13[00:13:21] <ardualabs> Greets - I'm on stretch 9, and got an Intuos CTL4100. The kernel seems to detect the device just fine (dmesg, lsmod | grep wacom # and so on) but when I get into X11 it's not showing as a viable tablet (sidenote: Using cinnamon)
14[00:13:36] *** Quits: Okee (~Gigglebyt@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
24[00:16:26] <ardualabs> Shooting from the hip, but in ye olde days, sometimes on multinic systems I ran into eth0 enumerating differently from one boot to the next (rare) and things definitely get weird if you add an interface (esp. in virtuals or hot-add situations)
29[00:19:35] <ardualabs> fwiw, centos and others are doing the same.
30[00:19:56] <de-facto> i dont even understand where that 3 comes from, i dont like it
31[00:20:43] <de-facto> GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX="net.ifnames=0 biosdevname=0" with "grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg" and changing /etc/network/interfaces from ens3 to eth0 seems to do the trick
86[01:06:29] <de-facto> btw what is the difference between stretch-updates and stretch/updates?
87[01:07:05] <cheapie> That first one gets you "normal" updates and the second one (note the debian-security) is for security updates.
88[01:07:08] <somiaj> one is security (stretch/updates) the others is previews of pacakages before they get put into a point release, mostly just bug fixes
89[01:08:07] <cheapie> You can leave out the stretch-updates one if you want, just don't expect too many bug fixes and stuff if you do that. Don't leave out either of the other two.
124[01:39:57] <Pegasus_RPG> Hello. My system froze completely (even the kernel) so I had to power-cycle it. Now LibreOffice has lost my preferences, recent documents, etc. Where are they stored on the official backported LibO 6.x package for Stretch?
125[01:40:12] <Pegasus_RPG> (I suspect there's a file lock or something.)
141[01:58:54] <rant> Pegasus_RPG: more than likely all your settings are in ~/.config/libreoffice/ how can you be sure the kernel froze? Did you try pressing numlock see if the light came on? Try a sysrq command?
142[02:01:05] *** Quits: de-facto (~de-facto@replaced-ip) (Quit: See you around.)
193[02:20:31] <mefistofeles> that is, if bios I guess
194[02:20:40] * iflema nods
195[02:21:01] <iflema> bs= even
196[02:21:07] <michael2> I typed it, then realised, it was a mistake, so I then used a zsh trick to run `lsblk' to see what the correct /dev/* identifier was - then forgot I had command sitting at command line. Momentarily lapse of concentration - hit <Enter>
197[02:21:26] <mefistofeles> ouch xD, tough luck
198[02:21:48] <michael2> iflema: yes /sda is my only hard disk
199[02:21:54] <iflema> !next
200[02:21:54] <dpkg> Another happy customer leaves the building.
209[02:27:39] <michael2> So this system won't reboot again. but Im guessing I can continue to use the current in-memory system to get files backed up. to prepare for another OS reinstall?
216[02:32:34] <michael2> so I need to get files and data copied off this system. is there anyway I can check whether I killed blocks belonging to those files? i.e. files whose inodes pointed to to blocks I just wiped? or do I just assume all files on this system are corrupted?
218[02:36:10] <ardualabs> if you haven't wiped all the backup blocks on sda...
219[02:36:18] <ardualabs> assuming you're ext4?
220[02:37:05] <ardualabs> but that's some pretty darn fiddly business. I'd personally just backup, and see what's left when you have a stable system again.
222[02:37:24] <Pegasus_RPG> rant: yes and yes, neither responded. (This happens somewhat regularly on this computer, about once a week if I never reboot it.)
223[02:37:27] <ardualabs> assuming any of the utils you would need to copy things around haven't gotten munged.
244[02:52:40] <rant> Pegasus_RPG: sounds like you need to replace the user if you keep letting something like that happen.
245[02:53:20] <michael2> when I set the hard disk up I just used the debian installer's option of using a LVM with full disk encryption. can anyone how understands how that lays out the partitions explain what data is contained in the first 34MB of this device? replaced-url
270[03:18:58] <goose> I've got a headless home server which I want to set up system encryption on (basically everything except /boot). I've found various guides when google'ing how to do this, but they mention different methods/programs for encryption. What's the "standard"/go-to encryption software I should be looking at using?
302[03:41:13] <rue_> I'm trying to collect spambot information, I need to have a count of around 22 or more people in a channel that dosn't matter, could I get some volunteers to join #gnaatrap?
308[03:42:26] <AciD`> hey guys, anybody knows if a updated version of the 'Understanding Debian, the universal operating system' image has been released somewhere? (see replaced-url
325[03:55:35] <rant> I'm not a betting man, but if I were, I'm willing to bet out of 1297 users on IRC as you say, you're the only one who ever knew that existed :p
326[03:56:08] *** Quits: sulit (~sulit@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
327[03:56:25] <rant> cause I been using Debian SINCE Potato, and been here about that long too (about 15 years) and I never seen it before
331[03:57:40] <KelinerALOC> Wow, 15 years are longer than I have lived...
332[03:58:05] <rant> that really only says, we put a lot of time and effort into making nice looking material nobody will use for anything but to act impressed at how much time we spend doing such things
333[03:58:35] <rant> KelinerALOC: sorry to hear that, what do you make of this planet? :P
340[04:02:01] <rant> KelinerALOC: well, you ok then, or you need help with something?
341[04:02:03] *** Quits: Tom__ (~Tom-_@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
342[04:02:24] <somiaj> funny the image suggests testing for 'general users'
343[04:02:34] <rant> yeah that rubbed me the wrong way too
344[04:02:55] *** Quits: Andocromn (~quassel@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
345[04:03:00] <KelinerALOC> rant I am here for loneliness? Linux is cool.
346[04:03:27] <rant> KelinerALOC: ah ok, well maybe check out #debian-offtopic and hang out here to learn more ;)
347[04:04:32] <KelinerALOC> rant You're right :)
348[04:05:07] <rant> KelinerALOC: I'm just glad you weren't gonna say you needed help collecting the debt we (US) owe China.. cause I was gonna refer you to that big orange moron..
349[04:06:14] <rant> KelinerALOC: even a broken clock is right twice a day.
374[04:10:55] <rant> KelinerALOC: this is not the official Debian channel anymore. This is the legacy support channel which was Offical back when I first came here. Debian has moved to the OFTC irc network
375[04:11:19] <rant> KelinerALOC: are you a Debian user?
384[04:14:27] <rant> KelinerALOC: I wouldn't get too caught up on those specialty distros were I you.. certainly cool to play with if you have the time.. but its best to be part of a distro with a large friendly support community
385[04:14:42] <rant> KelinerALOC: anything you can do on those others you can probably manage to do on Debian.
392[04:17:51] <KelinerALOC> rant Nope, Common Lisp with SBCL
393[04:17:58] <rant> KelinerALOC: it was the Window Manager for Gnome back in the day.. I still use it but its fallen behind in development a bit. It's written in lisp. Its one of the most powerful window managers ever created. Its just fallen out of style due to lack of proper support for EWMH and Themes and such
406[04:23:50] <KelinerALOC> rant Thank you! You can also look over this replaced-url
407[04:24:38] <KelinerALOC> rant I think I'm not so good at English .... agh
408[04:25:55] <KelinerALOC> rant I am just a primary school student... but thanks a lot:)
409[04:27:11] <KelinerALOC> rant The parrot offical site says : Parrot is a GNU/Linux distribution based on Debian Testing and designed with Security, Development and Privacy in mind.
