik> jhutchins, not "latest"
2637 [22:28:52] <Tenkawa> if there is you should be able to pull it that way
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2640 [22:29:43] <thavlik> jhutchins, all I am saying is that ideally it shouldn't be this risky or difficult
2641 [22:29:44] <blackflow> thavlik: llvm7 was released a few months ago. that's very much too soon for the level of stable reliability Debian aims for.
2642 [22:29:49] <blackflow> that's literally bleeding edge
2643 [22:29:54] <thavlik> blackflow, I could use older versions
2644 [22:30:02] <thavlik> blackflow, that was just the link that was sent to me
2645 [22:30:09] <jmcnaught> thavlik: Debian has always had this model. Every couple of years there's a new stable release, but then it's frozen except for security and bug fixes until the next stable release. Also the LLVM in stretch is from 2016
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2647 [22:30:25] <thavlik> blackflow, but I am speaking generally. I understand the desires of Debian. If it had more manpower, this would be less of an issue.
2648 [22:30:30] <blackflow> thavlik: well buster has 7 and it's about to be released in a few months.
2649 [22:30:31] <apteryx> blackflow: aren't there tags for new revisions (releases) ?
2650 [22:31:06] <behanw> thavlik: Or just run sid. ;)
2651 [22:31:08] *** Joins: cirilos (~cirilos@replaced-ip )
2652 [22:31:20] <thavlik> behanw, sounds like what I'll be doing
2653 [22:31:39] <behanw> I've been doing it before there was a "stable"....
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2655 [22:31:45] <blackflow> thavlik: if that's so important to you, then learn to backport yourself. it's not that hard once you get familiar with it, in fact, you'll laugh how easy it is -- assuming of course you don't have to drag down dependencies from sid or experimental
2656 [22:31:46] *** Joins: fredl (~fredl@replaced-ip )
2657 [22:31:47] * Tenkawa just wishesh asm-goto support for x86-64 would get added to llvm :(
2658 [22:31:55] *** Quits: dunix (~dunix@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2659 [22:31:59] <Tenkawa> heheheheh
2660 [22:32:00] <thavlik> blackflow, just might :)
2661 [22:32:02] <behanw> Works fine. Just don't blindly update. Gotta be smart about it
2662 [22:32:03] <thavlik> I appreciate the help
2663 [22:32:11] <thavlik> guess I'll just build llvm from source
2664 [22:32:14] <jhutchins> thavlik: sid is not recommended for regular use. You'd be better off with a different distro that's meant to be run on newer code.
2665 [22:32:15] *** Joins: himcesjf_ (~cesjf@replaced-ip )
2666 [22:32:19] <behanw> thavlik: That works too
2667 [22:32:26] *** Quits: him-cesjf (~cesjf@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
2668 [22:32:27] <thavlik> jhutchins, LOL seriously?
2669 [22:32:38] <blackflow> thavlik: also consider chroots/containers of pure sid, on otherwise stable debian, for specific purposes
2670 [22:32:41] <fredl> hi guys, I've added an IP alias to my br0 interface with the new iproute2 method (so skipping the :1 bla bla)
2671 [22:32:59] <fredl> so with 'ip a' I see the *2nd* IP now
2672 [22:33:20] <fling> rant: at first I wanted to exclude icon themes
2673 [22:33:35] <fredl> But then I added a third alias, identical syntax just different addresses, as the 2nd alias but that does not come up
2674 [22:33:43] <fling> Am I out of luck?
2675 [22:34:18] *** Joins: Ekchuan (~RandyMars@replaced-ip )
2676 [22:34:25] <thavlik> jhutchins, what distro would you recommend
2677 [22:34:37] <thavlik> I have had the most luck with debian
2678 [22:34:59] <jhutchins> thavlik: I don't really know, the debian derivatives tend to be newer.
2679 [22:35:08] <jhutchins> thavlik: There's always Gentoo.
2680 [22:35:12] <blackflow> heh
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2682 [22:35:20] *** Quits: zleap (~zleap@replaced-ip ) (Changing host)
2683 [22:35:20] *** Joins: zleap (~zleap@replaced-ip )
2684 [22:35:31] <fredl> here's my interfaces file: replaced-url
2685 [22:35:59] <fredl> So the weird thing.... the 192.168.3.1 IP does show up in 'ip a', but the 192.168.4.1 does not
2686 [22:36:12] <jhutchins> I'm at the other end of the spectrum, I run large commercial server farms, and those tend to run long-term-support releases like RHEL (10 yrs).
2687 [22:36:22] *** Quits: Gurty (~princess@replaced-ip ) (Excess Flood)
2688 [22:36:31] <jhutchins> thavlik: You might look at Fedora.
2689 [22:36:45] <fling> Should I just script something for deleting the files I don't need?
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2694 [22:37:04] <blackflow> thavlik: or ubuntu to stay within debian-ish ecosystem. they cut out of sid/unstable every 6 months on the clocl.
2695 [22:37:07] <blackflow> *clock
2696 [22:37:29] <fredl> Anybody wanna have a look what might be going wrong here?
2697 [22:38:05] <thavlik> blackflow, ubuntu is just debian + broken things :)
2698 [22:38:34] <blackflow> thavlik: which is what you get when you run sid :)
2699 [22:38:41] <phogg> Debian without the rigor.
