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• 4[00:01:02] <petn-randall> kot: Oh right, though it's only really relevant for embedded machines that are low on entropy.
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• 9[00:02:39] <JordiGH> So the live install ISO doesn't include vi, ohnoes, doesn't this break POSIX?
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• 17[00:07:14] <kot> alive876_, can you move /home to a separate partition if it isn't on one already? or you could increase the size of / if you can shrink or move the next partition.
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• 29[00:12:09] <alive876_> kot a little over my head what do you mean by /home and how do you move it?
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• 33[00:16:02] <kot> alive876_, /home contains your user data and can get big. to move it, you would make a partition, rsync/cp your entire existing /home to it, then tell /etc/fstab where the new /home is. then you can delete the old home and recover a lot of space in /
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• 50[00:24:09] <somiaj> JordiGH: linve install iso, what install iso are you talking about? vim-tiny (which provides vi) should be in the minimial install.
• 51[00:24:44] <somiaj> JordiGH: or are you talking about the minimum enviorment during the installer, that is a very limited enviorment, and is not meant to be a full enviorment.
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• 53[00:25:20] <somiaj> JordiGH: vim-tiny is an 'important' package, it should be in all debian installs.
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• 59[00:29:50] <JordiGH> somiaj: Hm, the live install you boot too. I don't have it anymore, but I'm pretty sure there is no vi executable at all in it.
• 60[00:30:18] <JordiGH> *boot to
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• 62[00:31:09] <somiaj> there really is no live system during the install, when you boot into the debian installer you are put into some minimial enviorment, and there isn't much of anything in that enviorment, including a text editor.
• 63[00:31:34] <somiaj> I wonder if it is busybox or some custom limited enviorment, basically you need to chroot into the base isntall to get access to all those tools
• 64[00:32:50] <somiaj> the release notes just call it a 'debug shell', so yea I'm not surprised vi is not there.
• 65[00:33:17] <somiaj> replaced-url
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• 69[00:35:04] <JordiGH> Nonono, not the one during the install, the one you boot into.
• 70[00:35:08] <JordiGH> With gnome and stuff.
• 71[00:35:19] <NerdTheThird> sudo rm -rf /
• 72[00:35:30] <JordiGH> NerdTheThird: Not funny.
• 73[00:35:39] <JordiGH> Anyone who doesn't know what that means, don't run that command.
• 74[00:35:48] <NerdTheThird> damn, i missed the whole channel
• 75[00:35:50] <somiaj> NerdTheThird: saying such things will earn a ban.
• 76[00:35:51] <JordiGH> somiaj: You have a choice of systems to boot in grub, and there's one where you can boot into and test Debian out.
• 77[00:35:52] <NerdTheThird> sorry guys, dont do that
• 78[00:36:15] <somiaj> JordiGH: hmm, I'm surprised vi or vim is not there then. do you recall what live image you were using? stretch and gnome?
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• 80[00:36:24] <JordiGH> Yeah, stretch and gnome.
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• 82[00:36:55] <killwill> hi ther
• 83[00:37:12] <somiaj> JordiGH: replaced-url
• 84[00:37:43] <killwill> can someone give me the command to install the AMD's graphic cards' drivers?
• 85[00:37:52] <JordiGH> Then why did "sudo vi" not load vi for me?
• 86[00:37:54] <JordiGH> I swear I tried.
• 87[00:38:14] <killwill> yesterday twb told me to add the backports fist
• 88[00:38:17] <somiaj> killwill: they should be installed by default, but many amd graphics cards will work better if you install firmware-amd-graphics
• 89[00:38:36] <somiaj> killwill: if you have newer amd hardware, maybe a kernel and firmware from stretch-backports will help.
• 90[00:38:53] <killwill> somiaj, no drivers man
• 91[00:38:55] <somiaj> JordiGH: well I don't know what the issue was, everything I see says it should have been in the live enviorment.
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• 93[00:39:13] <somiaj> killwill: the drivers are in the kernel, you don't need anything extra for them. Though you may want the firmware (or newer kenrnel/firmware from backports)
• 94[00:39:47] <killwill> somiaj, ok i guess it is the firmware then
• 95[00:40:20] <killwill> somiaj, what have i to do after the firmware installation?
• 96[00:40:31] <somiaj> reboot
• 97[00:40:52] <killwill> k
• 98[00:41:00] <somiaj> (unsure how hard it is to unload and reload the kms module with out a reboot)
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• 109[00:51:14] <AlexPortable> I'm trying to share a folder (/opt/test/) inside a chroot, but I don't have that much luck.. mounted it with bind, but the folder just seems to be empty
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• 111[00:51:54] <AlexPortable> can't write in the folder mounted folder, no permission. normal folder works fine. normal folder ls -la: `drwxrwx--x 10 root . drwxrwx--x 8 root .. drwxrwx--x 4 root folder2`
• 112[00:52:21] <ebrasca> How good talosII support in debian is?
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• 138[01:19:01] <awal1> how can I get dmenu list only gui apps?
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• 141[01:19:51] <awal1> nothing in manual but some one may have worked that via a script/modifying source?
• 142[01:20:42] <annadane> don't think you'd be able to
• 143[01:20:53] <annadane> only manually
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• 145[01:21:35] <awal1> "only manually" ?
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• 147[01:21:54] <annadane> as in, add/remove programs to dmenu which are GUI based
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• 149[01:22:19] <tomreyn> hi, i just installed debian 9.4 on an a system with 2x2 ssds (2 for OS, 2 for data). except for the ESP and /boot everything is on top of both a RAID-1 and dmcrypt-luks and LVM2 layer. i'm now looking into getting fstrim to work. it does work on /boot (which is ext4 on a mdadm mirror raid 'only'), but not on any other file system.
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• 151[01:22:59] <annadane> that's complicated. :P
• 152[01:23:23] <tomreyn> in a very similar configuration, it works on ubuntu 16.04 (kernel 4.15) for all file systems.
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• 156[01:24:11] <awal1> annadane, is not a standard menu like gnome-menus or similars "dmenu is a dynamic menu for X, which reads a list of newline-separated items from stdin..."
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• 159[01:24:38] <annadane> i'm pretty sure you can add/remove entries
• 160[01:24:43] <awal1> it is a great utility you may want to try :P
• 161[01:24:53] <annadane> i may be wrong though
• 162[01:24:56] <tomreyn> i rgrep'd /etc for both 'trim' and 'discard' on both systems and the configurations match (the only difference is that ubuntu comes with a weekly fstrim cron job, debian does not, not sure why)
• 163[01:24:59] <annadane> well, i do have i3 installed
• 164[01:25:25] <awal1> annadane, you wrong yeah, sorry :P
• 165[01:25:36] <awal1> " dmenu is a dynamic menu for X, which reads a list of newline-separated items from stdin. When the user selects an item and presses Return,
• 166[01:25:37] <awal1> their choice is printed to stdout and dmenu terminates. Entering text will narrow the items to those matching the tokens in the input.
• 167[01:25:37] <awal1> dmenu_run is a script used by dwm(1) which lists programs in the user's $PATH and runs the result in their $SHELL."
• 168[01:26:32] <awal1> I guess many wm's users runs it
• 169[01:27:03] <awal1> users focused on minimalism
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• 192[01:45:01] <ebrasca> How good talosII support in debian is?
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• 252[02:50:45] <lulix> I have an issue with installing packages. I have some background info here replaced-url
• 253[02:51:20] <lulix> Any help is appreciated even if it doesn't solve the problem but is educational
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• 257[02:52:35] <somiaj> !bat
• 258[02:52:35] <dpkg> In order to troubleshoot your problem with apt-get, apt or aptitude we need ALL OF THE FOLLOWING information: 1. complete output of your apt-get/apt/aptitude run (including the command used) 2. output from "apt-cache policy pkg1 pkg2..." for ALL packages mentioned ANYWHERE in the problem, and 3. "apt-cache policy". Use replaced-url
• 259[02:52:47] <somiaj> lulix: please provide the exact command you run, any errors and the rest of the info requested.
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• 262[02:53:23] <somiaj> though at first look, input/output error sounds like bad hardware, something like it cannot read something on your harddrive, check dmesg and see if you have any hardware issues.
• 263[02:54:03] <somiaj> also compling python from source -- that sounds bad, debian packages depend on python, and having a different version of python installed than is provided by debian can lead to problems.
• 264[02:54:30] <lulix> make altinstall prevents python3.6.5 from overwriting or interfereing with older versions of Python.
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• 266[02:54:58] <lulix> I do get hardware errors from dmesg but
• 267[02:55:00] <somiaj> if you have your custom python nicely isolated using a python virtual enviroment, that is okay.
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• 269[02:55:23] <somiaj> intput/output error sounds like a bad file system, hard disk. This is saying dpkg cannot read the file because something has been corrupted.
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• 271[02:55:44] <somiaj> could just be a single file has been corrupted and needs to be rebuilt
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• 274[02:56:00] <lulix> I was worried about such. I was hoping there was something else I wasn't considering
• 275[02:56:17] <lulix> Thank you somiaj this told me I was gonna have to bite the bullet
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• 280[02:57:56] <lightx> quick question, my static eth0 interfaces doesnt come up on boot time, its configured properly in /etc/network/interfaces ..
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• 282[02:58:12] <lightx> i have to bring it up with ifconfig
• 283[02:58:22] <lightx> any idea what I should be looking at?
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• 287[02:59:19] <dvs> lightx, auto eth0
• 288[02:59:38] <somiaj> lightx: that is needed in the interfaces fill to automatically bring up interfaces at boot.
• 289[02:59:41] <dvs> or allow-hotplug eth0
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• 291[03:00:07] <somiaj> does that always work, won't that only trigger when the cord is plugged in, but if it is already plugged in it may not trigger that event?
• 292[03:00:22] <lightx> im wondering about static
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• 294[03:00:53] <dvs> somiaj, allow-hotplug always works for me. Maybe I'm lucky.
• 295[03:01:04] <somiaj> oh wait you are bringing it up with ifconfig (not ifup). Does ifup eth0 work? Care to share your interfaces file.
• 296[03:01:24] <somiaj> dvs: I'm unsure, just the name to me makes me unsure if it brings it up at boot or not.
• 297[03:02:14] <lightx> its the typical : iface eth0 inet static, address x.x.x.x, netmask 255.255.255.0, gateway x.x.x.x
• 298[03:02:23] <dvs> somiaj, I think the link is brought up on boot if there is a plug in the port.
• 299[03:02:31] <somiaj> dvs: sounds reasonable
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• 301[03:02:48] <somiaj> lightx: sounds like you are missing an auto line. Though usually best to just share the file if you want people to help debug and not paraphrase.
• 302[03:03:24] <lightx> yeah i dont have the auto line, i was thinking it was for dhcp only
• 303[03:03:33] <somiaj> that is to bring up at boot
• 304[03:04:15] <lightx> well woops
• 305[03:04:20] <lightx> somiaj: thanks
• 306[03:04:37] <somiaj> and dvs as well, he won this round! (:
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• 308[03:04:56] <dvs> !beer me
• 309[03:04:56] * dpkg deftly decants a fine Gulden Drak for dvs
• 310[03:05:05] <lightx> brb, ill test this
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• 313[03:06:43] <lightx> totally works, awesome..
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• 315[03:07:13] <lightx> !beer dvs
• 316[03:07:13] * dpkg deftly decants a fine Yuengling Lager for dvs
• 317[03:07:29] <lightx> !beer somiaj
• 318[03:07:29] * dpkg pulls out a fine Delirium Tremens for somiaj
• 319[03:07:32] <dvs> *hiccup*
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• 350[03:40:40] <JordiGH> Is it possible for `apt install emacs` to always check the Debian repos and ignore the local list? Some kind of automated `apt update && apt install emacs` ?
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• 369[03:53:12] <lightx> anyone know whats the proper way to set the default browser in debian testing?
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• 372[03:55:06] <dvs> lightx, update-alternatives --config x-replaced-url
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• 375[03:58:33] <lightx> whats the difference betweel x-replaced-url
• 376[03:58:46] <dvs> dunno
• 377[04:00:50] <noodlepie> x-replaced-url
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• 379[04:02:07] <lightx> im running i3 and whenever I open a link, its starts chromium
• 380[04:02:28] <lightx> im trying to make it open in qutebrowser
• 381[04:03:19] <dvs> lightx, so run "update-alternatives --list x-replaced-url
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• 388[04:07:05] <lightx> anyone know what config files it actually modify, .. im new to the update-alternatives system
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• 411[04:09:57] <harison> hi
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• 413[04:10:54] <rpifan> hi
• 414[04:11:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1520
• 415[04:11:02] <dvs> bye!
• 416[04:11:45] <harison> how i can install the second dvd of debain 9 after installing the first dvd
• 417[04:11:50] <harison> ?