410[04:27:25] <rant> KelinerALOC: you are doing quite well, and I can understand why you might be interested in parrot if you are in PRC, but we don't support that here.
411[04:27:48] <KelinerALOC> So I think I am also a debian user ...(HAPPY:)
413[04:28:50] <rant> no, you are being seduced by one of the vast MANY debian spinoffs and thats keeping you from learning to do those things that specific spinoff is geared toward, yourself and alienating yourself from a large knowledgeable Debian community by not just using Debian
431[04:33:37] <rant> KelinerALOC: my personal recommendation is to install Debian stable, hang out here and other places, and try out things like parrot and such inside a virtual machine such as VirtualBox or such
432[04:34:11] <rant> that way you have the stability and support of debian, and you learn to interact with and implement the things you toy with yourself
433[04:35:23] <KelinerALOC> rant Thank you for your guidance.
434[04:36:39] <KelinerALOC> I thought more about programing before
435[04:37:16] <KelinerALOC> But nothing much in system...
436[04:37:19] *** Quits: RedSoxFan07 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: Goodbye and [depending on the time] good night.)
437[04:37:52] <KelinerALOC> rant Are you interested in AI?
446[04:47:25] <rant> you really should look into #debian-offtopic and other channels, this channel is for support of Debian Stable, #debian-offtopic is a more social channel
447[04:48:54] <KelinerALOC> Yup I will
448[04:49:19] <KelinerALOC> I've love debian
449[04:52:16] <KelinerALOC> I think the channel #debian-offtopic is more difficult to search than here
450[04:52:36] <KelinerALOC> But i'm happy to join that
451[05:00:00] *** Quits: cadillac_ (~omab@replaced-ip) (Quit: I quit)
494[05:59:23] <zumba_addict> any suggestions which terminal I should install? I don't like the currently installed one. I want something similar to my Iterm2 or maybe even better
568[07:55:20] <kale> hi, i have at some point been running testing by mistake, and downgraded to stretch again. but i still have som remaning issues. when i want to install gtk+3.0 it gives something like: "libwxgtk-media3.0-gtk3-0v5 : Depends: libwxbase3.0-0v5 (>= 3.0.4+dfsg) but 3.0.2+dfsg-4 is to be installed". How do i figure out which package gives me this problem?
598[08:15:20] <no_gravity> Ha! I was able to change a style by creating a file ~/.gtkrc-2.0
599[08:15:23] <no_gravity> What I am trying to achieve is to have a padding in the terminal window. Any ideas how to do that?
600[08:15:50] <Haohmaru> but the hard disk on this was kinda small-ish, and now the debian on this is used for more things than i initially expected, i've ran out of space two or three times already
601[08:16:31] <kale> Haohmaru: check for old package file is /var/cache/apt
627[08:28:33] <kale> Haohmaru: if you do "du -hs /*" then you should see which of those dirs take up the most space. you can then make a partition for that directory in you unallocated space and mount it there instead
628[08:28:34] *** Quits: Hunterkll (~Hunterkll@replaced-ip) (Disconnected by services)
629[08:28:36] *** Hunterkll_ is now known as Hunterkll
630[08:29:02] <Haohmaru> hmz
631[08:29:03] <kale> Haohmaru: i would recommend taking a look at lvm
632[08:29:23] *** Quits: Labu (~Labu@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 2.0.1)
633[08:29:24] <Haohmaru> i think i've looked into it, but it seems complicated at first
635[08:31:48] <kale> Haohmaru: i guess so. what you need to get it running is to create a physical volume, create a volume group on that, and the the lvm partitions in the volume group. it would require some cleverness to switch without reinstalling.
636[08:32:35] <Haohmaru> i think it's not worth to attempt such stunts in my case
637[08:33:10] <Haohmaru> i'm more considering switching from stretch to testing so i can get a few newer versions of the programs i use
639[08:34:59] <Haohmaru> i'm wondering.. if i make the 26GB unalocated chunk be a new "/", and then maybe wipe the old 14GB "/" and glue it onto the /home partition without disturbing the files, then install testing onto that
652[08:51:56] <Haohmaru> rant yes, i got LXDE and i'm using it for CAD stuff
653[08:52:21] <[Signal]> in essence of things, programs are that wide.
654[08:52:25] <rant> well I dont even use LXDE and I can assure you it has nothing at all to do with CAD
655[08:53:02] <Haohmaru> but i can't do anything right now because i'm using it.. but soonish i'm considering moving it to "testing"
656[08:53:28] <Haohmaru> rant uhm, well, i need some desktop to run the CAD programs, lxde is my choice
657[08:53:39] <rant> well if you move to testing you're saying I no longer will be getting support here in this channel, and I know how to solve basic package breakages and use the BTS on my own
658[08:54:09] <rant> where if you actually have new features in a SPECIFIC program we can look into other options to keep you on stable and get that newer program
659[08:54:27] <Haohmaru> oh wait, i have misunderstood you
666[08:58:14] <Haohmaru> but it might break my current projects (which are done with kicad4) so i might have to be able to also run kicad4 in an emergency situation
667[08:58:25] <rant> Haohmaru: that looks to be somethign really simple to backport.. are you at all familiar with the ssb proceedure? Its really simple
668[08:58:42] <Haohmaru> i guess i'm not
669[08:58:49] <rant> Haohmaru: well in that case you may want a chroot rather than a backport
670[08:59:08] <rant> Haohmaru: so you can keep the stretch 4.x and install the buster/sid 5.x in a chroot
673[08:59:59] <rant> Haohmaru: there is no reason to go possibly breaking your system to get a couple newer programs an SSB and a chroot are the best and simplest two options
680[09:01:25] <rant> well 4.0.7 is in backports, and thats not naughty.. if you didnt use the backports version, then you're just showing how little you know Debian and exactly why you shouldnt be moving to testing
681[09:02:00] <Haohmaru> nah, i was instructed how to get 4.0.7 properly (here)
682[09:02:21] <Haohmaru> i call it naughty cuz it was via commands, while i usually use synaptic
683[09:02:21] <rant> not only is getting both 4.0.7 and 5.0.0 easy in stable, but we have some regulars here who use kicad regularly for work and play and can support it well for you
684[09:02:31] <rant> if you go switching to testing you lose that support
689[09:04:11] <Haohmaru> tried out a bunch of DEs and what not, later i changed it to "stretch"
690[09:04:42] <rant> yes well just before/during a freeze isnt so bad.. cause it'll be stable real soon.. but we can't and dont suppot testing here.. you not only are left going to OTFC and dealing with a more narrow support group, but you are expected to know how to solve basic issues and report more complex ones
691[09:05:00] <rant> people aren't going to offer you the same level of support when you declare you're a tester not a normal user
692[09:05:16] <Haohmaru> yeah, i get that
693[09:05:31] <Haohmaru> oftc was a little bit more like the wild west ;P~
696[09:05:48] <rant> and I can't express enough that there are very simple ways to get newer packages in Stable
697[09:05:54] <rant> !ssb
698[09:05:55] <dpkg> First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>.
