People who Joins , Parts or Quits a chatroom
this is #debian an IRC -Channel at freenode (freenode IRC service closed 2021-06-01)
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27 [00:09:16] <Kevlar_Noir> I tried to follow this guide to avoid pulseaudio to start. replaced-url
28 [00:09:30] <Kevlar_Noir> but It doesn't work
29 [00:10:35] <somiaj> Kevlar_Noir: and removing pulseaudio isn't an option?
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31 [00:11:09] <Kevlar_Noir> yes
32 [00:11:26] <Kevlar_Noir> But I'm a beginner and I don't know how to remove it with kde
33 [00:11:34] <Kevlar_Noir> because of the dependecies
34 [00:11:49] <somiaj> yea, that could be a problem. So turrning autospan = no didn't work?
35 [00:12:06] <Kevlar_Noir> no
36 [00:12:08] <somiaj> also it might not be possible to run kde without pulse, it might only use pulse and not alsa.
37 [00:12:20] <Kevlar_Noir> I'm not sure
38 [00:12:22] <somiaj> so eventhough it isn't auto spawning, kde is still launching it.
39 [00:12:28] <Kevlar_Noir> I was on xfce
40 [00:12:34] <Kevlar_Noir> ah !
41 [00:12:36] <somiaj> any reason why you don't want pulse?
42 [00:12:51] <Kevlar_Noir> I have an RT kernel
43 [00:12:54] <somiaj> personally if using kde or a big desktop that uses it, I would just use it.
44 [00:13:02] <Kevlar_Noir> and I'm a musician
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48 [00:13:17] <Kevlar_Noir> I just want to switch sometimes to KDE
49 [00:13:22] <tijeretas__> Kevlar_Noir: Phonon might be starting it. Have you looked into the KDE sound settings?
50 [00:13:29] <Kevlar_Noir> I will
51 [00:13:31] <somiaj> Ahh, yea unsure on the details there. Maybe someone who uses KDE can say weither or not it can be disabled.
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54 [00:14:21] <Kevlar_Noir> will search on the kde option
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56 [00:16:41] <Kevlar_Noir> mhhh I'm lost
57 [00:17:12] <thescientist> nodiscc: hi, you helped me yesterday with trying to solve an issue with google earth. today I did some testing and found that apparently there is an issue with my system/installation. Because google earth does work properly on Buster/unstable. either installing it first and then upgrading to buster or the other way around. I guess I'll have to reinstall my system.
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67 [00:20:08] <tijeretas__> Kevlar_Noir: Just an idea, but maybe PulseAudio is started by another user (some KDE thing that's registered as a special user) and so you might have to disable autospawn globally? With globally I mean in /etc/pulse/client.conf
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69 [00:20:57] <Kevlar_Noir> I will see that
70 [00:21:13] <Kevlar_Noir> I think I've already do that
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72 [00:21:47] <Kevlar_Noir> another user ?
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74 [00:22:14] <Kevlar_Noir> yes I've already did that on the /etc/pulse/client.conf
75 [00:22:46] <tijeretas__> Kevlar_Noir: sometimes services are started as fictional users that have certain permsissions, but as I see, that's a moot point.
76 [00:23:04] <Kevlar_Noir> what can I dio ?
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78 [00:23:36] <tijeretas__> Does disabling Pulse via Systemd help somehow? Maybe by deleting the systemd entry?
79 [00:23:56] <Kevlar_Noir> wait
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81 [00:25:21] <kot> Kevlar_Noir, rosegarden + fluidsynth work pretty well, or musescore if you read. reaper works ok under wine.
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85 [00:26:20] <Kevlar_Noir> I can us the rc.local method
86 [00:26:46] <Kevlar_Noir> it's masked
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88 [00:27:20] <Kevlar_Noir> I can enable it ( there's already something in it, because I've add the KXstudio repos )
89 [00:27:57] <Kevlar_Noir> kot: I'm using Ardour
90 [00:28:45] <Kevlar_Noir> and I have not issues with "linvst"
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97 [00:32:01] <Kevlar_Noir> wait the systemctl method works
98 [00:32:17] <tijeretas__> yaaaaay
99 [00:32:44] <Kevlar_Noir> yeahhhhhhhhhhh
100 [00:33:08] <Kevlar_Noir> I can now play yt videos in "bitperfect"
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102 [00:33:31] <tijeretas__> I wouldn't celebrate just yet. Go and open up KDE with a native qt application and play sound. And then see if Pulseaudio has been restarted.
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104 [00:33:35] <g00se1> I'm sitting here at a Jessie/Mate laptop. The power management has decided to ignore my settings (Display sleep after 1 min inactive) What to do?
105 [00:33:42] <Kevlar_Noir> ah ok
106 [00:33:52] <g00se1> (Was working few days ago)
107 [00:34:06] <Kevlar_Noir> I tried with chromium tijeretas__
108 [00:34:10] <Kevlar_Noir> I think it's ok
109 [00:34:19] <Kevlar_Noir> but I will try other apps
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111 [00:34:54] <Kevlar_Noir> with kwave
112 [00:35:02] <tijeretas__> g00se1: have you installed any other power management software by accident? maybe something from another desktop environment?
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115 [00:35:33] <g00se1> Don't think so
116 [00:36:01] <Kevlar_Noir> I guess, I must create a script with the systemctl commands ?
117 [00:36:10] <Kevlar_Noir> for the startup
118 [00:36:37] <Kevlar_Noir> or just dsiable with systemctl
119 [00:36:39] <tijeretas__> Kevlar_Noir: isn't it enough to just disable pulseaudio from starting up at all?
120 [00:36:46] <Kevlar_Noir> I wrote it
121 [00:36:48] <Kevlar_Noir> yes
122 [00:36:51] <g00se1> >>Loaded: loaded (/lib/systemd/system/upower.service; disabled; vendor preset: << was weird though. I systemctl enabled it when i saw that. No change
123 [00:37:43] <tijeretas__> upower should definitely be started. Maybe you have to reboot after re-enabling this? And maybe make sure it's also started at system start up?
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125 [00:38:22] <somiaj> g00se1: enable only makes it run at boot, if you want to start it use systemctl start
126 [00:38:24] <Kevlar_Noir> why do I just avoid follow the archlinux wiki argh
127 [00:38:26] <g00se1> That would be a bit Windowsish ;)
128 [00:38:44] <g00se1> Did restart actually
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130 [00:39:39] <michael2> g00se1: are you managing power through upower.service?
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132 [00:40:39] <g00se1> Well i didn't do anything deliberate . Just looked for service - thinking that it got stopped maybe
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135 [00:41:24] <g00se1> That line i quoted above looks dodgy but it all said it was running??
136 [00:41:37] <g00se1> s/all/also
137 [00:41:37] <michael2> g00se1: what if you stop the upower service (kill the daemon) does the problem go away?
138 [00:42:02] <g00se1> I'll try it. Counter-intuitive ;)
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140 [00:42:59] <tijeretas__> I just thought about something... Jessie has an older version of Mate. Might that be the one that isn't using upower at all?
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143 [00:44:06] <g00se1> No chaange. What would it use instead?
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145 [00:44:47] <tijeretas__> g00se1: not sure? apt-cache show mate-power-manager should show upower as a dependency if it's used (I think)
146 [00:44:49] <michael2> g00se1: is upower.service running? you didn;'t show the "Active" line in you message above
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148 [00:45:15] <g00se1> Well i just stopped it - per your suggestion
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150 [00:45:53] <Kevlar_Noir> I follow the arch method finally
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152 [00:46:04] <tijeretas__> ACtually, scratch that. packages.debian.org shows that the jessie version also uses upower as dep.
153 [00:46:13] <Kevlar_Noir> because the previous method wasn't clear for me
154 [00:46:16] <Kevlar_Noir> To disable pulseaudio.socket, make sure that $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/systemd/user/ exists and run systemctl --user mask pulseaudio.socket
155 [00:46:20] <michael2> g00se1: and your laptop is "sleeping" still? what do you mean sleeping? the display turns off? it suspends?
156 [00:47:05] <g00se1> I want the display to sleep after 1 minute inaction. It stopped doing that a couple of days ago
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158 [00:47:14] <g00se1> No new software. Updates though
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161 [00:48:44] <michael2> oh you _want_ it to go to sleep after a minute? sorry I thought you wanted to stop the display turning off
162 [00:49:02] <g00se1> The very contrary ;)
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164 [00:50:01] <g00se1> I use at commands to get it to turn off when i start piling up ZZZZZZZZZZs. It keeps me awke if the display stays on
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166 [00:50:21] <g00se1> I have it playing music
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169 [00:52:40] <somiaj> what are you using to play music? Is it just music, or video and music?
170 [00:52:47] <g00se1> vlc
171 [00:53:08] <somiaj> wonder if vlc is disabling the screen saver, it should if playing a video, though seems odd if playing just music
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173 [00:53:20] <somiaj> anyways, maybe turn off vlc and see if that helps -- though as you said it use to work.
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175 [00:53:39] <g00se1> Yes, was not a problem before
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177 [00:54:24] <g00se1> Actually it's impossible to kill upowerd without it respawning
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182 [00:57:40] <somiaj> you have to mask the service, systemd restarts things that are killed (or stop the service)
183 [00:57:57] <g00se1> Right
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185 [00:59:03] <mnuhmnuh> what happens if you disable it?
186 [00:59:45] <g00se1> Haven't tried. Just killed mate-power-manager though
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192 [01:02:02] <g00se1> mnuhmnuh: what's your thinking on that one?
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194 [01:03:26] <mnuhmnuh> i've never heard of upowerd. i just know disabling cups via systemd does eliminate cups.
195 [01:04:38] <g00se1> I don't want to eliminate power control. On the contrary, - i want it to do MORE controlling ;)
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197 [01:06:39] <mnuhmnuh> i don't like the system powering down my display, so i run xscreensaver to disable mate's power mgmt. ickiness.
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199 [01:08:42] <mnuhmnuh> i turn it of at night with a button push; none of that soft-off !@#$ for me. :-)
200 [01:09:06] <g00se1> Not sure if i've got a hardware off facility
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202 [01:12:01] <g00se1> Hmm i suppose i could try the stretch backports mate-power-manager
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208 [01:14:34] <g00se1> Installed. Going to reboot. Thanks guys
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226 [01:23:25] <g00se1> Installing backported mate-power-manager fixed it. Possibly reinstalling main one would have done the same
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264 [01:45:47] <nezZario> I don't know what I did wrong
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270 [01:46:47] <nezZario> So, I had an ext4 filesystem take a crap last weekend. I was able to fsck it back to being mountable but I lost my entire /home directory and some other data. Enough data that it was no longer bootable, but I was able to mount the filesystem and I had a lot of data that was still recoverable without any special software.
271 [01:47:56] <mutante> areplaced-url
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273 [01:48:07] <nezZario> wait - it gets worse
274 [01:48:15] <mutante> never heard of ext4 doing that .. knock on wood
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276 [01:49:56] <nezZario> Anyway, so, before I re-installed, I did something like dd if=/dev/mapper/myvg-rootpartition of=/mnt/some-usbdrive/myrootpartition.ext4fs and let it complete. I never tested it afterward, though, stupidly. Now, for some reason, I can't mount it. It just says bad superblock or whatever. I did a hexedit on the disk-file and my data is definitely in there, ... What I am doing is just losetup -j /media/.../myroot.ext4fs
277 [01:49:56] <nezZario> /dev/loop0 and then mount /dev/loop0 /mnt ..
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283 [01:51:19] <nezZario> So (1) does anyone know if there is something else I might can try? That should be correct, right? I copied the filesystem block device, and not the underlying disk device, so I shouldn't have an offset, correct? ... (2) Assuming I am just completely unable to mount the disk copy, .. anyone have any software suggestions on going about trying to attempt to repair the filesystem copy or just try to pull files off?