2700 [22:39:03] *** Joins: teclo- (42@replaced-ip )
2701 [22:39:19] *** Joins: Brainium (~brainium@replaced-ip )
2702 [22:39:41] <Tenkawa> they all have their +-
2703 [22:39:59] *** Quits: srg_____ (~srgg@replaced-ip ) (Quit: srg_____)
2704 [22:40:12] <siloxid> debian has never been any rigor for me, in fact some hardware has worked better for me in the past
2705 [22:40:16] <thavlik> blackflow, I love linux more than any other OS, but this really isn't a problem on OS X or windows. And I do think it is fair to compare an open source OS to those. I think open source stands to do better than the mainstream platforms
2706 [22:40:42] *** Quits: mthe878 (~mthe@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2707 [22:40:44] <blackflow> you're comparing apples and oranges, neither osx or windows curate the packages like debian distro does
2708 [22:40:45] *** Quits: ber532k (~ber532k@replaced-ip ) (Quit: leaving)
2709 [22:40:52] <blackflow> you get bare possible OS, no applications.
2710 [22:40:59] <thavlik> *facepalms*
2711 [22:41:04] <siloxid> macOS sits in top of a good amount of open source
2712 [22:41:09] *** Quits: sdoubleyou (~sdoubleyo@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2713 [22:41:10] <thavlik> >And I do think it is fair to compare an open source OS to those
2714 [22:41:35] <thavlik> To you, it is apples and oranges being compared. To the end user, they are both competing solutions. They are compared.
2715 [22:41:40] <blackflow> still apples and oranges. there's no curated package repository for windows.
2716 [22:41:53] <thavlik> siloxid, the open source parts of mac are basically the best parts of it
2717 [22:42:10] <blackflow> you can install llvm7 on debian right now. download the tarball and uninstall it. done. just like in windows.
2718 [22:42:18] <thavlik> blackflow, and yet installing and managing 3rd party software is not as terrible as it is on debian
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2720 [22:42:22] *** Quits: soee (~soee@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
2721 [22:42:22] <cheapie> "I don't care if it's apples or oranges or whatever, I just need fruit"
2722 [22:42:26] <fredl> thavlik, blackflow - #debian-offtopic maybe?
2723 [22:42:28] <cheapie> ^ typical user
2724 [22:42:35] <thavlik> fredl, I need to get back to work :)
2725 [22:42:57] <blackflow> s/uninstall/unpack/ (lol)
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2730 [22:43:36] <Raazeer> Hey there. anyone here with some experience in lcdproc?
2731 [22:43:47] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2732 [22:43:49] <fredl> Anybody have a clue why using replaced-url
2733 [22:44:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1542
2734 [22:44:05] <Tenkawa> fredl: jut a sec
2735 [22:44:10] <Tenkawa> er just
2736 [22:44:25] <thavlik> blackflow, didn't realize they permitted that
2737 [22:44:28] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip )
2738 [22:44:32] <blackflow> fredl: you can't have multiple gateways
2739 [22:44:35] <rwp> fredl, First just pedantically please delete all of the lines that say "network" and "broadcast" as those are redundant and not needed.
2740 [22:44:49] <Raazeer> I'm trying to drive a 7-segment led display with lcdproc, basically by putting an arduino in between the max7219 and the PC to act as a smart usb port.
2741 [22:44:52] <rwp> The "netmask" line is the required bit of information there.
2742 [22:44:59] <Raazeer> now I'm wondering what driver might be useful there.
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2744 [22:45:12] *** Joins: hays (~quassel@replaced-ip )
2745 [22:45:24] <Tenkawa> he's got dupe br0 entries too
2746 [22:45:40] <rwp> fredl, +1 on blackflow's comment. Only *one* gateway please.
2747 [22:46:10] <Tenkawa> you cant do iface br0 inet static more tha once can you?
2748 [22:46:15] *** Joins: CaptainN (zelda@replaced-ip )
2749 [22:46:19] <fredl> yeah iproute2
2750 [22:46:21] <rwp> Also I believe a "iface eth0 inet manual" is desired there too.
2751 [22:46:24] <Tenkawa> ahh
2752 [22:46:28] *** Joins: upie (~upie@replaced-ip )
2753 [22:46:33] <Tenkawa> havent set it up this way yet
2754 [22:46:43] *** Parts: AmarOk1412 (~AmarOk@replaced-ip ) ("WeeChat 1.6")
2755 [22:46:46] <blackflow> Tenkawa: you can yeah
2756 [22:46:53] <fredl> Actually there's another fishy thing going on as well, when I do ifdown br0 it stays interface br0 not configured
2757 [22:46:56] *** Quits: Silmarilion (~Silmarili@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2758 [22:47:01] <rwp> Also the indentation in that file is inconsistent.
2759 [22:47:13] <fredl> anyway, yeah those gateway/network/broadcast comments, fixed to replaced-url
2760 [22:47:18] <Tenkawa> it just seems like it wouldnt parse properly
2761 [22:47:20] <fredl> Yeah fixed that too :)
2762 [22:47:27] <blackflow> fredl: replaced-url
2763 [22:47:40] <Tenkawa> how would it know what order is which
2764 [22:47:42] <blackflow> you just need one address line (cidr is okay too) for each alias
2765 [22:48:20] <rwp> As an oh, by the by, not the problem here but instead of a separate netmask line saying "address 192.168.178.2/24" in CIDR style is fully supported. I prefer it. It just makes for a more compactly described file that way.