699[09:06:25] <rant> that proceedure right there is dead simple.. it may be a lil confusing at first but once you do it and see how easy it is..
700[09:07:11] <rant> the other is to create a dir somewhere.. /srv/, /opt/, /home/, /usr/local/ wherever you like and use debootstrap to install testing/unstable in it..
701[09:07:29] <Haohmaru> that takes the source codez for a program from the debian testing, and builds it?
702[09:07:39] <rant> then you can chroot to that dir and install apps and run them from within that chroot
703[09:08:03] <rant> Haohmaru: exactly, it uses apt to fetch the newer source and build a package against the STABLE dependencies
708[09:09:33] <rant> Haohmaru: so if foo-1.2 in stable depends on bar-5.4 and foo-2.7 in testing depends on bar-6.3 in testing you backport it, apt fetches the source for foo-2.7 in testing and builds it against bar-5.4 in stable
709[09:09:47] <rant> then you have a deb file of the newer foo that works with all the older bars
710[09:10:14] <Haohmaru> okay, i can't try any of that here right now, but i could try it at home, since i don't have urgent kicad projects there
711[09:11:10] <rant> yes well when you backport the new backport deb is gonna replace the existing version.. if you wanna keep both versions you either need a more complex backporting proceedure or you need to use a chroot
712[09:11:52] <rant> a chroot is a whole other install inside a directory which can run programs on top of but seperate from your running system
713[09:12:37] <rant> debootstrap is a handy tool you can use that will install a base-install of any given branch from any given repo into a directory to use as a chroot
714[09:13:22] <rant> you need to learn how to do things like this, and how to use the BTS and all that before you even think of moving to testing/unstable or you're only going to cause yourself and volunteer supporters more problems
715[09:14:00] <Haohmaru> is this whole process explained (even just briefly) somewhere on a webpage so i can study it a bit more at home?
716[09:14:42] <Haohmaru> i think i did "chroot" once when i messed up something in grub due to incompleted kernel update
717[09:15:10] <Haohmaru> but, i think it's not the same kind of usage as here
731[09:25:19] <rant> yes chroot is very simply a commmand that runs another command, much like su or sudo does, only where those run it as a different user, chroot runs it changing the root directory so the program cannot see beyond the path specified and considers that path its root
733[09:25:58] <rant> the thing that makes it effective in this use case is debootstrap which installs a debian base system including apt and such into a directory
736[09:26:38] <rant> you need only install chroot and debootstrap and read their manpages, and when in doubt come here and most anyone can help you.. and dpkg can always recite the ssb mantra to you by doing /msg dpkg ssb
836[09:48:41] <hans_> colo-work, that fixed chromium! (but not firefox-esr for some reason. i did shut down all visible windows but maybe something in the background, or maybe it needs a restart? either way, chromium works)
837[09:48:42] <arahael> Install them all! :)
838[09:49:13] <AciD`> rant ⟹ I hear you ; I too never encountered that infography before today, and I've been using Debian for longer than you apparently
839[09:49:13] <colo-work> hans_, restarting the x11 application should suffice
840[09:49:27] <AciD`> but it looks ok for a presentation about Debian
901[10:47:37] <_wrksx> what "module" is used to auto mount partitions when plugging an USB device
902[10:48:19] <_wrksx> and does it rely on the fstab if it contains info about this device ?
903[10:52:51] <Haohmaru> there are probably mutliple ways it can be done, i know some filemanagers can even auto-mount such devices (PCManFM for example)
938[11:24:34] <ntz> I want to reduce the LV that is filled 55/300GB by 50GBs ... lvreduce manpage is rather scary saying, that all data on reduced extends will be lost ... did some test and seems like that the
953[11:28:12] <bites> lvm has the tendency to crap out at the worst of times.
954[11:28:13] <ntz> bites: oldstable :D
955[11:28:24] <bites> eh, backups not updates.
956[11:28:31] <bites> brain not fully bootes yet.
957[11:28:45] <bites> *booted. see?
958[11:29:49] <ntz> I did it already ... it passed .. fsck.ext4 /dev/rpool/home says it's clean
959[11:30:50] <ntz> I'm always saying to ppl that when they are installing a new system that they should always leave se free PEs in VG if possible, they don't listen :P
971[11:43:50] <sine0> guys anyone have experience of domain transfers, does the dns info have to be setup before the transfer or does it naturally preserve it
980[11:49:44] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
981[11:50:25] <sine0> Fox, k, jelly: but how do I get all the information to carry over, I can do dig lookups, but not sure how I get all the information. this is working business with busy mail and I have been putting off this process...
990[11:52:39] <sine0> Fox: what do you mean the actual dns zone? im sorry but I have lots of domains and I setup the mx/a/ns on them, but this is with someone else who I have contact with via email, and my client wants me to take ownership of the domain onto an account
999[11:54:39] <sine0> Fox: ok that is fair enough, but for example I wouldnt know how to give you access to a dns zone of my domains, so I wouldnt know how to access one either, I will look it up, is it like guest access to the table ?
1000[11:54:42] <Fox> sine0: I'm sure godaddy does give access to you're zone details via their website
1129[13:32:32] <ngomes> something, that uppon kernel update can configure my graphics card without me having to install the drivers from scratch
1130[13:33:13] <jelly> !nvidia dkms
1131[13:33:13] <dpkg> For Debian 7 "Wheezy" and later systems. Ask me about <contrib> and <non-free sources>. «aptitude -r install linux-headers-`uname -r|sed 's,[^-]*-[^-]*-,,'` nvidia-kernel-dkms && mkdir -p /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d ; echo -e 'Section "Device"\n\tIdentifier "My GPU"\n\tDriver "nvidia"\nEndSection' > /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/20-nvidia.conf». Restart your system to enable the <nouveau> blacklist.
1132[13:33:21] <jelly> !non-free sources
1133[13:33:21] <dpkg> Edit /etc/apt/sources.list, ensure that the two main Debian mirror lines end with "main contrib non-free" rather than just "main", then «apt-get update». But bear in mind that you'll be installing <non-free> software. These may have onerous terms; check the licenses. See also <sources.list>.
1134[13:33:32] <jelly> ngomes, ^^
1135[13:34:02] *** Quits: arthurmde_ (uid38505@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
1136[13:34:55] <ngomes> jelly, i'm on it , thank
1137[13:34:56] <ngomes> jelly, i'm on it , thank
1138[13:34:57] <ngomes> jelly, i'm on it , thanks
1139[13:35:19] <jelly> two thank equal one thanks yes
1160[13:52:40] <dpkg> Mesa 3D is an open source implementation of the <OpenGL> API. replaced-url
1161[13:52:50] <ngomes> !glx
1162[13:52:50] <dpkg> GLX (OpenGL Extension to the X Window System) enables programs wanting to use <OpenGL> to do so, via a window provided by X Window System. replaced-url
1183[14:08:34] <AeCEgGfTv5> I'm setting up a linux router, it has 3 interfaces: eth0 (internet/wan), eth1 (lan), tun0 (vpn). All traffic should go through the vpn tun0. The setup is currently working.
1184[14:08:46] <AeCEgGfTv5> can someone review my iptables to ensure they are secure and restrictive?
1193[14:12:53] <kopper> For iptables rules, how about #netfilter?
