Realtime Nick Name Ticker of #debian at freenode (ICQ IRC service)

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7[00:01:49] <tryoo> jhutchins: CuteMeOwnThroat ok - thatnks for some nice ideas and inspirations! gotta go - cya later everyone!
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32[00:09:56] <idts> ,v lsof
33[00:09:57] <judd> Package: lsof on amd64 -- wheezy: 4.86+dfsg-1; jessie: 4.86+dfsg-1; stretch: 4.89+dfsg-0.1; sid: 4.89+dfsg-0.1
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53[00:22:44] <LostSoul> Hi
54[00:22:51] <LostSoul> I have problem
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56[00:22:59] <LostSoul> My mysql patition is full (100%)
57[00:23:09] <LostSoul> How can I get free space?
58[00:23:18] <LostSoul> Delete and optimize do not work
59[00:23:26] <LostSoul> Or at least seems they don't
60[00:24:02] <RoyK> LostSoul: usually by extending the partition or disk or installing more diskspace
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62[00:24:14] <RoyK> LostSoul: does mysql have a dedicated partition
63[00:24:16] <RoyK> ?
64[00:24:31] <RoyK> LostSoul: are you using partitions or LVM?
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66[00:24:47] <RoyK> if LVM, did you leave some free space in the VG when you setup the system?
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73[00:27:14] <idts> ,v libgl1
74[00:27:15] <judd> No package named 'libgl1' was found in amd64.
75[00:27:24] <idts> ,v libgl1-mesa
76[00:27:25] <judd> No package named 'libgl1-mesa' was found in amd64.
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78[00:27:48] <idts> ,v libgl1-mesa-glx
79[00:27:49] <judd> Package: libgl1-mesa-glx on amd64 -- wheezy: 8.0.5-4+deb7u2; wheezy-security: 8.0.5-4+deb7u2; jessie: 10.3.2-1+deb8u1; jessie-backports: 12.0.3-1~bpo8+1; stretch: 12.0.3-1; sid: 12.0.3-2
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81[00:29:14] <LostSoul> RoyK: Yes, it has dedicated partition
82[00:29:15] <fearnothing> I'm trying to figure out why a cron job didn't run
83[00:29:21] <fearnothing> where would logs for failed jobs go?
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85[00:29:35] <LostSoul> RoyK: Once mysql partiion is full - it's over, yeah?
86[00:29:48] <LostSoul> I'm no so close with mysql and I got task to fix it ..
87[00:29:59] <RoyK> LostSoul: first of all, don't use dedicated partitions - use LVM for such stuff
88[00:30:00] <zykotick9> idts: fyi, you can message judd like "/msg judd versions libgl1-mesa-glx" to find this information and NOT spam channel with it.
89[00:30:27] <RoyK> LostSoul: next - it's not game over, you just need to move the data to soemwhere with more space. is this ext4?
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91[00:30:41] <idts> just trying to get jelly-home attention
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94[00:31:20] <CuteMeOwnThroat> I have a thinkpad and I see the microphone in alsamixer -c 0, but not at all in pavucontrol (and I pacmd)… dmesg also shows sound hdaudioC0D0: Internal Mic=0x23 and input: HDA Intel PCH Mic as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1b.0/sound/card0/input12
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96[00:31:43] <RoyK> LostSoul: if it's ext4 and you haven't done so yet, tune2fs -m0 /dev/yourdisk will buy you time by releasing the reserved 5% of disk space
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100[00:32:15] <LostSoul> RoyK: Yeah, it's ext4
101[00:32:28] <RoyK> LostSoul: pastebin tune2fs -l /dev/whatever
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105[00:33:32] <LostSoul> RoyK: replaced-url
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107[00:34:01] <RoyK> LostSoul: Reserved block count: 878899 <-- run tune2fs -m0 on that dev
108[00:34:19] <LostSoul> Should I stop mysql? unmount it?
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110[00:34:33] <RoyK> it'll only release 3,4GB
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112[00:34:40] <RoyK> LostSoul: not needed for this
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114[00:35:01] <CuteMeOwnThroat> how would I find out why pulse isn't seeing it
115[00:35:13] <RoyK> 878899 4k blocks
116[00:35:34] <LostSoul> Ok, I have some free space RoyK
117[00:35:35] <LostSoul> What now?
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119[00:36:11] <RoyK> LostSoul: delete old stuff or upgrade storage
120[00:36:25] <RoyK> LostSoul: make sure to use lvm next time to make life easier
121[00:36:49] <RoyK> and don't allocate the whole disk at once if you're using lots of smaller filesystems
122[00:37:00] <RoyK> leave a good bunch unallocated in the volume group
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125[00:37:24] <RoyK> allocate when needed and just grow the filesystem, it doesn't require downtime
126[00:37:30] <CuteMeOwnThroat> oh, duh. it was something in ~/.config/pulse.
127[00:37:43] <LostSoul> Nice, I guess I need to still learn a lot :)
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129[00:37:55] <LostSoul> Thanks RoyK, you are my saviour - again :)
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131[00:38:00] <RoyK> :)
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133[00:38:17] <LostSoul> RoyK: delete + optimize table did the work :)
134[00:38:18] <RoyK> LostSoul: just do something about it now - it's only a few gigs and it *will* fill up
135[00:38:30] <RoyK> bbl
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137[00:38:55] <LostSoul> Tell me how to turn this 5% again?
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139[00:39:09] <LostSoul> I want to make sure I can do same trick in the future if my team don't make it
140[00:39:22] <LostSoul> I'm not best here but come on somebody screwed up and it was full :)
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142[00:40:28] <zykotick9> LostSoul: it only works once, after it's removed there isn't another "5%"... the command is "tune2fs -m0 /dev/yourdisk"
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151[00:45:16] <LostSoul> I want to add those reserved space again
152[00:45:22] <LostSoul> Is it possible?
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157[00:48:52] <zykotick9> oh... i don't know...
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168[00:55:29] <LostSoul> I see zykotick9, thanks
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175[00:57:45] <simbalion`> Hi, I've got an Epson-XP-320 printer and I installed the linux drivers but when I try to print PDFs, it seems to shrink the PDF so it only takes 1/6th of the total page. Does anyone know how to fix this?
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227[01:16:46] <idts> libegl1-mesa install fails with replaced-url
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237[01:18:33] <fiveflowerzz> Hi!
238[01:18:53] <fiveflowerzz> How to modify what is logged in the /var/log/apache2/access.log ?
239[01:19:00] <fiveflowerzz> i want to not log certain things
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243[01:19:39] <AlexLikeRock> sudo nano /var/log/apache2/access.log
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247[01:20:24] <fiveflowerzz> AlexLikeRock: no, I want that automatically my log doesn't log access to certain virtualhosts
248[01:20:34] <fiveflowerzz> i don't want to manually edit the logs
249[01:20:47] <AlexLikeRock> fiveflowerzz, :-)
250[01:20:47] <AlexLikeRock> at terminal
251[01:21:33] <fiveflowerzz> yes
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259[01:24:22] <LostSoul> fiveflowerzz: You mean you don't want to log certain things?
260[01:24:34] <LostSoul> Like access to robots.txt?
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282[01:33:59] <fiveflowerzz> LostSoul: exactly!
283[01:34:04] <fiveflowerzz> how to do this?
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498[01:44:29] <LostSoul> RoyK: Thank you man, you saved my a** again :)
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634[01:44:34] <LostSoul> fiveflowerzz: You need to set proper directives in apache config for this vhost
635[01:44:34] <LostSoul> I know how to do it in nginx, let me check for apache2
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638[01:44:45] <LostSoul> fiveflowerzz: DAmn this Apache is strange for me :P
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641[01:44:52] <LostSoul> But take a look at this: replaced-url
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680[01:47:23] <fiveflowerzz> LostSoul : which is this Apache logging config file ?
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682[01:47:28] <fiveflowerzz> in debian?
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688[01:48:08] <LostSoul> fiveflowerzz: Good question
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691[01:48:18] <LostSoul> As I said I'm not good if it comes to apache
692[01:48:31] <LostSoul> Maybe try #httpd
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694[01:48:51] <gry> or the /usr/share/doc/apache2/* documentation
695[01:49:09] <gry> which rater obnoxiously doesn't go to an adequate help viewer on fresh installs, unfortunately
696[01:49:30] <awal1> Why all applications windows, when launched, are centered in the screen (firefox, pcmanfm, hexchat, vlc, terminal emulators...) except chromium?
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698[01:49:50] <gry> because chromium is being smart
699[01:49:53] <gry> what desktop are you using
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701[01:50:03] <awal1> I'm running openbox wm but that issue is persistent when I run xfce or any other DE/WM
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704[01:51:00] <awal1> I configured my openbox & xfce for center new launched apps but chromium doesn't "respect" that
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767[02:02:43] <yann-kaelig> Hi. First I thought I made a mistake during the debian netinstall with Mate DE + debian desktop env. But after another installation with only Mate DE, I always get the same OS result. I have the libreoffice-suit + Gimp + firefox when Inever ask to install them
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770[02:04:01] <yann-kaelig> How can I block gimp, libreoffice suite, firefox to be installed during the installation process
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772[02:04:22] <p3nt4> !Carrie
773[02:04:26] <gry> just don't install desktop, and install it by hand later without using the metapackage
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781[02:06:10] <yann-kaelig> gry, yes, I totally forgot this possibility. thx :) That a litlle strange to install more software than user ask, but this hack is a idea
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783[02:06:32] <gry> blame whoever wrote the metapackage
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785[02:06:37] <gry> and good luck
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788[02:07:42] <awal1> yann-kaelig, when you choose X desktop environment , in you case mate, the installer will install task-desktop-mate. check the description for find what is exactly (aptitude show task-desktop-mate). it's a metapkg. if you dont want it, do a minimal install (no DE) then install mate stuff. aptitude search mate
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792[02:08:22] <awal1> task-mate-desktop ^
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795[02:08:56] <yann-kaelig> awal1, thx, good to know I will make some research about this metapkg.
796[02:09:20] <jpastore> hi, I have 23 drives in a chassis. All of the guides for creating a RAID array seem to be during the install process. Is there a recommend guide for config after the fact?
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817[02:17:16] <TomTomTosch> jpastore: the debian handbook has a chapter on setting up mdadm raid iirc. that's more of a practical guide.
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850[02:22:34] <Cyb3rw0rM> replaced-url
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869[02:27:33] <jpastore> TomTomTosch: thanks!
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912[02:44:02] <ldumont> Hey guys, quick question, I'm trying to dual boot Windows 10 and Debian. I'm using two disk, one MBR with Windows on it and the other, a GPT (4TB) that is just holding files.
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914[02:44:39] <ldumont> I created a partition on the 4TB disk and I'm trying to install Debian on it.
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917[02:45:03] <ldumont> The install itself goes fine and I create one / partition and the swap and tell the installer to install Grub on the first disk.
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920[02:46:09] <ldumont> But when I reboot, I get straight into a grub rescue
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1033[03:56:20] <debian92> If I am using repository debian testing without codename, it's alright?
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1036[03:57:05] <debian92> I mean like this: deb replaced-url
1037[03:57:17] <RoyK> !sns
1038[03:57:17] <dpkg> Shiny New Shit Syndrome is a serious disorder, which usually breaks out into an epidemic every time something new is released. If you have SNS, ask me about <backports> and <ssb>; these are better options than upgrading to <testing> because it is a <moving target>.
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1042[03:59:25] <awal1> debian92, if you use "testing" you will always track testing branch; if you use the codename , say s"stretch", when stretch is released as stable you will so be tracking stable
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1047[04:01:02] <debian92> awal1, thank you for explain :)
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1050[04:02:37] <awal1> debian92: you have a better explanation here replaced-url
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1057[04:05:45] <debian92> awal1, I got it ;)
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1102[04:22:50] <seyfi> hello, I am new here, just testing
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1106[04:23:47] <dvs> flame him!!!!!
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1108[04:25:28] <idts> am having a problem with this libegl1-mesa fails install - any known issues during upgrade from dist-upgrade
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1111[04:28:50] <somiaj> Is there a nice way from a script to move a file from foo to foo-bakX where X is the first number not used or would I need to write a loop for this.
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1126[04:38:28] <Dewi> what sorts of problems might I expect running a wheezy kernel in jessie? I can't get the jessie ones to boot as guests in this xen environment, possibly to due to something like xz compression
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1137[04:44:36] <PryMar56> Dewi, did you build Xen yourself? if so, you paste me your config/Tools.mk ?
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1139[04:45:27] <Dewi> PryMar56: it's not my host
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1142[04:46:38] <PryMar56> Dewi, the Jessie kernels were 3.18* ?
1143[04:47:29] <PryMar56> Dewi, if so, might try a kernel from jessie-backports
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1145[04:48:12] <Dewi> I couldn't boot current (linux-image-3.16.0-4-686-pae_3.16.36-1+deb8u2_i386.deb), original (linux-image-3.2.0-4-686-pae_3.2.82-1_i386.deb), or the 3.16 wheezy backport (linux-image-3.16.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae_3.16.36-1+deb8u2~bpo70+1_i386.deb)
1146[04:48:45] <Dewi> oops, that 3.2 one is the latest wheezy one and it works
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1150[04:49:19] <Dewi> PryMar56: I suppose, any reason xen would like them more?
1151[04:49:24] <PryMar56> Dewi, ok, I meant 3.16
1152[04:49:43] <PryMar56> Dewi, no solid reason, but there is the option
1153[04:50:05] <Dewi> is a 3.2 wheezy one likely to be a problem at all?
1154[04:50:14] <Dewi> this host doesn't do a huge range of things
1155[04:50:42] <Dewi> er, guest host :P
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1165[05:04:49] <idts> what type of problems uncovered by --audit can be resolved with apt
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1170[05:07:31] <idts> ah yes only apt-policy can do that, but what other solutions are there
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1172[05:08:23] <idts> my systemd is kind of faster now i dont know why...
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1175[05:09:54] <idts> lol, anyhow that explains why most of all always push for new install which is pointless
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1181[05:12:09] <idts> am looking for a sugestion on how to have some libs installed - hey anyone alive here yet
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1278[06:12:51] <missmbob> sometimes i was there was a debian bounty program.
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1280[06:13:17] <missmbob> "please fix this shit for crowdsourced x dollars"
1281[06:13:34] <missmbob> wish*
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1283[06:14:19] <sm00th> or a job doing that for some american company in my own country.