2766 [22:49:07] *** Quits: siloxid (~user@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2767 [22:49:16] <fredl> alrite, trimmed down even further to replaced-url
2768 [22:49:30] * Tenkawa remembers when he use to have to calculate subnet masks and gateways by hand
2769 [22:49:37] <Tenkawa> oh that was fun
2770 [22:49:40] <Tenkawa> not
2771 [22:49:47] <fredl> yes lots of fun :)
2772 [22:50:12] <rwp> Additionally I think you should add "iface eth0 inet manual" as well.
2773 [22:50:18] <blackflow> thavlik: "permitted"? nobody prevents you from doing that. that's why you're comparing apples and oranges. the linux ecosystem opted for shared lib, curated repository approach, that does not exclude anyone form downloading and unpackinga tarball that installs everything, like in windows, so you end up with a gazillion of openssl libs each vulnerable and each in its own C:\Program Files\Foo Bar Baz\
2774 [22:50:24] <blackflow> directory
2775 [22:51:09] *** Joins: nmeal (gnealz@replaced-ip )
2776 [22:51:11] <rwp> fredl, In your latest you need to add /24 to the secondary interface sections. "address 192.168.4.1/24".
2777 [22:51:28] <blackflow> I'd do it in the first one as well
2778 [22:51:31] <fredl> Hmm, really on the 'manual' bit? It brings up br0 just fine this way, so I don't know if after removing a bunch of redundant information I should go and re-add other redundant info?
2779 [22:51:46] <fredl> ah rwp, ok
2780 [22:52:18] <fredl> that makes sense, that's how it decides on netmask/broadcast etc.
2781 [22:52:24] <blackflow> yup
2782 [22:52:43] *** Quits: cdown (~cdown@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 246 seconds)
2783 [22:52:43] <fredl> the thing that kinda baffles me....
2784 [22:53:03] <fredl> using this config file, ifdown br0 stays br0 not configured
2785 [22:53:21] <rwp> fredl, Personally I prefer the method of adding additional IP addresses using "up" and "down" commands such as described in replaced-url
2786 [22:53:21] <fredl> So it's kinda hard to test changes if you can't bring it down/up
2787 [22:53:30] *** Joins: pringau (~pringau@replaced-ip )
2788 [22:54:11] <blackflow> maybe flush it first. ip addr flush br0
2789 [22:54:12] <fredl> rwp - yeah I tried to google for that but there's so much old info that the new way doesn't show up so much
2790 [22:54:16] <rwp> fredl, That error you are getting about "not configured" is a clue. I don't know what it means. But it is a clue.
2791 [22:54:31] <fredl> fsck
2792 [22:54:40] *** Quits: nibble_zero (~nibble_ze@replaced-ip ) (Quit: nibble_zero)
2793 [22:54:42] <fredl> I just axed my iface :P brb
2794 [22:54:52] <blackflow> oh that was remote?
2795 [22:55:10] <rwp> A reboot a day keeps the networking at bay...
2796 [22:55:16] <blackflow> tsk tsk tsk tsk tsk.... *shakes head* more tsk tsk tsk tsk.
2797 [22:55:47] <thavlik> blackflow, if you want to nitpick my grammar, that's fine. But I am not missing the conceptual difference between linux and other operating systems.
2798 [22:56:15] <rwp> fredl, Long ago a wise admin hinted me to start a "sleep 300 && shutdown -r now" in another login session so that if I didn't get back to kill it the system would automatically reboot. In the case that I killed the connection to it. That has been an invaluable hint to me in the time since.
2799 [22:56:33] <rwp> However that assumes that the files on disk are bootable. Otherwise it is rescue-mode FTW.
2800 [22:56:46] *** Quits: aruna (~aruna11@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2801 [22:56:53] <blackflow> rwp: not that wise, was he. why reboot? just reset the network
2802 [22:56:57] *** Quits: manjeet (uid343474@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2803 [22:57:16] <blackflow> the _wise_ thing to do is run commands without permanentizing them in e/n/i. and if everything works, make it permanent.
2804 [22:57:18] <rwp> blackflow, If using the network to log into a remote system and the networking is broken then one can't just reset the network.
2805 [22:57:32] <blackflow> becuase if you fskc up, then on reboot you'll end up in the same, fsked up config
2806 [22:57:34] <rwp> I agree with the last thing you said completely.
2807 [22:57:35] <Tenkawa> or even better.... have a remote console
2808 [22:57:52] *** Quits: a_l_b (~a_l_b@replaced-ip ) (Quit: a_l_b)
2809 [22:58:01] <blackflow> rwp: yes one can. run in tmux so network resets don't break the resetting shell
2810 [22:58:16] <rwp> What I am astounded by is that some of the 800lb gorillas such as AWS do not support a remote console.
2811 [22:58:18] <blackflow> I've only done it a gazillion times, what do I know.
2812 [22:58:27] <jhutchins> ~Actually, I don't usually loose ssh sessions on network restart.
2813 [22:58:51] <rwp> blackflow, I agree. I always use tmux/screen for that. But that has nothing to do with disconnecting yourself from the system and being unable to connect to it.
2814 [22:59:21] <karlpinc> thavlik: The "secret sauce" in linux is that with linux you can get _all_ your software from your distro. The distro does the systems integration and makes sure everything works together. And stays working. See also footnote 1 of: replaced-url
2815 [22:59:22] *** Joins: mthe878 (~mthe@replaced-ip )
2816 [22:59:22] <rwp> For example try "ifdown $IFACE" and then try bringing it back up remotely.