284 [01:51:28] <mindloop> Hi, how do do I find out, via command line what graphics drivers my computer is using?
285 [01:51:43] <nezZario> mindloop: lspci might give you some indication
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288 [01:52:04] <mindloop> nezZario,
289 [01:52:10] <mindloop> was that card or driver?
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292 [01:54:09] <nezZario> Excuse me?
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295 [01:54:41] <mindloop> Hi, how do do I find out, via command line, what graphics drivers my computer is using?
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298 [01:54:59] <nezZario> Did you try the command, on the command line, 'lspci' ?
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303 [01:56:02] <mindloop> nezZario, Does that givethe card or driver?
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305 [01:56:38] <somiaj> lspci lists the actual hardware
306 [01:56:55] <somiaj> you can check dmesg, but usually when people thinkg graphics driver, they think xorg, so check your Xorg.0.log file
307 [01:57:10] <somiaj> if you just want to check glxinfo, run 'glxinfo' from a xterm or similar terminal
308 [01:57:10] <nezZario> I'm pretty sure the way it works is some sort of ID that the BIOS provides and it uses a database to convert that identifier into something intelligible
309 [01:58:07] <Thedarkb-X40> H
310 [01:58:08] <Thedarkb-X40> Hm
311 [01:58:18] <Thedarkb-X40> My integrated graphics are on the PCI bus.
312 [01:58:27] <Thedarkb-X40> And this laptop doesn't have PCIe
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315 [01:59:55] <somiaj> well the pci bus will be the same bus pcie cards are on.
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319 [02:01:25] <nezZario> Uh, .. I have some array of hope here
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321 [02:01:56] <Thedarkb-X40> somiaj, This laptop predates PCIe though.
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324 [02:02:19] <Thedarkb-X40> My WiFi card, graphics and modem are all on the same bus.
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328 [02:04:35] <mindloop> somiaj, I am sure there is a salient, cross distro command that can break down egg-zactly the driver your machine is using. There tends to be a distinction between hardware and drivers. Hence my question.
329 [02:05:04] <mindloop> Someone told me here but I forgot.
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331 [02:05:35] <nezZario> This is probably a little too niche, but, ... anyone know where I mind find some information about why losetup isn't working? Or.. any idea what's going on here? I'm doing .... losetup -v -j /media/myuser/longuuid/myvol-root.ext4fs /dev/loop0 .... and I get no output (even with -v) .. no useful information in syslog, either. Afterwards, there are no loop devices are in use (losetup --all and losetup --list produce no
332 [02:05:35] <nezZario> output)
333 [02:06:01] <nezZario> Just, nothing.
334 [02:06:09] <nezZario> So perhaps I just am not connecting the loop device properly
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336 [02:06:19] <somiaj> mindloop: lshw will list all hardware and let you know what kernel module is loaded and assoicated with your hardware (if any), but this may not list the xorg driver used.
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339 [02:06:59] <somiaj> but to me what graphics driver am I using is more an xy problem.
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346 [02:08:26] <michael2> I just downloaded a font file and put it into the location:
347 [02:08:30] <michael2> /home/user1/.fonts/System San Francisco Display Thin.ttf
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350 [02:10:07] <michael2> then I did `fc-cache -fv' and now I try to, search for, and match the font, with `fc-match' "System San Franciso" and fc-match returns
351 [02:10:09] <michael2> LiberationSans-Regular.ttf: "Liberation Sans" "Regular"
352 [02:10:14] <michael2> anyone know why?
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354 [02:11:05] <michael2> I expected fc-match to show the "System San Franciso" font
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356 [02:11:26] <nezZario> Uh, disregard my question above about losetup. Long story short, if you're going to read a man page, actually read it instead of just skimming the synopsis
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368 [02:17:39] <nezZario> hm .. i wonder if it's possible to recover my home directory ... does anyone know any software that works specifically with ext3/4 filesystems and data recovery? basically waht happened was, .. and it was bizarre, but, i did a fsck and it did a few but not many modifications, and then let me mount it, but the system still wouldn't boot, but my home directory was still there.... so I re-ran fsck and this time it came up with
369 [02:17:39] <nezZario> a mile long list of errors, and stupidly I ran fsck -y ... and then when I mounted it afterwards, my home directory was no longer even a directory, but a #*$@)'ing Google Chrome EULA file or something
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374 [02:18:51] <nezZario> I have 3,000 files in lost+found .. I wonder if it's all in here?
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407 [02:38:31] <somiaj> nezZario: sounds like your system shtudown without unmounting your file system.
408 [02:39:01] <somiaj> there is software, but if you want recovery you should 1) unmount the file system imidetally. 2) make an image of it, 3) use the recovery software on the image. I don't know any off hand.
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410 [02:41:39] <nezZario> somiaj: That's what I am working with, a file-based image of the disk on a usb stick. and yes, that's what happened. not even a power outage, funny enough, I just had moved some things around, and had the poewr strip exposed kind of sitting out in the open and my daughter kicked it enough that it unplugged.
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415 [02:44:38] <somiaj> well I would check lost+found first
416 [02:45:59] <somiaj> nezZario: replaced-url
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441 [03:09:07] <foul_owl> How do I replace the nvidia driver from the repos with the driver from nvidia's site?
442 [03:09:20] <foul_owl> Mainly concerned about the "uninstall" stage
443 [03:09:34] <foul_owl> I know how to run the .run file of course
444 [03:10:44] <somiaj> In general you don't want to do that.
445 [03:10:55] <somiaj> in debian use the nvidia driver provided by debian.
446 [03:10:59] <somiaj> ,v nvidia-kernel-dkms
447 [03:11:01] <judd> Package: nvidia-kernel-dkms on amd64 -- wheezy/non-free: 304.131-1; wheezy-backports/non-free: 340.102-1~bpo70+1; jessie/non-free: 340.102-1; jessie-proposed-updates/non-free: 340.106-1; stretch/non-free: 375.82-1~deb9u1; jessie-backports/non-free: 384.111-4~deb9u1~bpo8+1; stretch-proposed-updates/non-free: 384.130-1; stretch-backports/non-free: 390.48-2~bpo9+2; buster/non-free: 390.48-3; sid/non-
448 [03:11:02] <judd> free: 390.48-3
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450 [03:11:18] <somiaj> often the newer ones are provided in stretch-backports, so if you need a newer version you can get 390.48 from stretch-backports.
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453 [03:14:33] <foul_owl> Ok, so the driver in the repos doesn't support cuda 9
454 [03:14:49] <foul_owl> That's my issue
455 [03:15:10] <foul_owl> I'm working on a scientific computing project for school that requires cuda 9 to compile
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460 [03:15:55] <foul_owl> The driver in the repos is too outdated :(
461 [03:16:10] <foul_owl> I'm on Jessie
462 [03:16:23] <foul_owl> I don't have time to wipe my system and do a full OS reinstall
463 [03:16:39] <foul_owl> I actually tried that but getting some bug with stretch where i get a blank screen and no tty
464 [03:16:44] <dvs> foul_owl, you don't have to do a reinstall to go to stretch
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466 [03:17:02] <foul_owl> Ah do a distro upgrade
467 [03:17:05] <foul_owl> Hmmm
468 [03:17:52] <somiaj> you could remove all nvidia packages and isntall the nvidia drivers form upstream if you really want. This will put your system in a state that things may break, and it would make upgrading to stretch way harder.
469 [03:17:58] <foul_owl> 390.48 supports cuda 9? and all the cuda 9 packages are in the stretch repos?
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473 [03:18:43] <foul_owl> I have a second hard drive with the failed stretch install on it, I'm planning on migrating but so far my attempts to debug the black screen issue have failed. It's especially frustrating that systemd doesn't provide ttys by defaul
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476 [03:18:54] <foul_owl> So I'm screwed, can't enable ttys because I have a black screen
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478 [03:19:09] <foul_owl> Yes, I tried safe mode, all that, still black screen
479 [03:19:32] <foul_owl> My only guess is that for some reason stretch doesn't support my 4k tv which I'm using as a monitor (but works fine on my jessie install)
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482 [03:21:07] <foul_owl> My graphics card has 5 outputs....running my tv off the hdmi output...it seems my bios is smart enough to pick the right one, but stretch is not?
483 [03:21:20] <foul_owl> 1x dvi, 3x display port, 1x hdmi
484 [03:21:49] <foul_owl> SOrry running it off the dvi is what I meant
485 [03:21:54] <somiaj> you might find disabling the nvidia driver and just go back to nouveau can help during the upgrade process (also not running xorg)
486 [03:22:06] <somiaj> or even the debugging process
487 [03:22:39] <foul_owl> An upgrade is off the table, too risky with no fallback. I have two SSDs, one with jessie, one with stretch. I would prefer to debug the stretch install
488 [03:22:56] <foul_owl> That way I just swap the drives to fallback
489 [03:23:01] <foul_owl> Which I've had to do
490 [03:23:20] <foul_owl> So I guess my question now becomes:
491 [03:23:26] <somiaj> go disable the graphical.target in the stretch install and just use multi-user.target, so you don't boot into xorg, that could help
492 [03:23:27] <foul_owl> How do I tell grub I need ttys?
493 [03:23:37] <foul_owl> Still get a black screen when I do that
494 [03:23:46] <somiaj> that is outside of grub, grub only points at the kernel
495 [03:24:04] <foul_owl> Ok I can't even get a terminal when I'm booting
496 [03:24:08] <foul_owl> Just a black screen
497 [03:24:09] <somiaj> To me an install doesn't take to long, I would almost reinstall if you are unsure how to debug your install.
498 [03:24:26] <somiaj> so you see grub, then after you select to boot stretch, you get no output what so ever?
499 [03:24:30] <foul_owl> I have reinstalled several times here
500 [03:24:35] <foul_owl> Correct
501 [03:24:51] <foul_owl> Like I said, I think the bios picks the correct output from my video card, but stretch does not
502 [03:25:00] <somiaj> I woudl at least disable the nvidia module, so you don't have a tainted kernel.
503 [03:25:02] <foul_owl> jessie does however
504 [03:25:16] <somiaj> might just be you need to rebuild the initramfs, but at this point I'm only guessing.
505 [03:25:19] <foul_owl> How do I disable the nvidia module in grub?
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507 [03:25:56] <somiaj> you might have to just remove it, or blacklist it and unblack list nouveau.
508 [03:26:08] <foul_owl> Honestly I blame systemd :P
509 [03:26:19] <somiaj> I'm unsure if there is a flag you can disable it from grub. Grub is actually quite limited, and using a resuce system is better
510 [03:26:29] <foul_owl> Urg ok understood
511 [03:26:32] <somiaj> well since jessie and stretch both use systemd, seems like you just want to join the blame systemd banwagon
512 [03:26:45] <foul_owl> I know, I'm just joking
513 [03:26:59] <foul_owl> Sorry
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515 [03:28:17] <somiaj> so when installing stretch, did it work up to the time you installed the nvidia drivers? Or have you not even goten to the point of isntalling those drivers (I don't think you can isntall them during the installer stage)
516 [03:28:48] <foul_owl> Yes, no video drivers were selected by me
517 [03:28:53] <foul_owl> The entire install worked fine
518 [03:29:03] <foul_owl> I have not been able to boot into it once yet
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521 [03:29:34] <foul_owl> What mechanism is responsible for choosing the output port for my video card?
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528 [03:32:12] <somiaj> kinda depends on how you boot, if using uefi, you should be able to pass the uefi settings straight to the os, but maybe it nouveau driver is loading and causing problems. What nvidia card do you have?