• 418[04:11:52] <JordiGH> systemd is in charge of mounting all of those virtual filesystems, right? Where is the config for that?
• 419[04:12:07] <dvs> apt-cdrom add?
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• 421[04:12:44] <harison> its just my first time using debian
• 422[04:12:51] <dvs> harison, why are you installing DVD roms? No internet connection?
• 423[04:13:05] <JordiGH> Or a thin pipe.
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• 426[04:13:34] <harison> i have internet conection i want to install the dvd just for teting
• 427[04:13:56] <harison> *testing*
• 428[04:14:28] <dvs> harison, you can just install the first DVD. It will install a working system.
• 429[04:14:47] <harison> i know
• 430[04:14:50] <lightx> so .. change the default browser using i3, I used xdf-settings set default-web-browser qutebrowser.desktop
• 431[04:15:02] <lightx> i mean xdg-settings
• 432[04:15:34] <lightx> too much beer from dvs
• 433[04:15:37] <lightx> !beer dvs
• 434[04:15:38] * dpkg pulls out a tasty Gulden Drak for dvs
• 435[04:15:41] <lightx> ;-)
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• 438[04:16:54] <lightx> what are DVDs?
• 439[04:17:21] <rpifan> dvds are ancient things
• 440[04:17:22] <dvs> harison, well, there is a part of the installation that asks to add more DVDs to the install. I haven't used it in a long time though.
• 441[04:17:22] <harison> same as cd
• 442[04:17:23] <rpifan> we used to have
• 443[04:17:35] <rpifan> before flashdrives
• 444[04:17:44] <harison> forget the DVDs
• 445[04:17:44] <dvs> ancient X-)
• 446[04:17:57] <lightx> laserdisk?
• 447[04:18:03] *** Quits: zZzZzZ (~zZzZzZ@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 255 seconds)
• 448[04:18:13] <lightx> floppy drive
• 449[04:18:28] <lightx> stop, ill start crying
• 450[04:18:42] <JordiGH> lightx: They're kind of like zip drives but bigger.
• 451[04:19:11] <harison> which apps yours recomendo to install on my debian 9?
• 452[04:19:48] <harison> like games, burning tools, multimedia, office suite and others
• 453[04:19:48] <dvs> depends what you want to do
• 454[04:19:52] <somiaj> harison: installing apps is fairly easy when they are in the debian repos. If you have a DE installed, I would just install things as you find a need for them.
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• 458[04:20:12] <lightx> harison: thats a pretty open question
• 459[04:20:18] <JordiGH> harison: I recommend Wesnoth.
• 460[04:20:21] <JordiGH> Still an awesome game.
• 461[04:20:26] <dvs> harison, the best way is to get a basic system installed and then add the apps afterwards.
• 462[04:20:29] <JordiGH> Hex-a-hop is fun too!
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• 464[04:20:49] <JordiGH> nexuiz is cool too, if you want more action.
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• 468[04:21:09] <JordiGH> Dolphin emulates GameCube games really well too. PCSX2 works for PS2 games.
• 469[04:21:30] <JordiGH> Beneath a Steel Sky is a fun adventure game.
• 470[04:21:42] <JordiGH> I couldn't get into Flight of the Amazon Queen, but I think it's the same engine.
• 471[04:22:04] <lightx> I installed retropie on a rpi3 and it was fantastic
• 472[04:22:19] <lightx> but .. you know open ended questions
• 473[04:22:23] <JordiGH> Mednafen is a good emulator just about every console up until the Playstation 1.
• 474[04:22:37] <JordiGH> Shit, I think I play too many game.s
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• 476[04:23:01] <lightx> JordiGH: glad you have time for what you enjoy..
• 477[04:23:04] <lightx> ;-)
• 478[04:23:22] <JordiGH> mednafen was great for Final Fantasy VII.
• 479[04:23:27] <JordiGH> And VIII and IX
• 480[04:23:45] <harison> if one of yours want my pc specs they have 2g ram, single core 2ghz processor(64bits) no graphcs card
• 481[04:24:02] <JordiGH> Okay, forget mednafen and Dolphin and Nexuiz.
• 482[04:24:06] <JordiGH> But Wesnoth should be fine.
• 483[04:24:23] <JordiGH> fceux should be fine too for NES games.
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• 485[04:26:16] <harison> i like retro games just like snes, nes, nintendo 64, ps1 and others similar consoles
• 486[04:26:38] <JordiGH> mednafen is a pretty good snes emulator.
• 487[04:26:42] <harison> i am installing wesnoth now
• 488[04:26:52] <JordiGH> There are some great FFVI retranslation roms out there.
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• 490[04:27:17] <JordiGH> mednafen might have trouble with PS1 games with your hardware.
• 491[04:27:23] <JordiGH> But you could try it!
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• 496[04:31:15] <harison> just a bit ago i used windows epcsxe for ps1 f=games and i get a nice performance
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• 498[04:32:15] <JordiGH> I had better luck with mednafen than epcsxe.
• 499[04:32:26] <JordiGH> The mednafen interface is a bit more barebones but the performance was better.
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• 501[04:33:03] <harison> i installing wesnoth and they complete the download i will install mednafen
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• 504[04:34:52] <JordiGH> If it weren't so late for me, I'd challenge you to a Wesnoth match.
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• 506[04:35:43] <harison> download on 75%
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• 518[04:44:43] <OS-34254> join
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• 540[05:01:35] <JordiGH> What was the name of the crazy cdrtools guy?
• 541[05:01:39] <JordiGH> German guy?
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• 543[05:01:51] <JordiGH> Was deliberately using CDDL to piss off the GPL?
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• 545[05:04:27] <JordiGH> Jörg Schilling!
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• 553[05:22:18] <hgs> hi guys, i am trying build debian rootfs for arm64. Following are the logs from chroot/debootstrap/debootstrap.log replaced-url
• 554[05:23:03] <hgs> i believe the error at the end "/bin/rm: cannot remove '//debootstrap': Directory not empty" is the reason why it fails to continue
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• 556[05:23:41] <hgs> it would as simple as adding rm -rf but i cannot find the script which does this. any help?
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• 558[05:25:01] <hgs> iam Building a base debian system by ubuntu-build-service for arm64 platform
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• 569[05:44:39] <somiaj> hgs: there seems to be a lot of other warnings in that output too. Maybe the script isn't fully compadable with debian (since it is a ubuntu-build-service)
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• 571[05:45:04] <somiaj> maybe try to do it more manually than using ubuntu's build service.
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• 573[05:46:00] <somiaj> hgs: replaced-url
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• 578[05:48:03] <loliz> somiaj I believe you were the one who assisted me earlier with a readlinelib5 I/O error? i re-installed my OS and installed the same packages. no errors from dmesg now. I suspect I had something with the ISO. I doubt it was package dependencies because I had all the same exact packages installed on with compiled versions of python and perl and etc. anyways, thanks.
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• 607[06:13:17] <Tikilou> Hi guys
• 608[06:13:20] <Tikilou> I have a question, i want to boot GRUB bootloader on a no PC hardware, but with X86_64 CPU. I have the possibility to boot a Bzimage and Initramfs, but there is no accessible bios, and no UEFI, do you have any idea about it ?
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• 610[06:14:00] <rpifan> what do you mean no pc?
• 611[06:14:10] <Tikilou> A non standard computer.
• 612[06:14:26] <rpifan> what do you mean by non standard computer
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• 614[06:14:33] <Tikilou> With many bootloader security, but bypassed for booting a Bzimage
• 615[06:14:48] <Tikilou> A Sony Playstation 4 Pro.
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• 617[06:15:04] <rpifan> oh
• 618[06:15:06] <Tikilou> I have already booted Linux successfully on her.
• 619[06:15:21] <Tikilou> But a bootloader like grub could be very usefull
• 620[06:16:09] <rpifan> what for
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• 624[06:17:25] <Tikilou> Promote Linux environment like a good support for homebrews.
• 625[06:17:35] <Tikilou> Emulators, Kodi, etc...
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• 627[06:17:50] <Tikilou> Many people juste want piracy Unity or Sony SDK
• 628[06:18:00] <Tikilou> I want to promote Linux fore replace OrbisOS kernel
• 629[06:18:04] <Tikilou> for *
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• 633[06:19:29] <rpifan> to
• 634[06:19:31] <rpifan> not for
• 635[06:19:40] <rpifan> grub is dead in fact
• 636[06:19:41] <somiaj> it might not be possible to use grub if you don't have a standard bios/uefi enviorment.
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• 638[06:19:50] <rpifan> on newere efi systems
• 639[06:19:53] <rpifan> you can boot with efistub
• 640[06:19:56] <rpifan> no need for a bootloader
• 641[06:20:06] <somiaj> since grub needs to know how to boot, grub-pc and grub-efi are different flavors of grub for legacy and uefi support.
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• 643[06:21:21] <somiaj> and grub isn't dead, still many who use it, but agreed, with uefi, a seperate bootloader really isn't needed, but many like grub since they are acustom to it.
• 644[06:21:53] <Tikilou> Efistub ? I'm gonna check it...
• 645[06:22:04] <somiaj> it only works if you have uefi, which you said you didn't
• 646[06:22:34] <Tikilou> But a free bootloader will be usefull on PS4, like grub for booting multi distro. Juste specialised for one apps, exactly like proprietary apps on PS4.
• 647[06:22:56] <Tikilou> Yeah, not mbr boot, no uefi
• 648[06:23:37] <Tikilou> PS4 load a little part of BSD custom OS on the internal NAND. Then load full part of system on an encrypted partition on Hard drive
• 649[06:23:48] <somiaj> well efistub isn't a bootloader, it is more put info in the efi partition and let the uefi be the bootloader
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• 652[06:24:55] <rpifan> yea
• 653[06:24:57] <rpifan> i like efistub
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• 655[06:25:31] <Tikilou> If your are curious, look lines 133 to 171 : replaced-url
• 656[06:25:44] <Tikilou> This is our bootloader for Bzimage on PS4
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• 659[06:26:21] <rpifan> im not lol
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• 771[07:55:10] <mindloop> What is the status for AMD drivers in Debian. This is for a 6310 (wrestler) grapics card
• 772[07:55:55] <mindloop> We are at debian 9.4, the documentation stops at debian 8
• 773[07:56:28] <Tikilou> i have another question. Actually we booting up a Linux kernel from a FreeBSD custom Kernel. It's any way possible to boot a Linux Kernel from a Linux Kernel ?
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• 797[08:14:11] <michael2> Tikilou: cant you start the kernel from the boot loader?
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• 801[08:15:52] <Tikilou> No, there is no standard bootloader on PS4
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• 803[08:16:11] <Tikilou> it's a proprietary bootloader with CPU key DRM.
• 804[08:17:35] <michael2> like secure boot?
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• 810[08:20:08] <Tikilou> Worse, much worse, and it's not a bios or UEFI
• 811[08:20:51] <Tikilou> replaced-url
• 812[08:22:00] <michael2> jeez, full blown tivo-isation huh?
• 813[08:22:31] <Tikilou> Yeah
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• 822[08:25:05] <michael2> sorry, don't know of a way to get around that for you
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• 954[09:47:24] <tobias> hey i get an error running 'apt-get upgrade' that /etc/resolv.conf is immutable. I dont want to change that. Can i tell apt to ignore that ?
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• 959[09:49:26] <tobias> replaced-url
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• 961[09:50:11] <somiaj> the error tells you how to fix it
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• 963[09:50:44] <somiaj> unsure how it got that way if you already had /etc/resolv.conf installed. Is it a semilink?
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• 966[09:51:39] * alkisg can't see paste.debian.net any more, Error code: SSL_ERROR_EXPIRED_CERT_ALERT
• 967[09:52:01] <tobias> it is not a link. i need the immutable bit that network manager doesnt overwrite it .
• 968[09:52:16] <somiaj> then why are you installing resolv.conf
• 969[09:52:35] <somiaj> I mean resolvconf. resolvconf makes it a semilink and controls it, so things like networkmanager don't overwrite it
• 970[09:52:57] <somiaj> i.e. the purpose of the package you installed is to help with that exact issue, but then you manually did your own thing, hence the problem.
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• 973[09:53:58] <tobias> solved . i deinstalled the resolvconf package. Thanks
• 974[09:54:32] <somiaj> I personally would use resolvconf for that purpose, you can make it so things like network mangaer and other dhcp clients don't overwrite /etc/resolv.conf
• 975[09:54:38] <somiaj> or openresolv, the other option.
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• 978[09:55:25] <somiaj> alkisg: works fine here, what are you using to connect to paste.debian.net?
• 979[09:56:02] <somiaj> alkisg: also check the output of date, is time set correctly on your machine.