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1293[06:17:19] <sm00th> replaced-url
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1295[06:17:29] <sm00th> woops omg this is the wrong channel
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1363[07:11:49] <ambience> Hello, I have an AMD r7 graphics card and an amd apu, would this driver work on Debian?
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1365[07:12:03] <ambience> replaced-url
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1369[07:12:44] <missmbob> ambience: dont install drivers from their website. that's an easy way to break your system
1370[07:12:53] <missmbob> pastebin lspci -vv
1371[07:13:19] <missmbob> lspci -nn *i meant*
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1373[07:14:58] <ambience> replaced-url
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1378[07:16:07] <ambience> missmbob, replaced-url
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1380[07:16:23] <missmbob> ,pciid 1002:6613
1381[07:16:24] <judd> [1002:6613] is 'Oland PRO [Radeon R7 240/340]' from 'Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD/ATI]' with kernel module 'snd-hda-intel' in jessie. See also replaced-url
1382[07:16:42] <missmbob> huh
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1384[07:17:07] <missmbob> i'm guessing you'll be fine with firmware-amd-graphics
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1386[07:17:51] <ambience> missmbob, Please explain
1387[07:18:02] <missmbob> dpkg non-free
1388[07:18:02] <dpkg> [non-free] a component which contains software that does not comply with the <DFSG>. To add non-free packages to your packages index, ask me about <non-free sources>. To see which non-free packages are installed ask me about <non-free list>. For the non-free tracking system, see replaced-url
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1392[07:18:17] <missmbob> install that package from non-free and see what happens
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1395[07:18:51] <ambience> I have the AMD ati radeon graphics driver installed via the debian documentation, however, the graphics card is still not being utilized
1396[07:19:08] <missmbob> did you install the package i just named?
1397[07:19:12] <ambience> For instance, I use Blender, and the only option I have in preferences is to use the CPU
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1399[07:19:34] <ambience> Whereas in Windows, I have the choice to select my CPU or graphics card for rendering
1400[07:19:38] <missmbob> so it is working and is being utilized. you just dont have hardware accel that you want
1401[07:19:58] <missmbob> did you install said package?
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1404[07:20:40] <ambience> missmbob, I did this replaced-url
1405[07:21:16] <ambience> I have an APU, but I think there may be drivers to get my graphics card involved in the mix as well
1406[07:21:41] <missmbob> so no
1407[07:22:03] <missmbob> the firmware package i said is needed for your hard to fully work
1408[07:22:12] <ambience> missmbob, Okay, can you point me to the drivers I need to install?
1409[07:22:17] <missmbob> * Radeon R5/R7 IGP 200 series UVD microcode (radeon/kaveri_uvd.bin)
1410[07:22:23] <missmbob> i did
1411[07:22:37] <missmbob> 05:17 < missmbob> i'm guessing you'll be fine with firmware-amd-graphics
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1415[07:23:04] <missmbob> ,v firmware-amd-graphics
1416[07:23:05] <judd> Package: firmware-amd-graphics on amd64 -- jessie-backports/non-free: 20160824-1~bpo8+1; sid/non-free: 20160824-1; stretch/non-free: 20160824-1
1417[07:23:43] <missmbob> !backports
1418[07:23:44] <dpkg> A backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and <ABI> complications. replaced-url
1419[07:23:52] <missmbob> follow that to get it from jessie-backports. then reboot
1420[07:24:16] <missmbob> you might as well get linux-image-amd64 from jessie-backports as well while you're at it. might help
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1426[07:25:54] <ambience> missmbob, I already have the non-free repository enabled and I received notification that firmware-amd-graphics cannot be founnd
1427[07:26:04] <ambience> I tried twice
1428[07:26:21] <missmbob> ambience: because it's in jessie-backports, as i said. that's why i had the bot tell you about backports
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1430[07:26:39] <missmbob> replaced-url
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1432[07:27:01] <ambience> missmbob, Will this break my system, you think?
1433[07:27:06] <missmbob> no
1434[07:27:40] <ambience> missmbob, Okay, thanks. I will give this a try. It sucks bananas that AMD free drivers are substandard
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1442[07:36:07] <ambience> missmbob, I enabled backports but still says it cannot find firmware-amd-graphics....I also ran update as well
1443[07:36:35] <missmbob> ambience: paste.debian.net your sources.list
1444[07:37:52] <ambience> missmbob, replaced-url
1445[07:38:20] <missmbob> ambience: btw, i said paste.debian.net for a reason. a lot of people cant visit pastebin.com because of their javascript/adblock crap
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1447[07:38:45] <ambience> missmbob, Okay, hold on a sec
1448[07:38:48] <missmbob> ambience: you only have main on backports. add contrib non-free to the same line (#8)
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1450[07:39:56] <ambience> missmbob, Ahh, thanks
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1452[07:40:46] <ambience> missmbob, Anything else I shoudl do or do you suppose a reboot is enough
1453[07:40:47] <ambience> ?
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1455[07:40:57] <missmbob> you installed the new kernel, too, right?
1456[07:41:01] <ambience> Indeed
1457[07:41:33] <missmbob> so reboot and see how it goes. i've never in my life used amd or nvidia, so i'm just shooting from the hip. i only touch intel for a reason.
1458[07:42:33] <ambience> missmbob, I avoid intel for another reason. AMD is a pain inthe bum, but hopefully they will get their excrement together. Thanks for your help and patience
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1500[08:05:43] <oldbob> missmbob, Hey, you helped earlier with amd graphics
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1504[08:06:58] <oldbob> missmbob, My GUI is gone, I cannot get X, nor can I update
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1507[08:07:43] <oldbob> missmbob, |Unable to fetch archives"
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1509[08:08:16] <oldbob> "could not resolve ftp.debian.org"
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1511[08:08:52] <missmbob> oldbob: no way would installing firmware-amd-graphics from jessie-backports break your internet. something else happened
1512[08:09:02] <missmbob> oldbob: boot into the old kernel
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1518[08:10:54] <missmbob> you could always remove both packages and reboot. that'll get you back to where you were
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1523[08:12:22] <oldbob> missmbob, Yeah, I have no GUI under the old kernel
1524[08:12:38] <oldbob> bwahaha, welcome to Linux. screw amd
1525[08:13:01] <missmbob> even after removing the firmware you installed?
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1528[08:14:08] <oldbob> missmbob, Before I uninstall, under the newer kernel, I saw that there are 300 packages to be updated, but it cannot get those packages
1529[08:14:23] <Elronnd> s.n
1530[08:14:33] <oldbob> missmbob, It also said there is a bunch of firmware to bring in too
1531[08:14:58] <oldbob> But cannot resolve that debian.org addy
1532[08:15:03] <missmbob> you had 8.6 installed. i dont see how there could be 300+ packages to update
1533[08:15:27] <missmbob> pastebin your sources.list again
1534[08:15:34] <oldbob> missmbob, Because there is proprietary crap involved I guess. I piece of dung leads to another
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1536[08:15:56] <missmbob> and then pastebin apt-get dist-upgrade
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1539[08:16:19] <oldbob> missmbob, I cannot paste bin anything, I need to type it out
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1541[08:16:46] <missmbob> sounds like instead of backports you went crazy with stretch or sid
1542[08:16:55] <oldbob> deb replaced-url
1543[08:17:12] <oldbob> deb replaced-url
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1545[08:18:08] <oldbob> That's the one it complains about
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1548[08:18:33] <missmbob> i cant say anything about it if you don't pastebin the command + output
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1554[08:19:39] <oldbob> missmbob, Under the old kernel, there is no complaint. Everything is cool, the new one...well
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1556[08:20:08] <oldbob> but get no gui in the old either, so go figure
1557[08:20:38] <missmbob> again, without you pasting commands + outputs no one can help you
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1559[08:20:51] <missmbob> so good luck.
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1563[08:23:22] <oldbob> missmbob, Kinda hard without a screen or even a command line to look at now...jeez\
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1566[08:23:55] <oldbob> If I was r2d2 I could stick my
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1569[08:25:58] <oldbob> So amd drivers on Linux is a no-go
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1575[08:28:19] <oldbob> Maybe the day shift can help. People who actually have similar hardware setups. It may be ill advised to accept guidance from someone who does not have the same setup
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1759[09:48:27] <r4co0n> Hi. I am using Debian testing with gnome and want to report a bug - Upon entering my login password, which end with a capital letter, I don't release the shift key before hitting Enter twice (because I'm nervous ;) ), a context menu pops up, "Show password" is preselected and my password is revealed to anyone who happens to stand nearby. Which package should I report this against?
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1763[09:49:43] <r4co0n> This is happening on two machines that run testing, one was installed 2 weeks ago, so it's not some configuration cruft that won't happen on new install.
1764[09:50:49] <bhuddah> !debian-next
1765[09:50:49] <dpkg> #debian-next is the channel for testing/unstable support on the OFTC network (irc.oftc.net), *not* on Freenode. If you get "Cannot join #debian-next (Channel is invite only)." it means you did not read it's on irc.oftc.net.
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1768[09:51:42] <r4co0n> bhuddah, this is a question about what package to report the bug against. Just imagine it was in stable, the question is still valid.
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1775[09:52:52] <r4co0n> But hey, I can report it against gdm3 and let the maintainers figure out where to forward this to.
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1781[09:54:24] <r4co0n> I consider it rather rude to send someone to another IRC network, when the question can be answered with a single word.
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1795[09:59:33] <r4co0n> btw, currently "All connections in use" on oftc
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1808[10:05:47] <jelly-home> r4co0n: a better assumption would be noone knows the answer, instead of assuming they're gratuitously rude
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1816[10:08:27] <jelly-home> (apparently, not that many people here use gnome, for some reason)
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1819[10:08:46] <r4co0n> jelly-home, then silence is golden, isn't it? I got the impression that what I wrote was not read/understood, if this was not the case, I apologize.
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1821[10:09:24] <babilen> r4co0n: If you can reproduce that error on jessie this would be the correct channel. Bugs in testing and unstable are best discussed in #debian-next on irc.oftc.net
1822[10:09:27] <r4co0n> I try to get an answer on debian-next, maybe even ask on the -users mailing list and then report the bug.
1823[10:09:28] <jelly-home> I don't think silence is better than pointing you to the right channel for testing, no
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1827[10:10:44] <r4co0n> jelly-home, I meant better than saying you do not know. I don't want to argue over this, you are most certainly right and I need to finish my first coffee.
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1829[10:11:59] <jelly-home> we ought to get people knowledgeable about stretch in here as well, at some point before the release
1830[10:12:09] <r4co0n> babilen, I will try to reproduce it now, will take me some time, I have no stable install (to play around with) at hand.
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1836[10:13:51] <jelly-home> back in windows 95-2000 or so it used to be Ctrl-Enter popped up a context menu, not Shift-Enter. But nowadays there's a Menu key, and sometimes design choices of Gnome look unfathomable
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1839[10:15:06] <r4co0n> jelly-home, I don't know why I still use gnome. Maybe I'm addicted to eye-candy, I used to use i3 on my laptop and it may also be the better choice for my stationary pc.
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1874[10:32:46] <r4co0n> I stumbled upon strange behaviour in debian installer expert mode. After selecting a mirror, it first asks about using non-free, then about using contrib. If I answer the non-free question, but hit "Go back" on the contrib question and re-answer the non-free question, the contrib question is assumed to have been answered "Yes". Is this desired behaviour?
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1876[10:33:12] <r4co0n> The contrib question is not asked again.
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1878[10:34:05] <r4co0n> I don't know if "main non-free" as opposed to "main contrib non-free" makes any sense.
1879[10:34:38] <babilen> r4co0n: You can use main non-free
1880[10:35:06] <babilen> I wouldn't know *why*, but people might argue "Free or not free, but none of that inbetween shite!"
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1882[10:35:32] <r4co0n> babilen, then I will have to report a bug against debian-installer, it seems. I will first confirm my observations.
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1886[10:36:05] <babilen> Sure
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1888[10:36:23] <babilen> I take it that this is the last version of the installer you are testing?
1889[10:37:10] <r4co0n> It's a month old, I had it lying around, I will retest with the latest version.
1890[10:38:18] <babilen> I'd be surprised if that behaviour changed, but fair enough
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1893[10:41:17] <TomyWork> so, debian pretty much uniquely defaults to runlevel 2. other distributions have no network in runlevel 2. What do I write into my init.d script's LSB tags for a service that requires network?
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1907[10:45:50] <themill> TomyWork: "# Required-Start: $network" should do it
1908[10:46:10] <TomyWork> themill what would be the effect of that on a distro that has no network in runlevel 2?
1909[10:46:50] <themill> init scripts don't tend to be particularly portable
1910[10:47:04] <r4co0n> TomyWork, maybe replaced-url
1911[10:47:20] <themill> but if you didn't want it to be run in runlevel 2, you'd not add it to rc2.d
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1913[10:47:55] <TomyWork> themill but insserv/chkconfig do that for me
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1916[10:48:32] <themill> who actually uses insserv?
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1918[10:48:49] <TomyWork> or update-rc.d
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1920[10:48:56] <themill> (but then violates the rest of the expectations)
1921[10:49:11] <TomyWork> "update-rc.d defaults myservice" or something
1922[10:49:18] <r4co0n> TomyWork, see the last paragraph of the answer in my link, it talks about update-rc.d
1923[10:49:25] <TomyWork> or the other way round, i can never remember
1924[10:49:32] <themill> So the question is who is using update-rc.d?
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1928[10:50:30] <TomyWork> themill you mean you're not aware of any package that does?
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1931[10:51:26] <TomyWork> $ grep update-rc.d /var/lib/dpkg/info/* | wc -l
1932[10:51:26] <TomyWork> 217
1933[10:51:28] <TomyWork> pick one
1934[10:51:33] <themill> No, I'm not aware of any distribution that does.
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1938[10:51:54] <TomyWork> 41 hits for insserv
1939[10:52:06] <TomyWork> and 6 for chkconfig, oddly enough :D
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1942[10:53:01] <TomyWork> well technically this is ubuntu, lemme find a debian
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1944[10:53:30] <r4co0n> Hi, I'm back to confirm that gdm3 in debian stable is revealing the password upon holding Shift and hitting enter twice.
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1946[10:54:05] <TomyWork> themill 175/42/1 hits on debian wheezy
1947[10:54:41] <themill> TomyWork: what is in debian is irrelevant for this. You're asking about how to write cross-distro init scripts for a distro that uses update-rc.d and doesn't have network for runlevel 2.