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536 [03:36:59] <foul_owl> 1060 6gig
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626 [04:57:40] <jeb> I'm in a state where most apt-get commands prompt me to apt --fix-broken install, and when I do *that*, dpkg complains of dependency problems, for example: "glx-alternative-nvidia depends on glx-diversions (= 0.8.3); however: / Package glx-diversions is not installed." Trying to install glx-diversions with `dpkg --install glx-diversions` gives "dpkg: error: cannot access archive 'glx-diversions': No such file or directory". How can I get
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628 [04:59:43] <themill> jeb: apt download package name; you might also do better with #debian-next for testing/unstable support
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632 [05:00:25] <somiaj> jeb: note #debian-next is on irc.oftc.net (different network)
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637 [05:03:24] <jeb> themill: I can't join #debian-next without invitation, apparently.
638 [05:03:33] <themill> jeb: what somiaj said
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641 [05:04:13] <SlidingHorn> jeb: you have to go to the one on oftc.net
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643 [05:05:11] <jeb> SlidingHorn: Ah, found it. Thanks.
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651 [05:12:24] <davesp> jeb, have you tried putting all of the packages on the same command line, as in "apt-get install pkg1 pkg2 ..."?
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726 [06:43:19] <SirLagz> anyone still use ALSA and swaps their Left and Right channels? I've had them swapped via a .asoundrc config for ages, but after upgrading to kernel 4.6.0-9, it's suddenly stopped working. Anyone experienced the same?
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728 [06:44:48] <SirLagz> I used the same config as this answer - replaced-url
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732 [06:50:11] <FXpro> can someone help me please
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735 [06:53:20] <Pavel> What's the cleanest way to add firmware that's not packaged for Debian or any of its derivatives (as far as I can tell)? In particular, I have a graphics device (Ryzen 5 2400G APU) that seems to call for firmware (amdgpu/raven_gpu_info.bin and perhaps others) that is not packaged for any Debian but is available at linux-firmare.git.
736 [06:53:43] <cluelessperson> I have a question
737 [06:54:02] <cluelessperson> in debian, the permissions here ARE 555
738 [06:54:11] <Pavel> I've tried grabbing the bin files from there, and putting them into /usr/local/lib/firmware/amdgpu, but that doesn't seem to help. How do I make the system search there?
739 [06:54:12] <cluelessperson> but I get No permisison when I try to run it
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743 [06:58:29] <somiaj> Pavel: if the kernel supports it, you can just manually add it to /lib/firmware
744 [06:58:48] <somiaj> Pavel: just put it in /lib/firwmare
745 [06:59:24] <somiaj> cluelessperson: can you give the actual output? Sometimes the permission denied is not about the file that is being run, but something it depends on.
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747 [06:59:48] <Pavel> somiaj: I'd rather not pollute /lib/firmware. I'll forget about it, and then, when Debian starts packaging it, it'll cause mysterious errors.
748 [07:00:13] <somiaj> no it won't
749 [07:00:21] <cluelessperson> somiaj: that seems to be the case, sorry to bother you. :)
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751 [07:00:45] <somiaj> and unforntaully that is where the kernel looks for firmware. Debian would just overwrite that file and not think twice once it packages it
752 [07:00:52] <somiaj> cluelessperson: so you tracked down the issue? good job.
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757 [07:02:14] <cluelessperson> somiaj: thanks :)
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759 [07:03:08] <somiaj> Pavel: I just can't think of another option, so that is where I would put it.
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761 [07:04:37] <Pavel> somiaj: replaced-url
762 [07:04:53] <Pavel> somiaj: I was thinking of downloading the Debian source package and patching that.
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767 [07:07:37] <somiaj> Pavel: I seem to read that differntly than you then. replaced-url
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769 [07:08:19] <Pavel> somiaj: Oh, I see. My bad.
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771 [07:08:44] <somiaj> Pavel: replaced-url
772 [07:08:45] <judd> Bug replaced-url
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775 [07:11:51] <Pavel> Well, the firmware is loading, and there don't appear to be any errors, but the graphics still aren't working.
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777 [07:13:15] <somiaj> do you have firmware-amd-graphics installed?
778 [07:13:25] <somiaj> and by graphics still not working, I assume you are talking about xorg?
779 [07:14:01] <somiaj> did you double check your Xorg.0.log and see if the amdgpu driver is actually being loaded?
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781 [07:15:21] <Pavel> somiaj: Looking things now.
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784 [07:16:59] <Pavel> somiaj: Thought it might be an old xorg.conf, but it doesn't look that way.
785 [07:17:42] <somiaj> Pavel: it might be in ~/.local/share/xorg/ if using the non-setuid xorg.
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787 [07:18:09] <somiaj> but if amdgpu isn't being loaded you could try to force it, or the log might say what is being loaded or why amdgpu wasn't.
788 [07:18:11] <Pavel> somiaj: It's using GDM, so unlikely.
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793 [07:22:39] <Pavel> ... Forgot that a lot of logging is now done via systemd stuff rather than /var/log...
794 [07:23:17] <somiaj> Xorg.0.log should still be on your system, either in /var/log or ~/.local/share/xorg
795 [07:25:14] <Pavel> somiaj: It looks like sometimes it writes to it and sometimes it doesn't. Anyway, I've found the GDM's log. It detects the video card, but it can't detect the screen.
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821 [07:47:02] <Pavel> somiaj: Anyway, thanks for the advice.
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894 [09:03:07] <jim> what is opendkim?
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897 [09:04:36] <nkuttler> jim: do you know what dkim is?
898 [09:04:49] <nkuttler> replaced-url
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908 [09:10:42] <jim> nkuttler, no, not at all... the thing is installed and says (during upgrade) it wants to replace a config file
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946 [09:33:34] <Guest20750> h
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953 [09:43:19] <jim> orse? ouse? ipster?
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1045 [10:55:41] <vonsanchez> hello toystory fans
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1049 [10:56:21] <vonsanchez> i am trying to build my first stretch preseed iso
1050 [10:56:52] <vonsanchez> and i cannot figure out how to set "scan another CD or DVD?" to no in my preseed.cfg
1051 [10:57:05] <vonsanchez> anyone know how?
1052 [10:57:56] <vonsanchez> tried apt-cdrom-setup apt-setup/cdrom/set-next boolean false
1053 [10:58:12] <vonsanchez> tried d-i apt-setup/cdrom/set-next boolean false
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1055 [10:58:21] <vonsanchez> still getting the question
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1079 [11:19:33] <folatt_> replaced-url
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1105 [11:35:21] <SirLagz> anyone still use ALSA and swaps their Left and Right channels? I've had them swapped via a .asoundrc config for ages, but after upgrading to kernel 4.6.0-9, it's suddenly stopped working. Anyone experienced the same?
1106 [11:35:26] <SirLagz> I used the same config as this answer - replaced-url
1107 [11:35:49] <SirLagz> but even though I can see the alsa config settings changing in QasConfig, the sound is still reversed
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1110 [11:40:20] <Tywin> You must have some serious lag if you just upgraded to 4.6
1111 [11:40:24] <Tywin> *rimshot*
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1115 [11:42:16] <SirLagz> err 4.9
1116 [11:42:42] <SirLagz> was 4.9.0-6 rather than 4.6.0-9 lol
1117 [11:43:00] <SirLagz> was meant to be*
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1143 [12:04:58] <folatt> replaced-url
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1173 [12:31:51] <petn-randall> folatt: This is a Debian support channel. You are running raspbian. Please ask in their channel.
1174 [12:31:54] <petn-randall> !raspbian
1175 [12:31:54] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian on irc.freenode.net for support. replaced-url
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1177 [12:31:58] <petn-randall> Also relevant:
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1179 [12:32:00] <petn-randall> !crosspost
1180 [12:32:00] <dpkg> Posting the same question in several places at the same time (IRC channels, news groups, mailing lists, forums) is impolite; your time is NOT more valuable than everyone else's. Your question might be answered elsewhere, meanwhile we are wasting our time doing research for a problem you've already solved. Cross-posting can also make you look like a spammer and get you k:lined. See also <multiple ask> <hurry>.
1181 [12:32:04] <petn-randall> folatt: ^^^
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1183 [12:32:55] <folatt> petn-randall, okay thanks
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1193 [12:38:27] <hassoon> What can i do, after a recent upgrade from jessie to stretch, the system now is slower, I've been experiencing delayed response whether i'm typing code or scrolling some window
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1217 [12:53:46] <petn-randall> hassoon: What exactly is slower?
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1219 [12:54:19] <petn-randall> hassoon: I'd say those two things are separate.
1220 [12:54:21] <hassoon> petn-randall: scrolling windows/terminals, or typing somewhere
1221 [12:54:36] <petn-randall> hassoon: Even on a terminal you switch to with ctrl + alt + F2?
1222 [12:55:05] <hassoon> petn-randall: nah i don't often use full consoles
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1225 [12:55:14] <hassoon> petn-randall: but yeah, that too
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1258 [13:11:45] <webunicorn> hi
1259 [13:11:58] <webunicorn> I already got a sudoers.d file for user deploy to restart a service
1260 [13:12:08] <webunicorn> I also want that the user can issue mount and umount commands
1261 [13:12:20] <webunicorn> shold I create a 2nd file in sudoers for that user with mount and umount?
1262 [13:12:24] <webunicorn> Or append to the existing file?
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1264 [13:12:35] <webunicorn> will one file override the other anyway?
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1272 [13:18:32] <somiaj> webunicorn: it is up to you, splitting a single sudoers file into multiple is about how you want to orginze things.
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1274 [13:19:05] <somiaj> webunicorn: though be careful with allowing mount, that is a fairly easy way for someone to gain full root privalges (seems like you only want them to have limited privlages)
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1277 [13:23:25] <webunicorn> somiaj: right! there is sadly no alternative :/ mount command for a CIFS mount. On the other hand that user already got enough priviliges to bork stuff well enough
1278 [13:23:31] <webunicorn> (and I can't reduce them further)
1279 [13:24:50] <webunicorn> there is one tool that offers something for non-root but only for home directories
1280 [13:24:55] <webunicorn> and it wasn't sufficient for my needs
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1285 [13:27:56] <somiaj> yea, just pointing out that due to setuid bits, giving someone mount privlages requires a good amount of trust.
1286 [13:28:35] <webunicorn> somiaj: thanks! :) maybe I can even further restrict what arguments the mount command can get by that user?
1287 [13:28:41] <somiaj> wonder if you can limt the command to only being able to mount cifs mounts, and avoid loop back mounts.
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1290 [13:29:59] <noodlepie> Hiya guys! Debian updated successfully today! @:P-~
1291 [13:30:51] <webunicorn> noodle: distribution update?
1292 [13:30:53] <hiya> noodlepie, With what?
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1294 [13:31:19] <webunicorn> noodle: yes, upgrades can go wrong somtimes. I should use staging first more often than I do...
1295 [13:31:37] <webunicorn> noodle: sorry, wrong user, I meant noodlepie
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1360 [14:34:36] <epergny> hypothetical question (don't know which channel it's best to ask it): do I wear a SSD faster if I keep on working with it being while it's about 98% full (say 5 GB free out of 250 GB) vs using it while only, say, 50% full?
1361 [14:34:52] <ikonia> try ##hardware ?
1362 [14:34:57] <ikonia> (as a suggestion)
1363 [14:35:07] <rozie> short answer: yest
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1365 [14:35:12] <rozie> yes*
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1368 [14:37:52] <epergny> ikonia: thx
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1371 [14:37:55] <epergny> rozie: thx
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1490 [15:34:42] <jhutchins> webunicorn: The reason for modular sudoers files is so that applications can simply drop a file in that directory rather than trying to formulaically edit /etc/sudoers.
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1492 [15:34:59] <jhutchins> webunicorn: For admin alterations there's no reason not to use the main file.
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1543 [15:58:09] <octet> Why does debian gnome give me a notification to "Restart & Install" updates? I do not need to restart if I just use "apt upgrade", so I don't understand why it requires a restart. here is a pic of what I mean: replaced-url
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1548 [16:00:54] <apache2notworkin> hello im using debian stretch and i have set up apache2 exactly as the manuals say. i have set up a crossover ethernet cable between the server and the client , like so, server 192.168.2.2, mask 24 and client 192,168.2.1 mask 24. no gateways or routes are set. is my network correct?