1194[14:13:25] <AeCEgGfTv5> letme try that thanks
1195[14:13:37] <aloo_shu> from what I hear, in to world of open-rwt they set up more custom things
1196[14:14:37] <AeCEgGfTv5> i don't really trust open-rwt and dd-wrt. DD-wrt developers are not good, one release had a "accidental" backdoor and the developer did not inform anybody about it
1209[14:16:31] <AeCEgGfTv5> so some people are probably still running that release
1210[14:16:37] <jediofthecode> i also had a problem with gnome on stretch.Docker is creating virtual network interfaces but they're all showing up under the 'dropdown' menu
1239[14:29:44] <greycat> Why would we look at the docs of this thing that is totally unrelated to your desire to change the mount options of /home?
1240[14:30:53] <petn-randall> !context
1241[14:30:54] <dpkg> Try to give enough context! For example, let us know which command/program you are running, what you expected, and what you got instead. Try to be as specific as possible. If your command produced output, share the complete command (with all parameters!) and its output on replaced-url
1243[14:31:18] * aloo_shu dimly remembers gvfs mounts sitting in there that uid1000 could write to, but root couldn't
1244[14:31:23] <greycat> Also, why would you want a setuid program in a user's home directory in the first place?
1245[14:31:27] <_AleX_> mount -o remount,suid /run/user/1000 works but solve my problem, maybe i'm wrong. suid program dont work inside /home/myuser
1246[14:31:38] <_AleX_> mount -o remount,suid /run/user/1000 works but dont solve my problem, maybe i'm wrong. suid program dont work inside /home/myuser
1247[14:31:44] <j0seph> hiya all, I've been considering making a move to debian and I wanted to ask a question or two just to clear some trivial things up before i make a decision
1248[14:31:51] <petn-randall> _AleX_: Tell us about the problem you're trying to solve, not what you think the solution is.
1249[14:31:54] <petn-randall> !xy problem
1250[14:31:54] <dpkg> Slow down for a bit! Are you sure that you need to jump through that particular hoop to achieve your goal? We suspect you don't, so why don't you back up a bit and tell us about the overall objective... We know that people often falsely diagnose problems because they are too close to them -- it's easy to miss that there is a better way to proceed. See replaced-url
1251[14:31:57] <greycat> Why would you think that changing the mount options of /x would affect the behavior of /y?
1259[14:33:13] <greycat> Putting a setuid-to-root program in /home/susan is ludicrous.
1260[14:33:15] <petn-randall> _AleX_: And why not just put it in /usr/local/bin/?
1261[14:33:18] <FinalX> setuid in /usr/bin?
1262[14:33:23] <FinalX> put it in sbin at the very least :p
1263[14:33:42] <j0seph> out of debian testing and debian unstable, which is 'better' for security updates? ('better' as in availability, priority, etc.)
1264[14:33:48] <FinalX> forget my last comment.
1265[14:33:53] <petn-randall> j0seph: None of them.
1266[14:33:55] <_AleX_> petn-randall: just for understand how to suid limitations of users works
1267[14:34:05] <petn-randall> j0seph: If you want timely security updates, stick with stable.
1269[14:34:11] <_AleX_> petn-randall: and how to remove it if people ask me
1270[14:34:27] <petn-randall> _AleX_: If the program check from where it's being run, you need to edit the program.
1271[14:34:48] <petn-randall> *checks
1272[14:35:00] <FinalX> j0seph: I'd like to add that backports only receive selective updates, stable repo gets them for sure and in a timely fashion.. backports are anyone's guess
1273[14:35:01] <_AleX_> petn-randall: it's not a check made by the program, it's a config parameter of the system
1282[14:36:23] <greycat> Since, you know, the program was allegedly IN /home.
1283[14:36:30] <petn-randall> j0seph: However, if you really want to beta-test the unfinished release of Debian, you can go with the following to cherry-pick security fixes from unstable:
1284[14:36:33] <petn-randall> !tum
1285[14:36:33] <dpkg> «echo 'APT::Default-Release "testing";' >> /etc/apt/apt.conf», edit sources.list, copy your non-security testing lines and change one set to unstable, then apt-get update. Use apt-get -t unstable install foo; to install foo from unstable rather than testing as usual. WARNING to SYNAPTIC users: Synaptic ignores Default-Release: set Preferences->Distribution.
1286[14:36:39] <_AleX_> petn-randall: make a test : with a normal user, copy /usr/bin/passwd in your homedir and launch the command. On another window you will see that the process run with your user identity and not the root identity
1287[14:36:57] <greycat> _AleX_: if you only "copied" the program to your home directory, then it is not setuid.
1289[14:37:01] <petn-randall> j0seph: ^^^ However, both testing and unstable break regularly, so if you have to ask, you probably should be running stable.
1291[14:37:08] <j0seph> petn-randall, FinalX: i would like to run stable, though i'm not sure if i'd prefer running older software. as such I wanted to make a decision between testing and unstable. if they're both on the same level in regards to security and both are discouraged if security is a concern, perhaps debian isn't for me
1292[14:37:29] <FinalX> any software in any non-rolling distro is outdated by default
1293[14:37:43] <petn-randall> j0seph: stable or new, pick one.
1294[14:37:45] <_AleX_> jelly: same with chmod u+s ./passwd
1295[14:38:08] <jelly> _AleX_, show "ls -ld ./passwd" from that example, and output of "mount"
1296[14:38:23] <petn-randall> _AleX_: I haven't seen any command nor output yet ...
1297[14:38:24] <greycat> _AleX_: show us "ls -l" of the copy and show us the mount options of whatever file system the thing is ACTUALLY IN, which is NOT /run.
1320[14:40:57] <greycat> [sr]: so you just thought you could insert some random comment into a crontab file and it would magically do something? Even though it's a comment?
1321[14:41:05] <_AleX_> jelly: greycat : i'm running Linux since the 0.98b2 kernel ...
1322[14:41:07] <FinalX> yeah, was trying to remember if there was a more common one in debian, too :P
1323[14:41:12] <jelly> _AleX_, we _need_ to know whether you did it as root, and we _need_ to know which specific mountpoint it was copied to.
1324[14:41:20] <[sr]> greycat: ok, but how would i specify the UID+GID then?
1325[14:41:30] <[sr]> googled a bit but didn't found any relevant info
1326[14:41:34] <petn-randall> _AleX_: If you can't show us the output, we can't help you. Simple stuff.
1327[14:41:52] <greycat> [sr]: are you talking about /etc/crontab as opposed to regular crontab(5)?
1328[14:41:53] <jelly> _AleX_, we don't know that and even experts can get confused sometimes, so pretty please show the actual info, when you have access to the system
1330[14:42:22] <[sr]> greycat: yes, a line that is in /etc/crontab
1331[14:42:28] <j0seph> bitess: ah, so stable currently IS on 4.9. thanks
1332[14:42:56] <petn-randall> j0seph: That's right. But you can get the 4.16 from stretch-backports.
1333[14:43:25] <FinalX> but backports doesn't get updates from stretch-security
1334[14:43:27] <greycat> [sr]: the man page says that /etc/crontab has a "username" field. It does not specify any way to give a numeric UID. It does not specify any way to give a group name OR a GID.