• 980[09:56:30] <alkisg> somiaj: currently on ubuntu 18.04 with firefox 60, date is correct, are you trying https or http?
• 981[09:56:52] <alkisg> It does work with http
• 982[09:56:54] <somiaj> https, cert is valid until august this year.
• 983[09:56:58] <alkisg> Hrm
• 984[09:57:12] <somiaj> also you should probably be pointing out this issue to ubuntu and firefox.
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• 987[09:57:48] <alkisg> somiaj: maybe; or maybe to paste.debian.net; checking...
• 988[09:57:50] <somiaj> cert was issued may 4th 2018 and expires aug 2 2018, so maybe something on your end is confused, but everything looks valid here.
• 989[09:58:04] <alkisg> Let me try from stretch
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• 997[10:02:29] <alkisg> somiaj: ah, got it. It's talking about *my* certificate from alioth. I don't even know why it's asking me that periodically, maybe some SSO thing.
• 998[10:03:20] <somiaj> ahh nice
• 999[10:04:12] <alkisg> CN=alkisg-guest@users.alioth.debian.org, expired May 5th
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• 1001[10:04:33] <alkisg> Is that something I need to update, or related to the alioth deprecation and I shouldn't worry about it?
• 1002[10:04:52] <somiaj> yea that looks like the date that a new cert was issued for paste.debian.net too. I saw some google hits about disabling two way cert auth if it isn't needed
• 1003[10:04:58] <somiaj> I am unsure on that
• 1004[10:05:22] <alkisg> If I press "cancel" on the "select identity/certificate" dialog, then it shows the site properly
• 1005[10:06:06] <ejr> where would I put the line "powertop --auto-tune" that used to be in rc.local before systemd?
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• 1007[10:06:31] <ejr> (it's to prevent the shrill sound that the fan or cpu makes on a librebooted device running linux)
• 1008[10:06:55] <somiaj> rc.local works with systemd, create /etc/rc.local and make it executable. Or write a custom systemd unit file
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• 1014[10:10:46] <ejr> somiaj: alright, thanks!
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• 1047[10:33:26] <alkisg> I can't update my alioth sso certificate, replaced-url
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• 1074[10:48:34] <Meerkat> I have followed this guide to add boot entry for Windows 10. replaced-url
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• 1079[10:49:46] <somiaj> alkisg: maybe #debain-mentors on irc.oftc.net could help with that.
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• 1085[10:51:20] <somiaj> Meerkat: double check you set the UUID correctly. Though if you install the os-prober package, it might find and configure thigns for your automatically, as opposed to manually.
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• 1087[10:51:31] <themill> alkisg: alioth is no longer doing SSO
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• 1090[10:52:57] <themill> alkisg: replaced-url
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• 1138[11:10:07] <kale> hi, i get something funny from kdenlive "symbol qt_qhash_seed version Qt_5 not defined in file libQt5Core.so.5 with link time reference", trying to reinstall libqt5core5a says the package cannot be downloaded. what can i do to fix this?
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• 1147[11:12:31] <ov3rmind> hi great guys, here is time to say good morning! it'a pleasure tc with yours !
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• 1159[11:16:13] <themill> kale: which arch and which release is this?
• 1160[11:16:22] <kale> amd64, stretch 9.4
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• 1163[11:16:48] <themill> libqt5core5a certainly exists
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• 1165[11:17:04] <kale> it is installed too
• 1166[11:17:08] <themill> What's the output of "apt-cache policy libqt5core5a kdenlive; apt-cache policy"?
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• 1170[11:18:27] <kale> replaced-url
• 1171[11:18:53] <themill> Ahh... random libqt5core5a from sid doesn't help here
• 1172[11:20:17] <kale> themill, sorry, thought i got rid of all that sid stuff, will uninstall and pull the stable version
• 1173[11:20:46] <themill> "aptitude install libqt5core5a=5.7.1+dfsg-3+b1" will hopefully do it.
• 1174[11:20:51] <themill> !not available
• 1175[11:20:52] <dpkg> To get a list of packages you have installed now, that are not available from any repository in your sources.list: aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))'
• 1176[11:20:57] <themill> ^^ check what else you might have
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• 1192[11:32:09] <briner> I'm trying to use an iso as a source for constructing a flatpak ? Inside the iso, their is an installer script to launch. As a non-root user, I'd like to automate the process. Unfortunately I do not know how to mount (or something else) the iso, so that I can launch the installer.
• 1193[11:33:20] <kale> themill not aptitude apparently :-)
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• 1195[11:34:03] <kale> themill, is everything in the list from my old sid mistake?
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• 1197[11:34:23] <themill> dpkg: tell briner about mount iso
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• 1199[11:35:13] <themill> kale: old things that were not removed from a previous jessie→stretch upgrade would be there too. Locally built packages too. Basically, anything that apt can't figure out how to install right now is in that list.
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• 1201[11:35:45] <kale> 833 packages
• 1202[11:35:49] <briner> themill: sorry I do not really understand ? As said, my problem is how do I do to mount (or something similar) an iso as a non-root user ?
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• 1204[11:37:13] <kale> briner: you may be lycky that fuse can do that
• 1205[11:37:50] <themill> kale: ouch. what is in "aptitude search ~c" (that's obsolete packages rather than not available packages
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• 1207[11:38:47] <briner> kale: Do you know if Debian Developper, do such things when creating dpkg from an ISO (which only holds non-source files) ?
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• 1212[11:39:31] <themill> briner: Not sure what you're trying to do really, but what dpkg said is how you mount the iso image
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• 1216[11:40:57] <briner> themill: I used to create dpkg from binary to deploy proprietary softw
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• 1218[11:41:04] <briner> are within apt
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• 1225[11:45:43] <bipul> How to check the public and private key integrity? Since I have lot of keys, And i am not sure which private key matches it's public key?
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• 1227[11:47:42] <kale> themill: i did earlier by mistake upgrade to sid, an dthouhgt to have downgraded everything back to stable again. That might be the reason for the high number of packages. aptitude search ~c|wc returns 500 packages
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• 1229[11:48:10] <jelly> bipul: keys for what, pgp? ssh? ssl?
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• 1234[11:50:39] <kale> briner: i do not know what developer do/did or what you did, but you can try these fuse packages: fuseiso and fuseiso9660
• 1235[11:51:45] <bipul> jelly, ssh
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• 1256[12:01:43] <themill> kale: you might be able to get the downgrade to work still, «/msg dpkg partial downgrade». At some point it becomes easier to either accept it's broken and reinstall or accept it is upgraded and upgrade to testing.
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• 1259[12:02:09] <jelly> bipul: use ssh-keygen -l -f ... to find private and public keys with matching fingerprints
• 1260[12:02:31] <kale> themill: at least it will get fixed when i go to whatever comes after stretch. :-)
• 1261[12:02:49] <bipul> jelly, Thank you.
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• 1263[12:04:09] <edi> can i ask dnsmasq questions here? use on debian system
• 1264[12:04:12] <jelly> bipul: basically ssh-keygen has all sorts of key manipulation tools, it's not just "gen"
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• 1266[12:04:34] <bipul> Yes let me check.
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• 1275[12:10:04] <bipul> Yes, it works thank you.
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• 1284[12:14:21] <sysvalve> hey, quick question: when you build a deb package, is it required (or recommended) for any reason that you build it inside the target distribution environment?
• 1285[12:14:55] <sysvalve> i.e. Can I build a package inside a "jessie" machine to be deployed to all Debian distros (stable, oldstable, testing) and some Ubuntus?
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• 1289[12:15:59] <themill> sysvalve: as soon as shared libraries are involved it must be done in the target release.
• 1290[12:16:18] <sysvalve> themill: other than that? If it's just scripts?
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• 1292[12:16:31] <sysvalve> the only issue would be dynamic linkling to the right library, right?
• 1293[12:17:11] <themill> the right python version for modules too; shell scripts are only being copied in not built
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• 1301[12:20:48] <sysvalve> themill: thank you!
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• 1304[12:21:57] <edi> i got this strange behaviour
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• 1306[12:22:06] <edi> so i'm on a debian server, that does dnsmasq
• 1307[12:22:23] <edi> i want to set a static lease to a client 1.2.3.4
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• 1309[12:22:47] <edi> but when (after the client declines the ip) I ping the 1.2.3.4 address
• 1310[12:22:54] <petn-randall> !enter
• 1311[12:22:54] <dpkg> The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel.
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• 1313[12:22:58] <edi> i get back a response from the server's interface itself
• 1314[12:23:04] <edi> (i checked the mac)
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• 1318[12:23:29] <edi> without this address being configured in eiter network/interfaces or showing up using "ip a"
• 1319[12:23:40] <edi> i'm stunned
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• 1328[12:28:55] <petn-randall> edi: Can you show us the output of both 'ip a' and 'ping <address>'? → replaced-url
• 1329[12:29:19] <petn-randall> (I'm assuming that you don't own 1.2.3.4, it's better to use the real case instead of an example)
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• 1336[12:31:30] <edi> petn-randall, pastebin otw
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• 1345[12:33:47] <edi> petn-randall, replaced-url
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• 1355[12:36:20] <alkisg> Thank you themill :)
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• 1359[12:37:19] <nwe> hello debian versio 8.8 whats the name of that release?
• 1360[12:37:28] <shtrb|laptop> What is a good choice of running router/vpn contained instances ? (using vbox and I think there should be a better option )
• 1361[12:37:55] <shtrb|laptop> nwe, jessie
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• 1366[12:41:33] <nwe> shtrb|laptop: okey, thanks can I see the version/name somewhere?
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• 1368[12:42:38] <shtrb|laptop> cat /etc/debian_version (but that is by what installed) , (if I understand your question correctly)
• 1369[12:43:17] <shtrb|laptop> nwe, or replaced-url
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• 1378[12:50:04] <nwe> must I have ifenslave to setup bonding in debian?
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• 1380[12:50:24] <petn-randall> edi: It's not the host responding, those mac addresses don't match up.
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• 1382[12:50:43] <petn-randall> edi: So it must be a different host on the network that already has that IP address.
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• 1385[12:51:49] <shtrb|laptop> nwe, it's what "enable" the attachment
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• 1388[12:53:24] <shtrb|laptop> but bonding kernel, and ifup exist regardless of it
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• 1392[12:56:58] <shtrb|laptop> nwe, you might be able to work without it by ip link add name type bond mode ... , and then manually adding it with ip link set interfacename master name
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• 1401[13:03:11] <nwe> oh, okey
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• 1422[13:15:31] <briner> kale: I'll try the fuseiso* idea
• 1423[13:15:42] <briner> thanks for the help. Always appreciated
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• 1456[13:34:51] <Emil> Anyone have recommendations on which VNC viewer to use from the repos?
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• 1481[13:50:39] <BCMM> Emil: i just use tiger
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• 1484[13:52:27] <BCMM> Emil: but if you want one with more of a graphical frontend for choosing connection options, there's vinagre (gnome) or krdc (kde)
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• 1495[13:57:29] <Emil> hmm, rdesktop manages to connect but tiger just says connection refused
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• 1497[13:58:38] <Emil> ah had to specify port
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• 1499[13:58:59] <Emil> but hmm, no screen comes up
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• 1525[14:16:47] <BCMM> Emil: well, is it actually a VNC server?
• 1526[14:17:12] <BCMM> Emil: because I thought rdesktop was an RDP client - different protocol
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• 1531[14:22:22] <Emil> ah
• 1532[14:22:27] <Emil> I was told I can just vnc to it
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• 1534[14:22:36] <Emil> perhaps they weren't pedantic enough and it's just rdp
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• 1537[14:24:13] <shtrb|laptop> there are vnc extensions (SSL and different rfbs ) and there is vnc over ssh
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• 1541[14:24:49] <dak> hrm
• 1542[14:24:54] <shtrb|laptop> Emil, try telnet ip 5900 to see if it actually works
• 1543[14:24:56] <shtrb|laptop> *listen
• 1544[14:26:30] <jair> Emil: I am just jumping in here, but depends of what you are trying to do, there is nomachine and teamviewer both excellent for remote control a linux/windows environment (^^)
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• 1547[14:27:05] <shtrb|laptop> or nc ip 5900
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• 1550[14:28:57] <cef> I think rdesktop does vnc as well.. most of the client that use the freerdp libs seem to support vnc as well
• 1551[14:29:32] <shtrb|laptop> rdesktop is a special case (it's outdated )
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• 1556[14:30:25] <cef> fwiw: I've found remmina to be fairly nice to use, but YMMV
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• 1587[14:49:53] <shtrb|laptop> Anyone have an idea how to identify the difference between two sdcards what is wrong with the file system ? (one created by debian the other a camera), the card formated by a debian is not readable by the cam
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• 1590[14:52:00] <kale> shtrb|laptop: possible missing or non missing partitions table, debian may format as ext4, where the camera expects vfat
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• 1593[14:52:33] <shtrb|laptop> kale, sorry both format in vfat
• 1594[14:52:39] <shtrb|laptop> and both have parttion table
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• 1596[14:53:22] <thican> Hello everyone, may I have some help please about creating a runlevel daemon which its purpose is to execute one script .sh for start, and another for stop? Full-disclosure: replaced-url
• 1597[14:53:42] <thican> Unfortunately, the service fails to start; here's the log from systemctl status: replaced-url
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• 1599[14:54:06] <thican> I am on Debian 9
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• 1601[14:54:37] <shtrb|laptop> ahahah , debian declared that as fat16!