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1562 [16:10:19] <zZzZzZ> I just bought a 4TB seagate extention desktop hdd, and are about to format it with e4. lsblk tells me that there are 2 partitions on that drive: 1st: 128MB and 2nd: 3.7T. what is this first partition? shall I only format the 2nd? sigh. thx in advance
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1571 [16:19:30] <SirLagz> zZzZzZ: the first partition might be a 'virtual cd'? Tried plugging it into a windows machine?
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1573 [16:20:32] <zZzZzZ> yes, it isn't displayed there. the disk comes up as E: (primary partition)
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1593 [16:37:10] <emu_rider> octet: Because services / daemons would still be using the old version untill you restart them?
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1595 [16:38:11] <octet> Oh, I thought linux flushes the services, which is why people claim that Linux doesnt need restarts while Windows always must restart
1596 [16:38:31] <apollo13> no it does not and even if you were to restart services you'd need to restart for kernel updates
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1598 [16:39:00] <apollo13> and some services like systemd will be hard to restart after a glibc update
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1600 [16:39:36] <octet> I dont think any of the following are kernel updates though, yeah kernel updates must certainly need a restart
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1602 [16:40:06] <emu_rider> There is a command from xfce4-goodies package that will tell you what services you need to restart after upgrade
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1604 [16:42:32] <apollo13> needrestart is the cli version
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1614 [16:46:11] <WoC> Anyone using debian on hybrid graphics ? (intel + nVidia)
1615 [16:46:44] <babilen> Be the first!
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1617 [16:47:48] <WoC> Heh, lead the way! [;
1618 [16:48:04] <SirLagz> stupid ALSA, still haven't worked out why my L/R channel has stopped reversing itself :(
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1620 [16:48:21] <WoC> is debian systemd ?
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1623 [16:49:20] <NetTerminalGene> WoC, yes
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1626 [16:49:53] <WoC> dang... ty anyway
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1628 [16:50:28] <SirLagz> WoC: what's wrong with systemd?
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1634 [16:52:48] <WoC> i rather keep it simple, as in runit / openrc
1635 [16:52:52] <SirLagz> WoC: true
1636 [16:53:42] <SirLagz> WoC: if you wanted Debian without the systemd, you could try Devuan
1637 [16:53:56] <WoC> like being able to swutch runlevel easily , i.e. init 1... fix and init 3 (or 5)
1638 [16:54:13] <WoC> oh, ty
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1641 [16:57:31] <webunicorn> jhutchins: I am using ansible, so this may make sense?
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1644 [16:59:19] <babilen> dpkg: tell WoC -about bumblebee
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1646 [16:59:36] <WoC> ty
1647 [16:59:50] <babilen> WoC: You might want to inquire in #bumblebee about the current state of the art in that regard
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1652 [17:02:20] <apollo13> WoC: systemd allows you to switch runlevels rather easily
1653 [17:03:01] <apollo13> systemctl isolate runlevel1 is hardly much worse than init 1
1654 [17:03:13] <WoC> i wouldn't say easily
1655 [17:03:19] <apollo13> ?
1656 [17:03:34] <WoC> oh
1657 [17:03:53] <WoC> systemctl isolate runlevel6 too?
1658 [17:04:04] <apollo13> yes
1659 [17:04:13] <noodlepie> Did you remember to select Core2/Xeon cpu build type if you have a Core something CPU? (i7 here), rather then generic-x86_64 which produces slower kernels
1660 [17:04:17] <WoC> dang, that WAS ez
1661 [17:04:26] <apollo13> runlevelX are symlinks for poweroff, rescue, multi-user, graphical and reboot
1662 [17:04:37] <apollo13> I am always suprised by the ignorance of users (no offense to you directly WoC)
1663 [17:04:50] <apollo13> that they complain about the complexity of systemd but don't bother looking at it at all
1664 [17:04:51] <WoC> None taken :)
1665 [17:05:10] <apollo13> systemd can make your live so much easier
1666 [17:05:16] <Voldenet> people just assume systemd couldn't do what sysvinit could
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1668 [17:05:35] <WoC> Aye
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1676 [17:06:56] <Voldenet> It can pretty much do what sysvinit could
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1679 [17:08:13] <babilen> Can I write equally convoluted unit files like the init scripts we had to maintain?
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1681 [17:09:25] <Voldenet> You can write convoluted bash files and run them as Type=simple
1682 [17:09:34] <Voldenet> feel free to :)
1683 [17:09:44] <babilen> Hooray!
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1686 [17:11:47] <Voldenet> You can even run runsvdir from systemd, it's a bit confusing to use though, but you can :P
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1693 [17:18:15] <cariveri> I just tried apt-get upgrade on a jessie and it stucks at mysql-server-5.5 . whats a rasonable time to wait and what do I do in that case Id like to abort it?
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1695 [17:20:14] <at0m> depends on here it's stuck.. on install, on download, on extraction?
1696 [17:21:03] <at0m> can always ctrl-c it then apt-get -f install to 'fix' the previous installation (-f will always continue to try and install the previous request)
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1702 [17:29:17] <cariveri> at0m: ok thank you. after a while it continued successfully by itself. but nontheles good info!
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1706 [17:29:49] <jokoon> so does copying a debian iso image on a usb makes it bootable?
1707 [17:30:09] <jokoon> also I have a UEFI, do I have to disable secure boot?
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1713 [17:33:19] <at0m> jokoon: replaced-url
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1715 [17:34:32] <jokoon> well Im using windows right now, so Im out of luck
1716 [17:35:11] <jokoon> wait no, cp is ok
1717 [17:35:20] <jokoon> so yes, copying it is fine
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1719 [17:35:50] <at0m> but dont copy the iso to the partition. copy to the raw device, if windows supports that..
1720 [17:36:04] <SirLagz> win32dd will do that I think it's called
1721 [17:36:54] <cariveri> Hey agian. I considered upgrade debian 8 to 9 . and came across this warning: MariaDB replaces MySQL database in Debian 9 Stretch. is this correct?
1722 [17:37:01] <cariveri> I got it from replaced-url
1723 [17:37:53] <babilen> jokoon: Grab replaced-url
1724 [17:38:36] <jokoon> thanks
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1733 [17:42:29] <babilen> jokoon: I would also like to point out that Debian makes images with firmware available, which eases the installation if your networking depends on having firmware available (many wireless adaptors require it)
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1735 [17:42:33] <babilen> dpkg: firmware images
1736 [17:42:34] <dpkg> Unofficial <netinst> and DVD installer images containing non-free Debian firmware packages are available for installing Debian 9 "Stretch". See replaced-url
1737 [17:42:51] <babilen> That way you can use hardware that requires firmware during the installation
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1740 [17:43:33] <jokoon> oh
1741 [17:43:53] <jokoon> is it possible to know if I need this?
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1744 [17:44:56] <babilen> If you had planned to use the netinst image there is absolutely no downside to using the firmware one
1745 [17:45:25] <jokoon> I downloaded a 300MB image
1746 [17:45:26] <babilen> jokoon: It really depends on your hardware. If your wireless is a "standard" Intel one you probably need firmware for it to work
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1749 [17:46:00] <jokoon> its a 2x2 11b/g/n wireless LAN M.2 adapter (windows device manager speaking)
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1751 [17:46:23] <babilen> In the end the best image depends on the following points: 1. Do you have a (working) internet connection during the installation? 2. Does your hardware require firmware?
1752 [17:46:41] <jokoon> its a realtek
1753 [17:47:02] <babilen> Right, that probably requires firmware
1754 [17:47:25] <jokoon> so its not included in the 300MB debian installer?
1755 [17:47:36] <somiaj> Most likely if you have wifi you need firmware. If you have a wired connection, use that, then install firmware after.
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1757 [17:47:52] <babilen> jokoon: firmware is not included in the standard images as it isn't free
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1759 [17:48:24] <jokoon> by firmware, do you mean I have to flash my firmware? don't you mean a non-free driver?
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1761 [17:48:31] <babilen> There really is no downside in using the image with firmware if your hardware requires it
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1763 [17:48:50] <jokoon> yes but I did not understand how to get that image
1764 [17:49:11] <babilen> jokoon: No, you don't have to flash anything. It's just that the kernel module requires a binary blob (i.e. firmware) to function properly
1765 [17:49:26] <babilen> You download it from replaced-url
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1768 [17:50:44] <NetTerminalGene> i read that google switched to debian based system from ubuntu. why does google choose debian instead of centos or something?
1769 [17:50:56] <jokoon> what about UEFI secure boot? I remember having to disable it in a previous linux install
1770 [17:50:56] <babilen> Because Debian is awesome
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1772 [17:51:23] <jokoon> because debian is stable. ubuntu is based on debian
1773 [17:51:36] <jokoon> debian is the best maintained distro
1774 [17:51:38] <nkuttler> NetTerminalGene: i am the head of os research at google. debian is superior
1775 [17:51:46] <jokoon> it's the highest quality
1776 [17:51:46] <babilen> jokoon: You would have to disable that .. don't think we have signed images yet (but that might have changed)
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1778 [17:52:07] <NetTerminalGene> nkuttler, cool
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1780 [17:52:28] <jokoon> what does signed images mean?
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1783 [17:52:42] <babilen> jokoon: Images that you could use with secure boot
1784 [17:52:43] <jokoon> is that like a detached signature?
1785 [17:53:08] <jokoon> why aren't most linux distro not signed? isn't that trivial to do?
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1787 [17:53:13] <babilen> jokoon: Read replaced-url
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1791 [17:53:44] <jokoon> ok so it's some weird snafu from uefi chip makers I guess
1792 [17:54:12] <NetTerminalGene> nkuttler, in what sense is debian superior?
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1796 [17:55:10] <bites> they switched to debian testing for their in house distro because they wanted to make it a rolling release.
1797 [17:55:35] <jokoon> nkuttler, all the software that is included in debian, would it be driver, kernel updates, etc, are high quality, meaning they have higher standards
1798 [17:55:58] <jokoon> they don't update things if there is no need
1799 [17:56:26] <somiaj> NetTerminalGene: you are goint to be hard pressed to find people who argue it is not here. I personally like the stability and quality of debian, the amoutn of software availble, their stance on free software, and the fact that you can upgarde your system over time and not have to reinstall.
1800 [17:57:07] <jokoon> I wonder why ubuntu is more popular that debian though
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1802 [17:57:41] <jokoon> I heard ubuntu is abandoning unity
1803 [17:57:52] <NetTerminalGene> already abandoned
1804 [17:57:53] <somiaj> jokoon: it has a large company behind it pushign it, along with it makes things easy for end users, because it has different goals. For instance one would be given non-free firmware (and other software) automatically in ubuntu beucase it is easier.
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1806 [17:58:26] <babilen> Also "enterprise support"
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1827 [18:15:42] <NetTerminalGene> nkuttler, are you really head of research at google?
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1830 [18:19:10] <bites> can confirm. i'm head of HR at google.
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1844 [18:26:47] <NetTerminalGene> bites, what is HR?
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1847 [18:27:58] <NetTerminalGene> i thought heads of research wouldn't waste their time in here
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1851 [18:28:42] <emu_rider> cleaner at google, can confirm as well :P
1852 [18:28:57] <Ooze> Using a monitoring software, I'm trying to run the command 'cmk -II HOSTNAME' where HOSTNAME processes each line of a file of hostnames I have procured. Does anyone know of a way to complete this task?
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1857 [18:31:30] <somiaj> Ooze: maybe xargs, cat file | xargs cmk -II {} (man xargs for how to run the command one at a time, I'm missing some flags so my command wont' directly work)
1858 [18:32:22] <Ooze> I'll look into that. Thanks, somiaj
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1862 [18:32:41] <zZzZzZ> how can I tell if the lazy itable and journal inits are finished? would ot be save to rsync files to that drive if it is still going?