1335[14:43:34] <jelly> _AleX_, I spent an hour fixing an issue before checking for disk full, just a couple weeks back, and I've been using Linux since 1.2
1336[14:43:47] <[sr]> greycat: damn, that's what i had in mind
1337[14:43:50] <greycat> [sr]: you can try using a numeric UID instead of a username, and see what happens. Other than that, you can download the source code of cron and see what it does.
1338[14:44:01] <[sr]> greycat: doesn't work
1339[14:44:34] <j0seph> petn-randall: coolio, thanks. a couple of my main concerns was the older kernel and older version of KDE Plasma (I absolutely hate 5.8 but love 5.13)
1340[14:44:43] <_AleX_> jelly: greycat : i found my solution, a stupid problem of rights, i'm very sorry to distrub you with that. Thank you a lot
1341[14:44:49] <petn-randall> [sr]: Why can't you just use a username/groupname? The user must exist on the system to work, anyway.
1342[14:44:59] <_AleX_> (i forget petn-randall in the greetings)
1343[14:45:06] <[sr]> petn-randall: no system users
1344[14:45:17] <petn-randall> _AleX_: ... which we could have pointed out easily if you had showed us the output.
1351[14:48:08] *** Parts: _AleX_ (~alex@replaced-ip) ("I'll be back !")
1352[14:48:19] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: conta)
1353[14:48:29] <greycat> e.g. if you have daemontools installed, you could use setuidgid; or if you have runit installed, you could use chpst; I have no idea if systemd provides something equivalent
1354[14:50:14] <jelly> it's probably done as an option inside the unit definition file
1355[14:50:15] <[sr]> this is because a wordpress cron
1356[14:50:48] <greycat> jelly: yeah, that's why I'm thinking there isn't an actual program provided to do it. He might want to just install runit to get the chpst program.
1357[14:50:57] <[sr]> my 2nd option is to run the cron via url and not the script directly, like: php /path/wp-cron.php, and yes wget XXXX replaced-url
1358[14:51:12] <jelly> [sr], why does it have to be numeric uid and gid?
1359[14:51:21] <greycat> [sr]: which number option is "add the user to the system"
1360[14:51:33] <[sr]> 'cause my vhost's use uid+gid's
1361[14:51:34] *** Quits: Vizva (~Vizva@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1385[14:55:14] <greycat> Rather than writing your own deriviative distribution and then not understanding it/
1386[14:55:14] <jelly> that's what I do with a horrible legacy custom qmail setup
1387[14:55:41] <jelly> greycat, Debian is a platform. People run all sorts of crap on top of it.
1388[14:55:44] <[sr]> no qmail here, postfix&dovecot ;)
1389[14:56:03] <greycat> Sure, but if you remove pieces of the platform, then at what point does it stop being something we can support here?>
1390[14:56:21] <jelly> greycat, it's also said to be a "universal operating system" so it's MEANT to be used to run anything on it.
1391[14:56:25] <greycat> I'm saying that when you remove the freaking /etc/passwd file, you've already crossed that line.
1392[14:56:39] <jelly> [sr], did you remove /etc/passwd file?
1393[14:56:48] <Pegasus_RPG> rant: Well, I suspect the anti-virus engine is the problem. The kernel hanging tends to happen when the A-V engine updates itself. Not every time of course, just once in awhile. I'd like to try disabling it for a week and see if it occurs, but then I'm at risk. It uses FANotify though so I'm surprised it could hang the kernel.
1394[14:57:00] <[sr]> jelly: of course not! just my apache vhost's use numeric UID+GID, just that!
1395[14:57:21] <jelly> greycat, see, it's still there. Just not all the users are in it.
1396[14:57:41] <[sr]> apart from that, it's all debian the system, which i LOVE
1397[14:57:47] <FinalX> what about just doing: sudo -u #1000 crontab -e
1398[14:57:51] <greycat> I've already /ignored it. If the /etc/passwd file is there but he REFUSES TO USE IT because he's a stubborn jackass, then what is the point of offering assistance?
1399[14:57:51] <[sr]> i want to marry with it 'cause i love it
1400[14:57:58] <FinalX> and putting it in there instead of /etc/crontab or /etc/cron.*/*
1401[14:58:13] <greycat> FinalX: sudo -u needs an argument. You've stopped the shell command with a comment. So you will get a usage error.
1402[14:58:17] <jelly> [sr], honestly I'd do a simple mapping uid 1000 -> user u1000 and keep it updated
1403[14:58:25] <FinalX> greycat: no, it works fine here.
1404[14:58:38] <greycat> FinalX: then you are not typing what you said.
1405[14:58:40] <FinalX> well, my shell is different, but still
1409[14:58:50] <[sr]> jelly: i'll just call the cron via url, and won't have to touch anything else of my setup, that way the file will run with the vhost's uid+gid (that are numeric)
1415[15:00:11] <FinalX> greycat: using zsh, I get a perfectly running crontab -e as uid 1000. if # stopped the line, I'd have gotten the error: sudo: option requires an argument -- 'u'
1416[15:00:18] <greycat> FinalX: But, if sudo -u can be used as a chainloading alternative to setuidgid, using whatever shell quoting is necessary to pass the argument that begins with # (probably just regular quotes), then sure. Go for it. I didn't think it would work, so I didn't suggest that.
1417[15:00:34] <jelly> my shell does not think # in the interactive command line is a comment
1418[15:00:37] <greycat> you're telling me that zsh doesn't treat a word starting with # as a comment-until-end-of-line?
1419[15:00:47] <jelly> greycat, of course not
1420[15:00:53] *** glennb is now known as glennb_
1421[15:00:55] <FinalX> it does, but not in this case, apparently
1422[15:00:55] *** Quits: KelinerALOC (~keliner@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
1423[15:00:59] <jelly> who writes comments in interactive CLI?!
1424[15:00:59] <FinalX> surprised as you are :)
1425[15:01:07] <bitess> !localized errors
1426[15:01:07] <dpkg> To provide command output in English instead of your native language, set your locale to an English one (e.g. C) prior to running the command, e.g. "LC_ALL=C apt-get -f install".
1427[15:01:08] <jelly> [15:00] ~ => echo #foo
1428[15:01:08] <jelly> #foo
1429[15:01:12] <bitess> nrubsig: ^
1430[15:01:20] *** Quits: mibo (~mibo@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1431[15:01:23] <FinalX> though if you specify a uid not in passwd: crontab: your UID isn't in the passwd file.
1432[15:01:25] <bitess> nrubsig: show us the command you used too, please.
1433[15:01:28] <FinalX> so, guess it's pointless either way :)
1434[15:01:39] <greycat> FinalX: sudo, or crontab?
1435[15:01:56] <FinalX> what, the error? comes from crontab
1436[15:02:05] <nrubsig> bitess: $ apt-get install ./subgit_3.3.3_all.deb # as user "root"
1437[15:02:14] <greycat> FinalX: I thought you were talking about sudo -u '#6666'
1466[15:04:15] <FinalX> I'm not the one having the fucking problem here.
1467[15:04:16] <greycat> BECAUSE THIS IS NOT ZSH
1468[15:04:21] <FinalX> Chill the hell out.
1469[15:04:22] * nrubsig threatens zsh users here with ksh93's object-oriented extensions
1470[15:04:29] <jelly> greycat, it's not #bash either.