2817 [22:59:33] <blackflow> jhutchins: depends on what you do. if the routing table, flow hashmap is not flushed, then it shouldn't break connection
2818 [23:00:04] <Tenkawa> I still havent tried out tmux much yet to see if I'd rather use it
2819 [23:00:13] <Tenkawa> I've been using screen so long
2820 [23:00:15] *** Quits: fredl (~fredl@replaced-ip ) (Disconnected by services)
2821 [23:00:23] *** Joins: fredl (~fredl@replaced-ip )
2822 [23:00:25] <blackflow> rwp: ifdown iface ; sleep 2 ; ifup iface ? oh yeah if you brek it, nogo, but reboot will end up in a working config, unless you broke e/n/i
2823 [23:00:32] *** Joins: fredl_ (~fredl@replaced-ip )
2824 [23:00:35] <fredl> back again :)
2825 [23:00:43] *** Joins: T3RM1N41_ (~73rm1n41@replaced-ip )
2826 [23:00:58] *** Joins: Alprazolam (~Linux@replaced-ip )
2827 [23:01:03] <fredl> And... weirdest thing, I now have 192.168.4.1 but nothing changed it seems
2828 [23:01:06] *** Quits: Makaveli7 (~Makaveli7@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2829 [23:01:20] *** Joins: Makaveli7 (~Makaveli7@replaced-ip )
2830 [23:01:20] <rwp> Tenkawa, I have been using screen forever. A while back I decided to test drive tmux. I can tell you that I really like tmux. It is better.
2831 [23:01:20] *** Quits: booyah (~bb@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2832 [23:01:20] <rwp> fredl,
2833 [23:01:28] <fredl> yes?
2834 [23:01:31] *** Quits: YottaiQ (~YottaiQ@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2835 [23:01:31] <rwp> fredl, We have been having a nice discussion about resuming from broken network connections while you were away.
2836 [23:01:41] <Tenkawa> rwp: I might give it a go soon
2837 [23:01:44] *** Quits: GNU\colossus (~colo@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Bye.)
2838 [23:01:44] *** Quits: volter (~volter@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2839 [23:01:47] <fredl> yeah but I'm on laptop downstairs now
2840 [23:02:02] <Tenkawa> it support serial ports still right?
2841 [23:02:07] <fredl> so nothing to resume as I was upstairs earlier, server is in garage
2842 [23:02:18] *** Joins: booyah (~bb@replaced-ip )
2843 [23:02:31] <fredl> Oh, I've used 'screen' for decades :)
2844 [23:02:34] <Tenkawa> I need to be able to access my ttl bridge on my pi's
2845 [23:02:42] <rwp> That isn't a garage! That is your datacenter in the adjacent structure.
2846 [23:02:43] <Tenkawa> fredl: indeed
2847 [23:02:56] *** Quits: hele (~hele@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2848 [23:02:58] <fredl> usually just to start up long running things before going home from office
2849 [23:03:23] *** Quits: HugsWontletgo (~HugsWontl@replaced-ip ) (Quit: leaving)
2850 [23:04:04] <Tenkawa> I'm just not a very graphical person in general... give me terminal based sessions anyday
2851 [23:04:06] <fredl> rwp - you right man, I call it a micro-datacenter to paying customers. Here on #debian I have some more modesty though
2852 [23:04:29] *** Joins: GNU\colossus (~colo@replaced-ip )
2853 [23:04:51] <rwp> Tenkawa, When you test drive tmux plan to spend an afternoon twiddling with things. Like screen it is not friendly out of the box. Such as the escape character. And once you start playing with it you will burn through a few hours twiddling things to your liking. It will suck you in.
2854 [23:04:55] <fredl> Since on here some people have more hardware sitting next to their desk than me in my rack in the garage
2855 [23:05:38] *** Joins: \\Mr_C\\ (mrc@replaced-ip )
2856 [23:05:58] <karlpinc> fredl: Surely it's not a datacenter in your garage any more. It's a cloud, eh?
2857 [23:06:13] <rwp> Indeed there are quite varied people and experiences here. Debian is The Universal Operating System! :-)
2858 [23:06:23] <Tenkawa> rwp: yeah I've got my screen config setup all with 1 change.. I dont see this being too bad heheheh
2859 [23:06:50] <rwp> karlpinc, Nah... The cloud is just someone else's computer. These are fredl's computers. Not someone else's. :-)
2860 [23:07:21] <blackflow> "Cloud" is so 2018. It's all about Serverless(tm) now.
2861 [23:07:33] <Tenkawa> and that change is just to accomodate two control characters (one on my host and oe on my serial to usb attached bridge )
2862 [23:07:34] <rwp> Anyway... fredl? How are things for you with all of the updates? Good? Bad?
2863 [23:08:22] <Tenkawa> anyone think that folding phone is going to be a bit hit?
2864 [23:08:23] *** Quits: mthe878 (~mthe@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2865 [23:08:32] *** Joins: aruna (~aruna11@replaced-ip )
2866 [23:08:37] *** Quits: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2867 [23:08:56] *** Quits: jfoy (~jfoy@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2868 [23:09:22] <rwp> It's a fad. It will pass. The real future is in dialing shoe phones...
2869 [23:09:45] <Tenkawa> hah
2870 [23:10:12] <Tenkawa> cant believe what happened to the one guys
2871 [23:10:21] *** Joins: davis (~davis@replaced-ip )
2872 [23:10:23] <davis> hello
2873 [23:11:07] <davis> i have a laptop which was running gnome desktop fine. I did an update and now, a login session appears but xindows seems to hang.