1863 [18:32:52] <zZzZzZ> on ext4^
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1882 [18:46:20] <zetta> Hello!
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1909 [18:58:40] <emu_rider> When a new stable comes out, do you guys usually do a fresh install and reuse /home/, or just apt dist-upgrade?
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1913 [18:58:57] <bites> just the upgrade.
1914 [18:59:08] <somiaj> I think most just upgrade, since that is usually easier than an install.
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1917 [18:59:58] <somiaj> make sure to read the release notes about known issues. Sometimes it is best to wait a few months to let known issues get documented. And of course backup before ugprading. It works most the time, but in some cases it can cause problems (Espically if you use a lot of third party software)
1918 [19:00:56] <emu_rider> somiaj: do you mean issues with the upgrade process or the packages themselves have issues?
1919 [19:01:04] <somiaj> with the upgrade process
1920 [19:01:51] <somiaj> It is well testted before the release, but it is just not possible to test every use case, and as I said adding thrid party software into the mix can easily throw a wrench into the gears.
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1923 [19:02:20] <emu_rider> So it would be better if I fresh install with the new stable iso right?
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1926 [19:02:49] <emu_rider> and avoid all the potential issues
1927 [19:02:54] <somiaj> I dno't know what you mean by better. I haven't reinstalled my main desktop os since 2006, when I switched to 64bit hardware.
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1929 [19:03:17] <r3> define "better", as the same issues are going to arise with 3rd party stuff either way
1930 [19:03:34] <hicks__> fresh install means you need a backup anyway, so just backup, try the upgrade and if all works out you're done. I've yet to encounter an issue that wasn't noted in the release docs though.
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1932 [19:03:58] <hicks__> Long as you have backups, there's no reason imo to fear doing an upgrade.
1933 [19:04:21] <emu_rider> do release docs show how to fix the known upgrade issues?
1934 [19:04:33] <somiaj> they explain known issues and work arounds
1935 [19:04:44] <r3> if you're really worried, you could image the existing system, then create a VM with it, try the upgrade in the VM, and work out the issues there.
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1940 [19:05:50] <emu_rider> r3: There is a way to make an iso with all my installed packages?
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1946 [19:07:25] <r3> sure you can just image the drive? Not sure what you're asking. You'll have to boot from CD/USB so that you can image the drive unmounted.
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1954 [19:10:57] <r3> or take that system's drive over to a different system and image it there. I do that frequently.
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1959 [19:14:11] <emu_rider> ah so if I boot a live-usb and I can create an iso of my os
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1961 [19:14:59] <r3> sure
1962 [19:15:14] <r3> problem sometimes becomes where to put it - can't put it back on the drive you're imaging.
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1966 [19:16:02] <emu_rider> I have a portable hard drive to store the iso
1967 [19:16:16] <r3> you can use 'dd' but I prefer 'ddrescue' as it does more and has nice status. 'apt-get install gddrescue' is the one you want, with the 'g' - not the other one.
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1969 [19:17:43] <emu_rider> and if my current system is messed up, I can dd the iso back into /dev/sda and restore the system no problem yes?
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1971 [19:17:52] <sumi> hello
1972 [19:18:07] <emu_rider> Will I need to mess with grub or anything like that?
1973 [19:18:17] <r3> as long as the architectures match you should be able to run it in a VM, sometimes with some configs (IIRC grub), it gets all confused, but I've had some luck. At the least you should be able to mount the filesystem and pull data off.
1974 [19:18:21] <sumi> i’ve messed up a cli on my raspberry. could you tell me the default perms (ls -ahl) on /etc/login.defs and /etc/init.d scripts?
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1976 [19:19:08] <r3> emu_rider: if you've imaged the drive onto an external drive, you certainly can put it back. I do that all the time to be sure I have a quick way to go back to a known config, or to start a new system with a known config.
1977 [19:20:11] <r3> emu_rider: you shouldn't have to mess with anything. The system won't even know what happened. It should go back just as it was imaged.
1978 [19:20:23] <emu_rider> r3: yea Ive been recently looking into this as another backup method, seems really convenient if something happends to my system
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1981 [19:21:36] <emu_rider> r3: Did you use any step-by-step guide when making the image?
1982 [19:21:44] <r3> it can be wasteful of space, as images are going to be the size of the drive, usually. You can gzip them down, but it's still a large chunk of data. If you're backing up data another way, that's usually preferable because you can just backup what has been changed since the last backup. An image takes everything.
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1984 [19:22:27] <r3> a quick google turns up: replaced-url
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1986 [19:23:09] <r3> can be adapted to use ddrescue, for its status messages and mapfile. The process is the same, the syntax differs.
1987 [19:24:03] <r3> !raspbian
1988 [19:24:04] <dpkg> Raspbian is a distribution <based on Debian> made specifically for the <Raspberry Pi>. Raspbian is not Debian and it is not supported in #debian. Please use #raspbian on irc.freenode.net for support. replaced-url
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1993 [19:27:16] <emu_rider> r3: hmm seems pretty straight forward, I'll give that a try. Excluding /home/ I only need to copy 4.6GB over to iso so space is no problem/
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2010 [19:36:08] <r3> heh, "only" 4.6GB
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2016 [19:37:39] <emu_rider> well...compared to windows10 install, 4.6GB is pretty good no? :P
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2026 [19:40:48] <r3> oh it's just the old-timer in me, remembering back to when 128MB was a LOT of data.
2027 [19:41:17] <miamiwolverine> .
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2030 [19:42:04] <r3> lol, my first hard drive was 10MB. It was sizeable. Felt like infinite space.
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2033 [19:42:45] <annadane> i suppose 1TB is standard for a hard drive these days still, but in future i wonder if it will become 2TB
2034 [19:42:48] <epergny> r3: 40MB here, you win
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2036 [19:43:36] <r3> epergny: lol, I remember I had it sitting on a cheap "TV Tray" next to the desk, and during a full seek, it would cause the tray to sway back and forth
2037 [19:43:45] <epergny> annadane: 1TB for HDD maybe but many SSD are 256 to 512 MB. I've got a 256 GB Samsung 950 Pro nvme / M.2 PCIe 3.0x4 SSD: speed daemon.
2038 [19:44:10] *** Quits: Ticho_ (~Ticho@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 264 seconds)
2039 [19:44:13] <epergny> annadane: well, speed daemon for reads. Got a serious issue with write speed which I haven't figured out : (
2040 [19:44:28] <r3> I'm sure you mean "many SSD are 256 to 512 GB" ... not MB
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2042 [19:44:46] <annadane> i thought SSDs were about the same size these days and not much more expensive
2043 [19:44:49] <epergny> r3: nice... My 40MB HDD was on an Amiga.
2044 [19:44:57] <epergny> r3: yup, /s/MB/GB/
2045 [19:45:04] <r3> I've some CF cards that are 256MB. Use 'em on old CP/M systems where you can have 16 partitions of 8MB each for a total of 128MB
2046 [19:45:29] <annadane> i wouldn't mind paying extra for the speed of an SSD
2047 [19:45:45] <r3> it is well worth it, annadane
2048 [19:45:51] <epergny> annadane: they very well be, you may be right actually. But since my mobo has an M.2 I bought an M.2 SSD: it bypasses the Sata 3.0 bus and uses PCI lanes directly.
2049 [19:46:09] <r3> that's the way to go, truly
2050 [19:46:40] <annadane> my problem is i don't know where to shop for hardware :P
2051 [19:46:45] <emu_rider> 128GB ssd here, was worried it wasnt enough. Turns out linux apps / software take less space, even GUIs are very lightweight
2052 [19:46:48] <epergny> annadane: M.2 SSD are so fast that when copying a huge, uncached (on the source computer) file from one computer to another, the gigabit ethernet switch becomes the bottleneck.
2053 [19:47:33] <epergny> r3: ah I *think* I remember the Commodore 128 could boot into some CP/M system of sorts but... I used mine in C64 mode all the time. Then Amiga. Then PC : )
2054 [19:48:04] <epergny> annadane: which country are you in?
2055 [19:48:12] <annadane> canadia
2056 [19:48:21] <epergny> annadane: oh you can certainly order online
2057 [19:48:32] <annadane> "online" is vague :P
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2060 [19:49:01] <epergny> annadane: when I was in California newegg was a thing. Now I'm in Europe and most tech vendors are selling on Amazon directly.
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2062 [19:49:18] <epergny> annadane: I think newegg is still big in the US. Don't know about Canada.
2063 [19:49:40] *** Joins: conta (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip )
2064 [19:49:53] <epergny> r3: and you on Linux since a long time? My first Linux was Slackware. And I think I'm using Debian since version 1.2.
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2066 [19:50:10] <epergny> r3: I clearly remember Emacs compilation taking 45 minutes.
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2069 [19:50:36] <annadane> yeah, newegg's website looks fairly navigable
2070 [19:50:37] <epergny> r3: quite a ride we went through us old timers : )
2071 [19:50:44] <annadane> my complaint is that a lot of hardware websites... aren't
2072 [19:51:16] *** WoC` is now known as WoC
2073 [19:51:17] <mmpmmmpmp> hey, in /etc/fstab (stretch) I don't need acl or user_xattr anymore. This is by default for ext4. Is this right?
2074 [19:51:46] <epergny> annadane: make sure to buy something that's compatible with your system. For example if it's a laptop, you probably need a regular SSD. If it's a desktop, it probably does not have a M.2 slot. So you either buy a regular SSD, or an M.2 one and a PCI card but that's getting a bit hacky : )
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2078 [19:53:49] <WoC> epergny, which Amiga model(s) did you have ?
2079 [19:54:30] *** Joins: finlstrm (~quassel@replaced-ip )
2080 [19:54:35] <epergny> WoC: good ol' Amiga 500... A a friend who had a 1000.
2081 [19:55:00] *** Joins: |x| (~cc@replaced-ip )
2082 [19:55:00] <epergny> WoC: I still have it and it *may* still work. My 40MB hdd may still work too, which is insane.
2083 [19:55:12] <WoC> nice, i had 500/1000/2000 ;) CDTV [;
2084 [19:55:18] <epergny> WoC: last I booted my C128 it was still working and the floppy disk I tried were still working ^ ^
2085 [19:55:24] <epergny> WoC: oh nice
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2087 [19:55:43] <WoC> and yes, 128 can boot CP/M
2088 [19:55:47] <epergny> WoC: these were the days ^ ^ Got another friend who's still totally into it.
2089 [19:55:57] <rant> I have a HP ThinClient t520 running Stretch, has a AMD G-Series SoC w/ Radeon R2E graphics, I have the amd firmware package installed. I have one of the display ports going to my TV via HDMI and that works fine, but I have a 17in TV and a 17in monitor and when hooking either of those to the VGA port it works most of the time but then begins flashing on and off (power light blinks) I can't figure out whats
2090 [19:56:03] <rant> wrong with it
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2092 [19:56:38] <rant> I see nothing in dmesg or xlog, so the system seems unaware.. currently the display is on but blank.. switching to/from console makes it come on momentairly then in goes black again
2093 [19:56:43] <WoC> epergny, Well, i totally miss it. Would love to do some 680x0 asm again :)
2094 [19:57:08] <epergny> WoC: that's how I started to learn programming ^ ^
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2096 [19:57:39] <WoC> epergny, same here, then machinecode and then ansi c
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2098 [19:57:56] <epergny> WoC: I kept my toys and computers from when I was a kid then teenager in boxes, stored in a garage. 2000 km from where I live basically ^ ^
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2100 [19:58:23] <WoC> i lost em all when i moved to the u.s.
2101 [19:59:20] <epergny> WoC: ansi C on PC? I learned x86 asm and started doing C when I got my first 386. That was before Windows 95.
2102 [19:59:23] <WoC> 20+ pc's, sun workstation, vax workstation, hp 9000/e45 server and more ;P
2103 [19:59:42] <epergny> WoC: but early on I discovered Linux and ran Linux as my desktop ever since. Was an act of faith in the beginning.