1471[15:04:31] <FinalX> You just start ranting about things you haven't even tried yet.
1472[15:04:43] <FinalX> "it doesn't work"... yet it does
1473[15:04:51] <queip> jelly: well he has a point, debian defaults to bash
1474[15:04:57] <greycat> jelly: a crontab line is interpreted by /bin/sh which will treat a # as a comment unless quoted. Everyone offering assistance here should understand this.
1475[15:05:02] <jelly> cron uses /bin/sh by default, not zsh, not bash
1476[15:05:18] <FinalX> which is dash
1477[15:05:20] <FinalX> congrats
1478[15:05:30] <greycat> Which is either dash or bash or some other posix-compliant shell.
1480[15:05:52] <greycat> I bet zsh invoked as sh would probably treat an unquoted #1 as a comment too.
1481[15:06:14] <jelly> in fact, if cron thinks it can avoid calling /bin/sh at all it will spawn the command on its own
1482[15:06:18] <nrubsig> jelly: by definition /bin/sh should be a POSIX-conforming shell. If anyone wants to suffer ... conformance level goes from 1) ksh93 (fully conformany) 2) bash --posix 3) dash 4) bash (default mode)
1483[15:06:19] <FinalX> it doesn't matter now, does it? point is, with sudo you run programs as numeric user id's, yet crontab doesn't accept it. that was the whole point of everything and you're taking your frustration out on me without 1) checking things yourself first and 2) talking to the right person who is actually asking for help
1484[15:06:25] <FinalX> I'm not asking for your help, or ever asking for your help.
1494[15:09:13] <nrubsig> [sr]: too late to be sorry - this is Debian, and Debian people are like the people of the Earth Kingdom: Proud, stubborn, and bash in heads over harmless arguments
1507[15:11:38] <nrubsig> bitess: install *.deb package from local filesystem
1508[15:11:52] <nrubsig> What does $ apf -f install # do ?
1509[15:11:58] <greycat> nrubsig: take it up with the wordpress dude who has a passwd file but refuses to use it for some personal challenge reason that he thinks we will honor
1510[15:12:07] <bitess> install the missing dependencies.
1511[15:12:37] <bitess> just let him be...
1512[15:13:07] *** glennb_ is now known as glennb
1513[15:13:10] <nrubsig> bitess: my ancient ubunto has no command called "apf" ...
1562[15:22:51] <ngomes> it looks like wine32 is missing, you should install it.
1563[15:23:12] <ngomes> wine is installed , should i need wine32 ?
1564[15:24:30] <bitess> fender0107401: apt repositories are just http servers on port 80.
1565[15:24:50] *** donnelly is now known as TheDonnelly
1566[15:24:55] *** TheDonnelly is now known as donnelly
1567[15:25:01] <bitess> !multiarch
1568[15:25:02] <dpkg> Multiarch allows you to install foreign architecture packages. For example, to allow i386 packages to be installed on an amd64 system: «dpkg --add-architecture i386 && apt-get update». See replaced-url
1578[15:30:39] <thms> "Unable to satisfy the build-depends: Build-Depends: dh-apache2" when running aptitude build-dep libapache2-mpm-itk. I've tried installing dh-apache2 and apache2-dev, stil lsame problem.
1579[15:31:04] <thms> Quite sure this is the reason why the following steps are not working, though not sure. I'm trying to build a package without an option (capabilities)
1580[15:31:22] <thms> Can anyone help me out with this ? Not sure where to start to debug :/
1581[15:31:25] <ngomes> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
1582[15:31:25] <ngomes> wine32:i386 : Depends: libwine:i386 (= 1.8.7-2) but it is not going to be installed
1583[15:31:25] <ngomes> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
1587[15:32:53] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
1588[15:32:57] <bitess> ngomes: ^
1589[15:33:15] <Brigo> ngomes, you don't need wine for running steam in debian, just need to activate multiarch so you can use 32bit software in you amd64 installation.
1590[15:34:11] <ngomes> Brigo, how do i check if it is activated ?
1591[15:34:34] <jelly> thms, which version of libapache2-mpm-itk are you building, on which debian release?
1592[15:34:57] <jelly> just a package rebuild with different options within the same release?
1593[15:35:33] <thms> jelly thaty's what i aim yes
1598[15:36:01] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
1599[15:36:11] <jelly> thms, ^ start with all that
1600[15:36:26] <nrubsig> !help
1601[15:36:26] *** Quits: fabioluciano (~fabioluci@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1658[15:52:58] <jediofthecode> what is the stability of testing at currently ? vs say stretch
1659[15:53:13] <greycat> !debian-next
1660[15:53:13] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
1664[15:53:53] <greycat> Its "stability" as we define the word is zero. It is not stable. But you probably meant "buglessness" or "crash-bug-lessness" or something, which #debian-next might be able to answer.
1665[15:55:12] <ngomes> Brigo, i'checked it long time ago , what about it ?
1666[15:55:20] <section1> abrotman, ok aptitude giveme some options...lets try it :d
1667[15:55:34] <Brigo> ngomes, i was wondering if it could suit your needs.
1668[15:55:36] <ngomes> Brigo, does it have the hability to run Windows Steam ?
1722[16:31:04] * greycat reads cron(8) and learns that Debian's cron apparently tries to compensate for Daylight Saving by running missed jobs afterward, or skipping jobs that would be repeated. Still, I will not ever put a job into that time slot, because I don't trust it.
1765[17:06:50] *** Quits: beaver (~none@replaced-ip) (Quit: Can't locate Geo/IP.pm in @INC (you may need to install the Geo::IP module) restart again!)
1775[17:14:26] <aesin> current kernel 4.9.110-1 in stable has a bug fixed in 4.9.110-2. How can i install 4.9.110-2 ? i added proposal updates to sources.list but after apt-get update there is no 4.9.110-2
1783[17:16:15] <greycat> final comment says there's a 4.9.110-3 in stretch-proposed-updates
1784[17:17:21] <greycat> !stable-proposed-updates
1785[17:17:21] <dpkg> stable-proposed-updates is a repository containing packages being prepared for the next <point release>. While they have already been, your additional testing is most welcome prior to wider release. replaced-url
1788[17:19:25] <greycat> dpkg, stretch-proposed-updates is <reply> see stable-proposed-updates
1789[17:19:27] <dpkg> okay, greycat
1790[17:20:40] <aesin> after i enabled proposed updates in sources.list apt-cache search linux-image displays several kernels last of which linux-image-4.9.0-7-amd64. but apt-cache show linux-image-4.9.0-7-amd64 prints its version 110-1.
1791[17:20:50] <aesin> how to i get 110-3?
1792[17:20:51] <greycat> did you forget to apt-get update?
1802[17:30:10] <greycat> it will typically give several results that are all formatted alike, with just a blank line between them, and not in any meaningful order
1837[17:58:06] <greycat> The /usr/bin/env one is used when you plan to distribute the script to many different systems that may have bash in different locations, and you don't know in advance where it will be, and there isn't an installation procedure to target the shebang at install time.
1838[17:58:37] <greycat> It relies on the PATH variable at the time of execution to include a directory with at least one valid version of the interpreter.