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• 1603[14:55:03] <kale> shtrb|laptop: mkfs.vfat -F32
• 1604[14:55:33] <shtrb|laptop> I only need to backup 32 GiB first :-( , but thanks
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• 1606[14:56:16] <kale> shtrb|laptop: i tried earlier to copy images to an SDcard to see if the camera would show them, but never succeed.
• 1607[14:56:48] <shtrb|laptop> it was working always, the only change for me was inital format
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• 1641[15:17:05] <AlexPortable> Can someone help me getting shared folders to work in a chrooted environment?
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• 1643[15:17:44] <petn-randall> !ask
• 1644[15:17:44] <dpkg> If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>.
• 1645[15:17:57] *** Quits: stealintv (~stealintv@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 1646[15:18:11] <AlexPortable> Mounted a folder with bind to chrooted location, but folder is empty for the user
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• 1652[15:28:17] <ov3rmind> dig
• 1653[15:28:23] <ov3rmind> ops
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• 1655[15:28:28] <ov3rmind> err...
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• 1657[15:29:24] <shtrb|laptop> AlexPortable, does user have perms to read ?
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• 1675[15:40:23] <AlexPortable> shtrb|laptop: yes, when not using chroot the user can access (see, write, whatever) the folder just fine
• 1676[15:41:37] <shtrb|laptop> user inside the chroot
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• 1678[15:41:51] <petn-randall> AlexPortable: Do you get an error if you try to `ls` in the bind mounted folder within the chroot?
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• 1681[15:43:34] <AlexPortable> no idea, can't really check since i dont have terminal access
• 1682[15:44:36] <shtrb|laptop> can you try tro create a file by that user ?
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• 1685[15:45:42] <AlexPortable> that gives permission denied
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• 1700[15:52:20] <petn-randall> AlexPortable: How are you accessing it then?
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• 1703[15:53:15] <AlexPortable> sftp
• 1704[15:53:45] <shtrb|laptop> there is good chance you have ssh too (admins sometimes forget to disable it)
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• 1813[16:47:07] <AlexPortable> shtrb|laptop: nope ssh not working
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• 1851[17:04:35] <st_iron> hi
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• 1928[17:51:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1584
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• 2010[18:32:55] <jdaeira> I can't find a package to preview raw thumbnails in Gnome. Anyone know of one?
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• 2024[18:41:46] <Thedarkb-X40> I'm trying to install Debian on my Z60m
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• 2027[18:42:27] <Thedarkb-X40> I've got the ipw2200 drivers but IPv6 is just spitting out wlp20s2: link is not ready
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• 2033[18:45:07] <shtrb|laptop> firmware ?
• 2034[18:45:47] <shtrb|laptop> and make sure you do a full shutdown and start into debian (not restart)
• 2035[18:45:51] <Thedarkb-X40> Yes.
• 2036[18:45:53] <Thedarkb-X40> Firmware.
• 2037[18:45:59] <Thedarkb-X40> I'm actually just in the installer.
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• 2039[18:46:24] <shtrb|laptop> have you installed the firmware (normally installer does not have non freee firmwares)
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• 2041[18:46:27] <petn-randall> Thedarkb-X40: Are you using the firmware installer?
• 2042[18:46:37] <Thedarkb-X40> Yes.
• 2043[18:46:51] <Thedarkb-X40> Don't tell me it's unsupported or something.
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• 2047[18:47:36] <shtrb|laptop> while slow cpu, that laptop look very nice
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• 2049[18:48:07] <petn-randall> Thedarkb-X40: I'd assume it's supported. If in doubt, use the Ethernet to finish the installation and continue from there. It's easier to debug the issue on a completely installed system.
• 2050[18:48:12] <Thedarkb-X40> The Z60m?
• 2051[18:48:17] <shtrb|laptop> yes
• 2052[18:48:20] <Thedarkb-X40> I've had this issue on this machine too.
• 2053[18:48:25] <Thedarkb-X40> Which has the same card.
• 2054[18:48:31] <Thedarkb-X40> It's not that bad.
• 2055[18:48:40] <Thedarkb-X40> The CPU is socketed and you can swap in a 2.2ghz Dothan.
• 2056[18:48:50] <Thedarkb-X40> Which is basically a 2.2ghz Core Solo without SSE3
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• 2059[18:49:48] <shtrb|laptop> oh , the ads showed me a celeron , but back to our story after finishing install make sure you do a real shutdown and start it again
• 2060[18:50:31] <Thedarkb-X40> Are you sure it didn't say Centrino?
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• 2065[18:51:29] <shtrb|laptop> Intel Celron M 370 or upgrade to 378
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• 2070[18:52:46] <Thedarkb-X40> It's a Banias Pentium M though at least.
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• 2072[18:52:50] <Thedarkb-X40> Not NetBurst.
• 2073[18:53:01] <jsync> Hello. What's the most simple name server software for Debian?
• 2074[18:53:29] <petn-randall> jsync: server or client?
• 2075[18:53:34] <petn-randall> oh nvm
• 2076[18:53:38] <shtrb|laptop> Dnsmasq ?
• 2077[18:53:42] <petn-randall> jsync: dnsmasq probably.
• 2078[18:53:45] <jsync> It's for a local network.
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• 2095[19:07:22] <Kevin49283> Hey.
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• 2097[19:07:34] <shtrb|laptop> !apt-mirror
• 2098[19:07:34] <dpkg> apt-mirror is a tool for making a local mirror of any <APT> source. To mirror multiple architectures, specify "deb-$arch ..." in /etc/apt/mirror.list; e.g. "deb-amd64 replaced-url
• 2099[19:07:38] <shtrb|laptop> jsync, ^
• 2100[19:07:41] <Kevin49283> Does anyone know how to edit /etc/motd.dynamic so I can remove the information about the system?
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• 2102[19:08:10] <Thedarkb-X40> I think I'll install TinyCore Linux.
• 2103[19:08:12] <shtrb|laptop> Kevin49283, you can use your motd file
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• 2112[19:10:07] <Kevin49283> shtrb|laptop: I cannot find the line that displays system information after logging in.
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• 2126[19:15:01] <petn-randall> Kevin49283: Which OS are you running?
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• 2129[19:16:40] <AlexPortable> Mounted a folder with bind to chrooted location, but folder is empty for the user. when not using chroot the user can access (see, write, whatever) the folder just fine
• 2130[19:16:58] <petn-randall> AlexPortable: How are you chrooting?
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• 2133[19:18:03] <Kevin49283> petn-randall: raspbian stretch lite
• 2134[19:18:11] *** Quits: Meerkat (~meerkat@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2135[19:18:38] <greycat> AlexPortable: permissions problem? No read perms on the directory, so it *looks* empty if you used ls?
• 2136[19:19:10] *** Joins: herbmillerjr (~herbmille@replaced-ip)
• 2137[19:19:37] <shtrb|laptop> AlexPortable, didn't we cover it that you have a permission issue already ?
• 2138[19:20:03] <shtrb|laptop> the user inside the chroot need to have read/write permissions
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• 2142[19:20:36] *** Joins: jsync (~jason@replaced-ip)
• 2143[19:21:19] <jsync> So, for setting up a mirror on a local network, is it not recommended to use a symlink within the /var/replaced-url
• 2144[19:21:26] *** Joins: capin (capin@replaced-ip)
• 2145[19:21:42] <shtrb|laptop> only to subfolders of documentroot
• 2146[19:21:48] <shtrb|laptop> not outside
• 2147[19:21:57] <jsync> What does that mean?
• 2148[19:21:59] *** Joins: Rogalian (~cools@replaced-ip)
• 2149[19:22:18] <jsync> Not a symlink to anything located outside of /var/replaced-url
• 2150[19:22:26] <capin> i'm getting lovely ❤️ error messages when running, `sudo apt-get upgrade` replaced-url
• 2151[19:22:40] *** Joins: mibo (~mibo@replaced-ip)
• 2152[19:22:47] <shtrb|laptop> jsync, yes
• 2153[19:23:14] <jsync> So, to make my mirror listed, I need to move the files out of /var/spool & into /var/replaced-url
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• 2156[19:24:03] <shtrb|laptop> how is spool related to a website ?
• 2157[19:24:15] <shtrb|laptop> capin, did you delete some files / had a bad upgrade ?
• 2158[19:24:21] <jsync> /var/spool is where apt-mirror puts the mirror files.
• 2159[19:24:47] <greycat> Only 3 minutes before we learned you're talking about apt-mirror. Not bad.
• 2160[19:25:06] <capin> shtrb|laptop: i usually run `apt-get upgrade --dry-run` before upgrading, that's about it.
• 2161[19:25:15] <jsync> apt-mirror is just a software service for creating a Debian mirror, I think.
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• 2164[19:26:52] <jsync> Do I need to move those files?
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• 2167[19:27:11] <shtrb|laptop> jsync, apt-mirror has a config file where you put files. can you please explain your exact goal ?
• 2168[19:27:22] *** Quits: _ADN_ (~username@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
• 2169[19:27:26] <shtrb|laptop> you have asked about DNS , apt mirror and apache
• 2170[19:27:44] <jsync> the apt-mirror config is just utilized to tell apt-mirror what repositories to download & store within /var/spool.
• 2171[19:28:18] <AlexPortable> shtrb|laptop: well how can i give him those permissions?
• 2172[19:28:30] <AlexPortable> without the chroot on the user, the folder is accessible just fine
• 2173[19:28:49] *** Quits: Nawab (~OtakuSenp@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 2174[19:28:56] <greycat> AlexPortable: what's the user's UID and GID? What are the permissions on the directory in question?
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• 2177[19:30:32] <AlexPortable> root:group1, drwxrwx--x, user: 1017:1029
• 2178[19:31:00] <greycat> Well, there you go. Missing "other" read permission, so the directory will appear empty to anyone not in group "group1"
• 2179[19:31:01] *** Joins: Brigo (~Brigo@replaced-ip)
• 2180[19:31:07] <AlexPortable> but the user is in group1
• 2181[19:31:15] <greycat> Is 1029 group1?
• 2182[19:32:11] <AlexPortable> according to /etc/group, 1029 is the user itself, 1030 is the user, and he's also listed there in the group
• 2183[19:32:16] <AlexPortable> 1030 is the group*
• 2184[19:32:23] *** Quits: zarzar (~zarzar@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2185[19:32:34] <greycat> You're being incredibly unclear. What GID does "group1" have?
• 2186[19:32:55] *** Joins: robotroll (~robotroll@replaced-ip)
• 2187[19:33:02] <AlexPortable> how can i find out?
• 2188[19:33:17] <greycat> grep group1 /etc/group (both inside *AND* outside the chroot, probably)
• 2189[19:33:25] <AlexPortable> /etc/group: group1❌1030:user1
• 2190[19:33:38] <AlexPortable> ugh stupid emoji's
• 2191[19:33:50] <AlexPortable> /etc/group: `group1❌1030:user1`
• 2192[19:33:54] <greycat> So group1 is 1030 but "user" has GID 1029, you said.
• 2193[19:34:28] <AlexPortable> /etc/group: `user1 : x : 1029;`
• 2194[19:34:45] <greycat> Is one of those inside and the other outside the chroot?
• 2195[19:34:49] <AlexPortable> both outside
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• 2197[19:34:54] <greycat> Then one of them is a lie.
• 2198[19:34:55] <AlexPortable> can't shell access inside the chroot
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• 2200[19:35:18] <AlexPortable> /etc/passwd: `user1 : x : 1027 : 1029`
• 2201[19:35:19] <greycat> Oh, you changed the group name.
• 2202[19:35:31] <AlexPortable> why a lie? can't an user be in multiple groups?
• 2203[19:35:44] <greycat> Never mind. You gave info I didn't ask for and it's confusing.
• 2204[19:35:47] <kruug> Looking to set up a way to reduce the number of machines connecting to an internet repository. Leaning towards `Apt-Cacher NG` due to disk space, but I can't find anything to tell me recommended disk size for apt-cacher. Would I be good with 20GB?
• 2205[19:36:06] <greycat> The directory is missing other-read permissions and only has group-read permissions for group 1030, but the "user" is not in group 1030. Fix the perms.