1948[10:54:57] <TomyWork> themill no i'm not
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1950[10:55:10] <TomyWork> LSB tags are a standard
1951[10:55:16] <themill> Hardly
1952[10:55:19] <TomyWork> there is more than one tool that interprets them
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1955[10:55:55] <themill> Maybe you need to ask some distro that actually does that then. #debian doesn't exactly have much experience with this situation.
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1959[10:56:32] <TomyWork> replaced-url
1960[10:56:34] <themill> (and as I said, init scripts are a long way from portable)
1961[10:56:46] <r4co0n> According to popcon, almost 22% of the users are using gdm3 - It was the default desktop environment not so long ago.
1962[10:57:04] <TomyWork> themill well i asked here since debian was the odd one out, so i figured you'd know what to do
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1964[10:57:35] <TomyWork> the question is: how do i make this script, which works perfectly fine on suse and redhat, work on debian
1965[10:57:36] <themill> TomyWork: from this perspective, redhat is the odd one out ;)
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1968[10:58:24] <TomyWork> replaced-url
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1970[10:58:41] <r4co0n> What severity would you recommend for this bug? I consider using "grave".
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1972[10:58:58] <TomyWork> r4co0n is it remotely exploitable? :)
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1977[11:00:22] <bolt> with a pair of binoculars?
1978[11:00:55] <TomyWork> and dr farnsworth's finger extender?
1979[11:01:09] <r4co0n> A stuck shift key is enough to reveal your password.
1980[11:01:12] <TomyWork> professor*
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1982[11:01:30] <TomyWork> r4co0n oh, that is bad
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1984[11:02:10] <TomyWork> but still, not remote. i'm not familiar with debian's severity scale, but it could technically be worse :)
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1986[11:03:10] <r4co0n> I will need to read into the severity scale too, I thought someone with greater insight might let me jump over this.
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1988[11:03:38] <jelly-home> r4co0n: something like important
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1990[11:04:33] <r4co0n> jelly-home, important is also blocking release of this into the next stable, isn't it?
1991[11:04:38] <jelly-home> nope
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1994[11:05:36] <jelly-home> but it does not affect a lot of people. You could spin it as an accessibility issue, too
1995[11:05:42] <r4co0n> My gut tells me this should not get into stable like this, but I need to find a better argument for this.
1996[11:06:11] <r4co0n> I would really like this to be release-blocking.
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1998[11:06:43] <themill> It's probably an accessibility feature. It's not actually revealing your password -- you have to type it in first but not hit enter, right?
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2000[11:06:59] <themill> Sounds like the "show password" box that's on a stack of forms these days
2001[11:07:04] <r4co0n> you have to type it in, hold shift key while hitting enter two times.
2002[11:07:19] <r4co0n> as opposed to releasing the shift key before hitting enter.
2003[11:07:36] <jelly-home> if pressing shift-enter twice does it, and your last password character is uppercase...
2004[11:07:41] <r4co0n> Which is likely to happen if your last character happens to be uppercase
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2008[11:07:53] <themill> I'm struggling to see how that's any more of a bug in Debian than the user leaving their password on a post-it note on the monitor is
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2011[11:07:55] <jelly-home> or if you use sticky keys features
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2013[11:08:09] <jelly-home> themill: it's a UX fail if anything
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2015[11:08:41] <jelly-home> postit on monitor is not augmented by gnome's shift-enter behavior
2016[11:08:44] <r4co0n> themill, it is not worse than the post-it, but a security-conscious user might get bitten by it.
2017[11:09:03] <r4co0n> e.g., one that never uses post-its for passwords.
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2020[11:09:25] <r4co0n> I revealed my password to a coworker already by accident
2021[11:09:30] <jelly-home> r4co0n: I bet you could have better luck making upstream change it, they seem to care about user interfaces and ease of use
2022[11:09:32] <themill> fun
2023[11:09:50] <r4co0n> replaced-url
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2026[11:10:14] <r4co0n> they closed it 10 monts ago, but the description did not include the keyboard-only way to get this bug
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2028[11:10:32] <r4co0n> *months*
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2032[11:10:49] <jelly-home> r4co0n: sadly, as you can see, Fedora is not upstream and they auto-close bugs
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2034[11:11:41] <TomyWork> r4co0n you could switch to lightdm or something for the time being :)
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2036[11:11:56] <jelly-home> TomyWork: that probably won't change the default DM in debian
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2039[11:12:11] <TomyWork> true, but it will solve *his* problem
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2041[11:12:30] <r4co0n> I can also try to just release shift early enough.
2042[11:12:51] <TomyWork> or patch it yourself
2043[11:13:06] <TomyWork> doesnt sound too hard, from the outside. you know C?
2044[11:13:08] <r4co0n> or install a proper DE ;P
2045[11:13:16] <TomyWork> yes, that
2046[11:13:32] <TomyWork> KDE is nice these days
2047[11:13:55] <r4co0n> I think that's really the final nail to gnome's coffin for me, other people were running away years ago.
2048[11:14:27] <r4co0n> But I should still try to get it fixed for other people, gnome will be around for a while, I suppose.
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2051[11:16:01] <hpardis> gnome4lyfe
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2064[11:20:34] <grateful> is there a good tutorial for setting up a kvm type portal from my windows connection to my debian server?
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2071[11:25:11] <r4co0n> If I report this bug upstream, is it fair enough to just assume this is also happening with gnome's latest upstream release? Or do I need to first confirm with the latest upstream source?
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2083[11:28:50] <jelly-home> r4co0n: /topic #gnome
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2087[11:29:32] <jelly-home> will probably tell you which is the current upstream version
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2093[11:31:12] <ilSt> Hi all
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2116[11:40:48] <peetaur2> Howdy. How do I list packages that aren't in repos...the ones where apt-cache policy says "/var/lib/dpkg/status" and no repo names? replaced-url
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2118[11:40:59] <peetaur2> or...how do I remove all of those?
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2120[11:41:05] <themill> !not available
2121[11:41:05] <dpkg> To get a list of packages you have installed now, that are not available from any repository in your sources.list: aptitude search '?narrow(?not(?archive("^[^n][^o].*$")),?version(CURRENT))'
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2123[11:41:16] <peetaur2> themill: thanks
2124[11:41:22] <themill> actually, those are just
2125[11:41:25] <themill> !obsolete
2126[11:41:25] <dpkg> If you remove a repository from your sources.list (e.g. removing <dmm>), then you should check what packages you have installed from the other repository. Synaptic and aptitude have a "Obsolete and Locally Created Packages" list. Or, "aptitude search ~o". Note this doesn't include packages that exist in the repo at a different version to the one you have installed; see <not available> <list repositories>.
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2155[11:50:48] <peetaur2> yay it boots now :)
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2158[11:51:10] <r4co0n> For anyone interested, upstream bug is at replaced-url
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2223[12:26:51] <AndChat93396> Can debian play x265 videos? I can't open in totem or vlc
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2244[12:32:12] <heibol> AndChat93396: You can, you've to install the plugin libde265
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2252[12:36:44] <AndChat93396> Apt-get failed to find package
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2256[12:37:12] <markc> hi, is there any way to get dpkg-reconfigure to acknowlege altered debconf settings so I can script re-setting a fresh install?
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2270[12:42:32] <r4co0n> markc, debconf-get-selections and debconf-set-selections in package debconf-utils might do what you want, check it out.
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2274[12:44:26] <r4co0n> markc, see replaced-url
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2313[12:56:33] <neglesaks> Any knowledge of why I have to do a manural package list refrash in the package manager before any updates can be seen in package updatere? (deb 8)
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2315[12:57:40] <r4co0n> neglesaks, what program are you using exactly?
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2325[13:00:21] <neglesaks> the standard gpk-application
2326[13:00:21] <r4co0n> neglesaks, are you using the default desktop environment?
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2329[13:00:35] <neglesaks> yes. GNome. GPK-application
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2331[13:01:03] <r4co0n> gnome is not default anymore. I think you mean GTK application
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2348[13:05:59] <neglesaks> gpk-application is what it says on my processlist, together with gpk-package-viewer
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2357[13:08:21] <r4co0n> neglesaks, sorry, so it was just what I *wrongly* thought. I can confirm that this is also for me just working sometimes, though I don't have this problem on a newly installed system.
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2360[13:09:34] <neglesaks> OK, thanks.
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2364[13:11:07] <neglesaks> WHile I'm at it, is it normal for the description in the package updater app to give a "404" message that is saying that the The developer logs will be shown as no description is available for this update: Changelog for linux-libc-dev etc etc etc is not (yet) available (404 Not Found [IP: etc... )
2365[13:11:13] <neglesaks> >
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2373[13:12:02] <neglesaks> I've had this problem for years across several D-releases, and have neither been able to find a solution to it, nor anyone even acknowledging that it exissts
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2375[13:13:56] <r4co0n> neglesaks, you mean the little info box at the bottom? It is showing the normal package description for me for linux-libc-dev
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2377[13:14:24] <neglesaks> it was an example. it pertains to pretty much any package
2378[13:14:35] <r4co0n> neglesaks, maybe you should check if those problems also exist with a newly created user?
2379[13:14:48] <r4co0n> neglesaks, your example was not reproducible here.
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2382[13:15:23] <r4co0n> neglesaks, was it supposed to be non-reproducible?
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2384[13:16:17] <neglesaks> no. I've had the problem recurrently across any debian box on any given hardware on any given site. its perquecy varies though, but is persistent on security updates, less so on regular package updates
2385[13:16:24] <jmcnaught> neglesaks: "apt-get changelog linux-libc-dev" is a 404 for me too. It's not that unusual, sometimes there isn't a changelog. For your other problem, you want the apt package indexes to be updated automatically?
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2389[13:17:37] <neglesaks> im looking at the stadark pckage app which only givs limited choices for updates, clearly in ana ttempty at simplicity. turning to synaptic..
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2391[13:18:21] <r4co0n> neglesaks, good choice imo
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2396[13:19:08] <r4co0n> neglesaks, or just use command line tools (apt or aptitude). I like my updates to be relying on as little as possible.
2397[13:19:20] <neglesaks> good poijnt
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2401[13:21:24] <r4co0n> neglesaks, for automated updates/upgrades, look at unattended-upgrades, you can configure this just for security and volatile (or what it is called today) updates, for example.
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2403[13:21:48] <neglesaks> I'm thinking it is an issue of the respository simply not being updated often enough. The repo list in synapic obviously sallows for changes, but the repos now have to be manually entered instead of selected from a list as per th eolder versions. any list of recommended repos for a given region?
2404[13:22:01] <neglesaks> thank you r4co0n.
2405[13:22:40] <r4co0n> neglesaks, if what you think is correct, unattended-upgrades or simply a cronjob running "apt update" should fix it for you.
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2407[13:23:13] <rootkea> Hello! whenever I try to open any .ps file with Evince, Evince crashes with "invalidaccess -7 Segmentation fault" spitting on terminal.
2408[13:23:27] <rootkea> Evince version 3.14.1
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2410[13:23:47] <rootkea> BTW I'm using Debian Jessie if that matters.
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2418[13:27:16] <r4co0n> rootkea, I just used firefox/iceweasel to export to PostScript and was able to open the file with Evince (Document Viewer).
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2423[13:28:28] <rootkea> r4co0n: Is your version 3.14.1?
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2425[13:28:56] <r4co0n> rootkea, I just checked with 3.14.1, there I get exactly the behaviour you describe. Sorry for confustion
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2427[13:29:17] <r4co0n> rootkea, it is fixed in 3.22.0 (testing)
2428[13:29:38] <r4co0n> *confusion*
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2431[13:30:04] <rootkea> r4co0n: For stability reasons I prefer the stable branch.
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2435[13:31:12] <r4co0n> rootkea, in almost all cases this is the best decision, however, I would then end up having to rebuild lots of software myself as my projects sometimes depend on new versions.
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2437[13:31:48] <r4co0n> rootkea, docker is a good example.
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2442[13:32:32] <rootkea> That's fine. Anyways so upstream has fixed that bug in 3.22.0 (according to you) then what about the current stable Evince 3.14.1?
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2445[13:33:40] <rootkea> How long it takes to have the stable package from testing?
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2452[13:35:09] <r4co0n> rootkea, new versions generally do not enter the current stable release, bug fixes would rather be backported. I recommend filing a bug on evince in stable for that.
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2454[13:35:45] <rootkea> r4co0n: Okay. Thanks.
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2457[13:36:26] <WebHostingFree> let control panel administrator linux (developers)
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2460[13:37:42] <r4co0n> I think "not working" might not qualify for a fix being backported to stable, rootkea - Maybe someone else can confirm?
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2490[13:48:45] <folivora_> Hi, I need to block connections from the subnet where my server is. Is there simple way to tell iptables that all other connections are allowed inbound except connections which are coming from the same subnet where ie. eth0 has address
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2499[13:52:34] <jelly-home> folivora: regardless of the actual address? Probably not, you can just block new connections with required source, seems simple enough
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2501[13:54:10] <bezaban> ,v mtr
2502[13:54:11] <judd> Package: mtr on amd64 -- wheezy: 0.82-3; jessie: 0.85-3; jessie-backports: 0.86-1~bpo8+1; stretch: 0.86-1+b1; sid: 0.86-1+b1
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2504[13:54:50] <jelly-home> bezaban: you can also /msg judd v mtr
2505[13:55:06] <bezaban> jelly-home: yeah, thanks
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2508[13:56:30] <__raven__> i want to upgrade a laptop with a ssd for configuration msata-ssd=system sata-hdd=data. unfortunately bios is not able to recognize the msata but later ubuntu is able to find it. how to configure an ubuntu install to for example have the bootloader on the hdd and the system on the ssd though?
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2511[13:58:01] <cruncher> folivora, as jelly-home said, you cant, but you could use a (ba)sh script to set up iptables where you take the actual address/subnet into a variable then set the connections accordingly
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2514[13:59:47] <bezaban> I always forget if it''s judd or dpkg
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2518[14:00:50] <_shaun_> hi guys my system cant detect my wireless headset
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2522[14:02:00] <_shaun_> the blueman-applet cant find the device when i scan it, hcitool scan also shows nothing
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2557[14:15:31] <Eryn_1983_FL> hey peeps
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2559[14:15:46] <Eryn_1983_FL> my init for samba is broken, i cant get it to kill processes or start processes,
2560[14:15:53] <Eryn_1983_FL> its messed up :
2561[14:15:55] <Eryn_1983_FL> (
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2570[14:19:39] <Mibka> I installed proxmox (which is debian under the hood) on a PCI-e NVMe SSD but my bios doesn't support booting from it. I have a SD card which I want to use for booting so after install I used a rescue cd, mounted the SSD's root partition and mounted dev,sys and proc too. Then chrooted to this dir and used grub-install /dev/sda (SD card). It reported no errors but when I reboot grub says "error: disk 'lvmid/1POEYZ-RTV2.....' not found.' 'Entering resque mode...'