2104 [20:00:05] <WoC> i did some x86 asm, but lil-endian got to me
2105 [20:00:11] <epergny> WoC: WATH!? Which Sun workstation? I nearly bought a little Indigo a while ago.
2106 [20:00:17] <epergny> WoC: you sold all this?
2107 [20:01:26] <WoC> dumpster, somehow the shipping company would not give the address where to bring my stuff for shipping to the u.s. and for them to pick it up would make the price 500%
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2110 [20:01:50] <epergny> WoC: a friend of mine at this at home, when it came out, because his father was working for SGI: replaced-url
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2113 [20:02:04] <WoC> nice :)
2114 [20:02:08] <epergny> WoC: mind blown when I saw this and, well, Linux was a way for me to have my little Un*x system at home
2115 [20:02:38] <epergny> WoC: sucks! Pffft! : (
2116 [20:02:40] <WoC> the hp server had 3 raid systems (all raid 5)
2117 [20:03:04] <epergny> WoC: it was running Linux?
2118 [20:03:09] <WoC> fastest fileserver i ever seen
2119 [20:03:17] <WoC> hp/ux 10.20
2120 [20:03:21] <epergny> gotcha
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2125 [20:03:57] <WoC> the sun was on netbsd ;]
2126 [20:04:14] <epergny> WoC: and what do you run Debian on?
2127 [20:05:02] <WoC> fixing to put it on this crappy lap, i7 but with hybrid graphics (intel + nvidia)
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2129 [20:05:18] <WoC> only 8 Gb ram though (maxed)
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2134 [20:06:01] <WoC> still backing up my files :P
2135 [20:06:18] <epergny> WoC: I run Debian on my "workstation" (no sound, no fancy GPU: no gaming or anything) but it's just a high-end Core i7, then Debian on my laptop, Debian on my dedicated servers and Raspbian on my Raspberry Pi.
2136 [20:06:48] <epergny> WoC: ah ah... I'm in the process, like in that old xkcd, of going through all my old HDs and backing up everything.
2137 [20:06:53] *** Joins: Necrony (~Necrony@replaced-ip )
2138 [20:07:14] <WoC> But i did run debian many years ago ;)
2139 [20:07:25] <epergny> WoC: I'm putting everything into private IPFS nodes/servers because I'm a bit nuts. With IPFS I get file deduplication and integrity checks for free.
2140 [20:07:38] *** Quits: Worldexe (~Worldexe@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2141 [20:07:44] <WoC> k ;]
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2143 [20:08:20] <epergny> replaced-url
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2145 [20:08:47] <WoC> heh :)
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2149 [20:09:35] <epergny> backups, inside backups, inside backups. Worst offenders are pics and little movies taken by family with camera and smartphone which "I must not lose".
2150 [20:10:07] <WoC> Some time in the future, i will prolly get an old Power Mac G5 (big endian) and put linux on it and resume programming ;)
2151 [20:10:08] <epergny> trying to sort all this mess. "apt-get install fdupes" to the rescue by the way : )
2152 [20:10:21] *** Joins: Rogalian (~cools@replaced-ip )
2153 [20:10:36] <epergny> WoC: had to google it, nice case...
2154 [20:11:00] <WoC> Yup :) and it's a risc cpu ;)
2155 [20:11:29] <epergny> WoC: I remember the Archimedes.
2156 [20:11:31] <annadane> i have no more "old files" like the xkcd indicates and it makes me sad
2157 [20:11:35] *** Joins: GreatEmerald (~dainius@replaced-ip )
2158 [20:11:43] <WoC> :)
2159 [20:12:27] <epergny> WoC: yup, I remember correctly, it's RISC too: replaced-url
2160 [20:12:36] <GreatEmerald> I'm bootstrapping the x32 port, where should I get the kernel image?
2161 [20:12:39] *** Quits: sdoubleyou (~sdoubleyo@replaced-ip ) (Quit: sdoubleyou)
2162 [20:12:45] <GreatEmerald> It should be the amd64 kernel, I suppose
2163 [20:12:51] <epergny> annadane: still have all my emails since the nineties. I think I only miss 6 months at some point.
2164 [20:13:09] <GreatEmerald> So should I add the amd64 unstable repo?
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2166 [20:13:47] <r3> epergny: indeed, I remember a time before "Linux" proper. If I wanted a Unix I dialed into the VAX
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2168 [20:14:14] <WoC> epergny, if you want to look up something really nice; sharp x68000
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2171 [20:15:10] <annadane> my guess is you shouldn't need to enable the unstable repo
2172 [20:15:22] <epergny> WoC: japanese market only right? I think I remember these with weird arrows on the keyboard, gonna look it up
2173 [20:15:53] <WoC> Aye, sad. at that time it would have been great to have
2174 [20:16:00] <r3> what I would like to figure out is how to backup ~21 TB to optical medium, spanning several (many many) DVDs/BluRay - I'm sure there's a way to do it with tar but just am unsure how to proceed
2175 [20:16:52] <WoC> dang r3, external raid ?
2176 [20:17:00] <epergny> WoC: my most beloved piece of hardware, which I got shipped 2000 km, is my vintage arcade cab from the mid-80s. I've got some original PCBs and some bootleg PCBs.
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2178 [20:17:07] <epergny> WoC: a great many Z80 there ; )
2179 [20:17:11] <r3> WoC: yes, my little NAS here
2180 [20:18:05] <r3> maybe not, as it would take ~420 dual layer Bluray disks to do it I think - lol
2181 [20:18:06] <WoC> epergny, i heard there was a huge cluster of Z80s in the GB back in the day, almost supercomputer performance :P
2182 [20:18:13] <r3> so maybe not the whole thing, maybe one directory
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2187 [20:21:52] <annadane> but i know very little of bootstrapping so i can't really answer the question
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2190 [20:24:29] <GreatEmerald> Is there a package that would provide the amd64 repo?
2191 [20:25:04] *** Joins: CarlFK (~carl@replaced-ip )
2192 [20:25:21] <somiaj> what do you mean by that? There is no package that provides a repo.
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2194 [20:26:16] <CarlFK> debian minimal, with xorg and xfce installed - gui app is maxing out the cpu (all 4 cores) - friend says "sounds like opengl isn't working" how can I check for that ?
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2197 [20:28:02] <annadane> GreatEmerald, you're on i386 and are trying to bootstrap an amd64 environment...?
2198 [20:28:04] <somiaj> CarlFK: you could look at the output of 'glxinfo' in a xterm or xfce terminal, or check the xorglogs
2199 [20:29:14] <WoC> epergny, in your opinion; which would be faster of the debian installations; 32 bit with pae or 64 bit ?
2200 [20:29:26] <annadane> oh, bootstrapping the x32 port. yeah, as somiaj said, architecture specific packages don't have a repository
2201 [20:29:41] <annadane> i'm out of my depth here so i'll step to the side
2202 [20:29:48] <epergny> WoC: oh man no idea, isn't 32 bit + pae a thing of the past? I switched to amd64 a very long time ago and never looked back.
2203 [20:30:32] <GreatEmerald> Well, I need to get a kernel somehow
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2205 [20:30:43] <somiaj> GreatEmerald: use multiarch
2206 [20:30:46] <epergny> WoC: I think I remember running 32 bit + pae but... My old memory is failing me.
2207 [20:31:00] <CarlFK> somiaj: glxinfo|wc 392 lines. at the top I see "server glx version string 1.4" ... vendor SGI
2208 [20:31:07] <somiaj> annadane: it is just multiarch, if using i386, one can add the amd64 arch and have access to amd64 packages (which will run provided the cpu supports it)
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2210 [20:31:18] <WoC> epergny, k, i'll try it
2211 [20:31:27] <somiaj> CarlFK: sounds like you have glx enabled, read down to see if it is hardware or software, or check Xorg.0.log
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2213 [20:31:57] <CarlFK> how do I tell hardware/software?
2214 [20:32:12] <annadane> GreatEmerald, ^
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2216 [20:32:20] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: How do I do that
2217 [20:32:40] <somiaj> !multiarch
2218 [20:32:40] <dpkg> Multiarch allows you to install foreign architecture packages. For example, to allow i386 packages to be installed on an amd64 system: «dpkg --add-architecture i386 && apt-get update». See replaced-url
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2220 [20:33:29] <epergny> WoC: I probably installed Debian 9.4.0 from the "netinst" 4 times in the last 2 or 3 days : )
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2226 [20:37:32] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: It says "Skipping acquire of configured file 'main/binary-amd64/Packages' as repository debian-ports unstable InRelease' doesn't support architecture 'amd64'"
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2231 [20:40:29] <WoC> epergny, nice :)
2232 [20:40:57] <GreatEmerald> My /etc/apt/sources.list just has ftp.ports.debian.org/debian-ports
2233 [20:41:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1561
2234 [20:41:12] <GreatEmerald> I assume I need something more than that
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2238 [20:42:53] <somiaj> GreatEmerald: amd64 is offically debian. What arch do you have and why are you using ports?
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2240 [20:43:15] <somiaj> ports only contains unoffical ports, and there are no unoffical ports (that I know of) that are compadable with amd64.
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2242 [20:44:14] <annadane> if you dpkg --add-architecture foo (where foo is the name of the arch) you should be able to install packages with apt install foo:arch (where foo is the name of a package)
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2244 [20:44:27] <annadane> ie if you want the i386 version of krita, apt install krita:i386
2245 [20:44:31] <babilen> Question is: What is GreatEmerald trying to do?
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2249 [20:45:09] <somiaj> babilen: orignally I thought they had 32bit i386 and wanted to add amd64, but now I think they ahve some other arch.
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2253 [20:45:31] <mmpmmmpmp> hello, now I have tried everything. I have a windows 2016 DC and I have joined a debian stretch to the domain. I see all domain-users and domain-groups. But I cannot share a directory to the users. The users see the directory, but cannot access it.Can someone help me?
2254 [20:45:31] <mmpmmmpmp> This is what I did:
2255 [20:45:31] <mmpmmmpmp> smb.conf replaced-url
2256 [20:45:31] <mmpmmmpmp> nsswitch.conf replaced-url
2257 [20:45:31] <mmpmmmpmp> share replaced-url
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2262 [20:47:19] <mmpmmmpmp> hello, now I have tried everything. I have a windows 2016 DC and I have joined a debian stretch to the domain. I see all domain-users and domain-groups. But I cannot share a directory to the users. The users see the directory, but cannot access it.Can someone help me?
2263 [20:47:19] <mmpmmmpmp> This is what I did:
2264 [20:47:32] <annadane> mmpmmmpmp, we saw the question
2265 [20:47:40] <annadane> you ended with "what is wrong?"
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2267 [20:47:56] <mmpmmmpmp> okay, thanks, I was kicked out
2268 [20:48:05] <annadane> can happen if you paste too quickly, yeah
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2270 [20:48:13] <somiaj> I don't know how samba conntets to a windows AD. You may find a samba support channel more appropriate.
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2272 [20:48:51] <mmpmmmpmp> somiaj: I already tried, but no answer.
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2274 [20:49:17] <somiaj> I would be paitent, sometimes it takes a while for a response to happen. If users can see it but not access it, sounds like it is a permission issue.
2275 [20:49:22] <babilen> mmpmmmpmp: Did you idle for a while? The channel might not be as active as this one
2276 [20:50:24] <somiaj> but it sounds like a permissions issue, and you may have to idel here for a while to get someone who is familar enough with samba permissions to help out.
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2279 [20:50:36] <annadane> GreatEmerald, did you see what i said before about dpkg --add-architecture? it depends on what you're trying to do
2280 [20:50:38] <mmpmmmpmp> of course, but samba is also well common. So I that, it is not unlikely to get the answer here
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2282 [20:51:17] <mmpmmmpmp> *thought
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2284 [20:51:37] <somiaj> annadane: it sounds like GreatEmerald isn't on amd64 compadable hardware. They may need to be using qemu-static and not need to add amd64 to their sources.