• 2206[19:36:06] <AlexPortable> sorry, it's also unclear for me
• 2207[19:36:11] <petn-randall> Kevin49283: You might want to ask in the raspbian channel then, since that's a raspbian-only change. Debian doesn't come with a /etc/motd.dynamic.
• 2208[19:36:15] <petn-randall> !raspbian
• 2209[19:36:15] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian on irc.freenode.net for support. replaced-url
• 2210[19:36:21] <petn-randall> Kevin49283: ^^^
• 2211[19:36:30] <AlexPortable> greycat: then why does it work outside the chroot just fine?
• 2212[19:37:31] <greycat> Because you have added "user1" to "group1" as a SUPPLEMENTARY group, but obviously whatever you are doing INSIDE the chroot to "become" user1 is not picking up this supplementary group.
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• 2214[19:38:10] <AlexPortable> user1 : user1 group1
• 2215[19:38:14] <greycat> *sigh*
• 2216[19:38:23] <AlexPortable> how do i make it the non-supplementary group then?
• 2217[19:38:30] <greycat> Just fucking fix the permissions. chmod 775 the directory.
• 2218[19:38:38] *** Quits: Ilyas (uid43013@replaced-ip) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
• 2219[19:38:41] <Kevin49283> petn-randall: Okay I will thank you.
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• 2222[19:38:58] <AlexPortable> it's 771 already
• 2223[19:39:01] <greycat> Just fucking fix the permissions. chmod 775 the directory.
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• 2225[19:39:23] <AlexPortable> but that will also allow others to access the folder
• 2226[19:39:31] <greycat> So what?
• 2227[19:39:43] <AlexPortable> so i only want the person in the group to access it
• 2228[19:39:46] <greycat> You obviously don't understand how permissions work, so what makes you think you're effectively securing or hiding ANYTHING?
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• 2231[19:40:06] <AlexPortable> so it's not hidden?
• 2232[19:40:13] *** Joins: Avalchfan (~Avalchfan@replaced-ip)
• 2233[19:40:20] <greycat> What is inside this chroot that you feel needs to be hidden?
• 2234[19:40:21] *** Quits: IdleGandalf (~IdleGanda@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
• 2235[19:40:37] <AlexPortable> no it's not in the chroot
• 2236[19:40:38] <greycat> And why are you only using security-through-obscurity (-r perms) to hide it?
• 2237[19:40:43] <greycat> FUCKIKNG HELL
• 2238[19:41:12] <AlexPortable> it's a shared folder between users (who are in some groups)
• 2239[19:41:18] <AlexPortable> but every user has it's own chrooted folder
• 2240[19:41:39] <greycat> That's just ludicrous and stupid. I'm done. *plonk*
• 2241[19:41:41] <Murii_> Hey, For getting the ram usage, free -h is good?
• 2242[19:41:48] <Murii_> conky reports a different value than free -h
• 2243[19:41:51] <Murii_> that's why I ask
• 2244[19:41:53] <AlexPortable> 775'ed the directory, still get permission denied
• 2245[19:41:57] <AlexPortable> why is it stupid?
• 2246[19:42:10] <kruug> Only a bad worker blames their tools
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• 2248[19:42:51] <shtrb|laptop> jsync meet kruug I think you have something in common (apt proxy/mirroring)
• 2249[19:43:00] <petn-randall> Murii_: Depends on your definition of RAM usage.
• 2250[19:43:10] *** Joins: zarzar (~zarzar@replaced-ip)
• 2251[19:43:14] <Murii_> ?_? petn-randall
• 2252[19:43:20] <greycat> !free ram
• 2253[19:43:20] <dpkg> Unlike information, your computer's memory does *not* want to be free. Free RAM is wasted RAM! Linux tries to use free physical memory for caching files from disk which speeds up disk access considerably. Linux releases RAM from these caches if programs need it. If you want to know how much physical memory the free(1) tool says you have left for program use, it's 'free' + 'buffers' + 'cache'. Also ask me about <swapwake>.
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• 2256[19:44:38] <shtrb|laptop> Murii_, check pmap for per PID usage (and how it is used)
• 2257[19:45:10] *** Quits: dolphy (~kramer@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 2258[19:45:11] <petn-randall> !atemyram
• 2259[19:45:11] <dpkg> "Linux ate my ram!" No, it didn't. Read this: replaced-url
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• 2261[19:45:26] <petn-randall> Murii_: This site also lists ways to measure RAM usage. ^^^
• 2262[19:45:37] <greycat> The output of free(1) has changed over the last few releases, which makes it hard to write a factoid to cover it.
• 2263[19:45:54] <Murii_> free seems broken AF
• 2264[19:46:11] <greycat> Your concept of how memory works is not fully developed yet.
• 2265[19:46:14] <Murii_> it says I use 5gb but htop says I use 895mb (like conky)
• 2266[19:46:34] <petn-randall> Murii_: No, it's not broken. Read the link.
• 2267[19:46:35] <greycat> Murii_: you have to look at the entire output of free, not just 1 column.
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• 2270[19:46:43] <Murii_> greycat- it doesn't have what to cache. I have irc and two VIMs
• 2271[19:46:54] *** Quits: dasj (~daniel@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 2272[19:46:54] <Murii_> hmm
• 2273[19:46:55] <Murii_> ok
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• 2277[19:48:19] <kruug> greycat: factoid is not the word you want there.
• 2278[19:49:19] *** Quits: holmgren (magnus@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2279[19:49:27] <greycat> What... word do you believe I wanted there, to describe the information spat out by the bot named dpkg when requested by a ! trigger phrase?
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• 2285[19:51:03] <kruug> greycat: Definition of factoid. 1 : an invented fact believed to be true because it appears in print.
• 2286[19:51:11] <kruug> greycat: fact is the word I would use...
• 2287[19:51:22] *** Joins: SerajewelKS (~me@replaced-ip)
• 2288[19:51:23] <kruug> greycat: or `tidbit of information`
• 2289[19:51:27] <greycat> The chunks of information spat out by the bot are called "factoids".
• 2290[19:51:28] <jim> a few years back, a debian machine was transported to space on one of the shuttles... does anyone have a link for that
• 2291[19:51:29] <jim> ?
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• 2294[19:51:56] <kruug> greycat: ooo...or there's `factlet`
• 2295[19:52:32] <SerajewelKS> man this is driving me nuts. whenever i update the kernel on my server and reboot, grub drops me to a rescue shell with no error message.
• 2296[19:52:39] *** Quits: oerheks (~oerheks@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
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• 2298[19:52:43] <SerajewelKS> i have to boot the installer CD and reinstall grub every time i do a kernel update :/
• 2299[19:52:50] <petn-randall> kruug: What greycat said. Its been called that ever since.
• 2300[19:53:04] *** oerheks_ is now known as oerheks
• 2301[19:53:11] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: Sounds like you installed grub somewhere else before.
• 2302[19:53:13] <kruug> jsync: Looking to set up a way to reduce the number of machines connecting to an internet repository. Leaning towards `Apt-Cacher NG` due to disk space, but I can't find anything to tell me recommended disk size for apt-cacher. Would I be good with 20GB?
• 2303[19:53:16] <greycat> I found an infobot web page dated 1999 that uses it, and that's just from a brief google search.
• 2304[19:53:31] <greycat> replaced-url
• 2305[19:53:36] <AlexPortable> greycat: it's not related to the folder, but somehow the mounting goes wrong(?)
• 2306[19:53:49] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: nope. however, /boot is in a dmraid raid1.
• 2307[19:54:00] <jsync> kruug, I am not sure.
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• 2309[19:54:19] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: 'grub-install /dev/md0' might fix it for you, assuming md0 is your /boot/.
• 2310[19:54:20] <AlexPortable> /etc/fstab: `/var/tmp/testfolder/ /home/user1/testfolder`. ls -la /var/tmp/: `drwxrwxrwx 2 root root 4096 May 14 17:53 testfolder`
• 2311[19:54:28] <jsync> I just starting using the apt-mirror software. I'm just setting this up for my home network.
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• 2313[19:55:03] <kruug> jsync: Ok. I'll go with 20GB and expand as needed.
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• 2316[19:55:11] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: the raid volumes are in partitions, will that make a difference?
• 2317[19:55:13] <kruug> jsync: why did you choose apt-mirror over caching?
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• 2319[19:55:34] <SerajewelKS> when the system comes back up i'll give more details about how everything is structured. i forget exactly how i did this.
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• 2323[19:56:49] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: Is this UEFI or legacy bios?
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• 2326[19:57:32] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: If it's legacy bios, grub should be written to the disk, not the partition. But IIRC it'll do the right thing when you point it at a partition and write to disk instead.
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• 2328[19:57:59] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: UEFI judging by the presence of a bios boot partition
• 2329[19:58:18] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: In that case, is /boot/efi correctly mounted?
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• 2332[19:59:08] <SerajewelKS> i don't know, i don't recall ever reading anything about mounting that volume. from what i read, grub automatically handles writing to that partition so i never thought twice about it.
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• 2335[20:00:13] <SerajewelKS> the two disks that make up the raid1 each have two partitions: a BIOS boot partition and the raid volume. inside of each raid volume is an LVM PV. inside of that is the / volume, which is where /boot lives.
• 2336[20:00:31] *** Joins: ww_ (~ww@replaced-ip)
• 2337[20:00:33] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: BIOS boot partition is legacy bios. On EFI it's called "EFI system partition" that carries the payload to boot.
• 2338[20:00:53] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: Note that BIOS boot partition is *not* /boot/.
• 2339[20:00:53] <SerajewelKS> ah okay. i couldn't remember, it's been over a year since i set this up.
• 2340[20:00:58] <SerajewelKS> right, of course
• 2341[20:01:05] *** Quits: wonderworld (~ww@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 2342[20:01:10] <SerajewelKS> i've always been hands-off with that partition, assuming that grub knows what to do with it
• 2343[20:01:20] <petn-randall> Ok. In that case it should be enough to just 'grub-install /dev/<biosbootpartition>'.
• 2344[20:01:40] <SerajewelKS> oh -- not the device?
• 2345[20:01:56] <petn-randall> I don't recall if it even has a mountable filesystem, I switched to UEFI early.
• 2346[20:02:09] <SerajewelKS> a few months ago i did a test and did grub-install to both sda and sdb before rebooting and i still get dumped to a rescue shell
• 2347[20:02:10] *** Quits: orti (~orti@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 265 seconds)
• 2348[20:02:22] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: It should do the same thing, but it can't be of harm to do both.
• 2349[20:02:25] <SerajewelKS> it's like my system doesn't know something about itself, but the installer does
• 2350[20:02:42] *** Joins: magyar_ (~magyar@replaced-ip)
• 2351[20:02:43] <SerajewelKS> because i can only get grub-install to make things boot correctly from in the installer environment
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• 2356[20:03:26] <petn-randall> Hmm, weird.
• 2357[20:03:49] *** Joins: annadane (~annadane@replaced-ip)
• 2358[20:03:54] <SerajewelKS> my BIOS also seems to select the boot disk non-deterministically and i haven't found a way to force it to pick a specific disk. so i also have a BIOS boot partition on my third (non-system, storage) disk and i shotgun install grub to all three every time there is a kernel update.
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• 2361[20:04:36] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: Nothing wrong with that (it's good practice to keep them all in sync), however, your BIOS should be able to boot from a specific disk.
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• 2365[20:05:57] <SerajewelKS> yeah it can't. google confirmed that for me awhile ago. threads of people frustrated that the BIOS won't let you pick a disk. it tries the SATA ports in order, i think. so it's determinstic, but you better plug the boot disk into SATA0.
• 2366[20:06:04] <SerajewelKS> and the ports also aren't labeled on the mobo \o/
• 2367[20:06:17] <SerajewelKS> hp proliant: never again
• 2368[20:07:06] <SerajewelKS> it's just weird to me that i can run grub-install on the system before rebooting and it doesn't work. then i use the install CD to chroot into my system and grub-install again, to the same devices, and then it will boot fine.
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• 2374[20:10:08] <SerajewelKS> it makes me wonder if / (and hence /boot, i don't have a separate /boot) being in an LVM in a raid1 somehow makes my system itself unaware of that
• 2375[20:10:22] *** Quits: jessica523 (~jessica52@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
• 2376[20:10:24] <SerajewelKS> like it's not accounting for either the LVM or the raid1 when installing grub
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• 2379[20:11:35] <SerajewelKS> umm. hmm. okay so this is the first time that grub-install from the CD didn't work.