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2574[14:20:35] <bolt> !tell Mibka about based on debian
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2589[14:28:38] <jelly-home> Mibka: 1) ask in ##proxmox 2) verify your root= kernel parameter is correct, maybe you forgot to run update-grub
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2591[14:28:41] <folivora> cruncher: so if my subnet is 192.168.10.0/24 , I will deny all new inbound connections from that subnet?
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2596[14:29:46] <cruncher> folivora, if you want to do that...
2597[14:29:54] <overlord> hi, does any1 know if there is still a way to work with isa cards on modern debian? pnputils seems to have been removed after squeeze
2598[14:30:47] <Mibka> jelly-home: I'll ask in ##proxmox then. Thanks anyway.
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2600[14:31:25] <cruncher> Mibka, just a hint for the way... did you mount /boot on the sdcard?
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2605[14:33:48] <Mibka> cruncher: no I did not. All I did was mount the SSD's partition, mounted sys,dev,proc to it and chrooted to that directory. then created a single partition on the SD card, formatted it with mkfs.ext4 /dev/sda1 and grub-install /dev/sda
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2610[14:35:50] <markc> ‎r4co0n: woops, I was busy elsewhere, I've been using debconf-set-selections in every combination I can think of and it just doesn't work when using dpkg-reconfigure... unless I am missing something
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2630[14:45:49] <Mibka> cruncher: should the /boot partition be on the SD card then?
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2828[15:58:15] <cruncher> Mibka, sorry, was away
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2830[15:58:53] <cruncher> yes, basically just mount /boot on the sd card, grub install /dev/sda (or whatever your sdcard is), update-grub
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2833[15:59:26] <cruncher> and edit the /boot entry in fstab accordingly to the new partition
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2932[16:38:24] <jhutchins> .
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2958[16:49:05] <dark_anonymous> hi
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2960[16:50:24] <andyreplaced-url
2961[16:50:26] <andyreplaced-url
2962[16:51:09] <dark_anonymous> i am new here
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2967[16:52:11] <greycat> ssh will use password authentication if the key authentication attempt fails
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2969[16:52:24] <nkuttler> if password auth is allowed
2970[16:52:25] <greycat> at least, in the default configuration (either upstream or debian's), it does this.
2971[16:52:30] <nkuttler> andyreplaced-url
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2976[16:52:52] <andyreplaced-url
2977[16:52:54] <nkuttler> andyreplaced-url
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2979[16:53:02] <andyreplaced-url
2980[16:53:04] <andyreplaced-url
2981[16:53:06] <andyreplaced-url
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2984[16:53:26] <greycat> You don't have permission to *see* the sshd_config?
2985[16:53:38] <andyreplaced-url
2986[16:53:45] <nkuttler> andyreplaced-url
2987[16:54:03] <andyreplaced-url
2988[16:54:03] <andyreplaced-url
2989[16:54:07] <andyreplaced-url
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2993[16:54:39] <dark_anonymous> what is the best ddos attack for unbuntu? is my question legal?
2994[16:54:44] <nkuttler> andyreplaced-url
2995[16:55:12] <nkuttler> dark_anonymous: if you limit yourself to ubuntu the first d becomes difficult..
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2997[16:55:48] <dark_anonymous> what is the solution?
2998[16:55:55] *** Quits: rsarson (~rsarson@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
2999[16:55:56] <greycat> Unlcear whether ubuntu is the target, or the source.
3000[16:55:58] <serverlord> kali linux for pen testing for admins
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3002[16:56:22] <serverlord> also the first d in ddos means distributed
3003[16:56:26] <greycat> In any case, why are you asking US and not #ubuntu?
3004[16:56:34] <bolt> the "best" ddos attack all depends on the sort of target you're trying to take down
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3006[16:56:51] <dark_anonymous> HMMMM
3007[16:56:55] <nkuttler> if he's asking how to ddos an ubuntu box he needs to learn what ddos is..
3008[16:57:02] <serverlord> with enough brute force you can take down anything - see the last attacks with iot crap devices
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3011[16:57:29] <nkuttler> either way, not on-topic for #debian
3012[16:57:30] <bolt> if he wanted to use pure traffic to do it, i don't think he'd be asking
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3015[16:57:50] <bolt> since he's asking, i assume he wants to take advantage of some service or other that wastes cpu cycles
3016[16:57:53] <bolt> ..or similar
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3019[16:58:35] <dark_anonymous> thanks guys Q_O
3020[16:58:45] <dark_anonymous> Q_^
3021[16:58:56] * bolt needs a new emoticon dictionary
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3173[18:03:05] <mkwia> E: Unable to locate package php7.0-fpm /n E: Couldn't find any package by regex 'php7.0-fpm'
3174[18:03:11] <mkwia> ^what's going on?
3175[18:03:41] <greycat> mkwia: if you're not in jessie (stable), go to the OFTC network, channel #debian-next
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3177[18:04:10] <mkwia> greycat, I am Debian 8.6 jessie
3178[18:04:22] *** Quits: marcozink2 (~marcozink@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3179[18:04:30] <greycat> There is no php 7 in jessie. Yay! Problem solved.
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3181[18:04:43] <mkwia> what, really?
3182[18:04:48] <ksk> php7 is kind of recent actually.
3183[18:05:05] <greycat> And even in unstable I think the package is named "php-fpm" not "php7.0" or "php7" anything.
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3187[18:05:32] <mkwia> i tried php-fpm, php7-fpm and php7.0-fpm
3188[18:05:33] <greycat> Why would this be a surprise? Jessie froze November 2014.
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3190[18:05:55] <mkwia> how do you mean?
3191[18:06:02] <greycat> !jessie freeze
3192[18:06:02] <dpkg> Remember, remember, the fifth of November, gunpowder treason and plot! Debian 8.0 "Jessie" was frozen on 2014-11-05; no new versions of packages will enter this release and a period of intense bug fixing has begun. See replaced-url
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3195[18:06:27] <mkwia> so, what should I do now?
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3197[18:06:39] <greycat> Stop trying to use php 7. Or stop using jessie.
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3200[18:07:04] <mkwia> will arch have php7?
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3204[18:07:18] <ksk> ask arch ;) probably..
3205[18:07:40] <greycat> The testing version of Debian should have it, in theory. Unless it got pulled due to bugs or whatever.
3206[18:07:59] <debian92> mkwia, I think arch had been release it
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3211[18:08:46] <mkwia> this is sad, i want debian, and i need php7
3212[18:09:41] <musca> run it in a chroot
3213[18:10:09] <greycat> Run testing, or run testing from a VM or chroot, or install php 7 from UPSTREAM sources, not packages, and manage it as a third party product.
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3217[18:10:46] <cluelessperson> Hey guys, how can you set the debug level for DPKG using the /etc/dpkg/dpkg.cnf ?
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3219[18:10:53] <cluelessperson> I can't seem to find any documentation on it
3220[18:11:01] <greycat> cluelessperson: Didn't we debunk this crap yesterday? THERE IS NO VERBOSE OPTION.
3221[18:11:06] <greycat> Did you see one? No. There isn't one.
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3223[18:11:18] <debian92> did you try apt-get install php7.0
3224[18:11:22] <debian92> mkwia
3225[18:11:24] <greycat> debian92: it does not exist in stable.
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3228[18:12:02] <cluelessperson> greycat, strace seems to take down the test server, and keeps running even after the command finished
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3230[18:12:18] <greycat> replaced-url
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3234[18:12:52] <greycat> cluelessperson: this does not change the fact that dpkg has no "extra verbose" option. Unless you see one in man dpkg that I don't see.
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3236[18:12:56] <debian92> greycat: Yup, I read in packages debian. Only debian testing php7.0 available
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3242[18:13:50] <mkwia> why was this freeze done?
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3246[18:14:06] <greycat> That's how Debian WORKS.
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3249[18:14:38] <greycat> When preparing for a release, there is a freeze (no new stuff), a period of testing and bug fixing, a purge of everything that didn't get fixed, and then the release.
3250[18:15:00] <mkwia> so no php7 on jessie ever?
3251[18:15:04] <greycat> Correct.
3252[18:15:06] <greycat> !stable
3253[18:15:06] <dpkg> [stable] The status of a Debian release when no packages will be added, new versions introduced and changes will only fix security issues and critical bugs. Packages can be removed in rare circumstances. The current stable version of Debian is Jessie (8.6); ask me about <releases>. Security bugs are fixed in stable by backporting the fix to the stable version (ask me about <security backports>). replaced-url
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3255[18:15:33] <ctb> TIME TO FORK (kidding!)
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3257[18:15:53] <mkwia> so when will there be php7 on debian? version 9?
3258[18:16:12] <greycat> Yes. When stretch (Debian 9) releases, it'll have a newer version of PHP.
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3260[18:16:20] <greycat> ,v php-fpm
3261[18:16:21] <judd> Package: php-fpm on amd64 -- sid: 1:7.0+45; stretch: 1:7.0+45
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3263[18:16:28] <greycat> Right now it has 7.0
3264[18:16:38] <mkwia> and when is that happening?
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3266[18:16:45] <greycat> !stretch
3267[18:16:45] <dpkg> The release following Debian 8 "Jessie" is codenamed "Stretch" (the rubber octopus in Toy Story 3) and will be Debian 9: replaced-url
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3271[18:17:42] <jelly> mkwia: possibly 2017
3272[18:17:56] <ctb> mkwia: why php7? just curious.
3273[18:17:57] <cluelessperson> greycat, dpkg -dH
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3276[18:18:01] <jelly> !stretch freeze
3277[18:18:01] <dpkg> Stretch will start to freeze in early 2017; no new versions of packages will enter the release as this is a period of intense bug fixing. See replaced-url
3278[18:18:14] <cluelessperson> greycat, It describes running dpkg with debug levels.
3279[18:18:14] <jelly> INTENSE bug fixing
3280[18:18:18] <mkwia> ctb ??
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3282[18:18:31] <mkwia> literally ??
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3284[18:18:50] <greycat> cluelessperson: OK, fine, then you can put one of those in the dpkg.cfg file.
3285[18:19:05] <cluelessperson> probably "debug value"
3286[18:19:25] <greycat> Why guess? Do what the man page says.
3287[18:19:26] <ctb> mkwia: literally. I don't run anything php so I don't have any context.
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3289[18:20:19] <mkwia> ctb, its a coalesce operator, only added in 7.0
3290[18:20:33] <greycat> dpkg.cfg(5) -- "Each line contains a sin- gle option which is exactly the same as a normal command line option for dpkg except for the leading hyphens which are not used here."
3291[18:20:37] <mkwia> i mean, I can use 5, but it will be a bit of a pain
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3301[18:22:59] * greycat spanks whoever wrote the dpkg man page and did not include the string "verbo" anywhere, not even once.
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3303[18:24:08] <greycat> my fault for not following up with a search for "debug" I suppose...
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3353[18:40:43] <intothemountains> I installed the linux-libre package - which provides a kernel with no unfree blobs - and I'd like for /vmlinuz to point to that kernel. I could manually change the hardlink but then I'd have to do it every time I update the kernel. Could this be the ideal candidate for update-alternatives? Is there any such proposal?
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3357[18:41:38] <tremon> intothemountains: there is no linux-libre package in debian. Where is it from?
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3361[18:42:19] <tremon> (also, the linux kernel in debian also doesn't carry anything non-free)
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3365[18:43:10] <intothemountains> replaced-url
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3367[18:43:27] <ambient> Hello, anyone here use AMD hardware? I want to install graphics drivers for my GPU. I have an AMD APU and a GPU and would like to get the GPU to work rather than just the CPU for programs such Blender as when rendering
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3371[18:43:58] <jelly> intothemountains: debian separated the firmware from the kernel a long time ago
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3373[18:44:38] <intothemountains> tremon, jelly: oh, okay, so there is absolutely nothing non-free in the kernel Debian ships?
3374[18:44:51] <tremon> however, debian doesn't do blobless activation of gpu's. That's something that seems worthwhile for debian too imho
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3376[18:45:12] <jelly> intothemountains: nothing, as defined by DFSG
3377[18:45:20] <tremon> intothemountains: all non-free firmware packages are available through debian's non-free repository, but not installed by default
3378[18:45:20] <jelly> !dfsg
3379[18:45:20] <dpkg> DFSG is the Debian Free Software Guidelines, which are explained at replaced-url
3380[18:45:39] <intothemountains> tremon: are those blobs not non-free?
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3382[18:45:56] <jelly> that repo is not enabled by default, and it's not considered part of debian
3383[18:45:59] <tremon> which blobs?
3384[18:46:21] <intothemountains> the ones used to activate the gpus
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3394[18:47:20] <tremon> fafaik there isn't a single gpu out there that works without its own microcode, and no vendor offers that microcode in source form. They're free to redistribute, but they're effectively opaque binaries
3395[18:47:41] <tremon> so yes, gpu blobs are typically non-free
3396[18:47:41] <jelly> intothemountains: let's put it another way -- if you can find any non-free blob in, say, debian 8 amd64 linux-image-3.16.0-4-amd64, you can file a bug report
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3399[18:48:03] <ambient> How about proprietary drivers via Debian to activate the GPU, or even better, corssfirce for the CPU and GPU
3400[18:48:23] <jelly> tremon: older intel gpus do not require firmware load at boot time. Latest do.
3401[18:48:28] <ambient> if you have money, like 10K +, I do believe there are open drivers, but these are high end
3402[18:48:42] <ambient> I just have consumer level
3403[18:48:43] <tremon> sure, should have said "a single current gpu"
3404[18:48:44] <intothemountains> jelly: if those blobs aren't shipped in the linux-image packages, where are they shipped?