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2286 [20:52:01] <annadane> ah
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2290 [20:54:29] <GreatEmerald> No no
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2292 [20:54:37] <GreatEmerald> I'm on an amd64
2293 [20:54:41] <GreatEmerald> hardware, that is
2294 [20:54:47] <somiaj> then why are you using debian ports in your sources.list
2295 [20:54:51] <GreatEmerald> I'm trying to set up x32
2296 [20:55:10] <GreatEmerald> Because it's a netbook that has 700 MiB RAM
2297 [20:55:37] <GreatEmerald> So I followed the instructions on the wiki to set up the chroot
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2299 [20:56:02] <somiaj> ahh, so what is your goal?
2300 [20:56:17] <GreatEmerald> Debian x32
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2302 [20:56:38] <GreatEmerald> Right now I want to install the kernel
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2304 [20:56:46] <GreatEmerald> And it's not in the ports repo
2305 [20:56:55] <GreatEmerald> Which makes sense, because the kernel is amd64
2306 [20:56:57] <somiaj> That isn't clear, yes you are on the unoffical port x32. If you want to use that port, why do you want an amd64 kernel?
2307 [20:57:08] <GreatEmerald> There is no "x32 kernel"
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2309 [20:57:16] <GreatEmerald> It's the amd64 kernel
2310 [20:57:39] <GreatEmerald> x32 is a CONFIG of the amd64 kernel
2311 [20:58:04] <somiaj> well if it has different compile time flags, you want the kernel from the x32 port I would assume (not the amd64 configured kernel)
2312 [20:58:33] <GreatEmerald> The standard amd64 kernel has x32 enabled
2313 [20:58:41] <somiaj> but I don't have any experience with this unffoical port, though I now see what it is. And I'm unsure why you don't just use the kernel provided by that port.
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2315 [20:59:02] <GreatEmerald> (or at least it should, you could check with zcat /proc/config.gz | grep X32)
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2317 [20:59:22] <GreatEmerald> That's the problem, there is no kernel provided by it
2318 [20:59:28] <somiaj> anyways deb.debian.org is the mirror for offical ports like amd64, and you'll have to edit your sources.list and tell it to only use certian arches, 'deb [arch=x32] foo', and 'deb [arch=amd64] foo' for the different repos.
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2323 [21:00:09] <somiaj> that surprises me, I would thikn they would provided a way to get a kernel, but again I don't know anything about this port, it might be worth ask support from someone who is familar with this.
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2326 [21:01:07] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: Is it necessary to add the "arch=" part? I'd assume the ports only have x32 and the official repos only have amd64
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2329 [21:01:32] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: Though I wonder how to make sure that by default the x32 apps are installed, not amd64
2330 [21:01:44] <somiaj> it is because the mirror doesn't have both repos available, so you have to tell apt to only look for a specifc one.
2331 [21:02:40] <somiaj> but to me it sounds like there should be a better way to get the kernel than multiarch. I would not follow my advise. I missunderstood you and thought you were on i386
2332 [21:03:08] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: I'll need multiarch anyway, some apps (e.g. Skype) have only am64 versions
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2340 [21:04:04] <ghormoon> hi, any hints for lightweight (not brining in whole glome or kde dependencies) photo viewer with scriptabe hotkeys (for tagging etc, so I can set my own commands with some placeholder for current file)
2341 [21:04:19] <somiaj> well I would still find actual docs or support for this, maybe someone else here uses this unoffical port. I don't want to give you advise that breaks your system, and unsure what the proper method of multiarch and/or getting a kernel on x32 is.
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2343 [21:04:31] <ghormoon> also, any file viewer (that does thumbnails) that doesn't need a ton of dependencies too?
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2348 [21:05:31] <somiaj> ghormoon: look around, debian provides lots of image viewers and file managers, pcmanfm or spacefm-gtk3 are some smaller file managers. I use feh as my image viewer, unsure about scriptable keybindings though.
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2351 [21:06:23] <annadane> i'm sure emacs can do it but then you have to actually learn emacs which isn't really practical for common advice
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2353 [21:06:43] <annadane> i'm trying to think of the image viewers i know that can do that and can't really think of anythng
2354 [21:07:22] <GreatEmerald> somiaj: Well, I don't have a system to break at the moment :D
2355 [21:07:42] <annadane> (side note: emacs, great for everything, but high learning curve)
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2362 [21:09:16] <GreatEmerald> Yea, if I add the amd64 main repo, I get two warnings: that it doesn't support x32, and that the x32 repo does not support amd64
2363 [21:09:21] <GreatEmerald> So that sounds reasonable
2364 [21:09:29] <bolt> What is it I need when shorewall says "ERROR: A non-empty SWITCH column requires Condition Match in your kernel and iptables"? What's Condition Match and how do I get it in Debian?
2365 [21:10:03] <somiaj> GreatEmerald: add those [arch=] lines I mentioned.
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2368 [21:10:33] <GreatEmerald> Yea, but those are just warnings
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2371 [21:11:29] <annadane> ghormoon, krita tends to be one of the most featureful image viewers (and i suppose GIMP), though it does pull in a few qt packages, and i don't know how good either krita or GIMP are at scriptable keys
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2373 [21:11:50] <somiaj> GreatEmerald: sure, but why not get rid of them, it will make things nicer in the long run.
2374 [21:12:11] <somiaj> annadane: I woudln't think of gimp as an image viewer.....
2375 [21:12:29] <somiaj> imagemagick's dispaly works too
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2380 [21:15:48] <ghormoon> annadane: I don't even need feature to edit, just tag/delete/move etc through whole folder fast enough (tagging by ln -s)
2381 [21:16:26] <annadane> yeah, don't know, sorry
2382 [21:16:53] <rabbitear_sdf> ranger?
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2384 [21:17:21] <ghormoon> spacefm looks good enough, now just to find the image viewer :)
2385 [21:17:42] <rabbitear_sdf> feh, qiv, lots
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2387 [21:19:06] <ghormoon> is any of those scriptable for hotkeys?
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2389 [21:19:22] <somiaj> try them out, they are all small programs
2390 [21:19:32] <annadane> if you apt show foo it'll have a package description
2391 [21:19:37] <annadane> which may indicate whether it does or not
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2393 [21:19:59] <ghormoon> I'm on data roaming :)
2394 [21:20:00] <somiaj> I like feh, it is a nice simple image viewer, that can do simple edits, and even show thumbnials of a directory
2395 [21:20:15] <somiaj> imagemagick's display probably has more features, because it has the full tools of imagemagick it could have behind it.
2396 [21:20:32] <annadane> it's called feh because of the snorts of derision one gets upon revealing one's allegiance to it: "feh!"
2397 [21:20:35] <somiaj> ghormoon: fromt he feh manpage, feh supports filelists, various image sorting modes, image captions, HTTP and more. Configurable keyboard and mouse shortcuts are used to control it.
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2400 [21:21:04] <GreatEmerald> Hah, even man-db is not installed by default, that sure is spartan
2401 [21:21:06] <ghormoon> google search gave me fim as scriptable
2402 [21:22:11] <rabbitear_sdf> never trust online google search :)
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2404 [21:22:33] <somiaj> not like we are that more trust worthy, all just random people on the internet giving advise.
2405 [21:22:52] <somiaj> though a bit less likely to get outdated info here.
2406 [21:23:42] <GreatEmerald> To get grub2 that can run off an UEFI, should I install grub2 or (and?) grub2-efi?
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2408 [21:23:44] <rabbitear_sdf> I thank the fin's for irc, because of the web
2409 [21:24:51] <somiaj> you want grub2-efi for efi boot (Grub2-pc is for legacy boot)
2410 [21:25:14] <annadane> but feh is certainly lightweight, yeah
2411 [21:25:23] <annadane> being cli based
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2419 [21:28:12] <GreatEmerald> Hm, and where does it install the .efi file?
2420 [21:29:06] <rabbitear_sdf> isn't there a /boot/EFI directory ?
2421 [21:29:13] <GreatEmerald> /boot/grub/x86_64-efi/grub.efi?
2422 [21:29:19] <rabbitear_sdf> actually that is a partition
2423 [21:29:25] <GreatEmerald> Yes there is, but it's not populated with anything
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2425 [21:29:45] <rabbitear_sdf> GreatEmerald: fdisk -l .... you MAY see an EFI partition
2426 [21:29:51] <GreatEmerald> I have it
2427 [21:30:11] <GreatEmerald> But installing grub-efi didn't put anything into ESP/EFI
2428 [21:30:27] <GreatEmerald> Well, maybe that's not a big issue
2429 [21:30:29] <rabbitear_sdf> why is it a "hard work" to install EFI anymore ?
2430 [21:30:54] <GreatEmerald> I need to use efibootmgr I suppose
2431 [21:30:54] <rabbitear_sdf> debian9 does everything for you
2432 [21:31:09] <GreatEmerald> Not if you use debootstrap, apparently :D
2433 [21:31:11] <rabbitear_sdf> GreatEmerald: check out reFINd
2434 [21:31:33] <rabbitear_sdf> replaced-url
2435 [21:31:41] <GreatEmerald> I know it, I like it (using it on the device I'm writing from), but that device already had GRUB, so I'm sticking with it
2436 [21:31:53] <rabbitear_sdf> k
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2441 [21:34:29] <ghormoon> feh seems to do the trick with --action0..9, good enough for me
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2443 [21:35:24] <webunicorn> pain, so much... computing pain
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2452 [21:40:45] <GreatEmerald> Huh
2453 [21:41:01] <GreatEmerald> When I try to boot, it says that it failed to execute /init
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2455 [21:42:38] <GreatEmerald> Ah, need to have syscall.x32=y
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2459 [21:43:30] <michael2> is this a bootable USB or harddisk?
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2465 [21:46:57] <GreatEmerald> Hm, how do I get r600 firmware loaded
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2488 [21:57:27] <GreatEmerald> Hum. Is any networking installed by default?
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2491 [21:57:45] <GreatEmerald> I think I need at least a dhcp client...
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2518 [22:16:36] <GreatEmerald> Woaah, can't install sddm
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2525 [22:21:00] <grobi> o/ hello, can somone give me advice please?
2526 [22:21:02] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1558
2527 [22:21:48] <GreatEmerald> Hm, I don't get it
2528 [22:21:58] <GreatEmerald> It says that there are unmet dependencies
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2530 [22:22:08] <GreatEmerald> And that a bunch of them are not going to be installed
2531 [22:22:15] <GreatEmerald> But they are all in the repos
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2535 [22:25:04] <grobi> after installing and configuring lightdm and mugshot suddenly i can't choose wallpapers in desktop-settings under debian 9.4
2536 [22:25:26] <GreatEmerald> Hm
2537 [22:25:48] <GreatEmerald> It says that libqt5core5a requires libicu57
2538 [22:25:55] <GreatEmerald> But I have libicu60
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2543 [22:30:34] <grobi> all my subfolders in desktopsettings are greyd out for normal or rootuser
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2548 [22:34:41] <WoC> live iso has no network tools ?
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2550 [22:34:52] <WoC> i.e. ifconfig ?
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2555 [22:36:17] <apollo13> WoC: ifconfig is deprecated since ages
2556 [22:36:20] <apollo13> WoC: use ip
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2560 [22:37:20] <GreatEmerald> Hrm, so what should I do about qt5core if it has a depends on the wrong libicu version
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2562 [22:38:01] <GreatEmerald> The repo has libicu60, so it's odd that Qt5 would be compiled against a non-existant libicu57
2563 [22:38:05] <WoC> apollo13, wouldn't know of a way to prevent ethX from being renamed ?