• 2380[20:11:42] *** Quits: fred3 (~fred@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2381[20:11:44] <SerajewelKS> oh right, i forgot to update-grub *facepalm*
• 2382[20:11:48] <SerajewelKS> jesus this is frustrating
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• 2388[20:12:21] <SerajewelKS> i think that's the piece that's failing to work correctly -- update-grub
• 2389[20:12:22] *** Joins: fred3 (~fred@replaced-ip)
• 2390[20:12:42] <SerajewelKS> i should do some science and grab the bad and good boot.cfgs and diff them
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• 2394[20:14:22] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: is it necessary to reinstall grub after running update-grub? i've always wondered that.
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• 2401[20:16:13] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: No, it's not. However diffing those files might get you somewhere.
• 2402[20:16:22] <SerajewelKS> yeah that's what i'm trying now
• 2403[20:16:38] <SerajewelKS> after a kernel upgrade, update-grub is run automatically, yes?
• 2404[20:16:57] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: Usually, yes.
• 2405[20:17:07] <SerajewelKS> ok. pretty sure that that's the problem then.
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• 2407[20:17:15] <SerajewelKS> i strongly suspect that my system itself generates a bad grub config.
• 2408[20:17:33] <petn-randall> Which is why I believe something is severely broken on your setup. However, LVM shouldn't be a problem.
• 2409[20:17:47] <SerajewelKS> what files should update-grub touch? just grub.cfg?
• 2410[20:17:54] *** Quits: WhatisRT (~whatisrt@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 2411[20:17:55] <SerajewelKS> so i can grab them before i run it
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• 2419[20:18:39] <petn-randall> Actually, I don't know for sure if update-grub is run, maybe it's a different hook. Best way to test is install a new kernel and inspect the output carefully.
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• 2422[20:19:04] <SerajewelKS> either way, updating the kernel shouldn't break the boot config, yes? worst case i would boot into the prior kernel?
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• 2424[20:20:21] <SerajewelKS> i'm fairly positive that (un)installing a kernel package tries to update grub (if installed). that would explain, in combination with the theory that my system generates bad grub configs, that upgrading the kernel breaks grub.
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• 2427[20:20:53] <SerajewelKS> it still baffles me though that update-grub works when chrooted into the same system
• 2428[20:21:06] <SerajewelKS> there must be something different about the installer's environment that makes it work
• 2429[20:21:13] <rant> I have a PNY 128GB thumbdrive most of which is encrypted with luks and ext4, its causing severe lag and "task jbd2/dm-0-8:1142 blocked for more than 120 seconds." no signs of FS corruption or data loss just hangs even on basic ops like creating a dir or renaming a file for long periods of time idk what's the issue
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• 2432[20:21:59] <petn-randall> SerajewelKS: That sounds like it's working against a device name that only exists when booted the installer. /dev/sda being the installer image, sdb and sdc being your disks. So sounds like it got installed against "/dev/sdc"?
• 2433[20:21:59] <SerajewelKS> rant: hmm, the drive could be failing. very long writes are an early symptom of drive failure, in my experience.
• 2434[20:22:19] <SerajewelKS> sda is not the installer image, i think it's sr0
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• 2436[20:22:25] <SerajewelKS> sd[abc] are all my disks
• 2437[20:22:34] <petn-randall> I see.
• 2438[20:22:47] <SerajewelKS> unless the installer image also has BIOS boot and dmraid partitions :)
• 2439[20:23:14] <petn-randall> Or ... you're booting the installer in legacy bios, and the actual system in UEFI mode?
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• 2441[20:23:24] <rant> SerajewelKS: hmm.. could be.. I got it down to about 15G or so of data left on it I'm going to backup to another drive and then reformat this one.. just wasnt sure as the only errors are it hanging up jbd2
• 2442[20:23:28] <petn-randall> Some screw-up like that happened to me in the past.
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• 2444[20:23:47] <SerajewelKS> hmm... how would that even work considering that i don't have an EFI partition?
• 2445[20:24:08] <SerajewelKS> how would UEFI even boot? either way, i think it's an option in the BIOS that i have to go in and change to switch the boot mode.
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• 2448[20:26:20] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: the only difference between the two files is that the bad one has "set lang=en_US" and the good one has "set lang=C"
• 2449[20:26:31] <SerajewelKS> that's really interesting
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• 2451[20:27:02] <SerajewelKS> i'm going to change it back to en_US with vi and reboot, see if it breaks
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• 2454[20:28:36] <SerajewelKS> rant: maybe the journal is where the bad blocks are
• 2455[20:30:08] <epergny> rant: I've got a Luks encrypted M.2 SSD which gives amazing read speeds (1 Gb/s sustained) but crappy write speeds: 50 Mb/s. That's 1/20th the speed of reads. Still haven't found what the issue was. It's not the encryption speed/algo.
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• 2462[20:32:53] <rant> epergny: yes well I tried without encyption as well and used this on 3 machines now.. it hangs them all up.. armhf, i386, amd64, but its not all the time, just seems to get in moods or something
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• 2464[20:33:52] <rant> I never relied on flash this much before but normally on HDDs you start seeing read/write errors and experiencing data loss and fs corruption.. thats not the case here.. its just the jbd2 hanging
• 2465[20:34:02] <NetTerminalGene> my ocz ssd write speed is 30 Mb/s
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• 2469[20:35:40] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: mine is a M.2 Samsung 950 Pro (from 2015?) supposed to do sustained reads at 2200 MB/s. I get about 1100 MB/s. So half the spec: I'm happy with that. However...
• 2470[20:36:08] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: it's also listed at 900 MB/s sustained write and I don't get anything near that. I get 50.
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• 2474[20:37:12] <NetTerminalGene> epergny, do you think it is because of debian?
• 2475[20:37:26] <NetTerminalGene> by the way i also use encryption
• 2476[20:37:44] <NetTerminalGene> read speed is fine for me
• 2477[20:37:51] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: I don't think so. Yup, that is with encryption on. I tried on my laptop recently: re-installed Debian 9.4.0 several times, trying with and without encryption.
• 2478[20:38:14] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: so i replaced the config file and it booted fine :/
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• 2480[20:38:33] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: on my laptop and old SSD, I did see a write speed up of 2x without encryption but it's a much older laptop, so there maybe the encoding algo played a role.
• 2481[20:39:07] <NetTerminalGene> :O
• 2482[20:39:13] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: I *should* re-install everything without encryption but... I'm rocking this system since quite some time and don't feel like re-installing everything now ^ ^
• 2483[20:39:23] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: I mean: just to test...
• 2484[20:40:04] <NetTerminalGene> yeah it is bothersome
• 2485[20:40:06] <SerajewelKS> rant: jdb2 probably does a lot of synchronous writes. maybe the drive isn't great at those.
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• 2488[20:40:40] <NetTerminalGene> epergny, i don't do write stuff much, so i use it like that
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• 2490[20:41:21] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: I've seen some ppl buying SSD capable of doing encryption and then offloading the encryption to the SSD/Bios but it has downsides. Not well supported (not many drives can do that). Not easy to "mount" your SSD somewhere else. You have to trust the hardware encryption, etc.
• 2491[20:41:57] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: yup same here... Just pisses me off when I'm copying big files around. Also I don't understand why my results are lower than those I see other posting: bothers the nerd in me a bit. : )
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• 2493[20:42:35] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: update-grub must touch something else. otherwise i don't know why update-grub would fix it, but then replacing the config file with the prior one wouldn't un-fix it.
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• 2496[20:43:43] <NetTerminalGene> epergny, have you tried with other distro?
• 2497[20:43:49] <NetTerminalGene> another
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• 2499[20:45:01] <SerajewelKS> you could also benchmark the raw device to rule out encryption/filesystem overhead entirely
• 2500[20:45:07] <rant> SerajewelKS: so maybe before I put this drive back into use I should do some diagnostics/benchmarking you have any suggestions there? I've nearly got all the data off it onto another SanDisk 32G drive, no errors in the copying and I just used cp -R nothing fancy.I planned to reformat the entire disk with cryptsetup but I'm not sure how much I can rely on this drive right now :P
• 2501[20:45:29] <epergny> NetTerminalGene: nope because I've got lots of "junk" installed on this "workstation" of mine which I use everyday. Not feeling like re-installing it now but... I may simply buy another SSD (probably the SSD Samsung M.2 / PCIe3.0 x4 970 EVO 256 MB) and do experiments on that one.
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• 2504[20:45:58] <SerajewelKS> rant: you could run a badblocks test on it. IIRC it can display throughput statistics. a destructive write-test, perhaps, after you're sure you have all the data off of it.
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• 2506[20:47:00] <epergny> rant: or, well, I may just make sure to back up everything and do a few tests.
• 2507[20:47:13] <epergny> rant: but uptime... 150 days.
• 2508[20:47:16] <epergny> for my desktop : )
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• 2510[20:47:42] <SerajewelKS> epergny: seems you're missing several kernel updates then ;)
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• 2512[20:48:16] <epergny> SerajewelKS: oh man I certainly am: it's been quite a ride lately with kernel security patches.
• 2513[20:48:18] <rant> I'll consider that and perhaps just using this drive for backup or something for now I'm relying pretty much all on thumbdrives atm.. have 3x32GB, 2x4GB, 8GB, and 128GB. Though I only seem to have about 8GB or so in my OS install and less than 20GB personal data most the rest of the 100GB or so is duplicates and cache and crap
• 2514[20:48:48] <rant> right now I have over 200GB of storage between all the drives and less than 100GB of data so I can easily just keep two copies of it all
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• 2516[20:49:36] <SerajewelKS> i have a 3TB RAID1 that's almost full :X
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• 2518[20:50:05] <rant> yeah I been rather broke.. getting some TB hdds is high on my things to do list when I have cash to spare
• 2519[20:50:43] <SerajewelKS> i've had the disks for 2+ years so i've definitely gotten my money's worth out of them
• 2520[20:51:13] <rant> I used to buy white label drives for RAIDs.. they're cheaper and the RAID can tolerate faults
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• 2522[20:51:39] <SerajewelKS> using drives not designed for RAIDs is a bad idea though
• 2523[20:51:42] <petn-randall> NetTerminalGene: Are you TRIMming your SSD regularly? Also check the company's website for firmware updates, the Samsung 840 Evo for example had firmware bugs that caused very low I/O the longer the drive was in use.
• 2524[20:52:03] <SerajewelKS> petn-randall: oh. really? i have an evo in my main system.
• 2525[20:52:26] <SerajewelKS> and some games that my rig should be able to handle, it can't handle very well. maybe bad i/o performance.
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• 2527[20:53:16] <SerajewelKS> rant: if the drive isn't designed for RAID then it's probably a "consumer drive", and those drives handle bad sectors very differently. RAID drives will immediately report an I/O error while consumer drives will try to read the sector for many seconds before giving up.
• 2528[20:53:21] <epergny> petn-randall: "the longer the drive was in use" as in... Between reboots? Over over time / hours of usage?
• 2529[20:53:22] <NetTerminalGene> petn-randall, i tried trimming, it didn't do any good. yeah there is linux firmware updater for gnu/linux but i don't want it to touch my pure debian
• 2530[20:53:26] <rant> I'm way behind the times with all the new marketing schemes on drives.. some are labelled for surveillance..etc.. back in the day you just bought a drive for its interface and capacity :P
• 2531[20:53:28] <SerajewelKS> rant: if a disk has a bad sector you want it failed out of the array ASAP
• 2532[20:53:50] <SerajewelKS> rant: consumer drives will mask errors and keep bad drives in an array longer than they should be. you want to replace the drive at the first sign of failure.
• 2533[20:53:57] <greycat> interface type, capacity, and speed
• 2534[20:54:01] <rant> SerajewelKS: ah.. well dont all drives have SMART these days? heh
• 2535[20:54:12] <greycat> speed usually being measured in RPMs back then
• 2536[20:54:19] <SerajewelKS> rant: yes but smart considers some amount of bad sectors "normal"
• 2537[20:54:47] <SerajewelKS> if a drive develops a bad sector i don't want to wait until it has ten bad sectors for smart to flag it, i want it dropped from the array immediately
• 2538[20:55:45] <SerajewelKS> anyway, that's why i use "raid disks" for raid. their failure mode is different from consumer drives. fail fast.
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• 2540[20:56:11] <annadane> what are raid disks?
• 2541[20:56:23] <SerajewelKS> they are hard drives that are designed for use in RAIDs
• 2542[20:56:48] <annadane> i'm still not sure what i want in terms of backup solutions, need to do some research into the matter
• 2543[20:57:31] <rant> I noticed the other day when I went to luksFormat over the two thumbdrives I'd cp'd debian ISO to, that gparted was reporting their total space as 4x their actual size, showing an error that the driver was reporting their block size as 2048 instead of 512 the kernel reported or something, and they had unknown partition types on them
• 2544[20:57:42] <SerajewelKS> it's an interesting distinction, really. you'd think fault-tolerance is a good thing. in general, it kind of is. but for hard drives in a RAID array, it's actually a bad thing.