2874 [23:11:26] *** Quits: xormor (~xormor@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2875 [23:11:29] <davis> i tried to dpkg-reconfigure the xserver drivers but the problem persists
2876 [23:11:32] <thavlik> karlpinc, I get that! And I think it's actually a great system. Large corporations have the resources to spend in managing their official software updates. The observation I was making is that the current system may not be servicing end users in a way they want to be serviced. I suppose Debian succeeds wildly at what it does, and perhaps I should be running a different distro.
2877 [23:11:38] <davis> any idea what I should try next?
2878 [23:12:11] *** Quits: towo` (~towo@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2879 [23:12:13] <davis> if I simply run xstart it will hang as well.
2880 [23:12:27] *** Quits: cliluw (~cliluw@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2881 [23:12:34] <Tenkawa> how did you update?
2882 [23:12:37] <davis> if I try to reconfigure Xorg it says X is already running. i am guessing that is the login
2883 [23:12:39] *** Joins: Gyro (~user@replaced-ip )
2884 [23:12:56] *** Joins: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip )
2885 [23:12:57] <davis> apt-get update/upgrade but it had been a while since I did this.
2886 [23:13:24] <davis> at one point it had some packages which were reported as no longer being used so I did the autoremove.
2887 [23:13:42] <davis> if I do ctrl-alt f2, i can get to a console login
2888 [23:13:57] <Tenkawa> ok.. if you can login
2889 [23:14:02] <Tenkawa> do that first
2890 [23:14:02] *** Quits: tvm (~tvm@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
2891 [23:14:09] <davis> after i login the main terminal just has a blank screen
2892 [23:14:20] <Tenkawa> hit f1
2893 [23:14:24] <Tenkawa> er
2894 [23:14:27] <Tenkawa> alt f1
2895 [23:14:28] *** Joins: cliluw (~cliluw@replaced-ip )
2896 [23:14:37] <davis> im logged into the terminal on alt-f2
2897 [23:14:41] <karlpinc> thavlik: I came in late and am not sure what you're trying to do, but you're free to run anything on top of debian. There are a variety of ways of installing 3rd party software. We can help you with the tools that try to keep 3rd party software from breaking debian. But once you get past the point of asking for help with the underlying debian you're on your own when it comes to help with whatever it is that's broken in the software
2898 [23:14:41] <karlpinc> you've put on top of debian.
2899 [23:14:42] <davis> alt-f1 is blank
2900 [23:14:48] <Tenkawa> ahh ok good
2901 [23:14:57] <Tenkawa> sudo apt-get updat
2902 [23:14:59] <Tenkawa> sudo apt-get update
2903 [23:15:10] <Tenkawa> if not root
2904 [23:15:34] <davis> fwiw this a laptop with a nvidia/intel card which i never got to work with bummblebee or primus (i think that was what it called.)
2905 [23:15:44] <Tenkawa> ahhhh
2906 [23:15:52] <davis> i think i was running xwindows in intel mode
2907 [23:15:55] <Tenkawa> it could be the firmware
2908 [23:16:00] <karlpinc> thavlik: People want a pony. There's only so much that can be done for them.
2909 [23:16:17] *** Quits: square_batman (ajude@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2910 [23:16:30] <Tenkawa> that linux needs the new binay blob and the config tweaks
2911 [23:16:51] <davis> apt-get upgrade says four packages are held back, but none of them are x related
2912 [23:16:53] <Tenkawa> this part I cant help with since I dont know the config
2913 [23:16:56] *** Quits: painted (~fainted@replaced-ip ) (Quit: ...)
2914 [23:17:14] <blackflow> mmmmmmh Buster: nginx + openssl 1.1.1 = TLSv1.3
2915 [23:17:15] *** Joins: encod3 (~encod3@replaced-ip )
2916 [23:17:22] <davis> im not worried about the nviida, just trying to get back to intel mode
2917 [23:17:25] <Tenkawa> ps auxreplaced-url
2918 [23:17:35] <Tenkawa> any processes running
2919 [23:17:36] <Tenkawa> ?
2920 [23:17:45] <davis> yes
2921 [23:17:47] <davis> two
2922 [23:18:01] *** Quits: relaxed (~relaxed@replaced-ip ) (Quit: â â µ)
2923 [23:18:07] <davis> one is Debian owner and is /usr/lib/xorg/Xorg vt1
2924 [23:18:20] <davis> the other is the grep
2925 [23:18:23] <Tenkawa> yeah definitely going to need to talk to someone who knows a little more about the optimus setup
2926 [23:18:36] <thavlik> karlpinc, I was trying to install from sid. I am unsatisfied with doing so being considered dangerous/discouraged - it doesn't seem like it should be. Debian's stability due to its package manager's complexity
2927 [23:18:38] <Tenkawa> sorry I couldnt help more
2928 [23:18:52] <davis> i think it can be done without optimus.
2929 [23:19:07] <davis> i think that is only if you want to enable nvidia
2930 [23:19:25] <davis> which i had abandoned hence it was in regular intel cpu builtin video mode
2931 [23:19:28] <karlpinc> thavlik: Have you tried self-backporting? What package?
2932 [23:19:29] <Tenkawa> yes but theres things specific to the config you have to do to "disable"
2933 [23:19:32] <Tenkawa> it too
2934 [23:19:49] <davis> if I try to run Xorg -configure it will fail since X is running
2935 [23:20:02] <fling> libGL error: failed to load driver: i915
2936 [23:20:12] <fling> Which package to install for libgl? mesa something?