1839[17:58:44] *** Quits: p4p0l0 (~p4p0l0@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
1896[18:53:53] <setuid> In Ubuntu, we have an ubuntu-minimal package, which when installed, will take the system down into bare-bones, minimalist packages. Is there something like this for debian? I need to strip a system of all non-essential packages, and build it back up clean.
1908[19:00:06] <setuid> whereas in ubuntu, you can have a fully installed and working system, desktop, apache, Xorg, etc. and then install ubuntu-minimal, and it will strip it all back
1911[19:00:20] <ChmEarl> setuid, I used the XFCE disk, which is complete and fits on a CD
1912[19:00:40] <setuid> ChmEarl: The problem is that I have this system that seems to be a hybrid of wheezy, squeezze and stretch... in production.
1913[19:00:49] <setuid> I need to rip it all out, build it back up clean with current/stable packages
1914[19:00:55] <petn-randall> setuid: So a Frankendebian?
1915[19:00:55] <setuid> _without_ reinstalling
1916[19:01:08] <petn-randall> !frankendebian
1917[19:01:08] <dpkg> When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. Ask me about <reinstall>
1918[19:01:14] <greycat> I can't imagine that stripping everything that makes it a server will go well.
1919[19:01:15] <setuid> Yes, someone added the newer repos to sources.list, and packages got installed
1920[19:01:35] <petn-randall> setuid: If it's a mix out of three releases, I strongly recommend to reinstall and start from scratch. It'll be 10x easier than fixing it.
1921[19:01:39] <setuid> greycat: As long as it boots, and has basic packages/tools, I can reinstall the rest from the 'correct' repos
1922[19:02:41] <setuid> petn-randall: Yes, that's a last resort. It has a lot of services running, and each of them is uniquely configured. I had plans on breaking all of the services into separate VMs, but that's not as easy as it sosunds (sendmail, mailman, apache, git repos, and others)
1924[19:03:35] <jhutchins_wk> I've actually had to deal with this. It's pretty simple to just clean up the old distros in the source list and then do upgrades.
1925[19:03:37] <setuid> It's backed up, so we _could_ just wipe it
1926[19:04:04] <setuid> jhutchins_wk: Problem is that when I just point sources.list to stretch repos, it can't find basic packages like apache2 and supporting dependencies
1927[19:04:14] <petn-randall> setuid: The thing is, there's going from wheezy to stretch is not a supported path. So packages *will* break in horrible ways.
1928[19:04:17] <setuid> I may just build a clean VM and move data/services over
1929[19:04:31] <setuid> petn-randall: Yep, btdt over the last 18 or so yearss :)
1930[19:04:45] <setuid> I've got battle scars from debian upgrades many, many, many times
1934[19:06:07] <setuid> Well, I suspect this happened because someone added newer repos to get 1 package, forgot they were still there, and an upgrade jumped a release, causing frankendebian
1935[19:06:31] <setuid> I'll start removing groups of packages, and remove anything with 'wheezy' in the package version
1939[19:07:58] <petn-randall> setuid: Personally, I'd start using something like ansible to configure all those services, and then when you got all those services set, start migrating them over. This avoids the "unique snowflake" syndrom that you get with longrunning servers.
1940[19:08:53] <setuid> Agreed, right now we have 'web', 'mysql', 'mail' and other VMs set up, but this one monstrous snowball-of-snowflakes server is the keystone, and we have to tread carefully.
1942[19:09:40] <setuid> See above, it's still running 'sendmail', because it runs greymilter + dspam, and runs circles around a compatible postfix/exim config to strip out spam before it hits the mailboxes. It's current, but it's legacy.
1944[19:10:15] <setuid> So moving services is also a bit of porting of ugly legacy; at some point, someone began editing the sendmail.mc, instead of the m4 and re-generating the .mc, so it's got more snowflakes in there too.
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1970[19:33:22] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: conta)
1971[19:34:15] <xaeB5> i installed mate from debian and i'm getting some notification that pops up about adding a printer to google print or something related to google. anyone know what this could be and if it's normal? i searched for any google package and nothing seems to be installed. i don't have chrome either
1994[19:50:18] *** Quits: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: conta)
1995[19:50:32] <Brigo> peaceguy, yes
1996[19:51:03] <Brigo> peaceguy, there is no debian server version, just one for all purpouses
1997[19:51:13] <greycat> Debian doesn't have different "tiers" or whatever you implied by "debian server, the one with ...". It's just Debian. You choose which pieces you want to install.
2009[19:52:05] <jhutchins_wk> That's up to you when you run the installer.
2010[19:52:07] <greycat> Whether you're installing from netinst or from a "full" DVD image, the installer is the same.
2011[19:52:27] <greycat> The only thing that changes is how much comes from the physical media and how much comes from the network.
2012[19:52:27] <peaceguy> so i can set up separate /home partition and encrypt it?
2013[19:52:30] <jhutchins_wk> peaceguy: Ubuntu is really the same, they just pretend to have different versions where they've pre-selected certain packages.
2014[19:52:56] <peaceguy> but it's not the same, using the one without xorg and one that ships with some desktop environment
2015[19:53:13] <greycat> It's the same installer, unless you're talking about a "Live" image, and those are just not good.
2016[19:53:31] <jhutchins_wk> peaceguy: It's the same, you just don't select "Desktop" when you install.
2017[19:53:32] <peaceguy> i guess that's not important but i wonder how many space does it take, debian 9.5 lxde iso
2018[19:53:48] <peaceguy> ok
2019[19:53:49] <greycat> what is "debian 9.5 lxde"?
2020[19:54:05] <greycat> I still feel like you've somehow come across the "Live" images.
2021[19:54:06] <jhutchins_wk> peaceguy: We usually recommend using the net installer if you have a decent internet connection.
2024[19:54:18] <greycat> see where it says "-live" twice in there?
2025[19:54:25] <greycat> don't use those for installation
2026[19:54:30] <peaceguy> why??
2027[19:55:02] <greycat> The installer on the Live images is historically broken.
2028[19:55:18] <greycat> I can't say whether that *specific* one is as broken as the ones from years past, but there is a very poor track record.
2029[19:55:19] <peaceguy> what? why is it on the site then?
2030[19:55:30] <peaceguy> which one should i use then?
2031[19:55:34] <peaceguy> it's the official site
2032[19:55:34] <greycat> It's intended to be used as a "Live distro", not for installing.
2033[19:55:36] <jhutchins_wk> peaceguy: Because the live part works.
2034[19:55:40] <jhutchins_wk> !netinstall
2035[19:55:40] <dpkg> i heard netinst is a small CD image with which you can install Debian. If, during the installation process you have a working Internet connection, you can install more packages straight away, otherwise, you will have a base install and more packages later. See replaced-url
2036[19:55:42] *** Joins: Labu (~Labu@replaced-ip)
2037[19:55:48] <Brigo> the netinstall as greycat told you already
2040[19:56:11] <jediofthecode> hello, i was in here earlier with an issue, but it seems backporting network-manager myself didn't fix it
2041[19:56:30] <jediofthecode> docker is creating veth interfaces, and they're showing in the gnome menu, im wondering if anyone has experience hiding these
2042[19:56:33] <peaceguy> what packages do i need to install to netinstall in order to encrypt hard disk, or is it already supported?
2043[19:56:44] <Brigo> netinstall is not a good name. It can be used for rescue too, so i would call it rescueintall or something like that.