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• 2547[20:58:06] <SerajewelKS> rant: uh yeah. i'd toss those drives ASAP.
• 2548[20:58:40] *** Quits: feral (~kot@replaced-ip) (Quit: .)
• 2549[20:58:41] <rant> SerajewelKS: the one was brand new before I wrote the debian iso to it.. and I've luksformatted it and now its reporting properly again
• 2550[20:58:52] <SerajewelKS> still. that would be an RMA for me.
• 2551[20:59:10] <rant> literally took that 32GB SanDisk Cruzer Blade right out of its packaging and put a debian dvd 1 iso on it.. was only use it got
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• 2553[20:59:31] <rant> figured it was something related to the ISO or how the kernel copied it
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• 2558[21:01:30] <kyle__> raid is not a backup. I know it's writen everywhere, but if you're looking for backup solutions and saying RAID< it has to be said outloud.
• 2559[21:01:56] <SerajewelKS> nobody said it was a backup?
• 2560[21:02:35] *** Quits: DerLGm (~DerLGm@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
• 2561[21:02:43] <epergny> main issue to me with backup is: "one do you know if they work or not!?" And I'm now moving a content-based addressing filesystem for my backups.
• 2562[21:02:47] <annadane> i know nothing about it so saying RAID is not a backup is helpful to me
• 2563[21:02:49] <epergny> so I get integrity checks for free.
• 2564[21:02:54] <kyle__> From what was said though, someone might infer it. :)
• 2565[21:03:05] <epergny> and de-duplication too (on a single drive at least)
• 2566[21:03:22] *** Quits: dionysus69 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
• 2567[21:03:30] <epergny> I'm simply storing all my data in a private IPFS repo.
• 2568[21:03:45] <kyle__> IPFS? Not familiar with that one
• 2569[21:03:47] <SerajewelKS> RAID is more about uptime, and also convenience. it doesn't replace a backup but if one drive fails and not the other, you can avoid having to restore from a backup.
• 2570[21:03:49] * kyle__ googles
• 2571[21:04:05] <epergny> kyle__: decentralized file system... But you can run it privately.
• 2572[21:04:35] <SerajewelKS> but RAID doesn't protect from catastrophies (natural disaster, power surges) nor does it protect from human error (accidentally deleting /)
• 2573[21:04:38] <epergny> kyle__: it works for me... I don't have tens of TB of stuff to backup.
• 2574[21:05:09] <epergny> kyle__: I had to solve the "family taking huge pictures and movies with their CANON camera and high-end smartphones" issue.
• 2575[21:05:18] <rant> annadane: raid has the ability to provide redundancy/fault-tolerance as well as performance enhancement, however being that the data is still all about single logical volume, it is still susceptible to all the issues flood, electrical, fire, etc.. and all the issues of being an online media, viruses, corruption, etc.. where true backups are seperate media, snapshots, stored seperately and offline
• 2576[21:05:29] <SerajewelKS> epergny: i solved that with an owncloud server, which i do back up regularly
• 2577[21:05:56] <epergny> SerajewelKS: how many GB or TB you have there btw?
• 2578[21:06:08] <SerajewelKS> rant: ideally also stored in a different physical location
• 2579[21:06:15] <SerajewelKS> epergny: in the owncloud server?
• 2580[21:06:19] <epergny> SerajewelKS: y
• 2581[21:06:26] <kyle__> Humm. It's an interesting idea. I'm not sure if I like the idea for daily use, but it's interesting stuff.
• 2582[21:06:37] <SerajewelKS> epergny: du says 158GB
• 2583[21:06:44] <epergny> yup different physical location: online/onsite, online/offsite, offline/onsite, offline/offsite. That's the spirit of real backups ^ ^
• 2584[21:07:06] <epergny> SerajewelKS: yup that's on the order of manageable : )
• 2585[21:07:09] <SerajewelKS> for most people, offline/offsite is sufficient
• 2586[21:07:31] <rant> too me backups have always just been what I do when the drive is making funny noises and I've bought a new one.. heh
• 2587[21:07:43] *** Joins: dionysus69 (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip)
• 2588[21:07:55] <rant> I only really ever lost a ton of data once and gpart got it all back reconstructing the partition table
• 2589[21:07:55] <SerajewelKS> rant: sadly most of us fall into that camp, at least sometimes
• 2590[21:08:23] <epergny> Now I do still have all my emails, since the nineties. And all the pictures, everything. Even my old DOS program I wrote.
• 2591[21:08:36] <Dagger> RAID plus snapshots covers a lot of the use-cases of backups
• 2592[21:08:47] <SerajewelKS> i've gotten into the habit of imaging a disk before i do any partition changes. i once lost an entire volume beacuse the power went out while moving a partition to a different location on the same disk.
• 2593[21:08:49] *** Joins: DerLGm (~DerLGm@replaced-ip)
• 2594[21:08:55] <rant> it was mostly just like a 60GB mp3 collection.. which was pretty important cause I never kept my cds safe after rippin em.. just ripped em and tossed em aside like old magazines
• 2595[21:08:56] <epergny> and the problem with 25 years+ of backup is "folder inside folder inside folder" where the same data appears 27 times, sometimes with just one file modified in a repertory etc.
• 2596[21:09:05] <Dagger> not /all/ of them, but if you have dozens of TB of stuff and a budget sometimes you have to pick your battles
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• 2598[21:09:42] <kyle__> I always intend to have a tiered system: local devices => (local server => offline copies) => remote service. But there's almost always some level of it that' smissing.
• 2599[21:09:51] <SerajewelKS> epergny: that's why i use tar incremental backups for my owncloud server
• 2600[21:10:01] *** Joins: johnfg (johnfg@replaced-ip)
• 2601[21:10:05] <rant> found a few that werent broken at my parents hous e a few months ago.. most of em were on one of those cd spindles and it fell off a shelf and cracked almost all of em :O
• 2602[21:10:09] <johnfg> Hi folks
• 2603[21:10:20] <rant> gave away the only two cds I saved from that :P
• 2604[21:10:32] <SerajewelKS> the actual archive gets moved offsite/offline but i retain the (small) tar snapshot file which contains just the state of the last backup, so that i can make the next incremental backup without needing all of the backup tarballs
• 2605[21:10:43] <johnfg> I've been running stretch for a few months now. Just getting around to asking about this bug in mutt or gnupg.
• 2606[21:10:51] *** Joins: t3st3r (~t3st3r@replaced-ip)
• 2607[21:10:58] <rant> I wasnt gonna miss Brian McKight's "Anytime" or Tupac's "Strictly for my N****"
• 2608[21:10:58] *** Joins: holmgren (magnus@replaced-ip)
• 2609[21:11:03] <epergny> SerajewelKS: yup I know it's an option, but I first need to deduplicate everything.
• 2610[21:11:08] *** Quits: holmgren (magnus@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
• 2611[21:11:23] <johnfg> GPGME: CMS protocol not available, comes up every time I start mutt, yet my gpg itself works fine (I do use it).
• 2612[21:11:42] *** Joins: bobvador (~bobvador@replaced-ip)
• 2613[21:11:44] <epergny> SerajewelKS: and then I've got the issue of "mother in law deciding to give new names to old pictures (or folder)". Stuff like that. : )
• 2614[21:11:49] <johnfg> Didn't see any resolution by searching, but wondered if anyone here has come up with a fix for it?
• 2615[21:12:26] *** Quits: Colti (Miramar-FL@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
• 2616[21:12:41] <SerajewelKS> epergny: you can also just do the deduplication at the filesystem under owncloud
• 2617[21:12:42] <epergny> rant: I'm re-buying CDs. I like the idea to own the music and to be less of a pirate. So I torrent, but then I try to find the old CDs.
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• 2619[21:12:54] <annadane> i *probably* should look into encryption, my backups just basically are there because i never put thought into it
• 2620[21:13:02] <annadane> but my threat model is essentially non existant
• 2621[21:13:14] <epergny> rant: I mean: I do re-buy CDs but only to store them and/or rip them and then store them. Weird, I know.
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• 2624[21:14:02] <SerajewelKS> i encrypt my backups with gpg. the public key is left on all the computers that make backups. the private key is securely stored in multiple physical locations with ssss such that you need multiple physical pieces to construct the private key, but i can tolerate loss of some number of those pieces.
• 2625[21:14:14] <SerajewelKS> that way i can make backups online and send them to places i may not trust (e.g. amazon glacier)
• 2626[21:14:38] <rant> thats something I need to do again soon.. is make header backups of all my luks devices
• 2627[21:14:40] <SerajewelKS> while knowing that i'm the only one who can decrypt the backups, and i have redundancy of the private key
• 2628[21:14:42] <epergny> SerajewelKS: yeah, I do that for my cryptocurrencies seeds.
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• 2631[21:15:30] <epergny> SerajewelKS: I mean the "splitting the secret key/seed part".
• 2632[21:15:51] <rant> never lost a header, but unlike that time I lost a partition table, I would imagine once that header is corrupt you're screwed without a backup
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• 2634[21:16:03] <SerajewelKS> yeah. it also works well for general backups. just do the same splitting process with the private key (or its passphrase).
• 2635[21:16:21] <SerajewelKS> rant: yes, the header contains the keys
• 2636[21:16:37] <epergny> can a gpg backup file be verified for integrity without needing to decrypt it?
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• 2639[21:16:58] <epergny> I mean: without having the private key handy
• 2640[21:16:59] <SerajewelKS> epergny: not to my knowledge, though i've never tried to do that
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• 2645[21:17:30] <SerajewelKS> epergny: you could verify it right after creating the archive though. then make a sha256sum of the encrypted file.
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• 2648[21:17:37] <SerajewelKS> epergny: then you could verify the encrypted file against the sha256sum
• 2649[21:17:57] <epergny> I was wondering if maybe there was some metadata in the header, containing a hash of the rest of the file itself.
• 2650[21:18:01] *** Joins: JohnA (~john@replaced-ip)
• 2651[21:18:01] <epergny> SerajewelKS: yup that's an option ofc
• 2652[21:18:15] <JohnA> is rkhunter worth having?
• 2653[21:18:26] <SerajewelKS> epergny: i don't think so. a signed+encrypted file would have that, but the signature would be of the decrypted data, so it would be useless without the private key.
• 2654[21:18:35] <epergny> SerajewelKS: but with content addressing based filesystem, that's one thing you get for free: integrity check (as files are stored by their hashes)
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• 2656[21:18:59] <SerajewelKS> epergny: as long as you perform the integrity check at read time, too
• 2657[21:19:09] <epergny> not saying it's the best option for backups: I'm playing with it atm and then I can switch to something else anyway : )
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• 2659[21:19:26] <SerajewelKS> tar incremental works fine for me. i'm not too worried about duplicates.
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• 2661[21:19:50] <epergny> SerajewelKS: for individual files I don't know, but the whole repo can be verified "ipfs repo verify"
• 2662[21:19:57] <epergny> I need to test this more
• 2663[21:20:08] <SerajewelKS> i know btrfs has some integrity options as well
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• 2665[21:20:29] <epergny> ah interesting... I think it also does deduplication.
• 2666[21:20:39] <epergny> brb, gonna go eat
• 2667[21:20:43] <SerajewelKS> it can do that, yeah
• 2668[21:20:48] <SerajewelKS> it's not continual. you have to ask for it.
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• 2671[21:21:24] <SerajewelKS> btrfs is still too experimental for my taste
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• 2675[21:23:00] <NetTerminalGene> i saw studio kept hobbit movie in encrypted ext3 disk
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• 2679[21:25:46] <rant> yeah I just copied about 17G off that 128G thumbdrive without any errors.. I guess I'll just try some diagnostics on it before I put it back into use.. and for now untill I can afford some HDDs I'll try keep two copies of my data.. and I'll need to make new header backups since I'm not even sure where I stored the old ones :P
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• 2684[21:28:37] <rant> I thought the problem was just my OrangePi when I was using this 128GB drive for its root and home, but not only did I have the same issue with a usb sata hdd, but this thumbdrive hung up any other machine I put it in.. so idk.. for all I know it could be some bug in that f'n OPI kernel that screwed up any FS created on it
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• 2702[21:37:57] <waydot> hey guys (and infrequent gals); any experience in getting rid of video playback tearing on intel with resized/fullscreen video frames?
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• 2714[21:39:37] <rant> get a video card is my advice.. I never had any good performance with intel personally.
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• 2718[21:40:01] <rant> though enough people have shared our pain that there are lots of suggstions online
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• 2721[21:40:50] <jsync> Hello. I need to recursively change permissions of a file folder within /var/replaced-url
• 2722[21:41:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1588
• 2723[21:41:03] <waydot> yeah, thanks for your feedback, unfortunately a discrete card is not an option
• 2724[21:41:26] <waydot> also, it's a bit weird, since intel is the only vendor who actually opens the specs to OSS developers ...