2564 [22:38:21] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: which repo? stable has replaced-url
2565 [22:38:30] <apollo13> WoC: plenty
2566 [22:38:32] <GreatEmerald> apollo13: x32 port
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2568 [22:38:51] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: ah nevermind then, get something produced in 2000
2569 [22:39:02] <apollo13> WoC: but did you check the docs?
2570 [22:39:09] <apollo13> WoC: then again, why does the renaming hurt?
2571 [22:39:25] <WoC> ip requires the name
2572 [22:39:27] <GreatEmerald> apollo13: x32 != i686 ;)
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2574 [22:39:45] <apollo13> WoC: so?
2575 [22:40:02] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: oh I read that as x86, wth is x32 :)
2576 [22:40:33] <GreatEmerald> apollo13: amd64 with 32-bit pointers
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2578 [22:40:48] <apollo13> oh, how does one get that?
2579 [22:40:53] <apollo13> and more importantly why
2580 [22:41:19] <GreatEmerald> Because this is a netbook with 700 MiB RAM
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2582 [22:41:25] <bites> it's not officially supported.
2583 [22:41:32] <GreatEmerald> Those pointers take up a lot of RAM
2584 [22:41:40] <apollo13> measured or are you just guessing?
2585 [22:41:42] <GreatEmerald> Yea, x32 is a port
2586 [22:41:45] <GreatEmerald> Measured
2587 [22:41:56] <apollo13> that said the time you are wasting in getting that to run would be cheaper if you'd just buy more memory
2588 [22:42:25] <GreatEmerald> Can't, that's soldered on the board
2589 [22:42:45] <GreatEmerald> Besides, it's fun to get x32 running
2590 [22:42:59] <GreatEmerald> I had a Gentoo x32 install on it for a long time
2591 [22:43:11] <GreatEmerald> But now long compilations don't work well any more
2592 [22:44:14] <GreatEmerald> Anyway, in this case Qt5 is clearly compiled against the wrong thing. Is there a transition to icu60 in progress?
2593 [22:44:21] <apollo13> well I rather waste my time elsewhere, but just speaking from a business point of view; 5 hours work into the notebook would allow me to buy a new netbook for 1k€…
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2595 [22:44:54] <GreatEmerald> Or should I report a bug about that
2596 [22:45:06] <grobi> replaced-url
2597 [22:45:10] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: certainly not in stable
2598 [22:45:17] <GreatEmerald> This is unstable
2599 [22:45:27] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: then yes replaced-url
2600 [22:45:42] <frazr> been listening to this for over an hour on repeat while programming: replaced-url
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2604 [22:46:53] <apollo13> GreatEmerald: but unstable has both icu57 and icu60; then again you are in the wrong channel for unstable
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2607 [22:48:07] <GreatEmerald> No libicu57 in the x32 port
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2609 [22:48:30] <apollo13> *shrug* have fun compiling then :þ
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2611 [22:48:53] <GreatEmerald> Hm, I cn do that?
2612 [22:49:07] <bites> there is a very thin x32 dev channel on freenode. #debian-x32
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2614 [22:49:09] <apollo13> one generally can, no idea if you can
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2618 [22:49:46] <GreatEmerald> Hm, that is quite thin
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2620 [22:50:44] <bites> guess the demand for x32 isn't that high ^^
2621 [22:50:50] <apollo13> thin as in number of users? what did you expect oO
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2624 [22:51:04] <apollo13> I mean the use cases are thin at best
2625 [22:51:06] <GreatEmerald> Well, I compiled a lot of things on x32 so far, so it shold be doable
2626 [22:51:44] <bites> if you are rebuilding packages they might appreciate your help.
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2628 [22:51:53] <GreatEmerald> But I'm not sure how one does that on Debian
2629 [22:52:06] <apollo13> time to read a few manuals I guess? :)
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2631 [22:53:46] <GreatEmerald> Well, now I just need libicu57
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2634 [22:54:14] <GreatEmerald> Probably not very useful for x32 right now
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2658 [23:08:08] <GreatEmerald> Hm, looks like it's working
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2661 [23:08:34] <GreatEmerald> debuild is proceeding with the build just fine
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2664 [23:10:09] <Trel> On the ISO which includes non-free firmware, where should the firmware files be? the /firmware directory?
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2667 [23:11:55] <bites> Trel: yep, in the form of .deb packages.
2668 [23:12:30] <Trel> I think the wrong iso was uploaded to the mirrors then. There IS a /firmware directory, but it's empty
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2670 [23:13:14] <bites> can you show me the url you downloaded it from?
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2673 [23:15:08] <Trel> bites: replaced-url
2674 [23:15:12] <Trel> the iso at the bottom
2675 [23:15:21] <bites> they are meant to be symlinks to ../pool/
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2677 [23:16:06] <Trel> Hmm, that exists I think I know what may have happened
2678 [23:16:26] <bites> do you really need the dvd image and not the netinst?
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2680 [23:16:41] <Trel> Always
2681 [23:16:44] <bites> presumably you download the firmware image to have network connection during install.
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2683 [23:16:56] <Trel> No, to have an offline installer
2684 [23:17:06] *** Quits: baptist (~baptsk@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2685 [23:17:11] <Trel> which the netinst obviously isn't
2686 [23:17:17] <Trel> nor would one without firmware ><
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2688 [23:17:39] <bites> it is, just very minimal :D
2689 [23:17:41] <Trel> I used Rufus to do the iso on a usb drive, I wonder if that broke the symlink
2690 [23:17:50] <bites> yeah, probably.
2691 [23:17:53] <Trel> I'll try it again in DD mode
2692 [23:17:54] <bites> !rufus
2693 [23:17:54] <dpkg> rufus is a tool that can be used to make bootable USB devices under Windows. It is not recommended for use with Debian CD/DVD images, as it mangles the installer in cruel and unusual ways, resulting in hard to debug problems. Ask me about <hybrid images>, <usb install>, <win32diskimager>.
2694 [23:18:14] <Trel> I think DD mode may alleviate that issue then
2695 [23:18:31] <bites> just cp the image to the drive. cp firmware.iso /dev/<whatever your drive>
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2697 [23:19:11] <Trel> You mean the target drive?
2698 [23:19:25] <Trel> or my installer? because if it can break other things I'd rather redoi t
2699 [23:19:28] <Trel> *redo it
2700 [23:19:32] <bites> yes, your usb drive or whatever you use to install.
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2703 [23:20:55] <tuxmartin_> Hi, how is possible to set variable in bash to file descriptor? This: ' a="hello world"; exec 5<(echo "$a") ' fail with error "/5/dev/fd/63: No such file or directory". This is what I need: replaced-url
2704 [23:21:21] <Trel> that would fix the firmware, but I'd imagine if it broke one symlink how I did it the first time, there's probably other things it broke, I'll try it in DD mode first to see if that fixes it, if not, I'll try one of the other options.
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2707 [23:22:04] <Trel> 90% sure DD mode will fix it though since I'm pretty sure that's how w32diskimager does it
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2719 [23:29:52] <Trel> (I'll report back with the results shortly)
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2723 [23:32:24] <jesopo> where do i go to report a package being severely out of date, most likely due to the project shifting from sourcefudge to github?
2724 [23:32:57] *** Quits: Murii_ (~vlad@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 240 seconds)
2725 [23:33:40] <Trel> bites: I can't say for sure it'll work to completion, but making the USB in DD mode fixed the firmware part ofit.
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2729 [23:35:08] <Neo4> :)
2730 [23:38:11] *** Joins: vidarr (~vidr@replaced-ip )
2731 [23:40:16] <annadane> jesopo, i believe you'd file a regular bug
2732 [23:40:31] <jesopo> cool :o
2733 [23:40:33] <jesopo> I will do so
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2740 [23:47:36] <tx0h> can anyone tell me, why debian didn't release a more recent mono version with .net 4.7x ?
2741 [23:47:37] *** Joins: r2rien_ (~me@replaced-ip )
2742 [23:48:08] *** Joins: wgas (~wgas@replaced-ip )
2743 [23:49:16] <annadane> well, as a general answer the software in debian stable is older due to stability reasons
2744 [23:50:50] <tx0h> annadane: and now the more specific answer? :-)
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2746 [23:51:07] <annadane> i don't know because i'm not familiar with the package
2747 [23:51:40] <tx0h> they have it on 'watch'
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2749 [23:52:27] <tx0h> the experimental and unstable releases didn't have no meanings anymore. i think, whole debian is stable these days
2750 [23:53:01] *** Joins: r3c4ll (~Ali@replaced-ip )
2751 [23:53:04] <Neo4> debian is used .deb files, might you can use ubuntu packages too
2752 [23:53:21] <annadane> no; bad idea
2753 [23:53:28] <annadane> that's a great way to break your system
2754 [23:53:30] <annadane> !don't break debian
2755 [23:53:31] <dpkg> hmm... dont break debian is replaced-url
2756 [23:53:51] <tx0h> Neo4: oh no! mixing destros leads to disasters
2757 [23:53:53] <Neo4> annadane: why? ubuntu is based on debian, they are both backward compatible
2758 [23:54:03] <annadane> anyway, i agree unstable can be fairly stable, not experimental, though - of course, you can't really install unstable packages into stable unless you know what you're doing
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2762 [23:54:08] <Neo4> tx0h: it's not mixing, kernel equal
2763 [23:54:09] *** Quits: jessica523 (~jessica52@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2764 [23:54:39] <Neo4> tx0h: what is difference? They both use the same package manager apt-get
2765 [23:54:43] *** Quits: r3c4ll (~Ali@replaced-ip ) (Client Quit)
2766 [23:54:51] <Neo4> the same .deb
2767 [23:55:31] *** Joins: MadHatter42 (~madhatter@replaced-ip )
2768 [23:56:16] <bites> because the packages are built against different dependencies. they are not compatible.
2769 [23:56:17] <tx0h> Neo4: believe me, bad idea. better to use alien then...
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2771 [23:56:54] <bites> worst thing if you include foreign sources and you pull a bunch of dependencies which is very hard to repair.
2772 [23:57:01] <Tenkawa> tx0h: whats he trying to do?
2773 [23:57:21] *** Quits: spithash (~spithash@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Leaving)
2774 [23:57:23] <Neo4> bites: include ubuntu repository to debian and use packages from there with dependencices
2775 [23:57:40] <bites> Neo4: yes, that's how you break your system.
2776 [23:57:42] <SlidingHorn> Neo4: please don't recommend things that will break people's system
2777 [23:57:43] <tx0h> he tries to tell me, that i should use deb packages from another distro
2778 [23:57:46] *** Quits: electro33 (uid613@replaced-ip ) (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity)
2779 [23:57:58] <Tenkawa> very bad idea
2780 [23:58:07] <Tenkawa> do not mix distribution sources
2781 [23:58:12] *** Quits: MadHatter42 (~madhatter@replaced-ip ) (Client Quit)
2782 [23:58:13] <Neo4> bites: why not expend instead of breaking?
2783 [23:58:40] <tx0h> you can, if you alien them to tgz and install in a separate path
2784 [23:58:49] <Tenkawa> the packages are built specificly for the distro they are archived on
2785 [23:58:54] <Neo4> Tenkawa: but how they to do ubuntu? They take debian and include there their repositories, little customize
2786 [23:59:01] <Tenkawa> no
2787 [23:59:06] <Tenkawa> they rebuild them
2788 [23:59:07] <bites> Neo4: because you can only have one version of a package. if you pull a different version of something, that other packages in debian need you get into a situation where apt can't resolve dependencies.
2789 [23:59:24] *** Quits: CrazyEddy (crazyed@replaced-ip ) (Remote host closed the connection)
2790 [23:59:36] <Neo4> Tenkawa: ok
2791 [23:59:48] *** Quits: Haxxa (~Harrison@replaced-ip ) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2792 [23:59:49] <tx0h> meee.. and to make it even worse, i need mono 5.10x on armhf
2793 [23:59:52] <Neo4> Tenkawa: I though there all more simpler
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