2937 [23:20:27] <Tenkawa> do you get a grub boot up prompt
2938 [23:20:37] <Tenkawa> davis:
2939 [23:21:13] <Tenkawa> if so bring it up into rescue mode and that will start it up without X
2940 [23:21:30] <davis> ok one moment
2941 [23:21:56] *** Joins: n1ce (~n1ce@replaced-ip )
2942 [23:22:06] *** Quits: devbaka (~devbaka@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2943 [23:22:17] *** Quits: areyouloco (~areyouloc@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving.)
2944 [23:22:26] <davis> lol, when i move arrow keys it starts up rather than selecting a differnt boot mode
2945 [23:22:28] *** Joins: devbaka (~devbaka@replaced-ip )
2946 [23:22:32] <thavlik> karlpinc, that will probably be what I do. It's llvm 7
2947 [23:22:44] *** Quits: Raazeer (~Raazeer@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2948 [23:23:15] *** Joins: relaxed (~relaxed@replaced-ip )
2949 [23:23:30] <Tenkawa> davis: the key mappings are different
2950 [23:24:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1536
2951 [23:24:59] <Tenkawa> when the menu comes up immediately hit escape if it happens again
2952 [23:25:37] <davis> ok one morment
2953 [23:25:42] <karlpinc> ,checkbackport llvm
2954 [23:25:43] <judd> Backporting package llvm in sid→stretch/amd64: all build-dependencies satisfied using stretch.
2955 [23:26:01] <karlpinc> !tell thavlik about ssb
2956 [23:26:01] <Tenkawa> that should in theory stop th boot
2957 [23:26:14] *** Quits: alexandros_c (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2958 [23:26:15] *** Quits: alexandros_tab (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
2959 [23:26:32] <davis> nope, but fwiw, i dont see a rescue option.
2960 [23:26:42] <davis> so cant dork with that.
2961 [23:26:48] <Tenkawa> its under advanced
2962 [23:26:55] *** Joins: flokuehn (~flokuehn@replaced-ip )
2963 [23:26:56] <davis> ahh
2964 [23:27:06] <karlpinc> ,checkbackport llvm-runtime
2965 [23:27:07] <judd> Backporting package llvm-runtime in sid→stretch/amd64: all build-dependencies satisfied using stretch.
2966 [23:27:15] <Tenkawa> but heres what we can do
2967 [23:27:22] <karlpinc> thavlik: Should be very straightforward to self-backport.
2968 [23:27:28] <Tenkawa> boot it to grub
2969 [23:27:33] <fling> Which package for mesa?
2970 [23:27:42] *** Quits: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2971 [23:27:45] <Tenkawa> when the menu comes up immediately hit e
2972 [23:28:06] <fling> libglu1-mesa ?
2973 [23:28:15] *** Joins: lek (~lek@replaced-ip )
2974 [23:28:20] *** Joins: alexandros_tab (~quassel@replaced-ip )
2975 [23:28:36] *** Joins: alexandros_c (~quassel@replaced-ip )
2976 [23:28:40] <Tenkawa> we'll edit the current one and make it manually boot into single user
2977 [23:28:49] <Tenkawa> on the fly
2978 [23:28:49] *** Joins: xcm (~xcm@replaced-ip )
2979 [23:29:05] *** Joins: GaneshR (~ganeshraj@replaced-ip )
2980 [23:29:17] <davis> hmm, e does not stop it either. i think by the time my external monitor comes to life its already sarted
2981 [23:29:31] <Tenkawa> well darn
2982 [23:29:33] <davis> could i not just simply service stop the X login?
2983 [23:29:44] <Tenkawa> yeah
2984 [23:29:51] <Tenkawa> in theory
2985 [23:29:53] <Tenkawa> heheheh
2986 [23:30:12] <rant> fling: there are lots of packages for mesa.. there is the x driver, app support libraries, etc
2987 [23:30:42] <Tenkawa> fling: what was the error?
2988 [23:31:03] <rant> you're looking at the error
2989 [23:31:26] <rant> its likely the user in this "special" case :P
2990 [23:31:54] *** Quits: Haudegen (~quassel@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2991 [23:32:18] *** Joins: Sollg3r (~ejakuk@replaced-ip )
2992 [23:32:28] <Tenkawa> whats he "trying" to fix?
2993 [23:32:32] *** Quits: fedorafan (~fedorafan@replaced-ip ) (Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…)
2994 [23:33:01] <rant> not trying to fix.. trying to break.. last I heard they were trying to install unknown packages without getting anything large like icon themes..
2995 [23:33:24] <rant> vague, silly, ideas..
2996 [23:33:26] *** Joins: Zewwy (~zem@replaced-ip )
2997 [23:33:36] <Zewwy> can someone help me this SecAPT thing is driving me nuts
2998 [23:33:48] *** Quits: rpifan (~rpifan@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
2999 [23:33:54] <Zewwy> replaced-url
3000 [23:33:54] <Tenkawa> ahh
3001 [23:33:56] <rant> took so long to respond I'd been sound asleep for hours by time they said anything
3002 [23:34:09] <Zewwy> I'm following this and when i run apt update I get keyring uissues and this guide isn't covering it
3003 [23:34:54] *** Quits: pvdp (~pvdp@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3004 [23:35:32] <fling> rant: Tenkawa: installed xserver-xorg-video-intel and the error gone.