3405[18:48:58] <jelly> intothemountains: they are not shipped by default
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3408[18:49:15] <intothemountains> oh, i see
3409[18:49:29] <intothemountains> good then :)
3410[18:49:40] <tremon> intothemountains: as for your original question, the symlinks like /vmlinuz are created by update-grub script (or possibly another bootloader)
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3414[18:50:21] <tremon> as long as the 3rd-party kernel conforms to debian's naming convention for kernels, it will get detected and an entry for it created in the boot menu
3415[18:50:22] <jelly> intothemountains: incidentally, any leftover /vmlinuz symlink can be removed -- grub works just fine without that
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3417[18:50:53] <jelly> intothemountains: if you installed a kernel manually, use update-grub to refresh the boot menu
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3421[18:51:23] <jelly> debian's kernel packages do that automatically
3422[18:51:26] <intothemountains> jelly: I know, but I boot a fully encrypted disk (including /boot) using libreboot, so the grub config is stored on chip, and loading a new one every time I update my kernel seems too much, so I just use /vmlinuz
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3424[18:52:39] <jelly> intothemountains: a very unusual setup. I don't think changing the defaults to suit your situation would make sense.
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3426[18:53:02] <jelly> intothemountains: create a kernel-pkg trigger to update your grub config
3427[18:53:03] <tremon> as an fyi, kernel firmware is shipped in multiple separate packages: replaced-url
3428[18:53:32] <intothemountains> jelly: fair enough, update-alternatives just seemed a nice way to select the default kernel
3429[18:53:43] <jelly> it's not
3430[18:53:50] <intothemountains> why?
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3432[18:54:12] <jelly> because kernel package do not ship a single shared path, and they don't have to
3433[18:54:19] <jelly> packages*
3434[18:54:29] <tremon> (and search for just "firmware" to also see more separate firmware packages, some usually shipped with the kernel and some with drivers/tools)
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3436[18:54:57] <jelly> intothemountains: do something like grub does in /etc/kernel/postinst.d
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3443[18:56:02] <jelly> that seems to be the right infrastructure for doing any udpates to the boot process at kernel installation time
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3445[18:56:16] <intothemountains> jelly: well, now that i know Debian doesn't run anything non-free on my laptop, I have no use for the package anymore :)
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3447[18:56:37] <jelly> you will still update kernels every now and then
3448[18:56:41] <intothemountains> thank you all for all the clarifications :)
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3453[18:57:05] <intothemountains> jelly: well, yes, but I'll comfortably use the /vmlinuz link that's already updated for me
3454[18:57:09] <jelly> intothemountains: definitions of "non-free" differ slightly between Debian and FSF.
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3457[18:57:36] <intothemountains> jelly: how is Debian's non-free narrower?
3458[18:57:52] <tremon> intothemountains: note that while debian doesn't ship anything non-free by default, it also doesn't ship any blob replacements in free. If I'm reading the linux-libre page correctly, they do include some alternative firmware to at least boot the machine
3459[18:58:00] <jelly> intothemountains: I do not know whether it is.
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3461[18:58:35] <jelly> tremon: eh, if they have libreboot compatible hardware, it's probably not very fresh
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3463[18:58:43] <tremon> true
3464[19:00:23] <intothemountains> yeah, I didn't have to include anything from non-free
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3466[19:01:01] <intothemountains> In 50 years I see myself still using hardware from the year 2000 :_(
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3468[19:01:46] <jelly> that will mean they made excellent hardware in 2000
3469[19:02:02] <tremon> no need for that, my next desktop will probably be a cubox or something similar
3470[19:02:18] <intothemountains> i need a laptop though
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3472[19:02:27] <jelly> my 1986 commodore system died around 2000
3473[19:02:29] <tremon> sucks to be you :)
3474[19:02:35] <intothemountains> haha, cheers
3475[19:02:55] <intothemountains> tbh i'm perfectly happy with it for anything but gaming
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3480[19:03:41] <NapoleonWils0n> hi all
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3482[19:04:10] <NapoleonWils0n> im trying to use xkbcomp from ~/.xsession to remap some keys
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3484[19:04:29] <jelly> intothemountains: or something like replaced-url
3485[19:04:30] <NapoleonWils0n> but its not working, also tried using ~/.xinitrc as well
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3487[19:04:47] <NapoleonWils0n> if i run the command in the terminal it works perfectly
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3492[19:06:48] <tremon> NapoleonWils0n: can you paste the .xsession script?
3493[19:06:51] <greycat> NapoleonWils0n: if you log into a DE, the DE probably has its own key mapping that overrides what you did in ~/.xwhatever
3494[19:07:05] <intothemountains> jelly: yeah, I've been keeping an eye on that for quite a while
3495[19:07:07] <NapoleonWils0n> im using i3wm
3496[19:07:07] <greycat> NapoleonWils0n: what WM or DE do you run, and how are you logging in/starting X?
3497[19:07:22] <intothemountains> There are many interesting projects, I only hope the succeed
3498[19:07:27] <NapoleonWils0n> startx and ~/.xsession
3499[19:07:38] <sm00th> I hope the trisquel project don't die
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3502[19:08:00] <sm00th> cleanest distro i ever used
3503[19:08:03] <NapoleonWils0n> had same error running gnome desktop, so i wiped drive and didnt install a DE
3504[19:08:09] <sm00th> when I say that I mean noise free.
3505[19:08:10] <NapoleonWils0n> just i3
3506[19:08:16] <sm00th> every log clean.
3507[19:08:28] <sm00th> especially network
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3523[19:11:42] <awal1> NapoleonWilson, if using startx, use ~/.xinitrc, not ~/.xsession
3524[19:12:18] <NapoleonWils0n> tried that didnt work either xkbcomp isnt working
3525[19:12:45] <NapoleonWils0n> starting to think its a bug with something in stable
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3528[19:13:15] <ambient> Hello, anyone here use AMD hardware? I want to install graphics drivers for my GPU. I have an AMD APU and a GPU and would like to get the GPU to work rather than just the CPU for programs such as Blender when rendering
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3535[19:15:19] <tremon> ambient: the default kernel driver and glx packages are sufficient, as long as you have installed the firmware-linux-nonfree (jessie) or firmware-amd-graphics (backports, stretch) packages from non-free
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3537[19:15:41] <tremon> not sure if you need additional support packages for compute support, I don't use blender
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3540[19:16:25] <ambient> tremon, Hi, I tried to install firmware-amd-graphics last night and it broke my system. I had to reinstall. I received instructions from someone who does not have AMD hardware.
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3542[19:16:52] <tremon> that shouldn't happen... broke how?
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3544[19:17:29] <ambient> tremon, I had several issues with the repositories, I could not resolve the address it said
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3546[19:17:50] <tremon> ah, but that means you only broke the internet, not your system
3547[19:17:59] <ambient> tremon, Also I had no GUI anymore
3548[19:18:23] <ambient> tremon, When I logged in, I just had a blank screen and could only get into rescue mode
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3551[19:18:58] <tremon> seems odd that that would be caused by simply installing a package, unless that package uninstalled something else
3552[19:19:35] <ambient> tremon, It said it wanted to install 100 additional packages
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3555[19:19:57] <tremon> you tried to install it from testing then, instead of backports I guess
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3559[19:20:19] <jak2000> hi all
3560[19:20:29] <ambient> tremon, Okay, how do I install from backports?
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3562[19:20:39] <greycat> !jessie-backports
3563[19:20:39] <dpkg> Selected packages intended for the Debian 9 "Stretch" release but recompiled for use with "Jessie" (8.x) can be found in the "jessie-backports" repository. Note that jessie-backports are on the regular mirror network, not on backports.debian.org. A suitable line for your sources.list is «deb replaced-url
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3565[19:21:17] <tremon> did you use the instructions from this page last time? replaced-url
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3567[19:21:43] <NapoleonWils0n> euerka managed to fix my issue
3568[19:21:51] <NapoleonWils0n> used my arch .xinitrc
3569[19:21:52] <ambient> tremon, yeah, I also added 'contrib non-free'
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3574[19:23:02] <tremon> ok let me try here
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3596[19:29:44] <ambient> tremon, I'll be back. I need to reboot. My computer is having a nervous breakdown. Displays are going haywire here.
3597[19:30:04] *** Quits: ambient (~ambient@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3598[19:30:11] <tremon> sure
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3601[19:31:21] <ambient> tremon, okay, back
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3606[19:34:32] <tremon> I can't really test easily here, I already have the package installed. Can you paste the output of "apt-get -s install firmware-amd-graphics/jessie-backports" on your system please?
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3611[19:35:36] <jhutchins> sm00th: Trisquel hasn't had a release in two years.
3612[19:35:50] <ambient> tremon, E: Unable to locate package firmware-amd-graphics
3613[19:36:06] <ambient> jhutchins, That's a shame, people transfer lots of money to them
3614[19:36:12] * cruncher wonders what would happen when all developers that spend their time into debian derivatives would spend it into debian instead...
3615[19:36:25] *** Joins: AimHere (~bod@replaced-ip)
3616[19:36:31] <ambient> jhutchins, But I think they are LTS though
3617[19:36:32] *** Joins: shock- (~shock@replaced-ip)
3618[19:36:35] <jhutchins> ambient: Then again, that's pretty much Debian's release cycle.
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3620[19:36:54] <mik> cruncher: debian would explode.
3621[19:37:11] <cruncher> :)
3622[19:37:12] <tremon> heh. you need to re-enable backports first. So add the deb-line for jessie-backports (including at least non-free), run apt-get update and try again
3623[19:37:16] <tremon> ambient: ^^
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3625[19:38:13] <sm00th> jhutchins, its good till 2019, we'll see what happens after that.
3626[19:38:41] *** Joins: nog3 (~tud3@replaced-ip)
3627[19:38:44] <mik> cruncher: and there are not so much derivates: replaced-url
3628[19:38:46] *** Joins: pavlushka (~pavlushka@replaced-ip)
3629[19:38:55] <ambient> tremon, I use .is (iceland) servers, does it cause an issue if I tap into different repositories?
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3632[19:39:18] <greycat> jessie-backports is supported by the standard Debian mirrors
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3635[19:39:49] <greycat> whatever server you use for jessie, you can use the same for jessie-backports
3636[19:40:08] *** Quits: TomyWork (~tomy@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3637[19:40:29] <tremon> yes, doesn't really matter which mirror you use. Closer ones may be faster of course
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3640[19:41:15] <sm00th> awesome chart
3641[19:41:15] <sm00th> I like debian, trisquel, and qubes-os
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3654[19:47:44] <ambient> tremon, replaced-url
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3663[19:48:42] <ambient> tremon, Should I install anything else?
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3666[19:49:15] <tremon> you haven't installed anything yet
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3670[19:49:48] <ambient> tremon, it says 'one newly installed'
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3675[19:50:23] <tremon> it should also have said "NOTE: This is only a simulation!" unless you forgot the -s
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3679[19:51:18] <psylence> Hello. Is there a way for me to bridge my wireless internet connection to ethernet?
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3685[19:52:23] <tremon> but as you see, installing the firmware-amd-graphics removes the previous firmware-linux-nonfree package. I think you should at least also install the firmware-misc-nonfree package, it is possible your previous system didn't boot anymore because it was missing a different firmware
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3688[19:52:43] <ambient> tremon, "apt-get -s install firmware-amd-graphics/jessie-backports"
3689[19:52:52] <psylence> I find that the open source drivers are much better than the amd ones.
3690[19:53:03] <psylence> I have an HD7950 and fglrx is garbage.
3691[19:53:14] <jelly> that's not the way instructions for jessie-backports tell you to install stuff
3692[19:53:20] *** Joins: Shkrid (~Shkrid@replaced-ip)
3693[19:53:27] <tremon> psylence: you can't, unless you configure your access point for 4-addr mode
3694[19:53:36] <jelly> they specifically say to apt-get -t jessie-backports ...
3695[19:53:59] <jelly> thus, apt-get -t jessie-backports -s install firmware-amd-graphics
3696[19:54:05] <psylence> tremon: ok, that's what I was afraid of.
3697[19:54:19] <jelly> that enables apt to upgrade the other firmware package if it has to
3698[19:54:38] *** Quits: LordDeath (~LordDeath@replaced-ip##) (Quit: ZNC - ##replaced-url
3699[19:54:41] <tremon> jelly: I know, but I wanted to make sure that the firmware-amd package would not pull in 100 other packages because of a dependency somewhere
3700[19:55:37] <emilsp> is python-systemd broken for everyone ?
3701[19:55:38] *** {41444d494e}| is now known as {41444d494e}
3702[19:56:11] <ambient> So far looks good...should i try a reboot?
3703[19:56:20] <tremon> ambient: can you paste the output of "apt-get -t jessie-backports -s install firmware-linux-nonfree" too? I want to make sure it only installs 2 packages before really installing it
3704[19:56:36] <jelly> tremon: bad idea
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3706[19:56:51] <tremon> which is the bad idea?
3707[19:56:59] <jelly> you WANT it to pull the upgrades for changed firmware packaging, in this case
3708[19:57:24] <jelly> names of packages and contents changed and stuff was split
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3710[19:57:46] <ambient> tremon, replaced-url
3711[19:57:50] *** Parts: zer0-days (~Shion@replaced-ip)
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3713[19:58:01] *** debhelper sets mode: +l 1670
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3715[19:58:38] <jelly> in any case backports are supposed to be made with a bare minimum of new dependencies specifically to avoid "pull in 100 other packages"
3716[19:59:00] <tremon> jelly: of course. But I also wanted to make sure it would not pull in unrelated packages. Please see the previous paste, directly installing the firmware-amd-graphics package actually REMOVES the older firmware-linux-nonfree package (because of a conflicts:), without pulling in the replacements
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3721[20:01:37] <tremon> ambient: as you can see in the latest paste (and what jelly was referring to): the firmware package has been split into multiple packages. What happened previously, is that you installed the newer firmware-amd-graphics package but that actually removed some other files, which are now placed in the firmware-misc-nonfree package
3722[20:01:57] *** Joins: troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@replaced-ip)
3723[20:02:09] <ambient> tremon, So what do I do?
3724[20:02:18] *** Joins: rochelimit_ (~gct@replaced-ip)
3725[20:02:20] <tremon> ambient: so the correct command for you to use is "apt-get -t jessie-backports install firmware-linux-nonfree"
3726[20:02:57] <tremon> this will pull in the newer firmware-amd-graphics package, and some other firmware packages
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3728[20:03:26] *** Quits: Scuttle (~Scuttle@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
3729[20:03:35] <jelly> "user did not read apt would do stupid things and remove packages" happens way too often
3730[20:03:52] *** Quits: mra9776 (~mra9776@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3731[20:03:53] <ambient> tremon, It says it will install intel microcode...should that concern me?