2044[19:57:04] <peaceguy> can it encrypt?
2045[19:57:06] <greycat> because that name isn't confusing at all... :-/
2046[19:57:16] <Brigo> XD
2047[19:57:26] <Brigo> i said somethink like that :D
2092[20:11:57] <squarecircle> is there a recommended "default" way to go?
2093[20:13:05] <greycat> heh, the !kiosk factoid is amusingly antiquated
2094[20:13:10] *** Quits: earthundead (~earthunde@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
2095[20:13:43] <squarecircle> greycat: ?
2096[20:14:19] <greycat> !kiosk
2097[20:14:20] <dpkg> it has been said that kiosk is /bin/su -c "/usr/bin/X11/startx" - kiosk (/usr/sbin/kiosk); kk:2345:respawn:/usr/sbin/kiosk (/etc/inittab); telinit q, or replaced-url
2099[20:15:21] <booyah> are this characters visible by default in your IRC programs/terminals? (with exception of virtual terminal text where it will fail) -> ▁▂▃▄▅▆▇█▓▒░ (that should look like 8 characters of rising stair-case and then 3 gradient blocks)
2100[20:15:39] <greycat> are you conducting a survey? please don't.
2121[20:20:47] <squarecircle> greycat: ok, I'll look into it
2122[20:21:20] <greycat> squarecircle: I don't know what the systemd equivalent is. I was hoping there would be an up to date !kiosk factoid, but apparently not under that name.
2123[20:22:10] <greycat> If nobody else knows, you could try googling for "debian kiosk" and maybe add "stretch" or "systemd" or whatever to help weed out the old stuff.
2128[20:25:16] <RoyK> greycat: I'm using raspbian in kiosk mode for some infoscreens at work - not a big debian deal, really, just chromium running in kiosk mode (and everything forced to IPv6 for simplicity reasons, and software installed with ansible)
2129[20:25:35] <RoyK> and raspbian is basically stretch and some changes
2214[20:57:16] <cyberbootje> hi, anyone an idea how to restrict a tap adapter to allow some outgoing Ip's on a host? And with "restrict" i mean, no packet going out at all, not even ARP if it is not the ip that is allowed to do so
2215[20:57:39] *** Quits: a0z (~a0z@replaced-ip) (Quit: Lost terminal)
2216[20:58:02] <[BrightSide]> no_gravity: an issue is everything about your expectation from the *software*, it's not always bug
2277[21:49:32] <TinkerTiger> In a few weeks I will start teaching a CompTIA cert course. I have never heard of them but then again I'm 'coming back to' IT.
2283[21:53:55] <TinkerTiger> Of course there is. I've been a Debian user for several years now! Seriously though. Here's what's annoying me. I do a lot of work on imagining SD cards and on my Debian Server box the SD cards always come up as 'read-only' file systems and I can't wrtie to them. Even though, I move them to another computer and write to them. I want to figure out what is going on and the reading I have done so far
2284[21:54:01] <TinkerTiger> isnt' helpful. Also, is CompTIA credible? I mean, does anyone care?
2297[21:59:22] <TinkerTiger> Something1: However, I recently learned about USB Hubs, like yesterday, and now I'm wondering if the box is just a bit too beat up and I'm having USB Hub issues.
2303[22:01:25] <Something1> (You´re sure you didn´t switch that notch on the side?)
2304[22:01:57] <TinkerTiger> Something1: I have a 4TB drive attached to a regular USB port and have not had issues yet. It was purely speculation.
2305[22:02:42] <TinkerTiger> I've fiddled with the notch and right now the same card that failed in the server is imaging on my laptop.
2306[22:02:50] <jhutchins_wk> TinkerTiger: When you say the cards are read-only, are you talking about how they're presented in a GUI filemanger for an ordinary user?
2307[22:03:10] <jhutchins_wk> TinkerTiger: For some reason the default in Linux is to mount devices as read-only except for root.
2335[22:16:15] <greycat> rsync just calls ssh, and ssh will communicate with the ssh-agent if one is running and if rsync/ssh inherits the correct env vars to point to it
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2339[22:17:27] <Aebian> ah yes, probably thats the issue: Could not open a connection to your authentication agent
2340[22:17:51] <Aebian> thanks for the help
2341[22:18:22] <greycat> Typically you log in, and part of your login process is to run an ssh-agent and to add your keys to it (which prompts you for your keys' passphrase). Then anything you run from within your login session inherits those vars to talk to that agent and use those keys.
2355[22:25:20] <peaceguy> can i have something really minimal like just xorg lxde/openbox and that?
2356[22:25:29] <peaceguy> i mean it's not bloated, that dvd?
2357[22:25:35] <peaceguy> i can make minimal system using that?
2358[22:26:06] <greycat> At the end of the install, you get a dialog (or whiptail) box that lets you CHOOSE which software you want to install, from several "tasks" which are big collections of stuff, like desktop environments.
2362[22:27:09] <thavlik> Hi folks, I have an issue where every once in a while my mouse wheel will jump in the opposite direction a few increments. I have tried a different mouse, and unplugging/plugging it back in does not serve to fix the mouse by "resetting" it
2393[22:40:32] <bodqhrohro> What exact upstream kernel version do Debian linux-image-* packages correspond to: the one specified in the package name or the package version?
2409[22:49:50] <dashs> Current stable: running mplayer (or vlc) audio stream command works fine. If put in the background (with &} it suspends the job. Wassup with that?
2410[22:51:15] <Brigo> dashs, weird, have you tried fg command?
2413[22:53:00] <Brigo> dashs, it works for me (with vlc, i don't have mplayer installed)
2414[22:53:10] <greycat> It suspends in the background most likely because it's trying to read input from the temrinal.
2415[22:53:14] <Brigo> dashs, yes, as a test
2416[22:53:44] <greycat> If you want to run a program that can possibly read terminal I/O in the background, either tell it not to read any I/O using some command-specific option, or redirect stdin </dev/null
2442[23:06:42] <Kurogane> I've a problem with an alias, i setup an alias and working fine in the console but the problem is when i try to call via bash script not working... How i can the alias recognize me the command in the bash file?
2443[23:07:11] <greycat> aliases do not fire in bash scripts, unless you go out of your way to make them do so, because otherwise your aliases would wreck every script you run
2479[23:30:21] *** Quits: Immanuel (~Manu@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection reset by reptilians)
2480[23:30:25] <AeCEgGfTv5> running debian stable here, just want to make sure that the correct way to update is the follwing: run apt-get update and then apt-get full-upgrade
2501[23:35:25] <annadane> mefistofeles, if you have that problem currently, post it to paste.debian.net and perhaps #debian can resolve it
2502[23:35:26] <annadane> !bat
2503[23:35:26] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
2516[23:39:04] <AeCEgGfTv5> i built a debian router with the following 3 network interfaces: eth0 (WAN), eth1 (LAN), tun0 (VPN). I want all traffic to go through the tun0 VPN. I setup some basic firewall iptable rules and everything is working perfectly
2517[23:39:17] <AeCEgGfTv5> however, I want to make sure the rules I have are secure and restrictive
2518[23:39:23] <AeCEgGfTv5> these are the rules: replaced-url
2519[23:39:49] <AeCEgGfTv5> it's connected directly to the internet