3005 [23:35:35] *** Joins: shibboleth (~shibbolet@replaced-ip )
3006 [23:36:29] <fling> rant: exactly the user, the problem is I can't find the proper package because of so many different mesa things in apt cache
3007 [23:36:44] <fling> rant: I used to gentoo where I have a single mesa package.
3008 [23:36:58] <fling> Tenkawa: I had no mesa :P
3009 [23:37:12] <Tenkawa> ah
3010 [23:37:13] *** Joins: pvdp (~pvdp@replaced-ip )
3011 [23:37:19] <Zewwy> anyone any idea how to pass SecAPT
3012 [23:37:27] <fling> How do I skip deps? Not possible?
3013 [23:37:29] *** Joins: sayi (~sayi@replaced-ip )
3014 [23:37:35] <karlpinc> Zewwy: The easy way to install zoneminder on debian stretch is to enable the debian backports repo and install from that.
3015 [23:37:36] <Tenkawa> Zewwy: just a sec
3016 [23:38:01] *** Quits: zleap (~zleap@replaced-ip ) (Quit: WeeChat 2.4)
3017 [23:38:10] <Zewwy> karlpinc: why is the wiki not updated with a nice easy tut
3018 [23:38:21] <rant> fling: thats probably because gentoo builds everything from source.. here you have a binary distribution and a single source tree can yeild many different binary packages
3019 [23:38:22] <karlpinc> Zewwy: Upi
3020 [23:39:01] <fling> rant: right.
3021 [23:39:04] <karlpinc> You'd have to ask them. I haven't read it. Do they want you to install the latest and greatest? If so then you need to go to them for support because adding random repos into debian makes your distro not-debian any more.
3022 [23:39:32] <Zewwy> I'm just following the guides
3023 [23:39:39] <Zewwy> its their depdancy requirements
3024 [23:39:47] <Zewwy> that use packages the default debain repos clearly dont have
3025 [23:39:49] <fling> rant: what is wrong with me trying to skip installing icon themes?
3026 [23:39:51] <Tenkawa> cheers all. gotta run
3027 [23:39:55] *** Quits: cirilos (~cirilos@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3028 [23:39:58] <karlpinc> Zewwy: You still might be able to get _some_ help here. It depends on whether the guides have you replace pieces of actual debian.
3029 [23:40:02] *** Quits: Tenkawa (~Tenkawa@replaced-ip ) (Quit: leaving)
3030 [23:40:24] <Zewwy> there is a section about the keys lets see if i can follow that
3031 [23:40:51] <karlpinc> Zewwy: If you install from debian backports you will only install dependencies that debian has.
3032 [23:40:51] *** Joins: Penguin__ (~xwQ5kwYl6@replaced-ip )
3033 [23:41:05] <karlpinc> !tell Zewwy about frankendebian
3034 [23:41:08] <rant> fling: an if an icon theme is being installed its because one is required.. things that display icons require a theme or all the icons would just be the default white icon with a red X
3035 [23:41:31] <rant> fling: in a binary dependency based distro, you have to install or satisfy the dependencies of a package somehow
3036 [23:41:43] *** Quits: Penguin_ (~xwQ5kwYl6@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 258 seconds)
3037 [23:41:49] <Zewwy> if there a better guiode then what I shared I'm all ears
3038 [23:42:12] <Zewwy> this is the main thing I don't liek about linux... its such a mixed bag
3039 [23:42:28] <karlpinc> Zewwy: You want to get support from debian first, and if that fails go to the original authors and if that fails get advice from random strangers.
3040 [23:42:46] <karlpinc> !tell Zewwy about backports
3041 [23:42:55] <Zewwy> ok dokie
3042 [23:43:05] <Zewwy> so seem zonminder on debian 9 is impossible to do "clean"
3043 [23:43:14] <karlpinc> Zewwy: Just ask here with more questions.
3044 [23:43:32] *** Joins: mvaenskae (~mvaenskae@replaced-ip )
3045 [23:43:34] <Zewwy> man if i could do Apt install zoneminder and it just freaking worked
3046 [23:43:39] <Zewwy> I'd be one ahppy guy
3047 [23:43:50] <Zewwy> maybe linux will one day be that good
3048 [23:43:56] *** Joins: fedorafan (~fedorafan@replaced-ip )
3049 [23:44:00] <karlpinc> Zewwy: The backported zoneminder is "clean", in that if you use it you'll be able to upgrade your debian to the next major release. (If you follow the instructions in the release notes.) What does "clean" mean to you?
3050 [23:44:13] *** Quits: hipp (~hipp@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3051 [23:44:15] <rant> ,v zoneminder
3052 [23:44:16] <judd> Package: zoneminder on amd64 -- wheezy: 1.25.0-4; wheezy-security: 1.25.0-4+deb7u2; jessie-multimedia: 1.28.1-dmo10; jessie-backports: 1.29.0+dfsg-1~bpo8+1; stretch-backports: 1.30.4+dfsg-2~bpo9+1; sid: 1.30.4+dfsg1-5; experimental: 1.32.3-1; buster: 1.32.3-2; stretch-multimedia: 2:1.30.4-dmo1+deb9u2; buster-multimedia: 2:1.32.3-dmo2; sid-multimedia: 2:1.32.3-dmo2
3053 [23:44:20] <Zewwy> a guide that is easy to follow and supported
3054 [23:44:20] <fling> rant: on gentoo there is 1. 'provided' mechanism using which I could just add packages I don't want to package.provided file and they will not be installed.