3732[20:04:10] <tremon> intel microcode should concern everyone, but it never does :S
3733[20:04:13] *** Quits: cmj (~c@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)
3734[20:04:22] <jelly> ambient: if you have an intel cpu, that's fine, if you have an amd cpu, you don't have to care
3735[20:04:28] <tremon> no, it won't have any effect on your system
3736[20:04:56] *** Quits: electro7 (~electro7@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1)
3737[20:04:56] <ambient> I long for the day of free hardware so we don't have to deal with this crap
3738[20:05:06] *** Quits: debalance (~debalance@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3739[20:05:09] <jelly> that will never happen
3740[20:05:10] <ambient> sealed with a Stallman kiss
3741[20:05:20] <tremon> I could do without that last
3742[20:05:35] *** Joins: Groscheri (~Dyonisos@replaced-ip)
3743[20:05:39] <jelly> sloppy beards
3744[20:06:02] <ambient> jelly, Maybe there is food in there
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3750[20:06:27] <jelly> yum
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3753[20:06:41] <ambient> tremon, You think I can reboot now?
3754[20:06:55] <tremon> I think so, yes
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3759[20:07:45] <ambient> tremon, replaced-url
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3762[20:08:01] <ambient> tremon, Before I do hit reboot
3763[20:08:08] <tremon> that's in the firmware-realtek page
3764[20:08:16] <tremon> s/page/package/
3765[20:08:17] <ambient> okie, here goes
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3770[20:08:55] <jelly> but many rtl chips don't need fw for normal work
3771[20:09:46] <tremon> can you paste the output of "apt-cache policy firmware-linux-nonfree firmware-amd-graphics" before you reboot?
3772[20:10:08] <jelly> three late!
3773[20:10:15] *** Joins: ambient (~ambient@replaced-ip)
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3778[20:10:33] <tremon> aww, that's what you get for hiding enter/leave messages
3779[20:10:48] *** Parts: LorD_n1c0w (~igorhenri@replaced-ip)
3780[20:10:53] <jelly> !wb ambient
3781[20:10:53] <dpkg> O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay! ambient has returned!
3782[20:11:13] <ambient> jelly, Thanks.
3783[20:11:15] <tremon> maybe the system did not reboot at all
3784[20:11:38] <ambient> Okay, how do I know it worked? I launched blender and I still have cpu as the only option to render from
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3793[20:12:17] <DammitJim> what command should I run to re-mount a samba mount that got disconnected?
3794[20:12:21] <DammitJim> I want to put that on a script
3795[20:12:49] <ambient> tremon, I rebooted all right, thanks. : - D
3796[20:12:52] <KingsQuest> what is the official channel for debian bugs ?
3797[20:13:05] <ambient> glxgears looks okay...
3798[20:13:12] <DammitJim> no, I don't want to reboot
3799[20:13:19] <tremon> ambient: I'm not familiar with blender, but have you seen replaced-url
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3802[20:13:58] <greycat> DammitJim: if it's a mount defined in fstab, just "mount /mntpoint"
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3805[20:14:13] <greycat> If it's not, then repeat whatever crazy magic smbmount (?) command you used in the first place.
3806[20:14:14] <ambient> tremon, Radeon R7 240 Oland PRO 320 5
3807[20:14:35] <DammitJim> it's in /etc/fstab
3808[20:14:37] *** Quits: maziar (~textual@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
3809[20:14:40] <ambient> tremon, My gpu is there
3810[20:14:55] <DammitJim> is there something wrong with running: mount -a ?
3811[20:15:05] <tremon> yes, but the next table only lists the catalyst beta as a supported driver :(
3812[20:15:09] *** Quits: converge (~converge@replaced-ip##) (Quit: Linkinus - ##replaced-url
3813[20:15:12] <greycat> Shouldn't be, as long as you don't *want* any file systems to remain unmounted.
3814[20:15:13] *** Joins: cadeskywalker (~madoka@replaced-ip)
3815[20:15:20] <DammitJim> oh ok
3816[20:15:35] <DammitJim> last question for this session... when does a mount become dismounted?
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3819[20:15:56] *** Quits: GeneralIdler (~calvin@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3820[20:15:59] <DammitJim> I've rebooted servers for which I had a mount to and /proc/mounts still had an entry for it while the server was off
3821[20:16:09] *** Joins: murphy (~murphy@replaced-ip)
3822[20:16:11] <ambient> tremon, Yeah, I have options in Windows, I guess not so much in Linux yet...
3823[20:16:17] *** Quits: murphy (~murphy@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
3824[20:16:24] *** Quits: timahvo1 (~rogue@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3825[20:16:26] <greycat> If it's network mounts (samba or NFS or whatever), then it becomes way more complicated.
3826[20:16:36] <DammitJim> I know! I hate it
3827[20:16:42] <DammitJim> I should have never offered to have mounts for software
3828[20:16:45] *** Joins: murphy (~murphy@replaced-ip)
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3831[20:17:04] <tremon> ambient: the catalyst driver is in the fglrx-driver package in debian, if you want to try it. it's not something I want to have experience with though
3832[20:17:08] *** Quits: SpookNorge (~electro7@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 1.6)
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3836[20:17:29] <jak2000> for do: nslookup mydomain.com wich port need open on my firewall?
3837[20:17:45] <greycat> jak2000: UDP and TCP 53
3838[20:17:48] *** Joins: LNJ2GO2 (~lnj@replaced-ip)
3839[20:17:49] <tremon> jak2000: getent services domain
3840[20:17:51] *** Quits: jolt (jolt@replaced-ip) (Quit: leaving)
3841[20:17:54] <ambient> tremon, I do believe I installed the proprietary drivers, it is one of the first things I do when installing Debian
3842[20:17:57] *** Quits: LNJ2GO (~lnj@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving.)
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3847[20:18:05] *** Joins: jolt (jolt@replaced-ip)
3848[20:18:11] <DammitJim> I mean, does the OS check that the mountpoint exists constantly or is it on demand?
3849[20:18:16] *** Quits: z0ran (~z0ran@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3850[20:18:27] *** Quits: xet7 (~xet7@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
3851[20:18:28] <greycat> DammitJim: that's up to you. If you only set it up in /etc/fstab, then it is mounted one time at boot.
3852[20:18:38] <greycat> If you set up autofs, then it's mounted and unmounted based on demand.
3853[20:18:42] *** Joins: murphy (~murphy@replaced-ip)
3854[20:18:43] <DammitJim> no, no autofs
3855[20:18:45] *** Quits: murphy (~murphy@replaced-ip) (Max SendQ exceeded)
3856[20:18:50] <DammitJim> but when does the mount dissappear from mtab?
3857[20:18:54] <jak2000> greycat, need do a port forwarding?
3858[20:18:58] <DammitJim> (I think df polls mtab)
3859[20:19:12] <tremon> ambient: then installing the firmware-amd package was a nice exercise, but pointless, as catalyst comes with its own firmware :)
3860[20:19:14] *** Quits: Scuttle (~Scuttle@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3861[20:19:25] *** Joins: ma1k (~gyoza.jp@unaffiliated/ma1k)
3862[20:19:26] <greycat> jak2000: you should let DNS queries go through. Period.
3863[20:19:41] *** Joins: derstrom (~derstrom@replaced-ip)
3864[20:20:30] *** Quits: asterismo (~santiago@replaced-ip) (Quit: Konversation terminated!)
3865[20:20:36] *** Quits: Ishaq (~Ishaq@replaced-ip) (Excess Flood)
3866[20:20:37] <jak2000> ok
3867[20:21:14] *** Joins: countbackula (~user@replaced-ip)
3868[20:21:29] <jelly> jak2000: if DNS did not work, you would not be able to access the internet. Default firewall settings typically allow dns queries to go out, and dns responses to come back as "related" traffic, by default
3869[20:21:34] *** Joins: Ishaq (~Ishaq@replaced-ip)
3870[20:21:35] <ambient> tremon, Graphics playback looks good though. Some videos my computer would choke on is playing back nicely...
3871[20:21:42] *** Quits: tlaxkit (~Thunderbi@replaced-ip) (Quit: tlaxkit)
3872[20:21:50] <ambient> tremon, No tearing...
3873[20:21:58] <tremon> ambient: you can check which driver you're using with "glxinfo | grep vendor" -- if it says "Mesa", you're using the open drivers. If it says "AMD" (or something like that) you're running catalyst
3874[20:22:04] <jelly> jak2000: no need for port forwards if you're just a dns client
3875[20:22:39] <ambient> tremon, OpenGL vendor string: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
3876[20:22:53] *** Joins: Putti (~Putti@replaced-ip)
3877[20:23:05] <tremon> yes, that's catalyst. Oh well, I had expected catalyst to provide its own firmware but maybe not
3878[20:23:20] <ambient> tremon, OpenGL vendor string: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
3879[20:23:20] <ambient> , server glx vendor string: ATI
3880[20:24:13] *** Parts: zoredache (~zoredache@replaced-ip)
3881[20:24:22] *** Joins: CuSn (~glockensp@replaced-ip)
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3884[20:24:33] *** Quits: bocaneri (~bocaneri@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3885[20:24:47] <tremon> anyway, try asking in #blender for more information about that. All we can check here is that your system seems to be working fine, with the correct driver
3886[20:25:03] <ambient> Wow, not even Ubuntu got me these goodies. I tried with other distros and Debian is the only one that came through. I mean this is still better than what I had before
3887[20:25:08] *** Quits: PEPIT0 (~alberto@replaced-ip) (Quit: WeeChat 1.6)
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3892[20:27:51] *** Quits: polemic (~polemic@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3893[20:28:22] <ambient> tremon, Thanks a bunch!
3894[20:29:13] <ambient> I run a video production business and am trying to move my workflow to Linux
3895[20:29:17] *** Joins: r4z_ (~r4z@replaced-ip)
3896[20:29:31] *** Joins: alex_820 (~smuxi@replaced-ip)
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3898[20:29:43] <ambient> Blender is a bridge to help me move over. It also works a s avideo editor
3899[20:29:54] <CuSn> Looking for a kernel patch for the COW kernel hack - for LTS wheezy, can anyone suggest what to look for?
3900[20:30:39] <SwedeMike> CuSn: replaced-url
3901[20:30:43] <KingsQuest> try compiling your own kernel from kernel.org 4.8.4 and above
3902[20:30:44] *** Joins: RebelCoder (~Yuriy@replaced-ip)
3903[20:30:58] <greycat> KingsQuest: on *wheezy*? Hah.
3904[20:30:59] <SwedeMike> CuSn: there are patched kernels available already.
3905[20:31:13] <KingsQuest> it all goes to kernel.org
3906[20:31:19] <jaythelinuxguy> If you check Debian's CVE page, it mentions what has been patched
3907[20:31:26] <CuSn> SwedeMike: oh. does an apt-get update install them?
3908[20:31:26] <KingsQuest> even would be fixes
3909[20:31:26] *** Quits: Shkrid (~Shkrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3910[20:31:30] <TomTomTo1> CuSn: wheezy is patched. check if you have the latest kernel from security. replaced-url
3911[20:31:37] <SwedeMike> CuSn: yes, that's the LTS support for wheezy that get security updates.
3912[20:31:42] <CuSn> checking
3913[20:31:49] <jelly> CuSn: no, follow it with an apt-get upgrade or dist-upgrade
3914[20:31:52] <KingsQuest> what debian channel is for debian bugs ?
3915[20:32:07] <jelly> update never installs anything
3916[20:32:26] *** Joins: Shkrid (~Shkrid@replaced-ip)
3917[20:32:50] *** Quits: Scuttle (~Scuttle@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3918[20:32:54] <CuSn> jelly: I'm on LTS wheezy. Will upgrade move me to the latest?
3919[20:32:55] *** Joins: silentknight (~enigma@replaced-ip)
3920[20:32:56] *** Joins: sammi (~sammi@replaced-ip)
3921[20:33:01] <KingsQuest> even that linaro arm compiled bug is fixed and needs every kernel.org kernel rerolled.
3922[20:33:02] <greycat> CuSn: TIAS
3923[20:33:02] *** Joins: TomasCZ (~TomasCZ@replaced-ip)
3924[20:33:10] <jak2000> my dns server ip locally is: 192.168.1.101, if i do: nslookup mydomain.com it say: Server: 192.168.1.103 and Address: 192.168.1.103#53 why? i need answer: 192.168.1.101 192.168.1.103 is my fireall(its a fortinet)....
3925[20:33:13] <greycat> Setting up linux-image-3.2.0-4-amd64 (3.2.82-1) ...
3926[20:33:14] <KingsQuest> even for x64 and amd64
3927[20:33:19] <KingsQuest> 32
3928[20:33:21] <jelly> CuSn: if you only have wheezy repos, you will keep on wheezing
3929[20:33:24] <CuSn> greycat: i don't want to be on the latest so TIAs could be "Shot me in the face".
3930[20:33:32] *** Joins: gdot (~gdot@replaced-ip)
3931[20:33:32] <jak2000> locally domain.com cant access to wewbpage (but from the outside YES) any advice?
3932[20:33:47] <SwedeMike> CuSn: yes, fix those apt configuration lines, do apt-get update and then apt-get dist-upgrade
3933[20:33:53] <greycat> jak2000: nslookup is obsolete and deprecated and crappy, but it probably just does a PURE dns query, NOT a getent hosts equivalent that might look in your local hosts file.
3934[20:34:04] <greycat> jak2000: What are you trying to do?
3935[20:34:28] *** Joins: dreamon (~dreamon@replaced-ip)
3936[20:34:39] *** Quits: troulouliou_dev (~troulouli@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
3937[20:35:00] *** Joins: Scuttle (~Scuttle@replaced-ip)
3938[20:35:07] *** Joins: FIrewar (~EMA@replaced-ip)
3939[20:35:13] <sammi> Hi all I’m trying to debug systemd-netword bonding issue in debian jessie. I have a pxe booted machine that has a *.netdev with a [Bond] section with bonding options. When starting the systemd-networkd service it is ignoring the [Bond] section. Anyone seen this behaviour
3940[20:35:13] <jak2000> greycat: i wat acces locally this domain: domain.com (by sample) and access to webpage... but not access.
3941[20:35:21] <greycat> CuSn: You don't want to be on the latest wheezy security updates? What? Why?
3942[20:35:22] *** Quits: FIrewar (~EMA@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
3943[20:35:30] <jelly> jak2000: in a browser? What's the actual domain name?
3944[20:35:36] *** Quits: Janos (~Janos@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
3945[20:35:48] <greycat> what does "access locally" mean?