• 2725[21:41:36] <rant> jsync: chown -R user:user /var/replaced-url
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• 2727[21:41:57] <greycat> jsync: Make a backup first. Then, most commonly: chmod -R a+r /place
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• 2731[21:42:09] <waydot> a backup? of permissions?
• 2732[21:42:11] <greycat> rant: he wants them to *become* accessible
• 2733[21:42:25] *** Quits: argusbr (~down@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 248 seconds)
• 2734[21:42:32] <jsync> Yes. To make them accessible.
• 2735[21:42:56] <rant> greycat: even being familiar with your style I fail to see the distinction
• 2736[21:43:04] <jsync> Is it chmod -R 755 /var/replaced-url
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• 2738[21:43:45] <waydot> 755 includes execute, you dont want that on regular files
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• 2741[21:44:10] <jsync> What do I want?
• 2742[21:44:31] <rant> 644 is rw-r--r--
• 2743[21:44:32] <waydot> you want read for everyone and execute+read on directories
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• 2745[21:44:44] <greycat> rant: 700 is "NOBODY CAN SEE THEM BUT ME!"
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• 2747[21:44:52] <waydot> so, a+rX would be best
• 2748[21:44:58] <greycat> rant: a+r is "everyone can read them"
• 2749[21:45:12] <waydot> it's in the fine manual ;) (man chmod)
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• 2751[21:45:25] * waydot goes fetch that beer
• 2752[21:45:41] <rant> greycat: ah.. well I wasnt presuming to know the name of the dir or the desired permissions, felt the -R was really the part that was confused, but it would seem the recursion wasnt the only confusion
• 2753[21:46:21] <jsync> 644 is what I need then?
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• 2758[21:46:41] <greycat> jsync: you want 755 on dirs and 644 on files
• 2759[21:46:42] <waydot> jsync: you need 644 on *files* and 755 on directories
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• 2761[21:47:00] <waydot> rant: ;)
• 2762[21:47:13] <jsync> Is there an easy way to do that recursively?
• 2763[21:47:43] <rant> chmod -R a+rX
• 2764[21:47:51] <waydot> jsync: chmod -R a+rX /your/replaced-url
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• 2766[21:48:48] * rant just realized there are some things octal perms cant do :P
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• 2769[21:49:45] <waydot> yeah, the unfortunate side effect of using those octal values as binary flags
• 2770[21:49:52] <Shiraz_> hello . can someone help me factory reset an allied telesis AT-FS750/16 switch ? i don't have the credentials for the management interface
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• 2772[21:50:05] <Shiraz_> it does not havea reset button
• 2773[21:50:07] <waydot> does it run Linux? :D
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• 2776[21:50:38] <Shiraz_> i guess so .. maybe it runs some linux for embeded systems
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• 2778[21:51:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1581
• 2779[21:51:13] <Shiraz_> now i opened it and i don't see any reset switch on the PCB ??? wtf is this crap ?!
• 2780[21:51:42] <Shiraz_> i see some GPIO pins i think..
• 2781[21:52:05] <Shiraz_> maybe i have to connect some of these pins ?
• 2782[21:52:06] <waydot> perhaps if you also try on #network or what was it ... ?
• 2783[21:52:09] <rant> Shiraz_: if you're gonna go buckshot with IRC support, networking or hardware might be better
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• 2785[21:53:37] <Shiraz_> ok thanks rant i will try there . #debian was the most technical group i had in my autojoin list
• 2786[21:55:00] <rant> Shiraz_: it would seem nobody here is familiar with that hardware and its not really a question within the scope of this channel
• 2787[21:55:20] <rant> I'd ask the MFG and google first personally
• 2788[21:56:13] <Shiraz_> i understand , np, i checked on google but i can only find how to reset it using the management interface within a browser
• 2789[21:56:50] <rant> yeah well that dont help if auth credentials are the issue :P
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• 2881[22:53:51] <SpeakerToMeat> Hello.
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• 2884[22:54:46] <SpeakerToMeat> Question, what would be the right way to set a fixed mode/resolution (and refresh rate) fro xorg on stretch?
• 2885[22:55:07] <azy> my brightness seems to be missing a few steps. on the darker-side of the scale it suddenly jumps to almost black. halp
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• 2906[23:08:37] <waydot> SpeakerToMeat: i think that depends more on your choice of wm/de
• 2907[23:09:06] <waydot> so in general, if you do have the utilities, they should be somewhere under settings/display
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• 2909[23:10:28] <waydot> and it helps if the hardware is supported by the kernel - speaking from experience, for newest hw runnig current kernel helps
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• 2912[23:11:08] <SpeakerToMeat> so... you suggest using xrandr?
• 2913[23:11:17] <SpeakerToMeat> rather than setting init or xorg somehow?
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• 2917[23:12:50] <waydot> for me it's easier
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• 2919[23:13:26] <waydot> and it does not have tob e xrandr directly, you can use your desktop provided tools which could be easier (depending on your preference)
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• 2922[23:14:24] <waydot> from what i've read so far, using xorg.conf seems to be deprecated
• 2923[23:14:41] <waydot> whether that's true or not ... i dont know
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• 2933[23:17:54] <SpeakerToMeat> In this case it's for a locked down desktop
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• 2941[23:21:29] <waydot> well, if you want to bring security into the picture then the complexity of the question goes up
• 2942[23:23:01] <epergny> is there a way to detect which BIOS exactly a currently running Debian box is running? (without rebooting into the BIOS I mean)
• 2943[23:23:18] <SpeakerToMeat> Sigh I wanted to avoid having to deal with a modeline, I've not done that in ages, but I might end up doing that
• 2944[23:23:59] <epergny> SpeakerToMeat: last I did it I found out that tooling was greatly improved. Like no need to manually compute anything anymore.
• 2945[23:24:14] <SpeakerToMeat> I will try that
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• 2947[23:26:01] <Brigo> SpeakerToMeat, xrandr should be the way to go, what desktop environment are you using?
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• 2949[23:26:18] <petemc> epergny: dmidecode
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• 2953[23:27:35] <epergny> petemc: tyvm kind sir
• 2954[23:28:18] <petemc> np
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• 2957[23:29:50] <SpeakerToMeat> Brigo: none. wm is dwm
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• 2963[23:33:11] <rainfyre> hey folks, just a random afternoon question: can anyone point me to how many total packages are in the current stretch release for a given architecture?
• 2964[23:33:28] <rainfyre> this can be a general number, it's just for a comment in a research paper
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• 2966[23:34:46] <jsync> Hello. My Gespeaker program suddenly is not working. There aren't errors within the synaptic or other queries. Any suggestions?
• 2967[23:35:31] <epergny> rainfyre: dunno but don't forget the [37] source: #freenode #debian IRC channel reference : )
• 2968[23:35:38] <Brigo> SpeakerToMeat, most environment manager has a tool for configuring easely this kind of things.
• 2969[23:35:49] <r3> rainfyre: I just did a "dpkg --list | wc --lines" on a system with very few things installed and got 375 as an answer
• 2970[23:35:50] <rainfyre> thank you :)
• 2971[23:35:52] <rainfyre> lol
• 2972[23:36:08] <rainfyre> r3 ahh good idea.
• 2973[23:36:15] <epergny> rainfyre: 1650 here on my workstation
• 2974[23:36:17] <rainfyre> nice headless system you've got there
• 2975[23:36:21] <r3> so subtract a few for things like munin, ntp, ...
• 2976[23:36:27] <rainfyre> ty epergny
• 2977[23:36:35] <r3> yeah, it doesn't have any GUI or X installed.
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• 2979[23:36:47] <rainfyre> I can grep my installed packages too, I remember seeing the 30,000 number a few years ago
• 2980[23:37:12] <rainfyre> (gonna check my headless machine now)
• 2981[23:37:21] <rainfyre> 1800. boooo
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• 2985[23:37:53] <r3> if you want to include packages that are installed but whose removal you've requested. Another way is " aptitude search '~i' |wc -l "
• 2986[23:38:12] <rainfyre> does anyone know how to see how many are in stable, for say x86_64?
• 2987[23:38:51] <epergny> rainfyre: google as to know, let me check
• 2988[23:38:51] <r3> I should mention that it is on "... 4.9.0-4-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 4.9.65-3 (2017-12-03) x86_64 GNU/Linux "
• 2989[23:39:13] <rainfyre> sheesh
• 2990[23:39:30] <rainfyre> i've been googling, but holy cats, i just pulled up aptitude
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• 2992[23:39:47] <rainfyre> not installed packages: 76547
• 2993[23:40:02] <rainfyre> so there's that^ jeez. can I cite aptitude in a research paper? lol
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• 2996[23:40:25] <epergny> # aptitude -F "%p" search "?not(?installed)" | wc -
• 2997[23:40:26] <epergny> 86715 86715 1643003 -
• 2998[23:40:26] <epergny>
• 2999[23:40:28] <epergny> erf, sorry
• 3000[23:40:34] <epergny> wanted to put it on one line
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• 3003[23:40:39] <r3> lol
• 3004[23:40:40] <rainfyre> bah.
• 3005[23:40:42] <rainfyre> lol
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• 3007[23:40:59] <epergny> re
• 3008[23:41:02] <epergny> sorry 'bout that
• 3009[23:41:02] * r3 slaps epergny around a bit with a large trout
• 3010[23:41:11] <rainfyre> epergny: thank you!
• 3011[23:41:19] * epergny notices he's smelling bad now
• 3012[23:41:20] <rainfyre> i just ran the same command
• 3013[23:41:22] <rainfyre> lol
• 3014[23:41:23] <r3> so I'm not sure, rainfyre, what a good "source" for a paper would be.
• 3015[23:41:30] <rainfyre> I know, it's absurd
• 3016[23:41:38] <rainfyre> r3: irc should be cite-able
• 3017[23:41:45] <rainfyre> anyway, thank you everyone, I'm back to ie
• 3018[23:41:47] <rainfyre> *it
• 3019[23:41:49] <r3> you might be able to go here: replaced-url
• 3020[23:41:55] <rainfyre> good call
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• 3022[23:42:09] <r3> and get the (compact compressed textlist)
• 3023[23:42:21] <epergny> rainfyre: good luck
• 3024[23:42:22] <rainfyre> ok
• 3025[23:42:24] <r3> er, I meant maybe also here: replaced-url
• 3026[23:42:26] <rainfyre> thank you epergny
• 3027[23:42:30] <r3> but start at the bottom of that first link
• 3028[23:42:35] <rainfyre> oh cool ok
• 3029[23:42:54] <rainfyre> perfect, thank you again
• 3030[23:43:08] <r3> you could count the allpackages page, but I think you could cite the textlist
• 3031[23:43:17] <rainfyre> good call
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• 3033[23:43:34] <r3> here's what I should have pasted 10 lines ago: replaced-url
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• 3037[23:44:36] <rainfyre> lol found it anyway
• 3038[23:44:36] <r3> 4630 lines I think
• 3039[23:44:57] <r3> oops, that was compressed, hah
• 3040[23:45:01] <r3> nevermind that number
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• 3042[23:45:27] <rainfyre> lol I'm just using what aptitude told me
• 3043[23:45:29] <r3> 68771 lines
• 3044[23:45:32] <rainfyre> I'm gonna cite my hard drive
• 3045[23:45:33] <rainfyre> wow ok
• 3046[23:46:05] <r3> less 6 for the header in that list
• 3047[23:46:34] <r3> so 68,765
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• 3049[23:46:49] <epergny> but
• 3050[23:46:54] <epergny> many are very similar
• 3051[23:47:07] <r3> he didn't ask that, he asked how many total
• 3052[23:47:41] <epergny> claws-mail-pgpinline / claws-mail-pgpinline:i386 / claws-mail-pgpmime / claws-mail-pgpmime:i386 that's 4 packages but... It's all related to claws-mail PGP
• 3053[23:47:49] *** Quits: noodlepie (~Phillip@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
• 3054[23:47:51] <r3> to be technically correct, which is the best kind of correct
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• 3057[23:48:13] <r3> they still count as packages.
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• 3060[23:48:48] <r3> I mean look at 'fortune*'
• 3061[23:50:03] <epergny> r3: just did: good one!
• 3062[23:50:46] <r3> 25 of those, but not all are going to be installed on a system
• 3063[23:50:58] <epergny> yup well ofc with all the alpha-2 type country names (ISO something, don't remember the number), it multiplies fast for some packages.
• 3064[23:52:54] <jsync> When I try to run gespeaker within a terminal, it gives error "No module named gtk.glade".
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• 3067[23:54:32] <jsync> python-gtk2 python-glade2 are installed.
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