3055 [23:44:34] <Zewwy> without Effing with keyrings and third party repos
3056 [23:44:42] <karlpinc> Zewwy: You need to enable the backports repo. Then install following the backports instuctions.
3057 [23:44:57] <Zewwy> karlpinc: is there any simple guide on that
3058 [23:45:01] <Zewwy> im a newbie at this stuff
3059 [23:45:03] <fling> rant: and also there is 2. install mask mechanism using which I could add paths or globs of things I don't want to INSTALL_MASK
3060 [23:45:17] <fling> rant: for example INSTALL_MASK="bash-completion gnustep-4.sh lib32 opt systemd"
3061 [23:45:31] *** Quits: star314 (~star314@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
3062 [23:45:44] <karlpinc> Zewwy: replaced-url
3063 [23:45:51] <rant> fling: yes because gentoo is a SOURCE distribution you are compiling things from scratch and can leave things out.. debian is a BINARY distribution.. so those dependencies are already compiled in.. if you wanna rebuild packages from source, you're welcome to
3064 [23:45:54] <fling> rant: both things work for binary packages…
3065 [23:46:10] *** Quits: aruna (~aruna11@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
3066 [23:46:10] <Zewwy> thanks
3067 [23:46:11] <Zewwy> reading now
3068 [23:46:25] *** Quits: Sollg3r (~ejakuk@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3069 [23:46:25] <fling> rant: I don't think so. It is not related to SOURCE.
3070 [23:46:46] <rant> fling: whatever.. then I suggest you go use gentoo.. we dont do things like this.. it'd break things
3071 [23:46:49] *** Parts: izh_ (~denis@replaced-ip ) ()
3072 [23:47:01] *** Joins: Guest74644 (~francois@replaced-ip )
3073 [23:47:08] <jhutchins> LFS!
3074 [23:47:13] <rant> here you install packages AND their dependencies, or you se equivs and satisfy them another way
3075 [23:47:17] <fling> rant: both features available for binary packages in portage, binary packages you precompiled and proprietary packages missing sources. Also both features are available for binary gentoo based distros.
3076 [23:47:28] <fling> rant: ok, thanks for info!
3077 [23:47:33] <fling> I wanted to use debian!!
3078 [23:47:53] <karlpinc> Zewwy: FYI. It is often helpful to read the README.Debian file, especially for daemons and the like.
3079 [23:48:08] <karlpinc> !tell Zewwy about readme.debian
3080 [23:48:19] <rant> do you use your bathtub as a toilet, and your blender as a fishtank?
3081 [23:50:19] <fling> rant: I really don't see how skipping deps or installed files is related to _source_ distro.
3082 [23:50:28] <fling> debian could build from sources too I think
3083 [23:50:32] *** Joins: Sollg3r (~ejakuk@replaced-ip )
3084 [23:50:36] <fling> and gentoo could install binary packages
3085 [23:51:24] <phogg> fling: building from source on Debian is fairly easy, just not 100% automatic. Once built it would be chaos if you could pick and choose which bits of a package got installed. That way lies broken.
3086 [23:51:38] *** Quits: gugaua (~gugaua@replaced-ip ) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3087 [23:51:50] <rant> because if I compile foo against libbar and then package it so that foo-1.0 depends on libbar-1.0 and you install foo without libbar, not only have you broken the system that resolves package dependencies but now you can't run /usr/bin/foo without a segfault or such
3088 [23:52:11] <Zewwy> readmes fine
3089 [23:52:21] <Zewwy> but I'm mostly in particulary interested in zoneminder
3090 [23:52:25] <fling> rant: the same will happen on gentoo too.
3091 [23:52:35] <Zewwy> and it techincally avaiable on other distros, I just picked debian cause stablity
3092 [23:52:35] <rant> its not possible to sanely install binary package without breakage
3093 [23:52:35] *** Joins: jfoy (~jfoy@replaced-ip )
3094 [23:52:37] <fling> phogg: ok, not going to do so
3095 [23:52:38] <Zewwy> I liek that
3096 [23:52:51] <fling> rant: I agree
3097 [23:53:09] <karlpinc> Zewwy: Me too. Just install it from backports. There's 1 file to edit and 3 commands to run.
3098 [23:53:12] *** Quits: jmarsac (~jmarsac@replaced-ip##) (Quit: Nettalk6 - ##replaced-url
3099 [23:53:23] <Zewwy> Epic Thankx
3100 [23:53:50] <rant> fling: in debian, we dont do or support such idiotic things.. if someone insists on this, we tell them to use equivs.. it creates a metapackage which "provides" whatever is needed so the package manager is happy, then its up to you to actually satisfy the program's need for whatever it is through some other means
3101 [23:54:00] <karlpinc> Zewwy: I mention it because it's possible that the zoneminder package in backports has a README.Debian.
3102 [23:54:13] <Zewwy> ahhh good to know, thanks again
3103 [23:55:11] <karlpinc> Zewwy: After you setup to install one thing from backports you can install further things with a single command.
3104 [23:56:04] <rant> fling: read over the Why Debian? replaced-url
3105 [23:56:23] *** Quits: Ekchuan (~RandyMars@replaced-ip##) (Quit: Textual IRC Client: ##replaced-url
3106 [23:56:31] <fling> ok sounds fair
3107 [23:57:32] *** Quits: encod3 (~encod3@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
3108 [23:58:19] *** Quits: Sollg3r (~ejakuk@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3109 [23:59:37] *** Quits: Gyro (~user@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
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