3946[20:35:54] <jak2000> yes
3947[20:36:01] <jak2000> renypicot.com.mx
3948[20:36:10] *** Quits: Dohplay (~Dohplay@replaced-ip) (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
3949[20:36:19] <greycat> It resolves, to a non-private IP.
3950[20:36:34] <tremon> sammi: I thought -networkd and -resolved weren't ready for production time in jessie. You may need to update to at least 219 for resolved to work correctly at least
3951[20:36:36] <greycat> What error do you get in your web browser? Do other pages like replaced-url
3952[20:36:37] <jak2000> yes have a public ip
3953[20:36:43] <jelly> jak2000: what does "getent hosts renypicot.com.mx" say on the system where the browser cannot access replaced-url
3954[20:36:47] <CuSn> SwedeMike: just to clarify, I want to stay on the LTS release and not the latest debian release.
3955[20:36:48] *** Quits: redguy (~matik@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
3956[20:36:49] <jak2000> but in the Localnetwork where the server is phisically installed
3957[20:36:53] <jak2000> cant access why?
3958[20:36:54] *** Joins: v3g4n (~v3g4n@replaced-ip)
3959[20:36:56] <greycat> *sigh*
3960[20:36:57] *** Joins: smacnay (~textual@replaced-ip)
3961[20:37:00] *** Joins: IlNominePatre (~Discovery@replaced-ip)
3962[20:37:05] *** Joins: Glavata (~Glavata@replaced-ip)
3963[20:37:10] *** Joins: cybrNaut (cybrNaut@replaced-ip)
3964[20:37:11] *** Quits: cybrNaut (cybrNaut@replaced-ip) (Excess Flood)
3965[20:37:14] <jelly> CuSn: that's fine, apt won't magically switch you to a newer release
3966[20:37:17] <jak2000> 127.0.0.1 localhost renypicot.com.mx replaced-url
3967[20:37:20] <greycat> Are you saying that your workstation with a web browser is on the SAME PHYSICAL NETWORK as the web server?
3968[20:37:25] <greycat> *sigh* jesus
3969[20:37:26] <jak2000> yes
3970[20:37:27] <SwedeMike> CuSn: correct. The page I linked you to is wheezy with LTS security patches.
3971[20:37:35] <jak2000> not see the webpage..
3972[20:37:38] <jak2000> greycat CORRECT
3973[20:37:38] <greycat> Is the web browser on the SAME MACHINE as the web server?!
3974[20:37:42] <jelly> jak2000: do you have an entry for renypicot.com.mx in /etc/hosts ?
3975[20:37:43] <jak2000> no
3976[20:37:43] <CuSn> jelly, SwedeMike thank you.
3977[20:37:55] <greycat> Why would you have replaced-url
3978[20:37:56] <teraflops> jak2000: blame your router I guess it does not do nat loopback if I understand what you say
3979[20:38:08] <tremon> jak2000: is your webbrowser listening on 127.0.0.1?
3980[20:38:22] <tremon> argh. webserver, not browser
3981[20:38:29] <greycat> I don't even understand this question.
3982[20:38:29] <jak2000> jelly: 127.0.0.1 localhost renypicot.com.mx replaced-url
3983[20:38:38] <jelly> jak2000: why do you have that there?
3984[20:38:58] <jak2000> greycat: my server have lcoal ip: 192.168.1.101 i try access renypicot.com.mx from a widnowss pc with ip: 192.168.1.130
3985[20:39:11] <greycat> GAAAAH why is your web server on a PRIVATE NETWORK
3986[20:39:14] * jelly gives greycat a mxglish to Queen's Language translator
3987[20:39:16] *** Quits: Shkrid (~Shkrid@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
3988[20:39:21] *** Quits: Rackham (~Rackham@replaced-ip) (Quit: Leaving)
3989[20:39:22] <sammi> tremon: ok thank you for this hint. When referring to at least 219 are you then referring to version number or ?
3990[20:39:30] *** Joins: Fomina (~Discovery@replaced-ip)
3991[20:39:38] *** Quits: bugzc (~1@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
3992[20:40:12] *** Quits: smacnay (~textual@replaced-ip) (Client Quit)
3993[20:40:15] *** Joins: karthago (~edgrey@replaced-ip)
3994[20:40:19] *** Joins: domovoy (~domovoy@replaced-ip)
3995[20:40:22] <greycat> If your web server is in your basement in your HOUSE, and it's inside a NAT with port forwarding, but you ALSO want to reach it from the PC in your LIVING ROOM in the SAME HOUSE, then you have to do serious backflips.
3996[20:40:24] *** Joins: hacman (~yesser@replaced-ip)
3997[20:40:29] <jak2000> wich pastebin page recommend me?
3998[20:40:32] <greycat> This is not a good hosting arrangement. Trust me. Been there done that.
3999[20:40:43] <jelly> or have a local dns
4000[20:40:47] *** Joins: polemic (~polemic@replaced-ip)
4001[20:40:50] <jak2000> yes i have a dns
4002[20:40:54] <teraflops> hehe
4003[20:40:56] <jak2000> on server :192.168.1.101
4004[20:41:06] <greycat> *headdesk*
4005[20:41:14] *** Joins: user2 (~user@replaced-ip)
4006[20:41:14] <jelly> jak2000: does your windows machine with the browser on it know you have a dns?
4007[20:41:17] <tremon> sammi: yes, version number. systemd doesn't use semantic versioning
4008[20:41:23] <jak2000> strange when i try ping (on windows pc: 192.168.1.130) ping renypicot.com.mx answer a old DNSserver: 192.168.1.183
4009[20:41:25] <jak2000> why?
4010[20:41:35] <jak2000> jelly wait
4011[20:41:40] <l4m8d4> Is there already a good way to migrate debian 32 to 64 bit? And I mean not the strange wiki way of doing it
4012[20:41:54] *** Quits: alex_820 (~smuxi@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 256 seconds)
4013[20:42:00] <jelly> l4m8d4: make a fresh install, migrate data and apps
4014[20:42:05] <jelly> "no"
4015[20:42:10] <tremon> l4m8d4: what's the "strange wiki way"?
4016[20:42:14] <l4m8d4> jelly: Cmon it must be easier
4017[20:42:23] <l4m8d4> jelly: replaced-url
4018[20:42:23] <greycat> l4m8d4: WOW YOU ARE AN FUCKING ASSHOLE
4019[20:42:25] <jelly> l4m8d4: cmon yourself
4020[20:42:25] <greycat> *plonk*
4021[20:42:33] *** Parts: user2 (~user@replaced-ip)
4022[20:42:48] <greycat> My god. I can't believe someone can just come right in and be THAT offensive in like 15 seconds.
4023[20:42:51] *** Joins: JZTech101 (jztech101@replaced-ip)
4024[20:43:00] <l4m8d4> greycat: Offensive? Why?
4025[20:43:28] *** Quits: zpzu (~zpzu@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 260 seconds)
4026[20:43:28] <jak2000> jelly windwos pc is pointing to first DNS: 192.168.1.101 continue answewring the ping to renypicot.com.mx the local ip: 192.168.1183
4027[20:43:39] *** Joins: master_j (~user@replaced-ip)
4028[20:43:49] *** Quits: RebelCoder (~Yuriy@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
4029[20:43:56] <jelly> l4m8d4: there's a procedure, someone's written it up, presumably if there was an easier way they would have written THAT instead
4030[20:44:05] <l4m8d4> I just hought to myself that, now that apt supports multiarch, there should be a way to just tell it to use a new arch and get the corresponding packages
4031[20:44:19] <th0r> greycat, what do you find most offensive? Him yelling at the top of his lungs or calling someone a fucking asshole?
4032[20:44:20] <l4m8d4> jelly: Okay, do you mean the writeup in the wiki that I linked to?
4033[20:44:26] <jelly> l4m8d4: yes
4034[20:44:31] *** Joins: KingsQuest- (~ident@replaced-ip)
4035[20:44:40] <jelly> (or any similar hacky howto)
4036[20:44:40] *** Joins: cybrNaut (cybrNaut@replaced-ip)
4037[20:44:52] *** Quits: morphis_ (~morphis@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
4038[20:44:58] <greycat> th0r: I see your web site full of crazy stupid things. Tell me the truth. What is the real way of doing things? Not the idiocy on your web page. You are lying to me. Tell me now.
4039[20:45:00] *** Joins: Shkrid (~Shkrid@replaced-ip)
4040[20:45:24] <th0r> funny...I never saw him say that
4041[20:45:24] *** Quits: cybrNaut (cybrNaut@replaced-ip) (Excess Flood)
4042[20:45:26] <greycat> THAT is what l4<tab> did.
4043[20:46:07] *** Quits: KingsQuest (~ident@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)
4044[20:46:10] *** Joins: m8 (~m8@replaced-ip)
4045[20:46:10] *** Quits: v3g4n (~v3g4n@replaced-ip) (Ping timeout: 250 seconds)
4046[20:46:37] *** Joins: JordiGH (~jordi@replaced-ip)
4047[20:46:43] *** Quits: r4z_ (~r4z@replaced-ip) (Remote host closed the connection)
4048[20:46:48] <l4m8d4> jelly: It just seems very unsafe in the way it operates, also on the top it says it doesn't work with the current version
4049[20:46:54] <tremon> l4m8d4: a reinstall (/msg dpkg debian clone) is actually way easier than an in-place migration. Yes, it can probably be done. But it should not be performed by anyone who isn't very comfortable with apt, dpkg, or rescuing broken sysetms
4050[20:47:17] <JordiGH> Is there an easy way to answer what mercurial version Debian stable shipped on 2008-06-27?
4051[20:47:48] *** Joins: meilenstein (~markus@replaced-ip)
4052[20:47:58] <jelly> l4m8d4: if there was a better way, why would we not document it?
4053[20:48:20] <greycat> First see which release was stable at that point. Get the mercurial package from that release on that date or later, and read the changelog.Debian.gz to see the individual changes.
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4056[20:49:11] <JordiGH> greycat: Right, that's the brute force way. :-)
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4058[20:49:16] <greycat> Maybe use a 2-day wiggle period for the mirror propagation of a high security release, or a week of wiggle room for others.
4059[20:49:27] <sammi> tremon: thank you for the assistance :-) .
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4061[20:49:41] <tremon> JordiGH: replaced-url
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4063[20:49:48] <l4m8d4> jelly: Often it happens that wikis are not up to date because it can be tedious to maintain them - or because nobody wants to do it.
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4067[20:50:29] <JordiGH> tremon: Excellent, thanks.
4068[20:50:35] <mdim> hi everyone!
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4070[20:50:41] <l4m8d4> tremon: Hm, can that be done from a running system? For example installing a new system to a new btrfs snapshot, and then restarting?
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4072[20:50:55] <mdim> Can someone explain me what is this archive? replaced-url
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4075[20:51:27] <jelly> l4m8d4: it's maintained by the same volunteers that make packages or help in here
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4083[20:53:58] <tremon> l4m8d4: it can, by using debootstrap. You need to follow the same steps from the wiki page you linked under "create a 64-bit mini system", then use the commands dpkg gave you to build a similar package selection
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4085[20:54:30] <l4m8d4> jelly: May be, but it even says on top of the page that it's outdated and that it may be easier with dpkg. So why not ask in the IRC if someone knows about it? I'm not here to blame anyone for not updating some wiki page, but to try to think of a way how to safely transform this system to 64 bit
4086[20:54:37] <jak2000> jelly?
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4095[20:56:45] <jelly> jak2000: maybe your dns is misconfigured
4096[20:56:47] <tremon> l4m8d4: the part where it gets hairy is to reconfigure the bootloader for booting into either the new or old system. That's why the guide recommends using a rescue disk for that
4097[20:57:39] <tremon> l4m8d4: personally, I would start by installing the 64-bit kernel in the 32-bit system and verifying that the system boots correctly with a 64-bit kernel and 32-bit userland (it should)
4098[20:57:41] <l4m8d4> tremon: That part is not a problem I have done that before - thanks!
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4100[20:58:04] <l4m8d4> tremon: Have done that too, but thanks
4101[20:58:11] <jelly> jak2000: ask it from linux. what does "dig +short renypicot.com.mx @192.168.1.101" say
4102[20:58:47] <jelly> l4m8d4: it's still not really any easier
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4106[20:59:53] <tremon> l4m8d4: don't forget to ask dpkg about things to backup. You can probably mount /home from either system fine, but I recommend you do not share the same /var or /etc between the two systems
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4109[21:00:51] <jak2000> 201.144.114.19 public ip?
4110[21:02:00] <greycat> That means you have *not* in fact set up a splitview DNS that reports the local IP when queried from a local client.
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4113[21:02:26] <jelly> jak2000: thne figure out where the windows machine gets 192.168.1.183 from, because it does not seem to be coming from your 192.168.1.101 dns server
4114[21:02:41] <greycat> Probably the windows hosts file.
4115[21:02:59] <l4m8d4> tremon: My problem seems to be 1. how to really determine the set of packages that needs to be installed to the new system, since some packages have different names for different arches. 2. How to move all the files that I need from the old system over. As per the infrastructure behind it, I plan on making a new btrfs subvolume to debootstrap to and configure everything
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4117[21:03:43] <l4m8d4> And using a snapshot to move the files over from, so no race conditions can occur
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4123[21:04:40] <jak2000> jellymaybe fortinet? firewall?
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4125[21:04:58] <tremon> l4m8d4: as for 1), I would still use dpkg --get-selections and review that selection manually. I don't think there will be many packages still using architecture-unique names (the linux kernel is the main exception)
4126[21:05:28] <greycat> cross compilers also come to mind
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4136[21:06:33] <jelly> jak2000: I don't have expertise to help debugging dns resolution in windows, sorry. Find the cause for wrong resolution in ##windows channel maybe
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4144[21:07:52] <tremon> l4m8d4: as for 2), I would use a simple cpio -p (backup/restore), and not use snapshots. I would want to be absolutely certain that at least one of the systems still boots correctly
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4151[21:08:54] <l4m8d4> tremon: No I mean make a maintenance snapshot to restore from, create one to restore to, and leave the main system snapshot untouched. So the restore source can't change unexpectedly, I mean.
4152[21:09:12] <tremon> that would probably work too, yes
4153[21:09:14] <l4m8d4> tremon: So I would then just run your command between the two subvolumes
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4155[21:09:39] <l4m8d4> That way it would also be pretty much guaranteed to still have something to boot from :D
4156[21:11:00] <tremon> yup. you're also virtually guaranteed to at least once forget to change an fstab entry after copying it, and be working with the wrong volume mounted :)
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4158[21:11:53] <jelly> this is why labels > uuids
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4160[21:12:13] <l4m8d4> tremon: No, I work with btrfs a lot, I don't think I'll be making such a mistake - at least I hope so. But since I also make backups, evem that would be no problem
4161[21:12:32] <tremon> I agree that snapshots/clone can work very effectively for this kind of migration, but it's also a very easy hazard
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4167[21:15:10] <l4m8d4> tremon: Since I didn't use the program even once: what exactly would cpio -p do?
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4173[21:17:21] <tremon> it's a directory tree clone. Does basically the same as cp -a, but since its input can be a find command, I use it for selective backups
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4175[21:17:41] <tremon> just use what you're comfortable with
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4181[21:21:11] <l4m8d4> tremon: So I imagine being at the point of having all the necessary packages installed, and needing to move all the correct files and folders over. It seems I would have to do it manually, right?
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4184[21:22:02] <l4m8d4> I mean /home is obvious, /root is obvious, but /etc already may contain some files I shouldn't replace, right?
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4186[21:23:14] <tremon> as long as you install the same versions of packages in the new system as in the old (i.e. you don't install a newer release), you should probably copy all of /etc
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4192[21:23:54] <l4m8d4> tremon: That could be a problem since I'm using testing, well probably it's enough to update before beginning the procedure, right?
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4194[21:24:10] <tremon> yes that should be enough
4195[21:24:44] <l4m8d4> Ah I wish it was easier to migrate arhcitectures
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4197[21:25:21] <tremon> it's not a usecase that comes up regularly
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4200[21:26:51] <l4m8d4> I guess so. I moved from a machine that supports only i386 to one that supports both that and amd64. I guess some time in the future i386 might be ditched, so it's probably better to move - or to try to, at least
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4207[21:27:37] <Akuli> i'm not ready to throw away my 32-bit only laptop
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4210[21:28:24] <Akuli> i mean, debian still runs on my imac g3... it should be able to support i386 for a long time
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4213[21:28:55] <l4m8d4> Akuli: I also have a few machines running only i386 that I still want to use - maybe one can just stay on an obsolete version of the software for some time, before things get incompatible
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4217[21:29:36] <l4m8d4> E.g. this machine running my irc client is from 1997 - 128 mb of ram and 800mhz processor, but still runs testing just fine
4218[21:29:51] <Akuli> non-windows systems are all about supporting ditched computers to some people
4219[21:30:03] <Akuli> powerpc's are a good example of this
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4223[21:30:15] <Akuli> except that it's non-osx, but you get the idea
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4225[21:31:05] <l4m8d4> I'm always delighted to see that this old computer still runs the newest linux kernels and everything :D
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4227[21:31:23] <l4m8d4> But that's probably offtopic
4228[21:31:41] <Akuli> the gui takes up a lot of resources
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4231[21:32:07] <Akuli> debian without x can run on pretty much any computer of a supported architecture
4232[21:32:13] <l4m8d4> Akuli: Well, this one has no gui - it doesn't even have a graphics card - no integrated and no dedicated one
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4248[21:36:26] <dontknow> gnome and xfce uses same amount of resources
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4257[21:38:41] <jhutchins> dontknow: DOn't be rediculous.
4258[21:39:06] <dontknow> they both uses about 600MB of ram
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4261[21:39:31] <jhutchins> dontknow: Look at the processes they launch.
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4263[21:39:46] <dontknow> what does it matter?
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4273[21:42:25] <cruncher> dontknow, just for the record, after login, my system shows ~180MB used ram (xfce)
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4275[21:43:32] <dontknow> wtf. it may be related how much ram pc has. i have 8gb of ram
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4278[21:44:11] <th0r> dontknow, there is so much more to performance than just memory consumption
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4283[21:46:45] <cruncher> interesting.. ok, let me do the test... with 2GB ram: ~180MB, with 8GB ram: ~200MB, with 16GB ram: ~210MB
4284[21:46:54] <cruncher> all the same machine
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4290[21:47:35] <jhutchins> dontknow: Possibly. Also, ifyou use both, Gnome will have a lot of background processes even when it's not running.
4291[21:47:49] <jhutchins> dontknow: xfce has the ability to use some of them.
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4293[21:48:03] <l4m8d4> In my experience xfce is MUCH more lightweight than gnome - I can only really play minecraft on xfce because of memory limitations. Also, all my other games runs much better on xfce, too
4294[21:48:05] <awal1> the DM also matters
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4297[21:48:48] <awal1> cruncher, using gdm3 for start xfce?
4298[21:48:52] <`Kevin> fluxbox ;)
4299[21:48:56] <cruncher> lightdm
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4303[21:49:21] <awal1> cruncher, sorry I meant dontknow :P
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4305[21:49:46] <dontknow> no, i use startx
4306[21:50:05] <dontknow> after that it uses 600Mb of ram
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4308[21:50:55] <awal1> dontknow, systemd services, kernel modules and so also are involved there, not only xfce/gnome
4309[21:51:01] <humbot> bits ?
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4311[21:51:55] <dontknow> i dunno. i am ok with that
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4317[21:53:33] <awal1> dontknow, example: my openbox itself, excluding other background stuff uses only 0,3% of ram
4318[21:54:27] <dontknow> that sounds good
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4328[21:55:51] <awal1> dontknow, try x system monitor, say htop, top..., and check the amount of ram/cpu xfce/xfce session uses exclusively and compare with gnome
4329[21:56:02] <cruncher> same machine, without lightdm, started with startx, used slightly more ram (~200MB with 2GB) :D
4330[21:56:07] <cruncher> used less with lightdm
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4333[21:56:54] <dontknow> awal1, i have htop but i don't know what process i should loot at
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4336[21:57:40] <awal1> gnome (and kde/cinnamon) is obviously more hungry in resources
4337[21:57:54] <dontknow> xfce-teminal uses %0.3 ram lol
4338[21:58:10] <`Kevin> ps aux --sort rss
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4344[21:58:57] <`Kevin> but as others stated it isnt just ram, larger desktop envs have services such as a document(file) indexers and such
4345[21:59:10] <awal1> dontknow, htop F3 and search the process you want
4346[21:59:23] <dontknow> ok but what process?
4347[21:59:33] <awal1> try by name
4348[22:00:10] <awal1> just type xfce and htop will list xfce4 stuff
4349[22:00:36] <dontknow> xfce-panel %0.4
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4351[22:01:07] <dontknow> xfce-power-manager 0.2
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4394[22:22:04] <SunOS> hello
4395[22:22:14] <SunOS> how can i set a "locale " for local user
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4397[22:22:18] <SunOS> only
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4399[22:22:48] <alex1a> anyone know the best way to install "mathoid" in debian 8 jessie ?
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4401[22:23:45] <greycat> SunOS: how do you login as this user? Text console, ssh, lightdm, gdm3, ...?
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4403[22:24:53] <SunOS> greycat , ssh
4404[22:25:07] <greycat> Is the user's shell bash?
4405[22:25:36] <SunOS> yeah
4406[22:25:53] <greycat> Perhaps even more important: do you want to preserve the ssh client's locale on the server side, or are you simply content to statically *override* it in the user's dot file on the server?
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4409[22:27:31] <greycat> If you just want a brute force override, put "export LANG=whatever" in the user's ~/.bash_profile
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4416[22:30:28] <SunOS> greycat ; ) 10x
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4439[22:44:49] <cluelessperson> greycat, Can you suggest what to do? strace seems to crash functionality of the server while it's running. It keeps running even when the command finished up
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4459[22:53:30] <cruncher> cluelessperson, what is the problem? write it here so others can also help maybe
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4523[23:21:15] <ldumont> Hey guys, is there anything I should be aware when dual booting Windows 10 and Debian with the Debian partition residing on a GPT disk?
4524[23:21:21] <ldumont> The first disk with Windows is MBR
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4532[23:24:12] <Alver> Hello. Running sid x86_64 here. Since a short while, alt-arrow switches tty's, which is very much not what I want. Does anyone have an idea where to disable this behaviour again? I have these combos mapped to irssi and prefer to keep them that way.
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4534[23:25:34] <can-ned_food> Alver: does that keystroke work during the entire boot procedure?
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4537[23:26:11] <can-ned_food> i'm more curious than i have a ready answer, unfortunately
4538[23:26:50] <Alver> can-ned_food: what do you mean by that? I hardly ever reboot, so can't say I tried pressing that combo during the three seconds or so between kernel loading and graphical login
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4542[23:28:13] <tremon> Alver: switches tty's, as in virtual consoles? alt+arrow moves you out of X?
4543[23:28:20] <Alver> tremon: correct.
4544[23:28:31] <Alver> as does alt-Fx.
4545[23:28:43] <teraflops> Alver: nvidia?
4546[23:28:53] <Alver> teraflops: hybrid intel/ati.
4547[23:28:57] <tremon> that's definitely weird. I can only say it doesn't happen here
4548[23:29:11] <Alver> It didn't happen here either until... I dunno. A week or so. :)
4549[23:29:28] <Alver> But I hadn't updated in a good few weeks, possibly two months.
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4551[23:29:42] *** Callieforneon is now known as CharlieBrown
4552[23:29:46] <teraflops> Alver: looks like an old bug
4553[23:29:51] <Alver> Strangely, it seems some keystrokes are interpreted both by DE and the ttys
4554[23:30:11] <teraflops> Alver: I meant in upstream
4555[23:30:15] <Alver> If I do alt-F2, I switch to tty2, and when I get back to my X session, cinnamon has opened the "command prompt" still.
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4558[23:30:38] <Alver> teraflops: Hm? That's double odd then. Wonder what brought it back up.
4559[23:30:39] <tremon> yes, that sounds like something I have heard before yes
4560[23:30:48] <tremon> screen switches, but input stays in X
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4563[23:31:07] <Alver> That's a relief. At least it's not a poltergeist in my laptop then.
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4565[23:31:41] <awal1> Alver, ctrl-alt+fX you meant? alt+fX doesn't switch tty/X here
4566[23:31:48] <Alver> awal1: it does here.
4567[23:31:50] <tremon> it vaguely rings a bell, but it could simply be that I'm haunted too
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4571[23:32:12] <Alver> Hm. I found a very old report from ubuntu on this, and they recommend adding Option "GrabDevice" "True" to the xorg.conf input section.
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4573[23:32:19] <teraflops> Alver: I dont remenber I recall seeing it in archlinux like a month ago or so, look at dpkg log if there was a systemd update recently
4574[23:32:47] <Alver> teraflops: there most definitely was. I can verify if you want, but... pretty sure
4575[23:32:48] <tremon> Alver: the default configuration should switch VTs using only alt+Fn, however you normally need ctrl+alt+Fn to switch out of X
4576[23:33:16] * tremon wasn't going to mention logind
4577[23:33:28] <awal1> If I'm not wrong, switching between tty's and X is only via Ctrl+Alt+Fxnumber...
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4581[23:34:04] <tremon> awal1: you're partly wrong: if you're on a virtual console (non-X), you can switch away with alt+Fn
4582[23:34:06] *** Joins: gump_ (~gump___@replaced-ip)
4583[23:34:12] <at0m> just learned between tty's it's just alt-Fn ^^
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4585[23:34:28] <at0m> or, ctrl-alt-Fn if you like
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4589[23:34:57] <Alver> I think I'll run a full update again, and give it a reboot. It's overdue anyway. If the issue persists, I'll be back.
4590[23:36:06] *** Joins: ikus060 (~ikus060@replaced-ip)
4591[23:36:11] <ikus060> Hello, I need some help to configure my linux permission. I have multiple users that need to read write data to a server. Then I need a server (running as a system user) to read write the same data. So far /home/* is set to 700. So the service cannot access the /home/*. To only way I found to fix it is to run the service as root
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4593[23:36:18] <teraflops> Alver: but did you reboot after the issue appeared?
4594[23:36:22] <awal1> tremon, right, alt+Fnumber works once in Console (tty's)
4595[23:36:33] <tremon> Alver: do the answers in replaced-url
4596[23:36:39] <Alver> teraflops: that is what I'm starting to wonder too now.
4597[23:36:48] <teraflops> Alver: reboot please!
4598[23:36:56] <teraflops> .S
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4600[23:37:14] <teraflops> s/./:
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4602[23:37:30] <Alver> teraflops: on it. Installing a new kernel too, in the meantime. There's a dirty cow that needs washed anyway
4603[23:37:42] <teraflops> Alver: nah reboot I bet it fix the issue
4604[23:38:13] <can-ned_food> sorry to interrupt, but can anyone tell me where i can find a better documentation on the APT.conf options than the manpage?
4605[23:38:18] <funabashi> ist possible to move a process to my screen session ?
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4611[23:42:06] <tremon> Alver: do you have a /etc/vconsole.conf ?
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4614[23:44:05] <Alver> tremon, teraflops: an update + reboot did fix it. I probably forgot after last update, so oddities could be expected.
4615[23:44:12] <Alver> Thanks for the heads up!
4616[23:44:15] <teraflops> Alver: yeah I think so
4617[23:44:26] <teraflops> Alver: np
4618[23:44:33] <tremon> ok, then only for future reference: replaced-url
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4625[23:47:16] <teraflops> Alver: being on sid a systemd update worth a reboot imo
4626[23:47:39] <Alver> It is. I just tend to forget since I boot from USB stick, and I don't always have it near me
4627[23:47:39] <teraflops> Alver: even more if it's a major release
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4633[23:48:42] <teraflops> Alver: sometimes I even rebuild initramfs
4634[23:49:15] <Alver> Heh. I used to drop to runlevel 1 and back, but I'm not sure how much of that is even relevant with systemd anymore.
4635[23:49:25] <sudosudosudo> I attempting to install debian on my thinkpad that I just got. When going through the installer on the portion that says installing components I am getting an error that cd drive can not be read. I was reading this had something to do with microsoft asking lenovo to lock down their machines from free software. Does anyone have any information on this?
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4637[23:49:56] <teraflops> Alver: no runlevels anymore :P
4638[23:50:32] <Alver> teraflops: so I've noticed. Humbug. I need a few million quid to develop me a HPUX laptop.
4639[23:50:48] <teraflops> hehe
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4649[23:54:20] <Alver> Alright, I guess I've used up my fifteen minutes of debian support then. See you in a few years.
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4653[23:54:50] <tremon> sudosudosudo: I don't think so. if it were locked like that, debian would not recognize the harddisk. this just sounds like a corrupt install disc
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